Discontinuing Avare

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Avare Users

As AvareX overtakes Avare in features, there is little need to keep Avare on Play Store.

Avare will be replaced by AvareX on Play store this year. 

If there is an Avare feature missing in AvareX please indicate. 

There will be a learning curve since apps are different. You should start using AvareX now for a smooth transition.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

[Curtis Miller]

Truly disappointed to hear that!!! I have been using Avare for years and have no need to change... It has been working fine for me... I didn't need any new features and was totally satisfied where it was at!!! What a disappointment:(

Curtis 

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR_zdQ3MbnCChM5vmQrKQerTe3D-mTKdaNJ006PQv2MR1w%40mail.gmail.com.

[Linn Walters]

I too have used Avare for years and have moved on.  It has only had a couple upgrades since AvareX came out.  Why don't you download a copy of Avare, store it somewhere, and "side load" it when you need it?  Someone else will have to explain in detail how to do that.

[Apps4av Support]

Avare will be maintained on GitHub. The binary will be released for side load there. People who can build code can also do that themselves.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/0e0a513c-e826-4c06-8f16-54be3acfa26dn%40googlegroups.com.

[Dean Yaworowski]

I found the plan screen on Avare much more intuitive and user-friendly compared to AvareX. Being able to add waypoints one-by-one allowed for greater flexibility instead of building the entire plan all at once and then having to add additional waypoints from the map or starting all over entirely. Being able to push an approach procedure to the end of the plan is a feature that is sorely missed as well.

[Andrew Sarangan]

I find the Avare screen more responsive than AvareX. I keep getting these grey checkerboards on the screen on AvareX (see image).  

The GPS update rate also seems slower on AvareX as compared to Avare. I've had situations where my position had not updated for 15 or more seconds. When flying very close to airspace boundaries, this becomes an important issue. I have not done a side-by-side comparison, but I suspect this is coming from my phone not having enough computing power for AvareX. 

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/9b3d1f8c-1600-4447-a734-8cea101bbd97n%40googlegroups.com.

[Connor Sindt]

Andrew, I believe those grey checkers are cloud ceilings. Check the layers tab and move the "Ceiling" slider to change its opacity.

[Apps4av Support]

Avare is much faster for it gives away looks for speed. 

You need to turn off layers you don't need. Black boxes are ceiling layer. Turn it off and other unneeded layers for speed.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CAMtwq8-7ZCBxjkx5RLO_dyH_LCKrtmYBpiakzQSMTf9v%2BCgmyA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Andrew Sarangan]

Wow, thank you! This has been bugging me for a while. Now it makes sense!

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/d702351c-caff-4c71-9185-8143fd92efb7n%40googlegroups.com.

[Chuck Rosenfeld]

I am also disappointed that Avare will not be continued on PlayStore.  Avare X has been disappointing, despite some very nice new features.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CAMtwq882QHQ3LY%3DGu9XER1Qn7p0nrC7%3Dd-v%2BqAQukUQip_bqYA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Chuck

What's disappointing.? Without much information I see it as lack of effort on users part to learn the new interface. 

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CAEdfJyeveaXNAw-4CMxfeT_%2B__uVYK24gM4vN5P5L1cAMYkfnA%40mail.gmail.com.

[John Bouyea]

Typical answer. "Lack of effort to learn the new interface." Sheesh. After over 30 years managing software development with a focus on customer usability, the entire process is backwards. 

Users get the software that coders want to build, not what (at least some) customers want to own & use.

I get it, sometimes a new UI "just looks cool" and it definitely adds new features. And some guys want to trade in their 2024 Camry for a 2026 Tesla. The reality is there are a lot of 2024 Camrys still running around. And there still be be until the DB updates go away.

I do have Samsung's latest Android phone. But the platform where I actually run Avare in the airplane is a 2018 Asus ZenPad on Android 6. Works Great. Why change? Why buy new hardware when everything is fully functional? Those are the kinds of demands Apple & M$ make upon their users.

