Re: Dais and podium

[Snidely]

Just this Saturday, Steve Hayes puzzled about:
> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?

2

/dps "the length in AUE units"

--
"I am not given to exaggeration, and when I say a thing I mean it"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain

[Peter Moylan]

On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:

> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?

Podium is easier to spell.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

[Snidely]

Snidely scribbled something on Sunday the 9/12/2021:

> Just this Saturday, Steve Hayes puzzled about:
>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>
> 2
>
> /dps "the length in AUE units"

The other factor is the organization where the impediment is placed.

/dps

--
As a colleague once told me about an incoming manager,
"He does very well in a suck-up, kick-down culture."
Bill in Vancouver

[Janet]

[This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
the cited author.]

In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>,
haye...@telkomsa.net says...

>
> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?

A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.

A dais is a raised platform that may accommodate any number of
elevated personages.

Janet

[Janet]

[This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
the cited author.]

In article <shkeje$pg3$2...@dont-email.me>, pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid
says...

>
> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>
> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>
> Podium is easier to spell.

Unless talking about plurals of dais and podium, then you're properly
buggered.

Janet

[J. J. Lodder]

Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:

> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
> the cited author.]
>
> In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>,
> haye...@telkomsa.net says...
> >
> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>
> A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.

That makes it yet another false friend between English and Dutch.

Jan

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:

> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
> the cited author.]

Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 07:24:54 +0200, Steve Hayes
<haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:

>What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?

They are similar, but a dais is larger.

[Janet]

In article <490bbcbf-2a72-43c0...@googlegroups.com>,
gram...@verizon.net says...

No, total accident. Apologies to all

Janeth

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2021-09-12 17:01:18 +0000, Janet said:

> In article <490bbcbf-2a72-43c0...@googlegroups.com>,
> gram...@verizon.net says...
>>
>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>>
>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>>> the cited author.]
>>
>> Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?

Golly: no self-awareness at all.

>
> No, total accident. Apologies to all
>
> Janeth

--
Athel -- French and British, living mainly in England until 1987.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 1:10:56 PM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2021-09-12 17:01:18 +0000, Janet said:
> > In article <490bbcbf-2a72-43c0...@googlegroups.com>,
> > gram...@verizon.net says...
> >> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:

> >>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
> >>> the cited author.]
> >> Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?
> Golly: no self-awareness at all.

> --
> Athel -- French and British, living mainly in England until 1987.

Explain yourself, cretin.

Every message she posted has that notice.

She did not reply to any message of mine, so I do not know whether
an email was actually mailed to the cited author.

Any "self-awareness" would be on Janet's part, yet Athel chose not
to place his nasty comment in an inappropriate place.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

Do you _always_ have to come across with an Aggressive Post, rather than politely ask why this is happening?

P.S. N.B. you are not 'everyone'.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 18:43:25 +1100
Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>
> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>
> Podium is easier to spell.
>

said you!

> --
> Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 3:20:45 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 06:37:04 -0700 (PDT)
> "Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:

> > > [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent
> > > to the cited author.]
> > Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?
>
> Do you _always_ have to come across with an Aggressive Post, rather than politely ask why this is happening?

Your stoogemaster will be proud that you have adopted his catchphrase.

> P.S. N.B. you are not 'everyone'.

You would be pleased to receive copies of newsgroup postings in
your email?

[spains...@gmail.com]

Janeth? Scottish for "Janet"? I have me bagpipes so pass me me dirk.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

Here in Canada, and I'm sure elsewhere, "podium" is now applied to apartment
and strata tower complexes build in the larger cities. Typically, such projects
cover an entire city block, with street-level retail in the entire block, two or three
stories of offices that stretch the entire block, and an apartment tower at each end
of the complex, rising to 40 or more stories. the bottom two or three stories
that run for the whole block are called the podium.

That design was developed in Vancouver and was, for a while at at least,
called "Vancouverism".

https://www.canadianarchitect.com/book-review-vancouverism/

bill

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <daf375e5-7c42-4dc1...@googlegroups.com>,

bil...@shaw.ca <bil...@shaw.ca> wrote:

>Here in Canada, and I'm sure elsewhere, "podium" is now applied to apartment
>and strata tower complexes build in the larger cities. Typically, such projects
>cover an entire city block, with street-level retail in the entire
>block, two or three
>stories of offices that stretch the entire block, and an apartment tower
>at each end
>of the complex, rising to 40 or more stories. the bottom two or three stories
>that run for the whole block are called the podium.

I think in the specific usage of architects, the "podium" is
specifically the lower-level parking and/or ground-floor retail part.
The meaning is much more obvious in a 5-over-1, because the "podium"
is the concrete part that the remainder of the structure (framed in
wood) sits on top of. When the International Building Code[1] was
revised to allow this style of construction, it immediately became
very popular among apartment developers, because a wood-frame building
is much cheaper to construct than concrete and steel. In cities where
land values are high, parking minimums made this size of apartment
building uneconomical to construct under the old code (because either
the parking would have had to be in a separate building, or the whole
structure would have had to be concrete).

-GAWollman

[1] Something of a misnomer; the IBC is a US-developed code (and not
even uniformly adopted across the whole of the US), although some
countries that are too small to develop their own codes have adopted
it.
--
Garrett A. Wollman | "Act to avoid constraining the future; if you can,
wol...@bimajority.org| act to remove constraint from the future. This is
Opinions not shared by| a thing you can do, are able to do, to do together."
my employers. | - Graydon Saunders, _A Succession of Bad Days_ (2015)

[J. J. Lodder]

bil...@shaw.ca <bil...@shaw.ca> wrote:

> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 5:11:47 AM UTC-7, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
> >
> > > [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
> > > the cited author.]
> > >
> > > In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>,
> > > haye...@telkomsa.net says...
> > > >
> > > > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
> > >
> > > A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.
> > That makes it yet another false friend between English and Dutch.
> >
> > Jan
> > > A dais is a raised platform that may accommodate any number of
> > > elevated personages.
> >
> Here in Canada, and I'm sure elsewhere, "podium" is now applied to
> apartment and strata tower complexes build in the larger cities.
> Typically, such projects cover an entire city block, with street-level
> retail in the entire block, two or three stories of offices that stretch
> the entire block, and an apartment tower at each end of the complex,
> rising to 40 or more stories. the bottom two or three stories that run for
> the whole block are called the podium.

