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What is a "John Houseman" name, and how is it used?
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Helmer Bengtsson
Aug 19, 2014, 12:37:36 PM8/19/14
to
I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
what a "John Houseman" name is.
http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
doesn't really tell me how it's used.
Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
a good John Houseman name?
so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
what a "John Houseman" name is.
http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
doesn't really tell me how it's used.
Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
a good John Houseman name?
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 19, 2014, 1:26:47 PM8/19/14
to
On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 12:37:36 PM UTC-4, Helmer Bengtsson wrote:
> I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> what a "John Houseman" name is.
> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> what a "John Houseman" name is.
> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
interpretable.
> Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
> For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
> What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
> a good John Houseman name?
his life (long associated with Orson Welles), but in his last years
became an actor (notably in the movie and TV series based on Scott
Turow's memoir of his Harvard Law School days) and especially a TV
commercial spokesman for the Smith Barney brokerage firm, with the
catchphrase "We make money the old-fashioned way: We earrrrrn it."
But he was extremely non-rhotic -- either a Londoner or a Bostonian
-- and his distinctive pronunciations were easy to imitate.
Horace LaBadie
Aug 19, 2014, 1:27:19 PM8/19/14
to
In article <lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org>,
If you don't know Houseman's manner of speaking, then it is impossible
to explain.
Watch videos of him, and you might get the idea.
to explain.
Watch videos of him, and you might get the idea.
Mack A. Damia
Aug 19, 2014, 1:37:26 PM8/19/14
to
Laura might have a good John Houseman name.
--
John Dawkins
Aug 19, 2014, 1:59:20 PM8/19/14
to
In article <9aa07794-4980-45d3...@googlegroups.com>,
(1973) were based on an even earlier novel of that name. Scott Turow's
memoir ("One L") was published a few years after the movie appeared.
> But he was extremely non-rhotic -- either a Londoner or a Bostonian
> -- and his distinctive pronunciations were easy to imitate.
--
J.
"Peter T. Daniels" <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 12:37:36 PM UTC-4, Helmer Bengtsson wrote:
>
> > I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
> > so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> > what a "John Houseman" name is.
> > http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
> > It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> > doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> interpretable.
>
> > Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
> > For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
>
> No.
>
> > What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
> > a good John Houseman name?
>
> John Houseman was a very important theatrical producer for most of
> his life (long associated with Orson Welles), but in his last years
> became an actor (notably in the movie and TV series based on Scott
> Turow's memoir of his Harvard Law School days) and especially a TV
> commercial spokesman for the Smith Barney brokerage firm, with the
> catchphrase "We make money the old-fashioned way: We earrrrrn it."
The TV series ("The Paper Chase") and the earlier movie of the same name
> On Tuesday, August 19, 2014 12:37:36 PM UTC-4, Helmer Bengtsson wrote:
>
> > I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
> > so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> > what a "John Houseman" name is.
> > http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
> > It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> > doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> interpretable.
>
> > Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
> > For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
>
> No.
>
> > What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
> > a good John Houseman name?
>
> John Houseman was a very important theatrical producer for most of
> his life (long associated with Orson Welles), but in his last years
> became an actor (notably in the movie and TV series based on Scott
> Turow's memoir of his Harvard Law School days) and especially a TV
> commercial spokesman for the Smith Barney brokerage firm, with the
> catchphrase "We make money the old-fashioned way: We earrrrrn it."
(1973) were based on an even earlier novel of that name. Scott Turow's
memoir ("One L") was published a few years after the movie appeared.
> But he was extremely non-rhotic -- either a Londoner or a Bostonian
> -- and his distinctive pronunciations were easy to imitate.
J.
Don Phillipson
Aug 19, 2014, 5:51:51 PM8/19/14
to
"Helmer Bengtsson" <HelmerB...@is.invalid> wrote in message
news:lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org...
> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> what a "John Houseman" name is.
> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
This seems to make sense solely within the context of the
Seinfeld TV series. The extra irony is that, although it concerns
only pronunciation, it is irrelevant that John Houseman altered the
sound and look of his own name (originally Jacques Haussmann)
for professional resons.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
news:lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org...
> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
> what a "John Houseman" name is.
> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
Seinfeld TV series. The extra irony is that, although it concerns
only pronunciation, it is irrelevant that John Houseman altered the
sound and look of his own name (originally Jacques Haussmann)
for professional resons.
--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)
Message has been deleted
Daniel Webster
Aug 20, 2014, 8:51:06 AM8/20/14
to
On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> interpretable.
It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> interpretable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
Oliver Cromm
Aug 20, 2014, 12:37:40 PM8/20/14
to
* Horace LaBadie:
I suspect a lot of Seinfeld humor is of that kind, and that's one
reason the show never caught my interest.
--
If the aeroplane industry had advanced at the same rate as the
computer industry, today's planes could circumnavigate the world
in ten seconds, be two inches long, and crash twice a day.
Peter Moylan in alt.usage.english
reason the show never caught my interest.
--
If the aeroplane industry had advanced at the same rate as the
computer industry, today's planes could circumnavigate the world
in ten seconds, be two inches long, and crash twice a day.
Peter Moylan in alt.usage.english
Jerry Friedman
Aug 20, 2014, 9:17:35 PM8/20/14
to
On 8/19/14 7:04 PM, Lewis wrote:
> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Helmer Bengtsson <HelmerB...@is.invalid> was all, like:
> --> Tue, 19 Aug 2014 16:37:36 +0000 (UTC) <lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org>
> good follow-up TV series of the same name), you would know.
>
> He was also the executive in Rollerball.
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx22TyCge7w>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wOUMd3bMRI>
> doesn't roll the way John Houseman would want to roll it.
> and short on any s sounds.
Then it's unfortunate that the one time I've gotten to do that in class
("Mista Simpson. Heah's a quo'ta. Go and coll you' motha") the
student's name had two s's. On the other hand, hissing works well in
that line.
(The student was a few years older than me, and for other reasons as
well, I knew he'd take it as a joke.)
--
Jerry Friedman
> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Helmer Bengtsson <HelmerB...@is.invalid> was all, like:
> --> Tue, 19 Aug 2014 16:37:36 +0000 (UTC) <lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org>
>> I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
>> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
>> what a "John Houseman" name is.
>> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
>> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
>> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
> Well, if you ever saw John Houseman in The Paper Chase (or it's quite
>> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
>> what a "John Houseman" name is.
>> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
>> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
>> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
> good follow-up TV series of the same name), you would know.
>
> He was also the executive in Rollerball.
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx22TyCge7w>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wOUMd3bMRI>
>
>> Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
>> For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
>
> I don't think so, the gts combination in your name makes it a game that
>> Can someone help me better understand the term a "John Houseman name"?
>> For example, do "I" have a John Houseman name?
>
> doesn't roll the way John Houseman would want to roll it.
>
>> What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
>> a good John Houseman name?
>
> I'd say names with good hard sounds and an r or two to roll around in,
>> What would be a good example (other than Alec Berg of course) of
>> a good John Houseman name?
>
> and short on any s sounds.
Then it's unfortunate that the one time I've gotten to do that in class
("Mista Simpson. Heah's a quo'ta. Go and coll you' motha") the
student's name had two s's. On the other hand, hissing works well in
that line.
(The student was a few years older than me, and for other reasons as
well, I knew he'd take it as a joke.)
--
Jerry Friedman
Ross
Aug 20, 2014, 11:55:18 PM8/20/14
to
made his acquaintance via YouTube I find it amusing that people seem to
focus on his "rrr"s, whereas (as Peter points out) there is no "r" there,
in his pronunciation of words like "earn", "Berg", etc. Seinfeld's attempted
imitation seems to involve a sort of quasi-uvular-trill buzz in the
back of his throat, but I hear nothing like that in JH's actual speech.
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 21, 2014, 7:34:04 AM8/21/14
to
though he got an Oscar for his very first acting gig; all you need to
know is "We make money the old-fashioned way: we [oe:::::]n it." Those
commercials may well have aired _during_ *Seinfeld* episodes.
