Overseas number plates on cars in NSW
Tim Stevens
I live in Sydney, and am starting to see an increased number of
cars around the place (mainly euros, things like VWs, SAABs etc etc)
displaying overseas number plates - mainly plates from the UK, but have
seen some german ones as well. I happen to think that it looks quite
cool, and am keen to find out how they get away with doing it, as I have
an Audi A3 and think it would be really neat to get some german or UK
plates for my car (not hard to get them, trust me) :)
Does anybody know anything about this? (Like what the rules are, what
the penalties are for doing it (if any), what reason you'd have to have
to be allowed etc etc)
Thanks in advance
--
Tim Stevens
Australia
98 A3 Motorsport
http://nswtech.com/tim
David Z
on both the front and rear of the car.
But over in america for example, you only need plates on the rear. My
parents had a 'license plate' on the front of the car saying "Pompano Beach
Acura"
put there by the dealer, they never bothered removing it...
Other people would simply have nothing, while others would have stupid
things like "I heart NY"
I guess if someone wanted to put a euro plate or UK plate, nothing would be
stopping them :)
"Tim Stevens" <tste...@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:3A72640C...@optushome.com.au...
Garry
Tim Stevens wrote:
>
> Hello all,
> I live in Sydney, and am starting to see an increased number of
> cars around the place (mainly euros, things like VWs, SAABs etc etc)
> displaying overseas number plates - mainly plates from the UK, but have
> seen some german ones as well.
There are allowances in special circumstances for manufacturers to use
foreign registered vehicles for "testing and evaluation" purposes, and
for certain race vehicles to carry their foreign plates while in
Australia. For example, Audi may have vehicles here on evaluation, or
Possum Bourne has his rally car here for rallies, he still carries his
NZ plates, BUT, these vehicles have specific approvals and conditions
attached to their not being registered in this country. In other words,
they are operating by specific arrangement.
We in Australia are not used to this happening, one can not drive across
an international border like is possible in the Americas, Europe or
Asia.
> I happen to think that it looks quite
> cool, and am keen to find out how they get away with doing it, as I > have
> an Audi A3 and think it would be really neat to get some german or UK
> plates for my car (not hard to get them, trust me) :)
>
> Does anybody know anything about this? (Like what the rules are, what
> the penalties are for doing it (if any), what reason you'd have to have
> to be allowed etc etc)
My understanding of the current rules in Australia is that all motor
vehicles, other than those which have specific approval not to, are
required to carry a registration plate both front and rear, which must
be visible to certain specifications as defined under relevant Acts etc.
There is also an offence, referring to displaying something that
resembles a registration plate, for example, a home made plate or one
that says "COP BAIT" as one that I have knowledge of.
Having said all that, if you were to have both required Australian
plates affixed according to the rules, and another say German plate,
which had clearly expired and could not be mistaken for the Australian
plate (when photographic evidence of an offence were involved, like a
speed camera) I am not sure how that would be classed. IMO it would be
like a sign or emblem, provided it were not mounted in place of a
required plate.
For NSW I am sure Shane and Spooky can set you straight, but why not
just ring the RTA and ask them?
Garry
Spooky
They are displaying unauthorised plates. Unless they have a permit from
the RTA for some reason or another (motor show, promotion, transportaion),
they are not authorised to display these plates. You are not even allowed
to
put on an extra plate, like i have seen. In other words, displaying your
valid
plates as well as another one from "TEXAS" for example.
Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on the back
of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
Any permit to display unauthorised plates are usually time limited.
Spooky
>
Spooky
"David Z" <bz...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:6Rtc6.86350$xW4.6...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> well I dont know about Sydney, but down here in Melb we have to have
plates
> on both the front and rear of the car.
> But over in america for example, you only need plates on the rear. My
> parents had a 'license plate' on the front of the car saying "Pompano
Beach
> Acura"
> put there by the dealer, they never bothered removing it...
> Other people would simply have nothing, while others would have stupid
> things like "I heart NY"
>
> I guess if someone wanted to put a euro plate or UK plate, nothing would
be
> stopping them :)
No you're not allowed to. Not in NSW anyway.
Spooky
Tim Stevens
stuck on over the top (obviously the UK plates are much larger than ours)
would that be naughty?
thanks
tim...
Spooky
> I did see a new VW Passat with UK plates on, but the proper NSW plates
were
> stuck on over the top (obviously the UK plates are much larger than ours)
>
> would that be naughty?
