Rhymes with --

[grandda...@gmail.com]

My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2017-12-15 19:12:40 +0000, grandda...@gmail.com said:

> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.

I think we had this one a few months ago. Silver rhymes with orange.

The president of the Portuguese Biochemical Society, who I met a few
weeks ago, is called João Laranjinha -- little orange.


--
athel

[occam]

On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>

Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?

"Me and Tim a-huntin went,
Met three whores in a pop up tent.
They was three, and we was two,
So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "

[Peter T. Daniels]

That's not a limerick, and "buck" doesn't mean 'fuck'.

Since someone else above made an irrelevant comment, I will for the umpteenth time provide
Ira Gershwin's rhyme (from "Love Is Sweeping the Country" from *Of Thee I Sing*, which received
the Pulitzer Prize for drama):

Florida and Cal-
iforn-
ia get together
In a festival
of or'n-
ges and weather

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Sat, 16 Dec 2017 06:35:31 -0800 (PST), "Peter T. Daniels"
<gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

>On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 4:52:59 AM UTC-5, occam wrote:
>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> > My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>>
>> Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
>>
>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
>> They was three, and we was two,
>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
>
>That's not a limerick, and "buck" doesn't mean 'fuck'.

It seems to be used there as a variant of "fuck" so as to fit
"Timbuktu".

Anyway - OED:

buck, v.2

Etymology: < buck n.1

To copulate with; said of male rabbits and some other animals.

Although the most recent quotation is:

1736 Compl. Family-piece ii. i. 225 When the Buck goeth to the
Doe, he..having struck or buckt her, falls down backwards.

{This entry has not yet been fully updated (first published 1888).}


--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Sam Plusnet]

On 15-Dec-17 19:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>

A local mountain (FSVO mountain) certainly rhymes with orange.

--
Sam Plusnet

[Richard Yates]

Are you in Queensland or in Tennessee?

[Sam Plusnet]

Neither, South East Wales.

The 'mountain' is called the Blorenge.

--
Sam Plusnet

[Peter T. Daniels]

They may well not yet have known about Timbuktu in 1736.

And the quatrain isn't about rabbits or some other animals.

[Peter T. Daniels]

This afternoon's "Ask Me Another" (NPR word game out of Brooklyn) had a quiz
about words with no rhymes, and they used your mountain as the example.

[Kerr-Mudd,John]

'Snot a proper mountain, it just looks a bit like one from Abergavenny;
it's a spur.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blorenge#Etymology

There's some horse bones under the rubble somewhere:

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Blorenge/@51.80005,-3.06148

[Peter Moylan]

I suppose Queensland's Mt Tambourine would qualify.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Fri, 15 Dec 2017 11:12:40 -0800 (PST), grandda...@gmail.com
wrote:

>My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.

In BrE and OzE "ange" in "orange" often has the "a" as a short-i as in
"hinge". Otherwise the "a" is a schwa.

Even when "orange" and "hinge" have the short-i sound they are not a
good rhyme because the "inge" syllable in "orange" is unstressed but
that in "hinge" is stressed.

[Richard Yates]

On Sun, 17 Dec 2017 12:59:11 +0000, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>On Fri, 15 Dec 2017 11:12:40 -0800 (PST), grandda...@gmail.com
>wrote:
>
>>My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>
>In BrE and OzE "ange" in "orange" often has the "a" as a short-i as in
>"hinge". Otherwise the "a" is a schwa.
>
>Even when "orange" and "hinge" have the short-i sound they are not a
>good rhyme because the "inge" syllable in "orange" is unstressed but
>that in "hinge" is stressed.

Sam Plusnet must live near Mt. Blorenge,
He says that it rhymes well with "orange",
But Peter's new claim,
"Stress must be the same",
Is solved if we rhyme it with "door hinge".

[David Kleinecke]

And I discover that - for me - /i/ and /e/ are in free
variation in "orange". All these years and I never
realized!

[occam]

On 17/12/2017 13:59, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Dec 2017 11:12:40 -0800 (PST), grandda...@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>
> In BrE and OzE "ange" in "orange" often has the "a" as a short-i as in
> "hinge". Otherwise the "a" is a schwa.
>
> Even when "orange" and "hinge" have the short-i sound they are not a
> good rhyme because the "inge" syllable in "orange" is unstressed but
> that in "hinge" is stressed.

How about 'orange' and 'lozenge'?
>

[Joseph C. Fineman]

If I were a cassowary
On the sands of Timbuktu,
I would eat a missionary,
Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
--
--- Joe Fineman jo...@verizon.net

||: Too lively, and you're dead. :||

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

Fine if the vowel sounds are the same.

[occam]

On 17/12/2017 23:55, Joseph C. Fineman wrote:
> occam <oc...@invalid.nix> writes:
>
>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>>>
>>
>> Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
>>
>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
>> They was three, and we was two,
>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
>
> If I were a cassowary
> On the sands of Timbuktu,
> I would eat a missionary,
> Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
>

also...

