Final SDK build available (84853) deadline extended to Tuesday, August 5

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YA

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Jul 14, 2008, 6:05:18 PM7/14/08
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Just got this message --

ADC Entrants,

We're pleased to announce that SDK build 84853 is now available on
your private download site. This will be the last build released for
ADC Round 2 and is the build that you will need to submit your final
application under.

In addition, the final ADC deadline has been extended to Tuesday,
August 5. This is the final ADC deadline.

Thanks!
Android Developer Challenge Team

-- but where is this private download site? Anyone has a link?

Seni Sangrujee

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Jul 14, 2008, 7:16:40 PM7/14/08
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LOL, I got excited when I saw this email, but I'm guessing it was
mistakenly sent to losers. Unless now they're just taunting us for
sport.

-seni

plusminus

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Jul 15, 2008, 7:59:45 AM7/15/08
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xD

plusminus

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Jul 15, 2008, 8:01:30 AM7/15/08
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but it says "entrants" not "finalists". Anyway it still looks like an
mistake, as I also cannot guess what they mean with "private download
site".

Ken Adair

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Jul 15, 2008, 10:07:05 AM7/15/08
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Got the same email, talk about adding fuel to the fire...

Ken Adair

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Jul 15, 2008, 10:13:58 AM7/15/08
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Wonder how many of us would have actually gotten behind Android if we
knew that they were going to only cater to the top 50. Definitely feel
betrayed....

Gies,Brad

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Jul 15, 2008, 10:58:31 AM7/15/08
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I don't think it's anything to worry about, and probably a good thing in the long run. Google has selected a small group of very committed Android developers to help them test the SDK and get it to a final release.

Obviously the people in the top 50 of the Challenge are those that have really figured out Android, and their feedback will be much more valuable than the feedback from the community at large. Narrowing the group down to them until the final release helps to focus resources.

Personally, I have focused on design of my app, and not coding until I see the final release, so it fits in with my plans perfectly :). Anyone doing coding now has to expect to redo their code with every release they want their app to run on, and I don't have the time to do that anyway.


Sincerely,

Brad Gies
-------------------------------------
NLM Software
Southfield, MI, USA
-------------------------------------

If you get today's work done today, but do it in a way that you can't possibly get tomorrow's work done tomorrow, then you lose.


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Ken Adair

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Jul 15, 2008, 11:20:13 AM7/15/08
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I agree that those in the top 50 will add some very beneficial
feedback. However, I think it's silly to think those top 50 have some
superior understanding of Android. I have seen a few other
applications that didn't make it into the top 50 that were much more
complex and entertaining to boot. We don't know why Google selected
the winners they did. I'm sure there were underlying business concerns
involved and not just the complexity or quality of an application.
Obviously the winners have a leg up now and I'm sure they know much
more than the rest of us, but that's all because of Google.

Anyways, I don't think the biggest issue here is who has and doesn't
have access to the SDK. I think the main issue here is communication
or lack there of. Google embraced the development community and touted
how they were going to build this platform with the help of the
development community. Somewhere along the lines this "seemed" to
change. I say seemed because this could have always been part of
Google's strategy.

The problem is they have failed to nurture the relationship with the
development community. They have cut them off from the information
that was once flowing and left them to speculate and wonder. In
response, you are seeing many that feel cheated and betrayed. Google
can fix this before it's too late, but they need to act quickly. It's
ALL about communication.

Shane Isbell

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Jul 14, 2008, 7:32:10 PM7/14/08
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On Mon, Jul 14, 2008 at 4:16 PM, Seni Sangrujee <sang...@gmail.com> wrote:

LOL, I got excited when I saw this email, but I'm guessing it was
mistakenly sent to losers. Unless now they're just taunting us for
sport.
Or maybe it was orchestrated by a super secret group inside Google that's trying to smuggle information out to the community.
 
Shane

Michael Martin - MM Agency

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Jul 14, 2008, 8:31:52 PM7/14/08
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This is just for the 50 developers that made it into Round 2.

Michael Martin
Google And Blog
http://www.googlandblog.com/

-----Original Message-----
From: YA [mailto:yuri.a...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2008 3:05 PM
To: Android Discuss
Subject: [android-discuss] Final SDK build available (84853) deadline
extended to Tuesday, August 5

John P.

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Jul 14, 2008, 6:13:27 PM7/14/08
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I got the same email. I'm guessing that the email was intended for
ADC Round 2 entrants because
1. There's no need to notify the extension to others. Sure, it's
interesting for us to know, but we don't have a *need* to know.
2. I'm not aware of any "private download site" either. However,
previous posts suggest that Round 1 winners will have private access
to the latest SDK.

