The Fat Lady Sings- meaning?
Dr Edmund Byrne
Anyone know the origin of the saying:
"The Show is not over until the Fat Lady sings."?
Anandashankar Mazumdar
On Tue, 8 Apr 1997, Brian Cubbison wrote:
> "the opera ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."
"_Till_ the fat lady sings," I think
Ananda
Brian Cubbison
Football coach Darrell Royal is credited with originating the phrase,
"the opera ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."
Page One Syracuse Online
http://www.syracuse.com/pageone
N.Mitchum
Brian Cubbison wrote:
--------
> Football coach Darrell Royal is credited with originating the phrase,
> "the opera ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."
And Yogi Berra said, "It ain't over until it's over."
Also, "Ninety percent of this game is half mental."
--- NM (himself half-mental)
Bill Kinkaid
far...@primenet.com (Iain Farquhar) wrote:
>>>(1) I often hear or read something like "it is not over until
>>>the fat lady sings". What exactly does it mean and where does
>>>it originates?
>>
>>I'm pretty sure this refers to the old-time Wagnerian divas, who were
>>hefty ladies (but with glorious voices, unmatched today!!!!) So I
>>guess they meant the opera isn't over until the diva does her last
>>thing. Corrections welcomed.
>
>Since a Wagnerian singer has to be heard over a massive orchestra,
>they need all the power they can get to resonate over those Wagner
>tubas. Thus such singers tend to be beefy, whether male or female.
>Tristan and Isolde, and Goetterdaemerung are both extremely long
>operas which end after the hefty heroines (Isolde and Brunnhilde
>respectively) sing for around 15 to 20 minutes straight. Both final
>arias are magnificent pieces of music though and well worth the wait.
>
>Iain
Was it Yogi Berra or Casey Stengel who came up with that saying?
A friend of mine had another interesting take on the expression,
believing it to refer to Kate Smith singing "God Bless America" for
the Philadelphia Flyers in the 1970s (in place of the scratchy old
records that were usually used in those days). Usually the Flyers only
brought her in when they were down 3 games to 1 or something like
that. Of course, things weren't quite over at that point. With her
singing the Flyers won two Stanley Cups. After she died, they've tried
to have other people sing GBA, but without the same heart as Kate, and
without any more Stanley Cups.
Bill in Vancouver
(to respond by e-mail,
delete DIESPAMDIE)
Cissy . Thorpe
On Fri, 11 Apr 1997, Bill Kinkaid wrote:
> Was it Yogi Berra or Casey Stengel who came up with that saying?
> A friend of mine had another interesting take on the expression,
> believing it to refer to Kate Smith singing "God Bless America" for
> the Philadelphia Flyers in the 1970s (in place of the scratchy old
> records that were usually used in those days). Usually the Flyers only
> brought her in when they were down 3 games to 1 or something like
> that. Of course, things weren't quite over at that point. With her
> singing the Flyers won two Stanley Cups. After she died, they've tried
> to have other people sing GBA, but without the same heart as Kate, and
> without any more Stanley Cups.
>
>
> Bill in Vancouver
> (to respond by e-mail,
> delete DIESPAMDIE)
>
>
"It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings" is generally credited to Dan
Cook, sports caster extrodinare for KENS in San Antonio, Texas.
Cissy
Dr. Peter Kittel
In article <335D18...@zaz.servicom.es> Reuben Woolley <r.wo...@zaz.servicom.es> writes:
>about 35 years ago (Brit. Eng.). " Till" was considered, I think, to be
>nonstandard.
In German school I learnt that "till" were the short form of "until".
When I then visited UK (Brighton) in 1968, people there told me that
the word "till" (spoken, so not regarding spelling) did not exist,
they had never heard it. Oops.
--
Best Regards, Dr. Peter Kittel // http://www.pios.de of PIOS
Private Site in Frankfurt, Germany \X/ office: pet...@pios.de
Brian J Goggin
On 23 Apr 97 17:49:13 MEZ, pet...@combo.ganesha.com (Dr. Peter Kittel)
wrote:
>In article <335D18...@zaz.servicom.es> Reuben Woolley <r.wo...@zaz.servicom.es> writes:
>>Anandashankar Mazumdar wrote:
>>> On Tue, 8 Apr 1997, Brian Cubbison wrote:
>>>
>>> > "the opera ain't over 'til the fat lady sings."
