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Beauchamp/Beecham
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Quinn C
May 26, 2020, 1:29:08 PM5/26/20
to
In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
characters had the surname Beauchamp.
As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
--
They're telling the truth. [...] I know what you mean. There's
another truth that they're not telling. But newspapers never
do, that's not what they're for.
-- James Baldwin, Giovanni's Room
characters had the surname Beauchamp.
As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
--
They're telling the truth. [...] I know what you mean. There's
another truth that they're not telling. But newspapers never
do, that's not what they're for.
-- James Baldwin, Giovanni's Room
RH Draney
May 26, 2020, 2:30:23 PM5/26/20
to
On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>
> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>
> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>
> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>
> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
both pronounced the same?...r
skpf...@gmail.com
May 26, 2020, 2:34:47 PM5/26/20
to
Horace LaBadie
May 26, 2020, 2:54:36 PM5/26/20
to
Phil Hobbs
May 26, 2020, 3:05:43 PM5/26/20
to
(Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
Spains Harden
May 26, 2020, 3:09:52 PM5/26/20
to
the London sewers. I also find Ranelagh hard to pronounce.
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 26, 2020, 3:49:22 PM5/26/20
to
Cholmondley-Warner presents erm presents at Yuletide.
And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Peter T. Daniels
May 26, 2020, 3:54:32 PM5/26/20
to
On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:49:22 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd,John wrote:
> And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
Can anyone figure out how to get from "BeauK" to [buw'kej]?
> And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
David Kleinecke
May 26, 2020, 4:03:42 PM5/26/20
to
On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 12:54:32 PM UTC-7, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:49:22 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd,John wrote:
>
> > And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
>
> Can anyone figure out how to get from "BeauK" to [buw'kej]?
Bow-K.
> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:49:22 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd,John wrote:
>
> > And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
>
> Can anyone figure out how to get from "BeauK" to [buw'kej]?
Peter T. Daniels
May 26, 2020, 4:30:32 PM5/26/20
to
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 26, 2020, 4:32:57 PM5/26/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 20:03:40 GMT, David Kleinecke <dklei...@gmail.com>
pronounciation.
wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 12:54:32 PM UTC-7, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:49:22 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd,John wrote:
>>
>> > And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
>>
>> Can anyone figure out how to get from "BeauK" to [buw'kej]?
>
> Bow-K.
Well, I yawn corrected; it was a feeble attempt to show spelling isn't
> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 12:54:32 PM UTC-7, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>> On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:49:22 PM UTC-4, Kerr-Mudd,John wrote:
>>
>> > And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
>>
>> Can anyone figure out how to get from "BeauK" to [buw'kej]?
>
> Bow-K.
pronounciation.
David Kleinecke
May 26, 2020, 4:42:57 PM5/26/20
to
enough and jumped to the conclusion. How one pronounces "beau"
matters. I say /bow/ but I would have expected Mrs. Bucket to say
/bew/. How does "bouquet" fit in here?
Ross
May 26, 2020, 4:56:13 PM5/26/20
to
On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>
> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>
> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>
> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>
> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
It's a very old English surname, from a place (or places) in France.
The pronunciation has changed in various ways, but has been "Beecham"
for a long time now. Some families have changed the spelling to better
fit the pronunciation (e.g. some ancestor of the conductor Sir Thomas
Beecham); others have kept the spelling (e.g. the family of
Katherine Beauchamp, better known as Mansfield). It looks classy.
musika
May 26, 2020, 5:04:51 PM5/26/20
to
--
Ray
UK
Peter T. Daniels
May 26, 2020, 5:19:29 PM5/26/20
to
are Daisy, Violet, and Rose), maiden name unknown even though "Daddy"
is a recurrent character and lives with Daisy and her layabout husband
Onslow and Rose, married Richard Bucket, who pronounces his name like
the kicked thing, but Mrs Bucket, who insists on Keeping Up Appearances,
insists on pronouncing it like the hand-held arrangement of flowers; the
creator of the series seems to have overlooked the fact that the other
three flower sisters had no nominal connection with any "bouquet" name.
They were unable to escape the English obsession with cross-dressing,
however. Violet's husband -- I don't recall his name; could it be Bruce?
-- is a cross-dresser, to Violet's and Hyacinth's great shame, but was
never seen on camera.
RH Draney
May 26, 2020, 5:55:59 PM5/26/20
to
from Lincecomb to Linthicum (or perhaps the other way; I don't feel like
taking the time to confirm)....
(Another line went from Moncrieffe to Moncrief, but that's more in the
category of "tidying up")....r
Quinn C
May 26, 2020, 5:56:45 PM5/26/20
to
* RH Draney:
ITYM Tagliaferro (or Taillefer?), and I haven't heard an English
pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
--
Quinn C
My pronouns are they/them
(or other gender-neutral ones)
pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
--
Quinn C
My pronouns are they/them
(or other gender-neutral ones)
Quinn C
May 26, 2020, 5:56:47 PM5/26/20
to
* Ross:
> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>
>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>
>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
> I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
Because if you write it "Beecham", it looks like a proper Germanic place
name involving beech trees, when it's really "fairfield". I was just
idly wondering if people are processing it this way at all when
pronouncing "Beauchamp".
If someone by that name immigrated just recently, they should have the
right to be Bow-Shaw.
--
I'll call you the next time I pass through your star system.
-- Commander William T. Riker
> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>
>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>
>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
> I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
name involving beech trees, when it's really "fairfield". I was just
idly wondering if people are processing it this way at all when
pronouncing "Beauchamp".
If someone by that name immigrated just recently, they should have the
right to be Bow-Shaw.
--
I'll call you the next time I pass through your star system.
-- Commander William T. Riker
Quinn C
May 26, 2020, 5:56:54 PM5/26/20
to
* skpf...@gmail.com:
I regularly hear Duhaime, pronounced "dum" (in French).
