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"I stopped on Saturday"
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Pamela
Apr 13, 2023, 1:27:27 PM4/13/23
to
Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
Saturday and no more after that.
Any views on how to read this?
that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
Saturday and no more after that.
Any views on how to read this?
Mark Brader
Apr 13, 2023, 1:32:54 PM4/13/23
to
"Pamela":
This is the same issue that arises when writing about the closure of a
railway line or station. If the last train was on September 30, some
people will say it closed on that date, and others will say it closed
on October 1.
If it matters, it's best to choose another wording.
--
Mark Brader | "It seems my sense of humour is out of step
Toronto | not only with rec.puzzles, but with reality itself."
m...@vex.net | --Richard Heathfield
My text in this article is in the public domain.
railway line or station. If the last train was on September 30, some
people will say it closed on that date, and others will say it closed
on October 1.
If it matters, it's best to choose another wording.
--
Mark Brader | "It seems my sense of humour is out of step
Toronto | not only with rec.puzzles, but with reality itself."
m...@vex.net | --Richard Heathfield
My text in this article is in the public domain.
Mack A. Damia
Apr 13, 2023, 1:34:11 PM4/13/23
to
On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 18:26:39 +0100, Pamela
<pamela.priv...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
Depends who you are.
<pamela.priv...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
>My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
>dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
>However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
>Saturday and no more after that.
>
>Any views on how to read this?
"Minds"
occam
Apr 13, 2023, 2:30:39 PM4/13/23
to
I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in French]
When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
office with my phone.
I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
- in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
the end of that day, not the previous day.
I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
Ken Blake
Apr 13, 2023, 3:14:48 PM4/13/23
to
Saturday." But the sentence is ambiguous and not necessarily
understood the same way by everyone. It would be much better to say
"I took the last dose of medicine on Saturday."
lar3ryca
Apr 13, 2023, 3:21:27 PM4/13/23
to
10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
specified in the notice.
--
Golf is a game invented by the same people who think music comes out of
a bagpipe
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 13, 2023, 5:20:11 PM4/13/23
to
lar3ryca wrote:
>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>> French]
>>
>> When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
>> extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
>> informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
>> number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
>> office with my phone.
>>
>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
>>
>> I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
>> day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
>
> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
> specified in the notice.
So would I. In Danish we'd use a specific expression - direct
>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>> French]
>>
>> When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
>> extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
>> informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
>> number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
>> office with my phone.
>>
>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
>>
>> I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
>> day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
>
> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
> specified in the notice.
translation: "til and with 09/04/2023" - which would be "until and
including" in proper English. You never know how people would understand
the other expression.
--
Bertel, Denmark
TonyCooper
Apr 13, 2023, 6:19:41 PM4/13/23
to
On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:21:20 -0600, lar3ryca <la...@invalid.ca> wrote:
>On 2023-04-13 12:30, occam wrote:
>> On 13/04/2023 19:26, Pamela wrote:
>>> Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>>> that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
>>>
>>> My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
>>> dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
>>>
>>> However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
>>> Saturday and no more after that.
>>>
>>> Any views on how to read this?
>>
>> Here's a reality I was faced with recently:
>>
>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in French]
Seeing that statement, written in English, I would assume the meaning
>On 2023-04-13 12:30, occam wrote:
>> On 13/04/2023 19:26, Pamela wrote:
>>> Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>>> that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
>>>
>>> My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
>>> dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
>>>
>>> However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
>>> Saturday and no more after that.
>>>
>>> Any views on how to read this?
>>
>> Here's a reality I was faced with recently:
>>
>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in French]
to be the credit is valid anytime up until 12:001 AM on 10/4. It's
not valid at any time after that.
The word "until" means "up to that point".
>>
>> When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
>> extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
>> informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
>> number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
>> office with my phone.
>>
>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
>>
>> I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
>> day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
>
>Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
>10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>specified in the notice.
--
Mark Brader
Apr 13, 2023, 6:51:10 PM4/13/23
to
>>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>>> French]
>>>
>>> When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
>>> extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
>>> informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
>>> number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
>>> office with my phone.
>>>
>>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
>>>
>>> I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
>>> day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
"Larry":
>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>>> French]
>>>
>>> When I logged into the PT web site at 10am on 10/04/2023 in order to
>>> extend my credit (by topping up, hence extending the period), I was
>>> informed that the deadline had passed, and I could not top up. My phone
>>> number had been 'locked' and I needed to report at the nearest post
>>> office with my phone.