You want some specific information, okay, all aviation apps come secondary to flying the dang airplane. Relearning an app that (to the user) require a complete change in operation is actually hazardous to flight. If Garmin just decided to reorient how the screens appear, pilots would be lost, FAA would require recertification and I expect sales to extend equipment into a panel would plummet.

If you read it this far, thank you. I suggest leaving Avare v11 available on PlayStore in "Fully Mature" mode with no further development. At least until some future impacts of source database changes from the governmental agencies make it unsupportable.

[Lynn Alley]

I'm really liking AvareX, and I am almost 100% weaned off of Avare after using it for years.  It does take a little effort to switch because the human interface design is different, but I am convinced that it is more than worth the effort.

There is one thing on Avare that I miss.  It had a feature to select the GPS position source.  In one of my airplanes, the internal GPS is more reliable than the GPS in my external Stratux box.  In AvareX, I have no way of telling the system I prefer the internal GPS.  Would it be possible to allow the user to click on the Internal/External tile at the top of the screen to switch back to the internal GPS?  Or maybe something completely automatic would be possible, to rapidly switch back to the internal GPS should the external one experience a dropout?

Thanks again for all the good work.

Lynn Alley

[Andreas Grothues]

I am a new user, and have been thinking about adding my 2 cents. The last post impels me to do that sooner than later.

After reading previous posts on this thread, I decided to download AvareX with the intention to put in "the effort to learn the new interface." I have every great respect and gratitude for those that have been working diligently to make AvareX a great tool, and I have no desire to throw stones. However, objectively speaking, after considerable "effort to learn the new interface", I found it (particularly the 'plan' function) to be maddeningly frustrating.

I too write code (at major defense contractors), so I fully understand that we coders can become so familiar with the code that we lose track of how a user sees the results of our efforts. So my only put here is to please take the users comments seriously, even if they are not always phrased in the most charitable manner. Speaking for myself, I think AvareX can be a great tool, and I see some awesome features (love the checklist). But for the present, the old Avare is what I'll take flying.

Thanks for the effort!

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Lynn

Next release 89 will have ability to select gps source. Check the Help menu on how to do it. Help is under Menu.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/0d5036b0-dae6-4fd1-ab94-6605b2fd7b88n%40googlegroups.com.

[David Farleman]

My experience differs (maybe quite a bit) with some of the feedback here.

When AvareX came out and I saw the direction the development team was taking it, I dropped legacy Avare pretty quickly. I've found AvareX pretty intuitive, easy to navigate, and prefer the layout/UI with X. I've seen the development team implement suggestions from users pretty quickly and in a manor that fits with keeping X free of bloat and clutter. Which is great! That said, it's not lost on me that sometimes change can yield critics, as we are all creatures of habit.

-David

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/0b78d095-4742-4ca1-b17d-6a8f2b5d73fbn%40googlegroups.com.

[Andrew Sarangan]

Take my comments with a grain of salt, but for me AvareX (or any EFB) is strictly an inflight tool. A clean moving map with my aircraft position gives me about 75% of what I need. ADS-B traffic and weather make up the other 25%. Beyond a simple direct-to line, I don’t rely on flight-planning features in the cockpit. Serious flight planning is best done at home on a desktop with a full keyboard. Even when flying an instrument approach, I don’t need every waypoint loaded into the flight plan. I can see everything I need on the georeferenced IAP charts (which are outstanding because Foreflight charges extra for this feature). The additional EFB features like terrain alerts, airspace warnings, glide advisor, synthetic PFD, and so on are nice extras, but in 15 years of flying with EFBs (and another 15 years before that with paper charts), I’ve never truly needed them.

If AvareX performs smoothly with those extra features disabled, that’s perfectly fine with me. But if supporting them slows the app down or demands more powerful hardware, that becomes a concern.

Avare/AvareX stands out for two simple reasons: (1) it’s free and open source, and (2) it’s simple, fast, and intuitive. 