Of course, I could be wrong and there really is a private download
site for all entrants.

John P.

hitsu_g

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Jul 14, 2008, 6:56:49 PM7/14/08
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I got it too. Is this a goof-up? (I didn't know I was in Round 2 - I'd
better get to work!).

Hong

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Jul 15, 2008, 11:29:22 AM7/15/08
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On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 10:58 AM, Gies,Brad <bg...@nlmi.com> wrote:
Google has selected a small group of very committed Android developers to help them test the SDK and get it to a final release.
 
Winners do not necessarily mean they are very committed.  There are quite some companies in the winner list, and they do not ONLY focus on Android.  The Weather Channel has J2ME, Brew, and you bet, iPhone software.

Also, does this imply the rest of us are not "very committed"?  There are in fact many many "loosers" in this group answering questions and basically contributing, e.g. plusminus, mark, etc.  I have yet to see winners participate in the group as enthusiast as those guys, except Muthu.

Obviously the people in the top 50 of the Challenge are those that have really figured out Android, and their feedback will be much more valuable than the feedback from the community at large.

This is very long.  I'm pretty sure you haven't seen DUO or Enkin or some other great stuff that just didn't make it to the top 50.  Look at iPhone app store, games are a dominant mobile software category.  However, Android top 50 has NO games.  You think doing a map overlay is more difficult than doing an Open GL ES 3D racing game??

Hong

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Jul 15, 2008, 11:30:50 AM7/15/08
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On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 11:29 AM, Hong <lord...@gmail.com> wrote:
This is very long. 
long == wrong... too much typing >_<

Shane Isbell

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Jul 14, 2008, 6:08:18 PM7/14/08
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I received it as well. My guess is it's a mistake and not meant to be sent to all ADC entrants.
 
Shane 

Hong

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Jul 14, 2008, 9:22:23 PM7/14/08
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is this "mistaken email" trying to get android developers back to the community?  hehe...

Ken Adair

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Jul 15, 2008, 1:19:37 PM7/15/08
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Google can you hear us??

David McLaughlin (Android Advocate)

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Jul 15, 2008, 2:27:08 PM7/15/08
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Hi everyone,

As some pointed out, I accidentally sent the note concerning ADC Round
2 entrants to the wrong list. Sorry for the annoyance.

Thanks,
David

Dan T.

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Jul 16, 2008, 5:56:56 AM7/16/08
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Thank you for your clarification David.

I'm just happy to hear about a "FINAL" sdk, now we (the non finalist)
know that the sdk isn't anymore in beta testing and you will be able
to release it very quickly to everyone!


I'm not an expert in communication but I think it's much more annoying
for Google and the Android team than for us...

On 15 juil, 20:27, "David McLaughlin (Android Advocate)"
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted

Ken Adair

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Jul 17, 2008, 5:11:17 PM7/17/08
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Google's secrecy would have most likely received a much different
response should they have started out this way. The problem is when
you provide the SDK along with bundles of information to thousands of
developers, eliciting their help and feedback along the way you set a
certain level of exceptions. It is much harder to take something away
than it is to have never have given it.

I still have the utmost respect for Google and the Android team, but
this was a huge oversight on their part. I only hope that they realize
the stress and hardship they have put on those who have supported them
the most. Let's hope they respond quickly with some much needed
direction.

Best Regards,

Ken Adair
http://neevo.com

Ken Adair

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Jul 17, 2008, 5:14:08 PM7/17/08
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If you haven't already signed the SDK petition here's a link:

http://www.anddev.org/petition/

Shane Isbell

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Jul 17, 2008, 5:21:34 PM7/17/08
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Sadly, if Google said they were to release the SDK tomorrow, I just wouldn't care anymore. Google is closed; Google is the status quo in mobile;  Google is not really even a leader anymore, they are following Apple. What's really changed? Another mobile platform? More fragmented market? The carriers get a free operating system built on the hard work of the open-source community. Good for them.
 
We already have CDC and CLDC platforms if we want to do Java, with a market that already exists.
 
Shane

Mark Murphy

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Jul 17, 2008, 7:51:28 PM7/17/08
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These threads make me feel like Al Pacino: "Every time I try to get out,
they keep pulling me back in"...

Shane Isbell wrote:
> Google is closed

A drop of much of the source code is available in a repository and in
tarballs. It runs on Linux. It has a free (pre-alpha) SDK. People have
been able to take it and get it running on a variety of unsupported
hardware, such as the Nokia N800/N810.