Absolutely.
Spooky
Winkingdog
Tim Stevens <tste...@optushome.com.au> wrote in message
news:3A72640C...@optushome.com.au...
Terry
spook...@icqmail.com says...
> plates as well as another one from "TEXAS" for example.
> Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on the back
> of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
> Any permit to display unauthorised plates are usually time limited.
>
So people who drive around (eg to and from mechanic) with a unregoed car
having traffic is illegal?
Bob Milutinovic
> Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on
> the back of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
Now that you've reminded me... Can anybody tell me what the origins of
this stupid practice are?
My immediate reaction to seeing something like this (or a vehicle with
no plate at all) is to distance myself as much as possible, as I'd have no
recourse if we were involved in an altercation ("Did someone get that car's
rego?" "What rego?!")
So... Who can enlighten me as to why so many people seem to think
throwing a chunk of cardboard with "TRAFFIC" (or "TRAFIC" or even "TREFIK"!)
written on it allows them to drive on public roads without a registration
plate?
- Bob.
--
Save a Tree - Eat a Beaver!
Better still, Save the World - Kill a Septic!
Phil L
> So people who drive around (eg to and from mechanic) with a unregoed car
> having traffic is illegal?
Only way to drive an un-rego'd car (in WA at least) is to get a permit
to do so from the Dept. of Transport...
Only costs something like $12, and lasts for 48 hours... and you do have
to inform the DoT when you get the permit where you will be going...
(Although you can be fairly general, and make sure you give more
locations than you need... :-)
I've done this twice while re-registering a car, and only got pulled up
once... acutally was stopped at lights, waiting to turn right about 500m
from the inspection centre, when a cop car in the left hand lane and
well in front spotted me, and put his lights on.... :-)
(Strangely enough, that was by far the shorter of the 2 trips...)
--
Phil L.
ICQ: 26289546
Mobile: 0403 05 2070
Photo's and Information from Wanneroo (Barbagallo) Raceway, including
Sports Sedans.
http://www.iinet.net.au/~hibeach/
WA Sporting Car Club e-mail list: wascc-s...@egroups.com
Spooky
"Terry" <aus_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:poxc6.11992$BU4....@news1.blktn1.nsw.optushome.com.au...
Yes, very illegal. I don't know where the trend started to put "traffic"
on their car, but you may as well put a big sign on the car saying
"hey look at me, I'm driving an unregistered car.." The actual driving
of the unregistered car may not be illegal in some circumstances, but
displaying a "traffic" plate is illegal in ALL circumstances.
Spooky
Spooky
"Bob Milutinovic" <tr...@no.spam.bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:3a72...@bn.ar.com.au...
> G'day, Spooky...
>
> > Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on
> > the back of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
>
> Now that you've reminded me... Can anybody tell me what the origins of
> this stupid practice are?
>
> My immediate reaction to seeing something like this (or a vehicle with
> no plate at all) is to distance myself as much as possible, as I'd have no
> recourse if we were involved in an altercation ("Did someone get that
car's
> rego?" "What rego?!")
>
> So... Who can enlighten me as to why so many people seem to think
> throwing a chunk of cardboard with "TRAFFIC" (or "TRAFIC" or even
"TREFIK"!)
> written on it allows them to drive on public roads without a registration
> plate?
Exactly. It's some fable that has caught on over the years, but it's highly
illegal. And, as you rightly point out, should they have a prang, there is
no
insurance to cover any damage, or worse, no CTP to cover personal injury.
Spooky
Jeremy, Kathy or Croak
Australian State or Territory number plate's. The vehicle must also display
the "AUS" sticker which is available from your relevant motoring
organisation.
This sticker does not have the nations flag, merely the country designation
in black print over a white ground, with an oval black rim.
The 'AUS' sticker is an international requirement that tells foreign
authorities that the vehicle is registered in Australia. All countries get
their own unique 'nationality plate' stickers.
A car registered in the EU 'state' of Germany, therefore will display the
letter "D" within the flag of the European Union. This is a later
development having the 'state' designation within the EU flag.
It tells Spooky or Shane et al, that the vehicle they are following is
registered in Germany. To NOT have this sticker is an offence in most
countries, strictly speaking it is here too.
An American registered vehicle on a tour of Australia must display the "USA"
sticker. From the Netherlands it must display the "NL" sticker and so on.
The nationality plate sticker must be placed near the rear number plate. It
tells police only WHERE the vehicle is registered, not the nationality of
the driver.
