tractors and more in Argentina

8 views
Skip to first unread message

Patrick Gibbs

unread,
Aug 22, 2012, 4:52:49 PM8/22/12
to Appropedia community
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256


Hello Appropedia Foundation,

I'm writing to you because I figure some collaboration might arise
between Appropedia.org, Appropedia Foundation, and what we're up to here
in Argentina.

TRACTORS

I came here to coordinate the fabrication of a LifeTrac, the tractor
from the Global Village Construction Set of Open Source Ecology. A
place/group, Ecovilla Gaia, said they want a LifeTrac, they have the
funds and space to build one, and they want to do build it as part of
a course/training. I found James Slade in the US to come teach, and I
returned to Argentina to organize things here.

So far, the people with the most technical/mechanical experience who
I've talked to say that a LifeTrac is impractical here because
hydraulic motors are uncommon, which means they're expensive and
difficult to replace when they break and there's less knowledge about
how to fix them. I haven't yet seen a price list for the parts for a
LifeTrac here.

The idea arose to build tractors out of old car parts, since those are
relatively common compared to LifeTrac parts. I haven't seen a price
breakdown for such a recycled tractor.

Any hints?

AGRICULTURAL MACHINERY

I've also visited Tekny Campo, where they make agricultural tools for
horse/ox-powered agriculture, and a few electrical/combustion motor
mills. At TeknyCampo, Andres is happy to share the CAD designs of all
the machines, with libre licenses -- his interest is in getting the
tools into the hands of the people who can use them, and to that end
he's given trainings in other countries to help other groups
manufacture the same machines, and to modify the designs for their
local needs. I posted an hour-long video of my visit to the TeknyCampo
workshop here:
http://vimeo.com/43351383

If I get the CAD files from Andres, does it make sense to put them on
Appropedia?

Other videos of various bits of the project are at
http://www.MutualGift.net and http://vimeo.com/patrickgibbs/videos

GENERALLY

I see two broad aspects in this work: 1) building systems to support
the sharing and development of mechanical/engineering skills across
generations, locations, genders, and other differences; 2) documenting
the machines/tools and the processes using a multi-lingual semantic wiki.

cheers,
Patrick
http://www.MutualGift.net

PS: I'm fluent in Spanish, in case that matters.




-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

iF4EAREIAAYFAlA1RqAACgkQwrXQHOcmxrsE6AD+KEIndTgiWBfRvy3lLo7gv/Cp
rJdMR41DHMZuMLOKk3gA/3/OSiZcMpMy4/D8xkwmhc01bZiWpTQlFKgs8vAZ6a3Q
=i6fN
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Danyl Strype

unread,
Aug 24, 2012, 1:01:26 AM8/24/12
to appropedia...@googlegroups.com
Kia ora Patrick
(sorry if you get this twice, I wanted to be sure you get it at least once ;)

These sound like great projects! The point about the hydraulic motors
is really relevant - I've had a number of discussions with naive but
well-meaning people who want to "give" a piece of technology to a
"third-world" community, without considering the issues of maintenance
and replacement, and the dependence (and perhaps worse, debt) that can
be created. The last thing any of use want to do it repeat the
mistakes of the Green Revolution.

I recommend you give this feedback to Open Source Ecology (if you
haven't already), as I'd hope they'd be keen to rework (or "fork") the
LifeTrac design so it can be useful to more communities. They may also
be interested in hosting the CAD designs you mention as part of the
GVCS, or as a separate open design repository.

All these projects certainly come within the ambit of the Appropedia,
for example, I see the LifeTrac is already included in the Appro wiki.
I see no reason why Appro wouldn't host documentation of Andres'
designs.
To give the best chance of the CAD files themselves being useful to
anyone, regardless of what operating system or CAD application they
use, I suggest they would best be saved in a file format which is:
* patent-free
* well-documented
* well-supported by the most available CAD applications

CAD is outside my experience, but there is a proposal here for a CAD
file format inspired by Free Software ideas:
http://www.bruno.postle.net/2003/draft/

Keep up the good work!

He mihi nui
Strypey
Aotearoa

On 23 August 2012 08:52, Patrick Gibbs <patr...@riseup.net> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

> I'm writing to you because I figure some collaboration might arise
> between Appropedia.org, Appropedia Foundation, and what we're up to here
> in Argentina.
>


--
Danyl Strype
Community Developer
Disintermedia.net.nz/strype

"Geeks are those who partake in our culture."
- .ISOcrates

"Uncomfortable alliances are not just necessary; they reflect and
speak to the tremendous possibility of our political moment."
- Harmony Goldberg and Joshua Kahn Russell
http://www.nationofchange.org/new-radical-alliances-new-era-1337004193

"Both Marxists and Chicago-school libertarian economists can agree
that free software is the best model."
- Keith C Curtis
http://keithcu.com/wordpress/?page_id=407

Chris Watkins

unread,
Aug 24, 2012, 4:17:58 AM8/24/12
to appropedia...@googlegroups.com
Hi Patrick and Danyl,

I don't have the knowledge to comment much on LifeTrac and CAD, but I'll endorse Danyl's comments. 