Robert Bannister
Aug 21, 2014, 8:18:32 PM8/21/14
to
On 20/08/2014 9:04 am, Lewis wrote:
> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Helmer Bengtsson <HelmerB...@is.invalid> was all, like:
> --> Tue, 19 Aug 2014 16:37:36 +0000 (UTC) <lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org>
> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Helmer Bengtsson <HelmerB...@is.invalid> was all, like:
> --> Tue, 19 Aug 2014 16:37:36 +0000 (UTC) <lsvugg$7e9$1...@solani.org>
>> I heard the term used on the news (as if I had known what it meant),
>> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
>> what a "John Houseman" name is.
>> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
>> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
>> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
>> so, I wrote it down and then googled and still don't understand
>> what a "John Houseman" name is.
>> http://theseinfelddictionary.com/2008/01/28/john-houseman-name/
>
>> It seems that Seinfeld popularized the term (created it?) but that
>> doesn't really tell me how it's used.
>
> Well, if you ever saw John Houseman in The Paper Chase (or it's quite
> good follow-up TV series of the same name), you would know.
>
> He was also the executive in Rollerball.
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx22TyCge7w>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wOUMd3bMRI>
He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> good follow-up TV series of the same name), you would know.
>
> He was also the executive in Rollerball.
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx22TyCge7w>
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wOUMd3bMRI>
having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
might mean.
--
Robert Bannister - 1940-71 SE England
1972-now W Australia
Robert Bannister
Aug 21, 2014, 8:21:01 PM8/21/14
to
to me. That kind of R sound more German or French.
Jerry Friedman
Aug 21, 2014, 8:34:16 PM8/21/14
to
On 8/21/14 6:21 PM, Robert Bannister wrote:
> On 20/08/2014 8:51 pm, Daniel Webster wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>
>>> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
>>> interpretable.
>>
>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
>>
> I imagine you have to be American to understand that. It made no sense
> to me. That kind of R sound more German or French.
He's trying to imitate Houseman's occasional emphatic growl, as in the
> On 20/08/2014 8:51 pm, Daniel Webster wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>
>>> I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
>>> interpretable.
>>
>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
>>
> I imagine you have to be American to understand that. It made no sense
> to me. That kind of R sound more German or French.
very penultimate word of this commercial.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
--
Jerry Friedman
Ross
Aug 21, 2014, 9:44:18 PM8/21/14
to
I have to say this "classic Seinfeld moment" seemed to me rather pointless and unfunny. Maybe it was based just on the same nucleus in "earn" and "Berg".
Jerry Friedman
Aug 21, 2014, 10:01:45 PM8/21/14
to
imitation very well, especially considering that he (the character) is a
professional comedian, if I'm not mistaken. But I haven't watched much
/Seinfeld/, and I don't know whether they did that kind of hip
meta-ironic humor.
--
Jerry Friedman
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 21, 2014, 11:39:23 PM8/21/14
to
On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> might mean.
"A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> might mean.
something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
way. We earrrrn it."_
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
I can't believe none of you link-crazy posters looked it up.
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 21, 2014, 11:40:43 PM8/21/14
to
On Thursday, August 21, 2014 10:01:45 PM UTC-4, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> I wondered whether part of the humor was that Jerry didn't do the
> imitation very well, especially considering that he (the character) is a
> professional comedian, if I'm not mistaken. But I haven't watched much
> /Seinfeld/, and I don't know whether they did that kind of hip
> meta-ironic humor.
It was a Show About Nothing. What else would they do?
> I wondered whether part of the humor was that Jerry didn't do the
> imitation very well, especially considering that he (the character) is a
> professional comedian, if I'm not mistaken. But I haven't watched much
> /Seinfeld/, and I don't know whether they did that kind of hip
> meta-ironic humor.
Ross
Aug 21, 2014, 11:54:15 PM8/21/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:39:23 PM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > might mean.
>
> "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> way. We earrrrn it."_
By NOT A THING, I take it you mean not a conventional expression, but rather
> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > might mean.
>
> "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> way. We earrrrn it."_
a description Jerry makes up on the spot.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
>
> I can't believe none of you link-crazy posters looked it up.
detail, there was no point in posting the link. Anybody could find it.
