collective noun 'crush'

[occam]

I know we keep returning to this topic (collective nouns) periodically
here in AUE.

Today I stumbled on a new one (to me) which does not involve wildlife or
other exotic species. From the print version of the Financial Times
(28-01-2020):

"...tomorrow, David Solomon, who became the chief executive in October
2018, will stand before a crush of shareholders, analysts and
journalists at the bank's first ever investor day."

A 'crush', which I assume applies to shareholders AND analysts AND
journalists, is a new one to me. I wonder if it could also be applied to
other enthusistc throngs also e.g. a crush of music fans, baseball fans
etc?

[Spains Harden]

Replace "a" with "the" and it becomes standard: "the crush of
racegoers", rather than "a crush of racegoers".

[Tony Cooper]

A "crush" is simply a large number of people who are asking questions,
trying to make a point, or gathered for some specific purpose.

A crush of autograph seekers may approach a sports or entertainment
celebrity. A crush of reporters may gather to photograph and ask
questions of a sports, entertainment, or political figure.

A synonym might be "throng" in this context.

Standard AmE usage.

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Tony Cooper]

Not in my English. That would be "a crowd". A "crush" has to be
gathered in one area around a figure or small group of figures.

[Spains Harden]

"He arrived back to find a crush of reporters".
"He made his way through the crush of reporters".

[Jerry Friedman]

The OED has

4.
a. The crowding together of a number of things, or esp. persons, so
that they press forcibly upon each other; the mass so crowded together.
1806 T. S. Surr Winter in London III. iii. 136 No rank, no sex,
could possibly receive exemption from the general crush.
1830 A. Cunningham Lives Brit. Painters (ed. 2) II. 54 The crush
to see it was very great.
1841 C. Dickens Barnaby Rudge xxxvii. 148 A crush of carts and
chairs and coaches.

b. A crowded social gathering. colloquial.
1832 T. B. Macaulay Lett. 18 July I fell in with her at Lady Grey's
great crush.
1888 Mrs. H. Ward Robert Elsmere III. v. xxxv. 100 It [sc. the party]
isn't a crush. I have only asked about thirty or forty people.

c. A funnel-shaped fenced passage along which cattle, sheep, or horses
are driven for branding, dipping, etc. In full crush-pen.

[citations skipped]

d. A group or gang of persons; = crowd n.3 2c; spec. a body of troops; a
unit of a regiment. slang (originally U.S.).
1904 ‘No. 1500’ Life in Sing Sing 247 Crush, a crowd.
1916 ‘B. Cable’ Action Front 151 You want to ask something about
someone in the old crush [sc. regiment].
1924 A. J. Small Frozen Gold i. 40 Any one of that crush would do
murder for no more than that 500 dollars reward.
1927 Observer 12 June 10/3 The best recruiter is the man who is
pleased with his ‘crush’.
1931 R. Dark (title) Shakespeare--and that crush.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Quinn C]

* Jerry Friedman:

I was familiar with a., but not with the shift from the happening to
the group of people, as in b. and d.

--
But I have nver chosen my human environment. I have always
borrowed it from someone like you or Monk or Doris.
-- Jane Rule, This Is Not For You, p.152

[Jack]

Another synonym currently used is "gaggle".

--
John

[Tony Cooper]

On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 09:38:08 -0800 (PST), Spains Harden

Those are examples of what I described. The "He" in those examples is
the one who is being gathered around. If "He" was not yet where the
reporters were gathered, they'd be a "crowd" waiting for him.

[Tony Cooper]

I think a throng is larger than a gaggle, but both are smaller than a
horde.

[David Kleinecke]

Every time I hear the word "horde" I get the same mental picture. A
loud noise as a horde of horsemen move unseen through the valley on
the other side of the hills.

Could someone, perhaps, tell me what the heck I am flashing on?

[Jerry Friedman]

Sense d. was new to me too, probably because it's old.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Peter T. Daniels]

"The" vs. "a" would indicates either that the crush had been previously
mentioned, or that a restrictive relative followed its noun.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
is known in the business as a scrum.

bill

[Ross]

It reminds me of "push", which I first encountered as
an Australianism, but turns out to be a little older:

OED push,n. 7a. A press of people, a crowd, throng (1718-)
AusNatDic: a. A group of people having a common interest
or background, a coterie. b. (Hist) A gang of larrikins.

It seemed that quite a number of verbs of pressure
could be (or had been) nominalized in a similar way,
like "press" in the above definition, and

OED squeeze, n. 4.4. colloquial. A crowded assembly or social gathering. (1779-1893)

similarly "jam" in e.g.
1827 H. W. Longfellow in S. Longfellow Life H. W. Longfellow (1891) I. viii. 123 I have been several
times to her evening jams; but, as it was Lent, there
was no dancing.

