Brent

[Ken Blake]

According to Standard & Poor's, the discount for Russian Urals crude to
Brent was over $18 per barrel on Tuesday.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gazprom-lukoil-and-sberbank-are-now-penny-stocks-as-russian-companies-collapse-in-london-11646227312

It took me searching to figure out who Brent was.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brent_Crude

[bruce bowser]

Now you get to look up West Texas Intermediate:

Brent Crude vs. West Texas Intermediate: The Differences
-- https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/052615/what-difference-between-brent-crude-and-west-texas-intermediate.asp

[bruce bowser]

In places like Midland, TX there is a lot of nothin' but nothin' but nothin' ...

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 21:06:18 -0800 (PST)
lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:57 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:
> > On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:34 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:

I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[occam]

On 03/03/2022 11:48, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.

What makes you say that ('fake')? Has the real Ken made any complaints?

[Peter Moylan]

Yes, although not in this thread.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:48:26 +0000, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:

> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.

What's fake about my own name?

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 22:08:01 +1100, Peter Moylan wrote:

>> What makes you say that ('fake')? Has the real Ken made any complaints?
>
> Yes, although not in this thread.

I don't know who that other Ken Blake is but if it's his name, he's welcome
to it.

If he is spoofing my headers then I should be the one complaining. Not him.

Is the other Ken Blake's email the same as mine?
Is his newsserver the same as mine?
Is his newsreader the same as mine?

If not, then it's not his problem to complain about.
Nor is it my right to complain about his existence.

[J. J. Lodder]

Don't know about that. Sampling:
There have always two Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com> entities
One posts with Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:91.0)
Gecko/20100101 Betterbird/91.3.2 usually though aioe.org

The other posts with Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186,
usually through the Berlin server uni-berlin.de
(but servers have interchanged changed)
Both live at -07:00

They may be impersonating each other,
but my guess would be that it is just the same Ken Blake
using different machines or something like that,

Jan

[CDB]

On 3/3/2022 7:09 AM, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> Kerr-Mudd, John <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>> lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> lar3ryca wrote:

>>>> lar3ryca wrote:
>>>>> Ken Blake wrote:

>>>>>> According to Standard & Poor's, the discount for Russian
>>>>>> Urals crude to Brent was over $18 per barrel on Tuesday.
>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gazprom-lukoil-and-sberbank-are-now-
>
>>>>>>
penny-stocks-as-russian-companies-collapse-in-london-11646227312

>>>>>> It took me searching to figure out who Brent was.
>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brent_Crude

>> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake
>> "Ken Blake". HTH.

> Don't know about that. Sampling: There have always two Ken Blake
> <K...@invalid.news.com> entities One posts with Mozilla/5.0 (Windows
> NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Betterbird/91.3.2
> usually though aioe.org

> The other posts with Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186, usually through the
> Berlin server uni-berlin.de (but servers have interchanged changed)
> Both live at -07:00

> They may be impersonating each other, but my guess would be that it
> is just the same Ken Blake using different machines or something like
> that,

One of them had an exchange with Lar yesterday in the "Designated
Survivor" thread that doesn't seem like the regular Ken:

**********************************************************************
>>> Wise move anyway, with a President who thinks twice before
>>> buying
green bananas.

>> What event does that "banana republic" reference refer to?

> What reference? I saw none in either the post or the link.

green bananas <===> banana republic

It's a racial slure.
Look it up.
*********************************************************************

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

> Is the other Ken Blake's email the same as mine?

No, but it's weirdly similar.

> Is his newsserver the same as mine?
> Is his newsreader the same as mine?

Only a few technically inclined people take any note of that.

> If not, then it's not his problem to complain about.
> Nor is it my right to complain about his existence.

The other Ken Blake has been a regular in this group for a long time.
Even assuming your name is indeed Ken Blake, the polite thing for you as
the newcomer to do (not just to Ken Blake, but all readers) would be to
assume a different form of your name, like Kenneth Blake, Ken F. Blake
or something.

--
"I didn't mind getting old when I was young, either," I said.
"It's the being old now that's getting to me."
-- J. Scalzi, Old Man's War

[Quinn C]

* J. J. Lodder:

> Kerr-Mudd, John <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>
>> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken
>> Blake". HTH.
>
> Don't know about that. Sampling:
> There have always two Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com> entities

I don't know where you're sampling, but in this group, the second Ken
Blake first popped up 5 days ago. Not exactly my idea of "always".

The email address is different.

> They may be impersonating each other,
> but my guess would be that it is just the same Ken Blake
> using different machines or something like that,

Good ole Ken Blake wrote:

| he's a fraud, using my name and pretending to be me. He's posted with
| my name in most of the newsgroups I participate in.
<news:2s8n1hl0sjtr4795m...@4ax.com>
--
... it might be nice to see ourselves reflected in TV shows and
Pride season campaigns, but the cis white men who invented the
gender binary still own the damn mirror.
-- Delilah Friedler at slate.com

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:05:41 -0500, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Ken Blake:
>
>> Is the other Ken Blake's email the same as mine?
>
>No, but it's weirdly similar.
>
>> Is his newsserver the same as mine?
>> Is his newsreader the same as mine?
>
>Only a few technically inclined people take any note of that.
>
>> If not, then it's not his problem to complain about.
>> Nor is it my right to complain about his existence.
>
>The other Ken Blake has been a regular in this group for a long time.
>Even assuming your name is indeed Ken Blake, the polite thing for you as
>the newcomer to do (not just to Ken Blake, but all readers) would be to
>assume a different form of your name, like Kenneth Blake, Ken F. Blake
>or something.