Other paid alternatives get bloated with features over time that no one uses. When products rely on subscription models, there’s often pressure to keep adding new and increasingly niche features so customers feel they’re getting “more,” even if few pilots actually use them. 

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR_MaW0q4uoBVDWFHuq-4acY5-gvVbMcHzS64%3D91Oy%3DNQg%40mail.gmail.com.

[Lynn Alley]

> Next release 89 will have ability to select gps source.

Wow, thanks!  Looking forward to it.

Lynn

[Apps4av Support]

There is another path we could take..

Remove all weather, planning, 3d, pfd, etc. from the app and make it extremely lean. I mean Avare.

This will reduce support and server burden.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

[Sir Luck]

Not wanting to step on anyone's toes, but Zubair designed the app to help himself with his instrument rating.  He made it available to the general public (for free) with the understanding that it is not certified for primary flight.   Other volunteers jumped on the platform and assisted with new features when pilots who didn't know how to code wanted them. Because of his big heart and dedication to others, the app was expanded to multiple platforms.  In order to modify it for the transition, Zubair and team found it necessary to stop parallel development of Avare.  

Now they are continuing to modify and support this free app because it is something they enjoy doing.  So yes, if you want to learn how the app works, it is up to you as a user to research the abilities of the app.  There are no customers here, only very lucky pilots who have a strong community of developers dedicated to providing a free service to the general pilot population.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/89db7e23-a736-483b-9915-87e9000e2c34n%40googlegroups.com.

--

Kenny in Florida

[Mike]

How about an "expert mode" where all features are available; and "light" (for new users to start) where only essential items are visible. Maybe even the ability to select which buttons to show on the main screen. A redesign of the lower buttons would be great, so there are not two rows with different unaligned icons.

I personally would only need Map, Plate, Plan and Scribble directly accessible from the main screen.

[Steve Kelly]

Good idea.

[Rich Klarich]

I would love to see proof of this on Youtube.

Third person filming. No TNFlygirl reduxes.

Show a flight with legacy, return leg exact same on X.

Count and time number of heads down cycles editing the same changes.

Count and time presses and typing cycles.  Same turbulence.

I don't see X coming out with less heads downs or keypresses.

Not trying to change minds, you are way past v1.  Just trying to open eyes.

Rich

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 11:56 Apps4av Support <app...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks for the input. 

I still plan to discontinue it. I am a CFI and I use X. I like it better and it has potential to beat FF.

I would love people to go through other apps because they will then come back or not, but I like free choice. I just don't have time for both and I am not abandoning X. 

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 11:51 AM Rich Klarich <rkla...@gmail.com> wrote:

Overtakes?    No.  AvareX solidly is inferior to Avare.

The industry of aviation coding overhead issue is similar to other phone/tablet apps-  legacy apps go sideways when recoded to multiplatform.

Says who?

Part 121 airline pilot, current also in GA IFR, with Jepp FD Pro checkrides.  I could easily fly a check on Avare, not AvareX.

The heads down time on X is excessive.  Reroutes need to be single entry line inputs.

Feature I miss?  Traffic screening alone by altitude blocks kicks it right off my GA RV useage list.  Lack of surety of position loss indication.

The UI is clunky for real world turbulence.

Young/new students, Garmin Suites, Foreflight or Garmin EFB- the flight plans are seamless between the panel and tablets, single tap updates either way/syncs.

 I don't forsee breaking into that with AvareX.

Am I wrong?   

Any devs fly this weekly both dense bumpy VFR and dense IFR?  Would LOVE to see a youtube of it.  Better yet, active CFIs that are also 121 experienced.  Are you able to "sell" AvareX to your students?

I miss the I/O page.  I miss the GPS selection.  I miss the ease of inflight rerouting. I miss choosing traffic by vertical boundaries.  I miss an efficient app I can enjoy on my awesome legacy hardware.

I know when I have not practiced enough versus when I am being handcuffed.

