Annoying American expressions number 472

[James Wilkinson Sword]

"Seeing eye dog".

[Robert Bannister]

On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> "Seeing eye dog".

I've heard it in this country too. "Guide dog" always makes me want to
check whether their little legs aren't covered in badges.

--
Robert B. born England a long time ago;
Western Australia since 1972

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2017-05-24 02:59:53 +0000, Robert Bannister said:

> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> "Seeing eye dog".
>
> I've heard it in this country too.

Did you hear the hyphen: Seeing-eye dog?

> "Guide dog" always makes me want to check whether their little legs
> aren't covered in badges.


--

athel

[RH Draney]

On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> "Seeing eye dog".

Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....

I'll see your dog and raise you "drink driving"....r

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 07:49:45 +0100, Athel Cornish-Bowden <acor...@imm.cnrs.fr> wrote:

> On 2017-05-24 02:59:53 +0000, Robert Bannister said:
>
>> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>
>> I've heard it in this country too.
>
> Did you hear the hyphen: Seeing-eye dog?

I guess you hear a hyphen as a lack of a gap.

>> "Guide dog" always makes me want to check whether their little legs
>> aren't covered in badges.
>
>


--

Riots in Birmingham last month caused over £1 million worth of improvements.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 03:59:53 +0100, Robert Bannister <robertb...@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> "Seeing eye dog".
>
> I've heard it in this country too. "Guide dog" always makes me want to
> check whether their little legs aren't covered in badges.

I'd forgotten they were guide dogs, I call them blind dogs.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 03:59:53 +0100, Robert Bannister <robertb...@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> "Seeing eye dog".
>
> I've heard it in this country too. "Guide dog" always makes me want to
> check whether their little legs aren't covered in badges.

The scout dogs are the ones with testicles.

--
If sex is a pain in the ass, then you're doing it wrong.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 07:57:46 +0100, RH Draney <dado...@cox.net> wrote:

> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> "Seeing eye dog".
>
> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....

Who cares?

> I'll see your dog and raise you "drink driving"....r

That's used in the UK too, what's wrong with it? You drink and you drive, so it's drink driving.

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:

> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> "Seeing eye dog".
>
> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....

Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
what the AmE term is.

> I'll see your dog and raise you "drink driving"....r

+1


--
Now you're climbing to the top of the company ladder
Hope it doesn't take too long
Can't you see there'll come a day when it won't matter?
Come a day when you'll be gone --- Boston

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 14:07:59 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:

> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>
>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>
>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>
> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
> what the AmE term is.

Why would they be needed? Deaf people I know get by just fine, they either sign, or hold up a notice saying they're deaf, and people write things down on a notepad. A dog isn't going to be able to interpret English for them.

--
Two cowboys are riding along a trail in the mountains when they suddenly hear tom toms beating very close to them.
"Oh! That doesn't sound good," one says to the other.
As soon as the words were spoken, an Indian jumps out from behind a tree and said, "Yeah, our regular drummer is out sick."

[RH Draney]

On 5/24/2017 6:19 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Wed, 24 May 2017 14:07:59 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>>
>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>> what the AmE term is.
>
> Why would they be needed? Deaf people I know get by just fine, they
> either sign, or hold up a notice saying they're deaf, and people write
> things down on a notepad. A dog isn't going to be able to interpret
> English for them.

No, but a dog can alert the deaf person to things like a fire alarm
going off, or a siren that would keep a hearing person from stepping off
a curb into the path of a speeding emergency vehicle....r

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Seems like not enough reasons to have a dog with you at all times. Emergency vehicles have flashing lights anyway, so do fire alarms in places where there are deaf people.

--
Mary had a little lamb, it walked into a pylon. 10,000 volts went up its arse, and turned its wool to nylon.

[Tony Cooper]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 14:07:59 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com>
wrote:

>On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>
>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>
>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>
>Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>what the AmE term is.
>
>

A very unique American term: service dog.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[James Wilkinson Sword]

I would expect that to do mine sweeping duties.

--
"When one engine fails on a twin-engine aeroplane you always have enough power left to get you to the scene of the crash."

[GordonD]

*Very* unique? Tony, how could you?
--
Gordon Davie
Edinburgh, Scotland

[Tony Cooper]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 17:58:07 +0100, GordonD <g.d...@btinternet.com>
wrote:

It requires sticking the tongue firmly in the cheek when typing.

[Janet]

In article <f6dgvdx...@news.ducksburg.com>, a24...@ducksburg.com
says...

>
> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>
> > On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> >> "Seeing eye dog".
> >
> > Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>
> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
> what the AmE term is.

"Assistance dogs" is the term I keep seeing in UK
"No dogs, except assistance dogs".

Janet

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 24 May 2017 17:58:07 +0100, GordonD <g.d...@btinternet.com> wrote:

Can something not be unique if there are only two in the world?

--
What do you call kinky sex with chocolate?
S&M&M

[James Wilkinson Sword]

I've never seen that in Scotland. It's always "guide dogs", or a picture of one.

--
An elderly couple go to church one Sunday.
Halfway through the service, the wife leans over and whispers in her husband’s ear,
“I’ve just let out a silent fart. What do you think I should do?”
The husband replies, “Put a new battery in your hearing aid.”

[RH Draney]

On 5/24/2017 9:00 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Wed, 24 May 2017 16:43:06 +0100, Tony Cooper
> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> A very unique American term: service dog.
>
> I would expect that to do mine sweeping duties.