<http://www.arielleduhaimeross.com/>
In my early days of working in a French environment, I had a colleague
sitting not far from me for a while who was often on the phone. When he
took a call, he'd say "Smawday". I found that an unusual greeting. It
took me a few days to figure out he was saying his name, Simon Deshaies.
<http://www.arielleduhaimeross.com/>
In my early days of working in a French environment, I had a colleague
sitting not far from me for a while who was often on the phone. When he
took a call, he'd say "Smawday". I found that an unusual greeting. It
took me a few days to figure out he was saying his name, Simon Deshaies.
Quinn C
May 26, 2020, 6:03:45 PM5/26/20
to
* RH Draney:
> (Another line went from Moncrieffe to Moncrief, but that's more in the
> category of "tidying up")....r
Good crief.
--
But I have nver chosen my human environment. I have always
borrowed it from someone like you or Monk or Doris.
-- Jane Rule, This Is Not For You, p.152
> (Another line went from Moncrieffe to Moncrief, but that's more in the
> category of "tidying up")....r
--
But I have nver chosen my human environment. I have always
borrowed it from someone like you or Monk or Doris.
-- Jane Rule, This Is Not For You, p.152
Tony Cooper
May 26, 2020, 7:19:33 PM5/26/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 11:29:58 -0700, RH Draney <dado...@cox.net>
wrote:
I arrived on campus a bit too late to hear his name called out, but
George Taliaferro was legendary football player at Indiana University.
He was the first African American to be drafted by an NFL team. The
Chicago Bears drafted him in 1949, but he had already accepted an
offer from the Los Angeles Dons of the All American Football
Conference.
He was not the first African American to play for an NFL team, but he
was the first to be drafted by an NFL team.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
wrote:
George Taliaferro was legendary football player at Indiana University.
He was the first African American to be drafted by an NFL team. The
Chicago Bears drafted him in 1949, but he had already accepted an
offer from the Los Angeles Dons of the All American Football
Conference.
He was not the first African American to play for an NFL team, but he
was the first to be drafted by an NFL team.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Peter T. Daniels
May 27, 2020, 12:10:55 AM5/27/20
to
on the telephone.
HVS
May 27, 2020, 4:33:07 AM5/27/20
to
On 26 May 2020, Ross wrote
The anglicising of "Beauchamp" as "Beecham" is similar to the place-
name "Beaulieu", pronounced "Bew-lee".
--
Cheers, Harvey
CanEng (30 yrs) and BrEng (36 yrs),
indiscriminately mixed
name "Beaulieu", pronounced "Bew-lee".
--
Cheers, Harvey
CanEng (30 yrs) and BrEng (36 yrs),
indiscriminately mixed
Adam Funk
May 27, 2020, 5:15:05 AM5/27/20
to
pronounces all the letters.
--
All crime is due to incorrect breathing.
---Sir Henry Rawlinson
Paul Wolff
May 27, 2020, 5:41:38 AM5/27/20
to
On Wed, 27 May 2020, at 09:32:57, HVS posted:
Unseasonal remark: "And Lord Montagu of Beaulieu" fits the twelve days
of Christmas song just as well as "and a partridge in a pear tree" does.
--
Paul
of Christmas song just as well as "and a partridge in a pear tree" does.
--
Paul
musika
May 27, 2020, 5:43:41 AM5/27/20
to
--
Ray
UK
Adam Funk
May 27, 2020, 6:00:08 AM5/27/20
to
it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
--
Some people just have hatred built into them. I don’t know if there
is anything we can do for them... The right wingers of our country
might just have bad genetics. And I’m saying that as a transvestite.
---Eddie Izzard
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 27, 2020, 6:09:33 AM5/27/20
to
On 2020-05-27 09:31:25 +0000, Paul Wolff said:
> On Wed, 27 May 2020, at 09:32:57, HVS posted:
[ … ]
> On Wed, 27 May 2020, at 09:32:57, HVS posted:
>>>
>>
>> The anglicising of "Beauchamp" as "Beecham" is similar to the place-
>> name "Beaulieu", pronounced "Bew-lee".
>>
> Unseasonal remark: "And Lord Montagu of Beaulieu" fits the twelve days
> of Christmas song just as well as "and a partridge in a pear tree" does.
In days of yore Lord Montagu of Beaulieu was famous for his collection
>>
>> The anglicising of "Beauchamp" as "Beecham" is similar to the place-
>> name "Beaulieu", pronounced "Bew-lee".
>>
> Unseasonal remark: "And Lord Montagu of Beaulieu" fits the twelve days
> of Christmas song just as well as "and a partridge in a pear tree" does.
of vintage cars (among people who liked him) and for his sexual
preferences(among people who didn't). I suspect it was the latter
characteristic that led to the revision of the Christmas song.
--
athel
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 27, 2020, 6:43:11 AM5/27/20
to
On Wed, 27 May 2020 08:32:57 GMT, HVS <off...@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk>
wrote:
Which differs from Bewdley. Engage Brain before using SatNav.
wrote:
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 27, 2020, 6:44:06 AM5/27/20
to
charles
May 27, 2020, 6:47:11 AM5/27/20
to
In article <v4q1qgx...@news.ducksburg.com>,
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
> >> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
> >>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>>>
> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
> >>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
> >>>
> >>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
> >>>
> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
> >>
> >> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
> >> pronounces all the letters.
> >>
> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
which isn't cake, anyway
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
> >> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
> >>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>>>
> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
> >>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
> >>>
> >>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
> >>>
> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
> >>
> >> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
> >> pronounces all the letters.
> >>
> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 27, 2020, 6:49:38 AM5/27/20
to
On Wed, 27 May 2020 09:57:19 GMT, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com>
wrote:
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
>> On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
>>> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>>>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
>>>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>>>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>>>>
>>>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>>>>
>>>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
>>>
>>> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
>>> pronounces all the letters.