"Riding on a dromedary
O’er the plains of Timbuctoo,
Comes the British missionary,
With his tracts and hymn-book too."

An extensive list of variations of these can be found here:

https://nonsenselit.wordpress.com/2009/08/22/cassowary-vs-missionary/

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2017-12-18 07:59:28 +0000, occam said:

> On 17/12/2017 23:55, Joseph C. Fineman wrote:
>> occam <oc...@invalid.nix> writes:
>>
>>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
>>>
>>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
>>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
>>> They was three, and we was two,
>>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
>>
>> If I were a cassowary
>> On the sands of Timbuktu,
>> I would eat a missionary,
>> Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
>>
>
> also...
>
> "Riding on a dromedary

ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for both.
Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to use
"chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.

> O’er the plains of Timbuctoo,
> Comes the British missionary,
> With his tracts and hymn-book too."
>
> An extensive list of variations of these can be found here:
>
> https://nonsenselit.wordpress.com/2009/08/22/cassowary-vs-missionary/

--
athel

[Katy Jennison]

There must be countless variations. In the (cassowary) version I learnt
as a child, the last line was "Hat and gloves and hymn-book too."

--
Katy Jennison

[Lewis]

In message <f9pcmp...@mid.individual.net> Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:
> On 2017-12-18 07:59:28 +0000, occam said:

>> On 17/12/2017 23:55, Joseph C. Fineman wrote:
>>> occam <oc...@invalid.nix> writes:
>>>
>>>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
>>>>
>>>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
>>>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
>>>> They was three, and we was two,
>>>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
>>>
>>> If I were a cassowary
>>> On the sands of Timbuktu,
>>> I would eat a missionary,
>>> Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
>>>
>>
>> also...
>>
>> "Riding on a dromedary

> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
> camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
> seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
> dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
> appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for both.
> Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to use
> "chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.

I don't remember learning anything but camello as a child for camel, but
it was also used for a person who sold drugs when i was a bit older in
Denver. That may have been a chicano adoption and not strictly speaking
correct Spanish. Or is was just slang at the time.


--
In other news, Gandalf died. -- Secret Diary of Boromir

[Cheryl]

On 2017-12-18 5:01 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2017-12-18 07:59:28 +0000, occam said:
>
>> On 17/12/2017 23:55, Joseph C. Fineman wrote:
>>> occam <oc...@invalid.nix> writes:
>>>
>>>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Reminded me of the  'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
>>>>
>>>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
>>>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
>>>> They was three, and we was two,
>>>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
>>>
>>> If I were a cassowary
>>> On the sands of Timbuktu,
>>> I would eat a missionary,
>>> Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
>>>
>>
>> also...
>>
>> "Riding on a dromedary
>
> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau, camello)
> is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It seems to me
> that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a dromedary (i.e. we
> accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not appropriate for an animal
> with two humps), but we use "camel" for both. Is that generally agreed?
> I asked my daughter if it was OK to use "chameau" for "dromedaire", and
> she said no.

I use "camel" for both. At some point in my youth, I was taught that a
"dromedary" was a particular kind of camel, but either because the term
came to me late, or because I didn't really have much need to
distinguish among camels, I still get confused over whether a camel and
two humps and a dromedary one, or the other way around. No doubt, if I'd
grown up speaking French or Spanish, I'd have grown up knowing the
difference.


--
Cheryl

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[J. J. Lodder]

Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:

> On 2017-12-18 07:59:28 +0000, occam said:
>
> > On 17/12/2017 23:55, Joseph C. Fineman wrote:
> >> occam <oc...@invalid.nix> writes:
> >>
> >>> On 15/12/2017 20:12, grandda...@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Reminded me of the 'what rhymes with Timbuktu' limerick?
> >>>
> >>> "Me and Tim a-huntin went,
> >>> Met three whores in a pop up tent.
> >>> They was three, and we was two,
> >>> So I bucked one, and Timbuktu. "
> >>
> >> If I were a cassowary
> >> On the sands of Timbuktu,
> >> I would eat a missionary,
> >> Coat and bands and hymnbook too.
> >>
> >
> > also...
> >
> > "Riding on a dromedary
>
> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
> camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
> seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
> dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
> appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for both.
> Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to use
> "chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.

You can add German and Dutch to that list.
And science in general,
for the beast is Camelus dromedarius (Linnaeus)
It's only the Brits who can't count.
But to be fair, the word Dromedary does exist in English.
It's just that it is rarely used.

Jan

NowThatWeAreOnCamels,
I just discovered that this awful form of compression
is called 'Camel Case', presumably because of the humps it shows.

[Richard Heathfield]

Q: What do you call a camel with one hump? A: Dromedary.
Q: What do you call a camel with two humps? A: Bactrian.
Q: What do you call a camel with three humps? A: Humphrey.

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

[Katy Jennison]

Lay the two letters D and B on their sides. D for dromedary has one
hump; B for Bactrian camel has two.