It's not a slam on X.  Avare may not be replicable with even the best of the multiplat's coder skills.

That's a plus to Avare.  It should live to where Notam or weather type changes from the USG can be kept up.

Rich

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR_zdQ3MbnCChM5vmQrKQerTe3D-mTKdaNJ006PQv2MR1w%40mail.gmail.com.

[Apps4av Support]

I don't think the proof will satisfy you. 

Your workflows are best suited for Avare but your workflows are not everyone's workflows.

I designed and implemented the UI for both apps and don't you think I would know especially because I used both from start to finish to this day?

What makes you THE authority on efb apps ? I appreciate the help in indicating what does not work so I can improve it, but I will not give in to a few people who I believe are hating change. 

When was the last time you used X? The features you mention like source of GPS, traffic filtering are already implemented. They were implemented because someone sent a nice message indicating what their use case is. 

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

[Bill Volcko]

I love Avare, I prefer it to AvareX.  It seems simpler and more reliable, less "buggy".   If Avare must go, I would like to see WAC charts brought to AvareX

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Bill

Will add WAC.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/c1e4c29b-8879-40da-9bbe-92521212207en%40googlegroups.com.

[Jeffrey Ross]

Keep in mind, the FAA hasn't updated the WAC charts in over 10 years and as of March 2016 *ALL* WAC charts are expired (See the 15-02 Charting Notice).

Personally unless you have a very specific need for the WAC charts, I wouldn't even bother with them.

Jeff

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR-0C802V1ufA6UH48ZUHxqP8rE-4_MbQB4tpSjvPTeVJg%40mail.gmail.com.

[Rich Klarich]

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 12:22 Apps4av Support <app...@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't think the proof will satisfy you. 

Why?  Logical fallacy.

Your workflows are best suited for Avare but your workflows are not everyone's workflows.

Hence, SHOW me.  I know very well that multiplat coding is a set of handcuffs of its own.

I designed and implemented the UI for both apps and don't you think I would know especially because I used both from start to finish to this day?

Context?  Commercial pilot? IFR current? Instructor? Evaluator? ATP? Military and civilian?  User of what other flight decks and EFBs since they first went up?   Me, I'm a slacker and all of the above.

What makes you THE authority on efb apps ? I appreciate the help in indicating what does not work so I can improve it, but I will not give in to a few people who I believe are hating change. 

Changes happen. Threat is being forced off the original coding.  That comes with the attraction to going multiplatform.  I have betad and alphad this in aviation gaming and saw this path, so I'm not sitting silent.  The other gig was similar, never caught up to the initial app and the outcome lost the flavor that caused its level of success.

When was the last time you used X?

Yesterday, modernest iPad, current Apple store version.

The features you mention like source of GPS, traffic filtering are already implemented. They were implemented because someone sent a nice message indicating what their use case is. 

Great!  Original position stands.  I was taughtto "fight FOR feedback" not to fight it.  What, not who and too old to sweat the, "how".

Rich

[Alton Moore]

I haven't had much to say here, but here are my credentials and opinions.

I've been programming for money since I was 16, which is a long time now.  Been flying since 1991 I guess.  As soon as I could afford to, hah.  CFI, contract pilot, all of that stuff.

AvareX has been implemented with Google Flutter, which I figure is a good platform.  Most programmers can easily see which of the "bugs" come from using Flutter -- and there are understandably a few of those -- and which ones are part of the normal development process.  That development process seems to include a lot of "take it or leave it" responses from the developer(s), and they seem fairly adversarial much of the time, but oh well, I still use Avare and get the emails from this group and try to keep up with the latest news.

I wonder if a somewhat safety-related application such as this one should have the extra programming layer that multi-platform support of this nature introduces.  And some day Flutter will go away, and if history is any indication, AvareX will go away with it, and there will be a new version to learn.  Or not.  Meanwhile, they could have just created Avare natively under IOS, which threatens duplicate code management, but then it would have been a native app, like Avare for Android, which is a good thing from a technical perspective.

