No Consent bands

[Wendy]

This came out of the Summit via Shelley - the idea of having a band available for people who do not wish to be photographed, to make it easier for those taking photos to avoid breaching consent.

Shelley reckons it would be best if we were going to do this to order them along with the main wristbands so that would mean we need to decide soon.

My first question is what would it cost and do we have budget for it?  There are a few things now popping up that are more expensive than anticipated and I'm hearing 'we'll need to make room in the budget for this' a fair bit, so I'm a bit concerned about any extra costs not already budgeted for.

Other than that, I'm all for it.

[Shelley Watson]

How many would be required?  eg could have same colour every year and five year's supply for example? would have to be distinctly different than the wristband design each year and we don't know what they will be each year. so maybe white with large clear wording in it? or a bright block of colour?

[Nicola]

I would like this - bright red or colours would stand out.
Not to derail the thread, but there's also a summit action about under 18 wristbands. Has this been progressed?

[Shelley Watson]

also useful to get under 18 bands done at same time.

[Wendy]

I'd actually assumed the under 18 wristbands was a given alongside the child tickets.  Sorry.

On 4 October 2016 at 12:38, Shelley Watson <she...@design.gen.nz> wrote:

also useful to get under 18 bands done at same time.

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[Isa Ritchie]

Under 18 is different from child though... child ends at 16

[Pete Wyatt]

They would be cheaper if just a standard non klb branded wristband 

[Brendan]

Slight sidetrack - I was under the impression that "under 18" wristbands was already agreed to and budgeted for (I haven't reviewed the threads yet but it is in the budget).

> They would be cheaper if just a standard non klb branded wristband

These could be removable right? This way people don't need to make a decision at the gate, they could pick one up from Depot for a time and return it when no longer needed as their comfort level may vary throughout the festival. As long as they're easily recognised they don't really need to be similar to the ticketing wristbands.

[Rainbow Ronan]

is this really nessassary? I can understand the logic behind it, I'm just not sure when this becomes kiwiburns responsibility. and where does it end? don't talk to me hats? don't offer me a drink cod pieces? surely as a community we promote responsible photographers instead of funding don't photo me wrist bands?

[Wendy]

I don't think it's our responsibility as such, but it was discussed as a 'nice to have' way of:

a) making it easier for photographers to identify those not wishing to be captured in crowd scenes

b) being seen to be serious about facilitating a consent-based culture.

I don't think it's necessary but if we can afford it, it's a cheap way of doing these things.

On 5 October 2016 at 08:07, Rainbow Ronan <buckfast...@gmail.com> wrote:

is this really nessassary? I can understand the logic behind it, I'm just not sure when this becomes kiwiburns responsibility. and where does it end? don't talk to me hats? don't offer me a drink cod pieces? surely as a community we promote responsible photographers instead of funding don't photo me wrist bands?

[Rainbow Ronan]

but will they even be effective? most people won't know what they mean. will be hard to see in crowds. won't be visible in the dark. and how many people will actually utilize them? I'm all for promoting consent I'm just not sure this is the right way to do it

[Wendy]

Pretty sure there are ways of addressing these concerns:

- make them fluoro with NO PHOTOS on them in large letters.

- all photographers liaise with Shelley already, and it'd be in the guidance for them and in the survival guide as to what they mean

- no idea how many would use them. If we made them the same each year and had them available at gate and depot, after the first year we'd know how many people would use them.

To summarise the thread so far we have only three people have weighed in on this topic - so far we have one against and two for.  Can we get some more opinions please?

On 5 October 2016 at 09:10, Rainbow Ronan <buckfast...@gmail.com> wrote:

but will they even be effective? most people won't know what they mean. will be hard to see in crowds. won't be visible in the dark. and how many people will actually utilize them? I'm all for promoting consent I'm just not sure this is the right way to do it

[Isa Ritchie]

I thought we had this conversation earlier on and the bands weren't really considered an effective option. Do we have any evidence they will work? If they are not always clearly visible will it create a false sense of security? I recall from the earlier conversation that not wearing the bands could be mistaken for consent, when consent should always be treated with care etc...

don't talk to me hats? don't offer me a drink cod pieces? 

Now you're talking!

On Wed, Oct 5, 2016 at 9:10 AM, Rainbow Ronan <buckfast...@gmail.com> wrote:

but will they even be effective? most people won't know what they mean. will be hard to see in crowds. won't be visible in the dark. and how many people will actually utilize them? I'm all for promoting consent I'm just not sure this is the right way to do it

[Shelley Watson]

we did have a thread earlier in the year I started : ...no photos wristbands...

tho as it came up in Asana, I brought it up again y day. we don't have to have them at all. or if we introduce them as a long term thing, our community will know that person doesn;t want to be photographed, not just our 'photographers' as such.

[Wendy]

OK I just read the previous thread and the outcome of that was the same as here - pragmatism vs personal responsibility, the possibility of no band being taken as blanket consent, no real conclusion, and the issue was dropped.

On 5 October 2016 at 09:25, Shelley Watson <she...@design.gen.nz> wrote:

we did have a thread earlier in the year I started : ...no photos wristbands...

tho as it came up in Asana, I brought it up again y day. we don't have to have them at all. or if we introduce them as a long term thing, our community will know that person doesn;t want to be photographed, not just our 'photographers' as such.

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[Shelley Watson]

shall we just leave it then? 

[Wendy]

Fine by me.  :)

It occurs to me that this is the sort of thing that we could have a community engagement person put out to the community for discussion and we could observe and see what the outcome of that was and it could inform future discussions.

On 5 October 2016 at 09:36, Shelley Watson <she...@design.gen.nz> wrote:

shall we just leave it then? 

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[Rainbow Ronan]

community inovation grant perhaps if someone did feel like pursuing this

[Shelley Watson]

that's a great idea!

[Pete Wyatt]

I feel the hard part will be getting "ALL photographers" to take notice them.....

these days every man, woman and child takes photos with their camera and flips them up on social media, sometimes my friends let me know when they have seen a good on of me

Radical Do'aucracy....

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