Using Avare with Stratux ADSB.

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fly...@yahoo.com

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Feb 18, 2017, 10:28:41 PM2/18/17
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Hi Everyone.

More people are using the ADSB external devices and while I am not in favor of using them, as more questions are coming up I decided to create a post that should help setting it up.

Post here if you have any suggestions and or find something in error.

Thank you. TV

 

Below there is a textual description, and the pic has text and visual description.

 

About Stratux, in particular, there seem to be multiple variations of hardware being used, different versions of PI boards, some have WiFi built in, like the PI 3 B, some use the dongle.
Make sure that you get the latest code for the particular version board that you have. CYoung? and there may be others that contributed  their efforts to provide the Free software are doing their best to keep the code updated / in sync with the latest hardware versions.
I will try to do my best to describe the PI 3 B that has a built in WiFi, this will work for other versions if you have the WiFi dongle.
If you have a device that is assembled, you must:
1-In your Tablet / receiving device, make sure WiFi is ON.
2-Start your Stratux and wait until your device is booted up, Green LED starts to blink, or about 1min.
3-In your Tablet, Connections>WiFi, make sure that you see  Stratux and get it Connected, Do Not proceed beyond this point unless you have that satisfied. Note: If you are close to another WiFi source / Modem etc. you may not see the Startux, move to a different location.
4-Start Avare, enable GPS and confirm that  you do not see the " No GPS Signal", you can also verify at least 3 Green Satellites in Tools.
5-In Menu Preferences Weather>Use ADSB Weather selected.
6-Create a Flight Plan in the area, may not be needed.
7-Send Avare to background, do not exit, Home key.
8-Sart Avare IO, version 4.0.2 or later.
9-From the top Down arrow, select WiFi, verify that port 4000 is entered, and select Listen. At this point you should see data streaming below, if not go back and verify WiFi still connected... I observed many WiFi connections drop offs  when near other sources.
10-Restart Avare and be patient, you may not see any Wx, unless you are in the vicinity of transmitting stations on the ground, but should work above 3000 Ft., and if you are close to the airport you should see some traffic,Blue dots.

AvaSrtxInstl.jpg

eub...@gmail.com

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Feb 27, 2017, 11:49:12 PM2/27/17
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I have been building and selling build your own Stratux instructions, Stratux kits, and completed units for more than a year. No kidding, and ADS-B device just might save your life. As an IFR pilot I depend on the information FIS-B provides. And TIS-B just might help me avoid a midair collision  with an idiotic VFR pilot not keeping VFR minimums.  If you don't like external devices presumably because you do not have confidence in them, don't use one. However if you are using one there are some things you need to know.

It does not matter if you are close to another Wi-Fi signal. If you are close to a Wi-Fi signal you have set to auto-connect you will have to disconnect and connect to the Stratux Wi-Fi. Once connected open a browser session (Chrome, Firefox, etc) and type 192.168.10.1 in the address bar. This will bring up the Stratux WebUI. This is the ONLY reliable way to be sure Stratux is up and working. The WebUI also provides lots of good information.

Equbal Kalani

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May 27, 2017, 8:38:57 AM5/27/17
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Hi: I've been using avare with stratux with no problems until recently. My Avare I/O does not show any data messages scrolling anymore despite the fact that I can see traffic data in the browser on 192.168.10.1. Tried uninstalling and installing avare i/o without success. Any help will be appreciated 


On Saturday, February 18, 2017 at 10:28:41 PM UTC-5, fly...@yahoo.com wrote:

fly...@yahoo.com

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May 27, 2017, 1:39:53 PM5/27/17
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Hi Equbal and everyone.
Make sure your WiFi tablet is Connected to the Stratux in your Settings and in the IO you select WiFi and port 4000.
Avare and the IO are working without the problem, it must be a step missing, follow the original post and make sure you do not miss any of the steps in the Procedure described. TV

eub...@gmail.com

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May 29, 2017, 1:12:19 AM5/29/17
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Although a long time ago I had a similar problem. I logged on to Stratux and deleted the logs but if you are not familiar with Linux the simplest and safest way is to simply download the latest image and re-image your SDcard. New image new logs

FYI for Linux users (if you know what this is then you know how to use it. Make a typo and maybe ruin the image)

sudo rm -f/var/log/stratux/*

eric parks

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May 29, 2017, 4:24:57 PM5/29/17
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I have a Samsung TAB A that works great with the stratux, of course with all of the above advice utilized. My Samsung Galaxy S7 from Verizon does not want  to latch in the the I/O. Not sure what that means, but thought it might add to the discussion.

fly...@yahoo.com

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May 29, 2017, 5:23:21 PM5/29/17
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Hi Eric.
Most of these unusual problems are attributed to the WiFi sync. Make sure the Sratux and your S7 is, and stays, connected at all times. I noticed that in an area with multiple WiFi sources Stratux tends to disconnect from WiFi / your device / Phone  tends to reconnect to something else. Check your Settings in your S7 and see if still connected? TV

John W SBA

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May 29, 2017, 6:32:42 PM5/29/17
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Edit 3/5/2019: For anyone using Avare with a Stratux receiver, be
sure to remember that Android's battery settings may affect it.  In
brief, you not only need to set up the Stratux and Avare correctly
using the steps described elsewhere.  You must ensure that your
Android battery settings don't prevent Avare from receiving and
displaying the Stratux data. There are details in this Topic here in
If you have problems with Stratux in Avare, after double checking
all of the settings you might want to look into all the Android
settings in your device. There may be others beyond battery
power saver settings that could affect Stratux and/or Avare.

In Samsung S7 phone Settings > Wi-Fi > Advanced (pull-down three
dots at top-right) I have "Smart network switch" turned off.  This might
help, given TV's idea below.  On other devices and Android versions
this setting will of course be in different places, and might not be
available at all on some.