On the open spectrum, today, it is more open than Apple, Microsoft,
Blackberry, or even Symbian. It is less open today than LiMo and
OpenMoko. If -- *if* -- they keep their promises, it'll be as open as
LiMo and OpenMoko by year's end. With luck, Symbian will wind up this
open as well.

It is definitely more closed -- today -- than it was a few months ago.
That is definitely worthy of angst and anger, but only to a point.

> Google is not really even a leader anymore, they are following
> Apple.

Android is following lots of people: Apple on the sizzle side,
LiMo/OpenMoko on the free side.

Depending on your belief in the latter two platforms, Android *might* be
the longer-term leader in free, if it can use the energy from the sizzle
to be a "playa" bigger than LiMo or OpenMoko. It's even conceivable they
could wind up the leader in sizzle too -- just because *we* don't see
progress doesn't mean progress isn't happening.

> More fragmented market?

That barn door's been open for years. If you're looking for a
monoculture, try the desktop PC marketplace on for size.

> The carriers get a free operating system built on the hard work
> of the open-source community.

If you mean Linux, Android isn't the first or only Linux-based mobile
phone OS, and it probably won't be the last.

> We already have CDC and CLDC platforms if we want to do Java, with a
> market that already exists.

Considering that Microsoft doesn't like CDC/CLDC, and Apple doesn't like
CDC/CLDC, and Android's given no indication of liking CDC/CLDC, and I
don't see any CDC/CLDC activity with LiMo or OpenMoko, I'm not too
bullish on CDC/CLDC. But, hey, I've definitely been wrong before.

---------------------

Android is making a series of related mis-steps here, from the private
SDK releases to the lack of communication. Somebody, somewhere, needs to
be fired, or worse, needs to let me rip them a new one. If Android
fizzles, which is entirely possible, this whole mess will be one of the
bullet points as to why.

And, if Android is able to carve out a significant chunk of the market,
few will remember this fiasco in four years' time, other than a general
sense of unease whenever symptoms like we're seeing now happen to pop up.

In this respect, Android is going through some of the same stumbles that
Netscape did when they "released" Mozilla (big code dump, diddly-squat
for support), or when Sun released OpenOffice.org (big code dump,
license soup, mixed messages from management), or IBM did when it
released Eclipse (big code dump, general sense of "uh, now what?").
Those projects went on to be successes, by most measures.

Of course, the same stumbles befell Real Networks with the release of
Helix (big code dump, godawful license I have the shame of being
involved with), SAP with the release of SAP DB (big code dump, little
community building), and so on. There is no way to determine, here and
now, how this will play out for Android.

The only thing I know for certain is that rehashing the same complaints
again and again and again won't exactly help Android's cause any. Given
the press coverage to date, I feel fairly certain that the "we're
<bleep>ing unhappy" message has made it up the Mountain (View). Maybe
they'll respond now, maybe they'll stay the course until the ADC wraps
in three weeks, or until the product ships in a few months.

Zero days, three weeks, three months -- none of it really makes much
difference. Any, perhaps all, open source communities are marathons, not
sprints. As for me, I'm just staying limber.

--
Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)
http://commonsware.com
Warescription: All titles, revisions, & ebook formats, just $35/year

Shane Isbell

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Jul 17, 2008, 8:59:33 PM7/17/08
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I was looking for a change of the mobile ecosystem, with Google's leadership. But what we have is the same old, closed mobile ecosystem. It looks the same as Sprint J2ME developer's program back in 2002, generate a bunch of excitement from developers and once there were some initial apps, Sprint choose their vendors and the support went completely silent on the forums. The mindset is the same. And yes, J2ME (CDC/CLDC) did very well. Good for those on the inside track, miserable for the individual developer.
 
Don't get me wrong. If I were Google, I may do the same thing, focus all resources on getting the device out the door. But I'm not Google, I'm a developer, sitting there feeling cheated, lured into what seemed to be a thriving community before Google cut it off at the knees. What do I care if Google gets out a device in QIV of this year or QI of the next, if I'm on the outside, waiting, wondering if this is really the new mobile ecosystem, when it reeks of the old.
 
I don't have some grudge against Google, they can do what they want but when their interests and mine don't align, then it's time to move on and find something else. If Google somehow changes things and I think it's worth it, I'll jump back in. And as for open-source projects being a marathon, perhaps that's true but running blindly forward hoping that one is running in the right race or in the right direction may not be the wisest course; and don't forget Pheidippides didn't live through his marathon.
 
Shane

Mark Murphy

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Jul 17, 2008, 9:33:20 PM7/17/08
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Shane Isbell wrote:
> I was looking for a change of the mobile ecosystem, with Google's
> leadership. But what we have is the same old, closed mobile ecosystem.

