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Feneigling
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Harrison Hill
Apr 13, 2016, 2:31:42 PM4/13/16
to
Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
"with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
(in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
in USE.
"Feneigling" anybody?
"with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
(in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
in USE.
"Feneigling" anybody?
grabber
Apr 13, 2016, 2:43:05 PM4/13/16
to
Peter Young
Apr 13, 2016, 2:49:58 PM4/13/16
to
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/finagling
Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Os)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
Horace LaBadie
Apr 13, 2016, 3:05:34 PM4/13/16
to
In article <51fcaf6d-5e19-44b7...@googlegroups.com>,
Finagle, obtain by underhanded or dishonest means.
Tony Cooper
Apr 13, 2016, 3:29:22 PM4/13/16
to
bit of finagling means "working things out in an unconventional way".
It is not necessarily dishonest at all.
A tiny house like a caboose would be one that is very compact but
offers all facilities necessary for living.
What you call a "guards van" we call a "caboose".
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
snide...@gmail.com
Apr 13, 2016, 5:45:12 PM4/13/16
to
<URL:http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/121011-tiny-apt-smith-8am.666;660;7;70;0.jpg>
Turn-about is fair play ... gibbous some linques to London bedsitters.
/dps
Janet
Apr 13, 2016, 5:57:06 PM4/13/16
to
In article <51fcaf6d-5e19-44b7...@googlegroups.com>,
harrison...@gmail.com says...
Try finagle (to deceive).
Janet
harrison...@gmail.com says...
Janet
ANMC...@alum.wpi.edu
Apr 13, 2016, 6:07:36 PM4/13/16
to
On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 12:29:22 PM UTC-7, Tony Cooper wrote:
US practice called for high speed, 24 hour operation, and relatively long distances. The entire train was routinely braked, initially by hand. Brits had shorter runs, often in daylight, and often only braked with the loco and the brake (or guard) van.
Also, the paperwork of a US conductor was handled aboard on anything but the shortest runs.
So, Caboose: lived in, literally by large numbers of people initially - the conductor and the brakemen, and by smaller numbers throughout. Enclosed. On trucks (Bringlish "bogey"). Mostly a point to control part of the braking from
Brake van: the opposite.
ANMcC
Peter Moylan
Apr 13, 2016, 8:10:06 PM4/13/16
to
gneals"
-- Bridge on the River Wye, by The Goons.
(That's from a distant memory. Google can't find it.)
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia
ANMC...@alum.wpi.edu
Apr 13, 2016, 8:46:42 PM4/13/16
to
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.fan.goons/NSIfp4tNSEM
"Barbara: Thank you, thank you, thank you Seargant Major. Now tomorrow the
first train will be passing over our bridge. The bridge that you built.
Built with your own hands and certain amount of wood. I've always said, as
you know, that burden(??) of the British soldier have fanarguled the most
thick-headed ganeals. And when Stanley Baldwin was on the throne it was a
scrim of neil. Third drange on the furgi-mi. Therefore you will all face
Buckingham Palace and surnge the National Anthem. "
"Backguarding" can come out remarkably similar to "blarging" in some parts of West Cork.
AN "throw in a few pauses and glottal stops and such" McC
Peter Moylan
Apr 13, 2016, 10:09:35 PM4/13/16
to
On 2016-Apr-14 10:46, ANMC...@alum.wpi.edu wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 5:10:06 PM UTC-7, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 2016-Apr-14 04:31, Harrison Hill wrote:
>>> Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
>>> "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
>>> doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
>>> like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
>>> (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
>>> train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
>>> be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
>>> in USE.
>>>
>>> "Feneigling" anybody?
>>
>> "The blargon of the British soldier has finagled the most thick-headed
>> gneals"
>> -- Bridge on the River Wye, by The Goons.
>>
>> (That's from a distant memory. Google can't find it.)
>
> On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 5:10:06 PM UTC-7, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 2016-Apr-14 04:31, Harrison Hill wrote:
>>> Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
>>> "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
>>> doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
>>> like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
>>> (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
>>> train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
>>> be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
>>> in USE.
>>>
>>> "Feneigling" anybody?
>>
>> "The blargon of the British soldier has finagled the most thick-headed
>> gneals"
>> -- Bridge on the River Wye, by The Goons.
>>
>> (That's from a distant memory. Google can't find it.)
>
> Here's an attempt from alt.fan.goons
>
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.fan.goons/NSIfp4tNSEM
>
> "Barbara: Thank you, thank you, thank you Seargant Major. Now tomorrow the
> first train will be passing over our bridge. The bridge that you built.
> Built with your own hands and certain amount of wood. I've always said, as
> you know, that burden(??) of the British soldier have fanarguled the most
> thick-headed ganeals. And when Stanley Baldwin was on the throne it was a
> scrim of neil. Third drange on the furgi-mi. Therefore you will all face
> Buckingham Palace and surnge the National Anthem. "
Thank you. It now reminds me that when I was a student in a residential
>
> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.fan.goons/NSIfp4tNSEM
>
> "Barbara: Thank you, thank you, thank you Seargant Major. Now tomorrow the
> first train will be passing over our bridge. The bridge that you built.
> Built with your own hands and certain amount of wood. I've always said, as
> you know, that burden(??) of the British soldier have fanarguled the most
> thick-headed ganeals. And when Stanley Baldwin was on the throne it was a
> scrim of neil. Third drange on the furgi-mi. Therefore you will all face
> Buckingham Palace and surnge the National Anthem. "
college some friends wanted a copy of "God Save the Queen" to play from
the balcony at midnight. I was able to provide a copy of that record:
when they surnge to the National Anthem, they sing "Deutschland über
alles" to the tune of "God Save the Queen".
"But, sir, that's the German national anthem."
"No, you fool. That's the British national anthem disguised as the
German national anthem. If the Germans heard ours they would capture it
and play it behind bars."
From a little later:
"Field-Marshal Eccles, you can't press that plunger."
"Yes I can."
"No you can't."
"Yes I can, yes I can, yes I can ..." <BOOM>
Ah, now I see that the link you gave contains a complete script. It has
a small number of errors, according to my memory, but it also made me
realise that my version had even bigger errors.