So it seems that particular word in that particular ad was so famous
that Jerry, hearing an ordinary name that happened to have an "-er-" in it,
thought "Maybe it would be funny to pronounce that name the way JH pronounces
'earn' in that Smith Barney ad."
Huh. Guess you had to be there. Or maybe it was meta-. A show that's funny
about not being funny?
Message has been deleted
R H Draney
Aug 22, 2014, 1:19:34 AM8/22/14
to
Peter T. Daniels filted:
Arrange a masturbation tontine....r
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.
Tony Cooper
Aug 22, 2014, 2:57:41 AM8/22/14
to
On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 04:42:49 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>Okay, so one time? In band camp? Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> was all, like:
> --> Wed, 20 Aug 2014 20:55:18 -0700 (PDT) <47a01e57-7c0a-461e...@googlegroups.com>
>strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
>know who John Houseman was.
You might get better results in a street in an over-65 community. "The
Paper Chase" ran on television between 1978 and 1979. It was brought
back between 1983 and 1986. The movie appeared in 1973.
Ask the average person on the street today what a television show
called "The Paper Chase" would be, and they'd guess it was a reality
show where a group of New Jerseyites race around to see who can steal
the most newspapers from coin-operated vending machines using slugs
they've hammered out from bottle caps.
In the meantime, I'm trying to figure out what a "random stranger" is.
You can randomly select 100 people from a larger group of strangers,
though.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>Okay, so one time? In band camp? Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> was all, like:
> --> Wed, 20 Aug 2014 20:55:18 -0700 (PDT) <47a01e57-7c0a-461e...@googlegroups.com>
>> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 12:51:06 AM UTC+12, Daniel Webster wrote:
>>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>> > I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
>>> > interpretable.
>>>
>>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
>
>> I wasn't familiar with John Houseman as a pop-culture figure,
>
>He isn't. He's largely unknown and I bet if you asked 100 random
>>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>> > I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
>>> > interpretable.
>>>
>>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
>
>> I wasn't familiar with John Houseman as a pop-culture figure,
>
>strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
>know who John Houseman was.
You might get better results in a street in an over-65 community. "The
Paper Chase" ran on television between 1978 and 1979. It was brought
back between 1983 and 1986. The movie appeared in 1973.
Ask the average person on the street today what a television show
called "The Paper Chase" would be, and they'd guess it was a reality
show where a group of New Jerseyites race around to see who can steal
the most newspapers from coin-operated vending machines using slugs
they've hammered out from bottle caps.
In the meantime, I'm trying to figure out what a "random stranger" is.
You can randomly select 100 people from a larger group of strangers,
though.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando FL
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 8:08:17 AM8/22/14
to
On Thursday, August 21, 2014 11:54:15 PM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:39:23 PM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> > > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > > might mean.
> > "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> > something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> > way. We earrrrn it."_
>
> By NOT A THING, I take it you mean not a conventional expression, but rather
> a description Jerry makes up on the spot.
That's kinda how "observational comedy," as his particular style of stand-up
> On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:39:23 PM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> > > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > > might mean.
> > "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> > something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> > way. We earrrrn it."_
>
> By NOT A THING, I take it you mean not a conventional expression, but rather
> a description Jerry makes up on the spot.
is called, works.
Persons from your take on civilization apparently think
elderly men in women's clothing is the utmost of hilarity; there is no
rational way to explain the popularity of "Dame Edna Everidge." This fortnight
we've been reminded of one of the only two highly successful American attempts
at the genre -- *Mrs. Doubtfire* -- where the title character's passing as a
woman is handled quite seriously and might even have had a chance of success
in the real world. (One can't say the same for *Tootsie*.) The other, of
course, was *Some Like It Hot*, where the drag was basically a maguffin and
nothing was to be taken seriously.
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
> > I can't believe none of you link-crazy posters looked it up.
>
> Some of us did, but since someone had already described the ad in sufficient\
> detail, there was no point in posting the link. Anybody could find it.
age had done so and they were all in a tizzy about something called "a
John Houseman name."
