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le Carre: poison dwarf
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Marius Hancu
Jan 4, 2012, 3:33:51 AM1/4/12
to
Hello:
--
[Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
stories about Russian agents:]
We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
John le Carré, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
---
"poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
--
Thanks.
Marius Hancu
--
[Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
stories about Russian agents:]
We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
John le Carré, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
---
"poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
--
Thanks.
Marius Hancu
James Hogg
Jan 4, 2012, 3:58:59 AM1/4/12
to
Marius Hancu wrote:
> Hello:
>
> --
> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
> stories about Russian agents:]
>
> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>
> John le Carr�, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
> Hello:
>
> --
> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
> stories about Russian agents:]
>
> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>
> ---
>
> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
>
> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
Nazi Germany bore the title:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
--
James
James Hogg
Jan 4, 2012, 4:04:16 AM1/4/12
to
James Hogg wrote:
> Marius Hancu wrote:
>> Hello:
>>
>> --
>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>
>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>
>> John le Carré, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
> Marius Hancu wrote:
>> Hello:
>>
>> --
>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>
>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>
>> ---
>>
>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
> http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
> Nazi Germany bore the title:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>
> I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
My Langenscheidt translates "Giftzwerg" as "nasty little man".
>>
>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
> http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
> Nazi Germany bore the title:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>
> I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
--
James
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
Jan 4, 2012, 7:11:09 AM1/4/12
to
On Wed, 04 Jan 2012 09:58:59 +0100, James Hogg <Jas....@gOUTmail.com>
wrote:
>Marius Hancu wrote:
>> Hello:
>>
>> --
>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>
>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>
>> John le Carré, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
an interview with the actress Charlene Tilton, who played Lucy. I recall
it being on TV because I have a memory of her reaction, body language,
to the phrase. She was not a happy bunny.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
wrote:
>Marius Hancu wrote:
>> Hello:
>>
>> --
>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>
>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>
>> ---
>>
>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
>It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
>http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
>The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
>than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
>Nazi Germany bore the title:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>
>I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
Yes. I remember him describing the character Lucy as a "poison dwarf" in
>>
>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
>It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
>http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
>The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
>than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
>Nazi Germany bore the title:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>
>I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
an interview with the actress Charlene Tilton, who played Lucy. I recall
it being on TV because I have a memory of her reaction, body language,
to the phrase. She was not a happy bunny.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Iain Archer
Jan 4, 2012, 7:46:46 AM1/4/12
to
Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote on Wed, 4 Jan 2012
It seems there's possibly a treat in store for unreconstructed Dallas
fans. According to the Wikipedia entry for Tilton: "She will reprise her
role of Lucy Ewing in the new TNT series, Dallas, a continuation of the
original series where she will be joined by several of her former
castmates as well as a younger generation of Ewings."
--
Iain Archer
>On Wed, 04 Jan 2012 09:58:59 +0100, James Hogg <Jas....@gOUTmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Marius Hancu wrote:
>>> Hello:
>>>
>>> --
>>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>>
>>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>>
>>> John le Carr�, Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
>wrote:
>
>>Marius Hancu wrote:
>>> Hello:
>>>
>>> --
>>> [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
>>> stories about Russian agents:]
>>>
>>> We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
>>> campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
>>> told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
>>> plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
>>> just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>>>
>>> ---
>>>
>>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>>
>>It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
>>http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>>
>>The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
>>than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
>>Nazi Germany bore the title:
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>>
>>I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
>
>Yes. I remember him describing the character Lucy as a "poison dwarf" in
>an interview with the actress Charlene Tilton, who played Lucy. I recall
>it being on TV because I have a memory of her reaction, body language,
>to the phrase. She was not a happy bunny.
>
Poisonous, one can act; being 4'11", probably not.
>>>
>>> "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>>
>>It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
>>http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>>
>>The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
>>than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
>>Nazi Germany bore the title:
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
>>
>>I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
>
>Yes. I remember him describing the character Lucy as a "poison dwarf" in
>an interview with the actress Charlene Tilton, who played Lucy. I recall
>it being on TV because I have a memory of her reaction, body language,
>to the phrase. She was not a happy bunny.
>
It seems there's possibly a treat in store for unreconstructed Dallas
fans. According to the Wikipedia entry for Tilton: "She will reprise her
role of Lucy Ewing in the new TNT series, Dallas, a continuation of the
original series where she will be joined by several of her former
castmates as well as a younger generation of Ewings."
--
Iain Archer
Marius Hancu
Jan 4, 2012, 10:47:12 AM1/4/12
to
On Jan 4, 3:58 am, James Hogg <Jas.H...@gOUTmail.com> wrote:
> > --
> > [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
> > stories about Russian agents:]
>
> > We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
> > campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
> > told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
> > plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
> > just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>
> > John le Carr , Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
> > ---
>
> > "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
> Nazi Germany bore the title:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinricihttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
> > --
> > [Connie's been forced into early retirement from MI6; one of her
> > stories about Russian agents:]
>
> > We blew up the photographs and there they were: two gallantry and four
> > campaign [medals]. Aleks Polyakov was a war veteran and he'd never
> > told a soul in seven years. Oh I was excited! I didn't even need to
> > plot the campaigns. "Toby," I said - I rang him straight away - "You
> > just listen to me for a moment, you Hungarian poison dwarf."