By the way, that thread contains something familiar to AUE people. It's
a 1994 thread, with the sudden appearance of a 2015 comment by someone
with a gmail address. Containing, it turns out, a complete copy of the
original very long posting.
Charles Bishop
Apr 15, 2016, 4:48:48 PM4/15/16
to
In article <MPG.3178d10...@news.individual.net>,
Hmm. "finagle" in my AmE has a meaning of getting something from
someone, but convincing them to give it to you when they might not be
disposed to. There may be a trade involved.
"I finagled 2 gallons of gasoline from the motor pool."
I suppose deception is involved to some extent.
--
vharles
someone, but convincing them to give it to you when they might not be
disposed to. There may be a trade involved.
"I finagled 2 gallons of gasoline from the motor pool."
I suppose deception is involved to some extent.
--
vharles
Tony Cooper
Apr 15, 2016, 5:58:18 PM4/15/16
to
stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph. The stadium
was closed, but I found a groundskeeper who initially said no one was
allowed on the field. We chatted for a while (me buttering him up)
about baseball, and he agreed to let me in. The stadium is a
historic one in this area.
Jackie Robinson was at the field 1946 when he played for a white
Triple-A team out of Daytona Beach. The crowd booed him off the field
and he didn't play. The Sanford police chief threatened to cancel the
game if Robinson played.
Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 15, 2016, 6:10:21 PM4/15/16
to
On Friday, April 15, 2016 at 5:58:18 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 13:48:44 -0700, Charles Bishop
> <ctbi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >In article <MPG.3178d10...@news.individual.net>,
> > Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
> >> In article <51fcaf6d-5e19-44b7...@googlegroups.com>,
> >> harrison...@gmail.com says...
> >> > Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
> >> > "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
> >> > doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
> >> > like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
> >> > (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
> >> > train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
> >> > be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
> >> > in USE.
> >> > "Feneigling" anybody?
> >> Try finagle (to deceive).
> >Hmm. "finagle" in my AmE has a meaning of getting something from
> >someone, but convincing them to give it to you when they might not be
> >disposed to. There may be a trade involved.
> >"I finagled 2 gallons of gasoline from the motor pool."
> >I suppose deception is involved to some extent.
>
> I finangled today. I finangled my way into a municipal baseball
Oy, Oy!
> On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 13:48:44 -0700, Charles Bishop
> <ctbi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >In article <MPG.3178d10...@news.individual.net>,
> > Janet <nob...@home.com> wrote:
> >> In article <51fcaf6d-5e19-44b7...@googlegroups.com>,
> >> harrison...@gmail.com says...
> >> > Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
> >> > "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
> >> > doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
> >> > like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
> >> > (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
> >> > train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
> >> > be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
> >> > in USE.
> >> > "Feneigling" anybody?
> >> Try finagle (to deceive).
> >Hmm. "finagle" in my AmE has a meaning of getting something from
> >someone, but convincing them to give it to you when they might not be
> >disposed to. There may be a trade involved.
> >"I finagled 2 gallons of gasoline from the motor pool."
> >I suppose deception is involved to some extent.
>
> I finangled today. I finangled my way into a municipal baseball
> stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph. The stadium
> was closed, but I found a groundskeeper who initially said no one was
> allowed on the field. We chatted for a while (me buttering him up)
> about baseball, and he agreed to let me in. The stadium is a
> historic one in this area.
> Jackie Robinson was at the field 1946 when he played for a white
> Triple-A team out of Daytona Beach. The crowd booed him off the field
> and he didn't play. The Sanford police chief threatened to cancel the
> game if Robinson played.
>
> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
And even if he did _visit_ the stadium some time "later than" "1946," before
August 18, 1948, it's highly unlikely that he "played."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babe_Ruth#Cancer_and_death_.281946.E2.80.9348.29
Charles Bishop
Apr 15, 2016, 10:02:16 PM4/15/16
to
In article <86o2hb5dtbbv17n36...@4ax.com>,
Today was Jackie Robinson Day today, and baseball teams wore Number 42
in his honor. A good thing to do, I think.
--
charles
in his honor. A good thing to do, I think.
--
charles
Mack A. Damia
Apr 15, 2016, 10:19:30 PM4/15/16
to
On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 19:02:12 -0700, Charles Bishop
I taught at Jackie Robinson IHS in Crown Heights for a year - across
the road from the old Ebbets Field. I lived in Brooklyn.
There is a day of celebration; I cannot remember the name of it, but
among the festivities, many of the old Brooklyn Dodgers come to chat
and to sign autographs.
the road from the old Ebbets Field. I lived in Brooklyn.
There is a day of celebration; I cannot remember the name of it, but
among the festivities, many of the old Brooklyn Dodgers come to chat
and to sign autographs.
Tony Cooper
Apr 15, 2016, 10:57:45 PM4/15/16
to
On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 19:02:12 -0700, Charles Bishop
Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
in saying all played later. The original stadium was built in 1926.
In getting past the groundskeeper, I did finagle my way in using a
perfectly ordinary sense of "finagle".
in saying all played later. The original stadium was built in 1926.
In getting past the groundskeeper, I did finagle my way in using a
perfectly ordinary sense of "finagle".
Mark Brader
Apr 15, 2016, 11:47:43 PM4/15/16
to
Tony Cooper [copyedited]:
>>> I finagled today. I finagled my way into a municipal baseball
>>> stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph...
>>> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "I seem to have become a signature quote."
m...@vex.net -- David Keldsen
>>> I finagled today. I finagled my way into a municipal baseball
>>> stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph...
>>> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
> Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
> in saying all played later.
Well, thank you for the correction, but where is the photograph?
> in saying all played later.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "I seem to have become a signature quote."
m...@vex.net -- David Keldsen
Tony Cooper
Apr 16, 2016, 12:27:26 AM4/16/16
to
On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 22:47:40 -0500, m...@vex.net (Mark Brader) wrote:
>Tony Cooper [copyedited]:
>>>> I finagled today. I finagled my way into a municipal baseball
>>>> stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph...
>
>>>> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
>
>> Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
>> in saying all played later.
>
>Well, thank you for the correction, but where is the photograph?