>>>
>>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
>>>
>>> I am not sure if it was my logic, or my broken French, which won the
>>> day. She unblocked my number, and I was able to extend my credit.
>> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>> specified in the notice.
Bertel Lund Handsen:
>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>> specified in the notice.
> So would I.
Tony Cooper agreed, but I don't -- I agree with the first quoted poster.
If I'm given "until Friday" to do a task, then I'm allowed to do it on
Friday. This message reads the same way.
But of course I'm only talking about English usage, not similar expressions
in French or Danish.
> In Danish we'd use a specific expression - direct translation:
> "til and with 09/04/2023" - which would be "until and including"
> in proper English.
some date, with that meaning.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "People are entitled to their own opinions,
m...@vex.net | but not their own facts." --Michael Bloomberg
TonyCooper
Apr 13, 2023, 8:00:24 PM4/13/23
to
coupon/discount/rate, or that sort of thing with expiration time, has
a time period that must be met, and the last day it's good is
determined by the "until" time/date.
A job assignment is normally assigned with a "done by" time/date.
That would mean the coupon/discount/rate is good until Friday, but the
job assignment must be done by Friday.
Of course, the better was to state the expiration is "Good until
midnight on 10/4" and the job assignment is "Done by close of business
on 10/4".
>But of course I'm only talking about English usage, not similar expressions
>in French or Danish.
>
>> In Danish we'd use a specific expression - direct translation:
>> "til and with 09/04/2023" - which would be "until and including"
>> in proper English.
>
>In North America something is commonly referred to as valid "through"
>some date, with that meaning.
--
TonyCooper
Apr 13, 2023, 8:06:42 PM4/13/23
to
April 18th. The IRS considers anything postmarked no later than April
18th to be on time even if it's received by the IRS later. If
submitted electronically, it must be submitted by midnight on April
18th to be on time.
Mark Brader
Apr 13, 2023, 9:30:24 PM4/13/23
to
>>>>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>>>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>>>>> French]...
>>>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in
>>>>> I called the PT Helpdesk and asked what the problem was? I was still
>>>>> within the deadline until 23:59 of that day. She informed me that the
>>>>> deadline was the day *before* (i.e. 09/04/2023, 23:59). I explained that
>>>>> - in my logic - when something is valid until <dd:mm:yyyy> it implies
>>>>> the end of that day, not the previous day.
"Larry":
>>>> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
>>>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>>>> specified in the notice.
Bertel Lund Handsen:
>>> So would I.
Mark Brader:
>>>> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
>>>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>>>> specified in the notice.
Bertel Lund Handsen:
>>> So would I.
>> Tony Cooper agreed, but I don't -- I agree with the first quoted poster.
>> If I'm given "until Friday" to do a task, then I'm allowed to do it on
>> Friday. This message reads the same way.
Tony Cooper:
>> If I'm given "until Friday" to do a task, then I'm allowed to do it on
>> Friday. This message reads the same way.
> I consider that two different timelines. A statement about
> coupon/discount/rate, or that sort of thing with expiration time, has
> a time period that must be met, and the last day it's good is
> determined by the "until" time/date.
> coupon/discount/rate, or that sort of thing with expiration time, has
> a time period that must be met, and the last day it's good is
> determined by the "until" time/date.
That's what I said! Whereas *you* said:
| Seeing that statement, written in English, I would assume the meaning
| to be the credit is valid anytime up until 12:001 AM on 10/4. It's
| not valid at any time after that.
| Seeing that statement, written in English, I would assume the meaning
| to be the credit is valid anytime up until 12:001 AM on 10/4. It's
| not valid at any time after that.
> Of course, the better was to state the expiration is "Good until
> midnight on 10/4"
No, that's a terrible choice. Midnight "on" a particular day is
> midnight on 10/4"
either the start or the end of it. (In ISO 8601 notation, one is
written 00:00 and the other is 24:00.)
Better to use 12:01 am, 11:59 pm, or the like, or else some more
explicit wording such as "through" or "up to and including".
> and the job assignment is "Done by close of business on 10/4".
--
Mark Brader | "Don't be a luddy-duddy! Don't be a mooncalf!
Toronto | Don't be a jabbernowl! You're not those, are you?"
m...@vex.net | --W.C. Fields, "The Bank Dick"
Ruud Harmsen
Apr 14, 2023, 1:54:25 AM4/14/23
to
Thu, 13 Apr 2023 23:20:06 +0200: Bertel Lund Hansen
<gade...@lundhansen.dk> scribeva:
einschließlich
>You never know how people would understand
>the other expression.