That would seem to be in agreement
with the original Latin meanings of 'podium'.
The Dutch 'podium' is the stage on which acting or music making is done.
The English meaning is a later development.

> That design was developed in Vancouver and was, for a while at at least,
> called "Vancouverism".

So your 'Vancouverism' goes back to the original meaning,

Jan

[Richard Heathfield]

On 13/09/2021 10:52, Steve Hayes wrote:

> What IS the plural of "dais"?

"Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
you.

> And "podium", for that matter?

Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.

See also "predella" (plural "predelle").

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predella

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

[Peter Moylan]

On 13/09/21 20:52, Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:15:50 +0100, Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>

> What IS the plural of "dais"?

Daisies.

> And "podium", for that matter?

Either podios or podiatry. I'm not sure which.

[Janet]

In article <8ae17275-e858-441e...@googlegroups.com>,
gram...@verizon.net says...

Nobody here has received any email from me.

" Janet<nob...@home.com> " is very obviously a fake email address,
unusable for either incoming or outgoing emails. It won't send emails,
it won't receive emails.

The follow-up notice that recently appeared at the top of my posts,
had been accidentally triggered during a reboot; but as I rarely read my
new posts I hadn't noticed.

The error was politely brought to my attention, I politely apologised
for it and corrected it.

Too much to hope you'll ever do the same.


Janet

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2021-09-13 12:41:17 +0000, Janet said:

> In article <8ae17275-e858-441e...@googlegroups.com>,
> gram...@verizon.net says...
>>
>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 3:20:45 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 06:37:04 -0700 (PDT)
>>> "Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>>
>>>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent
>>>>> to the cited author.]
>>>> Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?
>>>
>>> Do you _always_ have to come across with an Aggressive Post, rather
>>> than politely ask why this is happening?
>>
>> Your stoogemaster will be proud that you have adopted his catchphrase.
>>
>>> P.S. N.B. you are not 'everyone'.
>>
>> You would be pleased to receive copies of newsgroup postings in
>> your email?
>
> Nobody here has received any email from me.
>
> " Janet<nob...@home.com> " is very obviously a fake email address,
> unusable for either incoming or outgoing emails. It won't send emails,
> it won't receive emails.
>
> The follow-up notice that recently appeared at the top of my posts,
> had been accidentally triggered during a reboot; but as I rarely read my
> new posts I hadn't noticed.

I assumed it was something like that and that it would be fixed quite soon.

>
> The error was politely brought to my attention, I politely apologised
> for it and corrected it.
>
> Too much to hope you'll ever do the same.

I suppose we shouldn't be surprised that the champion pisser-offer was
the one to whine about an obvious mistake.

[Richard Heathfield]

On 13/09/2021 13:41, Janet wrote:
> In article <8ae17275-e858-441e...@googlegroups.com>,
> gram...@verizon.net says...
>>
>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 3:20:45 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 06:37:04 -0700 (PDT)
>>> "Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>>
>>>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent
>>>>> to the cited author.]
>>>> Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?
>>>
>>> Do you _always_ have to come across with an Aggressive Post, rather than politely ask why this is happening?
>>
>> Your stoogemaster will be proud that you have adopted his catchphrase.
>>
>>> P.S. N.B. you are not 'everyone'.
>>
>> You would be pleased to receive copies of newsgroup postings in
>> your email?
>
> Nobody here has received any email from me.

I think I'm right in saying that I was your first "victim" (in a reply
about the colour of phlogiston), but I resolved that if I were going to
make a stink about it, I would do so quietly by email if ever the
threatened email arrived, which it never did.

Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD managed to
piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was pissed off by his
reaction (which seems to be a majority of those expressing an opinion).

[Quinn C]

* J. J. Lodder:

> Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>
>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>> the cited author.]
>>
>> In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>,
>> haye...@telkomsa.net says...
>>>
>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>
>> A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.
>
> That makes it yet another false friend between English and Dutch.

And German.

Looking for "podium discussion" online, it's pretty clear that most of
these English texts were written by German speakers. It should be "panel
discussion" in most cases. The "Podium" in this context is the whole
stage. In other cases it could be a raised part of any size.

--
Was den Juengeren fehlt, sind keine Botschaften, es ist der Sinn
fuer Zusammenhaenge. [Young people aren't short of messages, but
of a sense for interconnections.]
-- Helen Feng im Zeit-Int erview

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 9:09:09 PM UTC-4, bil...@shaw.ca wrote:
> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 5:11:47 AM UTC-7, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
> > > [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
> > > the cited author.]
> > > In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>,
> > > haye...@telkomsa.net says...

> > > > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
> > > A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.
> > That makes it yet another false friend between English and Dutch.

> > > A dais is a raised platform that may accommodate any number of
> > > elevated personages.
>
> Here in Canada, and I'm sure elsewhere, "podium" is now applied to apartment
> and strata tower complexes build in the larger cities. Typically, such projects
> cover an entire city block, with street-level retail in the entire block, two or three
> stories of offices that stretch the entire block, and an apartment tower at each end
> of the complex, rising to 40 or more stories. the bottom two or three stories
> that run for the whole block are called the podium.
>
> That design was developed in Vancouver and was, for a while at at least,
> called "Vancouverism".
>
> https://www.canadianarchitect.com/book-review-vancouverism/

"Mixed-use buildings" were pioneered in Chicago in the mid 1960s,
starting, maybe, with the John Hancock Tower, which was briefly the
tallest building in the world. Retail and commercial in the base, hotel
the next few floors, then apartments above. (Chicago doesn't have
Vancouver's luxury of being able to spread out.) Several are found
along Michigan Avenue, both the Magnificent Mile north of the River,
and the lakefront (well, there's a lot of park in between) portion along
the Loop.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 9:28:25 PM UTC-4, Garrett Wollman wrote:

> I think in the specific usage of architects, the "podium" is
> specifically the lower-level parking and/or ground-floor retail part.
> The meaning is much more obvious in a 5-over-1, because the "podium"
> is the concrete part that the remainder of the structure (framed in
> wood) sits on top of.