"throng" is probably from a Germanic root meaning
'push, press' (ME thring, German dringen)

and "crowd" itself was a verb (OE crúdan 'press')
long before it was a noun.

[Peter Young]

Are we being goosed?

Peter.

--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Hg)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk

[John Varela]

A crowd is a lot of people in one place; a crush is a crowd so dense
as to be difficult or even dangerous to pass through. There is a
crowd at a sports event, but a crush on Bourbon Street, New Orleans,
at Mardi Gras. A crowd at a (British) football stadium could become
a crush.

--
John Varela

[John Varela]

On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 16:45:09 UTC, Tony Cooper
<tonyco...@invalid.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Jan 2020 17:04:07 +0100, occam <oc...@nowhere.nix> wrote:
>
> >I know we keep returning to this topic (collective nouns) periodically
> >here in AUE.
> >
> >Today I stumbled on a new one (to me) which does not involve wildlife or
> >other exotic species. From the print version of the Financial Times
> >(28-01-2020):
> >
> >"...tomorrow, David Solomon, who became the chief executive in October
> >2018, will stand before a crush of shareholders, analysts and
> >journalists at the bank's first ever investor day."
> >
> >A 'crush', which I assume applies to shareholders AND analysts AND
> >journalists, is a new one to me. I wonder if it could also be applied to
> > other enthusistc throngs also e.g. a crush of music fans, baseball fans
> >etc?
>
> A "crush" is simply a large number of people who are asking questions,
> trying to make a point, or gathered for some specific purpose.

Not according to M-W.

> A crush of autograph seekers may approach a sports or entertainment
> celebrity. A crush of reporters may gather to photograph and ask
> questions of a sports, entertainment, or political figure.
>
> A synonym might be "throng" in this context.
>
> Standard AmE usage.
>


--

John Varela

[John Varela]

Game of Thrones?

--
John Varela

[Quinn C]

* David Kleinecke:

See a Past life regression specialist.

--
They spend so much time fussing about my identity
that I really shouldn't have to bother with it
myself at all.
-- Margaret Atwood, The Edible Woman, p.223

[David Kleinecke]

On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 2:58:51 PM UTC-8, Quinn C wrote:
> * David Kleinecke:
>
> > On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 11:00:38 AM UTC-8, Tony Cooper wrote:
> >
> >> I think a throng is larger than a gaggle, but both are smaller than a
> >> horde.
> >
> > Every time I hear the word "horde" I get the same mental picture. A
> > loud noise as a horde of horsemen move unseen through the valley on
> > the other side of the hills.
> >
> > Could someone, perhaps, tell me what the heck I am flashing on?
>
> See a Past life regression specialist.

Once upon an LSD trip I lived a life as a warrior somewhere in
central Asia. I remember wearing bamboo armor and I remember
being confused when someone tried to explain to me the concept
of a city.

I was very impressed by the cover of the June 1939 issue of
Unknown which featured a story set in the same region. But
the incidents are very different.

I've lived other lifes in exotic places during LSD trips. One
vivid one was as a woman in Teotihuacan.

I haven't dropped acid for many years now.

[Peter Moylan]

Those terms refer to the size of the gathering. "Crowd" and "crush"
refer to the density, with "crush" being a crowd so dense that there is
a risk of death by suffocation or perhaps even compression.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

[Sam Plusnet]

On 28-Jan-20 20:23, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:

> A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
> is known in the business as a scrum.

That's very descriptive.

With the intended interviewee playing the role of the odd-shaped ball?

--
Sam Plusnet

[bil...@shaw.ca]

Precisely. Scrums usually ensue when an announcement has been made
or another newsworthy event has occurred, reporters from all media
are present and looking for more information, but no news conference
or other event has been organized where questions can be asked.

bill

[CDB]

A crush of admirers?

[CDB]

On 1/28/2020 8:57 PM, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:

> Sam Plusnet wrote:
>> bil...@shaw.ca wrote:

>>> A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
>>> is known in the business as a scrum.

>> That's very descriptive.

>> With the intended interviewee playing the role of the odd-shaped ball?

> Precisely. Scrums usually ensue when an announcement has been made
> or another newsworthy event has occurred, reporters from all media
> are present and looking for more information, but no news conference
> or other event has been organized where questions can be asked.

I think that idiom is Canadian. "Scrum" has been the word used in
Ottawa all my adult life for the crowd of reporters around a Minister,
especially one emerging from the Commons Chamber.

