Disk First Aid Error
Adam McLeod
Im a relatively new convert from Windoze to Mac and have struck a problem.
As a result of my Mac (imac DV 400 slot loading with OS 9.04) hanging up a
lot and having to be restarted, I now seem to have struck a problem with my
Hard Disk.
Disk First Aid reported a problem it could not repair:
Problem: Ivalid PEOF, 62111, 1084
I have no idea what that means or what to do. How serious it is, or where
to go. I had intended on upgrading to OS X this weekend, but Im not sure if
this is going to fix the problem, especially if it is hardware. The imac is
still under warranty.
Hope someone can help
Thanks in Advance
Remy Davison
restart, DFA automatically checks the disk unless this pref is switched
off in the General Controls control panel. Should always be on and you
should always let it do its stuff.
Like any other computer, you need a more thorough disc utility. Norton's
(v.6.0) is the default standard. TechTool Pro is the competition. Disk
Warrior is brilliant at rescuing damaged directories. Without being too
biased about one product over another, Norton's should keep your disc
looking OK so long as you run it fairly regularly. It comes with a
bootable CD so you can unmount the hard drive and repair most problems.
What you have is a disc directory problem. Norton's should be able to
fix it. Nevertheless, after a repair such as this, I'd
backup/reformat/restore to be on the safe side.
BTW, it's certainly not a hardware problem.
If your iMac's hanging a lot, it's probably to do with a lack of memory.
How much do you have? Are you using VM? Allocate more RAM to troublesome
apps. (e.g., if you're using Word 98 with the default 9MB allocation,
you're asking for trouble; 12MB is a more reasonable minimum). If you're
planning on running OS X w/- Classic running, you should have 192MB of
RAM (more the better). 128 for OS X on its own (minimum).
Cheers,
RD
In article <B6ED1AA0.55A%amc...@unite.com.au>,
Adam McLeod <amc...@unite.com.au> wrote:
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Please remove NOSPAM from email address before replying directly.
Peter McCallum
http://www.apple.com/support/ should give you an idea what to do.
Basically apple says that you have a directory problem. You should
backup your hard drive and reformat it.
http://kbase.info.apple.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/kbase.woa/wa/viewDocument
?extKCID=16231
You may also try rebuilding the desktop files by holding the Apple and
option keys during startup.
Adam McLeod <amc...@unite.com.au> wrote:
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Peter McCallum
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Ph/Fax 07 4951 3524 mob 0402 966 560
email peterm...@mac.com
I. Balbin
McCallum at peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com wrote on 2/4/01 11:26 AM:
> The following article in the knowledge base at
> http://www.apple.com/support/ should give you an idea what to do.
> Basically apple says that you have a directory problem. You should
> backup your hard drive and reformat it.
No need. I have seen this problem and fixed it with Alsoft's Disk Warrior.
It's a great program.
>
> http://kbase.info.apple.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/kbase.woa/wa/viewDocument
> ?extKCID=16231
>
> You may also try rebuilding the desktop files by holding the Apple and
> option keys during startup.
That won't fix it.
Peter McCallum
> peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com, Peter
> McCallum at peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com wrote on 2/4/01 11:26 AM:
>
> > The following article in the knowledge base at
> > http://www.apple.com/support/ should give you an idea what to do.
> > Basically apple says that you have a directory problem. You should
> > backup your hard drive and reformat it.
>
> No need. I have seen this problem and fixed it with Alsoft's Disk Warrior.
> It's a great program.
Thanks for that advice, I should get hold of a copy when the $Aussie
finally makes it back to a reasonable exchange rate.
I still think that the advice Apple gives in the article I refered to is
prudent:
If Disk First Aid cannot repair the problem, you should consider
backing up the data and reformatting the drive -- even if other
utilities give the drive a clean bill of health. Each disk
utility program is good at finding different problems. Trusting
your data to only one utility is never wise. The conflicting
reports are usually a sign that something is wrong with the file
system and it needs to be fixed.
You should at least do regular backups.
Denis Wright
> Thanks for that advice, I should get hold of a copy when the $Aussie
> finally makes it back to a reasonable exchange rate.
You could be waiting for quite a while! Good disk repair tools are worth
their weight in gold, especially when you think of the cost of buying a
new drive or taking your computer to a repair shop - for them to use the
same program to fix it.
Denis
--
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University of New England NSW 2351 AUSTRALIA
change mutz to metz and zap .invalid to make email work
Peter McCallum
Dubya to suffer the same fate as his father did with the US economy and
buy then.