Hmm. In Chicago it's a "4 plus 1," four floors of apartments over the
parking area, the building entered only from a lobby in the middle of
the cars. No walls at ground level, just a forest of reinforced concrete
columns. Probably not frame construction above, because the Building
Code was developed after the 1871 Great Fire, with appropriate paranoia.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 8:41:25 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
> In article <8ae17275-e858-441e...@googlegroups.com>,
> gram...@verizon.net says...
> > On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 3:20:45 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> > > On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 06:37:04 -0700 (PDT)
> > > "Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 7:15:57 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:

> > > > > [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent
> > > > > to the cited author.]
> > > > Are you _trying_ to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup?
> > > Do you _always_ have to come across with an Aggressive Post, rather than politely ask why this is happening?
> > Your stoogemaster will be proud that you have adopted his catchphrase.
> > > P.S. N.B. you are not 'everyone'.
> > You would be pleased to receive copies of newsgroup postings in
> > your email?
>
> Nobody here has received any email from me.

The cretin was objecting to my assertion that no one would welcome
such a thing. Mine was the first complaint about the line to appear,
and the cretin chose to ignore your demurral.

> " Janet<nob...@home.com> " is very obviously a fake email address,
> unusable for either incoming or outgoing emails. It won't send emails,
> it won't receive emails.
>
> The follow-up notice that recently appeared at the top of my posts,
> had been accidentally triggered during a reboot; but as I rarely read my
> new posts I hadn't noticed.
>
> The error was politely brought to my attention, I politely apologised
> for it and corrected it.

By me, and indeed you did.

> Too much to hope you'll ever do the same.

Kindly take into account the chronology of postings. The only one
here needing to apologize is the cretin who used to be British, for
continuing to harp on the matter after you clarified it.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-4, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:

> I suppose we shouldn't be surprised that the champion pisser-offer was
> the one to whine about an obvious mistake.

Responding to about the sixth time I had seen the notice, cretin.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 8:55:00 AM UTC-4, Richard Heathfield wrote:

> I think I'm right in saying that I was your first "victim" (in a reply

That may well be. I saw it quite a few times before expressing annoyance.

> about the colour of phlogiston), but I resolved that if I were going to
> make a stink about it, I would do so quietly by email if ever the
> threatened email arrived, which it never did.
>
> Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD managed to
> piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was pissed off by his
> reaction (which seems to be a majority of those expressing an opinion).

"Those" achieving a count of One (1).

[Ken Blake]

On 9/13/2021 2:16 AM, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 13/09/21 20:52, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:15:50 +0100, Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>>
>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>>> the cited author.]
>>>
>>> In article <shkeje$pg3$2...@dont-email.me>, pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid
>>> says...
>>>>
>>>> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>>>
>>>> Podium is easier to spell.
>>>
>>>
>>> Unless talking about plurals of dais and podium, then you're properly
>>> buggered.
>>
>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>
> Daisies.

....give me your answers true.


--
Ken

[Ken Blake]

On 9/13/2021 3:11 AM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 13/09/2021 10:52, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:15:50 +0100, Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>>
>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>>> the cited author.]
>>>
>>> In article <shkeje$pg3$2...@dont-email.me>, pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid
>>> says...
>>>>
>>>> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>>>
>>>> Podium is easier to spell.
>>>
>>>
>>> Unless talking about plurals of dais and podium, then you're properly
>>> buggered.
>>
>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>
> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
> you.
>
>> And "podium", for that matter?
>
> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.

Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.

I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
that they will not be understood.


--
Ken

[charles]

In article <iq9afd...@mid.individual.net>, Ken Blake

Certainly in the theatre, 'rostra' is the plural of 'rostrum'.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 07:26:39 -0700 (PDT)

"Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-4, Athel
> Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>
> > I suppose we shouldn't be surprised that the champion pisser-offer
> > was the one to whine about an obvious mistake.
>

A Malicious Snip of the correction and apology, I notice

> Responding to about the sixth time I had seen the notice, cretin.

Well, it seems you're determined to be pissed off and take offence. Could I recommend this book?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influence_People

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 13:54:55 +0100
Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

[]

>
> Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD managed to
> piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was pissed off by
> his reaction (which seems to be a majority of those expressing an
> opinion).
>

Nah, we're all stooges. Only PTD can speak for "Everyone"

[Peter T. Daniels]

Who spoke for "everyone" in the paragraph you respond to?

(Still referring to a majority of one out of one.)

> --
> Bah, and indeed Humbug.

No, only those of you who take your entire impression of what certain
individuals say from a stoogemaster, and use pet expressions of that
stoogemaster in their attempts at humor, are stooges.

Still waiting for one of you stooges to come up with someone who
would have welcomed an emailed duplicate of a newsgroup posting.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2021-09-13 16:22:33 +0000, Kerr-Mudd, John said:

> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 07:26:39 -0700 (PDT)
> "Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-4, Athel
>> Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>> I suppose we shouldn't be surprised that the champion pisser-offer
>>> was the one to whine about an obvious mistake.
>>
>
> A Malicious Snip of the correction and apology, I notice
>
>> Responding to about the sixth time I had seen the notice, cretin.

We all saw it several times. It was exactly that that made me realize
that it was an accidental wrong setting in Janet's newsreader and not
her deliberate intention to annoy the silly little man. Perhaps not
surprisingly, he was unable to make that obvious deduction.

>
> Well, it seems you're determined to be pissed off and take offence.
> Could I recommend this book?
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Win_Friends_and_Influence_People


--

[Quinn C]

* Peter Moylan:

> On 13/09/21 20:52, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:15:50 +0100, Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>>
>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>>> the cited author.]
>>>
>>> In article <shkeje$pg3$2...@dont-email.me>, pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid
>>> says...
>>>>
>>>> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>>>
>>>> Podium is easier to spell.
>>>
>>>
>>> Unless talking about plurals of dais and podium, then you're properly
>>> buggered.
>>
>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>
> Daisies.

That's pushing it.

>> And "podium", for that matter?
>
> Either podios or podiatry. I'm not sure which.

Isn't podiatry when you molest children?