Foreign registered vehicles are permitted to drive in Australia for a time
under International reciprocal arrangements. The vehicle must usually leave
the country within 12 months or then be registered locally and any duties
paid.
If the vehicle has obvious foreign plates WITH Australian number plates
fitted on top, or near, this is an offence. Spooky has mentioned this.
If an Australian registered vehicle has a nationality plate sticker, for
example from England, "GB", this is an offence.
I won't enter the debate on wank cheap USA plates designed for Aussie - USA
wannabes. A form of rice of fatburger?
Jeremy H. Pritchard
Motorists Advocate
jp...@wxc.com.au
Garry
"Jeremy, Kathy or Croak" wrote:
<snip>
>
> Foreign registered vehicles are permitted to drive in Australia for a time
> under International reciprocal arrangements. The vehicle must usually leave
> the country within 12 months or then be registered locally and any duties
> paid.
You know I thought the officials at the California DMV were out of their
tree when they, and my insurer there, told me that I could drive my
Californian registered car in Australia, and be covered for CTP etc.
Even the insurance company said they would cover the car. The big
problem then was that is was left hand drive, that would be a problem
here. But, they would not refund my registration and tax fees because
the US has a reciprocal agreement with Australia and as far as they were
concerned, my car was legally registered in California, so therefore
could be used throughout the world, well anywhere where US has
reciprocal agreement.
So maybe they were right after all.
<snip again>
> I won't enter the debate on wank cheap USA plates designed for Aussie - > USA
> wannabes. A form of rice of fatburger?
Hope you're not referring to US shaped plates for US cars here in
Australia ;)
There is no way that a standard format Australian plate can be fitted to
the rear of my 94 Camaro, it would have to be severely bent to fit the
opening. Oh yeah, and Queensland Transport can't even get the hole
alignment on the plates to match the US standard. Their comment was that
each state may have a different attachment hole layout, tell that to GM
who just happen to make just two holes in the bumper to attach the
plates! When I took them my genuine US plate in to demonstrate the
offset, they said, too bad, that is how we make them, you will have to
drill extra holes in your bumper, you can't drill holes in your plate.
Fat chance! ;) Now got oblong holes in the plate!
Garry
Matt
> example from England, "GB", this is an offence.
If that's the case then I know no less than 20 cars in one particular suburb
will get fined easily...one of those cars have got 3 stickers up the back which
says NL!
Matt
Bob Milutinovic
> If that's the case then I know no less than 20 cars in one particular
> suburb will get fined easily...one of those cars have got 3 stickers
> up the back which says NL!
They're bloody middle-aged rice-boys if you ask me!
Jeremy, Kathy or Croak
"Matt" <ma...@popsmoppy.com> wrote in message
news:3A73D87E...@popsmoppy.com...
Absolutely, only because Australian State police are completely unfamiliar
with the 'offence'. Reciprocal protocol is more rigorously enforced in
European countries though where an 'obvious' cross-territory flow of traffic
exists.
Remember Matt, that only applies if the "NL" is black print over a white
ground, with a black rim. (Usually in an oval shape) If the sticker has
the Netherlands flag, then it is not the official NL nationality plate. It
may instead reflect the nationality of the driver, or previous owner?
I pulled over a British registered Jag a couple of years ago on the F3 north
of Caltex -Wyong, and asked the tourists had their AA issued them with the
"GB" nationality plate as required. They had. I had them fit it on the
spot.
I cringe sometimes when I see Aussies preparing to take their vehicles
overseas. They not only 'forget', or are not advised that they must fit the
"AUS" nationality plate as it is a legal requirement, but that they should
also buy a warning triangle meeting ECE38, as even foreign countries insist
on them. (You can see another small reason why I push mandatory hazard
warning triangles complying UN/ECE27R). I advise them that they 'should'
also fit a rear fog light as I had suggested in the NRMA's 'Overseas
Motoring' handbook. It is clear from experience that the Australian AA and
all it's state counterparts must 'improve' this communication.
I will update this information by Wednesday. Australian police 'must' get
up to date on this stuff. Not the greatest issue, but simple enough to
remember.
If ever $$'s allow, I'd recommend you take an Aussie registered car overseas
on a working holiday perhaps? You will enjoy the experience. I intend to
do this about April 2003 starting from Malaysia into EU.
