Reading Joe Bangert and the Winter Soldier Follies 03
Lee P.
We now come to where the rubber meets the road. The actual testimony
of one Joe Bangert in front of the Winter Soldier Follies.
Think back to that day long ago when you disembarked from your ship or
stepped off the ladder from the plane and set foot on Vietnam for the
first time.
Think back to those first hours in-country. What were your
impressions, your experiences?
All will pale in front of the first day of Joe Bangert's Vietnam! Joe
saw savagery and wanton murder before most of us were out of
in-processing!
Oh, the humanity!
********************
MODERATOR. Mr. Bangert, there's an incident here where you found
crucified bodies hanging on barbed wire fences and in the same
incident you witnessed South Vietnamese civilians shot without
provocation on Highway 1. Could you go into this and kind of see how
they are related?
BANGERT. I can cover a couple of these at the same time. The first day
I got to Vietnam I landed in Da Nang Air Base. From Da Nang Air Base I
took a plane to Dong Ha. I got off the plane and hitchhiked on Highway
1 to my unit. I was picked up by a truckload of grunt Marines with two
company grade officers, 1st Lts.; we were about 5 miles down the road,
where there were some Vietnamese children at the gateway of the
village and they gave the old finger gesture at us. It was
understandable that they picked this up from the GIs there. They
stopped the trucks--they didn't stop the truck, they slowed down a
little bit, and it was just like response, the guys got up, including
the lieutenants, and just blew all the kids away. There were about
five or six kids blown away and then the truck just continued down the
hill. That was my first day in Vietnam.
******************
I became intrigued with this right from his first sentence.
The Army had personnel and movement controls in place (for the most
part) that caught incoming personnel and ran them through processing
of paperwork, issuance of weapons, equipment, review of Geneva & Hague
Conventions, non-combat dangers such as bar girls and malaria, etc.,
before shipping the new warfighter off to his Divisional or Brigade
unit. As I recall most folks ended up staying at least one night in
Can Ranh Bay or Saigon or Freedom Hill in Danang before shipping out.
Did the Marines instead just let you get off one plane and onto
another and pick your own destination? For most Army guys the orders
we left the States with had nothing to do with the unit we ended up
assigned to -- as Personnel told me, the orders were just to get you
over there, and they'd decide where you went once you were there.
Alas, we don't want to get caught up in the small lies, there are so
many big ones!
Moving on, Mr Bangert hitchhikes up Highway 1 with a truckload of
grunts and two company grade officers. Five miles down the road he
can't decide if they stopped the truck or didn't stop the truck to
murder five or six kids ... all of them including the officers just
mowed them down. Except, of course, our boy Bangert....though I'm not
sure as he doesn't account for his own actions at that moment. Did he
simply watch as an "audience?" Did he fire along with experienced
grunts and officers?
I don't know about you, dear reader, but my own memories of being
given the finger by kids in Vietnam was that we laughed like hell at
them; the worst thing we threw at them was Ham & Limas.
But here we have a truckload of grunts and officers, stopping (or not
stopping) and having a Mad Minute on the tykes.
I have to admit that I'm having trouble suspending disbelief for this
one.
But allowing this tall tale to stand for a moment, let's consider what
happened next.
Next? Why, there is no next! We are left to assume that Bangert made
it to his unit that first day. We are also left to assume that Mr.
Bangert was pleased and comfortable with his experience on that
truckload of grunts and officers.
Which raises a question about the Winter Soldier Follies: Why didn't
anyone ask the question, "What did you do about it?
As a matter of fact, that question is conspicously absent throughout
the testimony. Bangert apparently did nothing, and that's just okay by
the WS Follies.
What do you think?
--
------------------------
To write me, remember NO-EL in the addy
Jim Elbrecht
-snip-
>The Army had personnel and movement controls in place (for the most
>part) that caught incoming personnel and ran them through processing
>of paperwork, issuance of weapons, equipment, review of Geneva & Hague
>Conventions, non-combat dangers such as bar girls and malaria, etc.,
>before shipping the new warfighter off to his Divisional or Brigade
>unit.
Bad memory alert! But. . . .
As I remember it we [Marines June1969] didn't get anything but orders
before we reached our Bn. I *think* I touched down in Danang in the
morning, and was on Hill 55 with 2/1 by sundown. I remember a long
line of Marines going up to a desk set up outside under a tarp.
The clerk handed you some orders and said-- 'Go get on that truck--
they're headed in that direction. I rode in the back of a 6-by with
maybe 20 other Marines who were headed to someplace between wherever I
was and wherever I was going. There were only 3 or 4 of us boots on
the truck. The rest were moving around in country, or coming back
from R&R. Finally the truck parked and the driver said something
like "Last stop-- anybody going to Hill 55 [I'm not even sure it was
hill 55], wait for the driver of this jeep to get back-- he's headed
there." I think it was at some checkpoint on Highway 1, because I
remember the road was tarred-- but I don't remember if it was a
villein, or a checkpoint or a base. Finally the driver showed up,
said it was getting dark so we had to hurry, and 3 or 4 of us finished
the trip to 2/1. On the last leg I was the only new guy-- so the
other 2 or 3 had weapons...
