Eastern North American Wolf
Tom Beno
Researchers, using DNA, have discovered a new species of wolf in Canada, one
that continues to evolve
Philip Lee - The Ottawa Citizen
For decades, biologists had been arguing that the wolves in Algonquin Park were
hybrids, a combination of grey wolves and western coyotes. That theory has now
been blown apart by new research that shows they are a separate species -
Adrian Wyld, The Canadian Press
After four years of pioneering scientific investigation, a team of Canadian
wildlife geneticists has rewritten the history of wolves in North America.
The team's findings, published in the December issue of the Canadian Journal of
Zoology, have the potential to revolutionize wolf management policies
throughout North America, including multimillion-dollar wolf reintroduction
programs in the United States and the cross border trade in coyote pelts.
The researchers studied genetic signatures in wolves throughout North America,
and ran DNA tests on specimens of wolves more than a century old, to identify a
new species they call the eastern North American wolf.
This month's publication is pure science, but has political implications on
both sides of the border.
Government must decide what to call the new species. Only two species of wolves
are recognized in the United States: The highly endangered red wolf (canis
rufus) and the grey wolf (canis lupus). The killing of wolves is outlawed in
the U.S., but coyotes (canis latrans) are fair game.
Many of the thousands of animals being killed for their pelts in the U.S. may
in fact be eastern North American wolves.
Bradley White, a biology professor at McMaster University, who led the research
team, said the new research has far-reaching implications, including how the
issue will be treated by the Convention on International Trade in Endangered
Species.
The scientists have proposed that the new species take the Latin name canis
lycaon.
The scientific detective story began in 1996, when John Theberge, a University
of Waterloo ecology professor, who for many years has worked to protect the
wolves in Algonquin Park, asked Dr. White to do some genetic tests to study the
dispersal of males and females in wolf packs. Mr. White runs wildlife DNA
laboratories at McMaster and Trent universities.
The Algonquin wolves, which are smaller than grey wolves and feed mainly on
deer instead of larger animals such as moose or caribou, were believed to be a
grey wolf and coyote hybrid. When Mr. White began to study the genetic patterns
of Algonquin wolves, he expected to find characteristics of grey wolves.
"We weren't finding that signature," he recalls. "This animal was supposed to
be a particular subspecies of grey wolf."
For decades, biologists had been arguing that these animals were hybrids, a
combination of grey wolves and western coyotes. According to this theory, the
Algonquin wolves emerged some time after coyotes started expanding into Eastern
Canada in the early 1900s. If true, the animals still should have been showing
grey wolf genetic signatures.
"We were wracking our brains for a while before we realized that maybe it never
was a grey wolf," Mr. White says.
As they conducted further genetic testing, they realized that the wolves in the
park shared genetic markers with the endangered red wolf found in the
southeastern United States.
Mr. White's team, which included his graduate student Paul Wilson, who runs the
DNA laboratory at Trent University, hypothesized that the wolves in Algonquin
park and throughout the Eastern Seaboard were in fact a separate species of
North American wolf that evolved independently of the grey wolf.
They began searching for historic specimens of wolves that were killed before
western coyotes began to migrate east at the turn of the century. They needed
to find samples of wolf that could not be a grey wolf and coyote hybrid. They
collected samples of hides and teeth from New York, Maine and New Brunswick,
some of them more than a century old.
At the Adirondack Museum in Blue Mountain Lake, New York, they took a sample of
a stuffed wolf that is labelled as the last wolf killed in the Adirondack
Mountains in the late 1800s, before the expansion of the western coyote into
the area. What kind of animal is this museum piece?
"It is an eastern wolf," Mr. White says. "If it was a sub-species of grey wolf,
it should have grey wolf in it. It doesn't have grey wolf in it. That lends
support that the whole of the East Coast of North America had this wolf and it
was not a grey wolf. It was one big population." Mr. White says researchers
believe the red wolf is simply the southern remnant of this wolf.
"Our data supports the fact that it is a real species and that this species was
in fact the dominant wolf from east of the Mississippi, the Gulf Coast north up
to the Great Lakes and St. Lawrence. That was the eastern timber wolf that the
original colonial people would have seen."
The story of the eastern wolf begins one to two million years ago when there
was a common wolf ancestor in North America. Some of these wolves travelled to
Europe and Asia over the land bridge where they evolved independently into the
grey wolf. The wolves that remained in North America evolved into the smaller
eastern North America wolf. About 300,000 years ago, an offshoot of this wolf
evolved into the western coyote.