--
Ruud Harmsen, http://rudhar.com
<gade...@lundhansen.dk> scribeva:
>> Personally, I would have taken that to mean that the deadline was at
>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>> specified in the notice.
>
>So would I. In Danish we'd use a specific expression - direct
>translation: "til and with 09/04/2023" - which would be "until and
>including" in proper English.
In Dutch too: tot en met. Abbreviated t/m. Up to and including. Bis
>> 10/24/2023 when that day started, ie. at 00:00:00, unless otherwise
>> specified in the notice.
>
>So would I. In Danish we'd use a specific expression - direct
>translation: "til and with 09/04/2023" - which would be "until and
>including" in proper English.
einschließlich
>You never know how people would understand
>the other expression.
--
Hibou
Apr 14, 2023, 2:03:16 AM4/14/23
to
Suppose you had a fortnight's supply of tablets, and had to take one in
the morning and one in the evening (i.e. 28 in all). If you collected
your prescription from the chemist's on a Saturday, and took the first
tablet that evening (a common scenario), then you would take the last on
the Saturday morning a fortnight later. You wouldn't take one that
evening. In such a case, you both took your medication and stopped it on
Saturday.
In general, I think 'stopped it' applies to the first occasion on which
you didn't take your medication.
occam
Apr 14, 2023, 5:28:27 AM4/14/23
to
On 14/04/2023 00:19, TonyCooper wrote:
> On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:21:20 -0600, lar3ryca <la...@invalid.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-04-13 12:30, occam wrote:
>>> On 13/04/2023 19:26, Pamela wrote:
>>>> Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>>>> that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
>>>>
>>>> My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
>>>> dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
>>>>
>>>> However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
>>>> Saturday and no more after that.
>>>>
>>>> Any views on how to read this?
>>>
>>> Here's a reality I was faced with recently:
>>>
>>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in French]
>
> Seeing that statement, written in English, I would assume the meaning
> to be the credit is valid anytime up until 12:001 AM on 10/4. It's
> not valid at any time after that.
>
> The word "until" means "up to that point".
>
It may mean that, but 'until 12:001 AM on 10/4' is as ambiguous as hell.
> On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 13:21:20 -0600, lar3ryca <la...@invalid.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-04-13 12:30, occam wrote:
>>> On 13/04/2023 19:26, Pamela wrote:
>>>> Referring to medication, if you wrote "I stopped on Saturday" then does
>>>> that mean you took the last dose of medicine on Friday or on Saturday?
>>>>
>>>> My impression is this is generally understood to mean you took the last
>>>> dose on Friday and took none on Saturday.
>>>>
>>>> However the literal sense of the words is that you took the last dose on
>>>> Saturday and no more after that.
>>>>
>>>> Any views on how to read this?
>>>
>>> Here's a reality I was faced with recently:
>>>
>>> I received a text message from my (P&T) mobile provider saying: "The
>>> credit on your [phone] card is valid until 10/04/2023." [Message in French]
>
> Seeing that statement, written in English, I would assume the meaning
> to be the credit is valid anytime up until 12:001 AM on 10/4. It's
> not valid at any time after that.
>
> The word "until" means "up to that point".
>
Does it mean 1 minute past noon (12:01AM on 10/4, or 1 minute into 10/4
(00:01AM)? (The latter was the way the Lux post office interpreted it.
In fact 10/4 did not come into it. It was 23:59PM on 09/4, according to
them.)
Athel Cornish-Bowden
Apr 14, 2023, 5:32:37 AM4/14/23
to
--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 36 years; mainly
in England until 1987.
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 14, 2023, 9:22:32 AM4/14/23
to
On Friday, April 14, 2023 at 5:28:27 AM UTC-4, occam wrote:
> Does it mean 1 minute past noon (12:01AM on 10/4, or 1 minute into 10/4
> (00:01AM)?
12 am is midnight, 12 pm is noon.
> Does it mean 1 minute past noon (12:01AM on 10/4, or 1 minute into 10/4
> (00:01AM)?
charles
Apr 14, 2023, 10:00:17 AM4/14/23
to
In article <6d101073-392f-4669...@googlegroups.com>,
Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
How can you be post noon at noon?