These are all larger questions which are all completely up to the developer(s), but I think that most users have a lot more invested in learning their application of choice than they do in the actual hardware.  This is just my opinion, but it's probably supported by many of the comments on this subject in this forum.  Here we're not being given a choice at all, but rather being told to take it or leave it (AvareX).

I run AvareX on a couple of hand-me-down iPhones myself, but I'm still not convinced, mainly because it's not very intuitive and I'm tired of being called a big dummy for thinking that programs should be intuitive.  If/when Avare goes away, I might go to iFly, which is more reasonable than ForeFlight and works fine, and likely won't suffer from such large-scale changes over the long term.  Or maybe some of us can maintain Avare; I don't even know what the status of that is.  Write a replacement?  Golly, I don't have anything to prove, would rather not reinvent the wheel and clone Avare, and would rather see the developers make a reasonable return off of Avare somehow, like any other endeavor.  In the end, I think that most people will use AvareX, and they'll eventually sell out and make a lot of money.

I believe that IOS was the most requested "feature" for Avare, and the developers are following the market in this case.  The redesign of the interface (why?) and dependency upon Flutter are the big questions here, the first because of the considerable reinvestment required of the existing user base and the second because of the possibility that it'll all happen again in a few years.

[Lynn Alley]

I too am a software professional, recently retired, with decades of experience.  I am also an unpaid contributor to an open project, to which I give many hours per month.

I think it is really important to remember that none of us are customers -- just free users of what others are graciously and freely providing.  The developers have the perfect right to do whatever they want, including leaving the rest of us out in the cold at any moment.  That would be devastating to me, because I really really love both products.  And the more I use and practice with AvareX, the better I love it.

I, for one, don't really want to offer much in the way of advice.  Instead, I just want to offer a whole bunch of humble gratitude for the huge amount of highly skilled effort that has been expended to get to this point.  And maybe the occasional little request :-)

Lynn

[Jeffrey Ross]

Andrew,

I agree with you.  Based upon your comments we have been flying roughly the same amount of years and as somebody that learned to fly strictly with paper charts, a thick book of approach plates, a NDB, and no GPS, I tend to use the tablet much the same as I would my old paper charts except I can now see exactly where I am without having to manually figure it out.

My above statements aren't 100% true, weather depiction (nexrad radar) and active/proposed TFR data is very important to me as well.  Traffic and terrain is less important to me as my avionics provide traffic monitoring and collision avoidance, plus I have full eTAWS which is TSO'd (Terrain Awareness and Warning System) for  I would also like to see lightning strike data, but this hasn't been added yet.

Below is what I believe to be a current list of all of the FIS-B weather/data products available today along with their update rates.  

Just a word to the wise, keep in mind the update rates, this is why the Nexrad images aren't good enough to pick your way through thunderstorms, what the images are good for is so that you can see what is trending ahead and roughly how fast it is changing so that you can make an informed decision whether or not it's safe to press on or divert. The NEXRAD images can be 15+ min old by the time they get transmitted over ADS-B.  Some displays that display the NEXRAD images will have a time/date along with the images, that date is when the graphic mosaic was created NOT when the radar image was captured.

Jeff

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CAMtwq8_MLZ2QJu6%2ByHNaKqwEseN3gn5OkqKZknkiygCj2crJhQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[Apps4av Support]

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 1:00 PM Rich Klarich <rkla...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 12:22 Apps4av Support <app...@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't think the proof will satisfy you. 

Why?  Logical fallacy.

Your workflows are best suited for Avare but your workflows are not everyone's workflows.

Hence, SHOW me.  I know very well that multiplat coding is a set of handcuffs of its own.

Why would I show you ? Makes no sense. I don't work for you. In fact if you have a problem, you show me and if you have a point I will look into it. 

I designed and implemented the UI for both apps and don't you think I would know especially because I used both from start to finish to this day?

