seeds are sowed or sewn?
James Duncan
I'm writing an essay, and I'm afraid of sabotaging a way over-extended
metaphor my misusing the following: Are seeds sewn or sowed? I get
approximately equal hits on Google with both. I have a suspicion both are
acceptable but dependant on tense. i.e. - "Seeds are sowed in April" vs.
"It's May, so you're seeds are sewn".
Thanks in advance to anyone who can clarify this for me.
James
Eòsaph
I think you can say either sowed or sown (with an "o"),
Tilly
they should grow well .!nne @sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:CxeE9.351$l45.1...@news20.bellglobal.com...
Tony Cooper
<jdu...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>Hello, this is my first post and I hope someone can help.
>
>I'm writing an essay, and I'm afraid of sabotaging a way over-extended
>metaphor my misusing the following: Are seeds sewn or sowed? I get
>approximately equal hits on Google with both. I have a suspicion both are
>acceptable but dependant on tense. i.e. - "Seeds are sowed in April" vs.
>"It's May, so you're seeds are sewn".
Replies might be slow in coming. The members of the audience are
stunned and can't take their eyes off of "you're seeds" to get as far
as "sewn". A truly auspicious first post.
If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
--
Christmas stocking stuffer suggestion:
http://www.kopes.com/computer/internet-urinal.htm
Tony Cooper aka: tony_co...@yahoo.com
James Duncan
just carelessness, so I'm not too ashamed, but I should of (you like that
one?) been more careful with this group. To clarify, I did consult a
dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
(proofreading....)
James
"Tony Cooper" <tony_co...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:q4v2uus8fcha35vb8...@4ax.com...
Tony Cooper
<jdu...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>Thanks for yewer replies. As for "sewn"- yeah, that was dumb. "You're" was
>just carelessness, so I'm not too ashamed, but I should of (you like that
>one?) been more careful with this group. To clarify, I did consult a
>dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
>whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
>(proofreading....)
>James
>
>"Tony Cooper" <tony_co...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:q4v2uus8fcha35vb8...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 24 Nov 2002 19:55:08 -0500, "James Duncan"
>> <jdu...@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>>
>> >Hello, this is my first post and I hope someone can help.
>> >
>> >I'm writing an essay, and I'm afraid of sabotaging a way over-extended
>> >metaphor my misusing the following: Are seeds sewn or sowed? I get
>> >approximately equal hits on Google with both. I have a suspicion both
>are
>> >acceptable but dependant on tense. i.e. - "Seeds are sowed in April" vs.
>> >"It's May, so you're seeds are sewn".
>>
>> Replies might be slow in coming. The members of the audience are
>> stunned and can't take their eyes off of "you're seeds" to get as far
>> as "sewn". A truly auspicious first post.
>>
>> If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
Dear, dear. Adding insult to injury by top-posting. I certainly hope
your sig shows up in a different color than the rest of the text or
you are in deep trouble.
Admitting error is simply not done here. The proper reply is to
either (1) find some source that will list what you wrote as a
variant, (2) blame it on the spellchecker, (3) proclaim it to be an
acceptable regionalism, or (4) seize the initiative and go on the
offensive by calling the person pointing out the error a "Spelling
Nazi". Use asterisks in the person's name to indicate severe
displeasure. We do have certain conventions here, and would
appreciate it if you would follow them.
Now I suppose you'll actually want an answer to your question. It was
one of the two, but I forget which. The other was definitely wrong.
R J Valentine
...
} If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
Or because you rip what you sew.
--
R. J. Valentine <mailto:r...@smart.net>
The quick brown fox leaps the lazy sow.
Alan Jones
"James Duncan" <jdu...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:7ygE9.430$l45.2...@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Thanks for yewer replies. As for "sewn"- yeah, that was dumb. "You're"
was
> just carelessness, so I'm not too ashamed, but I should of (you like that
> one?) been more careful with this group. To clarify, I did consult a
> dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
> whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
> (proofreading....)
A straight answer, now we've had our fun with you: there are two distinct
and unrelated verbs here,
"To sew" is what you do with needle and thread. "I am sewing a button on
your shirt", "I have sewn a button on your shirt", "I sewed a button in your
shirt yesterday", "Sister Susie's sewing shirts for soldiers", "She sews for
a living".
"To sow" is what you do with seeds. "I am sowing my early beans tomorrow",
"I sowed my beans yesterday", "After I had sowed my beans the birds dug them
all up and ate them", "I always sow beans in autumn".