--
Katy Jennison

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nh85au.1vf...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

>You can add German and Dutch to that list.
>And science in general,
>for the beast is Camelus dromedarius (Linnaeus)
>It's only the Brits who can't count.
>But to be fair, the word Dromedary does exist in English.
>It's just that it is rarely used.

I have rarely needed to distinguish between the two types of camel.

-- Richard

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

We don't have many camels in Britain, and those that we do have are in
zoos. The average Brit has no need to distinguish between dromedarys and
bactrians. We don't buy and sell them. We don't have them as pets and we
don't use them for transport. The vast majority of Brits have even less
reason to distinguish between them than to distinguish between breeds of
horses.

>Jan
>
>NowThatWeAreOnCamels,
>I just discovered that this awful form of compression
>is called 'Camel Case', presumably because of the humps it shows.

[RH Draney]

On 12/18/2017 6:22 AM, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>
> We don't have many camels in Britain, and those that we do have are in
> zoos. The average Brit has no need to distinguish between dromedarys and
> bactrians. We don't buy and sell them. We don't have them as pets and we
> don't use them for transport. The vast majority of Brits have even less
> reason to distinguish between them than to distinguish between breeds of
> horses.

I assume, then, that you also don't have picture books to read to your
children, with pages saying "C is for Camel" with pictures of
dromedaries for the brighter kids to point at and say "that's not a
camel, it's only got one hump!"...

Lest this strike some as a contrived example, it happened here with me
as the precocious child, leading to a lifetime of buying camel
tchotchkes of all sorts for the cousin who was trying to read to me at
the time....

[Peter Young]

The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
And I will bet my silk pyjama
That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".

Peter.

--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Pt)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk

[Peter Young]

"Cassock, bands and hymn-book" for me.

[Peter T. Daniels]

I haven't seen a pack of cigarettes in a long time, but isn't the Camel logo
a one-humped one? In front of some Egyptian pyramids?

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

That seems to be an English language distinction, perhaps local?

https://www.livescience.com/27503-camels.html

Camels are mammals with long legs, a big-lipped snout and a humped
back. There are two types of camels: dromedary camels, which have
one hump, and Bactrian camels, which have two humps.

Here is the classification of camels, according to Integrated
Taxonomic Information System:

Kingdom: Animalia
<snip>
Family: Camelidae
Genus: Camelus
Species:

Camelus bactrianus (Bactrian camel)
Camelus dromedarius (one-humped camel)

Subspecies:

Camelus bactrianus bactrianus
Camelus bactrianus ferus (wild Bactrian camel)

ITIS:
https://www.itis.gov/servlet/SingleRpt/SingleRpt?search_topic=TSN&search_value=624942#null

Camelus bactrianus Linnaeus, 1758 – Bactrian camel, Bactrian Camel
Camelus dromedarius Linnaeus, 1758 – One-humped Camel, dromedary

[Joseph C. Fineman]

Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> writes:

> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
> camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
> seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
> dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
> appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for
> both. Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to
> use "chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.

Ogden Nash wrote:

The camel has but one hump,
The dromedary, two --
Or else the other way around.
I'm never sure. Are you?

I guess we'll just have to look it up.

--
--- Joe Fineman jo...@verizon.net

||: The dirt in the cracks is where life goes on. :||

[Janet]

In article <86ind42...@verizon.net>, jo...@verizon.net says...

>
> Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> writes:
>
> > ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
> > camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
> > seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
> > dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
> > appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for
> > both. Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to
> > use "chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.
>
> Ogden Nash wrote:
>
> The camel has but one hump,
> The dromedary, two --
> Or else the other way around.
> I'm never sure. Are you?
>
> I guess we'll just have to look it up.

It's very easy to remember. Capital B for Bactrian has two humps.
Capital D for Dromedary has one.

Janet

[J. J. Lodder]

Then you have visited only poor man's zoos.
(supposing your experience isn't limited
to smoking mislabelled cigarettes)

In a better zoo they will have both kinds,
with properly labelled pictures,
to tell the kiddies which is which,

Jan

[J. J. Lodder]

Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

You don't have picture books for the brighter and curious kiddies
to tell them about all the things in the big world out there?
British kiddies have lost their natural curiosity?

As it happens, I visited friends last week,
and their kiddies insisted on telling me
about all the difficult names of all those dinosaurs,
which they are certain never to meet IRL.

And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,

Jan

[J. J. Lodder]

Joseph C. Fineman <jo...@verizon.net> wrote:

> Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> writes:
>
> > ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
> > camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
> > seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
> > dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
> > appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for
> > both. Is that generally agreed? I asked my daughter if it was OK to
> > use "chameau" for "dromedaire", and she said no.
>
> Ogden Nash wrote:
>
> The camel has but one hump,
> The dromedary, two --
> Or else the other way around.
> I'm never sure. Are you?
>
> I guess we'll just have to look it up.

There is no problem if you never learned it the wrong way round,

Jan

[Cheryl]

Not everyone lives near a zoo. I suppose the closest one to the place I
grew up was some 2,500 km away. There may have been some closer nature
parks that had native animals - there are now, not that we needed to go
there to see many native animals - but camels of either type are not
native to Canada.

