ATTN Mechanics : Holden Rodao 1991 2.6 petrol isuzu(Wont Run)

[CyBorg 0091]

Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
eye on bearing caps etc.

This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
key way slipped 180 out.
new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
sides. all seem to be mechanical all ok but it refuses to run
have checked the fuel pump best we can it is getting fuel moisture in
the cylinders ,but this pump only seems to run when the ignition is
turned first is the normal?second is there a way to check this pump
and can i get it to fire without the pump,mate dose not like wd40 but
this model has a n airflow meter I think so the manifold has to be
done up for it to run.....is this correct.????

Been on this one all day so help is great thank in advance to all.

PS I will be following this group for a day or so.

--
CybOrg
Nissan Navara DX 3.0
VG30e and five speed is cool

[Noddy]

On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
> eye on bearing caps etc.
>
> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
> key way slipped 180 out.
> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
> sides. all seem to be mechanical all ok but it refuses to run
> have checked the fuel pump best we can it is getting fuel moisture in
> the cylinders ,but this pump only seems to run when the ignition is
> turned first is the normal?second is there a way to check this pump
> and can i get it to fire without the pump,mate dose not like wd40 but
> this model has a n airflow meter I think so the manifold has to be
> done up for it to run.....is this correct.????
>
> Been on this one all day so help is great thank in advance to all.

Has it got *spark*?

Start with the basics. Check for spark. Disconnect the fuel line at a
convenient junction and aim the line into a container to see if there's
any fuel pressure. Try cranking the engine while spraying aerostart or
some such into the induction air stream.

A few more details might help. Is it a carburetted engine or is it EFI?

> PS I will be following this group for a day or so.

It might take Babblefish longer than that to translate your post.


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[D Walford]

On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
> eye on bearing caps etc.
>
> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
> key way slipped 180 out.
> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
> sides.

If the engine was running before the problem with the balancer why stuff
around with unrelated parts?
I'm not familiar with that engine, does it have a T belt or a chain?
I'd be checking that the key way on the crank that drives either the T
belt or the chain hasn't also broken which can happen if the balancer
comes loose.
Not sure if it applies with your engine but some engines have a crank
angle sensor under the balancer which may have been damaged when the
balancer came loose.

all seem to be mechanical all ok but it refuses to run
> have checked the fuel pump best we can it is getting fuel moisture in
> the cylinders ,but this pump only seems to run when the ignition is
> turned first is the normal?

Yes.

second is there a way to check this pump

If it runs then stops after about 20secs with the key turned on it
appears to working correctly, the pump won't run unless the computer
tells it the engine is running, this is to prevent it continuing to pump
after a crash.


Daryl

[Albm&ctd]

In article <4a68f802-c597-45b5...@rk3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...
> dose
>
2 aspirin

Al
--
I don't take sides.
It's more fun to insult everyone.

[Fraser Johnston]

A bit of punctuation instead of just keyboard dihorrea is probably going
to help you get an answer. Here are some suggestions. Full stops, use
them. Capitals, use them. Paragraphs ,use them.

Fraser

[Jason James]

On Sunday, January 22, 2012 3:21:28 PM UTC+11, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
> like Jason James

Thanx for the wrap,..but I'm not a mechanic :-)

athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
> eye on bearing caps etc.
>
> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
> key way slipped 180 out.
> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
> sides. all seem to be mechanical all ok but it refuses to run

Is it EFI or carby? If its an electric pump, its most likely EFI.

> have checked the fuel pump best we can it is getting fuel moisture in
> the cylinders ,but this pump only seems to run when the ignition is
> turned first is the normal?

Yes.

second is there a way to check this pump

If you can access the fuel rail supplying the injectors,..or the fuel connection to the petrol-filter,..undo it [you may need to fit a new sealing washer afterwrds,..so if it the fuel-filter, buy a new washer from Holden for when you connect the line again]then turn the ignition on for literally a second, while a helper checks to see if petrol spurts out.

> and can i get it to fire without the pump,mate dose not like wd40 but
> this model has a n airflow meter I think so the manifold has to be
> done up for it to run.....is this correct.????

If you have the inlet manifold off,..it isnt about to run :-)

>
> Been on this one all day so help is great thank in advance to all.
>
> PS I will be following this group for a day or so.

The old equation,..you need fuel...air...spark to run. Assuming your ignition and valve timJason

[CyBorg 0091]

> Noddy.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

hi sorry for my odd post of little to go on all.
it is a 1991 Holden redao 26.l efi 4ze1 enine(I think)
I went through the entire valve train and ignition and fuel but to no
avail,even hooked 12v right to the pumpand turned her overstill no
go,still sounds like it is 180 out poping and farting on one of the
stokes intermitently,if it even fires at all.
It has spake at number one and so on all checked.
will a sensor stop it from running or note,?
The next thing I did was hook in to the computer to try to retrive
codes but the code was a continuous flash of the check engine
light,not telling me anything i knew lol,what dose this mean on the
4ze1 ?
I even hooked 12v to the fuelpumpand forced it not after reading these
posts but it still did not really even want to go just poped like it
was 180 out still sensor?

thansk again Noddy

[CyBorg 0091]

thanks dayl,i explained as much as i know in my reply to noddy,thanks
for confirming the pump and it is timing belt not chain and it slipped
and caused it to stop running.

[Noddy]

On 22/01/2012 7:58 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> I even hooked 12v to the fuelpumpand forced it not after reading these
> posts but it still did not really even want to go just poped like it
> was 180 out still sensor?

Where's the cam timing at?

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Clocky]

"CyBorg 0091" <jjb...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4a68f802-c597-45b5...@rk3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
> eye on bearing caps etc.
>
> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
> key way slipped 180 out.
> new balancer

Replace the timing belt and tensioner and make sure the valve timing is set
up correctly.

.

[j...@nothome.com]

On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
> eye on bearing caps etc.
>
> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
> key way slipped 180 out.
> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
> sides.

Are you related to Jonz by any chance? ;> )

Cheers
DAVO

[Jeßus]

Nah. He may have poor grammar, but at least his arms can reach still
the keyboard. I wonder if Jonz's helper monkey gets bored of it's
usual routine - doing all the typing and constantly fetching pies?

[Jeßus]

On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 09:43:55 +1100, Jeßus <no...@all.invalid> wrote:

>On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 08:34:54 +1000, <j...@nothome.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>>> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
>>> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
>>> eye on bearing caps etc.
>>>
>>> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
>>> key way slipped 180 out.
>>> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
>>> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
>>> sides.
>>
>>Are you related to Jonz by any chance? ;> )
>
>Nah. He may have poor grammar, but at least his arms can reach still
>the keyboard.

Arrgh. "Can still reach the keyboard".