>>>
>>> "_Till_ the fat lady sings," I think
>>
>>I remember seeing " 'til" as a contraction of and alternative to "until"
>>about 35 years ago (Brit. Eng.). " Till" was considered, I think, to be
>>nonstandard.
>
>In German school I learnt that "till" were the short form of "until".
>When I then visited UK (Brighton) in 1968, people there told me that
>the word "till" (spoken, so not regarding spelling) did not exist,
>they had never heard it. Oops.
>
The Brightonians were wrong, at least for British English. *Till* (two
Ls) is a word in its own right; it is not an abbreviation of *until*;
it is an older word.
*'til*, with an apostrophe at the start and just one L, is a
contraction of *until*.
bjg
colf...@minn.net
On Thu, 24 Apr 1997 19:05:33 +0800, Chris Perrott
<cper...@pacific.net.sg> wrote:
>Not to mention that 'till' is what cash registers were called before
>they were invented. Also something farmers do, but it doesn't involve
>sheep.
Well, it might, but it would be very inefficient.
Carol from Mpls.
John Davies
In article <335F3E...@pacific.net.sg>, Chris Perrott
<cper...@pacific.net.sg> writes
>Not to mention that 'till' is what cash registers were called before
>they were invented. Also something farmers do, but it doesn't involve
>sheep.
Does any such activity exist? Most of us will take some convincing,
after the recent shenanigans in this group.
--
John Davies (jo...@redwoods.demon.co.uk)
On that of which one cannot bleat, one must remain silent.
Thomas Schenk
Dr. Peter Kittel wrote:
> In German school I learnt that "till" were the short form of "until".
> When I then visited UK (Brighton) in 1968, people there told me that
> the word "till" (spoken, so not regarding spelling) did not exist,
> they had never heard it. Oops.
The people of Brighton would appear to have been ill-informed. Both
forms are thriving in British and American usage. *Until* is possibly,
if only marginally, more common. *Until* is still more commonly seen and
heard at the beginning of a sentence than is *till*. Neither should be
confused with *'til*, which is a contraction of *until*, and restricted
to poetic use. The only possibly incorrect thing that your teacher may
have taught you was that *till* is the short form of *until*.
Eymologically *till* is the older word, and *until* might be considered
its longer form, somewhat like *to* and *unto*.
Tom
--
************************
Dr Thomas M Schenk
Laguna Beach, California
joy beeson
John Davies <jo...@redwoods.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In article <335F3E...@pacific.net.sg>, Chris Perrott
><cper...@pacific.net.sg> writes
>>Not to mention that 'till' is what cash registers were called before
>>they were invented. Also something farmers do, but it doesn't involve
>>sheep.
>Does any such activity exist? Most of us will take some convincing,
>after the recent shenanigans in this group.
>--
Just yesterday I went out to the garden to check on the "tilth" of the
soil --good tilth is something that soil loses if you till it too much
or at the wrong time. But nowadays, I say "cultivate". I'm not sure
just how much "till" covers; may have once meant more than is done by
the "rototiller". Which churns rather than tilling; don't use one
unless you absolutely have to.
The drawer of a cash register was called a "till" for a long time.
Joy Beeson
to use my e-mail address, replace the "x" with my first initial.
Lou Wiener
I just checked the RHUD and surprising it has the definition of till
as the usage of a shot form of until listed before the till as in
tilling the soil by a farmer or till as in the cash drawer.
I had always thought that the short form of until was til.
I am curious if the order of definitions in the RHUD is an indication
of the more common usage first.
On Thu, 24 Apr 1997 19:05:33 +0800, Chris Perrott
<cper...@pacific.net.sg> wrote:
>Brian J Goggin wrote:
>> *Till* (two
>> Ls) is a word in its own right; it is not an abbreviation of *until*;
>> it is an older word.
>>
>> *'til*, with an apostrophe at the start and just one L, is a
>> contraction of *until*.
>
>Not to mention that 'till' is what cash registers were called before
>they were invented. Also something farmers do, but it doesn't involve
>sheep.
>
>--
>Chris Perrott
Regards,
-lou-