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Friday, April 14, 2023 at 5:28:27#AM UTC-4, occam wrote:
> > Does it mean 1 minute past noon (12:01AM on 10/4, or 1 minute into 10/4
> > (00:01AM)?
> 12 am is midnight, 12 pm is noon.
shows how little the word makers know. The 'm" is noon (midday).
> > Does it mean 1 minute past noon (12:01AM on 10/4, or 1 minute into 10/4
> > (00:01AM)?
> 12 am is midnight, 12 pm is noon.
How can you be post noon at noon?
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Sam Plusnet
Apr 14, 2023, 11:01:11 AM4/14/23
to
They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
present in each and every one.
You can hardly be the first person to 'call them' on it, so why don't
they take the trivial step of fixing it?
Bureaucracy - mankind's greatest achievement.
--
Sam Plusnet
occam
Apr 14, 2023, 11:54:34 AM4/14/23
to
day before from now on. I guess they count on people adjusting to their
interpretation.
As to why they do not specify 23:59 in a text message, I am assuming it
is for brevity of the SMS message. And if I have to call them to sort
things out, that's more telephone time for them to charge to my account.
occam
Apr 14, 2023, 12:00:01 PM4/14/23
to
lar3ryca
Apr 14, 2023, 12:17:05 PM4/14/23
to
People who say 12PM or 12AM.
> Better to use 12:01 am, 11:59 pm, or the like, or else some more
> explicit wording such as "through" or "up to and including".
>
>> and the job assignment is "Done by close of business on 10/4".
>
> That's fine.
--
Athel Cornish-Bowden
Apr 14, 2023, 12:20:48 PM4/14/23
to
>>
>> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
>> present in each and every one.
>> You can hardly be the first person to 'call them' on it, so why don't
>> they take the trivial step of fixing it?
>
> I agree. I made the 'mistake' once , and I will renew my subscription a
> day before from now on. I guess they count on people adjusting to their
> interpretation.
>
> As to why they do not specify 23:59 in a text message, I am assuming it
> is for brevity of the SMS message. And if I have to call them to sort
> things out, that's more telephone time for them to charge to my account.
>
>>
>> Bureaucracy - mankind's greatest achievement.
--
>> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
>> present in each and every one.
>> You can hardly be the first person to 'call them' on it, so why don't
>> they take the trivial step of fixing it?
>
> I agree. I made the 'mistake' once , and I will renew my subscription a
> day before from now on. I guess they count on people adjusting to their
> interpretation.
>
> As to why they do not specify 23:59 in a text message, I am assuming it
> is for brevity of the SMS message. And if I have to call them to sort
> things out, that's more telephone time for them to charge to my account.
>
>>
>> Bureaucracy - mankind's greatest achievement.
athel -- biochemist, not a physicist, but detector of crackpots
Ken Blake
Apr 14, 2023, 12:56:17 PM4/14/23
to
concerned, "Good until midnight on 10/4" is not; it's ambiguous.
Midnight is the boundary between two days, not really in either of
them. If someone insists in "midnight" being in a day,"Midnight on
10/4" could refer to one minute before 12:01 am on 10/4 or to one
minute after 11:59 PM on 10/4
Yes, I know that there's some commonly accepted "rule" of what
"midnight," "12am," and "12pm" mean, but it's not understood by or
accepted by everyone. I for one never remember the rule, mostly
because I dislike it.
See, for example,
https://www.englishclub.com/efl/articles/12am-12pm-whats-the-difference/
which largely agrees with my point of view.
As far as I'm concerned, much better than "Good until midnight on
10/4" would be "Good until the end of 10/4."
Athel Cornish-Bowden
Apr 14, 2023, 1:01:45 PM4/14/23
to
convention, and there is no reason to expect different people and
organizations to adhere to a unique convention. If it's absolutely
clear from the context whether the reference is to day or night I may
say 12 o'clock; otherwise 12 noon and 12 midnight.
>
>> Better to use 12:01 am, 11:59 pm, or the like, or else some more
>> explicit wording such as "through" or "up to and including".
>>
>>> and the job assignment is "Done by close of business on 10/4".
>>
>> That's fine.
--
>> Better to use 12:01 am, 11:59 pm, or the like, or else some more
>> explicit wording such as "through" or "up to and including".
>>
>>> and the job assignment is "Done by close of business on 10/4".
>>
>> That's fine.
--
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 14, 2023, 1:28:08 PM4/14/23
to
TonyCooper
Apr 14, 2023, 2:35:58 PM4/14/23
to
On Fri, 14 Apr 2023 09:56:09 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
There's another concern that hasn't been brought up: time zone.