My extremely limited knowledge of camels and dromedaries was obtained
from children's books and, later, TV shows, neither of which went into
the matter in great detail. I must have also seen the cigarette package.

[Cheryl]

On 2017-12-18 3:05 PM, J. J. Lodder wrote:

Dinosaurs, for some reason, really appeal to children. I was probably
one of the few children of my generation who knew much about them, but
at some point after that, they became extraordinarily popular among
children.

[Tony Cooper]

On Mon, 18 Dec 2017 17:13:22 +0000, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>On Mon, 18 Dec 2017 07:15:19 -0700, RH Draney <dado...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>On 12/18/2017 6:22 AM, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>>>
>>> We don't have many camels in Britain, and those that we do have are in
>>> zoos. The average Brit has no need to distinguish between dromedarys and
>>> bactrians. We don't buy and sell them. We don't have them as pets and we
>>> don't use them for transport. The vast majority of Brits have even less
>>> reason to distinguish between them than to distinguish between breeds of
>>> horses.
>>
>>I assume, then, that you also don't have picture books to read to your
>>children, with pages saying "C is for Camel" with pictures of
>>dromedaries for the brighter kids to point at and say "that's not a
>>camel, it's only got one hump!"...
>>
>>Lest this strike some as a contrived example, it happened here with me
>>as the precocious child, leading to a lifetime of buying camel
>>tchotchkes of all sorts for the cousin who was trying to read to me at
>>the time....
>
>That seems to be an English language distinction, perhaps local?
>
>https://www.livescience.com/27503-camels.html
>
> Camels are mammals with long legs, a big-lipped snout and a humped
> back. There are two types of camels: dromedary camels, which have
> one hump, and Bactrian camels, which have two humps.
>

Missing from the description is that camels spit. This is not a myth
as many Central Floridians of a certain age will know.

The local zoo* used to be located in small piece of property with no
room for expansion. A Shriner's group "donated" a camel to the zoo.
I've scare-quoted "donated" because their real motive was to get rid
of the loathsome beast. It was foul tempered, mangy, and was prone to
spit on anyone who neared it.

The zoo did not have any space to add a camel enclosure, so they put
the camel on a narrow plot at the entranceway to the zoo. This was
not a good choice. That put the camel within spitting distance of all
visitors, and few visitors managed to pass through the entrance gate
without being spat upon.

The camel finally died, but if it's not known if it fell or was
pushed. It wasn't mourned.

The zoo has since relocated to much larger quarters and once again has
a camel on exhibit. The current one has a much better disposition. It
also has a large area that buffers the camel from visitors in case it
spits.

The zoo also houses a llama...another animal known for spitting. To
the best of my knowledge, the two have never engaged in a spitting
contest.

*It's the Central Florida Zoo, but located in Sanford FL and not
Orlando. Sanford is contiguous with Orlando.




--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[David Kleinecke]

Camels and llamas are fairly close relatives but camels are
ugly as sin and llamas are quite attractive. Very odd.

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

>And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,

The dromedary *is* a camel.

-- Richard

[Janet]

In article <p197ht$bbh$1...@macpro.inf.ed.ac.uk>, ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk
says...

I wouldn't walk a mile for a dromedary, either.

Janet

[Richard Heathfield]

What if I could get you a ticket for a bactrain?

[Mark Brader]

Athel Cornish-Bowden:

>>>> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
>>>> camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
>>>> seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
>>>> dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
>>>> appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for
>>>> both. Is that generally agreed?

Yes. But what do you expect in a language where the word for "camera"
only includes movie cameras, and you have to say "photographic apparatus"
if you mean a still camera?

Peter Young:

> The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
> The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
> And I will bet my silk pyjama
> That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".

If you're going to quote Ogden Nash, could you at least retain
the correct rhythm? The words are:

There isn't any three-l lllama.

--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "What we're looking for is the correct misnomer."
m...@vex.net | --Rodney Boyd

My text in this article is in the public domain.

[Mark Brader]

R.H. Draney:

>> I assume, then, that you also don't have picture books to read to your
>> children, with pages saying "C is for Camel" with pictures of
>> dromedaries for the brighter kids to point at and say "that's not a
>> camel, it's only got one hump!"...

>> Lest this strike some as a contrived example, it happened here with me

>> as the precocious child...

And you were wrong. Perhaps you were taught by a French person?

Actually I would say that the canonical image of a camel is of a
one-humper, although people are aware that the other kind exists.
(And I won't say "camelonical" if you don't.)

Peter Duncanson:
> That seems to be an English language distinction...

No, it *isn't*. That's the point.
--
Mark Brader "He'll spend at least part of his life
Toronto in prison, or parliament, or both."
m...@vex.net --Peter Moylan

[Peter Young]

On 18 Dec 2017 m...@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote:

> Athel Cornish-Bowden:
>>>>> ObAUE. In French and Spanish they insist that a camel (chameau,
>>>>> camello) is not the same as a dromedary (dromedaire, dromedario). It
>>>>> seems to me that in English we wouldn't call a Bactrian camel a
>>>>> dromedary (i.e. we accept that "dromedary" is specific, and not
>>>>> appropriate for an animal with two humps), but we use "camel" for
>>>>> both. Is that generally agreed?