[CyBorg 0091]

I personally checked and double checked the cam timing,could not find
anything wrong.
all I found is that someone had set the tappets to a different sequ.
starting with number 4 and the rest forgientiome,i corrtected the
valve to run at 1342 after being told this was the fire order and
thats how the leads were too.

this is a 4ze1 i am pretty sureI have a manual for it seems the efi
model but it says to set the cam timeing at tdc when cylinder number 4
is on the compression stoke....can you tell me what this means...?

thansk again

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 22, 11:28 pm, "Clocky" <notg...@happen.com> wrote:
> "CyBorg 0091" <jjbr...@gmail.com> wrote in message

done this spent almost couple hours on it.
the instuctionswere different from the manual the guy was following to
what seems to be the case with the engine.

everything lines up new timing belt and tensoioner the white dot and
cam dowl are at the top as is the ballance wheel ,number one is at tdc
and also the distribbutor seems to be sparking here to.

It all sounds 180 out and electrical.pops

got to find out what a continuos flash in the ECU means

thanks again

[CyBorg 0091]

have not used a computer for a while let aloneusenet so it was pretty
rough and ready lol

[Albm&ctd]

In article <557a5153-6778-405e...@p3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...

http://www.justanswer.com/car/0ydk6-timing-marks-1989-isuzu-2-6-4ze1-
cylinder.html

Maybe that might help you.

[Noddy]

On 23/01/2012 1:48 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> I personally checked and double checked the cam timing,could not find
> anything wrong.

Fair enough.

> all I found is that someone had set the tappets to a different sequ.
> starting with number 4 and the rest forgientiome,i corrtected the
> valve to run at 1342 after being told this was the fire order and
> thats how the leads were too.

This particular paragraph doesn't make a whole heap of sense.

Let's run through some basics.

This is a 1991 Holden Rodeo with an inline 4 cylinder engine, right?
Does it have a timing chain or a timing belt?

I have no idea what you mean in saying someone has set the valve
clearances to a "different sequence", but if I were you before I did
anything else I'd do a compression test to make sure there are no valves
that aren't seating properly.

You mentioned some fuck-up with the crank key way, and it's likely that
the cam timing got moved and may have bent a few valves.

> this is a 4ze1 i am pretty sureI have a manual for it

You're pretty sure?

I don't know what manual you're using, but it either covers the model in
question or it doesn't.

> seems the efi model but it says to set the cam timeing at tdc when cylinder number 4
> is on the compression stoke....can you tell me what this means...?

It doesn't mean anything other than that's where the manufacturer has
positioned the cam when the timing marks are aligned.

It's not important. All that *is* important is that the timing marks are
aligned correctly.


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Fraser Johnston]

On 23/01/12 10:55 AM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> got to find out what a continuos flash in the ECU means
>
> thanks again

You can get ODB2 usb cables on ebay for 20 bucks or so. If you like
spannering it is a must have.

--

Fraser

[Clocky]

Not sure if that is going to help him, I don't think the '91 Rodeo is
ODB-II.

[Jeßus]

I wasn't aware of these even exisitng, thanks!
I'll have to look into these.

------
If a man says something in the woods and there are no women there, is he still wrong? ? Steven Wright

[CyBorg 0091]

This one has a female pin you just loopp the black /yellow with the
red/black
on the isuzu forums I found the error codes but nothing for a
continuos flash of the check engine light

thanks again

[CyBorg 0091]

sorry I cannot neatly post your replys,using server
keyboard(littleone)

It is timing belt ,bent valves explains the pop,sortof,its comming
from the crank case cover.
what is the most easy way to check for bent valves compression check?
I will follow the timeing marks they are already correct.

thanks again

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 24, 12:59 am, Fraser Johnston <fra...@cjmanagement.com.au>
wrote:

hate spannering,just trying to get it to go the loop and engine check
light should give me all the info i need just it flashes lol

[Clocky]

Yes, a compression test but if you have tried adjusting the valves you might
want to read the following and recheck them before you bother with a
compression test. If you don't have adequate compression after rechecking
your valve clearances, you have some bent valves.

But before you do that, are you sure your valve clearances are correct as on
those engines they are critical (they burn valves if you don't get it right,
or if tight they will drop compression).

The sequence for doing the valve clearances is 1342, IOW the firing order
which is what I think you were rambling about before.

Start by getting #1 "on the rock"
Use this as your guide, in this order as you turn the motor over after
checking each pair of valve clearances per cylinder;

#1 on the rock = check #4 clearances
#3 on the rock = check #2 clearances
#4 on the rock = check #1 clearances
#2 on the rock = check #3 clearances

Set the clearances to .05 mm larger than what the manual states as that was
a factory recommendation at the time to prevent valves burning prematurely
(which was a very common problem early on). From memory that would bring
them up to .20mm for inlet and .25 for exhaust.

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 23, 4:54 pm, Albm&ctd <alb_mandctdNO...@connexus.net.au> wrote:
> In article <557a5153-6778-405e-bce5-6bf47aac8...@p3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> jjbr...@gmail.com says...

> It's more fun to insult everyone.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

could not get to that link

[Clocky]

"CyBorg 0091" <jjb...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:4f88665e-9c6c-456c...@kg1g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

Might mean there is no error.

Try disconnecting one of the sensors and see if you get a code. If it goes
back to continuous flash after reconnecting it likely means it's the "no
error" flash code.

[Clocky]

"CyBorg 0091" <jjb...@gmail.com> wrote in message

news:019f56da-b154-4305...@c9g2000pbh.googlegroups.com...

The info you get is likely to be very limited. I think you have a hardware
issue, not an electronic one.

[CyBorg 0091]

> them up to  .20mm for inlet and .25 for exhaust.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

ok thanks,checked valves again to day and reset,found out how to do so
on gemini fourms.
I don't think valves are bent.
checked them for the secound time my way and they were right on,have
already been warned on the vales,it was running rough before and the
guy was told to check valves

the fire order is 1342 but the distribor sits on number 4 at tdc i
found out.on these engines,makes little sense.
it is sparking and getting fuel the plugs damp,

according to the manual it says the computer will bypass problems and
still allow the engine to run,
from the gemini forums some said these were boat anchors when they
don't run.others live with them every day and even lay 10incs of
rubber with them the 4ze1 lol

thanks again
is the plug you were talking of to go right into the ecu under the
dash or kickboad

[Albm&ctd]

In article <8b34515d-6485-4f73...@so8g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...

Learn how to copy and paste into your browser.
Go back to my post and block the whole link and Ctrl-c
Ctrl-v into your browser.

Jeesus H fark*n Christmus past

[Albm&ctd]

In article <4f1e1cce$0$29980$c3e8da3$5496...@news.astraweb.com>,
not...@happen.com says...

Seems there were two diffent timing setups, one off No 4 and the other off No 1.
Maybe he's got a later engine in that vehicle?