I did take a couple of photographs, but only because I had gone to the
>Tony Cooper [copyedited]:
>>>> I finagled today. I finagled my way into a municipal baseball
>>>> stadium (Sanford Memorial Stadium) to take a photograph...
>
>>>> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
>
>> Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
>> in saying all played later.
>
>Well, thank you for the correction, but where is the photograph?
trouble of finagling my way onto the field and the groundskeeper
expected me to take a photograph. There was not anything there of
interest to photograph.
I'm doing a set of three images to submit for the 2017 Sanford
Historical Society calendar. I was hoping to find something at the
field to tie in with the history of this field. However, it's all
modern now. Not even interesting modern.
Just to show I was there:
https://tonycooper.smugmug.com/AUE-Photos/i-RKqqKcq/0/O/2016-04-15.jpg
but neither of these two will be submitted.
Mark Brader
Apr 16, 2016, 1:09:56 AM4/16/16
to
Tony Cooper:
> Just to show I was there...
Oh. Well, thanks.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "What do I do for fun? Knit. And pet cats.
m...@vex.net | I'm hopelessly stereotypical." --Margaret Miles
> Just to show I was there...
Oh. Well, thanks.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "What do I do for fun? Knit. And pet cats.
m...@vex.net | I'm hopelessly stereotypical." --Margaret Miles
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 16, 2016, 5:25:02 AM4/16/16
to
Tony Cooper skrev:
> Jackie Robinson
I found an article about him. It was impressing.
What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> Jackie Robinson
I found an article about him. It was impressing.
What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
musika
Apr 16, 2016, 6:44:20 AM4/16/16
to
On 16/04/2016 10:25, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
> Tony Cooper skrev:
>
>> Jackie Robinson
>
> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
> What does "win varsity letters" mean?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letterman_%28sports%29
> Tony Cooper skrev:
>
>> Jackie Robinson
>
> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
> What does "win varsity letters" mean?
And what is "track".
>
--
Ray
UK
Lewis
Apr 16, 2016, 7:41:16 AM4/16/16
to
In message <w6e11m0lct1h$.d...@lundhansen.dk>
have to do more than merely be on the team. For example, for my futbol
team (soccer) you needed a certain number of minutes of playing time.
For track, you had to score points in a 3 school (or more) meet, which
meant finishing in the top three in an event. At some schools being a
team manager might earn a letter, but I think that was quite uncommon
when I was in school.
Do to a rather unlikely and fortunate (for me) serious of improbable
events I earned a letter for track when I was in high school.
Earning your first letter allows you the right to wear a "letter
jacket", and further letters in sports will ear you pins you can put on
the jacket. Letter jackets are often leather and have a large letter
representing the school and come in school colors.
<http://www.varsityjacketstore.com/images/dana_hills_varsity_jackets.gif>
In a large high school the "jocks" would be the clique of students
comprising the cheerleaders (stereotypically in uniforms all the time,
though that was not something I ever saw) and the guys wearing their
letter jackets.
When I was in school in the last century, letter jackets were a guy
thing and if you saw a girl wearing one it was her boyfriend's. I doubt
that is true now as I am quite sure I've seen plenty of high school-aged
girls wearing their own letter jackets.
They are not what I would otherwise call a jacket since they are heavy
coats.
A "letterman" is someone who has earned the right to wear a letter
jacket.
You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American film having
anything to do with high school.
"track" is short for "track and field" and is a spring sport that
involves sprints, other track-based races, high jump, long jump, discus,
etc.
This is not to be confused with Cross Country, which is a different
sport (in a different season, perhaps?) that involves distance running.
My nephew ran Cross Country. I think his main event was the 15K.
In most American high schools there are three seasons for sports, fall
(football, the American one), winter (basketball), and spring (track or
baseball).
Larger schools may add other sports as well, but most schools will have
these three.
For girls I think the fall sport is volleyball or soccer, winter is
basketball, and spring is track or softball, but I am less sure of
those, and a lot of schools in large portions of the country expect
girls to be cheerleaders first and foremost.
--
All I know is that using the strap makes me feel like a hot woman in
sunglasses. :-) ~jeffcarlson
Bertel Lund Hansen <gade...@lundhansen.dk> wrote:
> Tony Cooper skrev:
>> Jackie Robinson
> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
> What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
In High school you can be on a sports team, but to earn a "letter" you
> Tony Cooper skrev:
>> Jackie Robinson
> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
> What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
have to do more than merely be on the team. For example, for my futbol
team (soccer) you needed a certain number of minutes of playing time.
For track, you had to score points in a 3 school (or more) meet, which
meant finishing in the top three in an event. At some schools being a
team manager might earn a letter, but I think that was quite uncommon
when I was in school.
Do to a rather unlikely and fortunate (for me) serious of improbable
events I earned a letter for track when I was in high school.
Earning your first letter allows you the right to wear a "letter
jacket", and further letters in sports will ear you pins you can put on
the jacket. Letter jackets are often leather and have a large letter
representing the school and come in school colors.
<http://www.varsityjacketstore.com/images/dana_hills_varsity_jackets.gif>
In a large high school the "jocks" would be the clique of students
comprising the cheerleaders (stereotypically in uniforms all the time,
though that was not something I ever saw) and the guys wearing their
letter jackets.
When I was in school in the last century, letter jackets were a guy
thing and if you saw a girl wearing one it was her boyfriend's. I doubt
that is true now as I am quite sure I've seen plenty of high school-aged
girls wearing their own letter jackets.
They are not what I would otherwise call a jacket since they are heavy
coats.
A "letterman" is someone who has earned the right to wear a letter
jacket.
You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American film having
anything to do with high school.
"track" is short for "track and field" and is a spring sport that
involves sprints, other track-based races, high jump, long jump, discus,
etc.
This is not to be confused with Cross Country, which is a different
sport (in a different season, perhaps?) that involves distance running.
My nephew ran Cross Country. I think his main event was the 15K.
In most American high schools there are three seasons for sports, fall
(football, the American one), winter (basketball), and spring (track or
baseball).
Larger schools may add other sports as well, but most schools will have
these three.