>
> > John le Carr , Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy
> > ---
>
> > "poison dwarf" (at the end): any origins for this?
>
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
>
> I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
Thanks a lot, everyone.
> I first heard it applied to Lucy in Dallas by Terry Wogan.
Marius Hancu
bert
Jan 4, 2012, 4:13:07 PM1/4/12
to
On Wednesday, January 4, 2012 8:58:59 AM UTC, James Hogg wrote:
> Marius Hancu wrote:
> > "poison dwarf": any origins for this?
> Marius Hancu wrote:
>
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
> http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
> Nazi Germany bore the title:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
Okay, so the Germans used it earlier, but I hardly think
> It's not in the OED. Here's some speculation:
> http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Where_does_the_term_poison_dwarf_originate
>
> The theory of a German origin sounds plausible, but it must be earlier
> than the Scottish soldiers in Minden. At least two senior officers in
> Nazi Germany bore the title:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotthard_Heinrici
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmuth_Stieff
anybody outside Germany used an English translation of it.
It was when the Mayor of Minden used it to describe British
servicemen, and the press went very anti-German on the story,
with headlines preferring the translation "poison dwarf" to
"nasty little men", that it entered the popular language.
--
Leslie Danks
Jan 4, 2012, 4:46:56 PM1/4/12
to
in 1918, 1928, 1932 and 1938.
<quotes>
1918: "... einen Ameisenbär, einen Giftzwerg, eine Spitzmaus, eine
Vogelscheuche und die liebe Goldelse."
1928: "Der Giftzwerg von Twickenham ist in der Anlage seines Wesens
antithetisch. Wesen und Dichten decken sich nicht völlig."
1932: "„wat willst denn von mir, Rleener;" sagte Paul Matzmohr ganz
gemütlich und sah spöttisch auf den Giftzwerg runter."
1938: "Aber die Komik lallt notwendigerweise des Grauen aus, das den heute
regierenden Fettwänsten, Heiratsschwindlern, Geldpantschern, Giftzwergen
zukommt, und ebenso ihrem Götzencharakter."
</quotes>
<http://www.google.at/search?
lr=lang_de&tbo=p&tbm=bks&q=giftzwerg&tbs=,cdr:1,cd_min:Jan%201_2%
201800,cd_max:Dec%2031_2%201940&num=50>
<http://tinyurl.com/855zoo4>
I would take the 1918 example to be mean "poison dwarf" literally; the
others could just as easily be "nasty little man", or something
equivalently pejorative.
Thus the expression seems to have been around for a while, but rarely used
in writing.
--
Les
(BrE)
James Hogg
Jan 4, 2012, 5:16:50 PM1/4/12
to
German writer.
--
James
Leslie Danks
Jan 4, 2012, 5:33:01 PM1/4/12
to
--
Les
(BrE)
Donna Richoux
Jan 4, 2012, 6:23:58 PM1/4/12
to
James Hogg <Jas....@gOUTmail.com> wrote:
> Leslie Danks wrote:
[snip much on Giftzwerg/poison dwarf]
> > I would take the 1918 example to be mean "poison dwarf" literally; the
> > others could just as easily be "nasty little man", or something
> > equivalently pejorative.
> >
> > Thus the expression seems to have been around for a while, but rarely used
> > in writing.
>
> Interesting to see Alexander Pope described as a venomous dwarf by a
> German writer.
Pope was four foot six inches tall.
--
Donna Richoux
> Leslie Danks wrote:
[snip much on Giftzwerg/poison dwarf]
> > I would take the 1918 example to be mean "poison dwarf" literally; the
> > others could just as easily be "nasty little man", or something
> > equivalently pejorative.
> >
> > Thus the expression seems to have been around for a while, but rarely used
> > in writing.
>
> Interesting to see Alexander Pope described as a venomous dwarf by a
> German writer.
--
Donna Richoux
Mike Lyle
Jan 5, 2012, 4:43:44 PM1/5/12
to
On Thu, 5 Jan 2012 00:23:58 +0100, tr...@euronet.nl (Donna Richoux)
wrote:
And famously deformed. In literature and folklore, such things are
sometimes treated as reflecting moral qualities: even in our own time,
one of the nastiest creationists in another newsgroup rejoices in what
he sees as Stephen Hawking's punishment for "giving the finger to
God".
--
Mike.
wrote:
sometimes treated as reflecting moral qualities: even in our own time,
one of the nastiest creationists in another newsgroup rejoices in what
he sees as Stephen Hawking's punishment for "giving the finger to
God".
--
Mike.
tobin....@gmail.com
Jun 9, 2016, 1:47:51 AM6/9/16
to
I think the really interesting question here isn't where the phrase originates but why it recurs so often in John le Carre. Poison dwarves with a certain sexual charisma adorn almost every single book.
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