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bozo de niro
Apr 14, 2023, 6:32:00 PM4/14/23
to
"If the shoe fits wear it"
Mean?
Mean?
J. J. Lodder
Apr 15, 2023, 5:14:59 AM4/15/23
to
Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
(documented there mid-17th)
Related: 'Wie geen schurft heeft hoeft zich niet te krabben'
(E. If you have no scabies you don't need to scratch youself)
Jan
(documented there mid-17th)
Related: 'Wie geen schurft heeft hoeft zich niet te krabben'
(E. If you have no scabies you don't need to scratch youself)
Jan
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 15, 2023, 8:53:53 AM4/15/23
to
On Saturday, April 15, 2023 at 5:14:59 AM UTC-4, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > "If the shoe fits wear it"
> > Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
Though you didn't actually tell the bozo what it means.
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > "If the shoe fits wear it"
> > Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
> Related: 'Wie geen schurft heeft hoeft zich niet te krabben'
> (E. If you have no scabies you don't need to scratch youself)
Peter Moylan
Apr 15, 2023, 9:40:48 AM4/15/23
to
On 15/04/23 19:14, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>>
>> Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
No, it's just a distortion of the old story about the Foo bird.
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>>
>> Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org
Phil Carmody
Apr 16, 2023, 9:48:03 AM4/16/23
to
nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) writes:
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>>
>> Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
Seems like it's the same as "if the cap fits, wear it":
> bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>>
>> Mean?
>
> Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> (documented there mid-17th)
"""
[If the cap fits, wear it] carries the same meaning as /if the shoe
fits, wear it/. It is used to convince someone to accept the legitimacy
of a criticism sent their way, or the truth of a description about
themselves. /If the cap fits, wear it/ is primarily a British phrase
first seen in the late 1500s. The phrase has remained the same in
Britain, but in its transition to the United States the idiom became /if
the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed that the phrase was influenced by
the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in which Cinderella becomes a
princess because the shoe fits.
""" --
https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
Phil
--
We are no longer hunters and nomads. No longer awed and frightened, as we have
gained some understanding of the world in which we live. As such, we can cast
aside childish remnants from the dawn of our civilization.
-- NotSanguine on SoylentNews, after Eugen Weber in /The Western Tradition/
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 16, 2023, 12:47:56 PM4/16/23
to
On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 9:48:03 AM UTC-4, Phil Carmody wrote:
> nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) writes:
> > bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> "If the shoe fits wear it"
> >> Mean?
> > Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> > (documented there mid-17th)
> Seems like it's the same as "if the cap fits, wear it":
> """
> [If the cap fits, wear it] carries the same meaning as /if the shoe
> fits, wear it/. It is used to convince someone to accept the legitimacy
> of a criticism sent their way, or the truth of a description about
> themselves. /If the cap fits, wear it/ is primarily a British phrase
> first seen in the late 1500s. The phrase has remained the same in
> Britain, but in its transition to the United States the idiom became /if
> the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed that the phrase was influenced by
> the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in which Cinderella becomes a
> princess because the shoe fits.
> """ --
> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>
> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
Well, I (AmE) have never heard the "cap" version.
> nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) writes:
> > bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> "If the shoe fits wear it"
> >> Mean?
> > Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> > (documented there mid-17th)
> Seems like it's the same as "if the cap fits, wear it":
> """
> [If the cap fits, wear it] carries the same meaning as /if the shoe
> fits, wear it/. It is used to convince someone to accept the legitimacy
> of a criticism sent their way, or the truth of a description about
> themselves. /If the cap fits, wear it/ is primarily a British phrase
> first seen in the late 1500s. The phrase has remained the same in
> Britain, but in its transition to the United States the idiom became /if
> the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed that the phrase was influenced by
> the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in which Cinderella becomes a
> princess because the shoe fits.
> """ --
> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>
> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
*Cinderella* has been very well known at least since the Disney movie
(which, fortunately, expurgated the Grim(m) original).
bozo de niro
Apr 16, 2023, 3:31:51 PM4/16/23
to
On Friday, April 14, 2023 at 3:32:00 PM UTC-7, bozo de niro wrote:
> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>
> Mean?