[Albm&ctd]

In article <4f88665e-9c6c-456c...@kg1g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...

That's obviously the - leave me alone, I've had enough - flash sequence.

[Clocky]

Did you do it my way?

> I don't think valves are bent.
> checked them for the secound time my way

"Your way" isn't working too well for you, maybe you should try it the
proper way.
You're in here asking for advice, only to ignore it. I think we have been
here before...

>
> the fire order is 1342 but the distribor sits on number 4 at tdc i
> found out.on these engines,makes little sense.

They're just a normal 4 cyl engine, they make perfect sense.

> it is sparking and getting fuel the plugs damp,
>

If the plugs are wet, clean and dry them. Oily plugs won't fire.
Take the dizzy out and move it 180 degrees. Failing that (some are keyed so
the dizzy can only go in one way), the cog that drives the distributor gear
(maybe driven by the timing belt) is out of whack. If you post a pic of the
motor I'll give you some pointers.

> according to the manual it says the computer will bypass problems and
> still allow the engine to run,

Not if the dizzy timing is out it won't. The computer can't compensate for a
fucked up setup.

> from the gemini forums some said these were boat anchors when they
> don't run.others live with them every day and even lay 10incs of
> rubber with them the 4ze1 lol
>
> thanks again

The performance of the motors is overstated. They are neither boat anchors
or rubber layers, but a fairly solid workhorse engine if maintained
correctly.

> is the plug you were talking of to go right into the ecu under the
> dash or kickboad

Forget the computer, you have fuel and spark. Do you have an injector pulse?
If not, the CAS isn't working and symptoms can be that the injectors are
held open, flooding the engine. That would also explain why the plugs are
wet.

BTW, you should assume you know nothing and follow sound advice.

[Clocky]

#1 still needs to fire at the right time, so he either needs to move the
dizzy 180 degrees (and if he hasn't had it out he should touch it) or his
timing is out and he needs to reset it so that the distributor points to #1
when #1 is on the TDC on the firing stroke.

[JONZ]

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~``
Hmmmm, Remember the sound you get when you reach the bottom of the
milkshake container??...
>
>

[Albm&ctd]

In article <4f1e4ea3$0$29986$c3e8da3$5496...@news.astraweb.com>,
not...@happen.com says...

Don't try and explain the basic to him or you'll end up needing medication,
probably chloroform to relax.

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 2:47 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> ok thanks,checked valves again to day and reset,found out how to do so
> on gemini fourms.
> I don't think valves are bent.

You don't think or you know?

Compression test the engine. Otherwise you could be completely wasting
your time.

> checked them for the secound time my way and they were right on,have
> already been warned on the vales,it was running rough before and the
> guy was told to check valves
>
> the fire order is 1342 but the distribor sits on number 4 at tdc i
> found out.on these engines,makes little sense.

It's a 4 cylinder inline engine. The Distributor rotor will sit at
number 1 *and* number 4 with the timing mark on the crank pulley at TDC
even if the engine is timed correctly. What you need to determine is if
the distributor is positioned correctly relative to the cam & crank.

Take off the rocker cover and wind the engine over in the correct
direction of rotation until the inlet valve starts to open. Keep winding
the engine over until it closes again and then continue to turn the
crank pulley stopping when the timing mark on the pulley is aligned with
the top dead centre mark on the timing cover.

The distributor rotor should now be in position to fire number one
cylinder.

If it's not, remove the distributor and re-fit it so that it's in the
correct position. If it is in the correct position and the engine still
refuses to start, it has fuel and spark and continues to backfire
through the intake then you have a mechanical issue that needs to be
addressed.

> it is sparking and getting fuel the plugs damp,
>
> according to the manual it says the computer will bypass problems and
> still allow the engine to run,

There are very few computers used in cars today that have the ability to
allow an engine with a mechanical problem to keep running :)

> from the gemini forums some said these were boat anchors when they
> don't run.others live with them every day and even lay 10incs of
> rubber with them the 4ze1 lol

Good for them.

> thanks again
> is the plug you were talking of to go right into the ecu under the
> dash or kickboad

--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 5:09 PM, Clocky wrote:

> BTW, you should assume you know nothing and follow sound advice.

That's probably the best advice he's had so far.



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[CyBorg 0091]

your comical reply highly regarded

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 8:17 PM, Noddy wrote:

> Take off the rocker cover and wind the engine over in the correct
> direction of rotation until the inlet valve starts to open.

That should read "Until the *number 1 cylinder* inlet valve starts to open.

Most people would probably be aware of that, but for some reason I feel
being as clear as possible is necessary in this case :)


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 24, 8:17 pm, Noddy <m...@home.com> wrote:

[CyBorg 0091]

noddy i am afraid something is wrong with the cam,at number 1 the
exhaust is slightly open number 4 however is perfect

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 24, 8:17 pm, Noddy <m...@home.com> wrote:

ok noddy reason for my dull assumptions i thought that the distributor
could not be removed.
can be
I changed it round to number one,it had white makes there from someone
else
its still no different,pops farts a bit.

[CyBorg 0091]

> its still no different,pops farts a bit.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

that said marks not makes

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 24, 4:20 pm, Albm&ctd <alb_mandctdNO...@connexus.net.au> wrote:
> In article <4f1e1cce$0$29980$c3e8da3$54964...@news.astraweb.com>,
> notg...@happen.com says...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "CyBorg 0091" <jjbr...@gmail.com> wrote in message

> >news:019f56da-b154-4305...@c9g2000pbh.googlegroups.com...
> > On Jan 24, 12:59 am, Fraser Johnston <fra...@cjmanagement.com.au>
> > wrote:
> > > On 23/01/12 10:55 AM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>
> > > > got to find out what a continuos flash in the ECU means
>
> > > > thanks again
>
> > > You can get ODB2 usb cables on ebay for 20 bucks or so. If you like
> > > spannering it is a must have.
>
> > > --
>
> > > Fraser
>
> > hate spannering,just trying to get it to go the loop and engine check
> > light should give me all the info i need just it flashes lol
>
> > The info you get is likely to be very limited. I think you have a hardware
> > issue, not an electronic one.
>
> Seems there were two diffent timing setups, one off No 4 and the other off No 1.
> Maybe he's got a later engine in that vehicle?
>
> Al
> --
> I don't take sides.

> It's more fun to insult everyone.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

yeah its makeing noddy have a heriner

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 9:04 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> noddy i am afraid something is wrong with the cam,at number 1 the
> exhaust is slightly open number 4 however is perfect

Re-check your valve clearances and compression test the engine.


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 9:24 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> ok noddy reason for my dull assumptions i thought that the distributor
> could not be removed.
> can be
> I changed it round to number one,it had white makes there from someone
> else
> its still no different,pops farts a bit.

Have you done a compression test?


