Avare does not recognize external mini-USB gps receiver

[n31...@gmail.com]

Greetings
I was given an Android NeuTab 7" tablet, and installed Avare - all appears to be doing well; except the tablet does not have an internal GPS nor Bluetooth.  So, I purchased a GlobalSat ND-105C external GPS receiver that plugs into the tablet using the mini-USB port.  I downloaded the recommended drivers and app from GlobalSat, which show the "PL2303GPS" is started and connected (and the red light on the GPS receiver is ON too).  I started Avare and it says that there is No GPS Signal.  So, I downloaded the Avare External I/O app, and on the upper left pull down menu it says Bluetooth, etc.  I select USB in, and then I get "no USB serial device available".  So, how in the heck do I get Avare to see and use the GPS signal from the GPS receiver?
Thanks
/Frustrated        

[Zubair Khan]

Hello!

Would have been better if you asked here before buying your GPS receiver. The USB stack in the IO module supports only certain serial devices and compatibility on USB is a big issue. There is nothing we can do because we have never tested nor we have this GPS available. Your best bet is to figure out how this GPS will send out GPS signals to Android so all apps can use it. Once other apps like Google mapscan use it, it will work with Avare without a need for IO module.
Zubair

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[fly...@yahoo.com]

Hi n31.
Are you able to get the GPS to work with any other apps like OsmAnd, other maps, GPS tests, etc.? If Yes you may have a chance, see which app will work and let us know. TV

[cl...@eugeneweb.com]

On Wednesday, February 25, 2015 at 2:47:47 PM UTC-8, n31...@gmail.com wrote:

Hi Guys,

I have the exact same problem. :-) Someone gave me an Asus tf101, got Avare installed etc...

Like others I would like to mount my tablet conveniently on the panel or yoke, but use another GPS placed at the bottom edge of the windscreen where reception is better, as discussed here: http://avare.ch/addon_en.htm

"This enables pilots to conveniently place their primary Avare device(s) for optimal viewing and operation in flight, and place a secondary Android device with built in receiver in the optimal location for satellite reception (for example, beneath the windshield with an unobstructed view of the sky)."

I have two USB GPS mice based on the Prolific chipset. They both show up as /dev/ttyUSB0, and run at 4800 baud. Very common, no? They work fine on Linux using gpsd. Though I can't get Avare external IO to see them. The error I get is "No USB serial device available", but when I use the terminal I see:

ll /dev/*US*                                                   
crw-rw-rw- radio    system   188,   0 2015-10-27 13:16 ttyUSB0

I also tried chmoding it to 666 and even 777, but no go.
There is another Android app called "You are here GPS" that can see them, so I'm not sure what the problem is. Perhaps if you are not already checking for /dev/ttyUSB0 you could add a field for the file name.

I did read below that if you can get android to use the external GPS, so will Avare, though I'm not sure how to turn off the internal one or even know which one it's using. I wouldn't want to go to the trouble of connecting the external one just to have it ignored. Just curious, is this a hard fix?

Here is some lightly edited log file output and the corresponding NEMA sentences for each device as seen by Linux:

Mag mount GPS mouse:
Vendor=067b, Product=2303 (PL2303 Serial Port)
Mfr=1, Product=2, SerialNumber=0
Product: USB-Serial Controller D
Manufacturer: Prolific Technology Inc.
pl2303 converter detected
pl2303 converter now attached to ttyUSB0

$GPGGA,193721.000,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,1,07,1.3,124.1,M,-21.4,M,,0000*67
$GPGSA,A,3,29,18,20,21,16,26,13,,,,,,2.3,1.3,2.0*31                         
$GPRMC,193721.000,A,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,0.00,62.63,271015,,,A*4D       
$GPGGA,193722.000,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,1,07,1.3,124.1,M,-21.4,M,,0000*64
$GPGSA,A,3,29,18,20,21,16,26,13,,,,,,2.3,1.3,2.0*31                         
$GPGSV,3,1,11,20,69,076,32,29,62,130,36,21,62,289,39,18,40,209,30*75
$GPGSV,3,2,11,26,37,279,38,15,28,121,,16,26,311,36,13,23,082,23*7E
$GPGSV,3,3,11,05,19,047,,25,09,186,,22,02,219,*4E          
$GPRMC,193722.000,A,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,0.00,62.63,271015,,,A*4E
$GPGGA,193723.000,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,1,07,1.3,124.1,M,-21.4,M,,0000*65
$GPGSA,A,3,29,18,20,21,16,26,13,,,,,,2.3,1.3,2.0*31        
$GPRMC,193723.000,A,4402.2272,N,12307.8456,W,0.00,62.63,271015,,,A*4F
...