The two may be pronounced the same but don't share any of their forms. So
there shouldn't be any problem. Do you want us to explain "lay" and "lie"
now? They're really confusing.
Alan Jones
Alan Jones
"Alan Jones" <a...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote in message
news:wQkE9.4731$Eo4....@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
> "To sow" is what you do with seeds. "I am sowing my early beans tomorrow",
> "I sowed my beans yesterday", "After I had sowed my beans the birds dug
them
> all up and ate them", "I always sow beans in autumn".
An omission: the past participle of the seed word used to be "sown", still
used by many people, but it is gradually being replaced by "sowed". So (BrE)
either: "After I had sowed my beans the birds dug them all up and ate them",
or "After I had sown my beans the birds dug them all up and ate them". AmE
may differ.
Alan Jones
Steve Hayes
wrote:
>Hello, this is my first post and I hope someone can help.
>
>I'm writing an essay, and I'm afraid of sabotaging a way over-extended
>metaphor my misusing the following: Are seeds sewn or sowed? I get
>approximately equal hits on Google with both. I have a suspicion both are
>acceptable but dependant on tense. i.e. - "Seeds are sowed in April" vs.
>"It's May, so you're seeds are sewn".
Seeds are sowed, seams are sewn.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/steve.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
N.Mitchum
----
> Are seeds sewn or sowed?
Seeds are either sown or sowed. "Sewn" is what you've done with
needle and thread.
-----
> I get approximately equal hits on Google with both.
>....
That surprises me, since one of the words is incorrect. Are you
saying that others are using "sewn" instead of "sown"?
----NM
Charles Riggs
<tony_co...@yahoo.com> penned the, now, immortal words:
>Admitting error is simply not done here. The proper reply is to
>either (1) find some source that will list what you wrote as a
>variant, (2) blame it on the spellchecker, (3) proclaim it to be an
>acceptable regionalism, or (4) seize the initiative and go on the
>offensive by calling the person pointing out the error a "Spelling
>Nazi". Use asterisks in the person's name to indicate severe
>displeasure. We do have certain conventions here, and would
>appreciate it if you would follow them.
These conventions are followed by evasive, dishonest, uneducated
sleazeballs with no balls such as C**per, but most of us are perfectly
willing to admit our errors when we make them. Whether he's kidding or
trying to be serious, dismiss anything idiot C**per has to say. His
head is so far up his ass, he'll never see daylight again. His bag of
tricks is large, but we're on, by now, to all of them.
--
Charles Riggs
chriggs |at| eircom |dot| net
Edward
> dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
> whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
> (proofreading....)
> James
But they're not both past tenses for sow. Sown is the past tense for
sow (meaning broadcast), sewn is the past tense for sew (meaning
needlecast).
Edward
Mike Lyle
> To clarify, I did consult a
> dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
> whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
Ah, now I get you. Past participle, yeah? not past tense. It's an
interesting question because "I have sowed" is perfectly normal
English, but the unwary may think because we also have "I have sown",
that "I have sowed" must be wrong, like "I have *growed". But it
isn't, so you're left with a dilemma: you can know you're right and
suffer the scorn of those who don't know; or you can play safe and
always go for "sown". I think I usually play safe.
> > If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
[...]
Wise words above from Tony Cooper. We sometimes hurl custard pies
about a bit here, because there's an unwritten convention that we know
one another and are always (well, usually) smiling if we do a
put-down. Don't let it put you off: it's an interesting group, and we
aren't often visited by the weirdo shouters who make other groups a
waste of time.
Mike.
Phil Carmody
I'd just like to cast a 'strewn' into the discussion, as it has all
the letters of 'sewn' within it. Crap reason I know, but I felt teh thread
had reached an impasse.
Phil
John Lawler
>"James Duncan" <jdu...@sympatico.ca> writes:
><snip> To clarify, I did consult a
>> dictionary and knew that both were past tenses for sow, I'm more concerned
>> whether one or the other should be used depending on context.
>> (proofreading....)
>But they're not both past tenses for sow. Sown is the past tense for
>sow (meaning broadcast), sewn is the past tense for sew (meaning
>needlecast).
<*buzzer*> Sorry.
"Sown" is the past participle (not the past tense) of "sow".
"Sewn" is the past participle (not the past tense) of "sew".
"Sowed" is the past tense of "sow".
"Sewed" is the past tense of "sew".
In all of these words, <sew> and <sow> have identical pronunciation, /so/.
But they don't have identical meanings.