Seems to me that Google, OEMs (e.g. Samsung) and carriers (e.g. Verizon)
all want to know where we are and what we're doing at all times.  They
also like to know where every wifi hotspot is, and to test them all
looking for open ones.  So maybe the default settings for wifi are to
always scan everything, and switch to the strongest signal with an
internet connection.  Anyway, I turn off everything possible and haven't
had problems with my home wifi.  I also use Airplane Mode aloft and when
not wanting incoming calls (asleep, etc.).  Every time Samsung has
pushed an update, I've needed to Disable more bloatware they've
installed and re-check settings they've turned back on.  Doing all this
enables me to enjoy going a week or so on a battery charge. :)

TV:
> with multiple WiFi sources Stratux tends to disconnect

Eric:

eub...@gmail.com

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May 30, 2017, 12:32:18 AM5/30/17
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Now I am spit balling here but I ask myself what is the difference between the Tab A and the S7? Well, one is a tablet and one is a phone. I wonder if the S7 would work if you put it in airplane mode (now there's an irony)

eub...@gmail.com

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May 30, 2017, 12:28:45 PM5/30/17
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I am wondering why TV keeps stating with multiple WiFi sources Stratux tends to disconnect. I have built many Stratux and tested them in an environment with three WiFi routers up and running. Never a disconnect. But the real rub is how can this be a problem in the plane? In the plane you are NOT going to "pickup" a WiFi signal period.

Anyway, try turning off the Smart Network Switch


On Monday, May 29, 2017 at 6:32:42 PM UTC-4, John Wiley wrote:
I haven't tried Stratux, nor used I/O on my VZW S7.  That said, in S7

fly...@yahoo.com

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May 30, 2017, 4:08:57 PM5/30/17
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Hi Eubie and everyone.
The reason I, TV, bring up WiFi is because I tested the unit in an environment that had many Sources of WiFi and every time it stopped working, for an illogical reason, I found out the Stratus was replaced by other devices around / disconnected.

We get very few details from the users abut the problems they encounter and most of the the uncommon problems are related to unusual procedures during the setup and not the app itself.

To the point of having only one WiFi source inside the aircraft I would be cautious, I fly some birds that have multiple instruments that interface / communicate via WiFi.

As to the Stratux and ADS-B traffic in general, I do not support using it yet, at this stage it can be more of a problem than help, it can be be of some use for Wx.

As to the Stratux itself, Avare only provides a conduit, communication channel, for it, and it is Not an Avare group developed code, and we just provide as much help as we can for Avare users. The code in Avare for Stratux works very well and the only issues I was able to find is the users not following the proper procedure to set it up.

If Users would give more details on the Procedure they follow, step by step, we can more efficiently help. In most cases the problems are created when a user attempts to do something that is out of sequence and or they do not properly know how to use their own device. You can also do a Search here on the Forum, All the problems showing up lately, have been discussed, an solution found for them.

For better help, post details and pics. when you can. TV

eub...@gmail.com

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May 30, 2017, 5:49:20 PM5/30/17
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Fly TV,
I just have to know how you came to use the handle Fly TV.

I agree totally that you should not rely on the Stratux for traffic but then I would not depend on any TIS-B unit until 2020. Depending on ground stations for relay traffic is a really bad idea. On the other hand I find FIS-B indispensable.

I am  very curious about planes that have several WiFi instruments. I have never seen any  and cannot find any TSO'd instruments that RECEIVE data  via WiFi. Commercial ADS-B devices (L3, NaxWorx et et) have OPTIONAL WiFi transmitters for the specific purpose of TABLET interface but not any other type of instrument. We all have things to learn so I would greatly appreciate it if you would tell me a few of the instruments that use WiFi.

Thanks in advance
Eubie

fly...@yahoo.com

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May 30, 2017, 7:34:10 PM5/30/17
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Hi Eubie.
TV are my initials, and the "fly" part is something I've been doing most of my life.

Dynon, TruTrak, Garmin PFTs, GPSs , some AP, GoPro and other cameras... and there are some less known all have the ability to communicate via WiFi, and in some cases you can have a separate IP for each instrument. TV

bman

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Jun 1, 2017, 9:59:33 AM6/1/17
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I am not sure I understand the concept of not using information in the cockpit that provides more data for safety whether that is weather or traffic.  I think we all understand the shortcomings, but any additional information is good.  If "rely" infers ignoring other sources of information (llike ATC or your eyes) I agree we should not rely on any single source - including ATC. Unless you have an F16 with air to air targeting radar, there is no absolute electronic means of determining traffic available to the pilot.

Therefore, just like we should gather all the weather information we can (FIS-B, preflight with DUATs, FSS, PIREPs, and our eyes), we should do the same with traffic.  TIS-B is just another source to provide SOME traffic information.  What is provides is accurate, just not complete. The advisories we get from ATC are also incomplete (consider that Tracon usually cannot see primary only aircraft and Center normally filters out anything but transponder equipped aircraft). They are accurate for what they report and often not complete especially if you add the problem of interface between controller and pilot. How often have you seen traffic zip by while on an IFR clearance with no notification? The traffic data provided by TIS-B should get better as we approach 2020 but even then there will be thousands of non-equipped aircraft. We are likely to see an increase in TIS-B data and a decrease in ATC capability if they remove Center radar as planned.

Use all the data you can get your hands on and rely solely on none. Unless IMC, the eyes are still the best source of data we have.