> So it seems that particular word in that particular ad was so famous
> that Jerry, hearing an ordinary name that happened to have an "-er-" in it,
> thought "Maybe it would be funny to pronounce that name the way JH pronounces
> 'earn' in that Smith Barney ad."
but in your class, and this is the sort of approach you have to use with
them, this is _exactly_ what I meant by "un-aueish."
> Huh. Guess you had to be there. Or maybe it was meta-. A show that's funny
> about not being funny?
reference was made, why would it seem funny to you now, more than
30 years later?
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 8:09:48 AM8/22/14
to
And, er, that's "master of one's domain."
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 8:14:40 AM8/22/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 2:57:41 AM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 04:42:49 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
> <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> > Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> Wed, 20 Aug 2014 20:55:18 -0700 (PDT) <47a01e57-7c0a-461e...@googlegroups.com>
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 04:42:49 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
> <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> >> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 12:51:06 AM UTC+12, Daniel Webster wrote:
> >>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
[a reference to John Houseman in a 30-year-old Seinfeld episode]
> >>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2014 10:26:47 -0700, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> >>> > I haven't heard it before; if I saw the episode it would be instantly
> >>> > interpretable.
> >>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
> >> I wasn't familiar with John Houseman as a pop-culture figure,
> >He isn't. He's largely unknown and I bet if you asked 100 random
> >strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
> >know who John Houseman was.
Lewis is clearly young enough to still be at band camp? more than one time?
> >>> > interpretable.
> >>> It's a classic Seinfeld moment:
> >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6Lyp0B4b5Mc#t=29
> >> I wasn't familiar with John Houseman as a pop-culture figure,
> >He isn't. He's largely unknown and I bet if you asked 100 random
> >strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
> >know who John Houseman was.
> You might get better results in a street in an over-65 community. "The
> Paper Chase" ran on television between 1978 and 1979. It was brought
> back between 1983 and 1986. The movie appeared in 1973.
> Ask the average person on the street today what a television show
> called "The Paper Chase" would be, and they'd guess it was a reality
> show where a group of New Jerseyites race around to see who can steal
> the most newspapers from coin-operated vending machines using slugs
> they've hammered out from bottle caps.
to New Jerseyites.
> In the meantime, I'm trying to figure out what a "random stranger" is.
> You can randomly select 100 people from a larger group of strangers,
> though.
its instantiations, had nothing to do with the Seinfeld bit (except
in the sense that it gave Smith Barney's ad agency the idea of using
him in their commercials).
It is the _commercials_ that were ubiquitous.
Ross
Aug 22, 2014, 9:18:29 AM8/22/14
to
On Saturday, August 23, 2014 12:08:17 AM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 11:54:15 PM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> > On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:39:23 PM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > > On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
>
> > > > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > > > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > > > might mean.
> > > "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> > > something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> > > way. We earrrrn it."_
>
> > By NOT A THING, I take it you mean not a conventional expression, but rather
> > a description Jerry makes up on the spot.
>
> That's kinda how "observational comedy," as his particular style of stand-up
> is called, works.
>
> Persons from your take on civilization apparently think
> elderly men in women's clothing is the utmost of hilarity; there is no
> rational way to explain the popularity of "Dame Edna Everidge." This >fortnight we've been reminded of one of the only two highly successful >American attempts at the genre -- *Mrs. Doubtfire* -- where the title >character's passing as a woman is handled quite seriously and might even have >had a chance of success in the real world. (One can't say the same for >*Tootsie*.) The other, of course, was *Some Like It Hot*, where the drag was >basically a maguffin and nothing was to be taken seriously.
I guess I'm being "non-aueish" again, but I don't see the relevance of this
> On Thursday, August 21, 2014 11:54:15 PM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> > On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:39:23 PM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > > On Thursday, August 21, 2014 8:18:32 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
>
> > > > He sounds vaguely Scottish with a strong American overlay to me. Even
> > > > having heard him, I wouldn't have a clue what "a John Houseman name"
> > > > might mean.
> > > "A John Houseman name" is NOT A THING. The joke concerned _pronouncing
> > > something the way John Houseman says "We make money the old-fashioned
> > > way. We earrrrn it."_
>
> > By NOT A THING, I take it you mean not a conventional expression, but rather
> > a description Jerry makes up on the spot.