Luke Maslen
peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com (Peter McCallum) wrote:
>I still think that the advice Apple gives in the article I refered to is
>prudent:
>
> If Disk First Aid cannot repair the problem, you should consider
> backing up the data and reformatting the drive -- even if other
> utilities give the drive a clean bill of health. Each disk
> utility program is good at finding different problems. Trusting
> your data to only one utility is never wise. The conflicting
> reports are usually a sign that something is wrong with the file
> system and it needs to be fixed.
>
>You should at least do regular backups.
Hi Peter,
Regular backups do indeed beat any repair. However, if your directory
structure is corrupt, you may find that you cannot back up your hard
disk as the Mac may crash during the backup. This is where a more
comprehensive tool that Disk First Aid will help. Unlike Disk First Aid
and other conventional disk repair utilities that often just patch over
problems in the directory structure, DiskWarrior will rebuild a perfect
new directory structure from scratch.
Directory structure corruption is a common problem and that is why Disk
First Aid is included with your Mac. If you rarely encounter a problem
that Disk First Aid cannot fix, then reformatting and restoring your
hard disk is a viable option. If you encounter the problem more
regularly, then a quick repair with a comprehensive repair tool will
save you a lot of time and frustration especially if you are using your
Mac for work.
In the meanwhile, keep those backups happening!
Regards,
Luke Maslen.
Peter McCallum
> Regular backups do indeed beat any repair. However, if your directory
> structure is corrupt, you may find that you cannot back up your hard
> disk as the Mac may crash during the backup. This is where a more
> comprehensive tool that Disk First Aid will help. Unlike Disk First Aid
> and other conventional disk repair utilities that often just patch over
> problems in the directory structure, DiskWarrior will rebuild a perfect
> new directory structure from scratch.
I've found that another solution if the directories are corrupted and
doing a rebuild using option-apple won't work is to make the desktop
files visible using resedit, move them to the trash, then restart. That
will build a complete new set of directories. Seems to work and is free!
Peter
J a s o n
They're just the desktop files, they are NOT the volume catalog etc., which
is what Disk First Aid, TechTool Pro, Norton Disk Doctor and DiskWarrior
repair...
--
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Haines | WWW: http://machome.w3.to/ | is to instruct him to hold in
| IRC: #macintosh channel | higher regard those who think alike
| IRC: client.oz.org | than those who Think Different"
Peter McCallum
probably a problem with desktop files being corrupted.
Peter
J a s o n
> That may very well be true but the original poster's problem is most
> probably a problem with desktop files being corrupted.
No, you're dead wrong.
Here's what he asked
"Disk First Aid reported a problem it could not repair:
Problem: Invalid PEOF, 62111, 1084"
Go read this technote about PEOF errors:
http://til.info.apple.com/techinfo.nsf/artnum/n16231
Peter McCallum
Have a look back to my first response to the original post, I
recommended reading that same article.
From memory the article says that if the physical end of file is a lower
number than the logical end of file then there is a problem because
there is less space allocated to the file than its actual size. Of
course that can't be a real situation, there must be a problem with the
way the filing system is working.
Now if the problem exists in one of the files that the computer uses as
it operating system or its filing system then the problem is likely to
cause hangs and crashes.
If you don't happen to have a copy of diskwarrior or some other similar
software on hand, or if disk first aid is showing up a problem and your
other software isn't, then the easiest way to work at resolving it would
be to start by removing the desktop files and restarting.
However I would recommend caution about this to a new user, as the
original poster said he was, due to the well known problems that can be
caused by people with a sudden fascination with the abilities of
resedit.
Hope this clears things up for you.
Peter
J a s o n <matreya@remove_mac.com> wrote:
J a s o n
> Hi Jason
> Have a look back to my first response to the original post, I
> recommended reading that same article.
>
> From memory the article says that if the physical end of file is a lower
> number than the logical end of file then there is a problem because
> there is less space allocated to the file than its actual size. Of
> course that can't be a real situation, there must be a problem with the
> way the filing system is working.
Big revelation there.
> Now if the problem exists in one of the files that the computer uses as
> it operating system or its filing system then the problem is likely to
> cause hangs and crashes.
>
> If you don't happen to have a copy of diskwarrior or some other similar
> software on hand, or if disk first aid is showing up a problem and your
> other software isn't, then the easiest way to work at resolving it would
> be to start by removing the desktop files and restarting.
Did you even read the technote I mentioned? Why on Earth do you think
it's the desktop files that are involved? You're simply assuming that
the desktop files, which can suffer from PEOF errors, are the culprit
because of your experiences.
> However I would recommend caution about this to a new user, as the
> original poster said he was, due to the well known problems that can be
> caused by people with a sudden fascination with the abilities of
> resedit.
Why does this user need to bother with ResEdit.