On Saturday, February 18, 2017 at 10:28:41 PM UTC-5, fly...@yahoo.com wrote:

Mike Dwyer

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Jun 1, 2017, 4:50:35 PM6/1/17
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Agreed.
I love my Stratux and Avare setup.  I am StratusESG ADS-B out equipped as I fly in Class B airspace all the time.  I used to have a Zaon MRX (listens for transponders and reports distance and altitude) and played a game of who sees the traffic first.  I was 50:50 with that device.  With the Stratux it sees the traffic 99% of the time before I do.  The only time I see the traffic first is when the other plane is illegal and has no transponder (Class B remember).  One time I did catch the Stratux showing the target at 10 o'clock when I found it at 2 o'clock.  I figured that was due to him using a transponder and the delay getting thru the ATC computer system.  I also like knowing the traffics' altitude, direction of flight, and approximate speed thanks to Avare!
Mike
N3QP
Q200 Website: http://goo.gl/V8IrJF

Greg Renda

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Jun 19, 2017, 4:40:31 PM6/19/17
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I've been very happy with my Avare/Stratux combination.  I'm definitely in the the more information is better camp.  I did run into a small issue yesterday, however.  I long-pressed on a restricted area in order to get the pop up containing the airspace info.  I was very confused when that info was nowhere to be found in the pop up.  I eventually figured out that if you have "Use ADSB Weather" checked in Preferences->Weather, the airspace info is not displayed.  Is this intentional?  Is there another way to get the airspace info while "Use ADSB Weather" is enabled?

Mike

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Jun 20, 2017, 5:12:25 PM6/20/17
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Hi Greg

This is by design. You either have the internet provided data as source or ADSB. If you select ADSB, you will have to wait for the data to come in via your receiver, before it will be displayed.

Regards, Mike

Greg Renda

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Jun 20, 2017, 5:28:45 PM6/20/17
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Ah, I didn't know that airspace info was part of the ADSB data.  Would be nice if when the ADSB data wasn't available to fall back to the internet data.  Or, at least, to indicate that the data wasn't available.

-Greg

Peter Gustafson

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Jun 20, 2017, 7:02:07 PM6/20/17
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I'm learning a lot from this discussion.

From the FAQ (https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/programs/adsb/faq/):
What are FAA ADS-B In broadcast services?

    Aviation Routine Weather Reports (METARs)
    Non-Routine Aviation Weather Reports (SPECIs)
    Terminal Area Forecasts (TAFs) and their amendments
    NEXRAD (regional and CONUS) precipitation maps
    Notice to Airmen (NOTAM) Distant and Flight Data Center
    Airmen's Meteorological Conditions (AIRMET)
    Significant Meteorological Conditions (SIGMET) and Convective SIGMET
    Status of Special Use Airspace (SUA)
    Temporary Flight Restrictions (TFRs)
    Winds and Temperatures Aloft
    Pilot Reports (PIREPS)

I'm not currently sure the status of receiving all these in Avare... I flew my stratux box (first times) for just under 5 hours last week.  I got recall seeing TAFs, winds, and pireps.  I didn't get any NEXRAD (despite having plenty of nearby precip).  I'm equipped with ADSB-out, but they don't broadcast to you unless you have ADBS-in.  As there aren't many birds in the air in my region, I don't get to piggy back too often.

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Mike

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Jun 21, 2017, 5:11:31 PM6/21/17
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To clarify - which data are you exactly looking for, related to "airspace info"?

Greg Renda

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Jun 21, 2017, 5:39:58 PM6/21/17
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All the info that appears in the popup when using internet data which include: name, altitude range, frequencies, notes.

Mike

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Jul 1, 2017, 8:42:57 AM7/1/17
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I tried to reproduce this, but it seems to work as designed. If you activate "Use ADSB Weather", only ADSB provided data is not dispalyed anymore. Frequencies are visible on the A/FD tab.

Regards, Mike

Greg Renda

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Jul 2, 2017, 11:52:07 AM7/2/17
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Here are a couple of screen shots showing the problem.  These result from a long press on SFO with and without "Use ADSB Weather" selected.

-Greg
with_adsb_weather.png
no_adsb_weather.png

fly...@yahoo.com

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Jul 2, 2017, 12:18:56 PM7/2/17
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Hi Greg.
You will get All / most / the same data IF you get the ADS-B current information.
If you are on the ground you will not get ADS-B in most / all locations. I found that you have to be around 3000Ft. AGL, in my area to get it.
Read Peter's post, above, for more details. TV

Greg Renda

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Jul 2, 2017, 12:43:38 PM7/2/17
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When I first ran into this problem I was at about 4500ft AGL and was receiving other ADS-B data (traffic, pireps, metars, etc).  But, regardless, I think it would be useful to display the non-ADS-B data if the ADS-B equivalent is not available.  It's not obvious that you have to disable ADS-B weather in order to see it and, even if it were, it's a bit of a pain.  Especially if you are fast approaching the restricted area as was my situation :-).

-Greg

fly...@yahoo.com

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Jul 2, 2017, 1:48:49 PM7/2/17
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Hi Greg.
I agree with you, and I suggest that users Do NOT depend on the ADS-B for information. Get you WX / data before you go up, for the duration of your flight, or get some additional info in the air from available sources.
If one needs to depend on ADS-B I would suggest that pilots learn how to get info needed without having ADS-B and or go only  when completely CAVU VFR for the next 24 hrs., or duration of flight, not likely to be many days.
By rthe way you can increase the Duration of the WX, that you get from Inet, to be viewed, without AS-B, and go back to it later.TV

John W SBA

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Jul 2, 2017, 4:20:29 PM7/2/17
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> suggest that users Do NOT depend on the ADS-B

My own solution is to use internet data for primary and use ADS-B on a
secondary device. I find it helpful to have both simultaneously without
having to switch anything other than my glance. I like ADS-B for the
most current data, and internet for the most reliable.

Zubair Khan

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Jul 2, 2017, 7:05:17 PM7/2/17
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Sure we will look into combining internet and adsb weather.


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bman

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Jul 3, 2017, 8:51:36 PM7/3/17
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Okay, TV, we understand you are against ADSB for in cockpit data for some reason but you are in an increasing minority as pilots become more educated and experienced with ADSB. It is simply wrong to rely only on Internet info acquired before a flight and to ignore a perfectly useful - and accurate - data source during the flight. Pilots should avail themselves to ALL available information for safety reasons.