Also about 300,000 years ago, the grey wolf returned to North America over the
ice bridge.
When European settlers arrived in North America, they began clearing land,
farming and killing wolves. The wolves that survived migrated north into
Canada, a more pristine environment away from the slaughter.
"It's a bit like the Loyalists as I see it, as the Americans were killing so
effectively, basically there was this movement to the north," Mr. White says.
"It's very much a story of North America."
Five hundred years ago, Ontario and Algonquin Park would have been occupied by
grey wolves. North American wolves would have roamed territory south of the
Great Lakes. As Ontario was deforested, the grey wolves migrated north and the
eastern wolves moved in following the expansion of deer herds.
"Our view is that Algonquin Park presently has a wolf in it that has only been
there since 1850 or so, when the park was heavily logged," Mr. White says.
Western coyotes reached Ontario in the early 1900s, and became a larger animal
as it moved eastwards.
"Our genetic data suggests that was a result of the western coyote hybridizing
with the eastern wolf to create the eastern coyote, which is a significantly
larger animal, and that animal moved across southern Ontario, Eastern Ontario
and Quebec, populated New York and the New England states from the north, and
then finished up in New Brunswick and Nova Scotia in the 1950s and 1960s. That
animal has a higher amount of this wolf in it as well."
In North Carolina, the red wolf reintroduction managers are using the Canadian
laboratories to try to protect a pure genetic strain of wolf. The wolves they
have reintroduced to the wild are breeding with coyotes. Biologists are
removing hybrids and coyotes to protect the genetic purity of their endangered
wolves. Mr. White thinks such a program is a mistake and ultimately may be
doomed.
"We're acting as God," he says. "I don't think there's such a thing as pure.
It's very hard to know what's pure and whether it has any meaning. I take a
much more functional view of the world.
"We need top-end predators in these various ecosystems and we need them to be
suitable."
He uses the evolution of the eastern wolves in Algonquin Park to make his
point. There, wolves have been evolving according to changes in the ecosystem.
The wolves on the southeast edge of the park have been breeding with coyotes.
Wolves in the north have been breeding with grey wolves.
"Whether in between that is a more pure one, whatever that may mean, is
anybody's guess," Mr. White says. "We can, from the genetics, show that there
is really one large population that expands from Manitoba, Minnesota,
Wisconsin, Michigan, through Ontario and Quebec. That population is exchanging
genes among themselves. There is an evolution going on.
"I view this as a wonderful kind of reflection of Canadian biodiversity, in
that we've got three species that have put their genes into the mix. We've got
a landscape that's been heavily impacted by humans and we're watching how this
might unfold."
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/national/001217/5030560.html
vzn05ze0
Tom Beno wrote:
> North America's lone wolf unmasked
>
> Researchers, using DNA, have discovered a new species of wolf in Canada, one
> that continues to evolve
>
> Philip Lee - The Ottawa Citizen
>
> For decades, biologists had been arguing that the wolves in Algonquin Park were
> hybrids, a combination of grey wolves and western coyotes. That theory has now
> been blown apart by new research that shows they are a separate species -
> Adrian Wyld, The Canadian Press
>
> After four years of pioneering scientific investigation, a team of Canadian
> wildlife geneticists has rewritten the history of wolves in North America.
>
Perfect example as to why the NON Native wolves from Canada are destroying our
native wolf populations in the lower 48 states.
Totally absurd to think that a wolf that is 20-40 lbs heavier would mate with a
Native wolf in the lower 48 states instead of killing them.
You finally posted something worth while ferry, I just hope you reread it a few
times.
Terry Rudd
entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not mean
just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way away from
you).
The gray wolves in Montana and Idaho and Wyoming are exactly the same species as the
ones in Alberta and BC. End of story. Either find the damned DNA evidence to prove
otherwise or shut up about it!
You still live by way of, "Truth is arrived at by repeated assertion". This is how
grade school children win arguments, not adults Grow up!
TRudd
vzn05ze0
Terry Rudd wrote:
> This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in the west. This is
> entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not mean
> just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way away from
> you).
>
> The gray wolves in Montana and Idaho and Wyoming are exactly the same species as the
> ones in Alberta and BC. End of story. Either find the damned DNA evidence to prove
> otherwise or shut up about it!