Jeremy H. Pritchard
Motorists Advocate
jp...@wxc.com.au
> Matt
Jeremy, Kathy or Croak
"Garry" <ghaw...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:3A73973C...@bigpond.net.au...
>
>
> "Jeremy, Kathy or Croak" wrote:
> <snip>
> >
> > Foreign registered vehicles are permitted to drive in Australia for a
time
> > under International reciprocal arrangements. The vehicle must usually
leave
> > the country within 12 months or then be registered locally and any
duties
> > paid.
>
> You know I thought the officials at the California DMV were out of their
> tree when they, and my insurer there, told me that I could drive my
> Californian registered car in Australia, and be covered for CTP etc.
> Even the insurance company said they would cover the car. The big
> problem then was that is was left hand drive, that would be a problem
> here.
To register the car locally is the only problem seeing as how it is LHD. To
'drive' it no,- for those 12 months providing that the US - AA supplied you
with the "USA" nationality plate. Remember this, and if necessary demand
it. Email me if you have this problem Stateside.
It is not the job of the DMV to issue you witht the sticker, they should, if
they are a 'knowledgeable' organisation, have sent you in the right
direction, that is to the United States AA.
But, they would not refund my registration and tax fees because
> the US has a reciprocal agreement with Australia and as far as they were
> concerned, my car was legally registered in California, so therefore
> could be used throughout the world, well anywhere where US has
> reciprocal agreement.
Yes.
All governments want your money. This surprises no one and is a normal fact
of life!
> So maybe they were right after all.
Yes.
> There is no way that a standard format Australian plate can be fitted to
> the rear of my 94 Camaro, it would have to be severely bent to fit the
> opening. Oh yeah, and Queensland Transport can't even get the hole
> alignment on the plates to match the US standard.
Of course not, they are not meant to Gary. With the exception of the USA,
to a lesser extent Canada and South America, the remainder of world uses
United Nations standards. The narrow US plate spacings are on the way out.
You will note that many newer US market vehicles (Chrysler for example) now
have European 'width' number plate spacing. This is for a long term
uniformity reason. Despite this, many US States will continue to use their
traditional narrow plates (the new NY plate is an example) which will fit
'within' the world standard spacing. It means the US States are free to
depart from their narrow width plates 'if' they decide too. This 'state'
decision would occur once the existing vehicle fleet is replaced with new
models with the wide 'world' standard spacing. Some years away.
(PS - the Aurora is the first US made vehicle with standard rear fog lights
for that market, yet not one state learner driver handbook has 'usage' text,
NY-DMV has accepted mine and will use it Late 2001:-).
QLD Transport are not responsible for US models. I can appreciate your
frustration, though remember that with time, these issues will lessen as
seemingly 'simple' things are unified on a world scale.
The issue that you import and convert a US model for Australian registration
means 'you' have to modify the US vehicle to support your Australian states
number plate parameters.
Hell, write GM USA a letter having them adopt UN width plate spacings, like
Chrysler:-)
Their comment was that
> each state may have a different attachment hole layout, tell that to GM
> who just happen to make just two holes in the bumper to attach the
> plates! When I took them my genuine US plate in to demonstrate the
> offset, they said, too bad, that is how we make them, you will have to
> drill extra holes in your bumper, you can't drill holes in your plate.
> Fat chance! ;) Now got oblong holes in the plate!
Great fun eh?
Jeremy .H Pritchard
Motorists Advocate
jp...@wxc.com.au
Jeremy, Kathy or Croak
Just a correction:-
> I cringe sometimes when I see Aussies preparing to take their vehicles
> overseas. They not only 'forget', or are not advised that they must fit
the
> "AUS" nationality plate as it is a legal requirement, but that they should
> also buy a warning triangle meeting ECE27R, as even foreign countries
insist
ECE27R is the correction.
Garry
"Jeremy, Kathy or Croak" wrote:
<snip>
> > There is no way that a standard format Australian plate can be fitted to
> > the rear of my 94 Camaro, it would have to be severely bent to fit the
> > opening. Oh yeah, and Queensland Transport can't even get the hole
> > alignment on the plates to match the US standard.
>
> Of course not, they are not meant to Gary. With the exception of the > USA,
Sorry Jeremy, I did not explain well enough, I meant on the "US Format"
plates I ordered from QT to fit into the moulded plate recess on the
rear bumper (the car doesn't even come standard with a front plate
mounting point, it is an option for those states which require them).