Context?  Commercial pilot? IFR current? Instructor? Evaluator? ATP? Military and civilian?  User of what other flight decks and EFBs since they first went up?   Me, I'm a slacker and all of the above.

How many are there with same credentials in US? 10000? That does not make you an authority of EFBs. You do have a perspective which I appreciate and value. But there are 10000 more and an app is not about you. It's about everyone.

What makes you THE authority on efb apps ? I appreciate the help in indicating what does not work so I can improve it, but I will not give in to a few people who I believe are hating change. 

Changes happen. Threat is being forced off the original coding.  That comes with the attraction to going multiplatform.  I have betad and alphad this in aviation gaming and saw this path, so I'm not sitting silent.  The other gig was similar, never caught up to the initial app and the outcome lost the flavor that caused its level of success.

Well I enjoy trying different things. That's how progress is made. Thanks for your concern.

When was the last time you used X?

Yesterday, modernest iPad, current Apple store version.

The features you mention like source of GPS, traffic filtering are already implemented. They were implemented because someone sent a nice message indicating what their use case is. 

Great!  Original position stands.  I was taughtto "fight FOR feedback" not to fight it.  What, not who and too old to sweat the, "how".

As I said I appreciate your feedback. But I also don't think that that is convincing enough yet to make me change my mind. 

Zubair

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Alton

Inline 

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

On Tue, Mar 3, 2026, 1:40 PM Alton Moore <aomo...@gmail.com> wrote:

I haven't had much to say here, but here are my credentials and opinions.

I've been programming for money since I was 16, which is a long time now.  Been flying since 1991 I guess.  As soon as I could afford to, hah.  CFI, contract pilot, all of that stuff.

AvareX has been implemented with Google Flutter, which I figure is a good platform.  Most programmers can easily see which of the "bugs" come from using Flutter -- and there are understandably a few of those -- and which ones are part of the normal development process.  That development process seems to include a lot of "take it or leave it" responses from the developer(s), and they seem fairly adversarial much of the time, but oh well, I still use Avare and get the emails from this group and try to keep up with the latest news.

Avare makes no money. That's fine. I did not intend to make money off of it. People complained about it's user interface all the time. And this or that didn't work for them. I took all that feedback and made a new system that you were asking for and it came out to be AvareX. Now I don't have time for maintaining two apps. So one of them needs to go.

I wonder if a somewhat safety-related application such as this one should have the extra programming layer that multi-platform support of this nature introduces.  And some day Flutter will go away, and if history is any indication, AvareX will go away with it, and there will be a new version to learn.  Or not.  Meanwhile, they could have just created Avare natively under IOS, which threatens duplicate code management, but then it would have been a native app, like Avare for Android, which is a good thing from a technical perspective.

Avare is implemented in Java and Google can pull plug on Java anytime in favor of Kotlin much quicker than Flutter. Java is not free. Flutter is open source and has a big user base. But yeah you cannot predict what will go obsolete when. That's the fun of SW.

These are all larger questions which are all completely up to the developer(s), but I think that most users have a lot more invested in learning their application of choice than they do in the actual hardware.  This is just my opinion, but it's probably supported by many of the comments on this subject in this forum.  Here we're not being given a choice at all, but rather being told to take it or leave it (AvareX).

Absolutely. People have the choice of improving AvareX. Keeping Avare is less of an option now. It will live on GitHub for side loading. 

I run AvareX on a couple of hand-me-down iPhones myself, but I'm still not convinced, mainly because it's not very intuitive and I'm tired of being called a big dummy for thinking that programs should be intuitive.

I can dig out emails and tonnes of them which mention that Avare was hard to follow. UI is very subjective and especially in an airplane where moments matter in challenging situations. It's much harder to shift from one EFB to another.