Not me...I'd expect it to check my oil, clean my windshield, and put air
in my tires....r

[James Wilkinson Sword]

My windshield is cleaned automatically, there are water jets fitted to my car. What century do you live in?

--
Saying that she is promiscuous is an understatement.
She'll go zero to sixty-nine in under fifteen seconds."

[Robert Bannister]

On 24/5/17 2:49 pm, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2017-05-24 02:59:53 +0000, Robert Bannister said:
>
>> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>
>> I've heard it in this country too.
>
> Did you hear the hyphen: Seeing-eye dog?

The Apple version is "seeing iDog".

[charles]

In article <op.y0rj5...@red.lan>, James Wilkinson Sword

<imv...@somewear.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 24 May 2017 20:10:52 +0100, RH Draney <dado...@cox.net> wrote:

> > On 5/24/2017 9:00 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> >> On Wed, 24 May 2017 16:43:06 +0100, Tony Cooper
> >> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> A very unique American term: service dog.
> >>
> >> I would expect that to do mine sweeping duties.
> >
> > Not me...I'd expect it to check my oil, clean my windshield, and put
> > air in my tires....r

> My windshield is cleaned automatically, there are water jets fitted to my
> car. What century do you live in?

Do they clean the whole windshield? or just the part the the wipers cover?

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

[GordonD]

On 24/05/2017 23:16, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Wed, 24 May 2017 20:10:52 +0100, RH Draney <dado...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>> On 5/24/2017 9:00 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> On Wed, 24 May 2017 16:43:06 +0100, Tony Cooper
>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> A very unique American term: service dog.
>>>
>>> I would expect that to do mine sweeping duties.
>>
>> Not me...I'd expect it to check my oil, clean my windshield, and put air
>> in my tires....r
>
> My windshield is cleaned automatically, there are water jets fitted to
> my car. What century do you live in?
>

'Windshield' is AmE. The proper BrE word is 'windscreen'.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

He was probably checking to see who would comment on it. (I noticed it
myself, but decided to let it pass, thinking it was probably
deliberate.)


--
athel

[Adam Funk]

Some are more unique than others.


--
Java is kind of like kindergarten. There are lots of rules you have to
remember. If you don't follow them, the compiler makes you sit in the
corner until you do. --- Don Raab

[Peter Moylan]

On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>
>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>
>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>
> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
> what the AmE term is.

My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW, Australia

[Peter Moylan]

I suppose I needn't mention what "service" usually means in animal
husbandry.

[Peter Moylan]

That would make them bique.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

"It was a unique building" is probably often used to describe something that there may well be another of somewhere, but it's bloody rare.

--
Girl with skirt up run faster than boy with trousers down!!

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Thu, 25 May 2017 12:01:35 +0100, Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

> On 2017-May-25 05:10, RH Draney wrote:
>> On 5/24/2017 9:00 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> On Wed, 24 May 2017 16:43:06 +0100, Tony Cooper
>>> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> A very unique American term: service dog.
>>>
>>> I would expect that to do mine sweeping duties.
>>
>> Not me...I'd expect it to check my oil, clean my windshield, and put air
>> in my tires....r
>
> I suppose I needn't mention what "service" usually means in animal
> husbandry.

And in the Wild West times, for humans too.

BTW Mr Draney, they're tyres. Tires are ones that have had enough for the day.

--
The true mark of a civilized society is when its citizens know how to hate each other peacefully.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Thu, 25 May 2017 11:59:43 +0100, Peter Moylan <pe...@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

> On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
>> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>>
>>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>
>>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>>
>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>> what the AmE term is.
>
> My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
> though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
> from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
> I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".

I always use the wrong term, as blind people can hear and deaf people can see, I tend to think of the thing they CAN do rather than the thing they can't. So I'd refer to a blind person needing subtitles.

--
In 1272, the Arabic Muslims invented the condom, using a goat's lower intestine.
In 1873, the British refined the idea by taking the intestine out of the goat first.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

I know, but I was using the word already there so the American would understand.

--
What did God say when he made the first black man? "Damn, I burnt one."

[James Wilkinson Sword]

That's enough.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Thu, 25 May 2017 03:41:20 +0100, Robert Bannister <robertb...@iprimus.com.au> wrote:

> On 24/5/17 2:49 pm, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>> On 2017-05-24 02:59:53 +0000, Robert Bannister said:
>>
>>> On 23/5/17 9:50 pm, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>
>>> I've heard it in this country too.
>>
>> Did you hear the hyphen: Seeing-eye dog?
>
> The Apple version is "seeing iDog".

https://youtu.be/rw2nkoGLhrE

--
When I told my mum I was going to buy a motorbike she went crazy:
"Don't you remember what happened to your brother? He was killed on one! Why would you want to buy one when you could just have his?"

[RH Draney]

On 5/25/2017 5:27 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>
> BTW Mr Draney, they're tyres. Tires are ones that have had enough for
> the day.

Save it for Pericles....r

[James Wilkinson Sword]

He died 2446 years ago. And I doubt he used either word as they weren't invented and he spoke Greek.

--
Contrary to popular belief, the most dangerous animal is not the lion or the tiger. The most dangerous animal is a shark riding on an elephant, trampling and eating everything it sees.

[Charles Bishop]

In article <5641a751...@candehope.me.uk>,

And how is the windshield cleaned automatically. It senses when it needs
to be cleaned and turns the cleaning mechanism on?