>
> You still live by way of, "Truth is arrived at by repeated assertion". This is how
> grade school children win arguments, not adults Grow up!
>
> TRudd
This is an OUT RIGHT LIE TERRY...!
Canadian Wolves are not even close to the same as the wolves in the lower 48 states and
there is no difference between turning hybrid wolves loose in the lower 48 than turning
NON Native Canadian wolves loose in the lower 48 states.
SO GROW UP TERRY AND START TELLING THE TRUTH..!!!!!
As for you acting like a child that would explain your problem with telling the truth
and making up lies about wolves...!!!!!!
Floyd Davidson
>Terry Rudd wrote:
>
>> This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in
>> the west. This is entirely about eastern wolves (just to be
>> sure you understand, east does not mean just east of you- it
>> means eastern North America. That is a long long way away
>> from you).
>>
>> The gray wolves in Montana and Idaho and Wyoming are exactly
>> the same species as the ones in Alberta and BC. End of
>> story. Either find the damned DNA evidence to prove
>> otherwise or shut up about it!
>>
>> You still live by way of, "Truth is arrived at by repeated
>> assertion". This is how grade school children win arguments,
>> not adults Grow up!
>>
>> TRudd
>
>This is an OUT RIGHT LIE TERRY...!
Yes, that is what he said. Practically everything you say is an
outright lie, including this:
>Canadian Wolves are not even close to the same as the wolves in
>the lower 48 states and there is no difference between turning
>hybrid wolves loose in the lower 48 than turning NON Native
>Canadian wolves loose in the lower 48 states.
>
>SO GROW UP TERRY AND START TELLING THE TRUTH..!!!!!
He must be a lot older than you if truth is how we measure age
around here!
>As for you acting like a child that would explain your problem
>with telling the truth and making up lies about wolves...!!!!!!
So what keeps *you* from ever telling the truth?
--
Floyd L. Davidson <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) fl...@barrow.com
vzn05ze0
Floyd Davidson wrote:
>
> >SO GROW UP TERRY AND START TELLING THE TRUTH..!!!!!
>
> He must be a lot older than you if truth is how we measure age
> around here!
I must be older than you too Floyd, seeing as how you live in the City
and dream about Alaska.!
> >As for you acting like a child that would explain your problem
> >with telling the truth and making up lies about wolves...!!!!!!
>
> So what keeps *you* from ever telling the truth?
I always tell the truth unlike you, City Boy Floyd, And I don't lie
about where i live unlike you do..!!!!
> Floyd L. Davidson <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
> Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) fl...@barrow.com
Now have a good day and start being truthful yourself.
Floyd Davidson
>Floyd Davidson wrote:
>
>>
>> >SO GROW UP TERRY AND START TELLING THE TRUTH..!!!!!
>>
>> He must be a lot older than you if truth is how we measure age
>> around here!
>
>I must be older than you too Floyd, seeing as how you live in the City
>and dream about Alaska.!
I'm a grandfather, you are clearly a whining baby.
>> >As for you acting like a child that would explain your problem
>> >with telling the truth and making up lies about wolves...!!!!!!
>>
>> So what keeps *you* from ever telling the truth?
>
>I always tell the truth unlike you, City Boy Floyd, And I don't lie
>about where i live unlike you do..!!!!
But you just lied about where I live. Twice in the same post!
>Now have a good day and start being truthful yourself.
So when are you going to stop lying?
And when are we going to be able to laugh about where you
think I live? You still won't tell anybody... because
you *know* it is in fact right here in down town BARROW! At the
TOP of the WORLD.
Now, buzz of you little cretin.
--
Aozotorp
>
>This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in the west. This
>is
>entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not
>mean
>just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way
>away from
>you).
>
>The gray wolves in Montana and Idaho and Wyoming are exactly the same species
>as the
>ones in Alberta and BC. End of story. Either find the damned DNA evidence
>to prove
>otherwise or shut up about it!
>
>You still live by way of, "Truth is arrived at by repeated assertion". This
>is how
>grade school children win arguments, not adults Grow up!
>
>TRudd
We all know Russ can not read for content!
Jessie
vzn05ze0 wrote:
> Terry Rudd wrote:
>
> > This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in the west. This is
> > entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not mean
> > just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way away from
> > you).
> >
> ><Snip>
> > TRudd
>
> This is an OUT RIGHT LIE TERRY...!