So?
-John Lawler http://www.umich.edu/~jlawler U Michigan Linguistics Dept
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Thinking is more interesting than knowing, but less interesting
than looking." -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
Jacqui
> Tony Cooper wrote: ...
> } If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
>
> Or because you rip what you sew.
>
frog". To rip what you have sewn is to "frog it", hence "I did some
frogging", "I frogged the whole row", "I'm going to have to frog" etc.
Rippit, rippit.
I've acquired a whole new swathe of vocabulary since I took up cross-
stitch. SEX, SABLE, frog - all have new meaning. And the wars over
"evenweave" and "even weave"...! :-)
Jac
Tony Cooper
There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
Frances Kemmish
> On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:54:44 +0000 (UTC), Jacqui
> <sirlawren...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>R J Valentine wibbled:
>>
>>>Tony Cooper wrote: ...
>>>} If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
>>>
>>>Or because you rip what you sew.
>>>
>>
>>Apropos of nothing, a nice piece of sewing jargon is the verb "to
>>frog". To rip what you have sewn is to "frog it", hence "I did some
>>frogging", "I frogged the whole row", "I'm going to have to frog" etc.
>>Rippit, rippit.
>>
>>I've acquired a whole new swathe of vocabulary since I took up cross-
>>stitch. SEX, SABLE, frog - all have new meaning. And the wars over
>>"evenweave" and "even weave"...! :-)
>
>
> There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
> little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
> shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
> a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
>
>
The device for ripping out seams is called a seam-ripper.
I didn't know that people who sew and cross-stitch used "frog" for
ripping out stitches; I only know it from knitting. Of course, it only
applies to pulling the knitting off the needles and ripping it out;
taking it out a stitch at a time while the piece is still on the needles
is called "tinking" ("knit" backwards).
And then there's the kind of fastener called a "frog".
Fran
Tony Cooper
I hope that Mr Duncan reads this. It is a perfect example of (4) with
emphasis by asterisk. The oft-wrong and seldom contrite Mr Riggs has
sensed that he is in the camp of the convention setters in blustery
counter-attacks and gone into full offense mode.
Learn by watching, Mr Duncan, there is no need to climb a mountain to
consult. Just go to the bog.
david56
> On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:54:44 +0000 (UTC), Jacqui
> <sirlawren...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>R J Valentine wibbled:
>>
>>>Tony Cooper wrote: ...
>>>} If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
>>>
>>>Or because you rip what you sew.
>>
>>Apropos of nothing, a nice piece of sewing jargon is the verb "to
>>frog". To rip what you have sewn is to "frog it", hence "I did some
>>frogging", "I frogged the whole row", "I'm going to have to frog" etc.
>>Rippit, rippit.
>>
>>I've acquired a whole new swathe of vocabulary since I took up cross-
>>stitch. SEX, SABLE, frog - all have new meaning. And the wars over
>>"evenweave" and "even weave"...! :-)
>
> There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
> little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
> shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
> a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
They seem to be called seam rippers:
http://www.sew-whats-new.com/quiltlessons/supplies.shtml
surprise.com has the intense legend "The Best Vintage Brass Seam Ripper
Info on the Web":
http://www.surprise.com/hobbies/sews/vintage_brass_seam_ripper.cfm
--
David
... there ain't no Devil, it's just God when he's drunk ...
=====
The address is valid today, but I will change it to keep ahead of the
spammers.
Jacqui
> There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end
> has a little pointed part that guides it under the seam and
> there's a "u" shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a
> name? Would it be a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for
> taking out a seam?
The brand name that I know is a Quickunpick (exact spelling unknown,
it's a relic of childhood that lurks somewhere in my mother's mending
basket now, but I suspect it hasn't got as many vowels...). But yes, it
would be a frogger.
Jac
Tony Cooper
<fkem...@optonline.net> wrote:
>> There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
>> little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
>> shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
>> a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
>>
>>
>
>The device for ripping out seams is called a seam-ripper.
>
Surely, there is a more exotic name for this utilitarian device. It
does not seem possible that people of both sides of the pond would
call it the same thing, especially when the term is so
self-explanatory. If we allow this, then the language will become
clogged with understanding.
Frances Kemmish
> On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:58:21 -0500, Frances Kemmish
> <fkem...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>
>>>There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
>>>little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
>>>shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
>>>a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>The device for ripping out seams is called a seam-ripper.