[CDB]

On 1/28/2020 2:00 PM, Tony Cooper wrote:
> Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>> Tony Cooper <tonyco...@invalid.com> wrote:
>>> occam <oc...@nowhere.nix> wrote:

>>>> I know we keep returning to this topic (collective nouns) periodically
>>>> here in AUE.

>>>> Today I stumbled on a new one (to me) which does not involve wildlife or
>>>> other exotic species. From the print version of the Financial Times
>>>> (28-01-2020):

>>>> "...tomorrow, David Solomon, who became the chief executive in October
>>>> 2018, will stand before a crush of shareholders, analysts and
>>>> journalists at the bank's first ever investor day."

>>>> A 'crush', which I assume applies to shareholders AND analysts AND
>>>> journalists, is a new one to me. I wonder if it could also be applied to
>>>> other enthusistc throngs also e.g. a crush of music fans, baseball fans
>>>> etc?

>>> A "crush" is simply a large number of people who are asking questions,
>>> trying to make a point, or gathered for some specific purpose.

>>> A crush of autograph seekers may approach a sports or entertainment
>>> celebrity. A crush of reporters may gather to photograph and ask
>>> questions of a sports, entertainment, or political figure.

>>> A synonym might be "throng" in this context.

>>> Standard AmE usage.

>> Another synonym currently used is "gaggle".

A gaggle of Honkeys?

[Don P]

On 28-Jan-20 8:27 PM, Sam Plusnet wrote:
> On 28-Jan-20 20:23, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:
>
>> A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
>> is known in the business as a scrum.
>
> That's very descriptive.

Scrum is peculiarly appropriate because at its source (rugby football) a
scrum begins as an orderly arrangement and always changes fast into a
disorganized melee (q.v.)

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

[Jerry Friedman]

Masher!

--
Jerry Friedman

[CDB]

On 1/29/2020 10:35 AM, Jerry Friedman wrote:

> CDB wrote:
>> occam wrote:

>>> I know we keep returning to this topic (collective nouns)
>>> periodically here in AUE.

[and "crush" in particular]

>> A crush of admirers?

> Masher!

OK, "young admirers".

[Jerry Friedman]

On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 7:01:06 AM UTC-7, CDB wrote:
> On 1/28/2020 2:00 PM, Tony Cooper wrote:
> > Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> Tony Cooper <tonyco...@invalid.com> wrote:
> >>> occam <oc...@nowhere.nix> wrote:

...

> >>>> "...tomorrow, David Solomon, who became the chief executive in October
> >>>> 2018, will stand before a crush of shareholders, analysts and
> >>>> journalists at the bank's first ever investor day."
>
> >>>> A 'crush', which I assume applies to shareholders AND analysts AND
> >>>> journalists, is a new one to me. I wonder if it could also be applied to
> >>>> other enthusistc throngs also e.g. a crush of music fans, baseball fans
> >>>> etc?
>
> >>> A "crush" is simply a large number of people who are asking questions,
> >>> trying to make a point, or gathered for some specific purpose.
>
> >>> A crush of autograph seekers may approach a sports or entertainment
> >>> celebrity. A crush of reporters may gather to photograph and ask
> >>> questions of a sports, entertainment, or political figure.
>
> >>> A synonym might be "throng" in this context.
>
> >>> Standard AmE usage.
>
> >> Another synonym currently used is "gaggle".
>
> A gaggle of Honkeys?

All looking for Ansers.

--
Jerry Friedman

[CDB]

On 1/29/2020 1:10 PM, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> CDB wrote:

>> Tony Cooper wrote:
>>> Jack:

[the masher with the pash is in the throng that is strong]

>>>> Another synonym currently used is "gaggle".

>> A gaggle of Honkeys?

> All looking for Ansers.

As long as there's money in them, you know.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

It's also used as a verb: We'll scrum him in the corridor before
he has a chance to duck into his office.

bill

[Anders D. Nygaard]

Den 29-01-2020 kl. 00:21 skrev David Kleinecke:
> [...LSD trips...]

> I haven't dropped acid for many years now.

So you have dropped acid?

More seriously: Does your usage refer to an action of dripping
e.g. the acid solution onto a blotting paper, or is there some
other rationale?

/Anders, Denmark.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

"Dropping" acid refers to the act of swallowing the blotting paper
or whatever other medium has been infused with the LSD. The same
applies to mescaline, psilocybin and any other psychedelic drug
that is taken orally.

bill

[David Kleinecke]

I do not include weed as one of the possible psychedelic drugs. Even
if I prefer to take it orally (brownies).

[Mark Brader]

William Boei:

>>> A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
>>> is known in the business as a scrum.