Nah, I was probably thinking of "pedagogy".

--
Be afraid of the lame - They'll inherit your legs
Be afraid of the old - They'll inherit your souls
-- Regina Spektor, Après moi

[Tony Cooper]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 09:32:30 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
<gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

>On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 12:27:16 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 13:54:55 +0100
>> Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> > Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD managed to
>> > piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was pissed off by
>> > his reaction (which seems to be a majority of those expressing an
>> > opinion).
>> >
>> Nah, we're all stooges. Only PTD can speak for "Everyone"
>
>Who spoke for "everyone" in the paragraph you respond to?
>
>(Still referring to a majority of one out of one.)
>> --
>> Bah, and indeed Humbug.
>
>No, only those of you who take your entire impression of what certain
>individuals say from a stoogemaster, and use pet expressions of that
>stoogemaster in their attempts at humor, are stooges.
>

Would that I had the influence you attribute to me.

>Still waiting for one of you stooges to come up with someone who
>would have welcomed an emailed duplicate of a newsgroup posting.

I have received a post intended for the newsgroup but sent by email
from a very respected regular with the initials M.B. He followed with
an email apoligizing and stating it was an error.

I did not exactly "welcome" the email, but I was not at all pissed
off. I recognized it as an error and shrugged it off. I can't
understand why you would think it would piss someone off.


--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[Tony Cooper]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 13:12:44 -0400, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Peter Moylan:
>
>> On 13/09/21 20:52, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>> On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:15:50 +0100, Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> [This followup was posted to alt.usage.english and a copy was sent to
>>>> the cited author.]
>>>>
>>>> In article <shkeje$pg3$2...@dont-email.me>, pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid
>>>> says...
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/09/21 16:24, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>>>>
>>>>> Podium is easier to spell.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Unless talking about plurals of dais and podium, then you're properly
>>>> buggered.
>>>
>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>
>> Daisies.
>
>That's pushing it.
>
>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>
>> Either podios or podiatry. I'm not sure which.
>
>Isn't podiatry when you molest children?

No, that's catching them by the toe, in a very disparaged line. A
meeny line, in fact.

>
>Nah, I was probably thinking of "pedagogy".
--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 2:04:03 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 09:32:30 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >On Monday, September 13, 2021 at 12:27:16 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> >> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 13:54:55 +0100
> >> Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

> >> > Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD managed to
> >> > piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was pissed off by
> >> > his reaction (which seems to be a majority of those expressing an
> >> > opinion).
> >> Nah, we're all stooges. Only PTD can speak for "Everyone"
> >Who spoke for "everyone" in the paragraph you respond to?
> >(Still referring to a majority of one out of one.)
> >> --
> >> Bah, and indeed Humbug.
> >No, only those of you who take your entire impression of what certain
> >individuals say from a stoogemaster, and use pet expressions of that
> >stoogemaster in their attempts at humor, are stooges.
>
> Would that I had the influence you attribute to me.
>
> >Still waiting for one of you stooges to come up with someone who
> >would have welcomed an emailed duplicate of a newsgroup posting.
>
> I have received a post intended for the newsgroup but sent by email
> from a very respected regular with the initials M.B. He followed with
> an email apoligizing and stating it was an error.

I have received, I think twice in all these years, two such messages,
and in each case I inquired of the sender whether they had intended
it as a private message or a missent newsgroup message. Both had
been intended for the newsgroup.

> I did not exactly "welcome" the email, but I was not at all pissed
> off. I recognized it as an error and shrugged it off. I can't
> understand why you would think it would piss someone off.

And if it happened over and over, as threatened by the note?

[Anders D. Nygaard]

You have a very strange definition of "politely".

>> Too much to hope you'll ever do the same.
>
> Kindly take into account the chronology of postings. The only one
> here needing to apologize is the cretin who used to be British, for
> continuing to harp on the matter after you clarified it.

I can think of a more obvious candidate.

/Anders, Denmark

[Peter Moylan]

We all saw the repeated glitch, but other people reacted very
differently. Most of us, apparently, didn't react at all, but assumed
that the problem would soon be fixed.

[Peter Moylan]

On 14/09/21 01:17, Peter T. Daniels wrote:

> "Mixed-use buildings" were pioneered in Chicago in the mid 1960s,
> starting, maybe, with the John Hancock Tower, which was briefly the
> tallest building in the world.

And the architect's signature work.

[Tony Cooper]

On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 12:51:36 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

More shrugs. I am not so easily pissed off as you.

Where do you get "over and over, as threatened by the note"?

The note says "This followup...".

Once again, you have read something not said and wildly exaggerated.

[Peter Moylan]

On 14/09/21 10:01, Tony Cooper wrote:

> Once again, you have read something not said and wildly exaggerated.

When I recently mentioned reading things that had not been written, it
was in an attempt to calm down the battles. By weaponising that
statement, you can only make the battles flare up again.

That might be amusing for you, but it is annoying to me, and probably to
many other people.

This would be a more pleasant group if it weren't for those who have a
pathological need to have the last word. Failing to respond to
provocation is another more sophisticated form of victory.

[Snidely]

Ken Blake explained on 9/13/2021 :

"I'm sorry, Dave, but I can't"

/dps

--
As a colleague once told me about an incoming manager,
"He does very well in a suck-up, kick-down culture."
Bill in Vancouver

[Snidely]

With a quizzical look, Tony Cooper observed:

You had to dig moe deep for that, I think

>>
>> Nah, I was probably thinking of "pedagogy".

-d

--
You could try being nicer and politer
> instead, and see how that works out.
-- Katy Jennison

[Snidely]

On Monday, Peter Moylan queried:

Hear, hear!

/dps

--
"That's a good sort of hectic, innit?"

" Very much so, and I'd recommend the haggis wontons."
-njm

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I'm afraid I have to tell you that Vancouver doesn't have "Vancouver's luxury
of being able to spread out" either. The City of Vancouver is hemmed in
by the U.S. border to the south, the Strait of Georgia in the west, Burrard Inlet
in the north, and various other municipalities with their own governments and
boundaries to the east. Vancouver can build more densely, mainly up, but it has
no unoccupied land for expansion in any ground-level direction.

bill

[Dingbat]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 12:36:47 AM UTC-7, Snidely wrote:
> Just this Saturday, Steve Hayes puzzled about:

> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>

Podium is an American term for a Rostrum, a raised platform for one speaker.

