"android os since 5.0 does not allow apps to store data on SD cards"

[Nelson Hochberg]

I got this message on my Samsung Galaxy Tab S running Android 6.0.1: "android os since 5.0 does not allow apps to store data on SD cards".

The internal storage on the device is not large enough to store all the charts I need. Is there a way around this problem?

Thanks

[Jeffrey Ross]

Yes you can specify the SD card, it is not very intuitive.

First I would suggest you delete all your currently downloaded charts, plates etc as they are stored in a location that I don't think you'll be able to access to remove afterwards, simply go to the download page and delete all of them.

Next what I did was create a folder using your favorite File Manager go to the directory called /storage/xxxx-xxxx     Note the directory name of xxxx-xxxx will be a number that is unique your tablet as this IS the SD card.  From this directory you should find a directory called Android (create it if it is not there) and then a directory called data, again create it if it isn't there.  Finally create a directory called com.ds.avare

Next start up Avare and go to the preferences screen and then "storage and downloads" and choose Charts Storage Folder, from here you need to navigate to: /storage/xxxx-xxxx/Android/data/com.ds.avare and choose ok. 

Lastly download your desired charts, plates etc.

Jeff

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[Nelson Hochberg]

Jeffrey,

Thanks for your reply.

I followed your instructions, yet the files still loaded into the internal storage. After deleting all Avare files internal storage shows 13.94 GB used of 16.00 GB and SD Card shows 1.16 MB used of 29.81 GB.  After following your instructions, internal storage shows 14.19 GB used and SD card shows 1.16 used.

I created a folder in sdcard/Android/data/com.ds.avare. I tried both of these as the Avare carts storage folder: sdcard/Android/data/com.ds.avare and /storage/emulated/0/Android/data/com.ds.avare

Neither worked and the files saved to the internal storage.

On Tuesday, September 3, 2019 at 6:24:55 PM UTC-7, Jeffrey Ross wrote:

Yes you can specify the SD card, it is not very intuitive.

First I would suggest you delete all your currently downloaded charts, plates etc as they are stored in a location that I don't think you'll be able to access to remove afterwards, simply go to the download page and delete all of them.

Next what I did was create a folder using your favorite File Manager go to the directory called /storage/xxxx-xxxx     Note the directory name of xxxx-xxxx will be a number that is unique your tablet as this IS the SD card.  From this directory you should find a directory called Android (create it if it is not there) and then a directory called data, again create it if it isn't there.  Finally create a directory called com.ds.avare

Next start up Avare and go to the preferences screen and then "storage and downloads" and choose Charts Storage Folder, from here you need to navigate to: /storage/xxxx-xxxx/Android/data/com.ds.avare and choose ok. 

Lastly download your desired charts, plates etc.

Jeff

On 9/3/19 8:30 PM, Nelson Hochberg wrote:

I got this message on my Samsung Galaxy Tab S running Android 6.0.1: "android os since 5.0 does not allow apps to store data on SD cards".

The internal storage on the device is not large enough to store all the charts I need. Is there a way around this problem?

Thanks

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[Jeffrey Ross]

Nelson, you chose the"emulated" SD card, go figure why that exists.

You need to look for a directory that is 4 digits dash 4 digits, the directory name will be unique to your device.

See both attachments, this is on my Samsung Galaxy S8 phone, yours should be similar.

Jeff

Jeff

[Nelson Hochberg]

I have no directory that is 4 digits dash 4 digits.  I have "Device Storage" and "SD card".

On Tuesday, September 3, 2019 at 6:24:55 PM UTC-7, Jeffrey Ross wrote:

Yes you can specify the SD card, it is not very intuitive.

First I would suggest you delete all your currently downloaded charts, plates etc as they are stored in a location that I don't think you'll be able to access to remove afterwards, simply go to the download page and delete all of them.

Next what I did was create a folder using your favorite File Manager go to the directory called /storage/xxxx-xxxx     Note the directory name of xxxx-xxxx will be a number that is unique your tablet as this IS the SD card.  From this directory you should find a directory called Android (create it if it is not there) and then a directory called data, again create it if it isn't there.  Finally create a directory called com.ds.avare

Next start up Avare and go to the preferences screen and then "storage and downloads" and choose Charts Storage Folder, from here you need to navigate to: /storage/xxxx-xxxx/Android/data/com.ds.avare and choose ok. 

Lastly download your desired charts, plates etc.

Jeff

On 9/3/19 8:30 PM, Nelson Hochberg wrote:

I got this message on my Samsung Galaxy Tab S running Android 6.0.1: "android os since 5.0 does not allow apps to store data on SD cards".

The internal storage on the device is not large enough to store all the charts I need. Is there a way around this problem?

Thanks

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[t v]

Hi Nelson.

You may not have the exact path that Jeff mentioned, it depends on the device / OS version you have, post your deice / OS info here, but the basic steps are the same.

Delete all your existing downloads that you now have in Avare>Downloads, one by one, then,

1-What you need / want is the SD Card.