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[CyBorg 0091]

On Jan 24, 5:44 pm, Albm&ctd <alb_mandctdNO...@connexus.net.au> wrote:
> In article <4f1e4ea3$0$29986$c3e8da3$54964...@news.astraweb.com>,
> notg...@happen.com says...

>
>
>
> > Albm&ctd wrote:
> > > In article <4f1e1cce$0$29980$c3e8da3$54964...@news.astraweb.com>,
> > > notg...@happen.com says...
>

> > >> "CyBorg 0091" <jjbr...@gmail.com> wrote in message

> It's more fun to insult everyone.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I have medication thanks,modecate.

[CyBorg 0091]

> BTW, you should assume you know nothing and follow sound advice.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

ok set the valves my way which is the same as your way and set the
distributor to number one,but still the same pops
maybe the cam is 180 out fucked if i know
when the timeing marks line up on one circut the valves are tigght on
number one and on the next they are loose as buggery,is this cam 180
out.

thanks again

[atec77]

bring no1 to tdc ( check on the compression stroke), where is the dizzy
pointing(no1 lead?) and reading the manual it should tell you no1 valves
will be "rocking " , check the ignition leads and the dizzy rotation ,
it sounds like you have two leads crossed over

--









X-No-Archive: Yes

[CyBorg 0091]

dont have compression tester and cant borrow one,its a way back town
with a sole mechanic who charges the earth for anything other than
mechanicaly problems,the bill would be over 1 k already if taken to
this mechanic.lol
hes a backyarder with a shop and makes a small fortuene selling
peoples cars when they cant pay for them.
Noddy can you ready my other posts to clocky

thanks again

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 10:39 PM, atec77 wrote:

> bring no1 to tdc ( check on the compression stroke), where is the dizzy
> pointing(no1 lead?) and reading the manual it should tell you no1 valves
> will be "rocking "

Um, no it won't.

Valve "rock" refers to the point in the valve timing cycle where the
exhaust valve is just about closed and the inlet valve is just opening.
At this point the cylinder is on the start of the intake stroke, and
setting the distributor to fire on that cylinder at that point will see
the ignition timing 180 degrees out.

You need to do one further complete revolution of the crankshaft for the
cylinder to be in the correct firing position.



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Noddy]

On 24/01/2012 10:47 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> dont have compression tester and cant borrow one,its a way back town
> with a sole mechanic who charges the earth for anything other than
> mechanicaly problems,the bill would be over 1 k already if taken to
> this mechanic.lol

Sounds like he's got the market sewn up in your area :)

> hes a backyarder with a shop and makes a small fortuene selling
> peoples cars when they cant pay for them.

Nice.

> Noddy can you ready my other posts to clocky

I've read your replies to Clocky, and very little of it makes any sense.

You can do a "bushman's" compression test by removing the plugs and
cranking the engine with a thumb over the plug hole if you can reach it.
If the engine's got compression it'll blow your thumb off the hole
easily. If it hasn't, it won't.


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[CyBorg 0091]

> X-No-Archive: Yes- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

no for tonight lets say the cam is 180 out till i change it tomorrow,

the confusion was as someone said in the group,there is two lots of
timeing for these engines maybe,thats what I can assume.

[D Walford]

On 24/01/2012 10:39 PM, atec77 wrote:

> bring no1 to tdc ( check on the compression stroke), where is the dizzy
> pointing(no1 lead?) and reading the manual it should tell you no1 valves
> will be "rocking " , check the ignition leads and the dizzy rotation ,
> it sounds like you have two leads crossed over
>

Number 4 is rocking when number 1 is on TDC.


Daryl

[Albm&ctd]

In article <jfm7dh$a9o$1...@dont-email.me>, m...@home.com says...

He's probably read that as the compression is going to blow his thumb off... and
at the very least he'd get bitten by HT so you forgot the disclaimer.
Far nicer (for visual effects) if he found some plug hole adapters and attached
different coloured balloons with lacky bands.

[Clocky]

Fucking hell... going round and round is making me dizzy ;-)

[Clocky]

It's not working.

[Noddy]

On 25/01/2012 7:38 PM, Clocky wrote:

> Fucking hell... going round and round is making me dizzy ;-)

Yep. Don't you just *love* people who ask for advice and then completely
ignore everything you tell them?

Ah, well. I wish him luck with his quest. I'm sure he's going to need
fucking shitloads of it :)



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Noddy]

On 25/01/2012 5:29 PM, Albm&ctd wrote:

> He's probably read that as the compression is going to blow his thumb off... and
> at the very least he'd get bitten by HT so you forgot the disclaimer.
> Far nicer (for visual effects) if he found some plug hole adapters and attached
> different coloured balloons with lacky bands.

It'd look nice at least :)


--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Clocky]

Funny things is that this is the sort of thing we could diagnose in a
minute.

[Clocky]

With some luck they would end up water balloons to really fuck his day ;-)

[j...@nothome.com]

"Jeßus" wrote in message news:lc4ph7dn4vvgbtnfl...@4ax.com...

On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 09:43:55 +1100, Jeßus <no...@all.invalid> wrote:

>On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 08:34:54 +1000, <j...@nothome.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>>> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for mechanics
>>> like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we don't see eye to
>>> eye on bearing caps etc.
>>>
>>> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the bottom
>>> key way slipped 180 out.
>>> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
>>> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm both
>>> sides.
>>
>>Are you related to Jonz by any chance? ;> )
>
>Nah. He may have poor grammar, but at least his arms can reach still
>the keyboard.

Arrgh. "Can still reach the keyboard".
====================================================
LOL ;> )
Cheers
DAVO

[Noddy]

On 25/01/2012 9:18 PM, Clocky wrote:

> With some luck they would end up water balloons to really fuck his day ;-)

Lol :)



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Clocky]

CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> On Jan 23, 9:43 am, Jeßus <n...@all.invalid> wrote:
>> On Mon, 23 Jan 2012 08:34:54 +1000, <j...@nothome.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 22/01/2012 3:21 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>>>> Hi its been a long time since I used this group,looking for
>>>> mechanics like Jason James athol and others Noddy although we
>>>> don't see eye to eye on bearing caps etc.
>>
>>>> This Holden wont run,originally it slipped the balancer on the
>>>> bottom key way slipped 180 out.
>>>> new balancer,I did not put it back together or do the job but after
>>>> finding the correct fireorder of 1342 I set the valves to .20mm
>>>> both sides.
>>
>>> Are you related to Jonz by any chance? ;> )
>>
>> Nah. He may have poor grammar, but at least his arms can reach still

>> the keyboard. I wonder if Jonz's helper monkey gets bored of it's
>> usual routine - doing all the typing and constantly fetching pies?
>
> have not used a computer for a while let aloneusenet so it was pretty
> rough and ready lol

Oh I see, so it's the computer that has taken away your ability to
paragraph, spell, use punctuation and use basic grammar...