For girls I think the fall sport is volleyball or soccer, winter is
basketball, and spring is track or softball, but I am less sure of
those, and a lot of schools in large portions of the country expect
girls to be cheerleaders first and foremost.
--
All I know is that using the strap makes me feel like a hot woman in
sunglasses. :-) ~jeffcarlson
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 16, 2016, 8:12:46 AM4/16/16
to
Lewis skrev:
> You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American
> film having anything to do with high school.
Now that the thing has been explained to me, I realise that I
have seen them countless times, but I just assumed that it was
something like T-shirts: Anyone could get them with any
decoration, but students would prefer to wear their varsity logo.
Thanks to you and musika in retreat.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American
> film having anything to do with high school.
have seen them countless times, but I just assumed that it was
something like T-shirts: Anyone could get them with any
decoration, but students would prefer to wear their varsity logo.
Thanks to you and musika in retreat.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 16, 2016, 9:12:57 AM4/16/16
to
given that the topic was the "breaking of the color barrier" 69 years ago.
> In getting past the groundskeeper, I did finagle my way in using a
> perfectly ordinary sense of "finagle".
Tony Cooper
Apr 16, 2016, 9:57:35 AM4/16/16
to
On Sat, 16 Apr 2016 06:12:54 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
<gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>On Friday, April 15, 2016 at 10:57:45 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 19:02:12 -0700, Charles Bishop
>> <ctbi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>> >In article <86o2hb5dtbbv17n36...@4ax.com>,
>> > Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> >> Jackie Robinson was at the field 1946 when he played for a white
>> >> Triple-A team out of Daytona Beach. The crowd booed him off the field
>> >> and he didn't play. The Sanford police chief threatened to cancel the
>> >> game if Robinson played.
>> >> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
>> >Today was Jackie Robinson Day today, and baseball teams wore Number 42
>> >in his honor. A good thing to do, I think.
>>
>> Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
>> in saying all played later. The original stadium was built in 1926.
>
>You failed to explain why you named Ruth in the context of Robinson and Mays,
>given that the topic was the "breaking of the color barrier" 69 years ago.
Good Lord! Why should I?
<gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>On Friday, April 15, 2016 at 10:57:45 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Apr 2016 19:02:12 -0700, Charles Bishop
>> <ctbi...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>> >In article <86o2hb5dtbbv17n36...@4ax.com>,
>> > Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> >> Jackie Robinson was at the field 1946 when he played for a white
>> >> Triple-A team out of Daytona Beach. The crowd booed him off the field
>> >> and he didn't play. The Sanford police chief threatened to cancel the
>> >> game if Robinson played.
>> >> Later, Robinson, Babe Ruth, and Willie Mays did play in this stadium.
>> >Today was Jackie Robinson Day today, and baseball teams wore Number 42
>> >in his honor. A good thing to do, I think.
>>
>> Robinson, Ruth, and Mays did play at the stadium, but I was incorrect
>> in saying all played later. The original stadium was built in 1926.
>
>You failed to explain why you named Ruth in the context of Robinson and Mays,
>given that the topic was the "breaking of the color barrier" 69 years ago.
The assignment of the topic of breaking the color barrier is yours and
yours alone. My topic was Sanford Memorial Stadium and historical
details about that place. The topic and context is a small town
baseball stadium where some of the most famous baseball players
played.
>> In getting past the groundskeeper, I did finagle my way in using a
>> perfectly ordinary sense of "finagle".
>
>Don't use dialect forms you're unfamiliar with.
Peter T. Daniels
Apr 16, 2016, 10:39:42 AM4/16/16
to
factoids about a stadium you happened to be near.
> >> In getting past the groundskeeper, I did finagle my way in using a
> >> perfectly ordinary sense of "finagle".
> >
> >Don't use dialect forms you're unfamiliar with.
>
> My use is a very common use of the word.
Jerry Friedman
Apr 16, 2016, 11:02:16 PM4/16/16
to
On 4/16/16 6:13 AM, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
> Lewis skrev:
>
>> You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American
>> film having anything to do with high school.
>
> Now that the thing has been explained to me, I realise that I
> have seen them countless times, but I just assumed that it was
> something like T-shirts: Anyone could get them with any
> decoration, but students would prefer to wear their varsity logo.
...
> Lewis skrev:
>
>> You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American
>> film having anything to do with high school.
>
> Now that the thing has been explained to me, I realise that I
> have seen them countless times, but I just assumed that it was
> something like T-shirts: Anyone could get them with any
> decoration, but students would prefer to wear their varsity logo.
As far as I know, we don't use "varsity" that way. The varsity team in
any sport is the team that consists of the best players and represents
the school. There may also be a "junior varsity" team and even a
"freshman" team, which would use the same logo.
"Varsity" is short for "university", as you may know, but I think that
meaning is pretty much forgotten here, and nobody sees any incongruity
in referring to a high school's varsity team.
--
Jerry Friedman
"No Trump" bridge-themed political shirts: cafepress.com/jerrysdesigns
Bumper stickers ditto: cafepress/jerrysstickers
Jerry Friedman
Apr 16, 2016, 11:51:24 PM4/16/16
to
On 4/16/16 5:37 AM, Lewis wrote:
> In message <w6e11m0lct1h$.d...@lundhansen.dk>
> Bertel Lund Hansen <gade...@lundhansen.dk> wrote:
>> Tony Cooper skrev:
>
>>> Jackie Robinson
>
>> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
>> What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
>
> In High school you can be on a sports team, but to earn a "letter" you
> have to do more than merely be on the team. For example, for my futbol
> team (soccer) you needed a certain number of minutes of playing time.
> For track, you had to score points in a 3 school (or more) meet, which
> meant finishing in the top three in an event. At some schools being a
> team manager might earn a letter, but I think that was quite uncommon
> when I was in school.
>
> Do to a rather unlikely and fortunate (for me) serious of improbable
> events I earned a letter for track when I was in high school.
>
> Earning your first letter allows you the right to wear a "letter
> jacket", and further letters in sports will ear you pins you can put on
> the jacket. Letter jackets are often leather
Where I grew up, they were heavy cloth, sometimes with leather or
> In message <w6e11m0lct1h$.d...@lundhansen.dk>
> Bertel Lund Hansen <gade...@lundhansen.dk> wrote:
>> Tony Cooper skrev:
>
>>> Jackie Robinson
>
>> I found an article about him. It was impressing.