A dais is like a stage, but for guests of honor rather than actors.

[Richard Heathfield]

On 14/09/2021 12:20, Dingbat wrote:
> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 12:36:47 AM UTC-7, Snidely wrote:
>> Just this Saturday, Steve Hayes puzzled about:
>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>
> Podium is an American term for a Rostrum

I thought it was a Latin term for a balcony (see pic)

https://www.google.com/search?q=colosseum+balcony&client=ubuntu&hs=y3p&channel=fs&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi1zNe2s_7yAhVoMewKHWA8B-0Q_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1920&bih=968#imgrc=WMrJUAl_4Rt4_M

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

[Janet]

In article <b94c8391-b8d0-49fb...@googlegroups.com>,
gram...@verizon.net says...

Everyone can read the "from address/email address" on every post from
me. It's blindingly obvious it's a deliberately fake address, non-
existent, non-functional.No messages can be sent from it.

So there never was even the slightest teensiest "threat" of my usenet
posts being duplicated to anybody's real email account.

The sky has not fallen,Chicken Licken. If your socks are wet, it's
because you pissed down your own leg.


Janet.

[CDB]

On 9/13/2021 12:32 PM, Peter T. Daniels wrote:

> Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>> Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

>>> Screw-ups happen. You handled yours rather well, while PTD
>>> managed to piss off everyone who posts to this newsgroup who was
>>> pissed off by his reaction (which seems to be a majority of those
>>> expressing an opinion).

>> Nah, we're all stooges. Only PTD can speak for "Everyone"

> Who spoke for "everyone" in the paragraph you respond to?

> (Still referring to a majority of one out of one.)
>> -- Bah, and indeed Humbug.

> No, only those of you who take your entire impression of what
> certain individuals say from a stoogemaster, and use pet expressions
> of that stoogemaster in their attempts at humor, are stooges.

> Still waiting for one of you stooges to come up with someone who
> would have welcomed an emailed duplicate of a newsgroup posting.

I was waiting for an opportunity to post something that would call for a
reply from Janet, to see what would happen; but then it was all over.

We must be diligent today; to wait until tomorrow is too late.

[CDB]

On 9/13/2021 10:31 PM, Snidely wrote:
> Peter Moylan queried:

>> Tony Cooper wrote:

>>> Once again, you have read something not said and wildly
>>> exaggerated.

>> When I recently mentioned reading things that had not been written,
>> it was in an attempt to calm down the battles. By weaponising that
>> statement, you can only make the battles flare up again.

>> That might be amusing for you, but it is annoying to me, and
>> probably to many other people.

>> This would be a more pleasant group if it weren't for those who
>> have a pathological need to have the last word. Failing to respond
>> to provocation is another more sophisticated form of victory.

> Hear, hear!

Ever so hear.

[Richard Heathfield]

On 14/09/2021 13:30, Janet wrote:

<snip>

> So there never was even the slightest teensiest "threat" of my usenet
> posts being duplicated to anybody's real email account.

The scare quotes are well used. "Threat" seems an odd word in the
circumstances. Janet is considerate, thoughtful, and according to a
recent thread so posh that wherever she is is *by definition* the
poshest place in the world. Such people do not threaten, or if they do
they can find a far more stylish way to do it than by email.

[CDB]

On 9/14/2021 4:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:

> Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com> wrote:

>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?

>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is
>>> "dai", look you.

>>>> And "podium", for that matter?

>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.

>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like
>> the correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.

>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent
>> chance that they will not be understood.

> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
> latter is from Greek.

So is "podium", ultimately (the "o" gives it away). But the um/a
pattern in Latin is matched by the on/a pattern in Greek.

[Quinn C]

* bil...@shaw.ca:

A few years ago I read that Vancouver was the city with the
second-highest real estate prices in the world in relation to local
income, surpassed only by Hong Kong. There are reasons for that. Well,
many reasons - another one is many buyers who aren't on a local income.

--
There is no freedom for men unless there is freedom for women.
If women mustn't bring their will to the fore, why should men
be allowed to?
-- Hedwig Dohm (1876), my translation

[pensive hamster]

On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 12:13:46 PM UTC+1, Janet wrote:
> In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>, haye...@telkomsa.net says...
> >
> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>
> A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.

Three people, in some sports:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Podium

'... In sports, a type of podium can be used to honor the top three
competitors in events. In the modern Olympics a tri-level podium is
used. ... In many sports, results in the top three of a competition are
often referred to as "podiums" or "podium finishes". In some individual
sports, "podiums" is an official statistic, referring to the number of top
three results an athlete has achieved over the course of a season or
career.

[Ken Blake]

On 9/14/2021 1:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 08:53:17 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>

> wrote:
>
>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>>
>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
>>> you.
>>>
>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>>
>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>>
>>
>>Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
>>correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>>dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>>
>>I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
>>that they will not be understood.
>
> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
> latter is from Greek.

"Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
that are almost always used only in their plural.


--
Ken

[Ken Blake]

On 9/14/2021 6:04 AM, CDB wrote:
> On 9/14/2021 4:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
>> Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>
>>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is
>>>> "dai", look you.
>
>>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>
>>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>
>>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like
>>> the correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>
>>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent
>>> chance that they will not be understood.
>
>> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
>> latter is from Greek.
>
> So is "podium", ultimately

Ultimately, yes. But as I understand it, the word comes into English
from the Latin, which got it from Greek.

> (the "o" gives it away). But the um/a
> pattern in Latin is matched by the on/a pattern in Greek.
>

--
Ken

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <9c60e559-2384-4bbf...@googlegroups.com>,

Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

>Kindly take into account the chronology of postings. The only one
>here needing to apologize is the cretin who used to be British, for
>continuing to harp on the matter after you clarified it.

Just shut the fuck up please, Daniels.