And then, as explained later, they got the holes to not match the
standard "US Format" holes in the car. Seems I wasn't the only one to
complain either, nearly everyone else I know with an american car with
these plates has had to elongate the holes to get them to fit.
Also, I am considering a request to take my car back to the US either
May 2002 or 2003 for a Chevrolet gathering, and being able to drive it
may well tip the balance in favour of doing it. The shipping is about
A$3500 return, which the organisers may well pick up. Just getting
insurance may be a problem though, I doubt my insurer here will cover me
in the States, but I will ask.
--
Regards,
Garry Hawgood
Adam
Spooky wrote in message ...
>
>They are displaying unauthorised plates. Unless they have a permit from
>the RTA for some reason or another (motor show, promotion, transportaion),
>they are not authorised to display these plates. You are not even allowed
>to
>put on an extra plate, like i have seen. In other words, displaying your
>valid
>plates as well as another one from "TEXAS" for example.
>Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on the back
>of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
>Any permit to display unauthorised plates are usually time limited.
>
>Spooky
Hmmm.
Just say I had a big sticker on my back bumper, near my number plate,
proclaiming "TRUST" or GREDDY", would you bust me? ;-)
At any rate I would expect to get pulled over and beaten silly with the
nightstick! ;-)
Cheers,
ADam
Spooky
"Adam" <vp...@nospamautospeed.com> wrote in message
news:98073978...@shelley.paradise.net.nz...
>
> Spooky wrote in message ...
>
> >
> >They are displaying unauthorised plates. Unless they have a permit from
> >the RTA for some reason or another (motor show, promotion,
transportaion),
> >they are not authorised to display these plates. You are not even
allowed
> >to
> >put on an extra plate, like i have seen. In other words, displaying your
> >valid
> >plates as well as another one from "TEXAS" for example.
> >Even writing "TRAFFIC" on a piece of cardboard and putting it on the back
> >of your car is displaying an unauthorised plate.
> >Any permit to display unauthorised plates are usually time limited.
> >
> >Spooky
>
>
> Hmmm.
>
> Just say I had a big sticker on my back bumper, near my number plate,
> proclaiming "TRUST" or GREDDY", would you bust me? ;-)
No, a sticker is not a plate. :)
Spooky
Terry
spook...@icqmail.com says...
> Yes, very illegal. I don't know where the trend started to put "traffic"
> on their car, but you may as well put a big sign on the car saying
> "hey look at me, I'm driving an unregistered car.." The actual driving
> of the unregistered car may not be illegal in some circumstances, but
> displaying a "traffic" plate is illegal in ALL circumstances.
I always tried to figure where the "traffic" plate came from :)
Driving a unregistered car to and from the mechanics or local garage is
ok though? Only if it is for registration purposes and I guess the
closest repairer / RTA is to your area?
Neil Fisher
You'd have to assume so - after all, to get an unregistered vehicle
permit, you need a pink slip. So to get a blue slip, you have to get
the car to an AUVIS, which means you need an unregistered vehicle
permit, so you need a pink slip. If you can't *drive* to the AVIS
place to get a pink slip, the only option is to tow it - and if you're
gonna do that, you may as well tow it to an AUVIS straight up. Fun,
innit? Trying to figure all this crap out, that is.
Neil
---
Neil Fisher / Bob Young
Thundercords
personal opinion unless otherwise noted.
Looking for spark plug leads?
Check out http://www.magnecor.com.au
Ennui Society
Nope. Not every state in USA is same! Most states requires BOTH front and rear
numberplates. Michigan, Oklahoma, and few other states do not need front ones.
You're lucky you can get Lilliputian-grade NSW numberplates for front bumpers
whilst we have to put up with standardised size for both front and rear. Woeful
look for the high performance cars!
Oliver
David Z wrote:
> But over in america for example, you only need plates on the rear. My parents
> had a 'license plate' on the front of the car saying "Pompano Beach Acura"
> put there by the dealer, they never bothered removing it...Other people would
David Z
rear
> numberplates. Michigan, Oklahoma, and few other states do not need front
ones.
Florida doesn't require them on the front either. Its much better,
especially with aerodynamic sports cars, where a flat square plate on the
front just ruins the whole thing.... cars aren't meant to have plates at
the front - thats why at the back, there's a nice flat square space to put
them, but on the front the bumper is usually curved without any thought
given to where a plate might be put...
Christopher Smith
Also nicely reduces the effective range of lidar and radar :).