--
charles

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Pressing the button is easier than stopping and asking someone to do it, then waiting for them to do it.

--
Her voice had that tense grating quality, like a first-generation thermal paper fax machine that needed a band tightened.

[Tony Cooper]

To ease your mind on the "probably" front, it was a deliberate choice
meant to emphasize that we use the same term that y'all use. In
stating that, it should be obvious that we aren't using a "unique"
term, let alone a "very unique" term.

I hope that this explanation clears thing up. I wouldn't want it to
become the epicenter of further controversy, but that's still up in
the air.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

It's confused my alcohol-ridden mind even further.

--
The sailor does not pray for wind, he learns to sail -- Gustaf Lindborg

[Quinn C]

* Peter Moylan:

And one-clawed lobster gives us unisque?

--
The only BS around here is butternut squash, one of the dozens of
varieties of squash I grow. I hope you like squash.
-- Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, S01E10

[Adam Funk]

On 2017-05-25, Peter Moylan wrote:

> On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
>> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>>
>>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>
>>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>>
>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>> what the AmE term is.
>
> My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
> though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
> from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
> I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".

Do they read them out at a fairly high speed? Years ago I knew some
people with experience in digital replacements for "books on tape", &
they told me that blind people like to turn the speed up to the
fastest setting they can understand (in order to maximize the
information input, in effect).


--
Mandrake, have you never wondered why I drink only distilled water,
or rain water, and only pure grain alcohol? --- General Ripper

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Wed, 31 May 2017 15:18:42 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:

> On 2017-05-25, Peter Moylan wrote:
>
>> On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
>>> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>>
>>>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>>>
>>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>>> what the AmE term is.
>>
>> My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
>> though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
>> from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
>> I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".
>
> Do they read them out at a fairly high speed? Years ago I knew some
> people with experience in digital replacements for "books on tape", &
> they told me that blind people like to turn the speed up to the
> fastest setting they can understand (in order to maximize the
> information input, in effect).

Well when I read a book (I'm not blind), I read it faster than I could speak the words aloud. So I guess I'd want it read to me fast too.

--
A man is a person who will pay two dollars for a one-dollar item he wants.
A woman will pay one dollar for a two-dollar item that she doesn't want.

[GordonD]

On 31/05/2017 16:51, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Wed, 31 May 2017 15:18:42 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2017-05-25, Peter Moylan wrote:
>>
>>> On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
>>>> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>>>
>>>>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>>>>
>>>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>>>> what the AmE term is.
>>>
>>> My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
>>> though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
>>> from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
>>> I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".
>>
>> Do they read them out at a fairly high speed? Years ago I knew some
>> people with experience in digital replacements for "books on tape", &
>> they told me that blind people like to turn the speed up to the
>> fastest setting they can understand (in order to maximize the
>> information input, in effect).
>
> Well when I read a book (I'm not blind), I read it faster than I could
> speak the words aloud. So I guess I'd want it read to me fast too.
>

Can't take you very long to get through "Run, Spot, run!" then...

[James Wilkinson Sword]

OY! I could read before I started school.

--
Why does a one-story brothel make more money than a two-story brothel?
Because there's no fucking overhead.

[Peter Moylan]

On 01/06/17 00:18, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2017-05-25, Peter Moylan wrote:
>
>> On 2017-May-24 23:07, Adam Funk wrote:
>>> On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>>>> "Seeing eye dog".
>>>>
>>>> Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>>>
>>> Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>>> what the AmE term is.
>>
>> My wife likes to listen to a "radio for the blind" radio station, even
>> though she's not blind. They do things like reading out daily papers
>> from cover to cover. (I suppose they skip things like the advertising.)
>> I keep getting confused and calling it "the deaf radio".
>
> Do they read them out at a fairly high speed? Years ago I knew some
> people with experience in digital replacements for "books on tape", &
> they told me that blind people like to turn the speed up to the
> fastest setting they can understand (in order to maximize the
> information input, in effect).

No, it's what I would call a typical reading-out-loud speed. Very
occasionally I've heard them reading the same newspaper article as I was
reading, and then I'd get to the end of the article while they were
still in the early part.

I think the people doing the reading are volunteers rather than trained
radio presenters, because they stumble now and then. Speeding up the
presentation without tripping over one's tongue would, I imagine,
require a good deal of training.

[Cheryl]

The app I use for audio books allows me to adjust the speed. Mostly I
don't bother, but I have had one or two situations in which I thought
the reader was simply going to slow. I found it a little tricky to get a
speed that I enjoyed if it wasn't there by default.

--
Cheryl

[Peter T. Daniels]

Many years ago (summer of 1971), I was a volunteer at Reading for the Blind,
which recorded books-on-tape: they took requests. Unfortunately one was only
allowed to participate one day a week, and a session was limited, IIRC, to 1
hour, so that a book would be read by many voices (I thought that would be
distracting). Mistakes were not tolerated. There was a reader in the little
room with the microphone, and a monitor following along in a second copy of
the book. If there was a mistake or a cough, the tape was backed up and the
sentence read again. A beep was inserted to mark page turns (I don't remember
whether the reader or the monitor pushed the button). "Monitor" was harder
than "Reader," and it probably wasn't until my second week that I put in a
"Monitor" hour alongside the "Reader" hour.

I was given mostly "grammar" textbooks -- anathema to the linguistics major.
I remember stopping at a section end or some such and expostulating to the
monitor that what I was reading was utter nonsense!