  If/when Avare goes away, I might go to iFly, which is more reasonable than ForeFlight and works fine, and likely won't suffer from such large-scale changes over the long term.  Or maybe some of us can maintain Avare; I don't even know what the status of that is.  Write a replacement?  Golly, I don't have anything to prove, would rather not reinvent the wheel and clone Avare, and would rather see the developers make a reasonable return off of Avare somehow, like any other endeavor.  In the end, I think that most people will use AvareX, and they'll eventually sell out and make a lot of money.

I have always said that if you want to move on to another one, do it. But it won't be easier than moving to AvareX. I guess then you won't have a threat again but who knows maybe that EFB will also change their UI.

I believe that IOS was the most requested "feature" for Avare, and the developers are following the market in this case.  The redesign of the interface (why?) and dependency upon Flutter are the big questions here, the first because of the considerable reinvestment required of the existing user base and the second because of the possibility that it'll all happen again in a few years.

The most requested feature was never iOS. It was always request for a more modern UI.

Good to hear different perspectives.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/2af06b72-3d11-4f51-a975-6aa042dddb08n%40googlegroups.com.

[Dean Gibson ATP/CFI]

I've stayed out of this discussion until now, because I don't currently use Avare or AvareX.  I have tried both in the recent past.  I preferred Avare.

However, I do want to comment on the LARGE amount of entitlement & laziness that I see from SOME forum participants.  I'm going to comment on this from both a developer perspective (45+ years as an employed software developer), & 50+ years as a CFI (4000+ PIC hours, with more than 50% of that as a CFI), including two stints as as the FAA-designated Chief Flight Instructor for two Part 141 flight schools.

The best example of entitlement & laziness, is the "AUTOMATICALLY switching to the airport diagram after landing" feature.  GPS signals are not perfect, & neither is software.  To have software think that you are on the ground & switch to the Airport Diagram, when you are executing a missed approach & need the approach plate in front of you, is a SERIOUS ERROR.  It doesn't matter how small the probability is, it can happen.  And what are the consequences of coming to a full stop off the runway after landing, & (heaven help us) having to push a button to switch to the Airport Diagram?  Ridiculous!

I think the last time I brought up this subject, I gave examples of real-life consequences of such attitudes in some pilots I knew.  I won't burden you all with those again.  Suffice it to say that those attitudes are visible here in this discussion.

-- Dean

[Apps4av Support]

Hi Dean. 

I am also not a fan of auto switch but many many people like it. Maybe I can let people turn it off but that will take real estate in plate screen.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/35e7ee88-bd24-4b1f-9a6e-3bf401dd7f81%40mailpen.com.

[John Bouyea]

I hope the outcome of this conversation serves to inform us all about the past and future of Avare & AvareX. I DO appreciate the Avare product, I have been a supporter and an active user in the last 4 airplanes I've owned and flown. Avare has made maintaining current charts and data in the cockpit a no-brainer. As I posted on my PlayStore endorsement of the Avare product, the handwriting was on the wall when ForeFlight appeared on iPad and our business model failed for our proprietary software and hardware (running on M$ tablet platforms with homebrew display hardware upgrades & SSD installations) sales & follow-on chart & data subscriptions (our real bread & butter income.) As the database engineer for both those companies (MentorPlus & FlightPrep) & responsible for product mastering, duplication and distribution to our customers, I fully appreciate the effort required to provide timely updates to maintain data currency. 
I hope that as long as it is possible for Avare & AvareX to share the same data update file formats, both products can continue to coexist.
Again, I’ll respectfully request that Avare V11.x would/ could continue to operate in a "fully mature" mode IE no further development or code maintenance, fully encouraging the developer to focus on where they want to take the new product.
I guess it’s time to make another donation… Ok, that’s done. Thank you.

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/apps4av-forum/bnrhlyIQvf8/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR9mQ79rE3RHRrxLkEOD4X%2BukmV5Z-E%2BJYrAoEFjvRBUag%40mail.gmail.com.

--

John Bouyea

503.341.9628

johnb...@gmail.com

[Mark Napier]

One feature is the ability to output NMEA wirelessly to a serial dongle.  

