Insofar as vs "inasmuch as" vs "in that"

[Unknown]

I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
when writing for the general public.

Thanks in advance for the opinions.

Tom

[CDB]

Tom Benson wrote:
> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> when writing for the general public.
>>

That is what "inasmuch as" means, but "insofar as" means "to the
extent or degree that ...". I wouldn't call either phrase too wordy
or pedantic, if it is used in the right context.

[Don Phillipson]

<Tom Benson> wrote in message
news:qjoj079j5ln5j1iq8...@4ax.com...

> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> when writing for the general public.

This is more a matter of your personal literary style than the
readers you have in mind.

When editing and when in doubt over questions like this it helps:
1. To remove the word or phrase completely and judge whether
a connecting or qualifying word is really essential. If so:
2. Try first the very simplest word or phrase with the necessary function,
e.g. "as," "for" or "because."

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

[Stan Brown]

On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 10:27:59 -0400, Tom Benson <> wrote:
> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> when writing for the general public.
>

All of those, and hackneyed too. Never use multiple words where one
will do.

--
"The difference between the /almost right/ word and the /right/ word
is ... the difference between the lightning-bug and the lightning."
--Mark Twain
Stan Brown, Tompkins County, NY, USA http://OakRoadSystems.com

[Robert Bannister]

On 28/06/11 10:27 PM, Tom Benson wrote:
>
> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> when writing for the general public.

Perfectly normal in my language.

--
Robert Bannister

[Robert Bannister]

On 29/06/11 8:51 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 10:27:59 -0400, Tom Benson<> wrote:
>> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
>> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
>> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
>> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
>> when writing for the general public.
>>
>
> All of those, and hackneyed too. Never use multiple words where one
> will do.
>

But "insofar" is one word. What did you mean?

--
Robert Bannister

[Peter Moylan]

If you're really, really old, it's three words.

--
Peter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org
For an e-mail address, see my web page.

[James Hogg]

The Oxford Dictionary for Writers and Editors has this interesting sequence:

in so far (three words)
insomuch (one word)

--
James

[Stan Brown]

"Insofar as" is two words; "since" is one.

[Stan Brown]

On Wed, 29 Jun 2011 12:02:37 +1000, Peter Moylan wrote:
>
> Robert Bannister wrote:
> > On 29/06/11 8:51 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
> >> On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 10:27:59 -0400, Tom Benson<> wrote:
> >>> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
> >>> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> >>> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> >>> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> >>> when writing for the general public.
> >>>
> >>
> >> All of those, and hackneyed too. Never use multiple words where one
> >> will do.
> >>
> >
> > But "insofar" is one word. What did you mean?
> >
> If you're really, really old, it's three words.

I must be really, really old, because I would have written it (if at
all) as three words. AHD4 lists it as one word, though.

[Robert Bannister]

On 29/06/11 6:22 PM, Stan Brown wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Jun 2011 09:40:28 +0800, Robert Bannister wrote:
>>
>> On 29/06/11 8:51 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
>>> On Tue, 28 Jun 2011 10:27:59 -0400, Tom Benson<> wrote:
>>>> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
>>>> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
>>>> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
>>>> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
>>>> when writing for the general public.
>>>>
>>>
>>> All of those, and hackneyed too. Never use multiple words where one
>>> will do.
>>>
>>
>> But "insofar" is one word. What did you mean?
>
> "Insofar as" is two words; "since" is one.
>

But they don't mean the same thing insofar as "since" means "because"
and "insofar" doesn't.

--
Robert Bannister

[r.las...@gmail.com]

"Insofar as" means neither "since" nor "because". "Inasmuch as" means both of those. I was taught in my modern symbolic logic class that the former means "to the extent that". Using the construction "Inasmuch as P, then Q", you are saying that P is the case. Using the construction "Insofar as P, then Q", you are saying that Q is the case, to the extent that P is the case. So if Mary likes bald men and you're totally bald, you'd say, "Inasmuch as I'm bald, Mary likes me," and if you're balding (like Captain Picard), you'd say, "Insofar as I'm bald, Mary likes me".

[CDB]

On 07/09/2012 3:18 PM, r.las...@gmail.com wrote:

> "Insofar as" means neither "since" nor "because". "Inasmuch as" means both of those. [examples]

I agree.

[GG]

They seem to overlap for meaning 1, but only "inasmuch as" has 2:

[
in戢s搶uch as

1 : in the degree that : insofar as <everything else that is desired is
desired inasmuch as it leads to pleasure -- Times Literary Supplement>

2 : in view of the fact that : for the reason that : SINCE, BECAUSE
<should not be used for the relief of pain inasmuch as its analgesic
value is slight -- D.W.Maurer & V.H.Vogel>
]

[CDB]

On 08/09/2012 9:02 AM, GG wrote:

I suppose that that use is what prompted "r.laskaris"'s posting. I
agree with him, and consider (1) to be an error, like "fulsome" for
"complete": of understandable origin, considering its elements, but
wrong wrong wrongity wrong.