I couldn't do music texts because the reader was expected to play the musical
examples on the piano.

This was long, long before the audiobooks industry.

By the time I got to know a blind person, he was using highly advanced (for its
time) text-to-speech software that read out loud books laid on the flatbed
scanner, with very great accuracy -- such equipment was not yet commercially
available. As a corolloary, it had amazingly fast OCR and I was able to scan a
book to a text file almost as fast as I could pick it up and turn the pages.

As for speeded-up reading, my first DVD player when running at 2x speed played
the sound at proper pitch, twice as fast, fully intelligible. With 4x and faster
it went silent.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

I've always hated that such devices silence the audio. I'm watching the video much faster, I want to hear the audio fast too. I watch everything through my computer using VLC media player, and that allows audio at any speed (with no pitch change). It's far easier to keep up with where you want to stop fast forwarding.

--
It is OK to let your mind go blank, but please turn off the sound.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Surely they could record it slow then feed it through a digital editor to speed it up?

--
If our service isn't up to your standards, please lower your standards.

[Nehmo Sergheyev]

On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 at 1:04:14 PM UTC-5, Janet wrote:
> In article <f6dgvdx...@news.ducksburg.com>, a24...@ducksburg.com
> says...

> >
> > On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
> >
> > > On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> > >> "Seeing eye dog".
> > >
> > > Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
> >
> > Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
> > what the AmE term is.
>

> "Assistance dogs" is the term I keep seeing in UK
> "No dogs, except assistance dogs".
>
In the US, "Service Dog" is the most common label, but people would understand "Assistance Dog" or even "Working Dog".

The problem arises from people who are not friendly to dogs and want to object to the expanding use of assistance animals. Nowadays, people with emotional disabilities can legitimately be accompanied by animals who help these people cope. The anti-dog crowd sees this as a loophole and doesn't approve of the development.

The 3 relevant federal laws use different terms:

The American with Disabilities Act (of the US) uses the term "Service Animal" https://www.ada.gov/service_animals_2010.htm .

The term “Assistance Animal” is used in the Fair Housing Act (of the US). http://www.humanesociety.org/animals/resources/tips/assistance-animals-tenants-rights.html?referrer=https://www.google.com/

"Differences between service animals and assistance animals
Service animals are categorized as animals trained to do a specific task for their owner. The most common example is a guide dog. Service animals are allowed in public accommodations because of the owner’s need for the animal at all times.
An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the animal as an assistance animal."

And the term “service animal” is used in the Air Carrier Access Act (of the US) http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanimals.html

The individual states have their own laws https://www.animallaw.info/topic/table-state-assistance-animal-laws .

[RH Draney]

On 6/1/2017 3:48 PM, Nehmo Sergheyev wrote:

> An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the animal as an assistance animal."
>
> And the term “service animal” is used in the Air Carrier Access Act (of the US) http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanimals.html

I won't fly on any carrier that won't let me travel with my emotional
support rhinoceros....r

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Thu, 01 Jun 2017 23:48:31 +0100, Nehmo Sergheyev <neh...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 at 1:04:14 PM UTC-5, Janet wrote:
>> In article <f6dgvdx...@news.ducksburg.com>, a24...@ducksburg.com
>> says...
>> >
>> > On 2017-05-24, RH Draney wrote:
>> >
>> > > On 5/23/2017 6:50 AM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>> > >> "Seeing eye dog".
>> > >
>> > > Your hyphen fell out; it's "seeing-eye dog"....
>> >
>> > Service dogs for the deaf do exist, but they are rare --- I'm not sure
>> > what the AmE term is.
>>
>> "Assistance dogs" is the term I keep seeing in UK
>> "No dogs, except assistance dogs".
>>
> In the US, "Service Dog" is the most common label, but people would understand "Assistance Dog" or even "Working Dog".

If you said you had a working dog, I'd think it was a sheepdog etc.

--
Why was the "pap smear" called that?
If it'd been called the "Cunt Scrape," no one would ever have it done.

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Your wife?

--
It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye, then it's fun and games that you can't see anymore.

[Adam Funk]

Perrin's mother-in-law?


--
The Nixon I remembered was absolutely humorless; I couldn't imagine
him laughing at anything except maybe a paraplegic who wanted to vote
Democratic but couldn't quite reach the lever on the voting machine.
--- Hunter S Thompson

[GordonD]

On 02/06/2017 10:23, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2017-06-01, RH Draney wrote:
>
>> On 6/1/2017 3:48 PM, Nehmo Sergheyev wrote:
>>
>>> An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the animal as an assistance animal."
>>>
>>> And the term “service animal” is used in the Air Carrier Access Act (of the US) http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanimals.html
>>
>> I won't fly on any carrier that won't let me travel with my emotional
>> support rhinoceros....r
>
> Perrin's mother-in-law?
>
>

She was a hippo.

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

"Of course sir, but you'll have to travel in the hold.

First we need to weigh you and your friend..."

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Adam Funk]

Doh!


--
When a man tells you that he got rich through hard work, ask him
whose? --- Don Marquis

[James Wilkinson Sword]

The deputy head at the school I worked at was called hippo. She was bloody huge. And an old fashioned prude. She thought bikinis were pornography. She went fucking ballistic when I deleted the evidence she was going to use to expel one of the boys. When I say deleted, I kept a copy for myself, it was pretty good porn.

--
You can listen to thunder after lightning to tell how close you came to getting hit. If you don't hear it nevermind.