Midnight comes earlier to me than it does to someone in California.
While I don't think a minute makes much of a difference, three hours
might.
Midnight comes earlier to me than it does to someone in California.
While I don't think a minute makes much of a difference, three hours
might.
Sam Plusnet
Apr 14, 2023, 3:04:43 PM4/14/23
to
Meridiem".
--
Sam Plusnet
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 14, 2023, 4:52:04 PM4/14/23
to
The symbols mean what they mean. Maybe at some point people were
told what they were abbreviations of, but most people have never been
exposed to a lick of Latin.
Ken Blake
Apr 14, 2023, 5:48:09 PM4/14/23
to
On Fri, 14 Apr 2023 14:35:53 -0400, TonyCooper
Yes, good point.
Peter Moylan
Apr 14, 2023, 10:33:31 PM4/14/23
to
On 15/04/23 01:01, Sam Plusnet wrote:
[Ambiguity]
> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
> present in each and every one. You can hardly be the first person to
> 'call them' on it, so why don't they take the trivial step of fixing
> it?
In my experience, complaints like that reach only some low-level
employees of the organisation. The decision-makers don't see the problem
because they never see the complaints.
--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org
[Ambiguity]
> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
> present in each and every one. You can hardly be the first person to
> 'call them' on it, so why don't they take the trivial step of fixing
> it?
employees of the organisation. The decision-makers don't see the problem
because they never see the complaints.
--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org
David Kleinecke
Apr 15, 2023, 1:28:33 AM4/15/23
to
The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established enough to be trusted. Violations are easy to find. You could say that the list starts being a list at 7 and it starts no longer being a list at 17.
In the real world caution is recommended.
In the real world caution is recommended.
Mark Brader
Apr 15, 2023, 1:43:18 AM4/15/23
to
David Kleinecke:
I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
were both included in the list. What I'd *expect* to see is
something explicit, like David's explanation of what it means.
--
Mark Brader "In general, it is safe and legal to
Toronto kill your children and their children."
m...@vex.net -- POSIX manual, quoted by Thomas Koenig
> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
were both included in the list. What I'd *expect* to see is
something explicit, like David's explanation of what it means.
--
Mark Brader "In general, it is safe and legal to
Toronto kill your children and their children."
m...@vex.net -- POSIX manual, quoted by Thomas Koenig
Hibou
Apr 15, 2023, 1:56:00 AM4/15/23
to
clock stopped at two-fifteen....
With medication, the best measure, I think, would we when the
concentration in the body falls to the point where it no longer has any
effect (cf. breathalysers and roadside drug tests).
But I can't see most people using that criterion, searching the Web for
graphs of plasma concentration vs time....
Peter Moylan
Apr 15, 2023, 3:00:37 AM4/15/23
to
On 15/04/23 15:28, David Kleinecke wrote:
> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is
> that "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those
> numbers n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet
> established enough to be trusted. Violations are easy to find. You
> could say that the list starts being a list at 7 and it starts no
> longer being a list at 17.
I would write that as [7,17). But then I would also interpret your "list
> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is
> that "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those
> numbers n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet
> established enough to be trusted. Violations are easy to find. You
> could say that the list starts being a list at 7 and it starts no
> longer being a list at 17.
of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to mean [7,17]. I don't
recall ever seeing your interpretation.
> In the real world caution is recommended.
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 15, 2023, 3:27:08 AM4/15/23
to
Mark Brader wrote:
> David Kleinecke:
>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>
> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
> were both included in the list.
How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
> David Kleinecke:
>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>
> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
> were both included in the list.
languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
If you define a range in C as "short door[3];
", then door[2] is the highest element. In Python you can write
"range(3)" where 2 is the highest number in the range.
--
Bertel, Denmark
Peter Moylan
Apr 15, 2023, 4:21:50 AM4/15/23
to
bound in C, therefore all subscripts start from 0. In your example the
relevant range is [0..2]. The 3 in your example specifies the size of
the array, not the subscript range.
David's example would be written "short door [10]", which means
subscript bounds 7 to 16, adjusted by the programmer to 0..9 to get
around the limitations of C.
In Modula-2, for example, you would write
TYPE range = [7..16];
VAR example: ARRAY range OF INT16;
which makes it clear that 17 is not an acceptable subscript. The legal
subscripts are numbers starting at 7 and ending at 16.