>
> That's kinda how "observational comedy," as his particular style of stand-up
> is called, works.
>
> Persons from your take on civilization apparently think
> elderly men in women's clothing is the utmost of hilarity; there is no
> rational way to explain the popularity of "Dame Edna Everidge." This >fortnight we've been reminded of one of the only two highly successful >American attempts at the genre -- *Mrs. Doubtfire* -- where the title >character's passing as a woman is handled quite seriously and might even have >had a chance of success in the real world. (One can't say the same for >*Tootsie*.) The other, of course, was *Some Like It Hot*, where the drag was >basically a maguffin and nothing was to be taken seriously.
excursus on your likes and dislikes in drag humour (or dragma), and I particularly find your attempt to identify your dislikes with my "take on civilization" (whatever you think you mean by that) utterly bizarre.
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
>
> > > I can't believe none of you link-crazy posters looked it up.
>
> > Some of us did, but since someone had already described the ad in sufficient\ detail, there was no point in posting the link. Anybody could find it.
>
> But it was obvious from the discussion that no non-USan of the appropriate
> age had done so and they were all in a tizzy about something called "a
> John Houseman name."
did not get the profoundly bathetic truth about what a "John Houseman name" was.
I had other theories: a name like the names of the sort of characters John
Houseman plays? a name that a caricature Englishman like John Houseman (or his
friends) might be called? That sort of thing.
> > So it seems that particular word in that particular ad was so famous
> > that Jerry, hearing an ordinary name that happened to have an "-er-" in it,
> > thought "Maybe it would be funny to pronounce that name the way JH pronounces 'earn' in that Smith Barney ad."
> Unless you teach particularly dense undergraduates who want to be anywhere
> but in your class, and this is the sort of approach you have to use with
> them, this is _exactly_ what I meant by "un-aueish."
group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly the OP
did not.
Or do you just mean it's uncool to explain humour? I did it for my own satisfaction, because I really was baffled.
> > Huh. Guess you had to be there. Or maybe it was meta-. A show that's funny
> > about not being funny?
>
> If you are unaware of the ubiquity of the referent at the time the
> reference was made, why would it seem funny to you now, more than
> 30 years later?
context. But I'm afraid not here. If you laughed at it 30 years ago, that's fine -- I'm not telling you you shouldn't have.
Tony Cooper
Aug 22, 2014, 10:35:56 AM8/22/14
to
or not John Houseman's name would be known to a random selection of
crinklies.
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 12:23:45 PM8/22/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 10:35:56 AM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 05:14:40 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >On Friday, August 22, 2014 2:57:41 AM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> >> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 04:42:49 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
> >> <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> >> > Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> Wed, 20 Aug 2014 20:55:18 -0700 (PDT) <47a01e57-7c0a-461e...@googlegroups.com>
> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 05:14:40 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >On Friday, August 22, 2014 2:57:41 AM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> >> On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 04:42:49 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
> >> <g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> >> > Ross <benl...@ihug.co.nz> Wed, 20 Aug 2014 20:55:18 -0700 (PDT) <47a01e57-7c0a-461e...@googlegroups.com>
> >> >> I wasn't familiar with John Houseman as a pop-culture figure,
> >> >He isn't. He's largely unknown and I bet if you asked 100 random
> >> >strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
> >> >know who John Houseman was.
> >> >He isn't. He's largely unknown and I bet if you asked 100 random
> >> >strangers on the street (depending on the street) only a handful would
> >> >know who John Houseman was.
> >> You might get better results in a street in an over-65 community. "The
> >> Paper Chase" ran on television between 1978 and 1979. It was brought
> >> back between 1983 and 1986. The movie appeared in 1973. ...
> >> Paper Chase" ran on television between 1978 and 1979. It was brought
> >Evidently Tony _still_ hasn't got it. *The Paper Chase*, in any of
> >its instantiations, had nothing to do with the Seinfeld bit (except
> >in the sense that it gave Smith Barney's ad agency the idea of using
> >him in their commercials).
>
> The television show would have had a great deal of effect on whether
> or not John Houseman's name would be known to a random selection of
> crinklies.
