Terminology training session #2

[Martin Benjamin]

Hi All,

This is the chat transcript of the training session with Jon Gosier
for Luganda. You'll see that these training sessions are two-way
conversations - the technical team is learning from your experiences,
so that we can fix problems with Glossmaster and make the system
better for everyone.

If you haven't had a training session yet, please get in touch with me
as soon as possible so that we can get you started!

Cheers,
Martin

[1:36:50 PM] Martin Benjamin: tell me what u see
[1:37:04 PM] Jon Gos: a screen with the Anloc logo
[1:37:15 PM] Jon Gos: translate statistics export and usersettings
[1:37:26 PM] Jon Gos: quick search and some other stuff
[1:38:49 PM] Martin Benjamin: do you see a list of words?
[1:38:56 PM] Jon Gos: Syntctic Group, Searh String,
[1:39:06 PM] Jon Gos: I do not see a list of words
[1:39:15 PM] Jon Gos: reloading
[1:39:24 PM] Martin Benjamin: ok, @louise, the default search is not
set to *
[1:39:56 PM] Martin Benjamin: @jon, please type * in the box for
search string
[1:40:31 PM] Jon Gos: okay, so I did that and now I see words
[1:40:36 PM] Martin Benjamin: @jon, what is the status that is
selected? (choice of all, empty, fuzzy, completed)
[1:40:54 PM] Jon Gos: empty
[1:41:11 PM] Martin Benjamin: @louise, default search should be All
[1:42:40 PM] Jon Gos: Martin, so we translate the source word and give
a definition in Luganda
[1:42:52 PM] Jon Gos: then under comments we would put notes in
English?
[1:42:58 PM] Martin Benjamin: almost
[1:43:09 PM] Martin Benjamin: translate the source word - yes
[1:43:38 PM] Martin Benjamin: definition in Luganda - yes. IMPORTANT
- this is a definition of the Luganda word, not an exact translation
of the English definition
[1:45:07 PM] Martin Benjamin: sometimes the english def and the
luganda def will be exact translations, but sometimes you will need to
or want something that is different
[1:45:31 PM] Jon Gos: but comments would be english because they are
notes for your team
[1:45:32 PM] Jon Gos: right?
[1:45:37 PM] Martin Benjamin: the english definition is there as a
guide, but not a straightjacket, and it also ensures that we are
talking about the same thing
[1:46:20 PM] Jon Gos: and tags I assume would be inglish
[1:46:22 PM] Jon Gos: engligh
[1:46:29 PM] Jon Gos: english
[1:46:32 PM] Martin Benjamin: comments - no. Comments are entirely
optional, and they should be in Luganda. Comments are things that
will help a Luganda speaker understand the technical concept, but are
not strictly part of the defintion
[1:46:41 PM] Martin Benjamin: see the English comment for 3-D, for
example
[1:46:43 PM] Jon Gos: ohh, okay
[1:47:07 PM] Martin Benjamin: and comments should NOT be a translation
of the English comment, unless that seems helpful
[1:47:25 PM] Jon Gos: okay
[1:48:39 PM] Martin Benjamin: you'll see that only some of the eng
terms have comments, and many of those comments are cut-and-paste
passages from wikipedia or some other source. Remember that users
will have access to any comments in English, so your only task is to
develop a tool that will aid localizers and users of localized
software in Luganda.
[1:49:40 PM] Jon Gos: got it
[1:49:55 PM] Jon Gos: what about tags?
[1:50:48 PM] Jon Gos: luganda as well?
[1:51:40 PM] Martin Benjamin: you have 3 options re tags
[1:52:39 PM] Martin Benjamin: 1) use the list that is provided. That
is a global list. Eventually we will provide a po file that can be
translated into Luganda, including those tags, and the tags will
appear in Luganda for Luganda users
[1:53:59 PM] Martin Benjamin: 2) suggest that we add a global tag.
You can use the little email icon on the top right of each entry, and
send me an email suggesting that we add a new tag. This won't be
instantaneous, so if you do this please make a written note of the
entry/ entries you want to come back to after the new tag is added.