>>>
>> Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
>
>
Pshurely Pomfret is fancy talk for chips?
wrote:
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
>> On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
>>> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>>>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
>>>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>>>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>>>>
>>>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>>>>
>>>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
>>>
>>> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
>>> pronounces all the letters.
>>>
>> Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
>
>
charles
May 27, 2020, 7:31:12 AM5/27/20
to
Phil Hobbs
May 27, 2020, 8:21:20 AM5/27/20
to
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 27, 2020, 8:25:37 AM5/27/20
to
On Wed, 27 May 2020 11:28:35 GMT, charles <cha...@candehope.me.uk>
wrote:
Surely even JJ must acknowledge Belgian superiority in chips and beer.
(We like 'em too in Britain, but the Belgian products are in a different
category).
wrote:
(We like 'em too in Britain, but the Belgian products are in a different
category).
Peter Moylan
May 27, 2020, 9:05:25 AM5/27/20
to
Belgians make them thin. And each faction has its supporters.
I can't comment on the beer. I've tasted Belgian beer (quite a few
varieties), but never British beer.
--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
the Omrud
May 27, 2020, 9:58:05 AM5/27/20
to
> RH Draney <dado...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>
>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>
>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>> both pronounced the same?...r
>
> Or Marjoribanks and Marchbanks.
>
>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>
>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>
>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>> both pronounced the same?...r
>
"They don't like it up 'em, Mr Mainwaring".
--
David
Ken Blake
May 27, 2020, 10:21:45 AM5/27/20
to
On 5/26/2020 11:29 AM, RH Draney wrote:
> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>
>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>
>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver
No.
> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>
>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>
>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver
> and Talliaferro,
Yes, but he spelled it "Tagliaferro," the Italian way...
> both pronounced the same?...r
...and he pronounced it the Italian was tal-yuh-FER-ro
For those who don't know, "Tagliaferro" means "steel cutter." It's the
Italian version of the German "Eisenhower."
--
Ken
Phil Hobbs
May 27, 2020, 10:22:00 AM5/27/20
to
"I know what you're thinking. 'Wait a minnit, podner, what do you
English know about beer? English beer is nasty warm sticky stuff with
various forms of pond life growing in it.'"
"Exactly! Which is why we English are _such_ experts on imported beer!"
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
John Varela
May 27, 2020, 12:45:21 PM5/27/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 19:49:19 UTC, "Kerr-Mudd,John"
<nots...@invalid.org> wrote:
> On Tue, 26 May 2020 19:05:29 GMT, Phil Hobbs
> <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
with all three syllables.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7rrIlPu-Ao&list=RD5Ivsb79-h90&index
=5
> Cholmondley-Warner presents erm presents at Yuletide.
John Varela
<nots...@invalid.org> wrote:
> On Tue, 26 May 2020 19:05:29 GMT, Phil Hobbs
> <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>
> > On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>
> >>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
> "Beecham".
> >>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>
> >>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>
> > On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>
> >>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
> "Beecham".
> >>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>
> >>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>
> >> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
> Talliaferro,
> >> both pronounced the same?...r
> >
> Talliaferro,
> >> both pronounced the same?...r
> >
> > Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
> >
> > (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
I have been informed in this very news group that although
> >
> > (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
with all three syllables.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7rrIlPu-Ao&list=RD5Ivsb79-h90&index
=5
> Cholmondley-Warner presents erm presents at Yuletide.
>
> And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
--
> And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
John Varela
Peter Moylan
May 27, 2020, 1:06:11 PM5/27/20
to
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 27, 2020, 1:13:23 PM5/27/20
to
Lovely, complex often brown beer served at cellar temperature, not
chilled so you can barely taste how metallic it really is. Only available
in the UK, with some honorable exceptions.
> "Exactly! Which is why we English are _such_ experts on imported
> beer!"
>
minutes.
Phil Hobbs
May 27, 2020, 1:16:12 PM5/27/20
to
Phil Hobbs
John Varela
May 27, 2020, 1:47:47 PM5/27/20
to
On Wed, 27 May 2020 09:57:19 UTC, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com>
wrote:
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
> >> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> >>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>>>
> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
> >>>> both pronounced the same?...r
> >>>
> >>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
> >>>
> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
> >>
> >> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
> >> pronounces all the letters.
> >>
> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
I don't know about the cake, but the fish gets its name from a
Portuguese word.
--
John Varela
wrote:
> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
> >> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
> >>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> >>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >>>>
> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
> >>>> both pronounced the same?...r
> >>>
> >>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
> >>>
> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
> >>
> >> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
> >> pronounces all the letters.
> >>
> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
Portuguese word.
--
John Varela
John Varela
May 27, 2020, 1:58:59 PM5/27/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 21:57:43 UTC, Quinn C
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> * RH Draney:
> pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
A few years ago there was a well-known (American) football player
named Talliaferro pronounced Tolliver. And it's not an Italian
name, it's British.
--
John Varela
<lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:
> * RH Draney:
>
> > On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>
> >> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> >> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>
> >> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >
> > Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
> > both pronounced the same?...r
>
> ITYM Tagliaferro (or Taillefer?), and I haven't heard an English
> > On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
> >> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> >> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >>
> >> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> >> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >>
> >> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
> >
> > Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
> > both pronounced the same?...r
>
> pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
A few years ago there was a well-known (American) football player
named Talliaferro pronounced Tolliver. And it's not an Italian
name, it's British.
--
John Varela
Phil Hobbs
May 27, 2020, 2:12:08 PM5/27/20
to
complexion, also British.
Cheers
Phil Hobbs
John Varela
May 27, 2020, 2:13:10 PM5/27/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 20:56:11 UTC, Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
> > In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> > characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >
> > As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> > Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >
> > Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
a name looks like it has a French pronunciation it will be given
some sort of attempt at a French pronunciation, but in his case it
was Beecham all the way.
--
John Varela
> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
> > In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
> > characters had the surname Beauchamp.