Of course this was supposed to be posted under "The Dumb Question Thread"
> "If the shoe fits wear it"
>
> Mean?
J. J. Lodder
Apr 16, 2023, 4:19:54 PM4/16/23
to
Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
> nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) writes:
> > bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> "If the shoe fits wear it"
> >>
> >> Mean?
> >
> > Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> > (documented there mid-17th)
>
> Seems like it's the same as "if the cap fits, wear it":
> """
> [If the cap fits, wear it] carries the same meaning as /if the shoe
> fits, wear it/. It is used to convince someone to accept the legitimacy
> of a criticism sent their way, or the truth of a description about
> themselves. /If the cap fits, wear it/ is primarily a British phrase
> first seen in the late 1500s.
I thought that it refered originally to a particular cap,
> nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder) writes:
> > bozo de niro <bosod...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> "If the shoe fits wear it"
> >>
> >> Mean?
> >
> > Seems to be from American, perhaps originally from Dutch.
> > (documented there mid-17th)
>
> Seems like it's the same as "if the cap fits, wear it":
> """
> [If the cap fits, wear it] carries the same meaning as /if the shoe
> fits, wear it/. It is used to convince someone to accept the legitimacy
> of a criticism sent their way, or the truth of a description about
> themselves. /If the cap fits, wear it/ is primarily a British phrase
> first seen in the late 1500s.
the fool's one.
> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
> """ --
> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>
> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
Jan
Peter Moylan
Apr 16, 2023, 9:04:18 PM4/16/23
to
On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
> Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>> """ --
>> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>>
>> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>
> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
> or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
>> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>> """ --
>> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>>
>> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>
> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
> or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
Ken Blake
Apr 16, 2023, 9:38:44 PM4/16/23
to
On Mon, 17 Apr 2023 11:04:10 +1000, Peter Moylan
<pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>
>>> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>>> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>>> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>>> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>>> """ --
>>> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>>>
>>> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>>
>> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
>> or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
>glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
That's also what I remember reading somewhere. How accurate it is, I
<pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>
>>> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>>> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>>> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>>> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>>> """ --
>>> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>>>
>>> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>>
>> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
>> or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
>glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
don't know.
Jerry Friedman
Apr 16, 2023, 9:57:27 PM4/16/23
to
On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 7:04:18 PM UTC-6, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>
> >> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
> >> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
> >> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
> >> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
> >> """ --
> >> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
> >>
> >> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
> >
> > AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
> > or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
> glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
There's no evidence for that theory. See for instance
> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>
> >> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
> >> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
> >> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
> >> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
> >> """ --
> >> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
> >>
> >> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
> >
> > AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
> > or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
> glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
https://writinginmargins.weebly.com/home/cinderellas-shoes-glass-or-fur
> The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
> bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
> city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
coach?
By the way, I enjoyed T. Kingfisher's recent fantasy novel /Nettle & Bone/,
which contains fairy godmothers.
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter Moylan
Apr 16, 2023, 10:51:22 PM4/16/23
to
On 17/04/23 11:57, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 7:04:18 PM UTC-6, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>>> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes, or the glass
>>> slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not
>> originally glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French)
>> vair, not verre.
>
> There's no evidence for that theory. See for instance
>
> https://writinginmargins.weebly.com/home/cinderellas-shoes-glass-or-fur
Thanks.
> On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 7:04:18 PM UTC-6, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>>> AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes, or the glass
>>> slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not
>> originally glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French)
>> vair, not verre.
>
> There's no evidence for that theory. See for instance
>
> https://writinginmargins.weebly.com/home/cinderellas-shoes-glass-or-fur
>
I had forgotten that the word "verre" occurs explicitly in
Perrault's title.
J. J. Lodder
Apr 17, 2023, 4:39:40 AM4/17/23
to
like a dog does.
They'll just refuse to fit anyone else,
Jan
Kerr-Mudd, John
Apr 17, 2023, 5:02:43 AM4/17/23
to
--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.