-snip-
>Which raises a question about the Winter Soldier Follies: Why didn't
>anyone ask the question, "What did you do about it?
That's kind of what I was wondering. The only thing familiar in
his testimony is the efficiency[?] with which the Marines got fresh
troops to their units.
We got orientation in the states, spent a few days on Okinawa-- and
[according to the Bn logs] were afforded more orientation after being
assigned, but I don't recall any in-country orientation. [which could
well be my faulty memory, and not a lack of attending the classes]
Jim
Nigel Brooks
"Lee P." <friart...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9dc3i...@enews4.newsguy.com...
My first day in Vietnam - By Nigel Brooks
August 16, 1966 - Arrived Tan Son Nhut courtesy of World Airways
Loaded onto green Army buses with mesh over windows and taken to the 90th
Replacement Battalion - Camp Alpha - Long Binh. Surprised as hell that
no-one was shooting at me (I'd seen the Sands of Iwo Jima about four weeks
previously).
Processed in given Rogers Rangers card and other associated stuff, told
about the bennie of being able to write home for free. Found duffle bag
thrown in with other bags in tent - don't remember if I was assigned a tent
to sleep in or not.
Spent next three days making formations and dodging work details. Took
shower in rain cause the stuff they trucked in was all gone.
Wondered how a canvas blivet could hold drinking water without leaking,
wondered why in the hell they were allowing the Vietnamese to walk around
.the camp.
Got picked up by unit and rode in the back of a duece and a half waving at
the pretty Vietnamese girls on their hondas. Never saw one crucified
person in the 5 years I stayed there
Nigel Brooks
Lee P.
"Jim Elbrecht" <elbr...@email.com> wrote in message
news:qmkjft45ujg3p5too...@4ax.com...
> "Lee P." <friart...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> said it was getting dark so we had to hurry, and 3 or 4 of us
finished
> the trip to 2/1. On the last leg I was the only new guy-- so the
> other 2 or 3 had weapons...
I take it from your comments that you did *not* get the finger from
some kids and proceed to light them up. Funny, neither did I when I
was in transit to and from my units...or any other time.
I wonder...did Joe pull the trigger? Or did he settle for just not
squealing?
Bill Clarke
Nigel Brooks <nbr...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:u2nK6.907$Vr3....@eagle.america.net...
>
> Never saw one crucified person in the 5 years I stayed there
>
> Nigel Brooks
>
You ever see one skinned Nigel? Naw, me either but I’d like to hear more
about that one. Hot damn! I bet that story was a big hit in the bar that
night.
Bill Clarke
F Troop, 17th Cav
Jim Elbrecht
>I take it from your comments that you did *not* get the finger from
>some kids and proceed to light them up.
Well, I did get the finger from VN kids. Usually with a smile, and
sometimes with a 'Fuck the war'. On the whole, though, I think they
were treated better than the little Mexican kids picking the dump by
the pedestrian bridge into Tiajuanna.[sp?]
The 'cruci-fiction' thing is a real puzzler, though. I thought I'd
talked to some pretty imaginative BS'ers in my day--- but this is the
first I've ever heard of that one.
> Funny, neither did I when I
> was in transit to and from my units...or any other time.
> I wonder...did Joe pull the trigger? Or did he settle for just not
> squealing?
Either way he'd be guilty. I'm assuming the terms were 'tell us
anything, we won't prosecute you'. Was anyone ever charged with
anything as a result of that circus?
Jim
[and also-- for the record. Like Klann's recollections, I don't
deny -or care- that Bangert actually 'remembers' this stuff. I just
question whether it actually happened.]
pmartin
make formation, after all if you were leaving Alpha it was posted
anyway. If you did not get assigned then they gave the rest
some crummy job to do.
I seen a guy from school doing KP, I never got caught !
Even in Basic I took the towel down and put on some fat guys
bed..no KP for me ! Poor guy, bet he would hunt me down and kill
me if he knew it was me.
Hey kept yelling " why me again! " "why ?" " I'm the only one
you pick on for KP ! "
Thanks for that memory, I forgot all about that. <bseg>
Nigel Brooks <nbr...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:u2nK6.907$Vr3....@eagle.america.net...
>
Perry
I tried that, the missing formations and all it got me was an Art 15
which gave me 7 days extra duty and a forfeiture of $25.00 out of my
pay. Some First Sergeants got real strange when you decided not to
attend their formations.
On Sat, 12 May 2001 19:02:46 GMT, "pmartin" <pma...@adelphia.net>
wrote:
pmartin
I found it easy, I think at my time there were so
many they could never keep track of all of us.
I got my assignment before the others from my class,
I had my duffle and told them I was being sent HOME
as they had too many 67N20s, the 1st Inf. was leaving early then.
Blew allot of minds, but I knew where I was headed before
time. If only you could of seen their eyes !
I was segregated from them in the first place with the 5th.
Then Nah Trang - Pleiku later Kontum City.
' skeeters at Nah Trang tried to fly me to N. Vietnam !
I guess I just like a sick joke.
Perry <pma...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:d9arftsh3jpmeaees...@4ax.com...