Re: Srimad Bhagavat Gita Study Group Digest for arsha-vidya-gita@googlegroups.com - 1 Message in 1 Topic

[DR. PRASAD BULUSU]

really  very  nice  introduction  ,  sir  !   I  quote  you  !                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   "  The  conclusion  I  have  about  myself   is  wrong  ! This  is   precisely  what  Vedanta  says. " ----                                                                   " There  is  a   solution  !                                                                                              And  it   is  in   the  form   of   Knowledge  of   my  True  Nature ."                                                                                                                                                                             to  Know  that  I  am  Poorn'a  Purusha  ! !                                                                                                                                              dr. prasad. --- On Tue, 4/24/12, arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> wrote: From: arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> Subject: Srimad Bhagavat Gita Study Group Digest for arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com - 1 Message in 1 Topic To: "Digest Recipients" <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> Date: Tuesday, April 24, 2012, 4:32 AM   Today's Topic Summary Group: http://groups.google.com/group/arsha-vidya-gita/topics Srimad Bhagavad Gita (SBG) - Vedanta - Introduction [1 Update]  Srimad Bhagavad Gita (SBG) - Vedanta - Introduction Paritala Gopi Krishna <paritalag...@gmail.com> Apr 23 04:33AM -0700   Dear Fellow Seekers, Love and Love alone .... I am sending herewith the first post -- Introduction on Vedanta -- from Sri Santatmananda, as a prelude to Srimad Bhagavad Gita postings. This may take a few posts from today onwards. Kindly go through leisurely and intently to grasp the essence of the philosophy, before we embark on learning and appreciting the depth of SBG. Love and Love alone .... P. Gopi Krishna ==== Knowledge is the easiest thing to be obtained. It involves no operation or action on its part. It is as true as the object, as real as the means is.   The Fundamental problem   What is it that I am really seeking through my various pursuits in life? What do I seek when I pursue money, pleasures, fame, name, power or heaven? Do I seek all these for the sake of themselves? If it were just for themselves, I would be satisfied when I fulfilled any given desire. However, I am only momentarily satisfied when I fulfill them. Soon I find myself with other set of desires. This way the desires I entertain may change in nature and in time. But one thing remains constant, in spite of all accomplishments I may have, me the unsatisfied and inadequate person, the person who would like to become somebody different from what I am at present. Why? Because I am conscious of myself and as a result of my relating with the world, I have a judgment about myself. My conclusion about myself is that I am limited, mortal, subject to sorrow.   I cannot accept myself as I am and therefore make attempts throughout my life to be acceptable to myself by pursuing different things. However, if I am an individual confined to this limited body, with limited powers to change situations, things and people in this vast universe, it seems impossible that I will one day become totally acceptable to myself and find a lasting fulfillment that does not depend upon any situation, any given place or time.   This preliminary inquiry into the nature of my pursuits leads me to the fact that there is no connection between what I want and what I do: I want to be free from being a wanting, limited, insignificant person. And my different pursuits in life have only the capacity to give me a temporary relief, in the form of momentary satisfaction and joy.   At this point, some will say, this is the reality of existence. Life is meaningless, you are a limited entity confronted with the immense forces of the world and you have to accept this fact of existence. You can give a meaning to it by your actions: just be an ethical person and try to excel in what you do, whether you are in business, arts, science or working in a company, contribute to the society as much as you can, but do not expect anything more than this from life. And do not forget to enjoy the small and big pleasures of life! But how can I accept this kind of reality and dismiss this intense aspiration for freedom from fear and sorrow, this fundamental search for everlasting fulfillment that seems to be at the core of my being?   Others will say, there is a heaven where you will enjoy eternally some special pleasures, provided that you behave well and follow the commandments of our scripture. But how can limited prayers and good actions that I do in this life produce an eternal stay in heaven? Since any limited action cannot produce a limitless result, eternal stay in heaven cannot be acceptable to my reason.   Then the only possibility is that maybe the conclusion I have abo ut myself is wrong. This is precisely what Vedanta says. It says that you are already what you are looking for, the limitless, the whole, you are already free from this sense of limitation, insecurity and lack. Logically, this seems to be the only solution: because if I am really a limited individual, no matter what I do, no action will ever produce the limitless I am seeking . But if I am making a mistake about myself, and taking myself to be limited while I am in reality limitless, there is a solution! And it is in the form of knowledge of my true nature . This seems to be the only way out !   It is interesting that most religions, philosophies, psychologies, etc. do not attempt to question this fundamental and universal conclusion that everyone has, 'I am a limited individual'. Often they confirm the conclusion about the limited nature of I and start their system of beliefs, school of thought or therapy with this in-built assumption. Keeping this paradigm, whatever solution they envisage, it can never solve my problem of being a limited individual.   Since Vedanta addresses the most fundamental problem that is universally faced by everyone, any discerning person will examine what Vedanta has to say about ones true nature.   You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Group arsha-vidya-gita. You can post via email. To unsubscribe from this group, send an empty message. For more options, visit this group.