Don Phillipson:

> Scrum is peculiarly appropriate because at its source (rugby football) a
> scrum begins as an orderly arrangement and always changes fast into a
> disorganized melee (q.v.)

For moment I read that last line as "disorganized males". Which is also
appropriate to the origins of the scrum in rugby!
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "Truth speak from any chair."
m...@vex.net -- Charlie Chan at the Wax Museum

[Lewis]

You've never heard the phrase "drop acid"?

It means to take a does of LSD.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide>

--
Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'. --The Last
Continent

[Lewis]

Marijuana is not a psychedelic drug.

Psychedelic drugs are things like "magic" mushrooms, LSD, Ecstasy, PCP,
Moxy, etc.

Other drugs like Meth, cocaine, marijuana, heroin, or speed are nit
psychedelics.

--
'Listen,' said Rincewind. 'It's all over, do you see? You can't put
the spells back in the book, you can't unsay what's been said,
you can't-' 'You can try!' --The Light Fantastic

[Madhu]

* David Kleinecke <e5f75c2d-94ec-4006...@googlegroups.com> :
Wrote on Tue, 28 Jan 2020 15:21:39 -0800 (PST):

> On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 2:58:51 PM UTC-8, Quinn C wrote:
>> * David Kleinecke:

>> > Every time I hear the word "horde" I get the same mental picture. A
>> > loud noise as a horde of horsemen move unseen through the valley on
>> > the other side of the hills.
>> > Could someone, perhaps, tell me what the heck I am flashing on?

Was it like the scenes in LOTR or maybe other movies?

A scene of vast expanses, plains from a distance, that darken up with as
if a shadow was crossing over them, and then shown to be armies
advancing. (perhaps more like swarms than hordes Also I've not seen the
movie myself except for a few seconds when walking across the room when
it was playing, etc.)

> Once upon an LSD trip I lived a life as a warrior somewhere in
> central Asia. I remember wearing bamboo armor and I remember
> being confused when someone tried to explain to me the concept
> of a city.

I had an ununsual vivid dream of a battle which I presumed was set in
central asia. I was actually asleep on a train which was going between
Mumbai and Bangalore. I was in the midst of some battle and perceived
reactions in vivid detail - mostly details on the ground. but also of
armour and some horses. And I was not under the influence of any drugs,
and put it was the influence of some evil spirits in some specific
region of Karnataka through which I was passing.

(More unsolicited and irrelevant details may be in order. My
co-passenger in the otherwise empty compartment was a devout muslim
youth who did namaz and ate carefully a elaborately prepared mixture of
betel-leaf and betel-nut at regular intervals. When I entered the
compartment it was full of muslims, I counted 15 people in the bay with
6 reserved berths. I sighed and thought this was going to be another
unenventful typical uncomfortable rail journey but I was
wrong. Apparently they were his friends giving him a "send off" and they
all alighted when the train started moving leaving us alone in an empty
compartment)

> I was very impressed by the cover of the June 1939 issue of
> Unknown which featured a story set in the same region. But
> the incidents are very different.
>
> I've lived other lifes in exotic places during LSD trips. One
> vivid one was as a woman in Teotihuacan.

When I traveled a lot (unfortunately almost always without access to any
recreational drugs) I used to get dreams localized to the particular
place I happened to be sleeping at - which I could not explain on the
basis of any experience or memories or impressions I had accumulated
elsewhere in life. Conan Doyle and other 19-20th century occultists
have documented cases of people getting "other people's dreams" prior to
waking up. I've had maybe 6-12 of these in all. I don't believe in
ghosts and so I have to put it down to local evil spirits projecting
images on the canvas of my main.

[Peter Young]

On 30 Jan 2020 Lewis <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <8654c755-017e-4889...@googlegroups.com> David
> Kleinecke <dklei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 4:36:18 PM UTC-8, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, January 29, 2020 at 3:53:34 PM UTC-8, Anders D. Nygaard
>>> wrote:
>>>> Den 29-01-2020 kl. 00:21 skrev David Kleinecke:
>>>>> [...LSD trips...]
>>>>> I haven't dropped acid for many years now.
>>>>
>>>> So you have dropped acid?
>>>>
>>>> More seriously: Does your usage refer to an action of dripping
>>>> e.g. the acid solution onto a blotting paper, or is there some
>>>> other rationale?
>>>>
>>> "Dropping" acid refers to the act of swallowing the blotting paper
>>> or whatever other medium has been infused with the LSD. The same
>>> applies to mescaline, psilocybin and any other psychedelic drug
>>> that is taken orally.

>> I do not include weed as one of the possible psychedelic drugs. Even
>> if I prefer to take it orally (brownies).

> Marijuana is not a psychedelic drug.