>>
>
> Surely, there is a more exotic name for this utilitarian device. It
> does not seem possible that people of both sides of the pond would
> call it the same thing, especially when the term is so
> self-explanatory. If we allow this, then the language will become
> clogged with understanding.
>
>
>
To be honest, I never encountered a seam-ripper until I moved to the
USA. I don't recall my mother ever owning such an object. That may be
because it makes seam-ripping so easy, and my mother would always prefer
to do things the hard way. That was part of my mother's philosophy of
life: if it's easy, you're doing it wrong; if you're enjoying it, you
shouldn't be doing it.
Fran
Laura F Spira
I'm a bit puzzled by this as I had always understood that frogging in
sewing had a different technical meaning. My mother, a trained and
accomplished needlewoman, has always referred to frogging as a
particular type of fastening which NSOED defines as:
An ornamental coat-fastening, originally forming part of military dress,
consisting of a spindle-shaped button covered with silk or similar
material and a loop through which it is passed.
--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)
Jacqui
> Jacqui wrote:
>> I've acquired a whole new swathe of vocabulary since I took up
>> cross-stitch. SEX, SABLE, frog - all have new meaning. And the
>> wars over "evenweave" and "even weave"...! :-)
>
> I'm a bit puzzled by this as I had always understood that frogging
> in sewing had a different technical meaning. My mother, a trained
> and accomplished needlewoman, has always referred to frogging as a
> particular type of fastening which NSOED defines as:
>
> An ornamental coat-fastening, originally forming part of military
> dress, consisting of a spindle-shaped button covered with silk or
> similar material and a loop through which it is passed.
Sure, that's still a valid meaning. But to frog is to rip-it. :-)
(SEX is Stash Enhancement eXpedition, and SABLE is Stash Acquisition
Beyond Life Expectancy. Stash is fabric, threads, patterns etc. All the
things that one keeps acquiring despite already having cupboards full
of the stuff.)
Jac
Murray Arnow
>X-No-Archive: yes
>In article <Xns92D1C96A7B6...@163.1.2.7>, Jacqui <sirlawrenc
>eobl...@hotmail.com> writes
>
>>Sure, that's still a valid meaning. But to frog is to rip-it. :-)
>
>obvious ones, the mortar hollows in house bricks are called frogs. The
>power input points on overhead trolley bus lines are also called frogs.
>Bus drivers are supposed to cut power when their booms ride over the
>frogs to avoid sparks and bits of molten cable falling on passers-by.
>
This brings me to ask if anyone knows the origin of frog-march? My OED
has gone punting down the Thames.
Wood Avens
<ja...@marage.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>The different meanings of "frog" are an education. Apart from the
>obvious ones, the mortar hollows in house bricks are called frogs. The
>power input points on overhead trolley bus lines are also called frogs.
>Bus drivers are supposed to cut power when their booms ride over the
>frogs to avoid sparks and bits of molten cable falling on passers-by.
A frog is also a gadget used in flower-arranging - it's a bit like a
tiny inverted table, and when attached inside a container its four
little sticking-up 'legs' hold secure the block of water-retaining
foam into which the stalks of the flowers are inserted.
I conjecture it's called a frog because it's green and has four legs.
Katy Jennison
spamtrap: remove number to reply
Skitt
> A frog is also a gadget used in flower-arranging - it's a bit like a
> tiny inverted table, and when attached inside a container its four
> little sticking-up 'legs' hold secure the block of water-retaining
> foam into which the stalks of the flowers are inserted.
>
> I conjecture it's called a frog because it's green and has four legs.
There are other kinds of flower frogs too. I have never seen the
four-legged kind.
http://www.gardenscape.ca/images/Frog.jpg
http://www.bullworks.net/ffg/rsv43/Rsv43b.jpg
http://www.frogstore.com/images/P60052.jpg
--
Skitt (in SF Bay Area) http://www.geocities.com/opus731/
I speak English well -- I learn it from a book!
-- Manuel (Fawlty Towers)
Jerry Friedman
I think you both mean "past participle", not "past tense".
As for "sowed" and "sown", I'd say you pretty much get your choice.
Welcome to aue, James! I hope you like it here.
--
Jerry Friedman
Martin Ambuhl
> Hello, this is my first post and I hope someone can help.
>
> I'm writing an essay, and I'm afraid of sabotaging a way over-extended
No, seeds are sown or sowed. "Sewn" is the past participle of "sew."