[GG]

CDB wrote:
> On 08/09/2012 9:02 AM, GG wrote:
>> CDB wrote:
>>> r.las...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>>> "Insofar as" means neither "since" nor "because". "Inasmuch as"
>>>> means both of those. [examples]
>
>>> I agree.
>
>> They seem to overlap for meaning 1, but only "inasmuch as" has 2:
>

>> [in�as�much as

>
>> 1 : in the degree that : insofar as <everything else that is desired is
>> desired inasmuch as it leads to pleasure -- Times Literary Supplement>
>
>> 2 : in view of the fact that : for the reason that : SINCE, BECAUSE
>> <should not be used for the relief of pain inasmuch as its analgesic
>> value is slight -- D.W.Maurer & V.H.Vogel>]
>
> I suppose that that use is what prompted "r.laskaris"'s posting. I
> agree with him, and consider (1) to be an error, like "fulsome" for
> "complete": of understandable origin, considering its elements, but
> wrong wrong wrongity wrong.

1 (MW-U) is confirmed though by Shorter Oxford English Dictionary.

[CDB]

On 08/09/2012 3:46 PM, GG wrote:
> CDB wrote:
>> On 08/09/2012 9:02 AM, GG wrote:
>>> CDB wrote:
>>>> r.las...@gmail.com wrote:

>>>>> "Insofar as" means neither "since" nor "because". "Inasmuch as"
>>>>> means both of those. [examples]

>>>> I agree.

>>> They seem to overlap for meaning 1, but only "inasmuch as" has 2:

>>> [in戢s搶uch as

>>> 1 : in the degree that : insofar as <everything else that is desired is
>>> desired inasmuch as it leads to pleasure -- Times Literary Supplement>

>>> 2 : in view of the fact that : for the reason that : SINCE, BECAUSE
>>> <should not be used for the relief of pain inasmuch as its analgesic
>>> value is slight -- D.W.Maurer & V.H.Vogel>]

>> I suppose that that use is what prompted "r.laskaris"'s posting. I
>> agree with him, and consider (1) to be an error, like "fulsome" for
>> "complete": of understandable origin, considering its elements, but
>> wrong wrong wrongity wrong.

> 1 (MW-U) is confirmed though by Shorter Oxford English Dictionary.

Usage is king. What do they say about "fulsome"?

IMO it's a use that arose from misinterpretation. It makes the phrase
"inasmuch as" almost useless, since context will often not indicate
which of the two meanings is intended.

[lordsol...@gmail.com]

I agree, when addressing the general public you should meet people where they are at.

[Peter Moylan]

Reminds me of a joke that came, I think, from an American university.

"Hey, where's the library at?"
"You can't end a sentence with 'at'."
"OK. Where's the library at, asshole?"

As a matter of interest, did Tom get any answers in 2011?

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

[Peter T. Daniels]

There were 17 messages in the thread before the quasi-lazarization, all
but one or three by persons still with us. (The "GG" may or may not be the
same one that occasionally interjects something incomprehensible.)

[Joe Fineman]

lordsol...@gmail.com writes:

> On Tuesday, June 28, 2011 at 9:27:59 AM UTC-5, nor...@googlegroups.com wrote:
>> I've often used "insofar as" to qualify a previous statement when I
>> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
>> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
>> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
>> when writing for the general public.

I have to reply to this at one remove, because Gnus can't retrieve the
original posting.

In my book, the connective phrases you mention are not synonymous.

"Insofar as" means "to the extent that".
"Inasmuch as" means "because".
"In that" means "because, in view of one interpretation of the preceding
statement".
"Since" means "because", but sometimes needs to be avoided in order to
prevent confusion with the temporal sense.

The general public be damned.
--
--- Joe Fineman jo...@verizon.net

||: If your feet smell and your nose runs, you're upside down. :||

[Stan Brown]

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 18:31:09 -0400, Joe Fineman wrote:
> lordsol...@gmail.com writes:
>
> > [quoted text muted]

> >> write scholarly papers. So I was wondering if you guys and gals
> >> considered that phrase, and/or "inasmuch as," overly wordy or ,
> >> perhaps, pedantic ways of saying "in that" or "since," particularly
> >> when writing for the general public.
>
> I have to reply to this at one remove, because Gnus can't retrieve the
> original posting.
>
> In my book, the connective phrases you mention are not synonymous.
>
> "Insofar as" means "to the extent that".
> "Inasmuch as" means "because".
> "In that" means "because, in view of one interpretation of the preceding
> statement".
> "Since" means "because", but sometimes needs to be avoided in order to
> prevent confusion with the temporal sense.

Joe's definitions match mine. I try to avoid the first three in
writing, because they feel flabby to me, but I tend to overuse
"since" to equal "because". I try to change at least some of them
when edit my drafts.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://BrownMath.com/
http://OakRoadSystems.com/