> >
> > As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
> > Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
> >
> > Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>
> I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
> It's a very old English surname, from a place (or places) in France.
> The pronunciation has changed in various ways, but has been "Beecham"
> for a long time now. Some families have changed the spelling to better
> fit the pronunciation (e.g. some ancestor of the conductor Sir Thomas
> Beecham); others have kept the spelling (e.g. the family of
> Katherine Beauchamp, better known as Mansfield). It looks classy.
Iigh school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was froleans where if
> It's a very old English surname, from a place (or places) in France.
> The pronunciation has changed in various ways, but has been "Beecham"
> for a long time now. Some families have changed the spelling to better
> fit the pronunciation (e.g. some ancestor of the conductor Sir Thomas
> Beecham); others have kept the spelling (e.g. the family of
> Katherine Beauchamp, better known as Mansfield). It looks classy.
a name looks like it has a French pronunciation it will be given
some sort of attempt at a French pronunciation, but in his case it
was Beecham all the way.
--
John Varela
John Varela
May 27, 2020, 2:47:04 PM5/27/20
to
In high school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was from New
Orleans, where if a name looks like it comes from French it will be
given some sort of quasi-French pronunciation, but in his case it
Janet
May 27, 2020, 2:48:01 PM5/27/20
to
In article <XnsABC9D3D7F2...@144.76.35.198>,
nots...@invalid.org says...
Janet
nots...@invalid.org says...
> And let's not forget PTD's favourite; Mrs Bucket (pron BeauK)
>
Bouquet
>
Janet
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 27, 2020, 2:48:43 PM5/27/20
to
On 2020-05-27 18:47:01 +0000, John Varela said:
> On Wed, 27 May 2020 18:13:06 UTC, "John Varela"
> <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 20:56:11 UTC, Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>
>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>
>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>
>>> I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
>>> It's a very old English surname, from a place (or places) in France.
>>> The pronunciation has changed in various ways, but has been "Beecham"
>>> for a long time now. Some families have changed the spelling to better
>>> fit the pronunciation (e.g. some ancestor of the conductor Sir Thomas
>>> Beecham); others have kept the spelling (e.g. the family of
>>> Katherine Beauchamp, better known as Mansfield). It looks classy.
>>
>> Iigh school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was froleans where if
>> a name looks like it has a French pronunciation it will be given
>> some sort of attempt at a French pronunciation, but in his case it
>> was Beecham all the way.
>
> Let me try that again:
>
> In high school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was from New
> Orleans,
I figured that that was what it was.
> On Wed, 27 May 2020 18:13:06 UTC, "John Varela"
> <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 20:56:11 UTC, Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wednesday, May 27, 2020 at 5:29:08 AM UTC+12, Quinn C wrote:
>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>
>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>
>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>
>>> I can't see any reason to invoke folk etymology.
>>> It's a very old English surname, from a place (or places) in France.
>>> The pronunciation has changed in various ways, but has been "Beecham"
>>> for a long time now. Some families have changed the spelling to better
>>> fit the pronunciation (e.g. some ancestor of the conductor Sir Thomas
>>> Beecham); others have kept the spelling (e.g. the family of
>>> Katherine Beauchamp, better known as Mansfield). It looks classy.
>>
>> Iigh school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was froleans where if
>> a name looks like it has a French pronunciation it will be given
>> some sort of attempt at a French pronunciation, but in his case it
>> was Beecham all the way.
>
> Let me try that again:
>
> In high school I knew a boy named Beauchamp. He was from New
> Orleans,
> where if a name looks like it comes from French it will be
> given some sort of quasi-French pronunciation, but in his case it
> was Beecham all the way.
--
J. J. Lodder
May 27, 2020, 4:39:30 PM5/27/20
to
in English style. (something like Boff'rt, I guess)
It is always pronounced as if French,
Jan
Peter Young
May 27, 2020, 4:46:13 PM5/27/20
to
On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip]
> I have been informed in this very news group that although
> Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> with all three syllables.
One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Hg)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
[snip]
> I have been informed in this very news group that although
> Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> with all three syllables.
town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
Peter.
--
Peter Young, (BrE, RP), Consultant Anaesthetist, 1975-2004.
(US equivalent: Certified Anesthesiologist) (AUE Hg)
Cheltenham and Gloucester, UK. Now happily retired.
http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk
charles
May 27, 2020, 4:55:45 PM5/27/20
to
In article <3a4063775...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
Peter Young <pny...@ormail.co.uk> wrote:
> On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
> [snip]
> > I have been informed in this very news group that although
> > Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> > with all three syllables.
> One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
> town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
> Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
> Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
> Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
> on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
> Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
and St Kilda started off as "Skilda" (a shield or safe harbour)
> On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
> [snip]
> > I have been informed in this very news group that although
> > Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> > with all three syllables.
> One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
> town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
> Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
> Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
> Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
> on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
> Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
Ross
May 27, 2020, 8:31:48 PM5/27/20
to
On Thursday, May 28, 2020 at 8:55:45 AM UTC+12, charles wrote:
> In article <3a4063775...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
> Peter Young <pny...@ormail.co.uk> wrote:
> > On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > [snip]
>
> > > I have been informed in this very news group that although
> > > Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> > > with all three syllables.
>
> > One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
> > town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
> > Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
> > Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
>
> > Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
> > on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
>
> > Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
>
> and St Kilda started off as "Skilda" (a shield or safe harbour)
>
...among other theories...
> In article <3a4063775...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
> Peter Young <pny...@ormail.co.uk> wrote:
> > On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > [snip]
>
> > > I have been informed in this very news group that although
> > > Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> > > with all three syllables.