By the way, ADSB also includes traffic (TIS-B) which is not available through an Internet source.

Zubair Khan

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Jul 3, 2017, 8:59:23 PM7/3/17
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I don't think TV sounds against ADSB. It's just not reliable in my experience and that's why I think he is saying. I myself rarely use it because I am not sure if I will get anything at a particular time.

What's the conversation about? Are we not seeing data ? Or is it that you want ADSB data to merge with internet data when it's received?
Thanks


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On Jul 3, 2017, 8:51 PM, bman < beech...@gmail.com> wrote:
Okay, TV, we understand you are against ADSB for in cockpit data for some reason but you are in an increasing minority as pilots become more educated and experienced with ADSB. It is simply wrong to rely only on Internet info acquired before a flight and to ignore a perfectly useful - and accurate - data source during the flight. Pilots should avail themselves to ALL available information for safety reasons.

By the way, ADSB also includes traffic (TIS-B) which is not available through an Internet source.

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Christine R

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Jul 4, 2017, 1:44:39 PM7/4/17
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Zubair,

Here is my experience. I get weather and TFR briefings before the flight, usually through the 1800wxbrief website and will do an Avare internet download if WiFi is available. Then when I'm in the air I switch to adsb weather and traffic to supplement the info I already have. However in adsb mode, Avare does not display the borders of the TFRs that were downloaded on the ground.

In my situation, it would be nice if we could either 1) View the TFRs that are being transmitted through adsb or 2) Allow the internet downloaded TFR data to be displayed in adsb mode (consider decoupling it from the weather expiration time clock?). I think either of those options provides better info to me than relying on my memory alone, especially when operating near a complex shaped presidential TFR like we currently see near NY/NJ.

- Christine

Michael Smith

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Jul 4, 2017, 2:42:02 PM7/4/17
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I use ADSB for weather, only. If you don't have ADSB out then you have a false sense of security about traffic, as you probably are seeing only a fraction of what is actually out there around you. I've experienced this many times. This is the best "simple" explanation I've seen:

http://ipadpilotnews.com/2016/01/ads-b-traffic-101-2/

Mike


On Monday, July 3, 2017 at 8:59:23 PM UTC-4, Zubair Khan wrote:
I don't think TV sounds against ADSB. It's just not reliable in my experience and that's why I think he is saying. I myself rarely use it because I am not sure if I will get anything at a particular time.


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bman

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Jul 4, 2017, 3:38:14 PM7/4/17
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But the fraction you see is more than not using it at all for traffic. Isn't it better to have more data about traffic as long as you understand it may not be complete?
My experience is that weather is close to 100% reliable and traffic depends on how many "out" aircraft are nearby. I would still rather see the partial picture than none.

Michael Smith

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Jul 4, 2017, 11:13:10 PM7/4/17
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On 7/4/2017 3:38 PM, bman wrote:
But the fraction you see is more than not using it at all for traffic. Isn't it better to have more data about traffic as long as you understand it may not be complete? 
My experience is that weather is close to 100% reliable and traffic depends on how many "out" aircraft are nearby. I would still rather see the partial picture than none.

I just find "incomplete" to be an understatement. Really just about everything is missing, or potentially so; you have no way of knowing. I've had airplanes fly across my nose a half mile away and they weren't displayed. I've had Boston airspace show me that nothing was in the area, when I know there are 3 or 4 dozen planes in the area. If I can't trust it, then I'd just as soon not have it. I'm working on getting an ADSB In/Out solution in my experimental a/c that will still be displayed on Avare. Hopefully by the end of the summer. Then I'll at least feel better about what I see on the screen.

For anyone using ADSB-In (only), as long as they know the limitations then certainly there is no harm at all. But I've been amazed at how the vast majority of users of ADSB-In (only) that I talk to really think they are getting all the traffic in the area because they have ADSB-In, they have a transponder, and there are ground stations nearby. We had this discussion last week at my EAA chapter meeting and 3/4 of the In-only users believed they were getting nearly a 100% traffic picture.

Mike


eub...@gmail.com

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Jul 5, 2017, 12:27:25 AM7/5/17
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To All


I assembled many Stratux and all of my customers are very happy. None of them use AVARE. I use AVARE for approach practice as it is faster to change plates than my iFLYGPS. I can tell you with certainty that the Stratux works perfectly on iFLYGPS. All FIS-B functions work perfectly. BUT TIS-B cannot be relied on until the 2020 mandate. For now the only traffic you will see directly is from planes that are 1090ES equipped and then only if you are running dual radios. If you are flying in an ATC radar veil you will see the traffic ATC sees. ATC sends the radar tracking information to the ground station and re-transmits it to any ADS-B receiver so the information is delayed by a few seconds.


Have you ever wondered why you see traffic and then it just disappears? It is because the plane dropped below radar altitude or simply is out of range.

 

ADS-B is mature. It works. But you cannot count on FIS-B until 2020. For you guys flying around with your Stratux guess what. If you are not flying in a radar environment NO one can see you and you can’t see them.

 

In 2020 everyone will be flying ADS-B out. Everyone will see everyone. But for now we will only directly ‘see’ planes with ADS-B out or 1090ES.

 

With your single radio Stratux you can see

Planes with ADS-B out

Planes being tracked by ATC radar


With your dual radio Stratux you can see Planes with 1090ES as they transmit directly to you.


 

I do not use AVARE enroute so I can’t speak about the helper plug-but I can tell you with certainty FIS-B works perfectly iFLYGPS. I have over 200 hours with my Stratux and I am totally confident in the information is receives.

Chip Davis

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Jul 5, 2017, 8:54:52 AM7/5/17
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Eubie9, I think you meant "But you cannot count on TIS-B until 2020".