> Psychedelic drugs are things like "magic" mushrooms, LSD, Ecstasy, PCP,
> Moxy, etc.

> Other drugs like Meth, cocaine, marijuana, heroin, or speed are nit
> psychedelics.

I never knew that nits needed these drugs.

[Madhu]

* bil...@shaw.ca <a49a53bf-939d-44ea...@googlegroups.com> :
Wrote on Wed, 29 Jan 2020 16:36:15 -0800 (PST):

> "Dropping" acid refers to the act of swallowing the blotting paper
> or whatever other medium has been infused with the LSD. The same
> applies to mescaline, psilocybin and any other psychedelic drug
> that is taken orally.

"Acid drops" was (were?) apparently some consumable product sold in
shops in Between-War-Britain. I've seen it in Dorothy Sayers.

[Katy Jennison]

Still available. Acid (sour) sweets (hard candies) flavoured with lemon
or an equivalent.

--
Katy Jennison

[Quinn C]

I've never used psychedelic drugs, but there was a time when I had
daydreams - sometimes about remote South Sea islands, but more often
about the Mongolian steppe - when life felt overwhelming. The latter
usually included some horses, but no hordes.

--
If someone has a penis (or we think they have a penis) we use
he/him/his pronouns and treat them like a boy/man. If someone
has a vagina (or we think they have a vagina) we use she/her/
hers pronouns and treat them like a girl/woman.
See what I did there? -- Kyl Myers

[Quinn C]

* Don P:

> On 28-Jan-20 8:27 PM, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>> On 28-Jan-20 20:23, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:
>>
>>> A group of reporters all trying to get close to an interview subject
>>> is known in the business as a scrum.
>>
>> That's very descriptive.
>
> Scrum is peculiarly appropriate because at its source (rugby football) a
> scrum begins as an orderly arrangement and always changes fast into a
> disorganized melee (q.v.)

That's not the expected outcome in the software development
methodology, though. Rarely in our daily scrums, thankfully.

I was curious who came up with that name - apparently, it was two
Japanese people!

--
I'll call you the next time I pass through your star system.
-- Commander William T. Riker

[Quinn C]

* Jerry Friedman:

Not believing the platyptudes they get instead.

--
"I didn't mind getting old when I was young, either," I said.
"It's the being old now that's getting to me."
-- J. Scalzi, Old Man's War

[Anders D. Nygaard]

Den 30-01-2020 kl. 15:18 skrev Lewis:
> In message <r0t5tr$518$1...@dont-email.me> Anders D. Nygaard <news2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Den 29-01-2020 kl. 00:21 skrev David Kleinecke:
>>> [...LSD trips...]
>>> I haven't dropped acid for many years now.
>
>> So you have dropped acid?
>
>> More seriously: Does your usage refer to an action of dripping
>> e.g. the acid solution onto a blotting paper, or is there some
>> other rationale?
>
> You've never heard the phrase "drop acid"?

Yes I have.

> It means to take a does of LSD.

Indeed. I was wondering, why "drop"?
Is the blotting paper "dropped" into your mouth; are LSD "drops" dripped
onto the blotting paper, or what. Or is it just a random verb that
happens to be used in this context?

/Anders, Denmark.

[Lewis]

In message <r16e0h$rh4$2...@dont-email.me> Anders D. Nygaard <news2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Den 30-01-2020 kl. 15:18 skrev Lewis:
>> In message <r0t5tr$518$1...@dont-email.me> Anders D. Nygaard <news2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Den 29-01-2020 kl. 00:21 skrev David Kleinecke:
>>>> [...LSD trips...]
>>>> I haven't dropped acid for many years now.
>>
>>> So you have dropped acid?
>>
>>> More seriously: Does your usage refer to an action of dripping
>>> e.g. the acid solution onto a blotting paper, or is there some
>>> other rationale?
>>
>> You've never heard the phrase "drop acid"?

> Yes I have.

>> It means to take a does of LSD.

> Indeed. I was wondering, why "drop"?

LSD is a liquid, and you took it originally with a dropper. Paper came
along later.

That said, no one knows for sure and the slang around drugs is often
intentionally obtuse.

--
RTFM replies are great, but please specify exactly which FM to R

[Mack A. Damia]

Agree. Originally taken in liquid form - "a drop of acid" on the
tongue.

Noun became verb.

Surely you can faith this.

[Quinn C]

* Anders D. Nygaard:

People are "dropping" pills, too, referring to e.g. ecstasy, so I
believe it can mean (dropping them in your mouth and) swallowing.