> Yes. But what do you expect in a language where the word for "camera"
> only includes movie cameras, and you have to say "photographic apparatus"
> if you mean a still camera?

> Peter Young:
>> The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
>> The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
>> And I will bet my silk pyjama
>> That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".

> If you're going to quote Ogden Nash, could you at least retain
> the correct rhythm? The words are:

> There isn't any three-l lllama.

?

[J. J. Lodder]

You don't have grandchildren who will walk you?

Jan

[J. J. Lodder]

And an Arabian camel is?

Jan

[J. J. Lodder]

Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org

Jan


<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>

[snide...@gmail.com]

Given the last link, I seem to have gotten lost trying to follow your point.

/dps

[Richard Heathfield]

And indeed the first link.

[David Kleinecke]

On Monday, December 18, 2017 at 2:22:42 PM UTC-8, J. J. Lodder wrote:

In the hadith literature camels per se are assumed one-humped.
Two-humped camels are known - but considered rarities.

[Mark Brader]

Peter Young:
>>> The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
>>> The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
>>> And I will bet my silk pyjama
>>> That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".

Mark Brader:

>> If you're going to quote Ogden Nash, could you at least retain
>> the correct rhythm? The words are:
>
>> There isn't any three-l lllama.

Peter Young:
> ?

"?"?
--
Mark Brader, Toronto, m...@vex.net
"History tells us that the Boston 'T' Party was succeeded
the next day by the Boston 'U' Party, where American rebels
yanked all the extraneous U's out of words like 'colour'
and threw them into Boston Harbour. Harbor. Whatever."
--Adam Beneschan

[Richard Heathfield]

On 19/12/17 00:08, Mark Brader wrote:
> Peter Young:
>>>> The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
>>>> The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
>>>> And I will bet my silk pyjama
>>>> That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".
>
> Mark Brader:
>>> If you're going to quote Ogden Nash, could you at least retain
>>> the correct rhythm? The words are:
>>
>>> There isn't any three-l lllama.
>
> Peter Young:
>> ?
>
> "?"?
>

'"?"?'!

[Mark Brader]

Richard Tobin:

> The dromedary *is* a camel.

By way of additional support:

http://www.sporcle.com/games/scole9179/mismatched-animals

--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "Please correct error between chair and monitor."
m...@vex.net | -- James Baughn

[Peter Moylan]

On 19/12/17 02:43, Peter Young wrote:

> The one-"L" "Lama", he's a Priest.
> The two-"L" "llama", he's a beast.
> And I will bet my silk pyjama
> That there's no such thing as a three-"L" "lllama".

(Last line needs fixing for scansion.)

This has of course been refuted by fire-fighters who have had to attend
a three-alarmer.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

>> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,

>> The dromedary *is* a camel.

>Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org

Wikipedia is not an authority on the English language. I'm a native
English speaker and until this thread I had never heard the slightest
suggestion that dromedaries and bactrians weren't simply two kinds of
camel.

-- Richard

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

>> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>
>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>
>Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org

... and if you want to take Wikipedia as an authority:

><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>

"The dromedary is the smallest of the three species of camel"

><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>

"The three surviving species of camel are the dromedary [...], the
Bactrian, [...]"

-- Richard

[Janet]

In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>, nospam@de-
ster.demon.nl says...

>
> Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>
> > In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> > J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >
> > >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
> >
> > The dromedary *is* a camel.
>
> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org

So why is its scientific name Camelus dromedarius?

A dromedary was the camel in Kipling's Just So Stories. ("How the
camel got his hump").

I was given the book for my sixth birthday, and asked why the camel
only got one hump, when the ones I'd seen in the zoo had two.

Janet.

[charles]

In article <p1ao5k$15vc$1...@macpro.inf.ed.ac.uk>,

+1

Charles

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

[J. J. Lodder]

BTW, did you naotice that a lion is a tiger?

Jan

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

+1

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[J. J. Lodder]

Perhaps not, but you can safely take wikip
as a reliable source for taxonomy.
Camels and dromedaries are different species,
just like lions and tigers.

There can be no but about it,

Jan

[Richard Heathfield]

On 19/12/17 10:03, Richard Tobin wrote:
> In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>
>>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>
>> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
>
> Wikipedia is not an authority on the English language.

Agreed, but (wonder of wonders) it happens to be right, here. Perhaps
someone corrected it when J J Lodder wasn't looking?

Of course, it's also possible that it's been uncorrected back again
while I've had my back turned. One cannot *keep* checking these things.

> I'm a native
> English speaker and until this thread I had never heard the slightest
> suggestion that dromedaries and bactrians weren't simply two kinds of
> camel.