Personally, having lived through the original transponder "mandate", I have serious doubts about the equipage of ADS-B/out by 2020.  The best possible scenario (imho) is that you might be able to trust TIS-B while you are within controlled airspace.  But if you are there, you should be in contact with ATC in the first place.  Outside of that, all bets are off, and it's still "see and avoid".

Now, would anyone care to discuss the effect on TIS-B of all the UAV's with their micro-ADS-B/out targets popping up?

-Chip-

Zubair Khan

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Jul 5, 2017, 1:29:55 PM7/5/17
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Hi Christine

Are you sure that TFR borders are not shown in ADSB mode? I see them. Maybe your data expiry setting (under weather settings where the ADSB weather option is) is too short. Try changing to 360 minutes.

SUA information is not shown. It should be received from ADSB (or shown for internet), I agree.

Hi Chip

I totally agree.

Zubair


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eub...@gmail.com

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Jul 5, 2017, 6:37:54 PM7/5/17
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Chip,

My bad! I must do a better job of proof reading. It just seems that there is a lot of confusion about ADS-B. UAV go TIS-B are going to be a problem but they will be ID'd. The horror will be when they don't respect the airspace. There will be excursions.

Michael Smith

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Jul 5, 2017, 10:39:11 PM7/5/17
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On 7/5/2017 12:27 AM, eub...@gmail.com wrote:
If you are flying in an ATC radar veil you will see the traffic ATC sees. ATC sends the radar tracking information to the ground station and re-transmits it to any ADS-B receiver so the information is delayed by a few seconds.

If you are ADSB-In (only), then that is not true. You "might" see the traffic in that area IF there is another ADSB-Out aircraft causing the ground station to send out its information. If not, then the ground station will NOT send its information to you. The FAA set it up that way to get us all to upgrade to ADSB-Out. I fly within the Mode C veil of Boston, and I don't see the traffic within that Mode C veil except very infrequently. I have purposely flown over some of the local ground stations but get no traffic unless there is another aircraft in the area causing the ground station to become active.

Mike

Christine R

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Jul 5, 2017, 11:14:33 PM7/5/17
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Mike, I'm curious what band are you monitoring for adsb in?

I'm also under the Boston mode C veil (based at 1B9) and I can't remember a time when I've seen NO traffic displayed around here. For sure I don't see everything. For every aircraft I spot with my visual scan, I'd say 40% of those are not displayed in my iPad. I have 1 antenna on my raspberry pi and it's usually monitoring the 978 band. I do not have adsb out (yet).

Christine R

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Jul 5, 2017, 11:20:44 PM7/5/17
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Thanks Zubair, my weather is set to 30 mins. I'll try longer and see if that helps.

Michael Smith

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Jul 5, 2017, 11:53:38 PM7/5/17
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978 band, through a DUAL XGPS 170. I get weather just fine, and got
some traffic on the way out and back to OSH, but actually saw very
little traffic displayed. I see very little in and around the Boston
area, too.

Mike

John W SBA

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Jul 6, 2017, 1:34:41 AM7/6/17
to Michael Smith, apps4a...@googlegroups.com
> I fly within the Mode C veil of Boston, and I don't see the traffic

I occasionally fly the LAX Class B area, and after preflight online data
download and in-flight check of UAT, I switch the HIZ app to 1090 and at
least see everyone with Out who's on that channel. I use an S7 phone on
a cool $14 mount I found online for ADS-B In with HIZ; and use the
internet data on my main Avare tablet (SM-350). Works OK until I get
ADS-B Out.

Barry

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Jul 6, 2017, 3:39:18 PM7/6/17
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I use two external devices, Stratux and Bolutek for BT to serial to drive my autopilot. Is there another way to do all of this internally with my Samsung 9.6 tablet? If not, what r your objections to external devices?
Second, I turned on the feature that allows AVARE to blink the screen when an event warrants attention. What are those events and how do I discern between different events?
BTW, Great product, KUDOS, I sent in a donation and suggest everyone do the same every year.  Thx to this product I am able to avoid potential conflicts long before the other fellow gets close.  My wife says: BLESS YOU.

On Saturday, February 18, 2017 at 8:28:41 PM UTC-7, fly...@yahoo.com wrote:


Hi Everyone.

More people are using the ADSB external devices and while I am not in favor of using them, as more questions are coming up I decided to create a post that should help setting it up.

Post here if you have any suggestions and or find something in error.

Thank you. TV

 

Below there is a textual description, and the pic has text and visual description.

 

About Stratux, in particular, there seem to be multiple variations of hardware being used, different versions of PI boards, some have WiFi built in, like the PI 3 B, some use the dongle.
Make sure that you get the latest code for the particular version board that you have. CYoung? and there may be others that contributed  their efforts to provide the Free software are doing their best to keep the code updated / in sync with the latest hardware versions.
I will try to do my best to describe the PI 3 B that has a built in WiFi, this will work for other versions if you have the WiFi dongle.
If you have a device that is assembled, you must:
1-In your Tablet / receiving device, make sure WiFi is ON.
2-Start your Stratux and wait until your device is booted up, Green LED starts to blink, or about 1min.
3-In your Tablet, Connections>WiFi, make sure that you see  Stratux and get it Connected, Do Not proceed beyond this point unless you have that satisfied. Note: If you are close to another WiFi source / Modem etc. you may not see the Startux, move to a different location.
4-Start Avare, enable GPS and confirm that  you do not see the " No GPS Signal", you can also verify at least 3 Green Satellites in Tools.
5-In Menu Preferences Weather>Use ADSB Weather selected.
6-Create a Flight Plan in the area, may not be needed.
7-Send Avare to background, do not exit, Home key.
8-Sart Avare IO, version 4.0.2 or later.
9-From the top Down arrow, select WiFi, verify that port 4000 is entered, and select Listen. At this point you should see data streaming below, if not go back and verify WiFi still connected... I observed many WiFi connections drop offs  when near other sources.
10-Restart Avare and be patient, you may not see any Wx, unless you are in the vicinity of transmitting stations on the ground, but should work above 3000 Ft., and if you are close to the airport you should see some traffic,Blue dots.

eub...@gmail.com

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Jul 6, 2017, 3:54:27 PM7/6/17
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Then I stand corrected. This information was given to me by my Instrument instructor to answer the question 'why the traffic disappears'. I have observed traffic disappearing at 3000 but I know they should still have a tower or two in the area.  Thanks for setting me straight

fly...@yahoo.com

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Jul 6, 2017, 5:34:24 PM7/6/17
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Hi Barry.
The Blink notifications are when you get close to a Waypoint. I am not aware of other selections.