If Evan were still here, by now he would have looked up the (dismal)
> >its instantiations, had nothing to do with the Seinfeld bit (except
> >in the sense that it gave Smith Barney's ad agency the idea of using
> >him in their commercials).
>
> The television show would have had a great deal of effect on whether
> or not John Houseman's name would be known to a random selection of
> crinklies.
ratings of that show to refute (sensu stricto) that claim.
I can't find any listing other than "Top 30," which it obviously wasn't.
The "new episodes" were made for Showtime premium cable, not broadcast,
in the mid 1980s, when few people had cable and even fewer subscribed
to the premium channels.
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 12:27:36 PM8/22/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:18:29 AM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> I personally don't give a fuck what you meant by it, though I marvel at the
> speed with which you have risen to the rank of arbiter of what is "aueish"
> and what is un-. Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites
> as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly
> the OPdid not.
Where did you get "classic" from? Not from me, and I don't think from
> I personally don't give a fuck what you meant by it, though I marvel at the
> speed with which you have risen to the rank of arbiter of what is "aueish"
> and what is un-. Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites
> as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly
> the OPdid not.
anyone who's tried to explain the bit.
> Sometimes humour can survive explanation and the need to reconstruct its
> context. But I'm afraid not here. If you laughed at it 30 years ago, that's fine -- I'm not telling you you shouldn't have.
ago Penn Gilette (as in Penn & Teller) talked about how he abuses audience
volunteers at his shows, and he noted that the one thing he never does is
make fun of their name, because they had very little say in what their name
was.
Guy Barry
Aug 22, 2014, 12:53:54 PM8/22/14
to
"Peter T. Daniels" wrote in message
news:0bd97c90-e26f-4437...@googlegroups.com...
>Persons from your take on civilization apparently think
>elderly men in women's clothing is the utmost of hilarity; there is no
>rational way to explain the popularity of "Dame Edna Everidge."
Everage. But I agree with the sentiment.
--
Guy Barry
news:0bd97c90-e26f-4437...@googlegroups.com...
>Persons from your take on civilization apparently think
>elderly men in women's clothing is the utmost of hilarity; there is no
>rational way to explain the popularity of "Dame Edna Everidge."
--
Guy Barry
Tony Cooper
Aug 22, 2014, 1:32:51 PM8/22/14
to
anything else.
Dame Edna can be funny, but isn't on my list of the very funny. Eddie
Izzard, though, is wicked brilliant.
Tony Cooper
Aug 22, 2014, 1:34:41 PM8/22/14
to
On Fri, 22 Aug 2014 09:23:45 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
Once again, you swang the cat and it didn't hit anything, so you've
decided there's nothing there.
decided there's nothing there.
the Omrud
Aug 22, 2014, 1:52:55 PM8/22/14
to
--
David
Mack A. Damia
Aug 22, 2014, 2:52:04 PM8/22/14
to
in, "The Paper Chase", in 1973, so he was quite popular with the film
and TV crowd.
--
Ross
Aug 22, 2014, 3:33:55 PM8/22/14
to
On Saturday, August 23, 2014 4:27:36 AM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:18:29 AM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
>
> > I personally don't give a fuck what you meant by it, though I marvel at the
> > speed with which you have risen to the rank of arbiter of what is "aueish"
> > and what is un-. Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly the OPdid not.
>
> Where did you get "classic" from? Not from me, and I don't think from
> anyone who's tried to explain the bit.
From Daniel Webster, the person who provided the link to the clip of the "moment".
> On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:18:29 AM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
>
> > I personally don't give a fuck what you meant by it, though I marvel at the
> > speed with which you have risen to the rank of arbiter of what is "aueish"
> > and what is un-. Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly the OPdid not.
>
> Where did you get "classic" from? Not from me, and I don't think from
> anyone who's tried to explain the bit.
Robert Bannister
Aug 22, 2014, 9:25:27 PM8/22/14
to
the non-rhotic BrE way where "r" simply tells you how to pronounce the
"ea". So, I'm afraid, I am totally whooshed.