[DR. PRASAD BULUSU]

Resp.   Sir  ,                                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Very  good  introduction  to  :                                                                                                                                           ( i )  knowledge  acquired  through  the  senses                                                                                                                                           ( ii )  knowledge  that  aims  at  knowing  the  Knower   &                                                                                                                                            ( iii )  nature  of  "  I  "   which  is  neither  unknown  --  nor  fully  known  ;                                                                                                                                     very  apt  &  perfect  that  you  have  written  !                                                                                                                                                                                                                   let  me  recall  the  words  of  our  Scriptures  :                                                                                                                                    Katha  Upanishad  says  :  paraanchi  khaani  vyatr.n'at  svayambhuh  tasmaat  paraan^  pas'yati  na  antaraatman  :  sense  organs  are  made  in  such  a  manner  that  they  can  know  the  external  objects  only  ;  they  fail  to  know  the  Inner  Essence  !                                                                                                                                                  Br.hadaaran'yaka  Upanishad  inquires  :  vijxaataaram  are'  ke'na  vijaaneeyaat  ?   how  to  know  the  Knower  ?  certainly  not  through  the  senses  !                                                                                                                                    Mund'aka  Upanishad  says  :  tat  doore'  tadvantike'  cha   :  It  (  the  Inner  Essence  ,  the  Knower  )   is   both   far   and  near  ,  known  &  unknown  !                                                                                                                                         &  also  says  :  anyame'va  tad  viditaat  ,  tatho  aviditaat  adhi  :  It  (  the  Inner  Essence  ,  the  Knower  )  is   different   from  the  known  sense-objects  &  is  certainly   higher   than   the  unknown  i.e.,  It   does   not   fall   in   the   purview   of  the   sense-objects  ;  It   should   be   known  through  an  entirely  different  ,  higher  method  !                                                                                                                                                                                       Kr.shn'am  Vande'  Jagadgurum  !                                                                                                                                                                                       dr. prasad.

--- On Thu, 4/26/12, arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

From: arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> Subject: Srimad Bhagavat Gita Study Group Digest for arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com - 1 Message in 1 Topic To: "Digest Recipients" <arsha-vi...@googlegroups.com> Date: Thursday, April 26, 2012, 3:57 AM

Today's Topic Summary Group: http://groups.google.com/group/arsha-vidya-gita/topics

Srimad Bhagavad Gita (SBG) - Vedanta - Introduction - 2 [1 Update]  Srimad Bhagavad Gita (SBG) - Vedanta - Introduction - 2 Paritala Gopi Krishna <paritalag...@gmail.com> Apr 25 09:25PM -0700   Vedanta is a means of knowledge   Vedanta claims that the conclusions that I have about myself are wrong and I am here and now the fullness I am seeking through all my life pursuits. How can I know what is the real nature of myself?   What are the means that I have at my disposal to know things in this world? Perception and inference. Perception is the basic means at my disposal and can be divided into seeing, hearing, sense of smell, taste and touch. Through my eyes, I can have access to the sphere of the colors and forms. With my ears, the sphere of sounds, with my nose, to the different odors, and so on. These basic means can be enhanced through various instruments. For example, a telescope to enable me to know a remote star located at several light years away from me or a microscope to know the structure of the HIV virus, to which I can have no access with my naked eyes. With inference and deductive reasoning, which also draw their data from perception, I am able to gather knowledge about what constitutes the domain of science and all disciplines of knowledge, from medicine to chemistry, and computer science to quantum physics.   Then what about the knowledge about this I, myself, the subject? Are these means of knowledge of any use to me to know myself? No, because I, the knower is employing these different means of knowledge to know what is different from me, what is an object separate from me the subject who knows them. They are therefore inadequate to give me access into myself.   One can ask a question, is not psychology the adequate means to acquire knowledge about myself? No, because psychology also draws its data from perception, and builds its different theories and therapies with the help of different forms of reasoning. The knower uses a specific form of perception called witness perception to observe and know his/her emotions, thoughts, dreams, etc. and their influence on one’s behavior. The existence of unconscious and its dynamics is arrived through these observations and inference drawn from the observations.   The sphere of operation of perception, inference, etc. is therefore restricted to what can be objectified by me, the knower. How can I have knowledge about myself, the knower himself? I need an appropriate means of knowledge. Vedanta presents itself as an independent means of knowledge in the form of words that reveals the true nature of I . Words of Vedanta no doubt need perception (my ears to be heard). On the other hand, words can be used to communicate or describe objects or concepts that are known through perception and inference. Here, we are talking about Vedanta as a means of knowledge in the form of words which like a mirror can make me see the nature of myself by looking into their meaning. Vedanta says also that the nature of myself cannot be arrived at by other means of knowledge like perception or inference, because "I" can never be objectified.   If Vedanta is a means of knowledge, like any other means of knowledge, it must reveal things that cannot be known through other means of knowledge. For example, what eyes can reveal, ears have no access to. Second, being a means of knowledge, what it says must also not be contradicted by any other means of knowledge. If any piece of knowledge can be contradicted by another, then it is not valid anymore as it can be negated, like in science any theory is held to be right until somebody contradicts it. If what Vedanta says is true, then it can be tested against any contention or theory or philosophy. Vedanta does not ask us to believe in what it says. It is only asking us to see what it reveals until we have any reason which disproves what it says. That means any doubts that we have, Vedanta refutes them by using logic and showing their untenability. This way, Vedanta poses the most incredible challenge that human reasoning can be confronted to.   Further, since Vedanta reveals the true nature of I, which is not something away from me in time and space, it gives me direct knowledge. If an object is a way from me in time and space, words can give me only indirect knowledge like an animal unknown to me or even heaven. For example, the existence of heaven is a non-verifiable belief for me and I have no way either to prove or to disprove in this life its existence or my going to it. I will have to wait for the after-life if there is one! Unlike this type of indirect knowledge, Vedanta speaks about I that is neither totally unknown nor it is fully known to me even though it is not clearly known at the same time. I know perfectly that I am, without using my perception or inference. That means I don't need any means of knowledge to know that I am. Therefore, I am self-evident. However, the precise nature of I is not clear. Vedanta is a means of knowledge to know true nature of I. Since I am always present, words of Vedanta give direct knowledge that can be verified by me.