[Sam Plusnet]

As you wish, but whales makes such soothing sounds.

--
Sam Plusnet

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Estimate the number of gallons of fuel required to carry a whale on a plane.

--
Three guys go to a ski lodge, and there aren't enough rooms, so they have to share a bed. In the middle of the night, the guy on the right wakes up and says, "I had this wild, vivid dream of getting a hand job!" The guy on the left wakes up, and unbelievably, he's had the same dream, too. Then the guy in the middle wakes up and says, "That's funny, I dreamt I was skiing!"

[bill van]

In article <b6ydnfMAuMJNX6zE...@brightview.co.uk>,

But their tanks are hardly portable.
--
bill

[James Wilkinson Sword]

On Fri, 02 Jun 2017 22:24:59 +0100, bill van <bil...@delete.shaw.ca> wrote:

> In article <b6ydnfMAuMJNX6zE...@brightview.co.uk>,
> Sam Plusnet <n...@home.com> wrote:
>
>> On 01/06/2017 23:57, RH Draney wrote:
>> > On 6/1/2017 3:48 PM, Nehmo Sergheyev wrote:
>> >
>> >> An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion
>> >> animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The
>> >> emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home
>> >> are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a
>> >> medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the
>> >> animal as an assistance animal."
>> >>

>> >> And the term “service animal†is used in the Air Carrier Access Act

>> >> (of the US)
>> >> http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanima
>> >> ls.html
>> >
>> > I won't fly on any carrier that won't let me travel with my emotional
>> > support rhinoceros....r
>>
>> As you wish, but whales makes such soothing sounds.
>
> But their tanks are hardly portable.

<yank>
Depends how big your truck is.
</yank>

In the rest of the world, a truck is a 50 tonne vehicle, usually articulated, used to transport large products around. What you think is a truck is actually a 4x4. A big car.

--
Eighty percent of married men cheat in America. The rest cheat in Europe.

[Sam Plusnet]

On 02/06/2017 22:24, bill van wrote:
> In article <b6ydnfMAuMJNX6zE...@brightview.co.uk>,
> Sam Plusnet <n...@home.com> wrote:
>
>> On 01/06/2017 23:57, RH Draney wrote:
>>> On 6/1/2017 3:48 PM, Nehmo Sergheyev wrote:
>>>
>>>> An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion
>>>> animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The
>>>> emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home
>>>> are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a
>>>> medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the
>>>> animal as an assistance animal."
>>>>

>>>> And the term “service animal†is used in the Air Carrier Access Act

>>>> (of the US)
>>>> http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanima
>>>> ls.html
>>>
>>> I won't fly on any carrier that won't let me travel with my emotional
>>> support rhinoceros....r
>>
>> As you wish, but whales makes such soothing sounds.
>
> But their tanks are hardly portable.
>

I leave the details to others.

--
Sam Plusnet

[Robert Bannister]

On 3/6/17 3:58 am, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Fri, 02 Jun 2017 20:56:02 +0100, Sam Plusnet <n...@home.com> wrote:
>
>> On 01/06/2017 23:57, RH Draney wrote:
>>> On 6/1/2017 3:48 PM, Nehmo Sergheyev wrote:
>>>
>>>> An assistance animal can be a cat, dog or other type of companion
>>>> animal, and does not need to be trained to perform a service. The
>>>> emotional and/or physical benefits from the animal living in the home
>>>> are what qualify the animal as an assistance animal. A letter from a
>>>> medical doctor or therapist is all that is needed to classify the
>>>> animal as an assistance animal."
>>>>
>>>> And the term “service animal” is used in the Air Carrier Access Act
>>>> (of the US)
>>>> http://www.southwestada.org/html/topical/aircarrier/aircarrier_serviceanimals.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I won't fly on any carrier that won't let me travel with my emotional
>>> support rhinoceros....r
>>
>> As you wish, but whales makes such soothing sounds.
>
> Estimate the number of gallons of fuel required to carry a whale on a
> plane.

> It's not the fuel that's the problem. It's the water.

--
Robert B. born England a long time ago;
Western Australia since 1972

[James Wilkinson Sword]

[ear trumpet]

--
Paddy takes his new wife to bed on their wedding night.
She undresses, lies on the bed spread-eagled and says
"You know what I want, don't you?"
"Yeah," says Paddy. "The whole flipping bed by the looks of it!"

[Janet]

In article <9c304323-b67f-4f60...@googlegroups.com>,
neh...@hotmail.com says...
> Subject: Re: Annoying American expressions number 472
> From: Nehmo Sergheyev <neh...@hotmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.usage.english

>
> On Wednesday, May 24, 2017 at 1:04:14 PM UTC-5, Janet wrote:

> > [quoted text muted]

> > > what the AmE term is.
> >
> > "Assistance dogs" is the term I keep seeing in UK
> > "No dogs, except assistance dogs".
> >
> In the US, "Service Dog" is the most common label, but people would understand "Assistance Dog" or
> even "Working Dog".

In Br.E "working dog" is used of police dogs, sheep-dogs, search
and rescue dogs, retrievers (of shot game).

Janet.

[David Kleinecke]

Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?

[Janet]

In article <ee76a808-643b-489e...@googlegroups.com>,
dklei...@gmail.com says...

Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely a hobby activity
here.

Janet.

[Peter T. Daniels]

I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?

Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.

[Jack Campin]

>>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
>> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
>> a hobby activity here.
> I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
> Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.

For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
perhaps.