>
> > One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
> > town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
> > Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
> > Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
>
> > Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
> > on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
>
> > Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
>
> and St Kilda started off as "Skilda" (a shield or safe harbour)
>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Kilda,_Scotland#Toponym
Madhu
May 28, 2020, 1:11:57 AM5/28/20
to
* "John Varela" <51W5y0sPNk52-pn2-2peZwpmdpXWn@localhost> :
Wrote on 27 May 2020 16:45:18 GMT:
> On Tue, 26 May 2020 19:49:19 UTC, "Kerr-Mudd,John"
> <nots...@invalid.org> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 19:05:29 GMT, Phil Hobbs
>> <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>>
>> > On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>> >> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>> >>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> >>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>> >>>
>> >>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
>> "Beecham".
>> >>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>> >>>
>> >>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>> >>
>> >> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>> Talliaferro,
>> >> both pronounced the same?...r
>> >
>> > Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>> >
>> > (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
>
> I have been informed in this very news group that although
> Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
> with all three syllables.
"The earlier form of the pomfret's name was "pamflet", a word
which probably ultimately comes from Portuguese pampo, referring
to various fish such as the blue butterfish (Stromateus
fiatola). The fish meat is white in color."
-- en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomfret
Bob Martin
May 28, 2020, 2:10:11 AM5/28/20
to
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 28, 2020, 2:40:22 AM5/28/20
to
On 2020-05-27 20:55:00 +0000, charles said:
> In article <3a4063775...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
> Peter Young <pny...@ormail.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> [snip]
>
>>> I have been informed in this very news group that although
>>> Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
>>> with all three syllables.
>
>> One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
>> town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
>> Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
>> Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
>
>> Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
>> on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
>
>> Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
>
> and St Kilda started off as "Skilda" (a shield or safe harbour)
I'm reminded of Saint-Chinian, a wine-producing village near Béziers.
> In article <3a4063775...@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>,
> Peter Young <pny...@ormail.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 27 May 2020 "John Varela" <jv919a...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> [snip]
>
>>> I have been informed in this very news group that although
>>> Shakespeare spelled it Pomfret, modern Brits pronounce Pontefract
>>> with all three syllables.
>
>> One Shakespearean spelling intrigues me. Inhabitants of the Pembrokeshire
>> town of Haverfordwest call the town "Harford". In "Richard III" Henry
>> Tudor is reported as being in "Harfordwest in Wales" having landed near
>> Milford Haven, downriver form Harford.
>
>> Also, I have a facsimile of a map of Britain from the time of Henry VIII
>> on which Haverfordwest is named "Arforde".
>
>> Pronunciation goes a long way back in some circumstances.
>
> and St Kilda started off as "Skilda" (a shield or safe harbour)
Who was St Chinian?, you may ask. He was actually called Inhan, and the
Ch comes from the Occitan for saint, which is Sanch.
--
athel
occam
May 28, 2020, 2:55:02 AM5/28/20
to
On 27/05/2020 00:04, Quinn C wrote:
> * RH Draney:
>
>> (Another line went from Moncrieffe to Moncrief, but that's more in the
>> category of "tidying up")....r
>
> Good crief.
>
It could have been worse. Ramsbotham to Ramsbottom.
> * RH Draney:
>
>> (Another line went from Moncrieffe to Moncrief, but that's more in the
>> category of "tidying up")....r
>
> Good crief.
>
It could have been worse. Ramsbotham to Ramsbottom.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 28, 2020, 2:55:41 AM5/28/20
to
--
athel
Snidely
May 28, 2020, 3:10:31 AM5/28/20
to
Remember Wednesday, when Phil Hobbs asked plainitively:
Taliaferro, a native of Venice who settled in London and was made a
denizen in 1562.[2]"
[cite available at the expected spot]
Adam or Lorenzo?
> I know a Miss Talliaferro, also pronounced Tolliver. Judging from
> complexion, also British.
<quote>
Walter Robertson Taliaferro (September 9, 1880 – October 11, 1915) was
a pioneer aviator in the U.S. Army who died in a flying accident. After
his first and last "loop the loop" in a Curtiss tractor biplane, the
plane suddenly dove into San Diego Bay, killing him instantly.
Camp Taliaferro in Texas was named in his honor, as was Camp Taliaferro
in San Diego.
<quote>
[similar cite, reached from the previous; pronunciation not indicated]
/dps
--
The presence of this syntax results from the fact that SQLite is really
a Tcl extension that has escaped into the wild.
<http://www.sqlite.org/lang_expr.html>
> On 2020-05-27 13:58, John Varela wrote:
>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 21:57:43 UTC, Quinn C
>> <lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>
>>> * RH Draney:
>>>
>>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>>
>>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>>
>>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>>>> both pronounced the same?...r
>>>
>>> ITYM Tagliaferro (or Taillefer?), and I haven't heard an English
>>> pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
>> A few years ago there was a well-known (American) football player
>> named Talliaferro pronounced Tolliver. And it's not an Italian
>> name, it's British.
"The surname in that line is believed to trace back to Bartholomew
>> On Tue, 26 May 2020 21:57:43 UTC, Quinn C
>> <lispa...@crommatograph.info> wrote:
>>
>>> * RH Draney:
>>>
>>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>>>
>>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>>>
>>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>>>
>>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>>>> both pronounced the same?...r
>>>
>>> ITYM Tagliaferro (or Taillefer?), and I haven't heard an English
>>> pronunciation of that. Or of someone named Tolliver.
>> A few years ago there was a well-known (American) football player
>> named Talliaferro pronounced Tolliver. And it's not an Italian
>> name, it's British.
Taliaferro, a native of Venice who settled in London and was made a
denizen in 1562.[2]"
[cite available at the expected spot]
Adam or Lorenzo?
> I know a Miss Talliaferro, also pronounced Tolliver. Judging from
> complexion, also British.
Walter Robertson Taliaferro (September 9, 1880 – October 11, 1915) was
a pioneer aviator in the U.S. Army who died in a flying accident. After
his first and last "loop the loop" in a Curtiss tractor biplane, the
plane suddenly dove into San Diego Bay, killing him instantly.
Camp Taliaferro in Texas was named in his honor, as was Camp Taliaferro
in San Diego.