-GAWollman

--
Garrett A. Wollman | "Act to avoid constraining the future; if you can,
wol...@bimajority.org| act to remove constraint from the future. This is
Opinions not shared by| a thing you can do, are able to do, to do together."
my employers. | - Graydon Saunders, _A Succession of Bad Days_ (2015)

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <13765432-d322-4993...@googlegroups.com>,

pensive hamster <pensive...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 12:13:46 PM UTC+1, Janet wrote:
>> In article <pm3rjgtqs0acvo1f4...@4ax.com>, haye...@telkomsa.net says...
>> >
>> > What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>
>> A podium is a raised platform to elevate only one person.
>
>Three people, in some sports:

Six people[1], in some other sports. No, I'm not sure why. The
fourth-place finisher is sometimes jokingly said to have received the
"wood medal" but they don't actually. See
<https://photos.bimajority.org/2019-20-BMW-IBSF-Skeleton-World-Cup-Lake-Placid/2019-20-BMW-IBSF-Skeleton-World-Cup-Lake-Placid-Medal-Ceremo/i-BWbLnXj/A>
for an example. (I think technically, Tina Hermann, the sixth-place
finisher, was supposed to be standing at left, next to Mirela Rahneva,
the fourth-place finisher, but the venue was undergoing renovation and
this podium was a temporary installation just for this event.)

-GAWollman

[1] Or teams.

[Paul Wolff]

On Tue, 14 Sep 2021, at 12:54:33, Richard Heathfield posted:

>On 14/09/2021 12:20, Dingbat wrote:
>> On Sunday, September 12, 2021 at 12:36:47 AM UTC-7, Snidely wrote:
>>> Just this Saturday, Steve Hayes puzzled about:
>>>> What, if anything, is the difference between "dais" and "podium"?
>>>
>> Podium is an American term for a Rostrum
>
>I thought it was a Latin term for a balcony (see pic)
>
>https://www.google.com/search?q=colosseum+balcony&client=ubuntu&hs=y3p&c
>hannel=fs&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi1zNe2s_7yAhVoMewKHWA8B-0
>Q_AUoAXoECAEQAw&biw=1920&bih=968#imgrc=WMrJUAl_4Rt4_M
>

A beak wuz wot they learned me at skool. Then a ship's prow, then a
trophy of some war or other consisting of the same erected in the forum,
then that place used by orators to harangue the SPQR - or at least the
PR, if not the SR.
--
Paul

[pensive hamster]

On Tuesday, September 14, 2021 at 3:58:15 PM UTC+1, Ken Blake wrote:
> On 9/14/2021 6:04 AM, CDB wrote:
> > On 9/14/2021 4:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:

> >> Ken Blake wrote:
> >
> >>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
> >
> >>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is
> >>>> "dai", look you.
> >
> >>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
> >
> >>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
> >
> >>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like
> >>> the correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
> >>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
> >
> >>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent
> >>> chance that they will not be understood.
> >
> >> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
> >> latter is from Greek.
> >
> > So is "podium", ultimately
> Ultimately, yes. But as I understand it, the word comes into English
> from the Latin, which got it from Greek.

Lexico says:

https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/podium
Origin
Mid 18th century via Latin from Greek podion, diminutive of pous, pod- ‘foot’.

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

"Media" only in one of it's various meanings.

--
Americans are not that comfortable with being uncomfortable.
-- Veronica Osorio

[Tak To]

I come across (and use) "[a/the] criterion" often enough.

--
Tak
----------------------------------------------------------------+-----
Tak To ta...@alum.mit.eduxx
--------------------------------------------------------------------^^
[taode takto ~{LU5B~}] NB: trim the xx to get my real email addr

[Peter T. Daniels]

I've mentioned before that between my two visits -- in 1975 and 1994 -- the
entire hill / mountainside to the north had become covered with luxury(-looking)
residential towers, for the refugees from Hong Kong.

An enormous amount of unbuilt land became built!

[Peter T. Daniels]

Why are you continuing to take the bait of the stooges and continuing
to repeat this, over and over?

[Peter T. Daniels]

She has replied in this thread quite a few times, explaining that she
did not insert the statement into her messages..

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Tuesday, September 14, 2021 at 11:37:09 AM UTC-4, Garrett Wollman wrote:
> In article <9c60e559-2384-4bbf...@googlegroups.com>,
> Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

> >Kindly take into account the chronology of postings. The only one
> >here needing to apologize is the cretin who used to be British, for
> >continuing to harp on the matter after you clarified it.
>
> Just shut the fuck up please, Daniels.

Tell Cornish-Bowden to.

[Ken Blake]

On 9/14/2021 12:13 PM, Tak To wrote:
> On 9/14/2021 10:56 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
>> On 9/14/2021 1:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 08:53:17 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>>>>
>>>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
>>>>> you.
>>>>>
>>>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>>>>
>>>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
>>>> correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>>>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>>>>
>>>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
>>>> that they will not be understood.
>>>
>>> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
>>> latter is from Greek.
>>
>> "Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
>> that are almost always used only in their plural.
>
> I come across (and use) "[a/the] criterion" often enough.

So do I. But my point is that most AmE speakers don't even realize that
"criteria" is the plural of "criterion."


--
Ken

[Tony Cooper]

You said you were looking for examples of an Aggressive Question®.

There's one for the files.

--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Tuesday, September 14, 2021 at 4:40:47 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021 12:41:07 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

> >Why are you continuing to take the bait of the stooges and continuing
> >to repeat this, over and over?
>
> You said you were looking for examples of an Aggressive Question®.
>
> There's one for the files.

Still no definition, though. A definition could help your stooge(s) use
the term correctly.

[Snidely]

Ken Blake scribbled something on Tuesday the 9/14/2021:

A criterion is the commander of a troop of crits?

/dps

--
"That’s where I end with this kind of conversation: Language is
crucial, and yet not the answer."
Jonathan Rosa, sociocultural and linguistic anthropologist,
Stanford.,2020

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I'd say that the singular "criterion", is gradually being lost from the language.
The now-plural "criteria" is taking on the roles of both the singular and the plural.
Not long from now, film buffs will be able to say they have viewed the entire
Criteria Collection.

bill

[occam]

On 14/09/2021 10:27, Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 08:53:17 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>>
>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
>>> you.
>>>
>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>>
>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>>
>>
>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
>> correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>>
>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
>> that they will not be understood.
>
> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
> latter is from Greek.
>
>

My favourite misuse of the plural as a singular is "phenomena". My toes
curl up when I hear a grown up say "this phenomena is known to occur..."