Charles Riggs
What this fool C**per fails to realise is that it is one thing to be
too cowardly to admit when you're wrong, as is his wont, and quite
another to make a declaration to newcomers that all of us in AUE are
equally as cowardly and dishonest. This little prick doesn't speak for
the majority. No-one here does or can.
John Holmes
"Wood Avens" <woodav...@gmx.co.uk> wrote in message
news:kv25uusunhl1mjdpd...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 20:14:44 +0000, James Follett
> <ja...@marage.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >The different meanings of "frog" are an education. Apart from the
> >obvious ones, the mortar hollows in house bricks are called frogs.
The
> >power input points on overhead trolley bus lines are also called
frogs.
> >Bus drivers are supposed to cut power when their booms ride over the
> >frogs to avoid sparks and bits of molten cable falling on passers-by.
>
> A frog is also a gadget used in flower-arranging - it's a bit like a
> tiny inverted table, and when attached inside a container its four
> little sticking-up 'legs' hold secure the block of water-retaining
> foam into which the stalks of the flowers are inserted.
My dictionary also says that a frog is a nut on a violin. I assume they
mean the bloke who sometimes busks in our local shopping centre.
--
Regards
John
Mike Lyle
Yes; my eldest, before going straight and doing English, did what they
call "Fashion", and the "quickunpick" was by the rag-lecturette
declared a "not in *my* studio" item: apparently you had to be tough,
and rip like a true professional. There seems to be a knack involved:
I tried it a few times, and as often as not done considerable damage
to the clout under experiment.
Mike.
Mike Lyle
I wish I could read the Follett obiter dicta (or is it table talk? we
could then call it "deipnosophistry") through some medium other than
their quotations in other people's postings. I imagine he mentioned
the loopy thing on your belt to hold a sword or bayonet, and the
depression in the top of a brick. With a double f it's also the Welsh
for "frock".
Mike.
Jacqui
> Wood Avens wrote
>>
>> >The different meanings of "frog" are an education. Apart from
>> >the obvious ones, the mortar hollows in house bricks are called
>> >frogs. The power input points on overhead trolley bus lines are
>> >also called frogs. Bus drivers are supposed to cut power when
>> >their booms ride over the frogs to avoid sparks and bits of
>> >molten cable falling on passers-by.
>>
>> A frog is also a gadget used in flower-arranging - it's a bit
>> like a tiny inverted table, and when attached inside a container
>> its four little sticking-up 'legs' hold secure the block of
>> water-retaining foam into which the stalks of the flowers are
>> inserted.
>>
>> I conjecture it's called a frog because it's green and has four
>> legs.
>
> I wish I could read the Follett obiter dicta (or is it table talk?
> we could then call it "deipnosophistry") through some medium other
> than their quotations in other people's postings. I imagine he
> mentioned the loopy thing on your belt to hold a sword or bayonet,
> and the depression in the top of a brick. With a double f it's
> also the Welsh for "frock".
Not to mention the bit in the middle of a horse's hoof (Boy Scouts and
stones optional).
Jac
Tony Cooper
wrote:
Which is the one that gets in the throat?
--
Provider of Jots, Tittles, and the occasional "Oy!"
Tony Cooper aka tony_cooper at yahoo dot com
Skitt
> Wood Avens writes:
>> A frog is also a gadget used in flower-arranging - it's a bit like a
>> tiny inverted table, and when attached inside a container its four
>> little sticking-up 'legs' hold secure the block of water-retaining
>> foam into which the stalks of the flowers are inserted.
>
> "oasis" in the UK. I don't know if it's a generic term or a trade
> name.
>> I conjecture it's called a frog because it's green and has four legs.
>
> compiling a list?
Yeah, ever noticed the frog of a violin bow?
http://www.thinmanmusic.com/frogs.jpg
Wood Avens
<ja...@marage.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>I think the low-density rigid foam you're referring to is called "oasis"
>in the UK. I don't know if it's a generic term or a trade name.
Strictly speaking, it's a trade name - 'Oasis' with a capital O.
There are other similar varieties, so teachers, demonstrators, books
etc all politely call the stuff 'floral foam'; in private, though,
flower arrangers all call all of them 'oasis'. So the word is in
transition as we speak.
--
Jacqui
> X-No-Archive: yes
> In article <Xns92D29D0971D...@62.253.162.106>, Jacqui
> <sirlawren...@hotmail.com> writes
>
>>> I wish I could read the Follett obiter dicta (or is it table
>>> talk? we could then call it "deipnosophistry") through some
>>> medium other than their quotations in other people's postings. I
>>> imagine he mentioned the loopy thing on your belt to hold a
>>> sword or bayonet, and the depression in the top of a brick. With
>>> a double f it's also the Welsh for "frock".
