I wish it wasn't so vs I wish it weren't so

D. F. Manno

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Jul 30, 2015, 11:57:08 AM7/30/15

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I stated a fact, and then I wrote ' I wish it wasn't so'.
However, I then wondered if it should have been 'I wish it weren't so'.

Since "it" is singular, isn't it "wasn't" even though it sounds
better (to my ear) to be "weren't"?

Peter T. Daniels

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Jul 30, 2015, 12:03:36 PM7/30/15

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It's subjunctive, so in formal writing "weren't" is proper; in casual speech
it would be a bit pretentious.

Peter Duncanson [BrE]

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Jul 30, 2015, 12:07:30 PM7/30/15

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"weren't" is correct. It is the subjunctive form of the verb.

https://www.englishclub.com/grammar/verbs-subjunctive-were.htm

Use of 'were'-subjunctive

In the following examples, you can see that we sometimes use the
'were'-subjunctive (instead of 'was') after:

'if'
'as if'
'wish'
'suppose'

Note that in these cases 'were' is always correct, but 'was' is
possible in informal language:

<a table of 8 examples showing formal use of 'were' and informal use
of 'was'>

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

Harrison Hill

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Jul 30, 2015, 12:33:52 PM7/30/15

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"I wish it wasn't so" is not wrong or ungainly, but "weren't" is better in BrE. "Say it ain't so Joe" has a nice story behind it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hW9tq9ImRTg

R H Draney

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Jul 30, 2015, 4:23:19 PM7/30/15

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"Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote in
news:dbda9a79-4126-49e6...@googlegroups.com:

Any votes at all for "I wish it be not so"?...r

snide...@gmail.com

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Jul 30, 2015, 5:57:27 PM7/30/15

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William Blake?

/dps

Eric Walker

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Jul 31, 2015, 2:54:24 AM7/31/15

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Number has nothing to do with it. When the verb asserts something that
is not real or true but rather exists only as an idea or imagining, the
verb needs to be in the subjunctive mood. For most verbs, the only
marker of the subjunctive is in the third person, where the -s normal in
the indicative mood is omitted:

If he fail in this, we are lost.

But the verb "be" has a whole set of subjunctive markers. In the third
person, it uses were:

If I were king, things would be ordered quite differently.

Nowadays, with language use becoming ever sloppier, use of the indicative
where the subjunctive is needed are increasingly common, but even in this
age there are some forms where failure to use the subjunctive clangs on
even the tin ear.

Peter Moylan

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Jul 31, 2015, 6:59:29 AM7/31/15

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On 2015-Jul-31 18:38, Lewis wrote:
> "The car I want to buy is red. I wish it weren't." The car could be
> painted, its redness is not a permanent state.
>
> "My hair is naturally curly, but I sure wish it wasn't."

"Wish" takes the subjunctive, but "sure wish" drops you down to a less
educated register.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Peter T. Daniels

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Jul 31, 2015, 7:40:34 AM7/31/15

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On Friday, July 31, 2015 at 2:54:24 AM UTC-4, Eric Walker wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:57:05 +0000, D. F. Manno wrote:

> > I stated a fact, and then I wrote ' I wish it wasn't so'.
> > However, I then wondered if it should have been 'I wish it weren't so'.
> >
> > Since "it" is singular, isn't it "wasn't" even though it sounds better
> > (to my ear) to be "weren't"?
>
> Number has nothing to do with it. When the verb asserts something that
> is not real or true but rather exists only as an idea or imagining, the
> verb needs to be in the subjunctive mood. For most verbs, the only
> marker of the subjunctive is in the third person, where the -s normal in
> the indicative mood is omitted:
>
> If he fail in this, we are lost.

Wrong: that should be "if he fails," because it is not counterfactual.

> But the verb "be" has a whole set of subjunctive markers. In the third
> person, it uses were:
>
> If I were king, things would be ordered quite differently.
>
> Nowadays, with language use becoming ever sloppier,

Wrong.

> use of the indicative
> where the subjunctive is needed are increasingly common, but even in this
> age there are some forms where failure to use the subjunctive clangs on
> even the tin ear.

And there are some who "hypercorrect" and try to use it where it doesn't fit.

Glenn Knickerbocker

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Jul 31, 2015, 2:24:32 PM7/31/15

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On 7/30/2015 4:22 PM, R H Draney wrote:
> Any votes at all for "I wish it be not so"?...r

Only if you're wishing for an upcoming change. Even so, I'd use either
"would be" or "for it to be."

¬R