Well, that's what you get when you borrow Atec's computer I suppose.

[Noddy]

On 25/01/2012 9:17 PM, Clocky wrote:

> Funny things is that this is the sort of thing we could diagnose in a
> minute.

I think we did :)



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[D Walford]

On 25/01/2012 9:17 PM, Clocky wrote:

True but its a lot more difficult to diagnose over the internet, some
people can't understand why that's its best to leave those sorts of jobs
to people with experience that has taken many years to accumulate.
Its not possible to learn those things from a few sentences on a
computer screen.


Daryl

[F Murtz]

Andy wrote:
> In
> article<557a5153-6778-405e-bce5-6bf47aac8...@p3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> jjbr...@gmail.com says...
>
>> On Jan 22, 10:02 pm, Noddy<m...@home.com> wrote:
>>> On 22/01/2012 7:58 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I even hooked 12v to the fuelpumpand forced it not after reading these
>>>> posts but it still did not really even want to go just poped like it
>>>> was 180 out still sensor?
>
>>> Where's the cam timing at?

>
>> I personally checked and double checked the cam timing,could not find
>> anything wrong.

>> all I found is that someone had set the tappets to a different sequ.

> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> ???
>
> (Mercifully it seems) I've missed most of this thread. What happened
> directly *prior* to the 'Won't run' condition?
>
> Broken timing belt by any chance?

balancer

[Clocky]

Particularly when they don't seem to listen, or worse still listen but come
back at you with "Nah, that's not it" or "I've already checked that" when
they haven't, or haven't checked it properly.

I've seen cars not start after repair jobs because the plugs are wet from
cranking over and over prior to repair... I get the feeling though that Mr.
Cyborg dismissed the advice to clean them up along with most other
suggestions yet something simple like that can stop an engine dead in it's
tracks (for example) and throw inexperienced people.

[D Walford]

This thread reminds me of a car my brother in law bought for next to
nothing because the owners brother who knew sfa about cars decided to
help with a tune up.
The car (Mk2 Austin 1800) wouldn't start and when I looked at it the
distributor and plug leads didn't look right, I found that the dist
drive was 180deg out and he had tried to fix that by moving the leads.
Much to the owners disgust I got it running in about 10mins and we drove
it home.


Daryl

[CyBorg 0091]

> tracks (for example) and throw inexperienced people.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

I checked a fucked round alot still wont go never checked compression
or injector pulse.

I think this vehicle was running till someone stuffed with it for a
service.
there is a hint that the timing belt slipped,but dunno.

was going to check compression today but he is not home.
he is turrning into one of those dodgy jobs were he refuses to use the
people with the correct skills to fix these like bloody holden.
if it was mine I would have had it at holden 11 months ago when it
stoped.
I know nothing about efi and CAS what i do know is the car hates
running when they are fucked.,however normally they will run,unless
mechanical failure.Holdens do any way

[CyBorg 0091]

apparently not,just someone went to do the valves cause told to by
mechanic for a rough running problem,notices the balance wheel had
slipped so they replaced that and new timing belt,now it won't run at
all.there is talk the timing belt slipped,but he dosenot seem to know
or want to admit to its the case.

I set the valves how clocky said there are other ways apparently,

I would have had the thing to holden garage months ago for diag
only,they are wizards in there most of the time even vacume out ya car

[CyBorg 0091]

> Daryl- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

ok I have had the 4ze1 in so many configurations and it still won't
run,yet to do a compression check,
according to the 4ze1 manual the rotor button goes at number 4 at tdc.
i did the valeves the way clocky said its the way i did them first
off,and my normal way of doing them,they seem to be right.
nothing acually happened to this thing it was running with a slight
miss,they discovered that the ballance wheel had slipped and decided
to replace it so some strange reason,rather than just redoing the
marks.

must be holes in the tops of the pistons but this guy is refusing to
take this for an answer and refusing to get the fucking this to a
mechanic,already told him i would tow him lol.

Its eiather holes in the pistons or something totally wrong with the
ecu something i cannot fix without a mulitmeter and advise.

[D Walford]

That will only work if the book means No.4 is on TDC, TDC usually means
No.1 so if the rotor button is pointing to number 4 plug lead when No.1
is on TDC then you will have the problem you currently have.

> i did the valeves the way clocky said its the way i did them first
> off,and my normal way of doing them,they seem to be right.

Incorrect valve clearances might make it run rough but usually the
engine will run so its unlikely the valve clearance will have anything
to do with the problem.

> nothing acually happened to this thing it was running with a slight
> miss,they discovered that the ballance wheel had slipped and decided
> to replace it so some strange reason,rather than just redoing the
> marks.
>

Replacing a faulty balancer is the correct thing to do.

> must be holes in the tops of the pistons but this guy is refusing to
> take this for an answer and refusing to get the fucking this to a
> mechanic,already told him i would tow him lol.

Doubt it has holes in the pistons.
Nothing you can do if the owner doesn't want to spend the money.

>
> Its eiather holes in the pistons or something totally wrong with the
> ecu something i cannot fix without a mulitmeter and advise.

Most likely its either an ignition or valve timing problem created by
people who don't know what they are doing.



Daryl

[Clocky]

Well yes Daryl, it could have everyting to do with that as he adjusted the
clearances (but didn't make sense on how he did them) and tight valves on
that engine means no compression and no go.

>> nothing acually happened to this thing it was running with a slight
>> miss,they discovered that the ballance wheel had slipped and decided
>> to replace it so some strange reason,rather than just redoing the
>> marks.
>>
>
> Replacing a faulty balancer is the correct thing to do.
>

A slipped balancer won't cause a misfire, I was under the impression that
the balancer had slipped on the crank due to a broken key.

>> must be holes in the tops of the pistons but this guy is refusing to
>> take this for an answer and refusing to get the fucking this to a
>> mechanic,already told him i would tow him lol.
>
> Doubt it has holes in the pistons.
> Nothing you can do if the owner doesn't want to spend the money.
>>
>> Its eiather holes in the pistons or something totally wrong with the
>> ecu something i cannot fix without a mulitmeter and advise.
>
> Most likely its either an ignition or valve timing problem created by
> people who don't know what they are doing.
>

Quite possibly, and he's still guessing as he hasn't done a compression
test.

Must be holes in the piston... FFS what hope is there.

[Clocky]

It has nothing to do with it being a Holden, all engines are basically the
same.

You need:
Air/Fuel, spark, injector pulse if injected, correct timing and compression.

If any of those are missing whatever engine it is isn't going to run. You
check each one systematically and make 100% sure they are present and
correct.

And don't assume "spark" means there is a spark at the coil lead so it must
be OK, it means check for a spark at the spark plug. Clean fouled plugs.