Our Ken, to use a Britishism, could start to add a "sig line" that
identifies him. His location, for example.


--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[Tony Cooper]

I meant to add that this is easily added by a Forte Agent user.

[J. J. Lodder]

Quinn C <lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

> * J. J. Lodder:
>
> > Kerr-Mudd, John <ad...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> >
> >> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken
> >> Blake". HTH.
> >
> > Don't know about that. Sampling:
> > There have always two Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com> entities
>
> I don't know where you're sampling, but in this group, the second Ken
> Blake first popped up 5 days ago. Not exactly my idea of "always".
>
> The email address is different.

See my reply in another thread.
First pop-up that I can see is more than two years ago,
(and perhaps there is older still)

Jan

[Jerry Friedman]

On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 7:05:49 AM UTC-7, Quinn C wrote:
> * Ken Blake:
> > Is the other Ken Blake's email the same as mine?
> No, but it's weirdly similar.
> > Is his newsserver the same as mine?
> > Is his newsreader the same as mine?
> Only a few technically inclined people take any note of that.
> > If not, then it's not his problem to complain about.
> > Nor is it my right to complain about his existence.

> The other Ken Blake has been a regular in this group for a long time.
> Even assuming your name is indeed Ken Blake, the polite thing for you as
> the newcomer to do (not just to Ken Blake, but all readers) would be to
> assume a different form of your name, like Kenneth Blake, Ken F. Blake
> or something.

Or use a sig. Some posters in a.u.e. like to say where they're from so
people will understand their perspective on English.

I agree with Quinn that as the newcomer in a.u.e., you should be the
one to make the accommodation. However, if you're not considerate
enough to do that, "our" Ken Blake certainly could use a sig, like "Tucson"
or "New York City English" or whatever might be appropriate.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Ken Blake]

It was the fake. No, I didn't complain. I didn't want to bore everyone
here by complaining every time the fake uses my name. I pointed out
that he was a fake when he started.

[Richard Heathfield]

I wouldn't sweat it. I think the group knows you well enough now to tell
the difference between you and a pale imitation.

--
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:05:41 -0500, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Ken Blake:
>
>> Is the other Ken Blake's email the same as mine?
>
>No, but it's weirdly similar.

Weirdly? No, it's not weird that he copied not only my name but also
almost copied my e-mail address.

>> Is his newsserver the same as mine?
>> Is his newsreader the same as mine?
>
>Only a few technically inclined people take any note of that.
>
>> If not, then it's not his problem to complain about.
>> Nor is it my right to complain about his existence.
>
>The other Ken Blake has been a regular in this group for a long time.
>Even assuming your name is indeed Ken Blake,

There's no way I can know for sure, of course, but I'm almost certain
it isn't. He's posted using my name in almost all the newsgroups I
participate in, and it would be an enormous coincidence if someone
with the same name as mine had all the same interests I do.

Judging from his headers, I think I know what other name he's posted
under, but not being sure, I'd rather not mention it.

>the polite thing for you as
>the newcomer to do (not just to Ken Blake, but all readers) would be to
>assume a different form of your name, like Kenneth Blake, Ken F. Blake
>or something.

Of course. I said much the same thing in an earlier message here.

[lar3ryca]

I wasn't saying anything. I was trying to determine which Ken Blake it
was. I use the GG web interface, and the email address of a poster does
not show. I have discovered that if two people have responded in series,
ie. KB->CBD->PTD, which shows in the quoted parts in PTD->CBD-KB, then
the email address of KB shows up.

I was trying to see if it would do so if I were the only serial
responder. Didn't work.

I suppose I really should get Thunderbird configured.

Any recommendations on a news server?

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:26:33 -0500, Tony Cooper

Yes, I know, but I didn't because I though he might also copy that.
But now that you mention it, I will.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:41:56 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

I just did. Checking to see if it's here.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:44:31 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Checking again.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:46:09 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

One more time.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:49:41 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Still no signature. I'm doing something wrong, but I haven't yet
figured out what it is.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 10:50:55 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Tony, can you or some other Agent user here, help? In
Tools|Options|Posting Messages|Signatures, I created a signature, and
then in Tools|Options|Posting Messages|Personas I've selected that
signature. It should be the default used in all messages, but it's
not.

I also went to http://www.pcug.org.au/files/agtman15.pdf to look for
help. On page 118, it tells me how to do it. It says go to
Options→Posting Preferences→Signatures and, showing an image of
that Windows, it says set the default there. I can't find
Options→Posting Preferences and I can't find that window anywhere.

I'm using Agent 6.00/32.1186. Is this perhaps an issue with the
version?