Whether Wikipedia has heard that suggestion in the past or will in the
future, I don't know. But as of my last visit to its camelarium, it
agreed that droms and bacts are both cams.

[Richard Heathfield]

...and the Humphrey? Oh please oh please oh please...

<sigh> No, it's the "Wild Bactrian". Presumably ordinary Bactrians are
much more even-tempered.

[Cheryl]

On 2017-12-19 8:07 AM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 19/12/17 10:07, Richard Tobin wrote:
>> In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
>> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>
>>>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>>>
>>>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>>>
>>> Nope, not even in  en.wikipedia.org
>>
>> ... and if you want to take Wikipedia as an authority:
>>
>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
>>
>>    "The dromedary is the smallest of the three species of camel"
>>
>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>
>>
>>    "The three surviving species of camel are the dromedary [...], the
>>    Bactrian, [...]"
>
> ...and the Humphrey? Oh please oh please oh please...
>
> <sigh> No, it's the "Wild Bactrian". Presumably ordinary Bactrians are
> much more even-tempered.
>

Wouldn't that be evidence that they aren't camels? I thought camels were
notoriously bad-tempered animals!

[charles]

In article <p1atje$1ju$1...@dont-email.me>,

Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:
> On 19/12/17 10:03, Richard Tobin wrote:
> > In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> > J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >
> >>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
> >
> >>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
> >
> >> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
> >
> > Wikipedia is not an authority on the English language.

> Agreed, but (wonder of wonders) it happens to be right, here. Perhaps
> someone corrected it when J J Lodder wasn't looking?

> Of course, it's also possible that it's been uncorrected back again
> while I've had my back turned. One cannot *keep* checking these things.

> > I'm a native
> > English speaker and until this thread I had never heard the slightest
> > suggestion that dromedaries and bactrians weren't simply two kinds of
> > camel.

> Whether Wikipedia has heard that suggestion in the past or will in the
> future, I don't know. But as of my last visit to its camelarium, it
> agreed that droms and bacts are both cams.

so are llamas. Someone has even bred a cross between an arabian camel and a
llama.

[Dingbat]

On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 2:08:40 PM UTC+5:30, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2017-12-15 19:12:40 +0000, grandda...@gmail.com said:
>
> > My mate said what rhymes with orange and I said no it doesn't.
>
> I think we had this one a few months ago. Silver rhymes with orange.
>
> The president of the Portuguese Biochemical Society, who I met a few
> weeks ago, is called João Laranjinha -- little orange.
>
>
Since you've heard his name, ...

How different are <nj> and <nh> in Portuguese?

[Mack A. Damia]

Bring back the birch.
~O Best Beloved~

[Richard Heathfield]

Dromedaries, Bactrians, and Wild Bactrians are different species of
genus Camelus, just as lions, tigers, jaguars, and leopards are
different species of genus Panthera.

No one Camelus species has any special claim on the word "camel" over
and above the other Camelus species.

We might also reasonably call lions, tigers, jaguars and leopards
"panthers", were it not for the confusion caused by other uses of that
word. Instead, we tend to call them "big cats". To say that a lion is a
big cat and /therefore/ a tiger is not a big cat makes no more sense
than to say that a bicycle is a vehicle and therefore a motor-cycle is
not a vehicle.

[Richard Heathfield]

I am reminded of "Pyramids", in which one character gets so cross with a
camel that he calls him 'bloody stupid'. The camel, in the privacy of
his own thoughts, muses: "What's he talking about? Bloody Stupid lives
over in Tsort."

[Mack A. Damia]

Joey Pants?

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nha433.161...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

>> Wikipedia is not an authority on the English language. I'm a native
>> English speaker and until this thread I had never heard the slightest
>> suggestion that dromedaries and bactrians weren't simply two kinds of
>> camel.

>Perhaps not, but you can safely take wikip
>as a reliable source for taxonomy.

As has been pointed out by me and others, it says that bactrians and
dromedaries are kinds of camel.

>Camels and dromedaries are different species,

"Camel" is not the name of a species, but of a genus.

Dromedaries and bactrians are different species, subspecies of camels.

>just like lions and tigers.

No, lions and tigers are both species. Camels aren't a species.

https://www.itis.gov/servlet/SingleRpt/SingleRpt?search_topic=TSN&search_value=624942#null

-- Richard

[Richard Tobin]

In article <56acdb41...@candehope.me.uk>,

charles <cha...@candehope.me.uk> wrote:

>> Whether Wikipedia has heard that suggestion in the past or will in the
>> future, I don't know. But as of my last visit to its camelarium, it
>> agreed that droms and bacts are both cams.

>so are llamas. Someone has even bred a cross between an arabian camel and a
>llama.

In a technical sense. The family Camelidae contains the genus Camelus
and the genus Lama.