[1:55:03 PM] Martin Benjamin: 3) add a local tag. You can input any
tag you like in the space provided. This will only appear in the
Luganda namespace. Presumably you'll want such a tag to appear in
Luganda.
[1:55:20 PM] Martin Benjamin: tags and comments are both optional
[1:55:40 PM] Martin Benjamin: translation and definition are
mandatory.
[1:55:55 PM] Jon Gos: so option 3 is probablly all we'll do
[1:56:17 PM] Martin Benjamin: you can submit an entry as "fuzzy" if it
only has a translation or only has a definition, but you can only
submit it as completed if it has both.
[1:56:48 PM] Jon Gos: okay
[2:00:08 PM] Martin Benjamin: please reload the entry for 3-D, I have
edited it (an earlier edit didn't make the cut for the final db
transfer)
[2:02:08 PM] Martin Benjamin: this shows a couple of things:
[2:03:23 PM] Martin Benjamin: 1) you can see that the English
syntactic group is Adjective. You have the option to change the
syntactic group for Luganda, if the term used is actually a different
part of speech. Sometimes that happens, but it will probably be rare.
[2:04:09 PM] Jon Gos: okay
[2:04:54 PM] Martin Benjamin: 2) you can see that the Comment field is
intended as a guide to users, not as a part of the dictionary entry
per se. In this case, it is a meta-comment about the structure of the
english entry
[2:06:22 PM] Martin Benjamin: 3) next to the Email icon, you will see
something that says "xyz". If you click on that, you will see how
other translators on the project have dealt with the term in their
lang. xyz = Example Language, sw = Swahili, fr = French, etc. Of
course, since we are just getting started, this feature is not
populated atm.
[2:07:24 PM] Martin Benjamin: 4) under "tags", you can see that
another lang has tagged this entry as "video". You can choose to
follow suit, or not.
[2:08:35 PM] Jon Gos: got ya
[2:10:56 PM] Martin Benjamin: ok, this is the basics for how to edit
an entry. The other important thing to go over is navigation.
[2:11:02 PM] Jon Gos: is there a way I can group terms. I mean we'll
have three guys working in tandem. But there's no real way to manage
who's translating what
[2:11:18 PM] Martin Benjamin: ok, this relates to navigatin
[2:11:56 PM] Martin Benjamin: in the upper left side of the white area
on screen
[2:12:43 PM] Martin Benjamin: You can do a maximal search by selecting
search string = *, syntactic group = all, and status = all
[2:13:16 PM] Martin Benjamin: or you can restrict the search in any
number of ways
[2:13:52 PM] Martin Benjamin: for example, use perm as your search
string, and either All or Empty as your status
[2:14:04 PM] Martin Benjamin: (at this point it doesn't matter,
because all strings are empty)
[2:14:52 PM] Martin Benjamin: you should see 7 results, 5 related to
permissions and 2 related to permanence
[2:15:51 PM] Jon Gos: right
[2:16:30 PM] Martin Benjamin: your team will probably find it easier
to tackle all the "permissions" entries at the same time, rather than
waiting until they come across them via an alphabetical approach
[2:18:23 PM] Martin Benjamin: and they will certainly find it easier
to use "All" if they are doing a restrictive search such as perm,
rather than just looking for Empty entries, because "all" will give
them the benefit of guidance from work already completed
[2:18:49 PM] Jon Gos: right, I mean more from a delegation
standpoint. Like Translator 1 is working on these terms, how does
Translator 2 know what not to duplicate. But I can figure that out
from my end
[2:19:08 PM] Martin Benjamin: but "empty" will show them the next
entry in their overall queue
[2:19:52 PM] Martin Benjamin: what I suggest with a team of three is
to give each one a letter of the alphabet to start with. So james
gets A, emmanuel gets B, and Ronnald get C
[2:20:21 PM] Martin Benjamin: But they shouldn't go straight through
their letter. For example:
[2:21:12 PM] Martin Benjamin: James has A. His first search is search