Robert Bannister
Aug 22, 2014, 9:32:02 PM8/22/14
to
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 10:37:42 PM8/22/14
to
The TV show *Paper Chase* made no impression on the American viewing
public. The movie might have gotten some attention because of its lone
Oscar (like Oprah's and a few other people's, for a debut appearance).
The use of "John Houseman" in pop culture derived solely from his
ubiquity promoting Smith Barney. (IIRC -- though it was a long time
ago -- the one on YouTube is rather atypical; I remember him usually
sitting at an imposing desk, staring into the camera to make his pitch.)
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 10:41:38 PM8/22/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 3:33:55 PM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> On Saturday, August 23, 2014 4:27:36 AM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:18:29 AM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> > > Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly the OPdid not.
> > Where did you get "classic" from? Not from me, and I don't think from
> > anyone who's tried to explain the bit.
>
> From Daniel Webster, the person who provided the link to the clip of the "moment".
I don't think we know anything about "Daniel Webster," so it's hard
> On Saturday, August 23, 2014 4:27:36 AM UTC+12, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:18:29 AM UTC-4, Ross wrote:
> > > Actually we have no clear evidence that the RRs or aue-ites as a group found this Seinfeld bit "classic" or even intelligible. Clearly the OPdid not.
> > Where did you get "classic" from? Not from me, and I don't think from
> > anyone who's tried to explain the bit.
>
> From Daniel Webster, the person who provided the link to the clip of the "moment".
to imagine where he's coming from, but "classic" could mean either
'archetypical' or the interpretation you put on it, no?
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 22, 2014, 10:44:14 PM8/22/14
to
On Friday, August 22, 2014 9:32:02 PM UTC-4, Robert Bannister wrote:
> On 22/08/2014 8:34 am, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> > On 8/21/14 6:21 PM, Robert Bannister wrote:
> >> I imagine you have to be American to understand that. It made no sense
> >> to me.
> On 22/08/2014 8:34 am, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> > On 8/21/14 6:21 PM, Robert Bannister wrote:
> >> I imagine you have to be American to understand that. It made no sense
> >> to me.
> > He's trying to imitate Houseman's occasional emphatic growl, as in the
> > very penultimate word of this commercial.
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
>
> But there is absolutely no "r" sound in it.
THAT'S WHAT MAKES IT FUNNY. "earn" and "Berg" are _supposed_ to
> > very penultimate word of this commercial.
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAMRXqQXemU
>
> But there is absolutely no "r" sound in it.
have r's in them, but this teddibly prestigious fellow growls
them instead of pronouncing them.
Message has been deleted
Guy Barry
Aug 23, 2014, 5:50:29 AM8/23/14
to
"Lewis" wrote in message news:slrnlvg4ql....@amelia.local...
>Eddie Izzard's stand-up (for lack of a better word) is excellent. His
>acting hasn't been all that brilliant.
What's wrong with "stand-up"?
--
Guy Barry
>Eddie Izzard's stand-up (for lack of a better word) is excellent. His
>acting hasn't been all that brilliant.
What's wrong with "stand-up"?
--
Guy Barry
Message has been deleted
Robert Bannister
Aug 23, 2014, 6:59:36 PM8/23/14
to
Peter T. Daniels
Aug 23, 2014, 11:10:30 PM8/23/14
to
Guy Barry
Aug 24, 2014, 3:15:44 AM8/24/14
to
"Lewis" wrote in message news:slrnlvi6li....@amelia.local...
>
>Okay, so one time? In band camp? Guy Barry <guy....@blueyonder.co.uk> was
>all, like:
> --> Sat, 23 Aug 2014 10:50:29 +0100 <AtZJv.62675$rb.3...@fx16.am4>
>His comedy is more of a performance than a normal stand-up routine.
Isn't all stand-up comedy a type of performance?
--
Guy Barry
>
>Okay, so one time? In band camp? Guy Barry <guy....@blueyonder.co.uk> was
>all, like:
> --> Sat, 23 Aug 2014 10:50:29 +0100 <AtZJv.62675$rb.3...@fx16.am4>
Isn't all stand-up comedy a type of performance?
--
Guy Barry
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