Odds are you're right. However, don't you think it's just a trifle early
to make that a definitive claim? Seeing as how the ecosystem hasn't been
launched yet? I mean, as much as the early community-building was slick
and all, the gun doesn't truly sound until devices are ready, as far as
I'm concerned.

> And yes, J2ME
> (CDC/CLDC) did very well. Good for those on the inside track, miserable
> for the individual developer.

I hear ya on the misery part. Complete with Kathy Bates and a
sledgehammer, IIRC. ;-)

> But I'm not Google, I'm a
> developer, sitting there feeling cheated, lured into what seemed to be a
> thriving community before Google cut it off at the knees.

I'm certainly hoping this is an interregnum, and we'll be in position to
raise the community anew shortly. But, I may be wrong, in which case
I'll look upon 2008 as being a bit of a lost year. C'est la vie.

> I'm on the outside, waiting, wondering if this is really the new mobile
> ecosystem, when it reeks of the old.

Simple: don't invest much in it just yet.

Early adopter-hood is not always a river of milk and honey. In fact, I
suspect that more often than not, early adopter-hood is a whole lotta
cow pies and bee stings first.

If things turn positive again, there will be plenty of room for all
sorts of folk in the community. If it turns completely south, you won't
be out much.

There will be some morons, like myself, who will try to double-down
during the hard times and hope it pans out. There's all sorts of
strategies for dealing with the situation.

Frankly, what gets my goat isn't the fact that people are jumping off
the bandwagon, or even that they're announcing they're jumping off the
bandwagon. It's that they are *repeatedly* announcing they're jumping
off the bandwagon and thereby attack the bandwagon on their way to stage
left.

> And as for open-source projects being a
> marathon, perhaps that's true but running blindly forward hoping that
> one is running in the right race or in the right direction may not be
> the wisest course;

As a wise man once said, "Sometimes, ya gotta roll the hard six."

Well, OK, a wise character on a TV show.

> and don't forget Pheidippides didn't live through his
> marathon.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, those who don't learn from history are doomed to do
something-or-another... ;-)

I'm not asking anyone to run the marathon who doesn't want to -- just
don't toss caltrops into the road for those who run now and those who
choose to run in the future.

Shane Isbell

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Jul 17, 2008, 10:47:21 PM7/17/08
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I'm only negative because the situation is negative. There are no amount of caltrops I, or any other member of the community, could throw down that would compare to the damage of one hour of Google's silence or to the impediment Google has erected before us. Some may grow tired of the noise, others of the silence, to each his own. 
 
Shane

hitsu_g

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Jul 16, 2008, 11:07:52 PM7/16/08
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If the SDK is really final, what is the powers-that-be's reason for
withholding it from the developers that want to still contribute to
Android?
If Android is able to pull a huge "come back" and make the kind of
impression on the mobile market it looked like it well might late last
year, I think the loyal developers that have stuck with Android
despite everything will be well rewarded for having done so, but why
does Google want to make it so hard for people to make that
commitment?

hitsu_g

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Jul 18, 2008, 8:28:16 AM7/18/08
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I am curious why it is taking more than a day for my posts to appear
online now? Is this the same for everyone? It seems to make carrying
on a forum conversation rather awkward (and a very rare forum
experience for me). A few months ago I am sure posts got on in a
matter of minutes...

Mark Murphy

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Jul 18, 2008, 2:10:10 PM7/18/08
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> I am curious why it is taking more than a day for my posts to appear
> online now? Is this the same for everyone? It seems to make carrying
> on a forum conversation rather awkward (and a very rare forum
> experience for me). A few months ago I am sure posts got on in a
> matter of minutes...

What I'm seeing is the occasional trickle of messages, then a whole batch
of them in one shot, some fairly old. For example, your message came in as
a part of a group of nine new ones. I think yesterday I got a flood of
about two dozen all at one time.

I'm not signed up to get individual emails from other Google Groups, so I
have no idea if this is system-wide or what -- anybody know?

--
Mark Murphy (a Commons Guy)
http://commonsware.com

_The Busy Coder's Guide to Android Development_ -- Available Now!


Shane Isbell

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Jul 18, 2008, 3:03:14 PM7/18/08
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"Why is Google launching the Android Developer Challenge? A thriving developer community will be an important part of creating better mobile experiences that delight users around the world. "
 
Was the creation of a thriving developer community the real reason for the ADC? Does anyone feel like we are thriving? I sure don't.
 
Shane
 

efon...@gmail.com

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Jul 22, 2008, 6:42:47 PM7/22/08
to Android Discuss
A really solid next SDK can be a foundation for that thriving
developer community. The ADC was needed to to get the SDK solid.
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