Meaning of "Ansatz"
Don Wilkins
There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
article.
Suggestions will be welcome to settle a small wager.
Thomas Baetzler
Don Wilkins (dwil...@orion.polaristel.net) wrote:
: There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
: German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
: article.
The ones I immediately came up with were "starting point" and
"attempt of a solution". The Collins bilingual dictionary discards
"attempt", but suggests in addition "approach" which looks much better
than my own feeble attempts. This is of course stipulated under the
assumption that you talk about a particular way to solve a (esp.
mathematical) problem.
Since you did not give any context, there's always the outside chance
that "Ansatz" refers to a liquid that has been prepared in the course
of an experiment - that would be a noun derived from the verb "ansetzen"
(to prepare). In that case preparation or solution should be suitable
translations. Howeve, this would be a highly unconventional usage from
my POV. German chemists should know better than to write like that -
if they're not out to get a job with the government, that is >:)
Hope this helps,
--
Thomas Baetzler, bath...@fh-karlsruhe.de, t...@spectre.ka.sub.org
<A HREF="http://www.fh-karlsruhe.de/~bath0011/"> thb's homepage </A>
This product has been cruelly tested on cute little furry animals.
Martin Rathgeber
Don Wilkins (dwil...@orion.polaristel.net) wrote:
: There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
: German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
: article.
: Suggestions will be welcome to settle a small wager.
Why don't you post the whole sentence?
That might help...
martin.
--
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Don Wilkins
On 17 Oct 1996 03:40:40 GMT, go...@tezcat.com (Martin Rathgeber)
wrote:
>Don Wilkins (dwil...@orion.polaristel.net) wrote:
>: There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
>: German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
>: article.
>:
>: Suggestions will be welcome to settle a small wager.
>
>Why don't you post the whole sentence?
>That might help...
My apologies I have made the same objection in other circumstances. My
feeble excuse is that I did not want to influence any responses.
It is a procedure for analyzing the iron content of barium carbonate.
A standard procedure is given for this analysis which uses 10 grams of
sample. The following sentence is at the end of the first paragraph:
Wenn nach dem Aufloesen Fe-Partikel gefunden werden, muss die
Fe-Bestimmung "Ansatz gross" (siehe unten) durchgefuehrt werden.
The procedure continues to give the various steps necessary to
complete the analysis. (For the non-chemists "Fe-Partikel" refers to
iron particles. In other words stuff that didn't dissolve.)
So what happens is that the sample didn't dissolve completely and
there are some sediments present so it is necessary to take a larger
sample in order to be certain that the sample contains a
representative amount of the sediments.
The next line has the following title:
Eisenbestimmung "Ansatz gross"
At this point a 50 gram sample is taken and the procedure continues.
It is obvious what they have done and why they did it. The question is
How does one translate "Ansatz gross" under these circumstances.
Thanks for the replies and again my apology for not providing the
context.
SIGRID BORCHERT
In this context I would translate "Ansatz" as "sediment".
Therefore "Ansatz gross" would mean "large amount of sediment".
Does that make sense? I am not a chemist.
Sigrid
Christian Weisgerber
dwil...@orion.polaristel.net (Don Wilkins) writes:
> There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
> German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
> article.
If you want to know what it actually means in the given context rather
than a list of dictionary definition, you need to quote the paragraph
where it appears.
--
Christian 'naddy' Weisgerber na...@mips.pfalz.de
See another pointless homepage at <URL:http://home.pages.de/~naddy/>.
Gerald Masan
In article <326c64f4...@news.polaristel.net>,
dwil...@orion.polaristel.net says...
>Fe-Bestimmung "Ansatz gross" (siehe unten) durchgefuehrt werden.
It appears to me, that there has to be a line "Ansatz klein".
This "Ansatz klein" is annother way of doing the same, but with
something less.
Or:
"Ansatz gross" required a visible iron sediment
the imaginary
"Ansatz klein" will work for invisible iron contained,
Gerald
Thomas Baetzler
[reposted because it seems to have gotten lost...]