<quote>
[similar cite, reached from the previous; pronunciation not indicated]
/dps
--
The presence of this syntax results from the fact that SQLite is really
a Tcl extension that has escaped into the wild.
<http://www.sqlite.org/lang_expr.html>
Adam Funk
May 28, 2020, 5:30:06 AM5/28/20
to
On 2020-05-27, charles wrote:
> In article <v4q1qgx...@news.ducksburg.com>,
No, but it's got "cake" in the name. Anyway, Wikipedia has
Pontefract cakes (also known as Pomfret cakes and Pomfrey cakes)
The original name for these small tablets of liquorice is a
"Pomfret" cake, after the old Norman name for Pontefract. However,
that name has fallen into disuse and they are now almost invariably
labelled "Pontefract cakes".
so I was wrong to think that they are consistently pronounced the long
way.
--
If an organization had to assume that anything it did would become
public in a few years, people within that organization would behave
differently. ---Bruce Schneier
> In article <v4q1qgx...@news.ducksburg.com>,
> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
>> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
>> On 2020-05-27, musika wrote:
>
>> > On 27/05/2020 10:03, Adam Funk wrote:
>> >> On 2020-05-26, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>> >>>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
>> >>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>> >>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>> >>>
>> >>>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>> >>>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it
>> >>>>> "Beecham". Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>> >>>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>> >>>
>> >>> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>> >>>
>> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
>> >>
>> >> I haven't come across "Pontefract" as a surname, but the town
>> >> pronounces all the letters.
>> >>
>> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
>> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
>> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
>
> which isn't cake, anyway
>> >> pronounces all the letters.
>> >>
>> > Except locally where it can also be Pomfret.
>
>> Interesting, I didn't know that. (I don't hear the name often, but
>> it's mainly in connection with the cake.)
>
No, but it's got "cake" in the name. Anyway, Wikipedia has
Pontefract cakes (also known as Pomfret cakes and Pomfrey cakes)
The original name for these small tablets of liquorice is a
"Pomfret" cake, after the old Norman name for Pontefract. However,
that name has fallen into disuse and they are now almost invariably
labelled "Pontefract cakes".
so I was wrong to think that they are consistently pronounced the long
way.
--
If an organization had to assume that anything it did would become
public in a few years, people within that organization would behave
differently. ---Bruce Schneier
RH Draney
May 28, 2020, 6:10:54 AM5/28/20
to
of New Mexico is named for St Taffy....r
Ross
May 28, 2020, 7:47:16 AM5/28/20
to
Anders D. Nygaard
May 28, 2020, 8:28:19 AM5/28/20
to
Den 26-05-2020 kl. 21:05 skrev Phil Hobbs:
> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>
>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>
>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>
> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>
> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
Or Dalziel, Colquhoun (Dee-el, Ce-hoon)
> On 2020-05-26 14:29, RH Draney wrote:
>> On 5/26/2020 10:30 AM, Quinn C wrote:
>>> In a TV series (which I don't particularly recommend) one of the
>>> characters had the surname Beauchamp.
>>>
>>> As I saw in the subtitles. Otherwise, I would've spelled it "Beecham".
>>> Is this an/the established English pronunciation?
>>>
>>> Can we call this a folk etymological pronunciation?
>>
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and
>> Talliaferro, both pronounced the same?...r
>
> Not to mention Pontefract, Cholmondeley, and Featherstonehaugh.
>
> (Pumfrey, Chumly, and Fanshaw.)
/Anders, Denmark.
Peter T. Daniels
May 28, 2020, 9:36:18 AM5/28/20
to
On Thursday, May 28, 2020 at 3:10:31 AM UTC-4, Snidely wrote:
> "The surname in that line is believed to trace back to Bartholomew
> Taliaferro, a native of Venice who settled in London and was made a
> denizen in 1562.[2]"
> [cite available at the expected spot]
"was made a denizen"? That's an interesting thing to be made. You'd
> "The surname in that line is believed to trace back to Bartholomew
> Taliaferro, a native of Venice who settled in London and was made a
> denizen in 1562.[2]"
> [cite available at the expected spot]
think it would be something that one just _is_.
M-W mng. 1 (i.e. oldest) is simply 'inhabitant'; 2 refers to an alien
being admitted to residence, perhaps on a path to citizenship; 3 (oddly,
separated from 1) is 'frequenter', as _a denizen of a neighborhood tavern_.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 28, 2020, 10:21:05 AM5/28/20
to
from Salford and the other from Birkenhead. Both pronounce(d) their
names in the traditional way. I suppose "Dee-el" is clear enough for
representing [,dɪ:j'el], but your "Ce-hoon" is misleading for
[kə'hu̟ːn]. "Ka-hoon" would be better.
I was once involved in writing a biochemical nomenclature document in
which the pronunciation of Dalziel came up: I suggested inserting a
note saying that it was pronounced exactly like the prefix DL- in
DL-lactic acid. This was not adopted and they put "[di:'jel], with only
slightly more stress on the second syllable than the first"
(https://www.qmul.ac.uk/sbcs/iubmb/kinetics/ek4t6.html#p51), which is
fine for people who know the phonetic symbols, but I think everyone in
the field would know how to pronounce DL-lactic acid.
Later on when we were preparing a document on sterochemistry, I
suggested a note telling readers to pronounce DL- like Dalziel. People
on the committee laughed, but didn't adopt that suggestion either.
--
athel
John Varela
May 28, 2020, 2:21:37 PM5/28/20
to
--
John Varela
John Varela
May 28, 2020, 2:51:30 PM5/28/20
to
named Beaufort in South Carolina. One of them is Bo-fert and the
other is Byoo-fert and I can never remember which is which.
In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
Coaling A.
--
John Varela
Sam Plusnet
May 28, 2020, 3:08:41 PM5/28/20
to
If so, they should change the name.