It's very simple. Disk First Aid doesn't repair PEOF errors, Norton
Disk Doctor, DiskWarrior and Tech Tool Pro *DO*
No VOODOO necessary.
> J a s o n <matreya@remove_mac.com> wrote:
> > In article <1erf13m.jwjppojbzll8N%peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com>,
> > Peter McCallum <peterm...@REMOVE.THIS.mac.com> wrote:
> >
> > > That may very well be true but the original poster's problem is most
> > > probably a problem with desktop files being corrupted.
> >
> > No, you're dead wrong.
> >
> > Here's what he asked
> >
> > "Disk First Aid reported a problem it could not repair:
> >
> > Problem: Invalid PEOF, 62111, 1084"
> >
> > Go read this technote about PEOF errors:
> >
> > http://til.info.apple.com/techinfo.nsf/artnum/n16231
--
Peter McCallum
I'll copy the text of the technote that you (and I) recommended reading:
TITLE Disk First Aid: Invalid PEOF Error
Article ID:16231
Created: 9/9/94
Modified: 3/10/99
TOPIC
Disk First Aid reports an "Invalid PEOF" error with some
numbers after it. It says it is unable to repair the problem.
Norton Utilities Disk Doctor reports no error could be found.
What is an Invalid PEOF?
DISCUSSION
An "invalid PEOF" is an invalid Physical End Of File.
This error means Disk First Aid found a problem with the length
of a particular file and cannot fix it. Macintosh files have two
end of file markers -- a Logical End Of File (LEOF) and a
Physical End Of File (PEOF). The logical end of file is the
number of bytes allocated to data in a file. The physical end of
file is the number of bytes currently allocated to the whole
file.
The Macintosh allocates "blocks" of space to files on a volume
(disk) for efficiency in reading/writing the files. The block
size varies depending on the volume size. Most files never
completely fill up their allocated blocks.
For example, if a given block size for a volume is set to 512K
bytes and a file is allocated 2 blocks (1024 bytes total in
file), a file with 650 bytes of data would have an LEOF of 650
and a PEOF of 1024, as this diagram illustrates:
<diagram omitted>
If the PEOF is less than the LEOF, then problems with reading a
file may occur. Disk First Aid is finding a PEOF allocation
problem. Of course, if this problem is in the Desktop files or
the System file, then system crashes and other anomalies may
result.
If Disk First Aid cannot repair the problem, you should consider
backing up the data and reformatting the drive -- even if other
utilities give the drive a clean bill of health. Each disk
utility program is good at finding different problems. Trusting
your data to only one utility is never wise. The conflicting
reports are usually a sign that something is wrong with the file
system and it needs to be fixed.
Firstly, from the topic paragraph we see that Apple says it is possible
for Disk First Aid to report errors while some of the software you have
recommended may to fail to detect them. As the last paragraph says each
utility has its own strengths and weaknesses. Don't trust any single
utility on its own.
Looking at the second-last paragraph you can see that problems similar
to those reported by the original poster can result from system or
desktop files corrupted with incompatible LEOFs and PEOFs.
The last paragraph says that the surest way to correct the problem would
be to do a backup and reformat the disk. However this can be tedious so
deleting the desktop files and forcing the system to recreate them will
resolve the problem (if that is where the problem lies). The easiest way
is to remove them and see what happens. It costs nothing to try and only
takes a minute or two.
Of course, if the problem persists, see your disk doctor.
See ya
Peter
J a s o n
> Hi Jason
> I'll copy the text of the technote that you (and I) recommended reading:
>
[Technote deleted]
>
> Firstly, from the topic paragraph we see that Apple says it is possible
> for Disk First Aid to report errors while some of the software you have
> recommended may to fail to detect them. As the last paragraph says each
> utility has its own strengths and weaknesses. Don't trust any single
> utility on its own.
If you look at the date, you'll find it's old, and I've found that Norton
Utilities Disk Doctor has fixed PEOF errors I've had.
> Looking at the second-last paragraph you can see that problems similar
> to those reported by the original poster can result from system or
> desktop files corrupted with incompatible LEOFs and PEOFs.
*can*. Most probably it's due to an earlier crash, where the cache hasn't
been flushed.
> The last paragraph says that the surest way to correct the problem would
> be to do a backup and reformat the disk. However this can be tedious so
> deleting the desktop files and forcing the system to recreate them will
> resolve the problem (if that is where the problem lies). The easiest way
> is to remove them and see what happens. It costs nothing to try and only
> takes a minute or two.
*IF*
> Of course, if the problem persists, see your disk doctor.
Just cut to the right solution, have a better disk repair program than
Disk First Aid.