>> What does "win varsity letters" mean? And what is "track".
>
> In High school you can be on a sports team, but to earn a "letter" you
> have to do more than merely be on the team. For example, for my futbol
> team (soccer) you needed a certain number of minutes of playing time.
> For track, you had to score points in a 3 school (or more) meet, which
> meant finishing in the top three in an event. At some schools being a
> team manager might earn a letter, but I think that was quite uncommon
> when I was in school.
>
> Do to a rather unlikely and fortunate (for me) serious of improbable
> events I earned a letter for track when I was in high school.
>
> Earning your first letter allows you the right to wear a "letter
> jacket", and further letters in sports will ear you pins you can put on
> the jacket. Letter jackets are often leather
leather-like sleeves.
> and have a large letter
> representing the school and come in school colors.
>
> <http://www.varsityjacketstore.com/images/dana_hills_varsity_jackets.gif>
> In a large high school the "jocks" would be the clique of students
> comprising the cheerleaders (stereotypically in uniforms all the time,
> though that was not something I ever saw)
confronted with evidence.
> and the guys wearing their letter jackets.
>
> When I was in school in the last century, letter jackets were a guy
> thing and if you saw a girl wearing one it was her boyfriend's. I doubt
> that is true now as I am quite sure I've seen plenty of high school-aged
> girls wearing their own letter jackets.
> They are not what I would otherwise call a jacket since they are heavy
> coats.
In my English, they're jackets because they're only go down to the
waist. In the English I hear around here, "coat" seems to be lost.
(Likewise caps are called hats--but I was recently subjected to an ad
for U. S. (golf) Open "hats", which were what I call ballcaps.)
> "track" is short for "track and field" and is a spring sport that
> involves sprints, other track-based races, high jump, long jump, discus,
> etc.
>
> This is not to be confused with Cross Country, which is a different
> sport (in a different season, perhaps?) that involves distance running.
> My nephew ran Cross Country. I think his main event was the 15K.
there was only one cross-country event, which was whatever the host
school's course happened to be. Not that I would have been caught dead
doing it, since dead is what I would have been by the halfway point.
> In most American high schools there are three seasons for sports, fall
> (football, the American one), winter (basketball), and spring (track or
> baseball).
>
> Larger schools may add other sports as well, but most schools will have
> these three.
both track and baseball. My school had about 100 students in each class
and had all those teams and others.
> For girls I think the fall sport is volleyball or soccer, winter is
> basketball, and spring is track or softball, but I am less sure of
> those, and a lot of schools in large portions of the country expect
> girls to be cheerleaders first and foremost.
Tony Cooper
Apr 17, 2016, 12:19:11 AM4/17/16
to
her cheerleading outfit to classes only on specified "pep days" when
they would have a pep rally in the gym for all students. Homecoming
day during football season and some special day during basketball
season or when one of the teams was in some district or state
competition.
While letter jackets were worn in my high school in Indiana, the
athletes wore letter sweaters - a cardigan type - in my daughter's
high school. The athletic department handed out the letters, but the
student purchased whatever the letter was to be sewn onto. A sweater,
in Florida, was usually the choice.
My wife was also a cheerleader in high school. She never had her
letter (varsity cheerleaders get letters) sewn on to anything. She
still has it in a box of memorabilia. Daughter's, and the other
cheerleaders, was sewn on a v-neck sweater that all the cheerleaders
settled on. Daughter removed it from the sweater after high school
and kept the letter and discarded the sweater. It was pinned up on a
bulletin board in her room for years, but I don't know where it is
now.
As I remember high school, *everyone* belonged to a clique of some
sort even if it was a clique of non-clique types. A "clique" is just
a group of people with shared interests or affiliations. Some people
like to say they were never in a clique in high school, but they hung
out with just a certain group of friends. That's a clique.
>> When I was in school in the last century, letter jackets were a guy
>> thing and if you saw a girl wearing one it was her boyfriend's.
her neck.
Mark Brader
Apr 17, 2016, 1:39:01 AM4/17/16
to
"Lewis":
letters (I think they had to buy the school jacket if they wanted
to actually wear them); but they were just called "school letters";
the word "varsity" was not used. I see[2] that these days they still
use the term and now also recognize non-athletic activities.
[1] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22147
[2] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22156
If it hasn't changed, the big R is the "first letter" because it's the
one awarded first, even though it comes third in the school's initials.
The J and F would be the "second" and "third" letters.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | Keep out of eyes--if this occurs, rinse with water.
m...@vex.net | (Directions seen on shampoo bottle)
My text in this article is in the public domain.
>>> You will almost certainly see letter jackets in any American
>>> film having anything to do with high school.
Jerry Friedman:
>>> film having anything to do with high school.
> The varsity team in
> any sport is the team that consists of the best players and represents
> the school. There may also be a "junior varsity" team and even a
> "freshman" team, which would use the same logo.
>
> "Varsity" is short for "university", as you may know, but I think that
> meaning is pretty much forgotten here, and nobody sees any incongruity
> in referring to a high school's varsity team.
FWIW, my high school[1] (in Canada) rewarded its athletes with these
> any sport is the team that consists of the best players and represents
> the school. There may also be a "junior varsity" team and even a
> "freshman" team, which would use the same logo.
>
> "Varsity" is short for "university", as you may know, but I think that
> meaning is pretty much forgotten here, and nobody sees any incongruity
> in referring to a high school's varsity team.
letters (I think they had to buy the school jacket if they wanted
to actually wear them); but they were just called "school letters";
the word "varsity" was not used. I see[2] that these days they still
use the term and now also recognize non-athletic activities.
[1] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22147
[2] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22156
If it hasn't changed, the big R is the "first letter" because it's the
one awarded first, even though it comes third in the school's initials.
The J and F would be the "second" and "third" letters.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | Keep out of eyes--if this occurs, rinse with water.
m...@vex.net | (Directions seen on shampoo bottle)
My text in this article is in the public domain.