??? No. Read the article again. It's about wolves in the Algonquin park area
of Ontario. That's thousands of kilometers from Idaho and Montana. The
findings presented in the article have few implications for the wolves in Western
North America.
>
> Canadian Wolves are not even close to the same as the wolves in the lower 48 states and
Not even close? That's a little far fetched. For one thing, Canada and the United
States are, well, right next to each other, and several radio collared wolves have traveled
between the two countries. Historically, wolves living along what is
now the border between the two countries have drifted between Canada and
the U.S. - populations of wolves in western Canada and the NW United States have not been
sufficiently isolated from each other for a long enough time to make
them completely different from each other. Wolves in the far North (Alaska and
the Territories) may be a bit larger and stockier than ones further south, (on
average) but to say that wolves in Western Canada and the Northwestern U.S.
are "not even close" is an exaggeration.
>
> there is no difference between turning hybrid wolves loose in the lower 48 than turning
Okay. So, what makes you think that the wolves that were released in
Yellowstone and central Idaho are hybrids? What kind of hybrid? Those wolves, as you know,
came from central Alberta and B.C. There's no evidence that any
wolves there have mated with dogs or coyotes, so they probably aren't hybrids.
-Jessie.
>
>
>
Terry Rudd
Jessie wrote:
> vzn05ze0 wrote:
>
> > Terry Rudd wrote:
> >
> > > This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in the west. This is
> > > entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not mean
> > > just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way away from
> > > you).
> > >
>
> > ><Snip>
>
> > > TRudd
> >
> > This is an OUT RIGHT LIE TERRY...!
>
> ??? No. Read the article again. It's about wolves in the Algonquin park area
> of Ontario. That's thousands of kilometers from Idaho and Montana. The
> findings presented in the article have few implications for the wolves in Western
> North America.
He still won't get it.
> > Canadian Wolves are not even close to the same as the wolves in the lower 48 states and
>
> Not even close? That's a little far fetched. For one thing, Canada and the United
> States are, well, right next to each other, and several radio collared wolves have traveled
> between the two countries. Historically, wolves living along what is
> now the border between the two countries have drifted between Canada and
> the U.S. - populations of wolves in western Canada and the NW United States have not been
> sufficiently isolated from each other for a long enough time to make
> them completely different from each other. Wolves in the far North (Alaska and
> the Territories) may be a bit larger and stockier than ones further south, (on
> average) but to say that wolves in Western Canada and the Northwestern U.S.
> are "not even close" is an exaggeration.
I have tried to have this same discussion with Russ but he has no clue about genetics so the
distinction between slight derivation between populations of the same species and species
differentiation is lost on him- I gave up! Even asking him the simple question of showing us
they are a different animals (aka species) causes these boughts of irrational histrionics, with
no effort to even support his arguement. He simply states it with larger fonts and bolder
letters as though that is definitive enough.
> > there is no difference between turning hybrid wolves loose in the lower 48 than turning
>
> Okay. So, what makes you think that the wolves that were released in
> Yellowstone and central Idaho are hybrids? What kind of hybrid? Those wolves, as you know,
> came from central Alberta and B.C. There's no evidence that any
> wolves there have mated with dogs or coyotes, so they probably aren't hybrids.
I think his point was that Canadian grays are as different from his mythical natives as they
are from hybrids. More nonsense with no basis in science or reality. Typical Russ :-)
Terry
>
>
> -Jessie.
>
> >
> >
> >
Jessie
Terry Rudd wrote:
>
>
> I have tried to have this same discussion with Russ but he has no clue about genetics so the
> distinction between slight derivation between populations of the same species and species
> differentiation is lost on him- I gave up! Even asking him the simple question of showing us
> they are a different animals (aka species) causes these boughts of irrational histrionics, with
> no effort to even support his arguement. He simply states it with larger fonts and bolder
> letters as though that is definitive enough.
Yeah, I've noticed. I'm not even sure why I tried explaining it - I fully expect
him to tell me I'm a liar, or a communist hippie or something like that. Oh well.
Jessie
vzn05ze0
Jessie wrote:
Truth of the matter is that Native wolves and NON Native wolves do cross the border of Canada
and USA but NOT the wolves they are introducing from the far north in Alberta or etc. of
Canada.
They are not the same wolves and the Canadian wolves in the far north DO NOT MIX with wolves on
the Canadian border either.
