is if

[GG]

"The only way of getting out is if the council decides to order the door
opened."

"is if": strictly informal?

Thanks.

[contrex]

On Sunday, November 11, 2012 1:42:25 PM UTC, GG wrote:

> "is if": strictly informal?

No, not really. A bit modern, maybe.

In the epigraph to Joe Wenderoth's new volume of poetry, a herdsman, exhorted by Oedipus to speak the truth, replies "It is if I speak that I will be destroyed."

"Given the vote and the leading in the polls in Ohio, the only way he can lose is if people are prevented from casting their ballots"

(Howard Dean www.realclearpolitics.com)

Report: Only Way Nation Will Pay Attention To Climate Change Is If Julia Roberts Dies In Hurricane (http://thinkprogress.org)

[Whiskers]

Very.

"No unauthorised exit" would be the formal notice. Or even "No exit", to
avoid any possibility of doubt.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

[Guy Barry]

"GG" wrote in message news:k7o9vu$2h5$1...@speranza.aioe.org...

> "The only way of getting out is if the council decides to order the door
> opened."

> "is if": strictly informal?

No, not at all. Here are some similar examples from the BNC:

"They often get left on the shelf, and the only way they can be sold is if
the price is reduced."
"The only way people will trust me is if I give them a signed piece of paper
with my address on."
"Your only chance of living is if you do what I say."
"The only way that's going to happen is if it looks like a professional West
End production. "

Nor does the subordinate clause need to be introduced by "if", e.g.:

"The only time I change the colour of my make-up is when I have a tan."

--
Guy Barry

[Eric Walker]

I am ill at ease over this "is if", and that last analogy only makes me
more nervous. That last is analogous to the simpler "The time is now."
I do not think either is parallel to the "is if" constructions.

"If" (in the sense "should it be the case that") clauses want an explicit
or implicit "then" clause, even if the word "then" is elided:

If he unlocks the door, [then] we can get out.

If the order of the clauses is inverted, idiom always omits the "then"--

We can get out if he unlocks the door.

--unless it is in question form:

Then we can get out if he unlocks the door?

In the OP's example, and the others adduced, there is no "then" clause
that I can see matching up with the given "if" clause.

When "if" serves as a synonym of "whether", we have a somewhat different
case:

What we do not know is if he has arrived yet.

There, the clause entire fulfills a different role, that of noun phrase.

I am not adamant on this, but my instincts suggest that the sentences
above want to read something like:

"They often get left on the shelf, and they can be sold only if the
price is reduced."

"People will trust me only if I give them a signed piece of paper with
my address on."

"Your only chance of living is for you to do what I say."

"The only way that's going to happen is for it to look like a
professional West End production. "

And, of course:

"The only way of getting out is by having the council decide to order
the door opened."

As I say, I am not going to the wall on this, but "is if" really sounds
wrong to my ears.


--
Cordially,
Eric Walker

[fabzorba]

Doesn't sound strictly informal, but is the sort of thing I might red
line as an editor for some formal procedures manual. In other words,
it's on the higher end of informality but the "is if" is "iffy". In
the example given, the construction "getting out" lends its idiomatic
stain to the succeeding "as if". Look at:

In this eventuality, the only licit way councillors may leave the
chamber is if council decides to order the doors be opened.

Does that sound more "proper"? Of course it does!

I suppose that something like the following would be in some manual:

In this eventuality, councillors may leave the chamber licitly only
pursuant to a council decision to the effect that the doors of the
chamber be opened, otherwise they may not leave.