I recently met somebody who worked by dog team in Antarctica in
the 1960s. They seem to have been better company than tractors.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
e m a i l : j a c k @ c a m p i n . m e . u k
Jack Campin, 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU, Scotland
mobile 07895 860 060 <http://www.campin.me.uk> Twitter: JackCampin

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Saturday, June 3, 2017 at 4:49:16 PM UTC-4, Jack Campin wrote:
> >>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
> >> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
> >> a hobby activity here.
> > I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
> > Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.
>
> For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
> in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
> sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
> perhaps.

Sound effects? In a symphony?? I haven't seen the movie. Do the dogs bark?

[Tony Cooper]

On Sat, 3 Jun 2017 14:51:40 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"
<gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

>On Saturday, June 3, 2017 at 4:49:16 PM UTC-4, Jack Campin wrote:
>> >>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
>> >> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
>> >> a hobby activity here.
>> > I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
>> > Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.
>>
>> For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
>> in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
>> sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
>> perhaps.
>
>Sound effects? In a symphony??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNatwyAJ6dI
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

[Jack Campin]

> > >>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
> > >> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
> > >> a hobby activity here.
> > > I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
> > > Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.
> > For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
> > in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
> > sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
> > perhaps.
> Sound effects? In a symphony?? I haven't seen the movie. Do the dogs bark?

I haven't seen the movie either - it was made long enough ago that
they probably couldn't afford to feature much livestock. There is
a wind machine in the symphony.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Leave it to Tony to grab the wrong end of the stick.

The 1812 Overture, let alone the brief excerpt provided in that clip,
is not a symphony, and rare these days is an outdoor performance that
doesn't feature cannons provided by the local National Guard.

The Grant Park Symphony ended the Third of July concert every year
with fireworks accompanying the cannon (and continuing after the end
of the music).

Cornell's Symphonic Band did it one time on Libe Slope (the hillside
below the old library) with not only cannon courtesy of the ROTC, but
actual carillon bells from the actual McGraw Tower adjacent.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 3 Jun 2017 15:20:45 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

Papa Leopold with bird sounds:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fHvOy33COU

[James Wilkinson Sword]

Where do they do it? Considering we have fuck all snow.

--
A hand job a day keeps arthritis away.

[Jack Campin]

>>>>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
>>>> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
>>>> a hobby activity here.
>>> I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
>>> Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.
>> For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
>> in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
>> sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
>> perhaps.
> Sound effects? In a symphony??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinfonia_antartica

The wind machine is clearly audible in every recording I've heard.
The score is PD if you live in Canada - it's on IMSLP. So you can
see for yourself what Vaughan Williams wanted it to do, though it's
about 150 pages long. And there is also a wind machine in Derek
Bourgeois's Symphony no65 op306.

Sound effects in symphonies go some way back - think of Mahler 6
with the cowbells and hammer. Shostakovich 2 has a factory siren.

[Sam Plusnet]

Unfortunately we have completely failed to hold any Antarctic (or indeed
Arctic) expeditions within the UK.

Geography is against us.

--
Sam Plusnet

[Sam Plusnet]

On 03/06/2017 23:20, Peter T. Daniels wrote:

> The 1812 Overture, let alone the brief excerpt provided in that clip,
> is not a symphony, and rare these days is an outdoor performance that
> doesn't feature cannons provided by the local National Guard.

Just a tad US-centric?

Performances of the 1812 outside the US are unlikely to feature the
local National Guard


--
Sam Plusnet

[Peter T. Daniels]

"Toy Symphony" was a popular genre.

And Respighi specified a particular birdsong album to be played during "The
Pines of Rome." Also not a symphony.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Saturday, June 3, 2017 at 7:23:43 PM UTC-4, Jack Campin wrote:
> >>>>> Are dogs that pull sleds considered "working dogs"?
> >>>> Probably not in UK, because dogsledding is purely
> >>>> a hobby activity here.
> >>> I think some of the Antarctic expeditions were British?
> >>> Resulting in Vaughan Williams's Sinfonia Antartica.
> >> For some reason he totally omitted any sonic reference to dogs
> >> in that. A wind machine but no dogs-barking sound effects (or
> >> sporadic bangs to mark ponies being shot). Time for a rewrite,
> >> perhaps.
> > Sound effects? In a symphony??
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinfonia_antartica
>
> The wind machine is clearly audible in every recording I've heard.
> The score is PD if you live in Canada - it's on IMSLP. So you can
> see for yourself what Vaughan Williams wanted it to do, though it's
> about 150 pages long. And there is also a wind machine in Derek
> Bourgeois's Symphony no65 op306.

What he "wanted to do" was to pull down a few quid by turning a movie score
into a symphonic work. There was no such thing as a "soundtrack album" in
those days, and no one expected old movies to be shown again after their
first run, so all the music would be wasted.

> Sound effects in symphonies go some way back - think of Mahler 6
> with the cowbells and hammer. Shostakovich 2 has a factory siren.

Cowbells and hammer were both respectable percussion instruments of the orchestra.

[Peter T. Daniels]

Do you have restrictions on setting off blanks in public, or something?

[RH Draney]

And then in the mid-20th century, along came Leroy Anderson:

https://youtu.be/naxsn5ymZI4

....r

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 3 Jun 2017 20:05:49 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

I should just ignore you and move on, but it concerns me when you post
incorrect information. I think you just hastily picked up a wrong
term from Google.