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 17:31:03 +0000, Richard Heathfield
<r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

>On 03/03/2022 5:28 pm, Ken Blake wrote:
>> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 11:57:27 +0100, occam <nob...@nowhere.nix> wrote:
>>
>>> On 03/03/2022 11:48, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>>>> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.
>>>
>>> What makes you say that ('fake')? Has the real Ken made any complaints?
>>
>>
>> It was the fake. No, I didn't complain. I didn't want to bore everyone
>> here by complaining every time the fake uses my name. I pointed out
>> that he was a fake when he started.
>
>I wouldn't sweat it. I think the group knows you well enough now to tell
>the difference between you and a pale imitation.

OK, thanks.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:40:06 -0800 (PST), lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com>
wrote:

news.individual.net


It's not free, but it's only about $10 a year.

[Richard Heathfield]

https://www.eternal-september.org/

Free, and highly recommended.

(Today's date is Thu 10411 Sep 18:23:50 GMT 1993.)

[Mack A. Damia]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:11:11 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

>Options?Posting Preferences?Signatures and, showing an image of

>that Windows, it says set the default there. I can't find

>Options?Posting Preferences and I can't find that window anywhere.

>
>I'm using Agent 6.00/32.1186. Is this perhaps an issue with the
>version?

You posted to alt.usenet.offline-reader.forte-agent before, why not
ask them?

[Ken Blake]

Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.

But if I don't, I will.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:05:41 -0500, Quinn C wrote:

> the polite thing for you as
> the newcomer

The polite thing is to use cogent arguments as aue isn't the only newsgroup
on usenet nor am I a newcomer just because you were unaware of my existence.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Ralph Fox is spot-on when it comes to Agent.

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
<tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>wrote:
>

>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>
>>But if I don't, I will.

Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
(holding down the Shift key) in the top box. Add what you want as a
sig in the box marked text.

When you go to post a message to try it, make you you have that sig
(you see just the ___ in the window) in the box in the heading area
labeled"Signature". Do that once it will do it for all posts.

Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Mack A. Damia]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 12:08:49 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalidinvalid.com>
wrote:

If you are not a troll stirring up trouble, why would you subscribe
and post to a newsgroup using somebody else's name?

Why not Kenneth Blake or K. Blake?

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper

<tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>
>>>But if I don't, I will.
>
>Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>(holding down the Shift key) in the top box.

Argh. Not clear: Hold down the shift key and hit the _ key three
times.

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

Other newsgroups are irrelevant. Most newsreaders allow you to use
different names in different groups.

--
Quinn C
My pronouns are they/them
(or other gender-neutral ones)

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 14:26:26 -0500, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:

>* Ken Blake:
>
>> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:05:41 -0500, Quinn C wrote:
>>
>>> the polite thing for you as
>>> the newcomer
>>
>> The polite thing is to use cogent arguments as aue isn't the only newsgroup
>> on usenet nor am I a newcomer just because you were unaware of my existence.
>
>Other newsgroups are irrelevant. Most newsreaders allow you to use
>different names in different groups.

In Forte Agent, there's a box labeled "Persona" in the Header pane.
Mine says "Tony Cooper". Any post I send will then be from Tony
Cooper.

I can create multiple personas and change that box to a different
persona I've created if I wanted to.

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
wrote:

>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>
>But if I don't, I will.

Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___

(holding down the Shift key) in the top box. Add what you want as a

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:17:52 -0800, Mack A. Damia

Absolutely right! He is extremely helpful and extremely reliable. He's
helped me several times.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper

<tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>
>>>But if I don't, I will.
>
>Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>(holding down the Shift key)

You mean I should type # ?

Why? Doing that did nothing.

> in the top box. Add what you want as a
>sig in the box marked text.

But that's what I did before, pressing the "Add" button. Yes the
signature was added.

>When you go to post a message to try it, make you you have that sig
>(you see just the ___ in the window) in the box in the heading area
>labeled"Signature". Do that once it will do it for all posts.

I had only tried to do that be replying. I didn't notice what was in
the signature box.

So I thought perhaps I had a to first send a new message rather than a
reply. so I just sent a message here called "Test." Everyone please
ignore it.

That had the correct signature in the signature box, and so does this
message. After I send this, I'll check again to see if the signature
is there.

Thanks very much.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:14:21 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Still no signature.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:22:14 -0500, Tony Cooper

<tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>
>>>>But if I don't, I will.
>>
>>Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>>(holding down the Shift key) in the top box.
>
>Argh. Not clear: Hold down the shift key and hit the _ key three
>times.

OK, but that also didn't do anything. But it shouldn't matter because
the desired signature is already there.

[Richard Heathfield]

On 03/03/2022 8:14 pm, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>
>>>> But if I don't, I will.
>>
>> Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>> (holding down the Shift key)
>
> You mean I should type # ?

I think he meant you should type the underscore character three times.
(Why Tony would ask you to do this is a mystery to me. It seems an odd
way to tell a newsreader to add a sig block, but there you go.)

Just in case you don't know, a Usenet sig block comprises two minus
signs, a space (invisible, but significant!), a new line, and up to four
further lines... as shown below.