About Stratux + Bolutek, I am not familiar with it but if you want the Stratux to display Traffic, Wx, on your Tablet, all you need is to make sure you have WiFi on your stratux and the Green LED is On, enable the WiFi on your tablet, and Connect with your Stratux.
 Start Avare on the Tablet, send Avare to background (Home key), start Avare IO>select WiFi, and select / enter the Port 4000, send Avare IO to background, and restart Avare.

I am not sure that I completely understand that part of your message, post here if you need more help. TV

James Holland

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Jul 7, 2017, 9:07:27 AM7/7/17
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Barry, I purchased (Amazon Prime $10) another device since I couldn't find a source for the Bluteck you used.  

KEDSUM Arduino HC-06 Serial Bluetooth Slave Wireless RF Transceiver Module 4 Pin with DuPont Cable.  


I'm sending it to you for further testing since I don't own any device these days that has a serial interface, or the old laptop I have might do the job but you've got it up and running.  It turns out that between Ebay and Amazon there are dozens of these devices for as little as $2.  It seems the robotics folks are all over this.  In the mean time I sticking with my 496 slaved to my Turtrack, rock solid for 12 years.  The ADS-B setup is working great now.  On the ground sees our local landing traffic (FNL), lots of high altitude traffic in and out and over DEN.  I'll check your email first to see where you got your suction cups?

Best,

Mike
N192MH 980hrs

Peter Gustafson

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Jul 17, 2017, 11:46:23 PM7/17/17
to James Holland, Apps4Av Forum
Just one thing I want to make sure everybody is aware of. At least to my level of understanding, you are not a adsb in equipped unless you have installed equipment certified for that purpose. The rebroadcast system knows whether you have it or not. Therefore, having adsb out in your airplane doesn't guarantee you're going to get any information back. See this faq.

https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/programs/adsb/faq/

Stratux with adsb out, as good as it is, is not legally adsb in. To get anything useful, you still need to piggyback off of somebody else. This might explain different levels of satisfaction in different regions.

For what it's worth I think this was a poor decision by the FAA. They must have had some good reasons, but I can't think of any that would have swayed me towards the diminished situational awareness. Once you have paid to offer up your out data, they should send it back.

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John W SBA

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Jul 18, 2017, 4:28:49 AM7/18/17
to Peter Gustafson, James Holland, Apps4Av Forum
> not a adsb in equipped unless you have installed equipment certified

Thanks for mentioning that, Peter. I've wondered about it.

> adsb out ... doesn't guarantee you're going to get any info

But since the In device doesn't transmit, isn't the capability to
receive simply a setting in the Out device?

> I think this was a poor decision by the FAA.

Seems to me there were several poor decisions in the design and
implementation process. :(

FAA AC 20-172B on TIS-B & ADS-R says it "describes an acceptable means,
but not the only means, to install ADS-B In equipment."

So have you read something in that document indicating only particular
classes (listed below) can qualify for TIS-B & ADS-R? Maybe there's
something in the requirements for setting the ADS-B In transmitted by an
Out installation, requiring a certified In receiver as described in 20-172B?

...
"2-2. Equipment Classes.
TSO-C195b defines minimum performance standards that provide a basis for
installation of ADS-B In equipment in aircraft. The TSO defines four
avionics equipment classes: (A) cockpit display of traffic information
(CDTI) (surface only); (B) CDTI; (C) airborne surveillance and
separation assurance processing (ASSAP); and (D) ADS-B Traffic Advisory
System (ATAS) Annunciator Panel. Class A equipment is intended to
support the display of ADS-B traffic while own-ship is on the surface
and moving slower than 80 knots. Class A equipment must deactivate the
CDTI when airborne or at speeds greater than 80 knots. Class B equipment
supports the display of ADS-B traffic when airborne as well as on the
ground. Class C equipment processes ADS-B messages to generate traffic
data for a CDTI. Class D equipment supports an aural only
implementation. Currently, this is only available for one application. ..."
...
"3-1. General.
Chapter 3. Test and Evaluation.
Installation of an ADS-B In system should be accomplished on an aircraft
with an ADS-B Out system. ADS-R and TIS-B services are only provided to
aircraft that indicate, in their ADS-B Out messages, that they are an
ADS-B In aircraft. This chapter assumes that the ADS-B Out system
complies with AC 20-165A, and defines tests for the installed system."

PDF:
http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_20-172B.pdf

bman

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Jul 18, 2017, 9:05:20 AM7/18/17
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ADS-B In data consists of two types: TIS-B and FIS-B.  FIS-B data includes weather information available and broadcast to ALL UAT receivers from the assortment of ground stations.  There is no need for ADS-B Out equipment to "trigger" this broadcast as it is sent out all the time to anyone with equipment to receive UAT signals.  I receive FIS-B data sitting here in my office.  TIS-B data contains information about traffic in the area of the ground station(s). The broadcast of this data is tailored to a 30 mile and +/- 3500' disc surrounding certified ADS-B out transmitters within range of a ground station and is only broadcast when one of those certified transmitters is nearby.  Therefore, if there are no ADS-B transmitters nearby, 1090 or UAT, there will be no broadcast of traffic data.  This is where the concept of "piggy backing" a certified transmitting aircraft is derived.