--
Quinn C
My pronouns are they/them
(or other gender-neutral ones)

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I can't say that "dropping" LSD or some other drug never referred to
"drops" being dripped, but I think it's unlikely. I was around in
the mid- to late 1960s when that term was being used in North American
drug culture. It meant swallowing the pill or piece of blotter paper
or mushroom that contained the LSD, mescalin, psilocybin, etc.

bill

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2020-02-03 06:03:52 +0000, bil...@shaw.ca said:

> On Sunday, February 2, 2020 at 9:42:54 PM UTC-8, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Anders D. Nygaard:
>>
>>> Den 30-01-2020 kl. 15:18 skrev Lewis:
>>>> In message <r0t5tr$518$1...@dont-email.me> Anders D. Nygaard
>>>> <news2...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Den 29-01-2020 kl. 00:21 skrev David Kleinecke:
>>>>>> [...LSD trips...]
>>>>>> I haven't dropped acid for many years now.
>>>>
>>>>> So you have dropped acid?
>>>>
>>>>> More seriously: Does your usage refer to an action of dripping
>>>>> e.g. the acid solution onto a blotting paper, or is there some
>>>>> other rationale?
>>>>
>>>> You've never heard the phrase "drop acid"?
>>>
>>> Yes I have.
>>>
>>>> It means to take a does of LSD.
>>>
>>> Indeed. I was wondering, why "drop"?
>>> Is the blotting paper "dropped" into your mouth; are LSD "drops" dripped
>>> onto the blotting paper, or what. Or is it just a random verb that
>>> happens to be used in this context?
>>
>> People are "dropping" pills, too, referring to e.g. ecstasy, so I
>> believe it can mean (dropping them in your mouth and) swallowing.
>>
> I can't say that "dropping" LSD or some other drug never referred to
> "drops" being dripped, but I think it's unlikely.

Yesterday we watched a replay of a mystery (Alex Hugo from 2015) in
which the murderer dripped drops of LSD onto sugar cubes that he gave
to his victims and convinced them that they could fly from cliffs and
other high places.

> I was around in
> the mid- to late 1960s when that term was being used in North American
> drug culture. It meant swallowing the pill or piece of blotter paper
> or mushroom that contained the LSD, mescalin, psilocybin, etc.
>
> bill

--
athel

[Peter T. Daniels]

More likely, it's simply transferred from the use with "acid," with no
reference to any physical action. We "take" pills.

[Lewis]

But the term appears to date from when people were taking LSD by
literally dropping the liquid onto their tongues.

--
Space Directive 723: Terraformers are expressly forbidden from
recreating Swindon.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

It's possible, but I wasn't around for that part. I know that Timothy Leary
and the gang were taking LSD in the 1960-62 period, but I was 13
in 1960 and I don't know if they put drops on their tongues
or whether they called it "dropping acid".

I do know that when LSD and other hallucinogens
arrived in my neck of the woods in about 1966-67, it no longer came
in actual drops but -- usually -- on little pieces of blotter paper,
and it was called blotter acid. There was also windowpane acid,
which came on little strips of gelatin.

That's a long-winded way of getting around to my point, which is
that when LSD became available where I lived, it was no longer
in liquid form, and taking it on a piece of paper or whatever
was called "dropping" acid. So was taking any other hallucinogen
orally.

I knew a grad student in the chemistry department at my university
who made LSD, but it was distributed on blotter paper.

bill

[Ross]

Green's earliest citation is interesting:

1961 Rigney & Smith Real Bohemia xx: The drugs are
either inhaled, swallowed or injected […] To take
orally is to ‘drop it’.

This is in San Francisco, but I think at a time before
LSD was widely available. I didn't find any reference
to it in the book. The passage quoted seems to be
concerned mainly with heroin. I suppose they might have
dropped it on their tongues -- don't know much about
such things.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I wonder if they had encountered cocaine, which was
normally snorted through the nose.

>
> This is in San Francisco, but I think at a time before
> LSD was widely available. I didn't find any reference
> to it in the book. The passage quoted seems to be
> concerned mainly with heroin. I suppose they might have
> dropped it on their tongues -- don't know much about
> such things.

We -- most of the people I knew who indulged in drugs in the 1960s --
drew heavy black lines between things that were smoked, snorted,
ingested and injected. Smoking, mainly weed and hashish -- was okay. Eating
those in brownies or whatever was also okay, but you had to learn
that it took time to return to your unstoned self. Anything that
was shot -- injected -- was dangerous; you could become addicted,
or overdose and die. It was a line I never crossed, and I never
considered trying heroin.

Hallucinogenics took too much time. About the third time I dropped
something it took 24 hours before I felt normal again, and that was
way too long. That was on the day of the first moonwalk, and that makes
it July 20, 1969.