[J. J. Lodder]

lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 4:48:30 AM UTC-6, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:

[-]

> > I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken
> > Blake". HTH.
> >
> I wasn't saying anything. I was trying to determine which Ken Blake it
> was. I use the GG web interface, and the email address of a poster does
> not show. I have discovered that if two people have responded in series,
> ie. KB->CBD->PTD, which shows in the quoted parts in PTD->CBD-KB, then
> the email address of KB shows up.
>
> I was trying to see if it would do so if I were the only serial
> responder. Didn't work.

Better to leave those things to people with real newsclients,
who just have to click on the option: Show full headers,

> I suppose I really should get Thunderbird configured.
>
> Any recommendations on a news server?

For free: AIOE or Eternal September as others have said.
Paying: The German server at 10$ a year.

Not yet mentioned: some commercial newsservers allow you to buy
a non-expiring credit of several gigabytes for a few dollars.
If you only use text groups a gigabyte will last forever. [1]

Bonus: Those servers may have a rentention of about 4000 days,
so you can see all of the past, (if you would want to)

Jan

[1] They hope that you will start looking at their binary groups,
and will start downloading files.
Then you will need to buy a monthly subscription.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:15:07 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Trying one more time. This time I started from scratch. I deleted the
signature, then added it back. The signature box in this composition
Windows said {none} and I changed it to the one I just created.
The real, original Ken Blake, not some other newcomer

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

AHHH! That did it. The last line above is the signature I added.

But I need to edit it to get it separated from the text I wrote. I'll
do that and see if the edited version appears in this reply.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:43:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

I didn't, but looking at this composition window, the signature went
back to [none} I just changed it to Ken again.


--

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:45:22 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

It keeps changing to [none]. If there's something I need to do to keep
the signature set to Ken, I don't see it.

The default persona is set to Ken

[Richard Heathfield]

Minus minus space newline

> The default persona is set to Ken
>
> --

What you have here is minus minus newline

You need minus minus space newline

The space may be invisible, but it's important.

Whether it will solve your problem, I don't know; but when you get it
right my newsreader will recognise it as a sig block and automatically
remove it from any reply to your article I might care to compose.

[musika]

On 03/03/2022 20:50, Ken Blake wrote:
>
> It keeps changing to [none]. If there's something I need to do to keep
> the signature set to Ken, I don't see it.
>
> The default persona is set to Ken
>

Have you ticked the box in your persona to use the sig for usenet?


--
Ray
UK

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:14:21 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>
>>>>But if I don't, I will.
>>
>>Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>>(holding down the Shift key)
>
>You mean I should type # ?

No, and I did try to make the clear in a subsequent post. You hit the
_ key three times.


Let's do it with pictures:

When you open Tools, and go to Options, it should look like this. It's
hard to see, but my ___ is right above that blue line.

https://folio.ink/jfw8xS

Then go to Tools>Options>Persona>Edit

and change it to show the ___ in messages and replies.


https://folio.ink/Esgf0b

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:45:22 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

I forgot to tell you edit your Persona. See my other post on how to
do this.

My excuse is that I set up a sig line years ago and had to re-learn
how to do it for you.

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 20:29:28 +0000, Richard Heathfield
<r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

>On 03/03/2022 8:14 pm, Ken Blake wrote:
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>>
>>>>> But if I don't, I will.
>>>
>>> Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>>> (holding down the Shift key)
>>
>> You mean I should type # ?
>
>I think he meant you should type the underscore character three times.
>(Why Tony would ask you to do this is a mystery to me. It seems an odd
>way to tell a newsreader to add a sig block, but there you go.)

It doesn't add a sig block, but those underscores are required as
part of the steps.

>
>Just in case you don't know, a Usenet sig block comprises two minus
>signs, a space (invisible, but significant!), a new line, and up to four
>further lines... as shown below.

It's not the minus sign. When shift is held it's the underscore sign.

[lar3ryca]

Testing the minus sign.

--
A pessimist's blood type is always B-negative.

[Richard Heathfield]

What Agent requires you to do is more than I can say. The Usenet
convention (minus minus space newline) is codified in RFC 3676 and
affirmed in the Agent user manual:

Usenet Signature Convention

There is a long-standing convention in Usenet news which also
commonly appears in Internet mail of using "-- " as the separator
line between the body and the signature of a message. When
generating a Format=Flowed message containing a Usenet-style
separator before the signature, the separator line is sent as-is.
This is a special case; an (optionally quoted or quoted and stuffed)
line consisting of DASH DASH SP is neither fixed nor flowed.

Generating agents MUST NOT end a paragraph with such a signature
line.


Dashes, not underscores.


From the Forte Agent manual:

Text - Enter any text that you want to appear with the currently selected
name in the Names list. If you want a separator to appear between the
rest of the message and the signature, you need to include it here. A
common convention on the Internet is to begin your signature with a line
containing two dashes (followed by a space), as shown below:
--<put one space here, no brackets>
Mark Prince
Forté Support



Quoted from p119 of the manual here:
<http://www.pcug.org.au/files/agtman15.pdf>

[Richard Heathfield]

THAT's a good sig. We know this because we can't see it quoted in this
reply, and we can't see it because Thunderbird recognised the sig
delimiter sequence DASH DASH SPACE NEWLINE and automatically snipped it
out of my reply to save me the trouble.

[Tony Cooper]

Evidently that works if that's what you used. I didn't know that.