-- Richard

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-12-18, J. J. Lodder wrote:

> Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>

>> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

>> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>

>> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>
>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>
> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
>

> Jan
>
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>

Well, that second link says:

A camel is an even-toed ungulate in the genus Camelus...
...
The three surviving species of camel are the dromedary, or
one-humped camel (C. dromedarius), which inhabits the Middle East
and the Horn of Africa; the Bactrian, or two-humped camel
(C. bactrianus), which inhabits Central Asia; and the critically
endangered wild Bactrian camel (C. ferus) that has limited
populations in remote areas of northwest China and Mongolia.
...
Both the dromedary and the Bactrian camels have been
domesticated....


--
Some say the world will end in fire; some say in segfaults.
<https://xkcd.com/312/>

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-12-18, J. J. Lodder wrote:

> Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
>> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>
>> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>
>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>
> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
>
> Jan
>
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>

Rather bizarrely, the article for Camel cigarettes shows "A very old
Camel pack from the first half of the 20th century at the Museo del
Objeto" with a 2-humped animal & the word "DROMEDARY" instead of
"CAMEL".

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel_(cigarette)>


--
The internet is quite simply a glorious place. Where else can you find
bootlegged music and films, questionable women, deep seated xenophobia
and amusing cats all together in the same place? --- Tom Belshaw

[RH Draney]

On 12/19/2017 3:41 AM, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> <snide...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Monday, December 18, 2017 at 2:22:42 PM UTC-8, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>>> Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
>>>> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>>>
>>>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>>>
>>> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
>>

>> Given the last link, I seem to have gotten lost trying to follow your point.
>
> BTW, did you naotice that a lion is a tiger?

And a strawberry isn't a berry (but a banana is), and a watermelon isn't
a melon (but a cucumber is)....

What is this, get set to go out and make bar bets week?...r

[J. J. Lodder]

Lions can't be made into tigers by the existence of a tribe somewhere
that has only one word for both,

Jan

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-12-19, RH Draney wrote:

> On 12/19/2017 3:41 AM, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> <snide...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Monday, December 18, 2017 at 2:22:42 PM UTC-8, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>>>> Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
>>>>> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
>>>>>
>>>>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
>>>>
>>>> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
>>>
>>> Given the last link, I seem to have gotten lost trying to follow your point.
>>
>> BTW, did you naotice that a lion is a tiger?
>
> And a strawberry isn't a berry (but a banana is),

That's different --- various unrelated plants have berries, trees,
&c. (See also "animals with eyes".)

> and a watermelon isn't
> a melon (but a cucumber is)....

That's more like it.

> What is this, get set to go out and make bar bets week?...r
>

--
It is the duty of the wealthy man to give employment to the
artisan. ---Hilaire Belloc

[J. J. Lodder]

Worse than that:
the non-domesticated dromedary has been extinct
for at least a thousand years,

Jan

[J. J. Lodder]

Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:

> On 2017-12-18, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>
> > Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> >> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >>
> >> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
> >>
> >> The dromedary *is* a camel.
> >
> > Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
> >
> > Jan
> >
> >
> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>
>
> Rather bizarrely, the article for Camel cigarettes shows "A very old
> Camel pack from the first half of the 20th century at the Museo del
> Objeto" with a 2-humped animal & the word "DROMEDARY" instead of
> "CAMEL".
>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel_(cigarette)>

Great, so twice wrong.
Skitt must be smiling, up there,

Jan

[Richard Heathfield]

Neither can dromedaries be made into bactrians, or vice versa. That
doesn't prevent us from having a word for a class to which they both
belong. Dromedaries and bactrians are camels, just as knives and forks
are cutlery. That doesn't mean a knife is a fork.

[Richard Tobin]

In article <1nha7wa.136...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,

I've no idea what that's supposed to mean. We have two words for lions
and tigers and two words for dromedaries and bactrians.

The fact is that in both everyday English and, apparently, in
biological taxonomy, dromedaries and bactrians are kinds of camel,
just as lions and tigers are kinds of big cat.

Where did you get the idea that dromedaries are not camels? Is it
true of the corresponding words in Dutch?

-- Richard

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Tuesday, December 19, 2017 at 8:00:07 AM UTC-5, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2017-12-18, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>
> > Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <1nh8tp3.11t...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> >> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >>
> >> >And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
> >>
> >> The dromedary *is* a camel.
> >
> > Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
> >
> > Jan
> >
> >
> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dromedary>
> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel>
>
> Rather bizarrely, the article for Camel cigarettes shows "A very old
> Camel pack from the first half of the 20th century at the Museo del
> Objeto" with a 2-humped animal & the word "DROMEDARY" instead of
> "CAMEL".
>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel_(cigarette)>

That image looks sadly like a hoax. Especially since there's no corresponding mention in the article.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

Almost no similarity. nj is nzh (sorry, I can't do phonetic symbols in
this computer); nh is ny (with consonant y) and corresponds to ñ in
Spanish, gn in French and Italian, and ny in Catalan, Hungarian and, in
a few words like canyon, English.

--
athel

[Richard Tobin]

In article <84126ff9-c950-419d...@googlegroups.com>,

Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

>> Rather bizarrely, the article for Camel cigarettes shows "A very old
>> Camel pack from the first half of the 20th century at the Museo del
>> Objeto" with a 2-humped animal & the word "DROMEDARY" instead of
>> "CAMEL".
>>
>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camel_(cigarette)>

>That image looks sadly like a hoax. Especially since there's no
>corresponding mention in the article.