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 15, 2023, 8:49:57 AM4/15/23
to
On Saturday, April 15, 2023 at 1:28:33 AM UTC-4, David Kleinecke wrote:
> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established enough to be trusted. Violations are easy to find. You could say that the list starts being a list at 7 and it starts no longer being a list at 17.
>
> In the real world caution is recommended.
If you're _really_ confused, you can say "see pages 12-37 inclusive."
> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established enough to be trusted. Violations are easy to find. You could say that the list starts being a list at 7 and it starts no longer being a list at 17.
>
> In the real world caution is recommended.
Ken Blake
Apr 15, 2023, 11:50:53 AM4/15/23
to
On Sat, 15 Apr 2023 06:55:55 +0100, Hibou
<vpaereru-u...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote:
>Le 14/04/2023 à 10:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
>> On 2023-04-14 06:03:11 +0000, Hibou said:
>>>
>>> In general, I think 'stopped it' applies to the first occasion on
>>> which you didn't take your medication.
>>
>> In general, yes, but there is still a bit of ambiguity. It would mean
>> either.
>
>It's a problem. With something continuous, the meaning is clear: the
>clock stopped at two-fifteen....
...when the old man died.
<vpaereru-u...@yahoo.com.invalid> wrote:
>Le 14/04/2023 à 10:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
>> On 2023-04-14 06:03:11 +0000, Hibou said:
>>>
>>> In general, I think 'stopped it' applies to the first occasion on
>>> which you didn't take your medication.
>>
>> In general, yes, but there is still a bit of ambiguity. It would mean
>> either.
>
>It's a problem. With something continuous, the meaning is clear: the
>clock stopped at two-fifteen....
Sam Plusnet
Apr 15, 2023, 3:07:48 PM4/15/23
to
On 15-Apr-23 3:33, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 15/04/23 01:01, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
> [Ambiguity]
>
>> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
>> present in each and every one. You can hardly be the first person to
>> 'call them' on it, so why don't they take the trivial step of fixing
>> it?
>
> In my experience, complaints like that reach only some low-level
> employees of the organisation. The decision-makers don't see the problem
> because they never see the complaints.
I'm sure it will say something in their Mission Statement about
> On 15/04/23 01:01, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
> [Ambiguity]
>
>> They must send out thousands of such messages, and that ambiguity is
>> present in each and every one. You can hardly be the first person to
>> 'call them' on it, so why don't they take the trivial step of fixing
>> it?
>
> In my experience, complaints like that reach only some low-level
> employees of the organisation. The decision-makers don't see the problem
> because they never see the complaints.
listening to their customers' needs - but once the Mission Statement is
complete, you don't need to bother with it again.
--
Sam Plusnet
Mark Brader
Apr 15, 2023, 6:22:49 PM4/15/23
to
David Kleinecke:
>>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
Mark Brader:
>>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
>> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
>> were both included in the list.
Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
>> were both included in the list.
> How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
> languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
> languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
valid expression.
--
Mark Brader | "This website offers to conjugate your French verb.
Toronto | Trust the French to come up with something kinky
m...@vex.net | like that." --Al Kriman
Peter Moylan
Apr 15, 2023, 8:26:50 PM4/15/23
to
programs to generate sentences that are plausible but meaningless. At
roughly the same time, my university required every department to come
up with a mission statement.
I used my program to generate the mission statement. Nobody noticed.
Peter Moylan
Apr 15, 2023, 8:28:11 PM4/15/23
to
And still made a ticking sound
Which my grandfather tried only this afternoon
And that's how the old man drowned.
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 16, 2023, 2:27:54 AM4/16/23
to
Mark Brader wrote:
> I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
> for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
> valid expression.
Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
> I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
> for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
> valid expression.
--
Bertel, Denmark
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 16, 2023, 2:30:41 AM4/16/23
to
Peter Moylan wrote:
> I've said this before, I think. I once wrote one of those computer
> programs to generate sentences that are plausible but meaningless. At
> roughly the same time, my university required every department to come
> up with a mission statement.
>
> I used my program to generate the mission statement. Nobody noticed.
There are web pages that will generate a complete, random article. At
> I've said this before, I think. I once wrote one of those computer
> programs to generate sentences that are plausible but meaningless. At
> roughly the same time, my university required every department to come
> up with a mission statement.
>
> I used my program to generate the mission statement. Nobody noticed.
least one such article has been printed in a scientific magazine - in
earnest.