Microsoft GPS mouse:
Vendor=067b, Product=aaa0 (Prolific Pharos)
Mfr=1, Product=2, SerialNumber=3
Product: USB-Serial Controller
Manufacturer: Prolific Technology Inc.
SerialNumber: 12345678
pl2303 converter detected
pl2303 converter now attached to ttyUSB0

$GPRMC,194057.338,A,4402.1850,N,12307.8485,W,0.000000,,271015,,*01          
$GPGGA,194058.338,4402.1853,N,12307.8486,W,1,03,12.0,0.0,M,-21.4,M,0.0,0000*7B
$GPGLL,4402.1853,N,12307.8486,W,194058.338,A*27            
$GPGSA,A,2,26,29,05,,,,,,,,,,23.3,12.0,20.0*0A             
$GPRMC,194058.338,A,4402.1853,N,12307.8486,W,0.000000,,271015,,*0E
$GPGGA,194059.338,4402.1863,N,12307.8496,W,1,03,12.0,0.0,M,-21.4,M,0.0,0000*78
$GPGLL,4402.1863,N,12307.8496,W,194059.338,A*24            
$GPGSA,A,2,26,29,05,,,,,,,,,,23.3,12.0,20.0*0A             
$GPGSV,3,1,12,26,37,277,45,29,61,131,35,22,22,215,0,12,8,184,0*42
$GPGSV,3,2,12,5,18,47,34,25,21,201,0,16,17,319,0,18,63,195,0*4F
$GPGSV,3,3,12,6,8,311,0,15,25,68,0,21,63,292,0,122,0,0,0*44
$GPRMC,194059.338,A,4402.1863,N,12307.8496,W,0.000000,,271015,,*0D
$GPGGA,194100.338,4402.1863,N,12307.8494,W,1,03,12.0,0.0,M,-21.4,M,0.0,0000*77
...

   Hope that helps, and thanks for all your hard work. :-)
   Clif

[fly...@yahoo.com]

Hi Clif.
See if the post below helps? I posted a portion below. You need / must use AVBluetooth app, for your task.
Post here again if you need more help. TV

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/apps4av-forum/TV/apps4av-forum/8_XTk8WU_58/WY9a-z_9aH4J

>>
Hi Kendell and everyone.
If I understand correctly you are trying to use the GPS output from one device as input to anther that has no GPS?
You would have to use AvBluetooth app in order to accomplish this, Not the AvareIO on both devices.
See link below for details and read the condensed version listed below. If both devices have BT you may not be able to use this method unless you can turn the receiving device's BT off? TV

The condensed version, for the lucky ones:

1- Start Av Bluetooth and Enable Pair, Yes, send to background (press Home key).

2- Start Avare, No, to GPS,  and send to background, Home key.

3- Start External I / O, and select  "Connect GPS/DSB units on Bluetooth" for your device, send to background, Home key. Note: If you did everything right you should see data streaming at the bottom of your device, lat, lon etc., if not do 1-3 and try again.

 8- Restart Avare, and go Fly.

[cl...@eugeneweb.com]

TV Writes:

Hi Clif.
See if the post below helps? I posted a portion below. You need / must use AVBluetooth app, for your task.
Post here again if you need more help. TV

Hi TV!,

thanks for the quick reply. :-)

I'm confused, I have USB GPS units that I've used for many years in the planes I fly, and they work fine with the other moving map SW that I've used in the past. One advantage with using USB devices over wireless is that I don't need to do a lot of battery management in the cockpit. I just plug my laptop or tablet into the cigarette lighter outlet and it stays charged while providing power to the other peripherals. Also there is less chance of interference from other blue tooth or wifi sources. Simpler is better no?  I'm still curious, the code for reciving NEMA packets over USB has been around for decades. Why can't it be incorporated into Avare External I/O?