2-You cannot install from within the File manager, except to create directory called Android, Data, com.ds.avare files, the rest you have to do it within Avare, in Preferences>Storage and downloads>Charts and storage folder and Navigate with the UP back arrow button all the way to "/" forward slash, then down to Storage>extSdCard>Android>Data>com.ds.avare and select OK.

Go back to Avare main screen, with Back arrow, and in Preferences>Download and redownload the charts. After this you should be able to see the charts in the File manager>SDcard....   TV

[Chip Davis]

I think the fundamental problem is the tool you are using to look at storage.  You need a file management tool which will show you the _actual_ file structure (not just what Android wants you to see) and can create the necessary directories on it.  I use "Cx File Explorer" which is smart enough to see past Android's subterfuge and let you get around its "protection".

Each SD card is given a unique identifier in the form of "nnnn-nnnn".  The one in my S5 happens to be "3364-6130".  "Cx File Explorer" knows that Android uses that id as a directory name and shows you the contents of the actual SD card, not the internal directory 'emulated' that Android wants you to use, thinking it's the SD card.

When you open "Cx File Explorer" there are six icons to select from: "Main storage", "SD card", "System", "Downloads", "Apps", and "Recycle Bin".  If you tap "SD card" it will show you the contents of the _real_ SD card, not the "emulated" one.  Odds are, you already have and "Android" directory.  If not, tap the "three-dot" icon on the upper right and select "New" then "Folder".

At this point you will get a pop-up screen explaining how to verify that you really, really want to update the real SD card.  Make the three suggested taps on the next screen, and you're good to go.  Enter the name of the directory ("Android" in this case) and then do the same for the "data" and "com.ds.avare" directories.  If you've already got "Android" and "data" directories, you'll see that it has other "com.this.and.that" directories so all you have to do is create a new "com.ds.avare" directory.  Somehow "Cx File Explorer" knows to put a small Avare logo on the folder icon.

Close "Cx File Explorer" and open "Avare", tap "Map" then "Menu", "Preferences", "Storage and Downloads", "Charts Storage Folder", then "Up" as many times as it takes for the red directory path to back down to just '/'.  Then find and tap "storage", your magic "nnnn-nnnn" SD card id, "Android", "data", and finally "com.ds.avare", and hit "OK".

Now go back to "Menu", and "Download".  It should automatically download the Databases.  Once it has finished, open "Cx File Explorer" again and verify that the "SDcard/Android/data/com.ds.avare/" directory has eight files and a "tiles" directory.

You should be good to download whatever charts and supplements you need and they will all be stored on your SD card.

HTH,

-Chip-

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[John W SBA]

> You need a file management tool which will show you the _actual_ file

I've used the open source OI File Manager for that, but don't use it
much anymore since Avare has the capability built in. For anyone who's
unclear about the process, here's how accessing the phone's physical SD
(similar process for an external SD in the USB port) looks on my S7
running Android 8.0 on Avare 8.1.0:

1. In Avare, navigate to the Charts Storage Folder:
Map->Menu->Preferences->Storage and Downloads->Charts Storage Folder
See SD1 screencap (downsized) attached. Tap the "Up" button
(circled in blue), until the red line above it shows only the "/"
character (in my blue circle in SD2 screencap).

2. The "/" character indicates the "Root" directory (aka folder) as I
noted in blue on the SD2 screencap. Scroll down the list of green
folder names as indicated by my blue arrow, until you see the "storage"
folder as circled in blue. Tap the "storage" name.

3. Your physical SD card will probably be at the top of the list, as
mine is (circled blue in SD3 screencap). Note that it's two 4-digit
"hexadecimal" numbers separated by a dash. Hexadecimal numbers include
numbers zero through 9 and letters A through F. You're unlikely to have
other such options in this list, but you could scroll down to check.

4. Tap the line identifying the specific physical SD in your own Android
device (could be all numbers 0-9 or all letters A-F or any combination).
Tap OK and you're done.

In theory (and my experience) this works quite well. That said, I'll
add that I've stopped using it. I found it easier and more reliable to
move other stuff onto the SD and generally keep lots of free space on
any device used for Avare (all eight of mine). One reason being that
Google seems to enjoy forcing Android users to take advantage of their
free cloud services, so they seem to have sabotaged devices that provide
SD and USB storage capability. In terms of Avare, some years ago every
Android update seemed to mess up SD charts in Avare so I gave up on it.
Quite possibly this is no longer the case, since many Avare users seem
content with SD charts. Regardless, it's easy enough to simply
re-select your physical SD in Avare should it stop working.

[Chip Davis]

Interesting, John.  I knew that none of the three big buttons on the
Charts Storage Folder page would use the actual SD card, but I didn't
know that Avare would _create_ the './Android/data/com.ds.avare'
directory structure on a brand new SD card.  That's what (I thought) I
needed a file manager app to be able to do.

I guess the take-home lesson from this long and perennial discussion
is that the in-app Help needs a little enhancement.  Is it, by any
chance, in a format that a volunteer could update and submit for
approval by the dev team?