It is NOT necessary for an aircraft to have certified ADS-B In equipment to trigger the transmission of TIS-B data. During the setup of ADS-B Out equipment there is a software toggle to set whether the aircraft is equipped for ADS-B In - either a certified receiver within the 1090 or UAT equipment or any other ADS-B In capability, certified or not (like Stratux, GDL89, Stratus, DUAL, iLevil, Clarity, Pingbuddy, etc.).

In summary, weather data is available all of the time to ANY aircraft with In capability like a Stratux receiver.  Traffic data is available to ANY aircraft with Out equipment assuming during installation the toggle was switched to indicate In capability - certified or not. With no Out capability, you are going to see traffic displayed only if you are within the 30 nm by 7000' disc of an aircraft with Out equipment.

Chip Davis

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Jul 18, 2017, 10:33:38 AM7/18/17
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I think there may be several issues here that need to be clarified.

First, let's separate "Traffic Information Services" from "Flight
Information Services". "FIS-B is available free to any operator with
the ability to receive ... the data that is broadcast on ... the 978
MHz link." No requirement for an "approved ADS-Binstallation". If you
have a Stratux, you're good.

Toget traffic, you'll need an ADS-B/In receiver of some sort. The FAQ
says that "TIS-B is a free service available to aircraft operators
equipped with ADS-B Out and ADS-B In." The key (and misleading) word
is "and". Again, if you have a Stratux, you're good, mostly.

For starters, there is "legal" and "works". If I'm a day late getting
my biennial transponder/altimeter-encoder certification from my
friendly neighborhoodavionicker, I'm not legal. But the damn thing
still works and, more importantly, ATC has no way of knowing whether
it's legal or not. (Thereis notechnical reason that recertification
information couldn't be added to the Mode-S squitter, however. The
way things are going, it probably will be.)

By the same token, there is absolutely no way for ATC or the ADS-B
system to know if you have a "certified ADS-B/In installation" or just
a Stratux. A receiver has no way of notifying the ADS-B system of
anything. Therefore, the system has no way of knowing if (or with
what) you are receiving TIS-B, it just does its thing. The same is
true for thetransponders on all ADS-B Out-equipped aircraft: they just
broadcast.

The ADS-B system does not interrogate aircraft, as radar does, to
trigger a squawk back from all aircraft within range. Instead, if you
have ADS-B, you are required by §91.225(f) "Each person operating an
aircraft equipped with ADS-B Out must operate this equipment in the
transmit mode at all times."

The ADS-R station simply listens for ADS-B/Out squawks. If it hears
none, it doesnothing. If it hears a squawk, it broadcasts theTIS-B
information. If you are in a remote area, with no one squawking
ADS-B/Out, you may not get all the traffic.

FIS-B, otoh, is broadcast continuously on 978MHzand does not require
an ADS-B/Out trigger.

So here's the situation: if you have a Stratux and are in a remote
region where there is no ADS-B/Out traffic (including airliners up in
the flight levels) you likely won'tsee any traffic because there
aren't anyprimary ADS-B/Out squawks to hear on 978 MHz or 1090 MHz.
Nor will you see any TIS-B targets being rebroadcast by the local
ADS-R ground station because it hears no ADS-B/Out traffic to trigger
it, or you're further than ~150 nm from the nearest station. Unless
you are attending a sailplane or balloonevent in the middle of
nowhere, that indicates that there is very little traffic with which
to be concerned in the first place.

On the more common hand, after 2020 someone in the service volume of
your ADS-R ground station will trigger its re-broadcast of the current
TIS-Bto everyone with an ADS-B receiver, "approved installation" or
not. That will show you all the ADS-B/Out trafficand all the
non-ADS-B primary and secondary targets painted by the local radar
facility.You should also hear ADS-B/Out squawks directly from aircraft
on the other side of you from the ground station. And frankly, that
should cover the vast majority of the targets you are concerned about.
Not much we can do about birds and drones at this point.

So I'll leave for discussion the accuracy of the FAQ statement "ADS-R
and TIS-B services are only provided to aircraft that indicate, in
their ADS-B Out messages, that they are an ADS-B In aircraft." I call
"bo-o-gus" because the only reason ADS-B/Out is required is to trigger
ADS-R, and if there is enough traffic for me to worry about it, there
are going to be a lot folks with more money than I that will have
installed ADS-B/Out.

[We can discuss separately the festering pustule on the stately
countenance of English grammar represented by the misplaced "only" in
that FAQ statement.]

-Chip-

bman

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Jul 18, 2017, 11:49:22 AM7/18/17
to Apps4Av Forum
a couple clarifications:  in my post I meant GDL 39 which is the Garmin non-TSO portable ADS-B in product, not GDL 89

Next, I believe you will find that a certified ADS-B Out transmitter sending a data stream meeting the performance requirements of the TSO is required to trigger TIS-B and ADS-R from the ground stations.  In the setup of my Garmin GTX335 ES transponder, there is a selection for 1090 In (yes or no) and one for 978 In (yes or no). It is my understanding that the ground station is looking for a yes on at least one of those in order to transmit the traffic data back out. 

For a decade I used XM weathr. For the last several years, my DUAL XGPS 170 has been receiving all weather products and traffic as a piggy-back to some other aircraft Out signal.  The weather products, while not quite as good as XM, are totally sufficient and don't cost $60 per month.  Now with Out capability and a Stratux dual frequency receiver, I receive the same weather but see a more complete traffic picture - some directly from other aircraft and others through TIS-B and ADS-R. The system works well virtually everywhere but some of the most remote western mountain areas at lower altitudes, is accurate and timely, and I wouldn't want to tackle a long trip without it.