string = abb, status = all
[2:22:14 PM] Jon Gos: okay
[2:22:48 PM] Martin Benjamin: turns out there's only one entry... so
his next search is search string = *, status = empty, which brings him
back to his list. (someone working farther down the list will need to
do something a bit more complicated, such as using the numbered list
at the bottom of the page to jump to their area)
[2:23:13 PM] Martin Benjamin: next search string = abo, status = all
[2:23:39 PM] Jon Gos: what determines the search string?
[2:23:48 PM] Jon Gos: abb vs abo for instance
[2:23:51 PM] Jon Gos: how do I know htat's a string?
[2:24:22 PM] Martin Benjamin: this gives him 6 entries, and he can
work through all 6. First he would do the ones relating to aborting,
then to about, then to above
[2:24:53 PM] Martin Benjamin: then he goes back to the master list of
empties, finds his next 3 or 4 letter search string sequence, and
jumps into that
[2:25:14 PM] Martin Benjamin: when doing the english, I found it most
useful to go for the first 3 letters of the next empty term
[2:25:47 PM] Jon Gos: got ya
[2:29:37 PM] Martin Benjamin: I played all sorts of tricks to move
through the data. for instance, I would work backwards for a while,
from the bottom of the alphabet. Or I would do all the Qs to feel
like I had completed more letters - some of the letters have a couple
of hundred entries, so it feels like you're making no progress for a
long time, whereas q just has a few :)
[2:30:48 PM] Martin Benjamin: if you use the strategy I suggest above,
you will find that the process gets faster as you go along, because
many of the entries from farther in the alphabet will be already
completed
[2:31:17 PM] Martin Benjamin: one last thing, there is a category
called Type of entry, and that lists core and supplementary.
[2:31:32 PM] Martin Benjamin: For the moment, all terms are "core".
These are the contracted terms.
[2:32:59 PM] Martin Benjamin: There is a possibility that we will want
to add more terms to the project as we go along. However, at the
moment we do not have funds to pay for work on those terms. So they
will go into the Supplementary category. Translators will have the
option of working on those terms for love, or leave them hanging
around in the hopes that more money will materialize at some point.
[2:33:15 PM] Martin Benjamin: That's all from my end. Any questions?
[2:33:58 PM] Jon Gos: not yet
[2:34:05 PM] Jon Gos: looks good
[2:34:18 PM] Jon Gos: the translators are excited
[2:34:37 PM] Jon Gos: this is far less technical than the last project
[2:34:47 PM] Jon Gos: basically I just need to find some Luganda
speakers
[2:35:00 PM] Jon Gos: sorry
[2:35:11 PM] Jon Gos: "I would just" need to find some Luganda
speakers
[2:35:19 PM] Jon Gos: if I didn't already have the trans team
[2:37:12 PM] Jon Gos: how many terms were you going a day for the
english version?
[2:38:54 PM] Martin Benjamin: my aim was about 100 per day, but it
rarely worked out that way. It took me almost 2 months, so average of
about 50 per day. But there weren't many days when I was at it for 8
hours - often I could only actually work on defs for an hour or two
[2:39:32 PM] Martin Benjamin: in some ways it should be easier in
Luganda, because you already have definitions of the concepts to use
as reference. Some of the concepts would take me twenty minutes or
more to define
[2:39:43 PM] Jon Gos: right
[2:39:49 PM] Jon Gos: to reasearch and so forth
[2:40:21 PM] Martin Benjamin: to research, to try to put into language
that will make sense to the translators, to get to the essense of the
term as it applies to software
[2:40:49 PM] Martin Benjamin: that's one thing that I want to stress -
this project is all about localization
[2:40:55 PM] Jon Gos: right
[2:41:26 PM] Martin Benjamin: so the focus of the definitions should
be, how is this term used in Firefox or OpenOffice or Linux or an
iPhone or some other IT context