It was the last time I took anything stronger than
a little weed.

bill

[Lewis]

But it is easy to check and find references for 1960-2 to "drop acid"

--
You know a thorn can main / But a lover does the same / A gem will
reflect light / And a Fool will marvel at the sight / A fool such
as me, /Who sees not the gold, but the beauty of the shine

[Ross]

Great! Tell us how!

[snide...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, February 4, 2020 at 4:17:14 PM UTC-8, Ross wrote:

> Green's earliest citation is interesting:
>
> 1961 Rigney & Smith Real Bohemia xx: The drugs are
> either inhaled, swallowed or injected […] To take
> orally is to ‘drop it’.
>
> This is in San Francisco, but I think at a time before
> LSD was widely available. I didn't find any reference
> to it in the book. The passage quoted seems to be
> concerned mainly with heroin. I suppose they might have
> dropped it on their tongues -- don't know much about
> such things.

I don't think heroin on the tongue does anything.
It was designed (developed) to require injection
because that was thought to bypass the addiction portals
that swallowed and smoked drugs went through
(and that thought was wrong).
Opium, both as pipe filler and laudanum,
was the drug crisis, and heroin was supposed to be the cure.

/dps

[Peter T. Daniels]

This and the following section ("Counterculture") suggest that LSD wasn't
available to the general public (i.e. not under CIA control) until 1963,
but it doesn't actually say so.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysergic_acid_diethylamide#History

This account is rather weird -- perhaps written under the influence?:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_lysergic_acid_diethylamide#From_1960_to_1980

[Lewis]

There's this webste you might have heard of, called google? It has a
vast array of search tools.

You might even find the reference someone else posted in this thread.

--
In Genua, stories came to life. In Genua, someone set out to make
dreams come true. Remember some of your dreams?

[Quinn C]

* snide...@gmail.com:

I know about snorting of heroin from TV, and Wikipedia says that it can
also be inhaled (vapor, not smoke) or swallowed, but that swallowing
isn't popular because it has multiple downsides (long delay, less effect
for the same dose.) Even rectal or vaginal application is mentioned.

--
A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against
his government.
-- Edward Abbey

[Ross]

Thank you, son, I do know about google. I was hoping
you might be able to tell me how to use it to find
examples of "drop acid" being used in 1960-62.

When you said it was "easy to check and find
references", I sorta assumed you might have
actually done so yourself, and might even provide
us with one or two of these references. But it
seems you meant "In theory it should be easy....".

> You might even find the reference someone else posted in this thread.

You wouldn't be thinking of the 1961 quotation I posted,
which had nothing to do with LSD?

[Lewis]

"drop acid" 1962 or 1961 or "1960"thought hte latter matches 1960s which
is less helpful.

> When you said it was "easy to check and find
> references", I sorta assumed you might have
> actually done so yourself, and might even provide

I had done so myself, but I did not keep the URLs I found. Since I had
no trouble finding them, it doesn't seem anyone else would.

--
"Are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"We think so, Brain! But dressing like twins is so tacky."

[snide...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday-ish, Lewis wrote:

> I had done so myself, but I did not keep the URLs I found. Since I had
> no trouble finding them, it doesn't seem anyone else would.

Browser history?

/dps

[Ross]

Yes, well, I assure you that occurred to me too. But I
have enough experience with google to know that it
would not be very useful. Let's see...
Googling "drop acid" 1961:

- The first hit is a discussion much like the one we're
having here, about the origin of the expression
"drop acid". The 1961 date occurs when somebody cites
exactly the same passage I cited, using "drop" to mean
taking drugs (not LSD) orally.

- The second hit is a Wikipedia article about someone
named Kevin Seconds. He was born in 1961. One of his
side band projects is called "Drop Acid".

- The third is a story about how Cary Grant took LSD
some time between 1958 and 1961. The phrase "drop acid"
is used by the writer of the story, but there is no
information about what CG may have called it at the time.

...and so on. Google tells me I still have 33,297
results to check. Yes, I know it's really only 146,
but I'm not encouraged to check even all of those.
I thought you might have some more efficient method.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Recall also that it wasn't "commercially" available until 1963. How the
CIA administered it before then wouldn't be particularly relevant to
the origin of the expression.

[David Kleinecke]

I wish I could remember what year it was when this happened:
I was over at Sasha Shulgin's [*] place when Owsley called and
asked Sasha for help with a batch of LSD he was brewing and
having trouble with.

[1] He has his own Wikipedia entry - remember Sasha is Alexander.

[Quinn C]

* Ross:

[...]