Regarding 'podium', how about 'podii' as plural? (It could come very
handy in scrabble.)

[occam]

On 15/09/2021 04:15, Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:56:32 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>

> The media are the massage.
>
>
>


I wonder sometimes if McLuhan would have come up with that memorable
piece of nonsense, had he lived in the current cacophony of media we
have today.
<see my post in Twitter>.

[Janet]

In article <iqccgn...@mid.individual.net>, k...@invalidemail.com
says...

What's even more grating, is people who think kudos is the plural of
kudo, so they spell it kudoes.

Janet

[Janet]

In article <mn.74a37e59922ce94b.127094@snitoo>, snide...@gmail.com
says...

Or the lifespan of a critter.

Janet

[CDB]

On 9/14/2021 10:58 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

Agreed. A great many Greek words came into later languages in the form
of Latin borowings, before Greek was widely known in the West.

[Lewis]

In message <2pl2kgt48lbr5ab8u...@4ax.com> Steve Hayes <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:56:32 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>

Data is mostly singular in modern English, as in "the data is clear".
News is almost exclusively, if not entirely exclusively, singular: "the
news is bad". The same is true for media, though it is also used as a
plural when discussing things like art. Criteria is still often plural,
but still mostly singular in common speech, though I would not be
surprised for academic sourced searches to show a tilt the opposite way.

> The media are the massage.

that almost works as a joke, almost.


--
Be careful what you wish for. You never know who will be listening.
Or what, for that matter.

[Quinn C]

* Janet:

It can be confusing. The first time I encountered "kudos", it was on a
web forum where you could give kudos to people who helped you with a
problem. You'd recognize helpful people by the mark next to their
profile picture, e.g.: "17 kudos".

--
Dottie: Maybe you can give him a pep talk.
Tunde: He is a white man with money. God already gave him a pep talk.
-- Bob hearts Abishola, S01E10

[Quinn C]

* Steve Hayes:

> Some people seem to think that "criterium" is the singular of
> "criteria".

It is; the Latinized version is just the less popular loan in English in
this case. German prefers the Latin one (but with native plural). The
Scandinavian languages, too, it seems.

--
The seeds of new thought, sown in a ground that isn't prepared
to receive them, don't bear fruit.
-- Hedwig Dohm (1874), my translation

[Ken Blake]

Yes.


--
Ken

[Ken Blake]

On 9/15/2021 5:48 AM, Lewis wrote:
> In message <2pl2kgt48lbr5ab8u...@4ax.com> Steve Hayes <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:56:32 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>>>On 9/14/2021 1:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 08:53:17 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
>>>>>> you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
>>>>>correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>>>>>dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>>>>>
>>>>>I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
>>>>>that they will not be understood.
>>>>
>>>> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
>>>> latter is from Greek.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
>>>that are almost always used only in their plural.
>
> Data is mostly singular in modern English, as in "the data is clear".

Yes. Most people (at least most AmE speakers) don't even know the word
"datum."

> News is almost exclusively, if not entirely exclusively, singular: "the
> news is bad"

Yes. One of my favorite stories is about the newspaper editor who
insisted that "news" was plural. He sent a reporter to cover an event
and then cabled him, "Are there any news?"

The reporter cabled back, "Not a new."

I don't know if it's a true story, but I like it a lot even if it isn't.




--
Ken

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <346b36b6-bec1-4bbb...@googlegroups.com>,

bil...@shaw.ca <bil...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>I'd say that the singular "criterion", is gradually being lost from the
>language.
>The now-plural "criteria" is taking on the roles of both the singular
>and the plural.

Following the path now well-trodden by the likes of "insignia" (nobody
*ever* says or even writes "insigne").

-GAWollman

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

"News" is a mass noun, not countable. So there's no need to have both a
singular and a plural form of it, and in the end, it doesn't matter
whether the one form looks like a plural or not.

Today I read in a recipe:

| The batter will be slightly thick and a few lumps is OK.

I guess the writer had in mind to talk about the consistency: "The
consistency where there are a few lumps is OK."

--
Some of the most horrific things ever done to humans
were done by the politest, best-dressed, most well-spoken
people from the very best homes and neighborhoods.
-- Jerry Springer

[Ken Blake]

On 9/15/2021 9:47 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> * Ken Blake:
>
>> On 9/15/2021 5:48 AM, Lewis wrote:
>
>>> News is almost exclusively, if not entirely exclusively, singular: "the
>>> news is bad"
>>
>> Yes. One of my favorite stories is about the newspaper editor who
>> insisted that "news" was plural. He sent a reporter to cover an event
>> and then cabled him, "Are there any news?"
>>
>> The reporter cabled back, "Not a new."
>>
>> I don't know if it's a true story, but I like it a lot even if it isn't.
>
> "News" is a mass noun, not countable. So there's no need to have both a
> singular and a plural form of it, and in the end, it doesn't matter
> whether the one form looks like a plural or not.
>
> Today I read in a recipe:
>
> | The batter will be slightly thick and a few lumps is OK.
>
> I guess the writer had in mind to talk about the consistency: "The
> consistency where there are a few lumps is OK."

I think of a sentence like that as being "The batter will be slightly
thick and [having] a few lumps is OK."



--
Ken

[Tak To]

On 9/14/2021 10:56 AM, Ken Blake wrote:

> [...]

> "Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
> that are almost always used only in their plural.

Agenda.

[Tak To]

On 9/15/2021 8:48 AM, Lewis wrote:
> In message <2pl2kgt48lbr5ab8u...@4ax.com> Steve Hayes <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> On Tue, 14 Sep 2021 07:56:32 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>>> On 9/14/2021 1:27 AM, Steve Hayes wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 08:53:17 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> What IS the plural of "dais"?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Daises" or perhaps it is already plural and the singular is "dai", look
>>>>>> you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And "podium", for that matter?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Choose from "podiums" and "podia", both of which are used.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Since "podium" apparently comes from the Latin, "podia" looks like the
>>>>> correct Latin plural. But although it's a choice in English
>>>>> dictionaries, I've never seen or heard it used in English.
>>>>>
>>>>> I always dislike plurals like that, since there's a excellent chance
>>>>> that they will not be understood.
>>>>
>>>> Like "this media" and "this criteria", though I'm pretty sure the
>>>> latter is from Greek.
>>>
>>>
>>> "Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
>>> that are almost always used only in their plural.
>
> Data is mostly singular in modern English, as in "the data is clear".