By the way...the sig you used is "A pessimist's blood type is always
B-negative".

My blood type is AB-negative, but I am usually optimistic.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 21:14:16 +0000, musika <mUs...@NOSPAMexcite.com>
wrote:

Yes.

[Richard Heathfield]

Didn't work on that one.

I presume you have the manual?

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:54:07 -0500, Tony Cooper

<tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:14:21 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
>><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>>><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>>
>>>>>But if I don't, I will.
>>>
>>>Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>>>(holding down the Shift key)
>>
>>You mean I should type # ?
>No, and I did try to make the clear in a subsequent post. You hit the
>_ key three times.
>
>
>Let's do it with pictures:
>
>When you open Tools, and go to Options, it should look like this. It's
>hard to see, but my ___ is right above that blue line.
>
>https://folio.ink/jfw8xS
>
>Then go to Tools>Options>Persona>Edit
>
>and change it to show the ___ in messages and replies.

That's what it was. I just changed it to have the signature without
the -- line, so I'm tryng again.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:00:02 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

Back to the way it was before.

Change to add underscores and trying again.

__

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:01:42 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

It seems to be OK now, thanks very much again, Tony, and my apologies
to the rest of you who have been bored by this interchange.

[Richard Heathfield]

You know how many times underscores are mentioned in the manual? 0.

>>
>> __
>>
>> The real, original Ken Blake, not some other newcomer
>
> It seems to be OK now

No, it seems to be Just Plain Wrong now, and Thunderbird isn't picking
it up as a sig because you screwed up the delimiter.

The manual makes this clear.

Text - Enter any text that you want to appear with the currently
selected name in the Names list. If you want a separator to appear
between the rest of the message and the signature, you need to include
it here. A common convention on the Internet is to begin your signature
with a line containing two dashes (followed by a space), as shown below:
--<put one space here, no brackets>
Mark Prince
Forté Support

(Tony Cooper's sig block is wrong too, by the way.)

[Ken Blake]

Yes, I left out the space after the underscores. Is it OK now?

>The manual makes this clear.
>
>
>Text - Enter any text that you want to appear with the currently
>selected name in the Names list. If you want a separator to appear
>between the rest of the message and the signature, you need to include
>it here. A common convention on the Internet is to begin your signature
>with a line containing two dashes (followed by a space), as shown below:
>--<put one space here, no brackets>
>Mark Prince
>Forté Support
>
>
>(Tony Cooper's sig block is wrong too, by the way.)

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:03:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

You seem to have *almost* have it.

Your sig is not dropping in the Reply. It should.

I apologize for not providing complete and clear instructions from the
get-go. If you are doing it as my screenshots show, the sig should
drop and the sig will automatically be added to new posts and replies.

I suggest that if you want to do more tests, you subscribe to alt.test
and do them there. Quick, easy, and no posts to clutter up a.u.e.

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:18:23 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

I changed the underscores to hyphens. Is that better?

>__
>
>The real, original Ken Blake, not some other newcomer

--
................................................................................................

[Ken Blake]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:18:29 -0500, Tony Cooper

I was posting tests here for you and any other Agent users to see, but
I think I'm done now.

I deleted the line of dots and I hope all should be OK now. No more
testing required.

--

[Richard Heathfield]

No, because the underscores are what we call in the trade "absolutely
nothing to do with it."

Tony has led you on a wild underscore chase up the garden path in
puruit of a red herring.

Your manual can be found here:

<http://www.pcug.org.au/files/agtman15.pdf>

For signatures, see pp 117-119. Delimiters are discussed on p119 in Point 6.

[Richard Heathfield]

Aye. So should yours. (It doesn't. See below.)

>
> I apologize for not providing complete and clear instructions from the
> get-go. If you are doing it as my screenshots show, the sig should
> drop and the sig will automatically be added to new posts and replies.
>
> I suggest that if you want to do more tests, you subscribe to alt.test
> and do them there. Quick, easy, and no posts to clutter up a.u.e.

Or just use minus minus space newline as your delimiter and be done with it.

> Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Richard Heathfield]

Not even a little bit better..

MINUS is between 0 and = on most keyboards. It's the same key you press
when you want to subtract something.


MINUS MINUS SPACE NEWLINE

Exactly like mine.

[Richard Heathfield]

BINGO!

Thunderbird has recognised your sig and autosnipped it from my reply.
Keep it just like that.

[Tony Cooper]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:23:53 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>

OK...The sig line appeared in your post and dropped for the reply.

[Ken Blake]

Thanks very much. Glad to hear it's OK Now,
--

[Peter Moylan]

On 04/03/22 10:01, Ken Blake wrote:

> Change to add underscores and trying again.
>
> __
>
> The real, original Ken Blake, not some other newcomer

This is definitely wrong. Where you have three underscores, you should
instead have the three characters hyphen hyphen space (-- ).

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

[Peter Moylan]

On 03/03/22 22:44, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:48:26 +0000, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>
>> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake
>> "Ken Blake". HTH.
>
> What's fake about my own name?