So you are wrong again, Keep trying however....!
vzn05ze0
Aozotorp wrote:
> >
> >
> >This article has absolutely nothing to do with gray wolves in the west. This
> >is
> >entirely about eastern wolves (just to be sure you understand, east does not
> >mean
> >just east of you- it means eastern North America. That is a long long way
> >away from
> >you).
> >
> >The gray wolves in Montana and Idaho and Wyoming are exactly the same species
> >as the
> >ones in Alberta and BC. End of story. Either find the damned DNA evidence
> >to prove
> >otherwise or shut up about it!
> >
> >You still live by way of, "Truth is arrived at by repeated assertion". This
> >is how
> >grade school children win arguments, not adults Grow up!
> >
> >TRudd
>
> We all know Russ can not read for content!
It just blows your mind that I keep pointing out the truth about the NON Native
wolves and pointing out that your lies are NOT going to cut it any more and that
local people in the Northwest have had enough of your lies and we are going to get
rid of the NON Native wolves, end of story.
We have already won the battle when it comes to more introductions by the US FWS
but it will take a while untill you understand why and stop your crying about it.
Terry Rudd
vzn05ze0 wrote:
<snip for brevity>
Russ, I will give you that there is discernible genetic variation between the wolves from Alberta
and the wolves that used to inhabit the western US (lower 48). But it doesn't make them non-native
because the differences you are so upset about are well within the normal genetic variability of
the species. I am sure there was likely similar genetic disparity between wolves in different
parts of Idaho, Montana and Wyoming 80 years ago but of course I cannot prove this since they were
essentially exterminated before we had statistically valid samples of their code.
So calling them "Non-Native" is still for effect and not biologically valid. The genetic
differentiation that you refer to is similar to the differences one will notice in geographically
dispersed populations of nearly any species of animal with genetic variability as a normal
occurrence for its code. Consider an extreme example being the North American brown bear, where
some adults might weigh only 300 pounds and others in Alaska can hit well over 1000 lbs. They are
still the same species of animal.
These geographic changes are largely driven by local variability in the animal's environs,
including their food sources. Local characteristics can apply reproductive pressure favoring
specimens of the local population, which code for one or more trait(s) within normal genetic
variation. Over time, all other things equivalent, the population will show this trait as
dominant, even while the animals remains a member of the same genus and species.
So consider your "fact" that these are non-natives that were dispersed into the three states,
where historically local environs favored smaller lighter gray wolves. If those environmental
conditions still exist in a statistically relevant way, then over time as gray wolf populations
mature and approach carrying capacity of the areas we allow them to live, it is possible that
smaller and lighter wolves will be the ones that once again bred and pass on that trait either
because the larger ones cannot live well enough or long enough to reproduce in numbers enough to
remain dominant.
Terry.
Jessie
vzn05ze0 wrote:
>
> Truth of the matter is that Native wolves and NON Native wolves do cross the border of Canada
> and USA but NOT the wolves they are introducing from the far north in Alberta or etc. of
> Canada.
> They are not the same wolves and the Canadian wolves in the far north DO NOT MIX with wolves on
> the Canadian border either.
> So you are wrong again, Keep trying however....!
They don't usually directly mix with wolves in the Northwestern United States. They rarely do,
though, as the odd wolf from central Canada has ended up in the states, though I don't think that's
common. However, even though wolf populations in the southern and northern rockies are
reproductively isolated to a degree, alleles from central-Western Canadian wolves can still
introgress into wolf populations further south, which results in the two populations being rather
similar genetically. Individual wolves and wolf packs often travel over an enormous range
throughout their lives - some radiocollared wolves in the rockies have been found over 1000 km
from their natal areas. Wolf packs are often capable of travelling over 60 km in one 24 hour
period. So, historically, wolves from North-central B.C. and Alberta could mix with ones a few
hundred km south, and those wolves could mix with ones in southern BC and AB, and those wolves
could breed with ones in the US. Hence, alleles (ie. different copies of genes) from wolves in
North-central BC and AB can end up in wolf populations further south in the rockies. The
populations just aren't distinct enough genetically to be considered separate species or
subspecies. The slight size difference that exists, on average, between the two populations is
simply a result of the normal genetic variation that exists in a species - Terry's post explained
that rather well.
-Jessie.
vzn05ze0
Terry Rudd wrote:
> vzn05ze0 wrote:
>
> <snip for brevity>
>
> Russ, I will give you that there is discernible genetic variation between the wolves from Alberta
> and the wolves that used to inhabit the western US (lower 48). But it doesn't make them non-native
> because the differences you are so upset about are well within the normal genetic variability of the
> species.