--
Sam Plusnet
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 28, 2020, 4:51:33 PM5/28/20
to
it's been that way for centuries.
>
> If so, they should change the name.
--
athel
> If so, they should change the name.
--
Sam Plusnet
May 28, 2020, 8:59:57 PM5/28/20
to
no word for entrepreneur.
>>
>> If so, they should change the name.
>
>
--
Sam Plusnet
>> If so, they should change the name.
>
>
--
Steve Hayes
May 29, 2020, 1:15:43 AM5/29/20
to
On Tue, 26 May 2020 11:34:43 -0700, skpflex1 wrote:
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>> both pronounced the same?...r
>
> I see your Tolliver and raise to featherstonehaugh. my next bet will be
>> Haven't you known of people with the surnames Tolliver and Talliaferro,
>> both pronounced the same?...r
>
> mapledurham (pronounced "mum").
Not to mention Auchinlech and Affleck.
In our family history we discovered a relative who had married a
Whatmough, and wondered if it was pronounced "Whumpff".
--
Steve Hayes http://khanya.wordpress.com
Steve Hayes
May 29, 2020, 1:17:39 AM5/29/20
to
"Father Sidebum".
Adam Funk
May 30, 2020, 9:30:08 AM5/30/20
to
--
There are some things that are not sayable. That's why
we have art. ---Leonora Carrington
Adam Funk
May 30, 2020, 9:45:06 AM5/30/20
to
Metrpolitan District Council.
--
Don't take me seriously, but I have a hunch that when the unknown
parts of the DNA are decoded, the so-called sequences of junk DNA,
they're going to turn out to be copyright notices and patent
protections. ---Donald Knuth
Sam Plusnet
May 30, 2020, 3:47:54 PM5/30/20
to
On 30-May-20 14:30, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2020-05-28, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
>> But surely they must have mended that broken bridge by now?
>>
>> If so, they should change the name.
>
> I think you should send that suggestion (in green ink) to Wakefield
> Metrpolitan District Council.
>
All my letters to the Wakefield District Council are in green ink.
> On 2020-05-28, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
>> But surely they must have mended that broken bridge by now?
>>
>> If so, they should change the name.
>
> I think you should send that suggestion (in green ink) to Wakefield
> Metrpolitan District Council.
>
--
Sam Plusnet
Lewis
May 30, 2020, 7:51:13 PM5/30/20
to
In message <ej3aqgx...@news.ducksburg.com> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>> In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>> Coaling A.
When I lived in the area about 40 years ago it was kuh-lin-ga.
>> In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>> Coaling A.
This makes sense, as there is no Spanish word "colinga" that I know of.
--
Twentieth century? Why, I could pick a century out of a hat,
blindfolded, and come up with a better one.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
May 31, 2020, 3:30:08 AM5/31/20
to
green ink.
--
athel
Kerr-Mudd,John
May 31, 2020, 3:47:55 AM5/31/20
to
invisible unicorn.
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Snidely
Jun 1, 2020, 12:33:43 AM6/1/20
to
On Sunday or thereabouts, Kerr-Mudd,John asked ...
Dash it!
-d
--
"This is all very fine, but let us not be carried away be excitement,
but ask calmly, how does this person feel about in in his cooler
moments next day, with six or seven thousand feet of snow and stuff on
top of him?"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain.
-d
--
"This is all very fine, but let us not be carried away be excitement,
but ask calmly, how does this person feel about in in his cooler
moments next day, with six or seven thousand feet of snow and stuff on
top of him?"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain.
Snidely
Jun 1, 2020, 12:46:19 AM6/1/20
to
Lewis was thinking very hard :
[except this part by John Varela]
John mentioned. I've been in Hanford, but not Coalinga, so I havent'
heard anyone identified as a local pronounce it, but no doubt there are
some oral histories around that could shed light.
To restore Adam's question:
>> How is Coalingb pronounced?
Try to find it. Google search turns up ads and reviews for
Coaling Station B - Coalinga, CA Apartments for rent
("nestled in the northeast part of town")
Adding Espee to the search terms yields
<quote>
Located in Fresno County, Coalinga is one of the few cities that began
as a mining town, and survived. Oil provided the community with over
100 years of relative prosperity, but it was the discovery of coal that
inspired the name, Coalinga, when laid out by Southern Pacific Railroad
engineers in 1891. Legend has it during those days; there were three
coaling stations: “A”, “B” and “C”. The name Coalinga is derived from
mixing “Coaling” with Station “A”, with the “A” meaning to arrive.
</quote>
<URL:https://coalingachamber.com/history-of-coalinga/>
but see also
<quote>
Lore says that the town was named for its long-ago coal industry.
According to the city's Web site (www.coalinga.com), however, "There is
debate about the name Coalinga itself. One claim is that (a) succession
of three coaling stations or perhaps hoppers were situated along the
rail line (that went through the area). They were Coaling Stations
called A, B and C. Coaling Station A persisted. This story does not
stand close scrutiny. A more likely explanation is that Coaling was
given the final 'a' for musical effect, changing maps to Coalinga.
Briefly, the area was also known as Coaling 'o.' The truth may never be
known, since the records were destroyed in the great quake and fire in
San Francisco in 1906, destroying the (Southern Pacific) Railroad's
office."
</quote>
<URL:https://www.sfgate.com/travel/article/What-s-in-a-name-Coalinga-is-still-debating-2496495.php>
/dps
--
Who, me? And what lacuna?
[except this part by John Varela]
>>> In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
>>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>>> Coaling A.
> When I lived in the area about 40 years ago it was kuh-lin-ga.
>
> This makes sense, as there is no Spanish word "colinga" that I know of.
In LA County and south, it is generally heard with the diphthong/glide
>>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>>> Coaling A.
> When I lived in the area about 40 years ago it was kuh-lin-ga.
>
> This makes sense, as there is no Spanish word "colinga" that I know of.