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 17, 2016, 3:12:19 AM4/17/16
to
Mark Brader skrev:
> to actually wear them); but they were just called "school letters";
> the word "varsity" was not used. I see[2] that these days they still
> use the term and now also recognize non-athletic activities.
> [1] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22147
> [2] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22156
I see to my dismay that frisbee gets a low score.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> to actually wear them); but they were just called "school letters";
> the word "varsity" was not used. I see[2] that these days they still
> use the term and now also recognize non-athletic activities.
> [1] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22147
> [2] http://www.ugdsb.on.ca/jfr/about/article.aspx?id=22156
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 17, 2016, 3:19:11 AM4/17/16
to
Tony Cooper skrev:
> As I remember high school, *everyone* belonged to a clique of some
> sort even if it was a clique of non-clique types. A "clique" is just
> a group of people with shared interests or affiliations. Some people
> like to say they were never in a clique in high school, but they hung
> out with just a certain group of friends. That's a clique.
The Danish word "klike" has a strong element of exclusiveness.
Cliques forming is seen as a problem in school.
Looking up the word in dictionary.com I also see the word
"exclusive" in the explanation. Don't you see it that way?
It's a natural thing that people form groups. Children, young
people and grown ups do it all the time.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> As I remember high school, *everyone* belonged to a clique of some
> sort even if it was a clique of non-clique types. A "clique" is just
> a group of people with shared interests or affiliations. Some people
> like to say they were never in a clique in high school, but they hung
> out with just a certain group of friends. That's a clique.
Cliques forming is seen as a problem in school.
Looking up the word in dictionary.com I also see the word
"exclusive" in the explanation. Don't you see it that way?
It's a natural thing that people form groups. Children, young
people and grown ups do it all the time.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Hank
Apr 17, 2016, 12:46:28 PM4/17/16
to
In article <51fcaf6d-5e19-44b7...@googlegroups.com>,
around" or "fiddling around" with something.
"Caboose" in US English refers to a house-type car that was historically
the final car on a freight train. Now essentially obsolete for about the
past 20 years. Formally called "way car" and informally called
"crummy." In the days of five-man crews, these were used to house and
transport the rear-end brakeman and conductor (two people, different
labor classifications).
Don't know the meaning of REM, and assume "USE" means US English.
British railway terminology differs at many points from US. A few I can
think of:
US UK
Engineer Driver
Car Wagon, van
Switch Points (in US, "points" are the rails in the switch.)
Throttle Regulator
That's only a quick beginning.
Not sure if the UK "guard" is generic or specific to things like US
"brakeman, trainman, conductor," which are differing labor
classifications.
Harrison Hill <harrison...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
>"with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
>doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
>like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
>(in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
>train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
>be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
>in USE.
>
>"Feneigling" anybody?
In US usage, I'd spell it "finagling," with a meaning of "fussing
>Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
>"with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
>doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
>like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
>(in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
>train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
>be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
>in USE.
>
>"Feneigling" anybody?
around" or "fiddling around" with something.
"Caboose" in US English refers to a house-type car that was historically
the final car on a freight train. Now essentially obsolete for about the
past 20 years. Formally called "way car" and informally called
"crummy." In the days of five-man crews, these were used to house and
transport the rear-end brakeman and conductor (two people, different
labor classifications).
Don't know the meaning of REM, and assume "USE" means US English.
British railway terminology differs at many points from US. A few I can
think of:
US UK
Engineer Driver
Car Wagon, van
Switch Points (in US, "points" are the rails in the switch.)
Throttle Regulator
That's only a quick beginning.
Not sure if the UK "guard" is generic or specific to things like US
"brakeman, trainman, conductor," which are differing labor
classifications.
Peter Young
Apr 17, 2016, 1:59:28 PM4/17/16
to
manager".
Peter
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Os)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
Hank
Apr 17, 2016, 2:40:08 PM4/17/16
to
In article <2bfc6918-cabd-4afb...@googlegroups.com>,
And just, pray tell, is with this nit-picking. If Robinson, Ruth, and
Mays played in the stadium, then three well-known names in major league
baseball played there. Believe it or not, baseball is not all about
skin color.
And yes, he "finagled" his way into the ball park. Perfectly acceptable
usage of the word except, apparently, to you.
Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
Mays played in the stadium, then three well-known names in major league
baseball played there. Believe it or not, baseball is not all about
skin color.
And yes, he "finagled" his way into the ball park. Perfectly acceptable
usage of the word except, apparently, to you.
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 18, 2016, 4:09:17 AM4/18/16
to
Peter Young skrev:
> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
> manager".
What is their function?
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
> manager".
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Mike Barnes
Apr 18, 2016, 4:20:47 AM4/18/16
to
Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
> Peter Young skrev:
>
>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>> manager".
>
> What is their function?
Make announcements.
> Peter Young skrev:
>
>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>> manager".
>
> What is their function?
Check/sell tickets.
On my local line, they also operate the control to open and close the doors.
--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 18, 2016, 4:46:39 AM4/18/16
to
Mike Barnes skrev:
>>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>>> manager".
>> What is their function?
> Make announcements.
> Check/sell tickets.
> On my local line, they also operate the control to open and close the doors.
In Denmark we have two kinds of train officers apart from the
loco driver who sits in the cabin and runs the train. The "train
driver" is in charge of the train as much as the loco driver, and
he gives the go signal and operates the doors. The other function
only has to do with checking tickets and servicing the
passengers. Usually there is only the train driver.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
>>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>>> manager".
>> What is their function?
> Make announcements.
> Check/sell tickets.
> On my local line, they also operate the control to open and close the doors.
loco driver who sits in the cabin and runs the train. The "train
driver" is in charge of the train as much as the loco driver, and
he gives the go signal and operates the doors. The other function
only has to do with checking tickets and servicing the
passengers. Usually there is only the train driver.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Mike Barnes
Apr 18, 2016, 5:44:43 AM4/18/16
to
one person. He/she drives, controls the doors, checks passes and
collects fares. Only on smaller stopping services, of course. I wouldn't
be surprised if they also tidied the trains between runs at the terminus
(not that much tidying would be necessary).
Janet
Apr 18, 2016, 8:07:52 AM4/18/16
to
In article <2egvufnl...@lundhansen.dk>, gade...@lundhansen.dk
says...
not started.