--
Bertel, Denmark
Mark Brader
Apr 16, 2023, 10:45:26 AM4/16/23
to
Mark Brader:
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "I can be gullible about these kinds of things.
m...@vex.net | Or so people tell me, and I believe them."
> > I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
> > for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
> > valid expression.
Bertel Lund Hansen:
> > for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
> > valid expression.
> Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
No! We're talking about expressions in English!
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "I can be gullible about these kinds of things.
m...@vex.net | Or so people tell me, and I believe them."
Madhu
Apr 16, 2023, 12:31:29 PM4/16/23
to
* (Mark Brader) <ieGcnZQmEMdllKH5...@giganews.com> :
Wrote on Sun, 16 Apr 2023 14:45:12 +0000:
> Mark Brader:
>> > I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
>> > for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
>> > valid expression.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
>
> No! We're talking about expressions in English!
common lisp has
(loop for i from 1 below 10 collect i)
(loop for i from 1 to 10 collect i)
(loop for i to 10 collect i)
(loop for i from 10 downto 0 collect i)
(loop for i from 10 above 0 collect i)
etc.
Wrote on Sun, 16 Apr 2023 14:45:12 +0000:
> Mark Brader:
>> > I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary keywords
>> > for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" to be a
>> > valid expression.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
>
> No! We're talking about expressions in English!
(loop for i from 1 below 10 collect i)
(loop for i from 1 to 10 collect i)
(loop for i to 10 collect i)
(loop for i from 10 downto 0 collect i)
(loop for i from 10 above 0 collect i)
etc.
Peter Moylan
Apr 16, 2023, 8:49:06 PM4/16/23
to
On 17/04/23 00:45, Mark Brader wrote:
> Mark Brader:\
>>> I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary
>>> keywords for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17"
>>> to be a valid expression.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
>
> No! We're talking about expressions in English!
As I read it, your "these languages" referred to C, C++, Python and
> Mark Brader:\
>>> I don't believe any of these languages have the necessary
>>> keywords for "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17"
>>> to be a valid expression.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> Would Python's "range(7,18)" satisfy you?
>
> No! We're talking about expressions in English!
(prpbably) Java, mentioned by Bertel.
Mark Brader
Apr 16, 2023, 10:17:14 PM4/16/23
to
Mark Brader:
David Kleinecke:
>>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
Mark Brader:
In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
"the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
programming languages.
Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
one whose meaning was being disputed.
--
Mark Brader | "The only physical constants that can be measured
Toronto | are the ones in universes that contain physicists."
m...@vex.net | --Peter Moylan
> > No! We're talking about expressions in English!
Peter Moylan:
> As I read it, your "these languages" referred to C, C++, Python and
> (prpbably) Java, mentioned by Bertel.
Of course. But the context was:
> (prpbably) Java, mentioned by Bertel.
David Kleinecke:
>>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
>>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
>> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
>> were both included in the list.
Bertel Lund Hansen:
> How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
> languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
>> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
>> were both included in the list.
Bertel Lund Hansen:
> How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
"the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
programming languages.
Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
one whose meaning was being disputed.
--
Mark Brader | "The only physical constants that can be measured
Toronto | are the ones in universes that contain physicists."
m...@vex.net | --Peter Moylan
Phil Carmody
Apr 18, 2023, 11:17:45 AM4/18/23
to
m...@vex.net (Mark Brader) writes:
> Mark Brader:
>> > No! We're talking about expressions in English!
>
> Peter Moylan:
>> As I read it, your "these languages" referred to C, C++, Python and
>> (prpbably) Java, mentioned by Bertel.
>
> Of course. But the context was:
>
> David Kleinecke:
> >>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
> >>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
> >>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>
> Mark Brader:
> >> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
> >> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
> >> were both included in the list.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
> > How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
> > languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
>
> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
> programming languages.
>
> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
> one whose meaning was being disputed.
That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
> Mark Brader:
>> > No! We're talking about expressions in English!
>
> Peter Moylan:
>> As I read it, your "these languages" referred to C, C++, Python and
>> (prpbably) Java, mentioned by Bertel.
>
> Of course. But the context was:
>
> David Kleinecke:
> >>> The more or less standard for mathematics and computer science is that
> >>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" means those numbers
> >>> n such that 7 <= n < 17. But this definition is not yet established...
>
> Mark Brader:
> >> I don't believe it. I have never seen a phrasing like that in
> >> technical usage, and if I did, I'd take it to mean that 7 and 17
> >> were both included in the list.