When you check for fuel, check for fuel pressure, check the fuel itself (is
it stale) and check that the injectors are getting an injector pulse. Don't
assume it's working.

Check the timing, remove the timing cover and check that all the marks line
up to factory spec. Poke a screwdriver in Cyl 1 and make sure that when the
valves are on the rock on 1 or 4, the piston is actually at TDC. Don't
assume it is.

Check compression. If you have no compression on one cylinder or more,
either your valve clearances are up the shit or you have burnt/bent valves
or a fucked head gasket.

[D Walford]

Possible but they would have to out by a long way.

>
>>> nothing acually happened to this thing it was running with a slight
>>> miss,they discovered that the ballance wheel had slipped and decided
>>> to replace it so some strange reason,rather than just redoing the
>>> marks.
>>>
>>
>> Replacing a faulty balancer is the correct thing to do.
>>
>
> A slipped balancer won't cause a misfire, I was under the impression that
> the balancer had slipped on the crank due to a broken key.

True but after all this discussion its hard to remember what the
original fault was, I also assumed it was a broken key causing a valve
timing issue.

>
>>> must be holes in the tops of the pistons but this guy is refusing to
>>> take this for an answer and refusing to get the fucking this to a
>>> mechanic,already told him i would tow him lol.
>>
>> Doubt it has holes in the pistons.
>> Nothing you can do if the owner doesn't want to spend the money.
>>>
>>> Its eiather holes in the pistons or something totally wrong with the
>>> ecu something i cannot fix without a mulitmeter and advise.
>>
>> Most likely its either an ignition or valve timing problem created by
>> people who don't know what they are doing.
>>
>
> Quite possibly, and he's still guessing as he hasn't done a compression
> test.
>
> Must be holes in the piston... FFS what hope is there.
>
>

LOL, so frustrating that what seems so easy to a trained person is so
difficult for amateurs.


Daryl

[Noddy]

On 27/01/2012 6:40 PM, Clocky wrote:

> A slipped balancer won't cause a misfire, I was under the impression that
> the balancer had slipped on the crank due to a broken key.

That was my impression as well, and I was wondering if the key had
actually broken or had flogged out the keyway and now the timing is
fucked because it hasn't been fixed properly.

> Quite possibly, and he's still guessing as he hasn't done a compression
> test.
>
> Must be holes in the piston... FFS what hope is there.

Not very much I expect.



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Clocky]

No Daryl, as I mentioned before that engine has a habit of burning valves as
it takes bugger all to hold them open. If they are not adjusted properly,
you can easily lose compression.

>>
>>>> nothing acually happened to this thing it was running with a slight
>>>> miss,they discovered that the ballance wheel had slipped and
>>>> decided to replace it so some strange reason,rather than just
>>>> redoing the marks.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Replacing a faulty balancer is the correct thing to do.
>>>
>>
>> A slipped balancer won't cause a misfire, I was under the impression
>> that the balancer had slipped on the crank due to a broken key.
>
> True but after all this discussion its hard to remember what the
> original fault was, I also assumed it was a broken key causing a valve
> timing issue.
>>
>>>> must be holes in the tops of the pistons but this guy is refusing
>>>> to take this for an answer and refusing to get the fucking this to
>>>> a mechanic,already told him i would tow him lol.
>>>
>>> Doubt it has holes in the pistons.
>>> Nothing you can do if the owner doesn't want to spend the money.
>>>>
>>>> Its eiather holes in the pistons or something totally wrong with
>>>> the ecu something i cannot fix without a mulitmeter and advise.
>>>
>>> Most likely its either an ignition or valve timing problem created
>>> by people who don't know what they are doing.
>>>
>>
>> Quite possibly, and he's still guessing as he hasn't done a
>> compression test.
>>
>> Must be holes in the piston... FFS what hope is there.
>>
>>
> LOL, so frustrating that what seems so easy to a trained person is so
> difficult for amateurs.
>

Yeah, but some people...

[Clocky]

atec77 wrote:
> On 24/01/2012 9:34 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

>> On Jan 24, 5:09 pm, "Clocky"<notg...@happen.com> wrote:
>>> CyBorg 0091 wrote:

>>>> On Jan 24, 11:26 am, "Clocky"<notg...@happen.com> wrote:
>>>>> CyBorg 0091 wrote:

>>>>>> On Jan 23, 11:27 pm, Noddy<m...@home.com> wrote:

>>>>>>> On 23/01/2012 1:48 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>> I personally checked and double checked the cam timing,could
>>>>>>>> not find
>>>>>>>> anything wrong.
>>>

>>>>>>> Fair enough.

>>>
>>>>>>>> all I found is that someone had set the tappets to a different

>>>>>>>> sequ. starting with number 4 and the rest forgientiome,i
>>>>>>>> corrtected the valve to run at 1342 after being told this was
>>>>>>>> the fire order and thats how the leads were too.
>>>
>>>>>>> This particular paragraph doesn't make a whole heap of sense.
>>>
>>>>>>> Let's run through some basics.
>>>
>>>>>>> This is a 1991 Holden Rodeo with an inline 4 cylinder engine,
>>>>>>> right? Does it have a timing chain or a timing belt?
>>>
>>>>>>> I have no idea what you mean in saying someone has set the valve
>>>>>>> clearances to a "different sequence", but if I were you before I
>>>>>>> did anything else I'd do a compression test to make sure there
>>>>>>> are no valves that aren't seating properly.
>>>
>>>>>>> You mentioned some fuck-up with the crank key way, and it's
>>>>>>> likely that the cam timing got moved and may have bent a few
>>>>>>> valves.
>>>
>>>>>>>> this is a 4ze1 i am pretty sureI have a manual for it
>>>
>>>>>>> You're pretty sure?
>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know what manual you're using, but it either covers the
>>>>>>> model in question or it doesn't.
>>>
>>>>>>>> seems the efi model but it says to set the cam timeing at tdc
>>>>>>>> when cylinder number 4 is on the compression stoke....can you
>>>>>>>> tell me what this means...?
>>>
>>>>>>> It doesn't mean anything other than that's where the
>>>>>>> manufacturer has positioned the cam when the timing marks are
>>>>>>> aligned.
>>>
>>>>>>> It's not important. All that *is* important is that the timing
>>>>>>> marks are aligned correctly.
>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> Noddy.
>>>
>>>>>> sorry I cannot neatly post your replys,using server
>>>>>> keyboard(littleone)
>>>
>>>>>> It is timing belt ,bent valves explains the pop,sortof,its
>>>>>> comming from the crank case cover.
>>>>>> what is the most easy way to check for bent valves compression
>>>>>> check? I will follow the timeing marks they are already correct.
>>>
>>>>>> thanks again
>>>
>>>>> Yes, a compression test but if you have tried adjusting the valves
>>>>> you might want to read the following and recheck them before you
>>>>> bother with a compression test. If you don't have adequate
>>>>> compression after rechecking your valve clearances, you have some
>>>>> bent valves.
>>>
>>>>> But before you do that, are you sure your valve clearances are
>>>>> correct as on those engines they are critical (they burn valves if
>>>>> you don't get it right, or if tight they will drop compression).
>>>
>>>>> The sequence for doing the valve clearances is 1342, IOW the
>>>>> firing order which is what I think you were rambling about before.
>>>
>>>>> Start by getting #1 "on the rock"
>>>>> Use this as your guide, in this order as you turn the motor over
>>>>> after checking each pair of valve clearances per cylinder;
>>>
>>>>> #1 on the rock = check #4 clearances
>>>>> #3 on the rock = check #2 clearances
>>>>> #4 on the rock = check #1 clearances
>>>>> #2 on the rock = check #3 clearances
>>>
>>>>> Set the clearances to .05 mm larger than what the manual states as
>>>>> that was a factory recommendation at the time to prevent valves
>>>>> burning prematurely (which was a very common problem early on).
>>>>> From memory that would bring them up to .20mm for inlet and .25
>>>>> for exhaust.- Hide quoted text -