Fact of the matter is that they are so far apart that the Canadian wolves are destroying any resembles
of Native wolves by killing or native population of wolves and NOT mixing with them at all.
People like you are responsible for just being stupid with thinking that the introduction of a NON
Native species would work and then turn around and say they and the same wolves we always had.
vzn05ze0
You are an out right LIAR, The native wolves NEVER mix with Canadian wolves that have been introduced
into the lower 48 and they have always killed and destroyed any resemblance of our native wolves.
Terry Rudd
letting that temper your ability to show nonsense about it but he FACT remains, you have no clue what you
are talking about. Moreover, you have on many occasions, made it clear that you hate all wolves. Your
only interest in this "difference" at all is strictly to create FUD about the wolves in general, thinking
that others are as stupid as you and will rally to save your "Native wolves". It is clearly nonsense
and I am clearly wasting my time with you but you are the deceptive liar here Russ.
TRudd
vzn05ze0
I refuse to let you lie to the people of this great country to promote your road closures and etc.
Wayne
> Fact of the matter is that they are so far apart that the Canadian wolves are destroying any resembles
> of Native wolves by killing or native population of wolves and NOT mixing with them at all.
Provide one shred of evidence of this. Even a shard. A sliver. A shadow.
A carcass would be most helpful. You cant. You wont. End subject. Troll.
Wayne
Jessie
vzn05ze0 wrote:
> Jessie:
> You are an out right LIAR, The native wolves NEVER mix with Canadian wolves that have been introduced
> into the lower 48 and they have always killed and destroyed any resemblance of our native wolves.
I don't even think you understood a word of what I was trying to say to you. Also, do you know why wolves
were reintroduced into Idaho? Because the wolves there were essentially wiped out. So, of course the
Canadian wolves don't mix with your "native" ones - there are not any "native" ones for them to mix with!
Also, I, and others, have told you why the wolves of the Northwest U.S. are not distinct enough, either
morphologically or genetically, to be considered separate species or even subspecies from Canadian ones.
The best counter- argument you can come up with is "LIAR!" Sorry, that
doesn't, and will never, convince me or anyone that you are correct or
even know what you're talking about. Come up with some facts or theories
that show that the wolves are drastically different and that I'm a liar. I bet that you can't.
Jessie.
>
>
vzn05ze0
Wayne wrote:
> Provide one shred of evidence of this. Even a shard. A sliver. A shadow.
> A carcass would be most helpful. You cant. You wont. End subject. Troll.
>
> Wayne
Gee Wayne: How many carcasses would you like.
They have plenty of native wolf carcasses that have been killed by NON NATIVE wolves.
You went and fell in your poop hole again Wayne.
Wayne
>
> Wayne wrote:
>
> > Provide one shred of evidence of this. Even a shard. A sliver. A shadow.
> > A carcass would be most helpful. You cant. You wont. End subject. Troll.
> >
> > Wayne
>
> Gee Wayne: How many carcasses would you like.
> They
Who are they
>have plenty of native wolf carcasses that have been killed by NON NATIVE wolves
All I asked was for you to produce one. If "they" have many, one should
be no problem. But neither they nor you have one.
Wayne
vzn05ze0
Jessie wrote:
Our Native wolves were making a come back until assholes like you start Introducing NON Native wolves that
have virtually destroyed any capability of the return to nature.
GO TAKE YOUR LIES SOMEWHERE ELSE LOOSER!!!!!
Floyd Davidson
So, tell us where even one of those is located. Provide
a cite that can be verified. As Wayne said, you can't.
vzn05ze0
Try the Yellow Stone park web page, hey you got the idea now don't you.
As for you Floyd, Get your boy friend out of your mouth before you start typing
please.
Jessie
vzn05ze0 wrote:
>
> Our Native wolves were making a come back until assholes like you start Introducing NON Native wolves that
> have virtually destroyed any capability of the return to nature.
> GO TAKE YOUR LIES SOMEWHERE ELSE LOOSER!!!!!
"Looser"?! LOL!!!! So, I guess when you can't defend your viewpoint,
you start calling people silly names. Great. Also, I
personally didn't reintroduce any wolves anywhere, and had nothing
to do with the reintroduction,.
Jessie.