-Chip-

[John W SBA]

> Interesting, John. ... Avare would _create_ the './Android

Interesting, Chip: I didn't know Avare could NOT still create the
directory on my S7. I can no longer modify the SD with my version of OI
File Manager either. It seems Google has disabled it again. As I
wrote, this is the reason I gave up on using the SD for charts. :)

> That's what (I thought) I needed a file manager app to be able to do.

You seem to be correct, at least on my old Android 8 phone. That still
leaves open the question for me, of whether your (or any) file manager
can set SD directory permissions on an un-rooted device so that Avare
can access the SD. Maybe an expert on past, current and evolving
Android file/directory permissions could tell us if there's a reliable
way to give Avare access to our SD cards without rooting.

As I reported, I've had it working on several older devices and Android
/ Avare versions. Each update from Android (possibly including Google's
"Android System Webview") or Samsung seemed to change whether and how it
worked. Much as the hacking was fun, at some point the bumper sticker
slogan took precedence: "I'd Rather Be Flying."

> in-app Help needs a little enhancement.

Agreed. Our generous Dev Team and documentarians are all volunteers,
and we have enough generous donations to cover the out of pocket
expenses. Our initial motto was "Contribute what you want, when you
want." I think it's still pretty much the same, since everyone seems to
have busy lives.

> in a format that a volunteer could update and submit for approval

Yes, and the way I've done it sometimes was to notice a need or randomly
rummage through the in-app Help, and post a suggested change here in the
Forum. If you want to take it on more formally, this would be a good
place to post an offer to join the Dev Team in that (or any) capacity.
Keep in mind that it's not a one-time job. The app, Android, and
devices are sporadically changing.

[John W SBA]

I'm holed up inside on an uncharacteristically hot SB day, and took a
moment to explore SD issues further. Surprisingly for me, there does
*seem* to currently be an easy way of putting charts on the SD in my
antique S7 phone running Android 8.0 and an outdated version of the
Samsung My Files app.

First I googled to see if there's anything new about SD access in
Android and found this official page:
https://support.google.com/android/answer/6088895?hl=en
Since I use the SD to move files between devices, mine's set to what
they call "Portable storage." I didn't format the SD to test their
"Internal storage" option but maybe that could have advantages in the
face of future Android changes? Since the web page mentions "Android
6.0 and up" perhaps it's settled and will stay this way?

Anyway, here's what I did:
1. Swap in an extra SD card I use on a computer. Launch the My Files
app, go to its Settings (top-right pulldown), turn on "Show hidden
files" (may not be needed, but I like to see what's going on), Back key
to see main My Files menu.

2. Tap the SD card line, check to confirm that I'm actually seeing the
same files & directories as shown in the manual OI File Manager process
described previously (rather than the "emulated" contents that aren't
actually on the SD).

3. Tap "Android" (file structure was already there so I didn't need to
create it), then "data" and then (because avare's folder wasn't already
there) the top-right pulldown, and "Create folder" on that menu, type in
"com.ds.avare" (no Caps or spaces), tap "CREATE" and confirm that the
folder now shows in the list.

I didn't test whether Avare would automatically create the whole
Android/... directory structure without doing it manually. Does anyone
know if it definitely do that?

4. Launch the Avare app and set it to that newly created "folder" (aka
directory), exit back to the Map screen and load the Databases file as
prompted. Avare then looked normal, given that I'd not loaded any charts.

I then checked in OI File Manager and Avare's file structure and
Databases files are there. Next I checked with the My Files app, and
though the physical SD address isn't accessible it did show the "SD
card" contents as apparently the physical card and when I ejected the
card it correctly reflected that fact. Maybe in the years since I last
tried this, Google has worked with OEMs to provide a way for users to
reliably access their SDs?

[John W SBA]

Here's a more detailed description of the changes introduced with
Android 6.0, that to me begs the question of if/when Avare might move to
that minimum OS.
https://www.howtogeek.com/242937/how-to-set-up-a-new-sd-card-in-android-for-extra-storage/

[Nelson Hochberg]

John,

I tried following your steps: creating a folder at /sdcard/Android/data/com.ds.avare; then setting Avare to use that folder but it still uses the internal /data/user/0/com.ds.avare/files folder.

[Jeffrey Ross]

Nelson,

The SD card will have a folder name something like "4A31-B87C" and what you are seeing is a some sort of emulated SD card, I don't know why Android (Samsung?) does that but they do.  What you need to do is locate the actual SD card and create a directory there.  For example on my phone a Samsung Galaxy S8 the chart storage folder I'm using is /storage/6FDB-6137/Android/data/com.ds.avare and I created the directories "Android/data/com.ds.avare".

One thing to keep in mind the SD card filesystem has several reserved file names that come from the old MS-DOS days and I believe there are instrument approach plates for two states that you will not be able to load to the SD card, they are New Hampshire due to CON and Alabama due to CMD, I do not think there are any other airports with issues.  There were a few discussions about these airports and SD cards in the past.

Jeff