Rich Ulrich
Apr 17, 2023, 1:03:01 PM4/17/23
to
--
Rich Ulrich
TonyCooper
Apr 17, 2023, 1:22:51 PM4/17/23
to
fairy tales. Next thing you know, they'll be pointing out that the
Bible contains inconsistancies.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando,Florida
Sam Plusnet
Apr 17, 2023, 2:05:49 PM4/17/23
to
On 17-Apr-23 9:39, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>
> Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>
>> The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
>> bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
>> city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
>
> Those are magic shoes of course, that recognise their owner,
> like a dog does.
> They'll just refuse to fit anyone else,
Of course.
>> bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
>> city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
>
> Those are magic shoes of course, that recognise their owner,
> like a dog does.
> They'll just refuse to fit anyone else,
The owner is in league with their boots.
--
Sam Plusnet
![Peter Duncanson [BrE]'s profile photo](http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/a-/ALV-UjU1GGYFBCZgBCNB-pRgkosMu-ej0qpnECw3jc8uGYOTiF8a=s40-c)
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Apr 17, 2023, 2:24:38 PM4/17/23
to
On Sun, 16 Apr 2023 18:57:24 -0700 (PDT), Jerry Friedman
<jerry.fr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 7:04:18?PM UTC-6, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> > Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>>
>> >> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>> >> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>> >> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>> >> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>> >> """ --
>> >> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>> >>
>> >> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>> >
>> > AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
>> > or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
>> glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
>
>There's no evidence for that theory. See for instance
>
>https://writinginmargins.weebly.com/home/cinderellas-shoes-glass-or-fur
>
>> The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
>> bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
>> city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
>
>What is the probability that someone could turn a pumpkin into a
>coach?
Low probability. Also a very small coach or a very large pumpkin.
Considerably lower probability that a coach could be turned into a
pumpkin.
>
>By the way, I enjoyed T. Kingfisher's recent fantasy novel /Nettle & Bone/,
>which contains fairy godmothers.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
<jerry.fr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Sunday, April 16, 2023 at 7:04:18?PM UTC-6, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 17/04/23 06:19, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> > Phil Carmody <pc+u...@asdf.org> wrote:
>>
>> >> The phrase has remained the same in Britain, but in its transition to the
>> >> United States the idiom became /if the shoe fits, wear it/. It is assumed
>> >> that the phrase was influenced by the Cinderella story, a fairy tale in
>> >> which Cinderella becomes a princess because the shoe fits.
>> >> """ --
>> >> https://grammarist.com/idiom/if-the-shoe-fits-and-if-the-cap-fits/
>> >>
>> >> Citations needed, but sadly lacking.
>> >
>> > AFAIK it is not well known where and when the shoes,
>> > or the glass slippers, came into the Cinderella story,
>
>> It's generally accepted, though, that the slippers were not originally
>> glass slippers. As I recall it, the word was (French) vair, not verre.
>
>There's no evidence for that theory. See for instance
>
>https://writinginmargins.weebly.com/home/cinderellas-shoes-glass-or-fur
>
>> The part about the shoe fitting in the Cinderella story has always
>> bothered me. What is the probability that only one woman in an entire
>> city wears, for example, a size 5 shoe?
>
>What is the probability that someone could turn a pumpkin into a
>coach?
Considerably lower probability that a coach could be turned into a
pumpkin.
>
>By the way, I enjoyed T. Kingfisher's recent fantasy novel /Nettle & Bone/,
>which contains fairy godmothers.
--
(in alt.usage.english)
J. J. Lodder
Apr 17, 2023, 4:02:03 PM4/17/23
to
Jan
Ken Blake
Apr 17, 2023, 7:18:11 PM4/17/23
to
leg.
bruce bowser
Apr 17, 2023, 11:03:58 PM4/17/23
to
IF your feet fit in the shoe, THEN you can wear the shoe.
[ALS passen uw voeten in de schoen, DAN kunt u de schoen dragen.]
bil...@shaw.ca
Apr 17, 2023, 11:20:34 PM4/17/23
to
bill
Kerr-Mudd, John
Apr 18, 2023, 10:45:02 AM4/18/23
to
Stroll on!
Ah well, at least I s tried.
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