SBO...@concentric.net (SIGRID BORCHERT) wrote:
:Don Wilkins wrote:
:> On 17 Oct 1996 03:40:40 GMT, go...@tezcat.com (Martin Rathgeber)
:> wrote:
:> Wenn nach dem Aufloesen Fe-Partikel gefunden werden, muss die
:> Fe-Bestimmung "Ansatz gross" (siehe unten) durchgefuehrt werden.
:>
:> The procedure continues to give the various steps necessary to
:> complete the analysis. (For the non-chemists "Fe-Partikel" refers to
:> iron particles. In other words stuff that didn't dissolve.)
:>
:> So what happens is that the sample didn't dissolve completely and
:> there are some sediments present so it is necessary to take a larger
:> sample in order to be certain that the sample contains a
:> representative amount of the sediments.
:>
:> The next line has the following title:
:>
:> Eisenbestimmung "Ansatz gross"
:In this context I would translate "Ansatz" as "sediment".
:Therefore "Ansatz gross" would mean "large amount of sediment".
:Does that make sense? I am not a chemist.
I'm not a chemist either, but I still claim that "Ansatz" in this case
would be derived from "ansetzen". A sediment in this context would be
something like "Ausflockung", "Ablagerung", "(Boden-)Satz" or
"ungel\"ste Reste".
In my opinion, "Grosser Ansatz" could be circumscribed as "preparation
using a large sample" in contrast to the description of how to set up the
analysis for small quantities of the sample ("kleiner Ansatz"?).
Whether "preparation" is actually the right word is up for grabs. My
Longman's DCE lists preparation (4): "something that is made ready for
use by mixing a number of (chemical) substances." In my opinion this
would be a description of the noun to the verb "ansetzen". Actual chemists
might use a different term, though.
Cheers,
Thomas Baetzler, bath...@fh-karlsruhe.de, t...@spectre.ka.sub.org
--
Any great truth can --- and eventually will --- be expressed as a cliche
--- a cliche is a sure and certain way to dilute an idea. For instance,
my grandmother used to say, "The black cat is always the last one off
the fence." I have no idea what she meant, but at one time, it was
undoubtedly true.
--- Solomon Short
Sigrid Borchert
You may well be right. If they had said "Grossansatz" there would have
been no doubt.
Sigrid (Gruss an Karlsruhe - es war fuer 2 Jahre meine Heimat.)
Achim Recktenwald
> >: There is a minor disagreement on the translation of "Ansatz" from
> >: German to English. The usage is actually in an analytical chemistry
> >: article.
> >: Suggestions will be welcome to settle a small wager.
> >
> >Why don't you post the whole sentence?
> >That might help...
> My apologies I have made the same objection in other circumstances. My
> feeble excuse is that I did not want to influence any responses.
>
> It is a procedure for analyzing the iron content of barium carbonate.
> A standard procedure is given for this analysis which uses 10 grams of
> sample. The following sentence is at the end of the first paragraph:
>
> Fe-Bestimmung "Ansatz gross" (siehe unten) durchgefuehrt werden.
>
> The procedure continues to give the various steps necessary to
> complete the analysis. (For the non-chemists "Fe-Partikel" refers to
> iron particles. In other words stuff that didn't dissolve.)
>
> So what happens is that the sample didn't dissolve completely and
> there are some sediments present so it is necessary to take a larger
> sample in order to be certain that the sample contains a
> representative amount of the sediments.
>
> The next line has the following title:
>
> Eisenbestimmung "Ansatz gross"
>
> It is obvious what they have done and why they did it. The question is
> How does one translate "Ansatz gross" under these circumstances.
>
> Thanks for the replies and again my apology for not providing the
> context.
In this case I would translate it with 'method' or 'procedure'; e.g.,
'large-scale Fe-determination method' or 'Fe-determination, large-scale
procedure'
Achim