>>>
>>>>> - Show quoted text -
>>>

>>>> ok thanks,checked valves again to day and reset,found out how to
>>>> do so on gemini fourms.
>>>
>>> Did you do it my way?
>>>
>>>> I don't think valves are bent.
>>>> checked them for the secound time my way
>>>
>>> "Your way" isn't working too well for you, maybe you should try it
>>> the proper way.
>>> You're in here asking for advice, only to ignore it. I think we
>>> have been here before...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> the fire order is 1342 but the distribor sits on number 4 at tdc i
>>>> found out.on these engines,makes little sense.
>>>
>>> They're just a normal 4 cyl engine, they make perfect sense.
>>>
>>>> it is sparking and getting fuel the plugs damp,
>>>
>>> If the plugs are wet, clean and dry them. Oily plugs won't fire.
>>> Take the dizzy out and move it 180 degrees. Failing that (some are
>>> keyed so the dizzy can only go in one way), the cog that drives the
>>> distributor gear (maybe driven by the timing belt) is out of whack.
>>> If you post a pic of the motor I'll give you some pointers.
>>>
>>>> according to the manual it says the computer will bypass problems
>>>> and still allow the engine to run,
>>>
>>> Not if the dizzy timing is out it won't. The computer can't
>>> compensate for a fucked up setup.
>>>
>>>> from the gemini forums some said these were boat anchors when they
>>>> don't run.others live with them every day and even lay 10incs of
>>>> rubber with them the 4ze1 lol
>>>
>>>> thanks again
>>>
>>> The performance of the motors is overstated. They are neither boat
>>> anchors or rubber layers, but a fairly solid workhorse engine if
>>> maintained
>>> correctly.
>>>
>>>> is the plug you were talking of to go right into the ecu under the
>>>> dash or kickboad
>>>
>>> Forget the computer, you have fuel and spark. Do you have an
>>> injector pulse? If not, the CAS isn't working and symptoms can be that
>>> the
>>> injectors are held open, flooding the engine. That would also explain
>>> why the
>>> plugs are wet.
>>>
>>> BTW, you should assume you know nothing and follow sound advice.-

>>> Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -
>>

>> ok set the valves my way which is the same as your way and set the
>> distributor to number one,but still the same pops
>> maybe the cam is 180 out fucked if i know
>> when the timeing marks line up on one circut the valves are tigght on
>> number one and on the next they are loose as buggery,is this cam 180
>> out.
>>
>> thanks again
> bring no1 to tdc ( check on the compression stroke), where is the
> dizzy pointing(no1 lead?) and reading the manual it should tell you
> no1 valves will be "rocking " , check the ignition leads and the
> dizzy rotation , it sounds like you have two leads crossed over

Shut up you dickhead, you don't know what you are talking about.

[Noddy]

On 28/01/2012 9:43 PM, Clocky wrote:

> Shut up you dickhead, you don't know what you are talking about.

[Albm&ctd]

In article <4f1fc053$0$29987$c3e8da3$5496...@news.astraweb.com>,
not...@happen.com says...

Injected the wrong head.

[Jason James]

On Tuesday, January 24, 2012 9:19:45 PM UTC+11, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
> On Jan 24, 4:20 pm, Albm&ctd <alb_mand> > In article > >
> >
> >
> >
> > > "CyBorg 0091" <jjb...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > >news:.googlegroups.com...

> > > On Jan 24, 12:59 am, Fraser Johnston <fra...@cjmanagement.com.au>
> > > wrote:
> > > > On 23/01/12 10:55 AM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:
> >
> > > > > got to find out what a continuos flash in the ECU means
> >
> > > > > thanks again
> >
> > > > You can get ODB2 usb cables on ebay for 20 bucks or so. If you like
> > > > spannering it is a must have.
> >
> > > > --
> >
> > > > Fraser
> >
> > > hate spannering,just trying to get it to go the loop and engine check
> > > light should give me all the info i need just it flashes lol
> >
> > > The info you get is likely to be very limited. I think you have a hardware
> > > issue, not an electronic one.
> >
> > Seems there were two diffent timing setups, one off No 4 and the other off No 1.
> > Maybe he's got a later engine in that vehicle?
> >

> > Al
> > --
> > I don't take sides.
> > It's more fun to insult everyone.- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>

> yeah its makeing noddy have a heriner

Its not that difficult. If the crankshaft is not timed right with the cam, it wont start. You have already, correctly ascertained the firing order [1342]. If the dizzy is not timed correctly with the crank and cam, it wont start.

If you remove num 1 spark-plug, you can insert a long thin screw-driver so it rocks up and down as you turn the crankshaft. Watch out it doesnt jam as you approach TDC [top dead centre num 1]. Because you are dealing with a 4 stroke, there will be 2 tdc per 4 cyles [2 revolutions of the crank] The first tdc will be on the end of the compression-cycle, the 2nd tdc is the end of the exhaust cycle. looking at these 2 cycles, you can identify them by observing the valve positions. The first tdc [compression] will be acompanied by *both* valves [intake and exhaust]being closed. If the exhaust valve is partly opened instead,..you are on the wrong cycle. Turn the crank one complete turn. Stop the crank when its notch [as observed on the crank-pulley] is lined up with the longest mark on the crank-case [TDC mark]. This test, will let you know if the cam is timed right. Use the screwdriver in parallel with the timing marks to ascertain crank-position and, that everything is jake.

If the dizzy is in question,..you simply observe the rotor position when the crank is at tdc [compression cycle]. If the dizzy is right for num 1, check the next 3 leads are going to 3, 4 and 2 cylinders from the dizzy-cap. Make sure you are accounting for which direction [CW or ACW] the dizzy turns when the crank is moved in the CW rotation.