On Sun, Mar 1, 2026 at 7:58 AM Apps4av Support <app...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Avare Users

As AvareX overtakes Avare in features, there is little need to keep Avare on Play Store.

Avare will be replaced by AvareX on Play store this year. 

If there is an Avare feature missing in AvareX please indicate. 

There will be a learning curve since apps are different. You should start using AvareX now for a smooth transition.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Apps4Av Forum" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to apps4av-foru...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/CADA_tR_zdQ3MbnCChM5vmQrKQerTe3D-mTKdaNJ006PQv2MR1w%40mail.gmail.com.

[Sean Roe]

I have used Avare and AvareX for a while.  I have two suggestions. 

1) can we have ability to reposition the pfd display and maybe be able resize it?  maybe make so we can split screen it with the map screen centered in its own pane? 

2) in the flight planning screen can we have the additional ability to plug in/search for waypoints like Avare has?  Maybe just a couple of lines at the top of the screen where we can input a known point manually?

Thanks,

Sean  

[Apps4av Support]

I have added long press to add a waypoint in the plan after the line long oressed. Use +Plan button. This is a complicated sequence though but keeps the clutter away.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/46527a02-cc65-4ad3-9197-84995e46ef31n%40googlegroups.com.

[Andy]

I started off with Avare and liked it a lot, used it for many years but when AvareX came along I immediately made the switch so I could use in on both my Android Table and my iPhone.

The manual on Github is excellent, everyone should be looking there first. https://github.com/apps4av/avarex/blob/master/USER_MANUAL.md

Last point is that it's not perfect nor exactly how I'd like it to be (hate that the aircraft is right smack in the middle of the screen) but I can live with it.

Big thank you to everyone that has worked so hard on it.

-Andy

[Apps4av Support]

The manual is built into the app under Help menu.

Regards,

Apps For Aviators Support,

We encourage users to use the Forum for all questions. Any updates to the forum will help other users, who might have similar questions.
Forum: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/apps4av-forum

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/b9cf9973-5911-4daf-94bc-9210acb10404n%40googlegroups.com.

[Robert Ohrenberg]

Love the manual. Thank you!  New interface looks real nice too. 

[Roger R]

When will Avare legacy cease to be maintained/current?

It more than meets my needs AS IS for my day only/vfr only/steam gauge/fun flyer (but fast mover) acft. For me there is absolutely no need to go to AvareX. Avare is easy to learn/use and fast. And of course, after checking I see that my tablet's android OS will not be capable of running X. The tablet works fine for Avare, is dedicated to Avare only, and stays in the cockpit. 

In reading thru the comments, I see that it is mentioned Avare will be maintained on 'GitHub' and can be 'sideloaded'....I have no idea what that means. Does it mean that the last version before discontinuing it will be avbl for downloading/using in its then current form? If it will be avbl in its last version and can be updated with new cycles, data base, wx products, TFRs and StratuX adsb, that would be great. 

[Brad Walker]

I understand all the dynamics about why AvareX was created. And the motivation for no longer "supporting" Avare.

I'm currently improving and/or supporting Avare as moving to AvareX is not really an option for me.

https://github.com/BradWalker/avare

-brad w.

[Brad Walker]

I would think so.

F-Droid is a very viable alternative!

-brad w.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/apps4av-forum/a9eaae9c-95b3-48b9-b9d9-b904ec2e5124n%40googlegroups.com.

[Andreas Grothues]

Hello Brad

Thanks for doing this. Just for clarification, I understand that you will not keeping this on google playstore, Also I haven't found an apk file in your branch, so I assume we need to generate that ourselves?

i've done quite a bit of coding on Linux and Windows, but nothing on Android. I just spent all of 5 minutes learning what I could, and discovered that I most likely need to install android studio If I wanted to generate the apk file or even make some mods for myself. Does your folder contain a project file? Also, are there any particularities we need to know with respect to the environment to avoid going off in the wrong direction?

Thanks!

Andreas