Looks they fooled this museum too, then:

http://elmodo.mx/en/colecciones/1/

-- Richard

[Adam Funk]

I wonder if it's a near-counterfeit, i.e., a real brand of cigarettes
suggesting a more famous brand.


--
Dear Ann [Landers]: if there's an enormous rash of necrophilia that
happens in the next year because of this song, please let me know.
99.9% of the rest of us know it's a funny song! --- Alice Cooper

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-12-19, Richard Tobin wrote:

> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:

...

>>> Dromedaries and bactrians are different species, subspecies of camels.
>
>>> >just like lions and tigers.
>
>>> No, lions and tigers are both species. Camels aren't a species.
>>>
>>> https://www.itis.gov/servlet/SingleRpt/SingleRpt?search_topic=TSN&search_value=624942#null
>
>>Lions can't be made into tigers by the existence of a tribe somewhere
>>that has only one word for both,
>
> I've no idea what that's supposed to mean. We have two words for lions
> and tigers and two words for dromedaries and bactrians.
>
> The fact is that in both everyday English and, apparently, in
> biological taxonomy, dromedaries and bactrians are kinds of camel,
> just as lions and tigers are kinds of big cat.
>
> Where did you get the idea that dromedaries are not camels? Is it
> true of the corresponding words in Dutch?

That might be the issue. IIRC, "un chameau" in French refers to the
1-humper, whereas the 2-humper is normally called "un dromadaire" ---
however, the latter can also be "un chameau d'Arabie".




--
Mrs CJ and I avoid clichés like the plague.

[Janet]

In article <p1aud6$81s$1...@dont-email.me>, r...@cpax.org.uk says...

>
> On 19/12/17 11:33, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Richard Tobin <ric...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <1nh91tz.1j0...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>,
> >> J. J. Lodder <jjl...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> >>
> >>>>> And yes, they knew about the dromedary and camel too,
> >>
> >>>> The dromedary *is* a camel.
> >>
> >>> Nope, not even in en.wikipedia.org
> >>
> >> Wikipedia is not an authority on the English language. I'm a native
> >> English speaker and until this thread I had never heard the slightest
> >> suggestion that dromedaries and bactrians weren't simply two kinds of
> >> camel.
> >
> > Perhaps not, but you can safely take wikip
> > as a reliable source for taxonomy.
> > Camels and dromedaries are different species,
> > just like lions and tigers.
> >
> > There can be no but about it,
>
> Dromedaries, Bactrians, and Wild Bactrians are different species of
> genus Camelus, just as lions, tigers, jaguars, and leopards are
> different species of genus Panthera.

Cameleopards are none of the above.

Janet.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Why is one of the sides inscribed in Spanish? Maybe "Dromedary" is Mexican-Spanish
for "Camel," and if they used the name "Camel" on product marketed in Mexico,
the logo would not be understood.

[Janet]

In article <1nha7wa.136...@de-ster.xs4all.nl>, nospam@de-
ster.demon.nl says...

Lions and tigers tried that, resulting in ligers and tigons.

Janet

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

I imagine that's a thinko, but it's the other way round

> however, the latter can also be "un chameau d'Arabie".


--

athel

[musika]

Neither are camelopards.


--
Ray
UK

[J. J. Lodder]

And in other European languages. (French, German, and probably others)
There are Dromedaries and Camels,
and these are distinct species.
There is no collective word for the class that comprises both.
(just like there is no word in English for both lions and tigers)

There is 'Kameelachtigen' (Lit. camel-alikes) but this corresponds with
scientific Camelidae, and E. Camelid.
So that includes lama and vicugna too,

Jan

[Cheryl]

Lions and tigers are known collectively in English as "cats". Some
prefer "big cats" - as with many common names for animals, there is some
variation. The two types of camels are known collectively as "camels"
although, as with cats, the term also commonly applies to one particular
species in the 'camel' category.

The reason scientific terminology is so important is that common
terminology - like "camel" - sometimes follows scientific species
classification and sometimes doesn't. It's not particularly unusual to
notice that a common name for an animal is also applied to another
animal which, scientifically speaking, is not the same species as the
first. Or that a common name applies to a group of animals which are
not, scientifically speaking, the same species.

[charles]

In article <p2mngex...@news.ducksburg.com>,

That is worrying. In English it's the single humper that is the dromedary

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

[bebe...@aol.com]

Yes, there is: actually, their common _class_ is "mammals".

As you said, they are distinct species, but one level up
in the taxonomic classification, they both belong to the
_genus_ Camelus, and that genus only includes camels and
dromedaries.

[Adam Funk]

Some kind of editing mistake. I know that in English you turn the
first letter 90° to distinguish the "D" camel & the "B" camel.


--
There is no Internet of Things. There are only many unpatched,
vulnerable, small computers on the Internet.
@netik