Janet.
says...
>
> Peter Young skrev:
>
> > On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
> > manager".
>
> What is their function?
Making diplomatic public announcements about why the train has stopped/
> Peter Young skrev:
>
> > On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
> > manager".
>
> What is their function?
not started.
Janet.
![Peter Duncanson [BrE]'s profile photo](http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/a-/ALV-UjU1GGYFBCZgBCNB-pRgkosMu-ej0qpnECw3jc8uGYOTiF8a=s40-c)
Peter Duncanson [BrE]
Apr 18, 2016, 8:32:16 AM4/18/16
to
disorderly behaviour.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Tony Cooper
Apr 18, 2016, 9:32:20 AM4/18/16
to
On Mon, 18 Apr 2016 09:12:57 +0100, Mike Barnes
<mikeba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
>> Peter Young skrev:
>>
>>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>>> manager".
>>
>> What is their function?
>
>Make announcements.
>
>Check/sell tickets.
>
>On my local line, they also operate the control to open and close the doors.
The progress of this thread confuses me. It was a discussion about
<mikeba...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
>> Peter Young skrev:
>>
>>> On British passenger trains the guard has metamorphosed into "train
>>> manager".
>>
>> What is their function?
>
>Make announcements.
>
>Check/sell tickets.
>
>On my local line, they also operate the control to open and close the doors.
the (AmE) caboose being called a "guards van" in the UK and if a
guards van contains enough space and facilities to be compared to a
small apartment. The post that spawned the discussion was about a
caboose-size apartment if I remember correctly.
Passenger trains do not have cabooses as far as I know. Passenger
train crews and freight train crews have entirely different functions.
Is any kind of train worker considered to be a "guard"?
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 18, 2016, 9:35:37 AM4/18/16
to
Mike Barnes skrev:
> In Japan I was struck by the system where the whole train is operated by
> one person. He/she drives, controls the doors, checks passes and
> collects fares. Only on smaller stopping services, of course. I wouldn't
> be surprised if they also tidied the trains between runs at the terminus
> (not that much tidying would be necessary).
What we call "regionaltog" are run by the loco driver only, but
the doors are automatic, and he doesn't leave the cabin.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> In Japan I was struck by the system where the whole train is operated by
> one person. He/she drives, controls the doors, checks passes and
> collects fares. Only on smaller stopping services, of course. I wouldn't
> be surprised if they also tidied the trains between runs at the terminus
> (not that much tidying would be necessary).
the doors are automatic, and he doesn't leave the cabin.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Mike Barnes
Apr 18, 2016, 10:11:08 AM4/18/16
to
swivels 180 degrees and a window slides open so that he/she can serve
passengers, more like a bus than the trains I'm used to. I've only ever
seen this done when the train is stationary. :-)
BTW the word "loco" is charmingly archaic in BrE. Only high-speed trains
have a separate unit, and I believe it's normally called the "engine"
nowadays. Boring, I know.
Bertel Lund Hansen
Apr 18, 2016, 10:29:09 AM4/18/16
to
Mike Barnes skrev:
> BTW the word "loco" is charmingly archaic in BrE. Only high-speed trains
> have a separate unit, and I believe it's normally called the "engine"
> nowadays. Boring, I know.
It's "lokofører" in Danish no matter how the train is composed.
The passenger trains now consist of units with three connected
waggons supplied with a motor. They can be combined to form long
trains.
Unless it's diaster trains from Italy. They have four waggons and
only run one unit at the time. There are (still) problems with
the clutch - not to mention having them approved for use at all.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
> BTW the word "loco" is charmingly archaic in BrE. Only high-speed trains
> have a separate unit, and I believe it's normally called the "engine"
> nowadays. Boring, I know.
The passenger trains now consist of units with three connected
waggons supplied with a motor. They can be combined to form long
trains.
Unless it's diaster trains from Italy. They have four waggons and
only run one unit at the time. There are (still) problems with
the clutch - not to mention having them approved for use at all.
--
Bertel, Kolt, Denmark
Mark Brader
Apr 18, 2016, 2:37:56 PM4/18/16
to
Bertel Lund Hansen:
> BTW the word "loco" is charmingly archaic in BrE...
And "cabin" is charmingly nautical. The place Bertel is talking
about is the "cab".
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "No victor believes in chance."
m...@vex.net -- Nietzsche (trans. Kaufmann)
>> What we call "regionaltog" are run by the loco driver only, but
>> the doors are automatic, and he doesn't leave the cabin.
Mike Barnes:
>> the doors are automatic, and he doesn't leave the cabin.
> BTW the word "loco" is charmingly archaic in BrE...
And "cabin" is charmingly nautical. The place Bertel is talking
about is the "cab".
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "No victor believes in chance."
m...@vex.net -- Nietzsche (trans. Kaufmann)
Mark Brader
Apr 18, 2016, 2:56:55 PM4/18/16
to
Tony Cooper:
Attending to baggage would be one of the guard's functions.
> Passenger train crews and freight train crews have entirely different
> functions. Is any kind of train worker considered to be a "guard"?
What the trains had in common in the early days was that they didn't
have continuous brakes -- i.e. brakes operating on all the cars --
as invented by Westinghouse and others. The train would have one
or more "brake vans" or "guard's vans", in which a guard would apply
handbrakes at the driver's whistle signal.
British railways in the mid-19th century tended to reject anything that
was "not invented here", as we say now, and between that attitude and
issues of cost, continuous brakes did not become standard until this
was required by law in 1889. The guard then simply became the person
in charge of the train, corresponding to a North American "conductor".
He would do things like make sure unaccompanied children didn't miss
their stop, telegraph refreshment orders ahead before there were
dining cars, patrol the train at stations, and signal the driver
when the train was ready to leave a station. He would also apply
the brakes in an emergency if he realized the driver had not done so.
In the late 1960s some stations lost their ticket-selling function
and the guard also became responsible for taking fares, and the term
"conductor-guard" was then introduced. I don't know if it's still
used.
Meanwhile on British freight trains, believe it or not, continuous
brakes did not become standard until the *1980s* and the guards
continued to have their old function.