The fact is, a 4 cycle engine needs its cam to be timed correctly with the crank. Even one tooth out and it may well not start. Same goes for the dizzy. No one lead *must* be facing the rotor when the crank is at compression tdc. If any of these things are out by even a bit,..you'll have trouble.

Jason

[Fraser Johnston]

On 25/01/12 6:13 PM, Noddy wrote:
> On 25/01/2012 7:38 PM, Clocky wrote:
>
>> Fucking hell... going round and round is making me dizzy ;-)
>
> Yep. Don't you just *love* people who ask for advice and then completely
> ignore everything you tell them?
>
> Ah, well. I wish him luck with his quest. I'm sure he's going to need
> fucking shitloads of it :)
>
>
>

For sale: Holden Rodao, not working....

--

Fraser

[Fraser Johnston]

On 25/01/12 6:44 PM, D Walford wrote:

> True but its a lot more difficult to diagnose over the internet, some
> people can't understand why that's its best to leave those sorts of jobs
> to people with experience that has taken many years to accumulate.
> Its not possible to learn those things from a few sentences on a
> computer screen.

I've learnt loads about fixing cars and bikes through the internet.
Mainly on forums. But you need to be able to understand what you are
being told and sift through the bullshit.


--

Fraser

[Fraser Johnston]

On 26/01/12 5:25 PM, D Walford wrote:

> This thread reminds me of a car my brother in law bought for next to
> nothing because the owners brother who knew sfa about cars decided to
> help with a tune up.
> The car (Mk2 Austin 1800) wouldn't start and when I looked at it the
> distributor and plug leads didn't look right, I found that the dist
> drive was 180deg out and he had tried to fix that by moving the leads.
> Much to the owners disgust I got it running in about 10mins and we drove
> it home.

My best mate tells a similar story of buying a mini owned by an old lady
that wouldn't start. It turned out she had filled it with oil. Until
it was pouring out of the filler cap. Quick drain of the excess and a
great running car was had for bugger all.


--

Fraser

[D Walford]

Very true, when I was putting the 4AGZE into my son's AE86 I would have
been screwed if didn't have all the info I found on the net, I found a
diagram the showed where all the many vacuum lines went which saved me a
lot of time.


Daryl

[Clocky]

"D Walford" <dwal...@internode.on.net> wrote in message
news:4f2b688f$0$11112$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...

You found a diagram of a bin?

[D Walford]

It would be good to get rid of most of them but since throwing all the
vac lines in a bin would have stopped the engine running properly it
isn't a particularly great idea.
At the moment the vac line that cuts the supercharger boost is
disconnected so with the pulley kit it now can get approx 12psi boost
which makes for very good performance from 1.6lts.


Daryl

[CyBorg 0091]

On Feb 4, 5:46 pm, D Walford <dwalf...@internode.on.net> wrote:
> On 04/02/2012 4:40 PM, Clocky wrote:
>
>
>

> > "D Walford"<dwalf...@internode.on.net>  wrote in message

> Daryl- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

the engine has no compression just did a backyard compression check,I
remembers my ma and vc Mazda motors used to sound like an air
compressor with the plugs out so gave it a wirl and the 4ze1 seems to
have no compression,

[CyBorg 0091]

> Jason- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

thanks Jason very well explained and nice and simple,I checked
compression there is no compression or very little.
am printing this one for further refference.

[Jason James]

On Sunday, February 5, 2012 12:14:38 PM UTC+11, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> On Feb 4, 5:46 pm, D Walford wrote:
> > On 04/02/2012 4:40 PM, Clocky wrote:
> >
> >
> >

> > > "D Walford wrote in message

It's been cooked>>rings lost tension :-(

Jason

[CyBorg 0091]

according to physcs I am about tobe discharged
apparently i have paranoid shcizphenia and a very servere case,that took 5 mins and two doctors to diagnose.

I just hate authority when i am charged at her service in the stars,well someone had to do it.
part of her majestys request was to infiltrate the dept of health.
that i did
what i found is they don't care if ya talk to people hear voices see things etc.
they treat chemical inbalance,wellnot diagnosed just if they feel like it.
i read Sigmond Freord was somegood reading

[Albm&ctd]

In article <374e5828-fad5-45af...@lr19g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...

no clearance on the valves (riding),
incorrect valve timing,
no head gasket :)
no rings,
no pistons,
no free beer
no sex
no drugs
for typing this.

[Albm&ctd]

In article <3654763.55.1328595250462.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@pbcqk3>,
jjb...@gmail.com says...

> i read Sigmond Freord was somegood reading
>

He was just a Freud, Freud I say.

[Jeßus]

On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 17:14:38 -0800 (PST), CyBorg 0091
<jjb...@gmail.com> wrote:


>the engine has no compression just did a backyard compression check,I
>remembers my ma and vc Mazda motors used to sound like an air
>compressor with the plugs out so gave it a wirl and the 4ze1 seems to
>have no compression,

I could have sworn a compression test was suggested to you numerous
times a couple of weeks ago. You're wasting your own and other
people's time by ignoring good advice.

[Jeßus]

On Tue, 7 Feb 2012 16:59:59 +1000, Albm&ctd
<alb_mand...@connexus.net.au> wrote:

>In article <3654763.55.1328595250462.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@pbcqk3>,
>jjb...@gmail.com says...
>> i read Sigmond Freord was somegood reading
>>
>He was just a Freud, Freud I say.

Careful, otherwise you might give him an octopus complex.

[Noddy]

On 5/02/2012 12:14 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> the engine has no compression just did a backyard compression check,I
> remembers my ma and vc Mazda motors used to sound like an air
> compressor with the plugs out so gave it a wirl and the 4ze1 seems to
> have no compression,

Dig a huge hole, push the car into it, throw all your tools and
"workshop manuals" in along with it and pour concrete over the top.
You'll then have somewhere nice and clean to play your banjo while you
try to eat watermelon with your three teeth.



--
Regards,
Noddy.

[Noddy]

On 7/02/2012 5:14 PM, CyBorg 0091 wrote:

> according to physcs I am about tobe discharged
> apparently i have paranoid shcizphenia and a very servere case,that took 5 mins and two doctors to diagnose.

Pal, you really didn't need to waste money on a couple of doctor's
visits....

> I just hate authority when i am charged at her service in the stars,well someone had to do it.
> part of her majestys request was to infiltrate the dept of health.
> that i did
> what i found is they don't care if ya talk to people hear voices see things etc.
> they treat chemical inbalance,wellnot diagnosed just if they feel like it.
> i read Sigmond Freord was somegood reading

And that's a perfect example of why :)


--
Regards,
Noddy.