It doesn't agree with the name in your .sig

[Peter Moylan]

On 04/03/22 05:25, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 03/03/2022 5:40 pm, lar3ryca wrote:

>> Any recommendations on a news server?
>
>
> https://www.eternal-september.org/
>
> Free, and highly recommended.

Seconded. I once had a problem when they changed servers, but it was
quickly fixed (and documented on their web site). Otherwise it was just
set-and-forget.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2022-03-03 20:45:22 +0000, Ken Blake said:

> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:43:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>> wrote:

>>
>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:15:07 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:14:21 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:19:23 -0500, Tony Cooper
>>>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 14:16:56 -0500, Tony Cooper
>>>>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 11:40:35 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Because I thought I would get an answer more quickly here.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But if I don't, I will.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Go to Tools>Options>Signature (under Posting Messages) and type 3 ___
>>>>>> (holding down the Shift key)
>>>>>
>>>>> You mean I should type # ?
>>>>>

>>>>> Why? Doing that did nothing.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> in the top box. Add what you want as a
>>>>>> sig in the box marked text.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> But that's what I did before, pressing the "Add" button. Yes the
>>>>> signature was added.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> When you go to post a message to try it, make you you have that sig
>>>>>> (you see just the ___ in the window) in the box in the heading area
>>>>>> labeled"Signature". Do that once it will do it for all posts.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I had only tried to do that be replying. I didn't notice what was in
>>>>> the signature box.
>>>>>
>>>>> So I thought perhaps I had a to first send a new message rather than a
>>>>> reply. so I just sent a message here called "Test." Everyone please
>>>>> ignore it.
>>>>>
>>>>> That had the correct signature in the signature box, and so does this
>>>>> message. After I send this, I'll check again to see if the signature
>>>>> is there.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks very much.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Still no signature.
>>>
>>>
>>> Trying one more time. This time I started from scratch. I deleted the
>>> signature, then added it back. The signature box in this composition

>>> Windows said {none} and I changed it to the one I just created.

>>> The real, original Ken Blake, not some other newcomer
>>
>>

>> AHHH! That did it. The last line above is the signature I added.

Bingo! That did it!

>>
>> But I need to edit it to get it separated from the text I wrote. I'll
>> do that and see if the edited version appears in this reply.
>
>
> I didn't, but looking at this composition window, the signature went

> back to [none} I just changed it to Ken again.


--
Athel -- French and British, living mainly in England until 1987.

[occam]

On 03/03/2022 19:17, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 09:40:06 -0800 (PST), lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 4:48:30 AM UTC-6, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
>>> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 21:06:18 -0800 (PST)
>>> lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:57 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:34 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:
>>>>>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 9:52:02 PM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
>>>>>>> According to Standard & Poor's, the discount for Russian Urals crude to
>>>>>>> Brent was over $18 per barrel on Tuesday.
>>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gazprom-lukoil-and-sberbank-are-now-penny-stocks-as-russian-companies-collapse-in-london-11646227312
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It took me searching to figure out who Brent was.
>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brent_Crude

>>> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.
>>

>> I wasn't saying anything. I was trying to determine which Ken Blake it
>> was. I use the GG web interface, and the email address of a poster does
>> not show. I have discovered that if two people have responded in series,
>> ie. KB->CBD->PTD, which shows in the quoted parts in PTD->CBD-KB, then
>> the email address of KB shows up.
>>
>> I was trying to see if it would do so if I were the only serial
>> responder. Didn't work.
>>
>> I suppose I really should get Thunderbird configured.

>>
>> Any recommendations on a news server?
>
>

> news.individual.net
>
>
> It's not free, but it's only about $10 a year.

Seconded. I consider 10Eur per year charge as 'free'.
The other (free) Eternal September server
(https://www.eternal-september.org/) is also good, but has had hiccups
in the past.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 18:25:15 +0000
Richard Heathfield <r...@cpax.org.uk> wrote:

> On 03/03/2022 5:40 pm, lar3ryca wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 4:48:30 AM UTC-6, Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:
> >> On Wed, 2 Mar 2022 21:06:18 -0800 (PST)
> >> lar3ryca <lar3...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:57 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:
> >>>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 11:05:34 PM UTC-6, lar3ryca wrote:
> >>>>> On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 9:52:02 PM UTC-6, Ken Blake wrote:
> >>>>>> According to Standard & Poor's, the discount for Russian Urals crude to
> >>>>>> Brent was over $18 per barrel on Tuesday.
> >>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/gazprom-lukoil-and-sberbank-are-now-penny-stocks-as-russian-companies-collapse-in-london-11646227312
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It took me searching to figure out who Brent was.
> >>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brent_Crude
> >> I don't know what your not saying, but you are replying to the fake "Ken Blake". HTH.
> >
> > I wasn't saying anything. I was trying to determine which Ken Blake it
> > was. I use the GG web interface, and the email address of a poster does
> > not show. I have discovered that if two people have responded in series,
> > ie. KB->CBD->PTD, which shows in the quoted parts in PTD->CBD-KB, then
> > the email address of KB shows up.
> >
> > I was trying to see if it would do so if I were the only serial
> > responder. Didn't work.
> >
> > I suppose I really should get Thunderbird configured.
> >
> > Any recommendations on a news server?
>
>

> https://www.eternal-september.org/
>
> Free, and highly recommended.
>

> (Today's date is Thu 10411 Sep 18:23:50 GMT 1993.)
>
>
I was going to say that, so I'll just click <Like>

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:52:32 -0500

Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:23:53 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
> wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:18:29 -0500, Tony Cooper
> ><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:03:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
> >>wrote:

[?]