Christine R

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Jul 21, 2017, 1:58:33 PM7/21/17
to Apps4Av Forum, fly...@yahoo.com
Hi guys, looking for ideas.

My current tablet screen is dying, so I picked up a Samsung Tab A7.  The new tablet connects to the Stratux wifi, however when I run the IO app (port 4000 + Listen) I don't see any data.  I can see that data is flowing using the Stratux manager app and also my old tablet is receiving data normally.  Both tablets are running the IO version 4.0.2.  My new tablet is running Android 5.1.1 compared to the old tablet 4.4.4.  I've attached some side by side screen shots...

I've followed the 10 steps above.  I've uninstalled and re-installed the I/O app.  I've used the clear cache and clear data buttons in the android app manager.  I've turned off the WiFi smart network feature.  There is no indication that the wifi is dropping on the new tablet.  The only difference I notice is the new tablet will point out that this WiFi has no internet access.  Any thoughts on settings I may have missed?  I'm having the same issue on my Samsung S7 phone, so it's clearly me and not the IO app.

Thoughts?
Christine



On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 at 4:08:57 PM UTC-4, fly...@yahoo.com wrote:
Hi Eubie and everyone.
The reason I, TV, bring up WiFi is because I tested the unit in an environment that had many Sources of WiFi and every time it stopped working, for an illogical reason, I found out the Stratus was replaced by other devices around / disconnected.

We get very few details from the users abut the problems they encounter and most of the the uncommon problems are related to unusual procedures during the setup and not the app itself.

To the point of having only one WiFi source inside the aircraft I would be cautious, I fly some birds that have multiple instruments that interface / communicate via WiFi.

As to the Stratux and ADS-B traffic in general, I do not support using it yet, at this stage it can be more of a problem than help, it can be be of some use for Wx.

As to the Stratux itself, Avare only provides a conduit, communication channel, for it, and it is Not an Avare group developed code, and we just provide as much help as we can for Avare users. The code in Avare for Stratux works very well and the only issues I was able to find is the users not following the proper procedure to set it up.

If Users would give more details on the Procedure they follow, step by step, we can more efficiently help. In most cases the problems are created when a user attempts to do something that is out of sequence and or they do not properly know how to use their own device. You can also do a Search here on the Forum, All the problems showing up lately, have been discussed, an solution found for them.

For better help, post details and pics. when you can. TV


On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 at 9:28:45 AM UTC-7, eub...@gmail.com wrote:
I am wondering why TV keeps stating with multiple WiFi sources Stratux tends to disconnect. I have built many Stratux and tested them in an environment with three WiFi routers up and running. Never a disconnect. But the real rub is how can this be a problem in the plane? In the plane you are NOT going to "pickup" a WiFi signal period.

Anyway, try turning off the Smart Network Switch


On Monday, May 29, 2017 at 6:32:42 PM UTC-4, John Wiley wrote:
I haven't tried Stratux, nor used I/O on my VZW S7.  That said, in S7
Settings > Wi-Fi > Advanced (pull-down three dots at top-right) I have
"Smart network switch" turned off.  This might help, given TV's idea
below.  On other devices and Android versions this setting will of
course be in different places, and might not be available at all on some.

Seems to me that Google, OEMs (e.g. Samsung) and carriers (e.g. Verizon)
all want to know where we are and what we're doing at all times.  They
also like to know where every wifi hotspot is, and to test them all
looking for open ones.  So maybe the default settings for wifi are to
always scan everything, and switch to the strongest signal with an
internet connection.  Anyway, I turn off everything possible and haven't
had problems with my home wifi.  I also use Airplane Mode aloft and when
not wanting incoming calls (asleep, etc.).  Every time Samsung has
pushed an update, I've needed to Disable more bloatware they've
installed and re-check settings they've turned back on.  Doing all this
enables me to enjoy going a week or so on a battery charge. :)

TV:
> with multiple WiFi sources Stratux tends to disconnect

Eric:
>> S7 from Verizon does not want  to latch in the the I/O
Manager.jpg
Wifi connected.jpg
about tablet.jpg
Data.jpg
about IO.jpg

fly...@yahoo.com

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Jul 21, 2017, 3:17:44 PM7/21/17
to apps4a...@googlegroups.com, fly...@yahoo.com
Hi Christine.
Confirm that you are using the same Avare version 771 or let us know what its?
Confirm that you give Avare and Avare IO All the needed permissions.
It looks like you are doing the right things, I would just check back and see that Stratux is still WiFi connected after you send the Avare IO to the background. TV

Christine R

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Jul 21, 2017, 8:41:51 PM7/21/17
to Apps4Av Forum
The attempts last night were with a previous version of Avare. I have updated to Avare 7.7.1 and tried again today with the same results. I always hit a brick wall at step 9. When I click listen in the IO app, there is no data showing. I don't even see the 'low battery false' message I would normally expect to see. I am sure the WiFi is still connected when the app is minimized, and I can see traffic and weather data rolling in with the stratux manager app.

Is there a permission setting or another app that might interfere/prevent Wi-Fi data from getting to the IO app?

Thanks

fly...@yahoo.com

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Jul 21, 2017, 9:07:44 PM7/21/17
to apps4a...@googlegroups.com
Hi Christine.
Nothing in particular, they All have to be enabled. Here is what works in my Tab A 7in.
Confirm Menu>Preferences>GPS=All Available, should be by default.
You may want to try and reinstall Avare, be cautious you will need to redownload all your Data, Charts etc. TV
AvIO-Perms.jpg
Av-Perms.jpg

Zubair Khan

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Jul 21, 2017, 10:10:56 PM7/21/17
to rhuba...@gmail.com, apps4a...@googlegroups.com, fly...@yahoo.com
Christine
I think you fly near OWD. I will be happy to look at this problem in person if you can make it to the airport. I am there usually on the weekends.
Zubair


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Zubair Khan

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Jul 22, 2017, 5:35:18 PM7/22/17