Data is becoming a mass noun. (Technical sense excluded.)

To avoid the appearance of hyper-correctness, I use "data
point", "piece of data" etc instead of "datum". So perhaps
people like me are partially at fault.

When referring collectively, I would use "information [is]"
rather than "data [are]".

> News is almost exclusively, if not entirely exclusively, singular: "the
> news is bad".

Always a mass noun for me. I would use "news item" in
a counting situation.

> The same is true for media, though it is also used as a
> plural when discussing things like art.

Both mass and count, with entirely separate meanings.

> Criteria is still often plural,
> but still mostly singular in common speech, though I would not be
> surprised for academic sourced searches to show a tilt the opposite way.

I hardly encounter "criterion" or "criteria" in "common
speech". You keep better company than I.

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I've cribbed the following from the LA Times, but have heard or read it from
a number of sources over many years. It's about perspective in news coverage:

"There is a well-worn story about a reporter who was sent out to cover
the Johnstown flood and who sent his editor a telegram beginning,
'God sits on the mountaintop tonight looking down on a scene of death
and destruction in the valley below.'

"The editor wired back: 'Forget flood. Interview God.'"

bill

[Ken Blake]

On 9/15/2021 10:18 AM, Tak To wrote:
> On 9/14/2021 10:56 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
>> [...]
>> "Media" and "criteria," along with "data" and "news" are English words
>> that are almost always used only in their plural.
>
> Agenda.

No, as far as I'm concerned, "agenda" is different. "Media," "criteria,"
"data" and "news" are all plural forms of English words that are often
treated as singular.

That's not what "agenda" is. Regardless of the fact that in Latin,
"agenda" is the plural of "agendum," in English "agenda" is singular.
The Latin singular "agendum" also exists in English, but dictionaries
define it as a synonym of "agenda" and it is almost never used. I can't
remember even reading it or hearing it.


--
Ken

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

Fair, but I'm sure that at least "criterion" looks almost exactly like
that to some people - "a rarely used synonym for a single criteria". The
one difference being that they should be familiar with criteria as
plural as well.

--
... English-speaking people have managed to get along a good many
centuries with the present supply of pronouns; ... It is so old and
venerable an argument ... it's equivalent was used when gas, railways
and steamboats were proposed. -- Findlay (OH) Jeffersonian (1875)

[Peter Moylan]

On 15/09/21 23:48, Lewis wrote:

> The same is true for media, though it is also used as a plural when
> discussing things like art.

The computer world still uses the term "multimedia", presumably in
contrast to "single medium".

Mind you, in that context it usually means "pictures and sound". A rare
example of "multi" meaning "two".

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

[Lewis]

And rebel at "the data are"

>> News is almost exclusively, if not entirely exclusively, singular: "the
>> news is bad"

> Yes. One of my favorite stories is about the newspaper editor who
> insisted that "news" was plural. He sent a reporter to cover an event
> and then cabled him, "Are there any news?"

> The reporter cabled back, "Not a new."

> I don't know if it's a true story, but I like it a lot even if it isn't.

It's a good one.

--
If you think that Mick Jagger will still be doing the whole rock star
thing at age fifty, well, then, you are sorely, sorely mistaken.

[Lewis]

In message <news-2021...@ram.dialup.fu-berlin.de> Stefan Ram <r...@zedat.fu-berlin.de> wrote:

> Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com> writes:
>>Yes. One of my favorite stories is about the newspaper editor who
>>insisted that "news" was plural.

> "news (n.) is plural in form but is treated grammatically as
> a singular: This news is bad."

> (Compare with "mathematics".)

> "News is simply the plural of the noun 'new', which we use,
> for example, in the adage 'Out with the old, in with the new.'"

>> He sent a reporter to cover an event
>>and then cabled him, "Are there any news?"

> He could have asked: "Are there any news items (pieces of news)?".

Sure, because items is plural. And pieces. News is singular.


--
and I swear it happened just like this: / a sigh, a cry, a hungry
kiss, the Gates of Love they budged an inch / I can't say much
has happened since / but CLOSING TIME

[Lewis]

In message <shu812$62r$1...@dont-email.me> Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
> On 15/09/21 23:48, Lewis wrote:

>> The same is true for media, though it is also used as a plural when
>> discussing things like art.

> The computer world still uses the term "multimedia", presumably in
> contrast to "single medium".

Multimedia is also singular.

> Mind you, in that context it usually means "pictures and sound". A rare
> example of "multi" meaning "two".

Multimedia feels like it became skunked about 20-25 years ago.

--
"Are you pondering what I'm pondering?"
"I think so, Brain, but how are we going to get the bacon flavoring
into the pencils?"

[Peter Moylan]

On 16/09/21 13:36, Lewis wrote:
> In message <shu812$62r$1...@dont-email.me> Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>> On 15/09/21 23:48, Lewis wrote:
>
>>> The same is true for media, though it is also used as a plural when
>>> discussing things like art.
>
>> The computer world still uses the term "multimedia", presumably in
>> contrast to "single medium".
>
> Multimedia is also singular.
>
>> Mind you, in that context it usually means "pictures and sound". A rare
>> example of "multi" meaning "two".
>
> Multimedia feels like it became skunked about 20-25 years ago.

It will come back once we have smellevision.

[Dingbat]

On Wednesday, September 15, 2021 at 8:23:22 AM UTC-7, Ken Blake wrote:

I'd cable back, "No singular news":-)

[Snidely]

Janet presented the following explanation :

4 score and 10, adjusted for heart rate.

/dps

--
"That’s where I end with this kind of conversation: Language is
crucial, and yet not the answer."
Jonathan Rosa, sociocultural and linguistic anthropologist,
Stanford.,2020