--
Mark Brader | "The job of an engineer is to build systems that
Toronto | people can trust. By this criterion, there
m...@vex.net | exist few software engineers." --John Shore
> The progress of this thread confuses me. It was a discussion about
> the (AmE) caboose being called a "guards van" in the UK ...
> Passenger trains do not have cabooses as far as I know.
In a passenger-train context, instead of "caboose" think "baggage car".
Attending to baggage would be one of the guard's functions.
> Passenger train crews and freight train crews have entirely different
> functions. Is any kind of train worker considered to be a "guard"?
have continuous brakes -- i.e. brakes operating on all the cars --
as invented by Westinghouse and others. The train would have one
or more "brake vans" or "guard's vans", in which a guard would apply
handbrakes at the driver's whistle signal.
British railways in the mid-19th century tended to reject anything that
was "not invented here", as we say now, and between that attitude and
issues of cost, continuous brakes did not become standard until this
was required by law in 1889. The guard then simply became the person
in charge of the train, corresponding to a North American "conductor".
He would do things like make sure unaccompanied children didn't miss
their stop, telegraph refreshment orders ahead before there were
dining cars, patrol the train at stations, and signal the driver
when the train was ready to leave a station. He would also apply
the brakes in an emergency if he realized the driver had not done so.
In the late 1960s some stations lost their ticket-selling function
and the guard also became responsible for taking fares, and the term
"conductor-guard" was then introduced. I don't know if it's still
used.
Meanwhile on British freight trains, believe it or not, continuous
brakes did not become standard until the *1980s* and the guards
continued to have their old function.
--
Mark Brader | "The job of an engineer is to build systems that
Toronto | people can trust. By this criterion, there
m...@vex.net | exist few software engineers." --John Shore
Jerry Friedman
Apr 18, 2016, 5:43:38 PM4/18/16
to
On Saturday, April 16, 2016 at 4:44:20 AM UTC-6, musika wrote:
> > What does "win varsity letters" mean?
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letterman_%28sports%29
But often used to refer to all of track and field. A shot-putter is
"on the track team".
If I had to come up with the dividing line between track and field, I'm
not sure where I'd put the jumping events--or jumping contests, as they
may be called in some places.
--
Jerry Friedman
> On 16/04/2016 10:25, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
> > Tony Cooper skrev:
> >
> >> Jackie Robinson
> >
> > I found an article about him. It was impressing.
"Impressive".
> > Tony Cooper skrev:
> >
> >> Jackie Robinson
> >
> > I found an article about him. It was impressing.
> > What does "win varsity letters" mean?
>
>
> And what is "track".
> >
> The running part of athletics. (USE "Track and field")
> And what is "track".
> >
But often used to refer to all of track and field. A shot-putter is
"on the track team".
If I had to come up with the dividing line between track and field, I'm
not sure where I'd put the jumping events--or jumping contests, as they
may be called in some places.
--
Jerry Friedman
Tony Cooper
Apr 18, 2016, 6:25:47 PM4/18/16
to
track. High and long jumps, discus, shot-putting, and the pole vault
are held in the field inside or outside of the track.
All participants in track and field events are on the track team.
bill van
Apr 18, 2016, 7:57:20 PM4/18/16
to
In article <khnahbdboutr85o9r...@4ax.com>,
The high, long and triple jumps and the pole vault all have sections of
track on which the athletes take their run-ups, so if you're
differentiating between track and field, they're track. Discus, shot
put, hammer (do they still have hammer throw in the Olympics?) and
javelin are all held on grass, i.e. field.
track on which the athletes take their run-ups, so if you're
differentiating between track and field, they're track. Discus, shot
put, hammer (do they still have hammer throw in the Olympics?) and
javelin are all held on grass, i.e. field.
>
> All participants in track and field events are on the track team.
--
bill
> All participants in track and field events are on the track team.
--
Tony Cooper
Apr 18, 2016, 8:19:50 PM4/18/16
to
On Mon, 18 Apr 2016 16:57:15 -0700, bill van <bil...@delete.shaw.ca>
wrote:
In the US, the layout at high schools is usually a track circling a
football field. At the local high school that I am familiar with, the
long jump/triple jump pit is just beyond one end zone and the high
jump pit is just beyond the other end zone. Both are inside the track
but outside of the field boundaries. The pole vault pit is outside
the track parallel to the backstretch of the track. Shot-put, discus,
and javelin is done on the field.
But, I would still separate races at track events and the rest as
field events. Races are the only thing actually done on the track.
>> All participants in track and field events are on the track team.
--
wrote:
football field. At the local high school that I am familiar with, the
long jump/triple jump pit is just beyond one end zone and the high
jump pit is just beyond the other end zone. Both are inside the track
but outside of the field boundaries. The pole vault pit is outside
the track parallel to the backstretch of the track. Shot-put, discus,
and javelin is done on the field.
But, I would still separate races at track events and the rest as
field events. Races are the only thing actually done on the track.
>> All participants in track and field events are on the track team.
--
bosod...@gmail.com
Apr 27, 2016, 7:56:40 AM4/27/16
to
On Wednesday, April 13, 2016 at 11:31:42 AM UTC-7, Harrison Hill wrote:
> Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
> "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
> doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
> like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
> (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
> train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
> be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
> in USE.
>
> "Feneigling" anybody?
sounds nasty
> Watching a US program, a couple have used the expression
> "with a bit of feneigling", which I recognise but Google
> doesn't seem to. Also they want their "tiny house" to be
> like "a caboose". I would think "a caboose" is what we
> (in BrE) would call "a guards van" - the last truck on the
> train; where (in BrE) the brakeman or "guard" used to
> be situated. I know my REM and he is "the train conductor"
> in USE.
>
> "Feneigling" anybody?
Snidely
Apr 28, 2016, 1:04:10 AM4/28/16
to
With a quizzical look, bosod...@gmail.com observed:
Something about French snow on an English fen?
/dps
--
"That's a good sort of hectic, innit?"
" Very much so, and I'd recommend the haggis wontons."
-njm
/dps
--
"That's a good sort of hectic, innit?"
" Very much so, and I'd recommend the haggis wontons."
-njm
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