John mentioned. I've been in Hanford, but not Coalinga, so I havent'
heard anyone identified as a local pronounce it, but no doubt there are
some oral histories around that could shed light.
To restore Adam's question:
>> How is Coalingb pronounced?
Try to find it. Google search turns up ads and reviews for
Coaling Station B - Coalinga, CA Apartments for rent
("nestled in the northeast part of town")
Adding Espee to the search terms yields
<quote>
Located in Fresno County, Coalinga is one of the few cities that began
as a mining town, and survived. Oil provided the community with over
100 years of relative prosperity, but it was the discovery of coal that
inspired the name, Coalinga, when laid out by Southern Pacific Railroad
engineers in 1891. Legend has it during those days; there were three
coaling stations: “A”, “B” and “C”. The name Coalinga is derived from
mixing “Coaling” with Station “A”, with the “A” meaning to arrive.
</quote>
<URL:https://coalingachamber.com/history-of-coalinga/>
but see also
<quote>
Lore says that the town was named for its long-ago coal industry.
According to the city's Web site (www.coalinga.com), however, "There is
debate about the name Coalinga itself. One claim is that (a) succession
of three coaling stations or perhaps hoppers were situated along the
rail line (that went through the area). They were Coaling Stations
called A, B and C. Coaling Station A persisted. This story does not
stand close scrutiny. A more likely explanation is that Coaling was
given the final 'a' for musical effect, changing maps to Coalinga.
Briefly, the area was also known as Coaling 'o.' The truth may never be
known, since the records were destroyed in the great quake and fire in
San Francisco in 1906, destroying the (Southern Pacific) Railroad's
office."
</quote>
<URL:https://www.sfgate.com/travel/article/What-s-in-a-name-Coalinga-is-still-debating-2496495.php>
/dps
--
Who, me? And what lacuna?
Adam Funk
Jun 2, 2020, 9:15:06 AM6/2/20
to
On 2020-06-01, Snidely wrote:
> Lewis was thinking very hard :
>> In message <ej3aqgx...@news.ducksburg.com> Adam Funk
>> <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>
> [except this part by John Varela]
>>>> In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
>>>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>>>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>>>> Coaling A.
>
>> When I lived in the area about 40 years ago it was kuh-lin-ga.
>>
>> This makes sense, as there is no Spanish word "colinga" that I know of.
>
> In LA County and south, it is generally heard with the diphthong/glide
> John mentioned. I've been in Hanford, but not Coalinga, so I havent'
> heard anyone identified as a local pronounce it, but no doubt there are
> some oral histories around that could shed light.
>
> To restore Adam's question:
>
>>> How is Coalingb pronounced?
>
> Try to find it. Google search turns up ads and reviews for
> Coaling Station B - Coalinga, CA Apartments for rent
> ("nestled in the northeast part of town")
The one with the catchier pronunciation has subsumed B.
> Lewis was thinking very hard :
>> In message <ej3aqgx...@news.ducksburg.com> Adam Funk
>> <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>
> [except this part by John Varela]
>>>> In California there is a town named Coalinga, pronounced as in
>>>> Spanish: co-ah-LIN-ga. The town originated as a stop on the railroad
>>>> where the locomotives refueled with coal: Coaling Station A =>
>>>> Coaling A.
>
>> When I lived in the area about 40 years ago it was kuh-lin-ga.
>>
>> This makes sense, as there is no Spanish word "colinga" that I know of.
>
> In LA County and south, it is generally heard with the diphthong/glide
> John mentioned. I've been in Hanford, but not Coalinga, so I havent'
> heard anyone identified as a local pronounce it, but no doubt there are
> some oral histories around that could shed light.
>
> To restore Adam's question:
>
>>> How is Coalingb pronounced?
>
> Try to find it. Google search turns up ads and reviews for
> Coaling Station B - Coalinga, CA Apartments for rent
> ("nestled in the northeast part of town")
and now the time has come at last to crush the motif of the rose.
Adam Funk
Jun 4, 2020, 10:15:06 AM6/4/20
to
On 2020-06-01, Snidely wrote:
> On Sunday or thereabouts, Kerr-Mudd,John asked ...
>> On Sun, 31 May 2020 07:30:04 GMT, Athel Cornish-Bowden
>> <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2020-05-30 19:47:51 +0000, Sam Plusnet said:
>>>
>>>> On 30-May-20 14:30, Adam Funk wrote:
>>>>> On 2020-05-28, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> But surely they must have mended that broken bridge by now?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If so, they should change the name.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you should send that suggestion (in green ink) to Wakefield
>>>>> Metrpolitan District Council.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> All my letters to the Wakefield District Council are in green ink.
>>>
>>> All of mine, too. I've never sent them a letter that wasn't written in
>>> green ink.
>>>
>> Almost all of my correspondence with them (pause comma?) I delegate to my
>> invisible unicorn.
>
> Dash it!
Sterne would approve of that.
> On Sunday or thereabouts, Kerr-Mudd,John asked ...
>> On Sun, 31 May 2020 07:30:04 GMT, Athel Cornish-Bowden
>> <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2020-05-30 19:47:51 +0000, Sam Plusnet said:
>>>
>>>> On 30-May-20 14:30, Adam Funk wrote:
>>>>> On 2020-05-28, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> But surely they must have mended that broken bridge by now?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If so, they should change the name.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you should send that suggestion (in green ink) to Wakefield
>>>>> Metrpolitan District Council.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> All my letters to the Wakefield District Council are in green ink.
>>>
>>> All of mine, too. I've never sent them a letter that wasn't written in
>>> green ink.
>>>
>> Almost all of my correspondence with them (pause comma?) I delegate to my
>> invisible unicorn.
>
> Dash it!
<https://twitter.com/ianduhig/status/1266392081641201666>
--
When Chayefsky created Howard Beale, could he have imagined
Jerry Springer, Howard Stern, and the World Wrestling
Federation? ---Roger Ebert
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