   Best, and thanks for a very cool project,
   Clif

[fly...@yahoo.com]

Hi Clif and everyone.
I do think that the idea to include the BT in the AvareIO was looked at, talked about, before, and I am not sure what the status of it is?
I am sure someone, maybe  Z can give you more information.
Originally AvareBT was developed, to the best of my knowledge,  to accomplish a single task, have an external deice with GPS / BT feed data to the tablets / active devices that may Not have have internal GPS in. TV

[cl...@eugeneweb.com]

Fly TV Writes:

Hi Clif and everyone.
I do think that the idea to include the BT in the AvareIO was looked at, talked about, before, and I am not sure what the status of it is?
I am sure someone, maybe  Z can give you more information.
Originally AvareBT was developed, to the best of my knowledge,  to accomplish a single task, have an external deice with GPS / BT feed data to the tablets / active devices that may Not have have internal GPS in. TV

- show quoted text -

Hi TV,

Hmmmm, Though weren't we talking about including USB in Avare IO? Actually there are already configure options in Avare IO for Wifi, BT, and USB. Or do you mean that they considered porting the functionality of the AVBluetooth app into Avare IO? Which brings up the question of, isn't there a lot of overlap between what these two apps or plugins are supposed to do? It would be interesting to hear more about that.

   Thanks for all your help,
   Clif

[Zubair Khan]

The USB serial stack works with Avare External IO module. However not all USB devices are compatible. When you plug in a compatible device the IO module will detect it and show a confirmation to use. Only then it can be used. The other option is to somehow have the GPS transmit mock location, and then Avare can directly receive it.

To check Mock location, open Android settings and enable Mock locations. Then open google maps and see if your GPS can send location to Google maps. If your GPS does not work with Google maps, then it had no chance of working with Avare.

Regarding USB, the list of compatible devices include FT232 devices only.

Zubair

--

[Mr. Clif]

Hi Zubair,

Thanks for the info. I'm pretty new to the Android way of doing things, I come from a linux desktop perspective, so some of my thoughts and questions might seem a bit naive. Though I am interested in how all the pieces talk to each other.

So The kenel has the drivers for each USB device, and because the device file is created and that other USB apps can get GPS date from it then we know Android has that driver right? You can just connect to it with a terminal program like minicom. My understanding is that if you sent the baud rate and stop bits correctly then the GPS will start spiting out NEMA sentences at you. So the part I don't understand is what would Avare IO have to do differnetly with a PL2303 chip if the kernel already has the driver?

My Second question is if I do turn on Mock locations, how do I know which GPS I'm getting data from? Is there a way I can turn off the internal GPS so I know it's coming from the USB GPS?

    Thanks,
    Clif

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[Zubair Khan]

Hi Clif

Many devices physically disconnect the USB from kernel (not the case for you).

Other devices do not have USB serial kernel driver. So we use https://github.com/mik3y/usb-serial-for-android/tree/master/usbSerialForAndroid/src/main/java/com/hoho/android/usbserial/driver for USB-serial, and this driver does not support all USB-serial chips.

Regards

Zubair

Zubair Khan
apps4av.com
zk4u.blogspot.com
Sudbury, MA 01776

[Mr. Clif]

Hi Zubair,

Hey thanks for the info it makes a lot more sense now.

So is there a way for me to know or control the source my system is getting GPS data from? Or is there a way I can turn off just my internal GPS?

    Thanks,
    Clif

[fly...@yahoo.com]

Hi Clif.
I do not have the exact Make / Model you have, but you should be able to turn your internal Location / GPS, Off, in your Settings, or Press and Hold Drag, top row and do the same. TV

On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 11:20:00 AM UTC-7, Mr. Clif wrote:

Hi Zubair,

Hey thanks for the info it makes a lot more sense now.

So is there a way for me to know or control the source my system is getting GPS data from? Or is there a way I can turn off just my internal GPS?

    Thanks,
    Clif

On 10/28/2015 05:42 AM, Zubair Khan wrote:

Hi Clif

Many devices physically disconnect the USB from kernel (not the case for you).

Other devices do not have USB serial kernel driver. So we use https://github.com/mik3y/usb-serial-for-android/tree/master/usbSerialForAndroid/src/main/java/com/hoho/android/usbserial/driver for USB-serial, and this driver does not support all USB-serial chips.

Regards

Zubair

Hi Zubair,

Thanks for the info. I'm pretty new to the Android way of doing things, I come from a linux desktop perspective, so some of my thoughts and questions might seem a bit naive. Though I am interested in how all the pieces talk to each other.

So The kenel has the drivers for each USB device, and because the device file is created and that other USB apps can get GPS date from it then we know Android has that driver right? You can just connect to it with a terminal program like minicom. My understanding is that if you sent the baud rate and stop bits correctly then the GPS will start spiting out NEMA sentences at you. So the part I don't understand is what would Avare IO have to do differnetly with a PL2303 chip if the kernel already has the driver?