"Genre" is a class or category of artistic composition. There is only
one "Toy Symphony".

[GordonD]

The sledges have wheels. They used to have an event in Holyrood Park
every New Year's Day.
--
Gordon Davie
Edinburgh, Scotland

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

I think the point is that "National Guard" is a US name. Other countries
either don't have a National Guard or if they do it is a different type
of organisation from the US National Guard.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Peter T. Daniels]

Maybe you came to classical music after CD stores disappeared, so
browsing has not been available to you. Toy Symphonies were very popular in the
Rococo era -- C. P. E. Bach committed one or some, as well.

[Peter T. Daniels]

And my next paragraph described a performance involving the Cornell ROTC, also
not the National Guard. Don't complain to me if Sam won't extrapolate!

[Janet]

In article <979e08f0-0f46-4052...@googlegroups.com>,
gram...@verizon.net says...

Yes. But dogsledding here in UK bears no relation to long distance icy
haulage. and rarely involves snow :-)

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/feb/07/born-to-run-dog-
sledding-uk-huskies

Janet

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

In fact, snow might hamper the progress of the "sleds".

> https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/feb/07/born-to-run-dog-
>sledding-uk-huskies
>
> Janet
Image from the website of the company mentioned in that article, showing
a three-wheeled "sled" pulled by a husky followed by a bicycle pulled by
two huskies:
http://www.arcticquest.co.uk/public/images/banner/home.jpg

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 07:08:55 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

Complete bullshit, Daniels. The point is that there is no
"Toy Symphony" genre.

I was actively listening to classical music before you were born, boy.
I was obsessed with Bach's Double Violin Concerto in D minor (BWV
1043) when I was nine years old. I had a stack of 78 rpm vinyl disks
- all classical - given to me by a family friend.

I would have liked to have heard E. Power Biggs play this on the
Flentrop tracker at the Busch-Reisinger Museum, Harvard University.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZQ--KHn21A

(I love classical organ. You will probably know this as music from the
movie, "Casino")

[Peter T. Daniels]

Try looking in a music encyclopedia.

> I was actively listening to classical music before you were born, boy.
> I was obsessed with Bach's Double Violin Concerto in D minor (BWV
> 1043) when I was nine years old. I had a stack of 78 rpm vinyl disks
> - all classical - given to me by a family friend.
>
> I would have liked to have heard E. Power Biggs play this on the
> Flentrop tracker at the Busch-Reisinger Museum, Harvard University.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZQ--KHn21A
>
> (I love classical organ. You will probably know this as music from the
> movie, "Casino")

I'm not sure I've ever heard of that movie -- certainly haven't seen it --
but I outgrew E. Power Biggs's approach to Bach as soon as I encountered organists
who knew what they were doing, in terms of historical practices and appropriate
timbres. That was upon arriving in college in 1968.

The Flentrop was a decent guess in 1955 or so. We know much more now.

Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's Organ Symphony
with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at. His pedal-harpsichord
attack on Schubert's Marche Militaire is hilarious.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 10:42:09 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

You fraud. Post your reference!

>> I was actively listening to classical music before you were born, boy.
>> I was obsessed with Bach's Double Violin Concerto in D minor (BWV
>> 1043) when I was nine years old. I had a stack of 78 rpm vinyl disks
>> - all classical - given to me by a family friend.
>>
>> I would have liked to have heard E. Power Biggs play this on the
>> Flentrop tracker at the Busch-Reisinger Museum, Harvard University.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZQ--KHn21A
>>
>> (I love classical organ. You will probably know this as music from the
>> movie, "Casino")
>
>I'm not sure I've ever heard of that movie -- certainly haven't seen it --
>but I outgrew E. Power Biggs's approach to Bach as soon as I encountered organists
>who knew what they were doing, in terms of historical practices and appropriate
>timbres. That was upon arriving in college in 1968.
>
>The Flentrop was a decent guess in 1955 or so. We know much more now.
>
>Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's Organ Symphony
>with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at. His pedal-harpsichord
>attack on Schubert's Marche Militaire is hilarious.

I see Google must have been smoking. You're a fraud. How can anybody
believe anything you say?

[Jack Campin]

> Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's
> Organ Symphony with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at.

His recording of the Bartok Concerto for Orchestra was by far the
best available for many years and still holds up pretty well.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sun, 04 Jun 2017 19:11:06 +0100, Jack Campin
<bo...@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>> Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's
>> Organ Symphony with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at.
>
>His recording of the Bartok Concerto for Orchestra was by far the
>best available for many years and still holds up pretty well.

This is his classic recording, I think. I do believe that he captured
the soul of JSB.

It has been re-released several times over the decades.

https://www.discogs.com/E-Power-Biggs-Bach-Bach-Organ-Favorites/release/2243923

He is sitting at the Harvard Flentrop. The organ is one of the finest
examples of a Baroque tracker in the world.

http://www.hcs.harvard.edu/organ/organs.php

[Peter T. Daniels]

The 1910 edition of Grove's Dictionary has an entry naming Haydn (i.e., Leopold's),
Mendelssohn, etc. The 1980 New Grove doesn't have an entry under "Toy Symphony"
and since I don't have all the volumes, I can't check other possibilities.