> >
> >I was posting tests here for you and any other Agent users to see, but
> >I think I'm done now.
> >
> >I deleted the line of dots and I hope all should be OK now. No more
> >testing required.
>

All's well from Ken

> OK...The sig line appeared in your post and dropped for the reply.
>
>
> Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

We just need to fix Tony's sig now!

[Tony Cooper]

On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 12:19:15 +0000, "Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1>

wrote:

>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:52:32 -0500
>Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:23:53 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:18:29 -0500, Tony Cooper
>> ><tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >>On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:03:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
>> >>wrote:
>[?]
>> >
>> >I was posting tests here for you and any other Agent users to see, but
>> >I think I'm done now.
>> >
>> >I deleted the line of dots and I hope all should be OK now. No more
>> >testing required.
>>
>All's well from Ken
>
>> OK...The sig line appeared in your post and dropped for the reply.
>>
>>
>> Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
>
>We just need to fix Tony's sig now!

I think mine's right now. I started over with mine in coming up with
instructions for Ken, and screwed up mine.

--

Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida

[Richard Heathfield]

Alles ist in Ordnung. And Thunderbird has signalled its agreement by
autosnipping your sig.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Why does he keep calling the hyphen "minus"? They are
different characters in Unicode (a minus glyph usually
has the length of an en-dash but may be at a slightly
different height, and probably won't allow a line break
before or after it, and may have the spacing before-and-
after built into it, and in more sophisticated programs
will be called by the minus-key on the keypad.

The character between 0 and = on a standard keyboard
is the ASCII character "hyphen," and is the one that has
been used for such functions by programmers since time
immemorial.

[Ken Blake]

Not quite free, but yes, also close enough to free for me.

>The other (free) Eternal September server
>(https://www.eternal-september.org/) is also good, but has had hiccups
>in the past.

Yes, it's not bad. I used to use it, but there were too many of those
annoying hiccups, so I switched to news.individual.net, which has had
none since I started using it.
--

[lar3ryca]

On 2022-03-04 09:14, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 6:33:59 PM UTC-5, Richard Heathfield wrote:
>> On 03/03/2022 11:20 pm, Ken Blake wrote:
>
>>> I changed the underscores to hyphens. Is that better?
>> Not even a little bit better..
>>
>> MINUS is between 0 and = on most keyboards. It's the same key you press
>> when you want to subtract something.
>>
>>
>> MINUS MINUS SPACE NEWLINE
>>
>> Exactly like mine.
>> --
>
> Why does he keep calling the hyphen "minus"? They are
> different characters in Unicode (a minus glyph usually
> has the length of an en-dash but may be at a slightly
> different height, and probably won't allow a line break
> before or after it, and may have the spacing before-and-
> after built into it, and in more sophisticated programs
> will be called by the minus-key on the keypad.

So do YOU actually use the minus sign on the keypad?
Oh my, I guess I'm screwed. I don't have a keypad! I guess I'll have to
use the Fn key every time I need that single character.

>
> The character between 0 and = on a standard keyboard
> is the ASCII character "hyphen," and is the one that has
> been used for such functions by programmers since time
> immemorial.

Programmers immemorial have been likely to use a minus sign far more
often than a hyphen.

I guess you find it strange that the hyphen actually works when you are
using it for subtraction.

You are a pedantic twit.

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

It also does decent spam filtering.

I use one of those (often Dutch) binary servers JJ alluded to - I paid
them $5 at some point for a few gigabytes of data volume, and have
nibbled on that for many years now. But I need to take care of spam
myself.

--
The need of a personal pronoun of the singular number and common
gender is so desperate, urgent, imperative, that ... it should long
since have grown on our speech -- The Atlantic Monthly (1878)

[Quinn C]

* Peter T. Daniels:

And in Unicode, it's quite officially called the "hyphen-minus",
different from a "minus sign" and a "hyphen". The latter probably looks
the same as the first one in most fonts, but it doesn't have to.

In German, it's very common to call it "minus" when spelling out
Internet addresses, presumably because the German word for hyphen
(Bindestrich) is so long. But it still bothers me. But not when it's a
character out of context as above. Unicode minus sign or Unicode hyphen
aren't available directly on a common keyboard, so they remain somewhat
"special use".

--
... while there are people who are consecrated, chronic
assholes--like Donald Trump for example, or General Patton--
it's a condition that all of us are liable to.
-- Geoffrey Nunberg, 2012 interview

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

And an ignorant one too. I suppose that there are some standard
keyboards that require different keys for hyphen and minus, but I can't
immediately think of one. If I want a minus sign when I'm in math mode
in LaTeX I press -; if I want a hyphen when I'm in text mode I press -.
Do you see any difference? Don't bother looking too hard because there
isn't any. However, even that's a bit pedantic, because in an email
message no one bothers with math mode, so if they want to write 10
minus 5 equals 5 they type 10 - 5 = 5. Simple as that.