> ...and so on. Google tells me I still have 33,297
> results to check. Yes, I know it's really only 146,
> but I'm not encouraged to check even all of those.
> I thought you might have some more efficient method.

I checked about 10, didn't see anything else promising on the first 5
pages, then gave up.

Google Books, where the all sources are labeled with time, doesn't find
me any "drop acid" earlier than 1967.

--
The Eskimoes had fifty-two names for snow because it was
important to them, there ought to be as many for love.
-- Margaret Atwood, Surfacing (novel), p.106

[Snidely]

Lo, on the 2/5/2020, Quinn C did proclaim ...

Evidently the developers were doubly wrong.

/dps "not me, of course"

--
"I'm glad unicorns don't ever need upgrades."
"We are as up as it is possible to get graded!"
_Phoebe and Her Unicorn_, 2016.05.15

[bruce bowser]

On Thursday, January 30, 2020 at 9:55:59 AM UTC-5, Madhu wrote:
> * David Kleinecke <e5f75c2d-94ec-4006...@googlegroups.com> :
> Wrote on Tue, 28 Jan 2020 15:21:39 -0800 (PST):
> > On Tuesday, January 28, 2020 at 2:58:51 PM UTC-8, Quinn C wrote:
> >> * David Kleinecke:
> >> > Every time I hear the word "horde" I get the same mental picture. A
> >> > loud noise as a horde of horsemen move unseen through the valley on
> >> > the other side of the hills.
> >> > Could someone, perhaps, tell me what the heck I am flashing on?
> Was it like the scenes in LOTR or maybe other movies?
>
> A scene of vast expanses, plains from a distance, that darken up with as
> if a shadow was crossing over them, and then shown to be armies
> advancing. (perhaps more like swarms than hordes Also I've not seen the
> movie myself except for a few seconds when walking across the room when
> it was playing, etc.)
> > Once upon an LSD trip I lived a life as a warrior somewhere in
> > central Asia. I remember wearing bamboo armor and I remember
> > being confused when someone tried to explain to me the concept
> > of a city.
> I had an ununsual vivid dream of a battle which I presumed was set in
> central asia. I was actually asleep on a train which was going between
> Mumbai and Bangalore. I was in the midst of some battle and perceived
> reactions in vivid detail - mostly details on the ground. but also of
> armour and some horses. And I was not under the influence of any drugs,
> and put it was the influence of some evil spirits in some specific
> region of Karnataka through which I was passing.
>
> (More unsolicited and irrelevant details may be in order. My
> co-passenger in the otherwise empty compartment was a devout muslim
> youth who did namaz and ate carefully a elaborately prepared mixture of
> betel-leaf and betel-nut at regular intervals. When I entered the
> compartment it was full of muslims, I counted 15 people in the bay with
> 6 reserved berths. I sighed and thought this was going to be another
> unenventful typical uncomfortable rail journey but I was
> wrong. Apparently they were his friends giving him a "send off" and they
> all alighted when the train started moving leaving us alone in an empty
> compartment)
> > I was very impressed by the cover of the June 1939 issue of
> > Unknown which featured a story set in the same region. But
> > the incidents are very different.
> >
> > I've lived other lifes in exotic places during LSD trips. One
> > vivid one was as a woman in Teotihuacan.
> When I traveled a lot (unfortunately almost always without access to any
> recreational drugs) I used to get dreams localized to the particular
> place I happened to be sleeping at - which I could not explain on the
> basis of any experience or memories or impressions I had accumulated
> elsewhere in life. Conan Doyle and other 19-20th century occultists
> have documented cases of people getting "other people's dreams" prior to
> waking up. I've had maybe 6-12 of these in all. I don't believe in
> ghosts

How do you explain this video, then?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97Qbsjds7ek

[Richard Heathfield]

On 10/03/2022 6:48 pm, bruce bowser wrote:

<snip>

> How do you explain this video, then?:

Unscientific.

And I didn't even need to watch it, which is a great time saver.

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

[soup]

On 10/03/2022 18:48, bruce bowser wrote:

> How do you explain this video, then?:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97Qbsjds7ek

Seriously?
That video actually shows her walking into the lift from one angle,
whilst she appears to walk into the wall from another, perhaps blamable
on such a low resolution system.

I take it you are just trolling.
There are NO, repeat no, such things as ghosts.
When you are dead that is it, no long sleep, no complete blackness, no
heaven, no hell; nothing.

No crappy camera system or 'spiritual belief system' will change that .

[Dingbat]

It doesn't see possible that there can be ghosts. Yet, ghosts seem to be
attested, and better attested than the deities of those whose religion
denies ghosts. Look up Heidi Wyrick:
https://www.google.com/search?q=heidi wyrick