>>
>>Not to mention the bit in the middle of a horse's hoof (Boy Scouts
>>and stones optional).
>
> This is beginning to sound like "Call My Bluff". I simply refuse
> to believe that someone decided to call the hollow in the middle
> of a horse hoof a "frog". Bluff!
<wry smile, shake of head, unfolding of True card>
http://hoof.net/foaltrim.htm will show you a diagram of how to trim a
hoof, with visible frog.
Jac
Richard
<tony_co...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:54:44 +0000 (UTC), Jacqui
><sirlawren...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>R J Valentine wibbled:
>>> Tony Cooper wrote: ...
>>> } If replies are a bit harsh, it's because you reap what you sow.
>>>
>>> Or because you rip what you sew.
>>>
>>Apropos of nothing, a nice piece of sewing jargon is the verb "to
>>frog". To rip what you have sewn is to "frog it", hence "I did some
>>frogging", "I frogged the whole row", "I'm going to have to frog" etc.
>>Rippit, rippit.
>>
>>I've acquired a whole new swathe of vocabulary since I took up cross-
>>stitch. SEX, SABLE, frog - all have new meaning. And the wars over
>>"evenweave" and "even weave"...! :-)
>
>There is a little device used to rip out seams. The working end has a
>little pointed part that guides it under the seam and there's a "u"
>shaped cutting edge that cuts the thread. Has it a name? Would it be
>a "frogger" if "frogging" is the term for taking out a seam?
>
I know of it as an "unpicker". It unpicks the stitches.
--
Richard Bollard
Canberra, Australia
John Dean
Frog-march or frog's-march. When 4 men hold a prisoner by one limb each,
face down, and trnsport him. Presumably, because he looks like a frog in the
act of jumping. More recently taken to mean opinning someone's arms behind
them and propelling them forward.
Keeping one jump ahead, I was surprised to find OED has a cite for
'goose-step' as far back as 1806 and that it was despised even then :
1806 Sir R. Wilson Jrnl. 11 Feb., The balance or goose-step introduced for
their practice excites a fever of disgust.
--
John Dean
Oxford
De-frag to reply
Mike Lyle
[...]
> Keeping one jump ahead, I was surprised to find OED has a cite for
> 'goose-step' as far back as 1806 and that it was despised even then :
>
> 1806 Sir R. Wilson Jrnl. 11 Feb., The balance or goose-step introduced for
> their practice excites a fever of disgust.
Another leap ahead:
"Goose-step" was a mistranslation. *Gänse-Marsch*, if I've got the
spelling right, means "single file" -- you often see geese doing it. I
believe the German expression for "formal frightfully alarming
marching" equates to something like "formal parade marching", as they
don't have a word for it. I also believe it may have started out
simply as a fitness drill: the OED entries are consistent with this
idea.
Mike.
John Dean
It did start out like that, but became the straight legged march we know so
well :
a. An elementary drill in which the recruit is taught to balance his body on
either leg alternately, and swing the other backwards and forwards. b. A
balance step, practised esp. by various armies in marching on ceremonial
parades, in which the legs are alternately advanced without bending the
knees.
The 1806 cite is clearly to the exercise but the next one is to the march :
1825 D. L. Richardson Sonnets 32 Oft with aching bones, I marched the
goose-step, cursing Serjeant Jones.
German Gänse-Marsch (Literally goose-march) indeed means 'in single file'
but German for goose-step is Stechschritt (literally stab-step)
It is by no means clear who actually introduced the step.
Mike Lyle
I just assumed it was another Prussian blue. Thanks for the stab-step,
which sounds even worse.
But there's no way Sjt (does this mean Richardson, or at any rate
Jones, must have been a black-buttoned bastard?) Jones could have had
men marching, qua marching, like that on the parade-ground, shirley?
My reading of that quotation remains obstinately PT until further
notice.
DNB says Richardson, of whom I had never heard, was a Bengal army
cadet at home and then went out. I imagine they had ox and bucks
thingies in Bengal, too. Who would have been unlikely to goose-step in
public, as they do everything about three times as fast as humans, and
are very careful not to do any stamping of feet for fear they may come
to resemble guardsmen.
I quite like the idea of the goose-step at light div pace, don't you?
Many an a would be entertainingly over-t'd, I expect. Quite another
image comes to mind with Highlanders.
Mike.