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
> > How much standard it is, I don't know, but in several programming
> > languages it certainly is the case: C, C++, Python and (prpbably) Java.
>
> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
> programming languages.
>
> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
> one whose meaning was being disputed.
idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included", contrasting
against "an idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by
specifying the upper and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is
excluded".
I'd claim that C doesn't have such an expression. It may have
upper-bound-excluded semantics in several contexts, but it doesn't have
an idiomatic expression for such ranges per se.
Python's range fits the bill, it is such an expression..
Perl's start..end syntax also fits the bill, and adopts the included
upper bound.
$ perl -e 'print 1..5'
12345
eLisp likewise:
(number-sequence 1 5)
(1 2 3 4 5)
Phil
--
We are no longer hunters and nomads. No longer awed and frightened, as we have
gained some understanding of the world in which we live. As such, we can cast
aside childish remnants from the dawn of our civilization.
-- NotSanguine on SoylentNews, after Eugen Weber in /The Western Tradition/
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 18, 2023, 12:35:51 PM4/18/23
to
Phil Carmody wrote:
>> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>> programming languages.
>>
>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
>
> That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
> and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included", contrasting
> against "an idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by
> specifying the upper and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is
> excluded".
That was whatI meant, but I think that Mark's point was that he wanted
>> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>> programming languages.
>>
>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
>
> That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
> and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included", contrasting
> against "an idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by
> specifying the upper and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is
> excluded".
to write English language when programming, and not codes.
--
Bertel, Denmark
Mark Brader
Apr 18, 2023, 1:14:03 PM4/18/23
to
Mark Brader:
Bertel Lund Hansen:
wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
--
Mark Brader, Toronto, m...@vex.net | "Volts are like proof." --Steve Summit
>>> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>>> programming languages.
>>>
>>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
Phil Carmody:
>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>>> programming languages.
>>>
>>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
>> That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
>> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
>> and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included" ...
>> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
Bertel Lund Hansen:
> That was whatI meant, but I think that Mark's point was that he wanted
> to write English language when programming, and not codes.
I was commenting on a specific claim made by David about specific
> to write English language when programming, and not codes.
wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
--
Mark Brader, Toronto, m...@vex.net | "Volts are like proof." --Steve Summit
Phil Carmody
Apr 19, 2023, 6:29:38 AM4/19/23
to
m...@vex.net (Mark Brader) writes:
> Mark Brader:
>>>> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
>>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>>>> programming languages.
>>>>
>>>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>>>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
>
> Phil Carmody:
>>> That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
>>> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
>>> and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included" ...
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> That was whatI meant, but I think that Mark's point was that he wanted
>> to write English language when programming, and not codes.
>
> I was commenting on a specific claim made by David about specific
> wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
> is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
You were probably contributing to the wrong thread then. The rest of us
> Mark Brader:
>>>> In other words, Bertel was claiming that the expression David cited --
>>>> "the list of numbers starting at 7 and ending at 17" -- exists in those
>>>> programming languages.
>>>>
>>>> Not an *equivalent* expression, *that* expression, because that's the
>>>> one whose meaning was being disputed.
>
> Phil Carmody:
>>> That's not how I interpret Bertel at all. I interpret his "it" as "an
>>> idiomatic expression defining a numerical range by specifying the upper
>>> and lower bounds, and where the upper bound is included" ...
>
> Bertel Lund Hansen:
>> That was whatI meant, but I think that Mark's point was that he wanted
>> to write English language when programming, and not codes.
>
> I was commenting on a specific claim made by David about specific
> wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
> is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
knew what were were talking about.
Mark Brader
Apr 19, 2023, 4:22:08 PM4/19/23
to
Mark Brader:
--
Mark Brader | But it doesn't matter what I plead;
Toronto | the universe doesn't provide an appeals process
m...@vex.net | when you make a mistake. --Paul Robinson
> > I was commenting on a specific claim made by David about specific
> > wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
> > is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
Phil Carmody:
> > wording in technical English. Nothing in programming-language coding
> > is relevant. I do not wish to "write English language when programming".
> You were probably contributing to the wrong thread then. The rest of us
> knew what were were talking about.
No, I quoted what I was responding to. Anyway, no more to say here.
> knew what were were talking about.
--
Mark Brader | But it doesn't matter what I plead;
Toronto | the universe doesn't provide an appeals process
m...@vex.net | when you make a mistake. --Paul Robinson
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