The practical difference between hyphens and minus signs when you're
not being super-fancy with LaTeX has to do with spacing: hyphens should
never be typed with spaces around them; minus signs always. So I could
write C-B = me, C - B = B if I've already defined C = 10, B = 5.

[Richard Heathfield]

Someone else called it a hyphen, and Ken in all honesty typed the wrong
character. And *that* is why I very deliberately called it a "minus"...
so that there could be no confusion, in a situation where confusion was
already rife.

[J. J. Lodder]

They had some problems with accepting non-euro payments for a time,
but that has been sorted out in the meantime,

Jan

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 11:56:19 AM UTC-5, lar3ryca wrote:
> On 2022-03-04 09:14, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 3, 2022 at 6:33:59 PM UTC-5, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> >> On 03/03/2022 11:20 pm, Ken Blake wrote:

> >>> I changed the underscores to hyphens. Is that better?
> >> Not even a little bit better..
> >> MINUS is between 0 and = on most keyboards. It's the same key you press
> >> when you want to subtract something.
> >> MINUS MINUS SPACE NEWLINE
> >> Exactly like mine.
> >> --
> > Why does he keep calling the hyphen "minus"? They are
> > different characters in Unicode (a minus glyph usually
> > has the length of an en-dash but may be at a slightly
> > different height, and probably won't allow a line break
> > before or after it, and may have the spacing before-and-
> > after built into it, and in more sophisticated programs
> > will be called by the minus-key on the keypad.
>
> So do YOU actually use the minus sign on the keypad?

I rarely or never have occasion to type a minus sign, but
I type en-dashes almost every day, and in MSWord, the
keyboard shortcut for en-dash is Ctrl-Minus (not Ctrl-
hyphen), and the keyboard shortcut for em-dash is Ctrl-
Alt-Minus.

You're welcome.

I have also created possibly hundreds of custom keyboard
shortcuts within MSWord so that I can type just about every
letter in the IPA, all the diacritics I'd ever need, etc. Unfortunately
they don't port over into PowerPoint or, of course, Windows
in general, so here I have to resort to BabelMap (or, for the
easier items, Windows's Character Map).

> Oh my, I guess I'm screwed. I don't have a keypad! I guess I'll have to
> use the Fn key every time I need that single character.

A few times I've asked people with a keypadless laptop how
they type en- or em-dashes. Often they don't know what I'm
talking about, but I really would like to know. There is a built-
in AutoCorrect entry that converts certain hyphen combinations,
but it's also responsible for turning any leading hyphen (as
when you refer to a suffix, such as -ing) to an en-dash, and
that's just wrong. I quickly discovered which Word Option to
uncheck so it would stop doing that.

> > The character between 0 and = on a standard keyboard
> > is the ASCII character "hyphen," and is the one that has
> > been used for such functions by programmers since time
> > immemorial.
>
> Programmers immemorial have been likely to use a minus sign far more
> often than a hyphen.

And they've been forced to type it with a hyphen because the
devisers of ASCII were so thoroughly American-oriented.

> I guess you find it strange that the hyphen actually works when you are
> using it for subtraction.

But I never do.

> You are a pedantic twit.

You are ignorant in so many fields that it's mind-boggling.

And that you come to the defense of RH says something
about your psyche, too.

[Lewis]

Today is also the 733rd of March 2020.

> I was going to say that, so I'll just click <Like>



--

No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of
Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

[Peter T. Daniels]

00AD is "discretionary hyphen," 2010 and 2011 are both labeled
"hyphen," and hyphens are provided for in several script blocks.
2212 is the Mathematical Operators "minus."

[bruce bowser]

On Friday, March 4, 2022 at 9:24:18 AM UTC-5, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 04/03/2022 2:05 pm, Tony Cooper wrote:
> > On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 12:19:15 +0000, "Kerr-Mudd, John" <ad...@127.0.0.1>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:52:32 -0500
> >> Tony Cooper <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:23:53 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 18:18:29 -0500, Tony Cooper
> >>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 16:03:25 -0700, Ken Blake <K...@invalid.news.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >> [?]
> >>>>
> >>>> I was posting tests here for you and any other Agent users to see, but
> >>>> I think I'm done now.
> >>>>
> >>>> I deleted the line of dots and I hope all should be OK now. No more
> >>>> testing required.
> >>>
> >> All's well from Ken
> >>
> >>> OK...The sig line appeared in your post and dropped for the reply.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
> >>
> >> We just need to fix Tony's sig now!
> >
> > I think mine's right now. I started over with mine in coming up with
> > instructions for Ken, and screwed up mine.
> Alles ist in Ordnung.

I guess that means ,,Alles Wunderbar"

[Ken Blake]

Speaking of the - character, let me ask about numbers like -3

I read that as "minus three," since that's what it was always called
when I was in school. But these days, many people, including my
grandson, read it as "negative three," since that's what it's
apparently called in schools these day (at least in the US).

So, how do the rest of you here call it?

As usual, I'm against changing names. Yes, perhaps "negative three" is
better than "minus three," but if so it's only slightly better, and
there's no real advantage to changing names. As usual, doing so
confuses many people.
--