> >> I was actively listening to classical music before you were born, boy.
> >> I was obsessed with Bach's Double Violin Concerto in D minor (BWV
> >> 1043) when I was nine years old. I had a stack of 78 rpm vinyl disks
> >> - all classical - given to me by a family friend.
> >>
> >> I would have liked to have heard E. Power Biggs play this on the
> >> Flentrop tracker at the Busch-Reisinger Museum, Harvard University.
> >>
> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZQ--KHn21A
> >>
> >> (I love classical organ. You will probably know this as music from the
> >> movie, "Casino")
> >
> >I'm not sure I've ever heard of that movie -- certainly haven't seen it --
> >but I outgrew E. Power Biggs's approach to Bach as soon as I encountered organists
> >who knew what they were doing, in terms of historical practices and appropriate
> >timbres. That was upon arriving in college in 1968.
> >
> >The Flentrop was a decent guess in 1955 or so. We know much more now.
> >
> >Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's Organ Symphony
> >with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at. His pedal-harpsichord
> >attack on Schubert's Marche Militaire is hilarious.
>
> I see Google must have been smoking.

What would Google have to do with it???

You're a fraud. How can anybody
> believe anything you say?

In 1968, there was a Schlicker in Bailey Hall, the main concert hall, that
replaced the grand 1913 organ that had been destroyed in a flood (when someone
idiotically turned on the blower while it was under water). The Schlicker was
monumentally unsuited to the large concert hall, or to use with orchestral works,
and when the university bookstore moved out of Barnes Hall, the former chapel
in Barnes Hall was converted to a recital hall and the Schlicker worked
perfectly there. (Though it's since been removed.)

Sage Chapel has a 1940 Aeolian-Skinner, based on the 1909 E. M. Skinner, and
it's remarkable versatile. Sometimes I'd hang around when Mr. Strauss was
tuning it. (Yes, the small town of Ithaca, New York, could support a full-time
professional organ tuner.)

Just after I graduated, an Adam, IIRC, French Baroque
instrument was installed in the Annabel Taylor Chapel; I heard it a year or
two later; Mr. Paterson, our Organist and Choirmaser, was a specialist in French
Baroque organ music and also participated in the dedicatory recital series at
St. Thomas's on Fifth Avenue (NYC) when the same builder installed a similar
instrument in the balcony, complementing the Aeolian-Skinner in the chancel.

In Chicago, I mostly heard the E. M. Skinner in Rockefeller Chapel, though the
Organ Historical Society had its national convention in Chicago in 1986 or
so, so I heard historic instruments all over the city in free recitals. (That
was before the OHS started putting out CD sets of representative pieces
on each of the organs they visited -- there's a Chicago set from years later but
it seems not to have hit equally old instruments.)

Medinah Temple had an organ excellently suited for orchestra work --
you can hear it in Reiner's Also Sprach Zarathustra (only recently is there
an organ in Orchestra Hall). The only time I heard it was in Mahler's Eighth
in 1997. Medinah Temple is now a department store and I've no idea what happened
to the organ. Clearly they had no notion of doing a Wanamaker's and drawing
in customers with daily organ recitals (the New York store, which burned up in 1955,
had an organ too, but not as elaborate as the Philadelphia one.)

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sun, 4 Jun 2017 11:30:12 -0700 (PDT), "Peter T. Daniels"

You said:

>"The Flentrop was a decent guess in 1955 or so. We know much more now."

If you were not a fraud, you would know that the Harvard Flentrop is
one of the best examples of a Baroque tracker in the world.

"The instrument is in classic "Werk-prinzip" formation, that is to
say, each division is clearly delineated architecturally. The Great
manual (Hoofdwerk) is in the middle on top, with the Brustwerk
underneath. The big pedal pipes are in towers on either side, and the
Rückpositiv (which in England used to be called the "Chaire" organ) is
on the front of the gallery, behind the organist's seat. The stops are
all those which Bach would have known, and the connection between keys
and pipes is entirely mechanical ("Tracker")—unlike the G. Donald
Harrison instrument, which had electric action. The pipes, voiced on
low wind pressure and placed on the historic form of slider chests,
have a gentle, alive quality of sound, and the open-toe, unnicked
voicing gives an articulate quality. This instrument was among the
first examples (and for many years by far the most prominent) of the
"Baroque" or historical organ revival; Flentrop subsequently installed
many other instruments throughout the United States. This organ
therefore had and continues to have a profound effect on organ
building and organ playing throughout this country."

http://www.hcs.harvard.edu/organ/organs.php

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Sunday, June 4, 2017 at 2:24:46 PM UTC-4, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Sun, 04 Jun 2017 19:11:06 +0100, Jack Campin
> <bo...@purr.demon.co.uk> wrote:

[no, I did]

> >> Maybe the only decent recording Ormandy ever made was Saint-Saens's
> >> Organ Symphony with Biggs. That was the kind of thing he was good at.
> >His recording of the Bartok Concerto for Orchestra was by far the
> >best available for many years and still holds up pretty well.
>
> This is his classic recording, I think. I do believe that he captured
> the soul of JSB.
>
> It has been re-released several times over the decades.

Of course. Columbia/CBS/Sony/BMG knows that naive buyers have heard of certain
names, so they keep reprinting them. Authentic organ performances of JSB (the
complete works, not just a handful of warhorses) are available on many European
labels. Most of them use the instruments he knew.

> https://www.discogs.com/E-Power-Biggs-Bach-Bach-Organ-Favorites/release/2243923
>
> He is sitting at the Harvard Flentrop. The organ is one of the finest
> examples of a Baroque tracker in the world.
>
> http://www.hcs.harvard.edu/organ/organs.php

Fifty years ago it was.