My Second question is if I do turn on Mock locations, how do I know which GPS I'm getting data from? Is there a way I can turn off the internal GPS so I know it's coming from the USB GPS?

    Thanks,
    Clif

On 10/27/2015 05:13 PM, Zubair Khan wrote:

The USB serial stack works with Avare External IO module. However not all USB devices are compatible. When you plug in a compatible device the IO module will detect it and show a confirmation to use. Only then it can be used. The other option is to somehow have the GPS transmit mock location, and then Avare can directly receive it.

To check Mock location, open Android settings and enable Mock locations. Then open google maps and see if your GPS can send location to Google maps. If your GPS does not work with Google maps, then it had no chance of working with Avare.

Regarding USB, the list of compatible devices include FT232 devices only.

Zubair

On Feb 25, 2015 6:56 PM, "flytv1 via Apps4Av Forum" <apps4av-forum@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Hi n31.
Are you able to get the GPS to work with any other apps like OsmAnd, other maps, GPS tests, etc.? If Yes you may have a chance, see which app will work and let us know. TV

On Wednesday, February 25, 2015 at 2:47:47 PM UTC-8, n31...@gmail.com wrote:

Greetings
I was given an Android NeuTab 7" tablet, and installed Avare - all appears to be doing well; except the tablet does not have an internal GPS nor Bluetooth.  So, I purchased a GlobalSat ND-105C external GPS receiver that plugs into the tablet using the mini-USB port.  I downloaded the recommended drivers and app from GlobalSat, which show the "PL2303GPS" is started and connected (and the red light on the GPS receiver is ON too).  I started Avare and it says that there is No GPS Signal.  So, I downloaded the Avare External I/O app, and on the upper left pull down menu it says Bluetooth, etc.  I select USB in, and then I get "no USB serial device available".  So, how in the heck do I get Avare to see and use the GPS signal from the GPS receiver?
Thanks
/Frustrated        

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Zubair Khan
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zk4u.blogspot.com
Sudbury, MA 01776

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[eschlanser]

Hello Z!

 What is recommended for a GPS receiver? A forum search for the answer brought came up with this thread.
Thanks in advance,

Eric
New Avare user, no computer skills beyond turning it on, ASUS TF201 tablet with nonfunctional GPS
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.    

[eschlanser]

Even though my question was addressed to Z, it's OK if anyone responds with the answer.

Regards, 

Eric

[Zubair Khan]

I will use an external bluetooth gos like xgps150.
Z

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[John W SBA]

> What is recommended for a GPS receiver?

That's a great question, and in order to help others seeking answers I'm
going to start a new Topic on the Forum with that title and add my 2
cents there.

[John W SBA]

Occasionally we have seen recommendations for an affordable GPS receiver
to use with the Avare apps. This post is an attempt to begin a thread
where we can all share our experiences, questions and preferences. My
understanding is that the Apps4Av (Avare, etc.) all-volunteer
development team has a policy of actively supporting all companies
willing to work with them on compatibility. There's a page on the
Apps4Av website with a list of companies that worked with Avare
developers a couple of years ago (not updated since) to ensure
compatibility,
here: https://apps4av.com/partners/

To start off the discussion of what people are using, I can share having
briefly borrowed a Dual XGPS and it was great. Easy to set up with
Avare and worked flawlessly. Though sorely tempted but with a rather
small aviation budget, I decided not to buy one when it came time to
return the loaner.

Since the GPS receivers in my Samsung S4 phones work great and the one
in my 1st gen. Nexus 7 tablet works ok on a yoke mount, my focus shifted
to a stand-alone ADS-B receiver. Constrained by the aforementioned tiny
budget, I tried out the HIZ app with a cheap SDR receiver (total cost
about $15). To my great delight, it was easy to set up and works great.
I now have GPS and both ADS-B bands, with weather & traffic info in
flight. Note that the traffic info is limited because my aircraft
doesn't yet have ADS-B out which would trigger more and better ground
station data. The website for info on the HIZ app is
here: http://hiz.ch/index.php/home/adsb-receiver
The free version of the HIZ app's gPlay page is
here: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=bs.Avare.ADSB

So what questions do people have? What solutions have you found? Are
there new ones you've heard of? Is anyone using a home-built Stratux
receiver with ADS-B and/or GPS?

[John Rodkey]

I have a stratux, but no GPS on the stratux yet.  

I haven't used the stratux as much as I thought I was going to: the extra steps for connecting seem a bit much when I am just hopping over to a nearby airport for lunch.

When I do longer trips, I'll definitely use the stratux.  

John