You're certainly welcome to share information and files through Appropedia. If the specific file types can't be uploaded on Appropedia, let us know - it's possible to change those settings.

That's good to hear. In the meantime, the emphasis needs to be on using a format which is widely usable, without requiring the user to pay for software. 

Cheers
Chris


Keep up the good work!

He mihi nui
Strypey
Aotearoa

On 23 August 2012 08:52, Patrick Gibbs <patr...@riseup.net> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

> I'm writing to you because I figure some collaboration might arise
> between Appropedia.org, Appropedia Foundation, and what we're up to here
> in Argentina.
>


--
Danyl Strype
Community Developer
Disintermedia.net.nz/strype

"Geeks are those who partake in our culture."
- .ISOcrates

"Uncomfortable alliances are not just necessary; they reflect and
speak to the tremendous possibility of our political moment."
- Harmony Goldberg and Joshua Kahn Russell
http://www.nationofchange.org/new-radical-alliances-new-era-1337004193

"Both Marxists and Chicago-school libertarian economists can agree
that free software is the best model."
- Keith C Curtis
http://keithcu.com/wordpress/?page_id=407

--
For the public archive and subscription options, visit this group at
http://groups.google.com/group/appropedia-community?hl=en
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
appropedia-commu...@googlegroups.com



--
Chris Watkins

Appropedia.org - Sharing knowledge to build rich, sustainable lives.

nikki caputo

unread,
Aug 24, 2012, 12:29:57 PM8/24/12
to appropedia...@googlegroups.com

Really appreciate this thinking/doing; bravo.

Prosper,
Nikki

Patrick Gibbs

unread,
Aug 24, 2012, 5:38:59 PM8/24/12
to appropedia...@googlegroups.com
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256



On 08/24/2012 02:01 AM, Danyl Strype wrote:
> Kia ora Patrick (sorry if you get this twice, I wanted to be sure
> you get it at least once ;)
>
> These sound like great projects! The point about the hydraulic
> motors is really relevant - I've had a number of discussions with
> naive but well-meaning people who want to "give" a piece of
> technology to a "third-world" community, without considering the
> issues of maintenance and replacement, and the dependence (and
> perhaps worse, debt) that can be created. The last thing any of use
> want to do it repeat the mistakes of the Green Revolution.
>
> I recommend you give this feedback to Open Source Ecology (if you
> haven't already), as I'd hope they'd be keen to rework (or "fork")
> the LifeTrac design so it can be useful to more communities.

I intend to give the feedback, and I'm curious to see what response it
brings, if any. Part of my effort includes using OSE as a gateway into
appropriate technology, since (as far as I can tell) many folks in OSE
haven't heard of approtech and don't know any of the history or
collaboration that uses the name "appropriate technology".

> They may also be interested in hosting the CAD designs you mention
> as part of the GVCS, or as a separate open design repository.

Maybe, although their Internet setup seems rather underdone currently,
with access to CAD files difficult to find. I figured coming to
Appropedia might make my life easier since Appropedia seems more
organized.
>
> All these projects certainly come within the ambit of the
> Appropedia, for example, I see the LifeTrac is already included in
> the Appro wiki. I see no reason why Appro wouldn't host
> documentation of Andres' designs. To give the best chance of the
> CAD files themselves being useful to anyone, regardless of what
> operating system or CAD application they use, I suggest they would
> best be saved in a file format which is: * patent-free *
> well-documented * well-supported by the most available CAD
> applications
>
> CAD is outside my experience, but there is a proposal here for a
> CAD file format inspired by Free Software ideas:
> http://www.bruno.postle.net/2003/draft/

Neat proposal. As I'm just starting to learn CAD, I don't yet know the
current state of CAD file formats. I'll only use libre CAD programs.

Thanks for your response.

As all my projects are in flux, I don't know if or when you'll see
anything from me on Appropedia.org, though I imagine I'll show up
there sometime this year.

cheers,
Patrick
>
> Keep up the good work!
>
> He mihi nui Strypey Aotearoa
>
> On 23 August 2012 08:52, Patrick Gibbs <patr...@riseup.net>
> wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
>> I'm writing to you because I figure some collaboration might
>> arise between Appropedia.org, Appropedia Foundation, and what
>> we're up to here in Argentina.
>>
>
>
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

iF4EAREIAAYFAlA39HEACgkQwrXQHOcmxrvevwD/YdVq6CIVHv1TVN6HUsDj+hak
N5s5H1x4THCFU7YUZxcBAISq8l0aqKaiQ4YGhTs1wIVIx5T9SafZGqctw0f7uNae
=ULen
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages