Plural of "Lord Lieutenant"

[Guy Barry]

Well there's a turn-up for the book. After a lifetime of believing that the
plural of "Lord Lieutenant" was "Lords Lieutenant", I have just learned that
the correct plural is "Lord-Lieutenants":

http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/OfficialRoyalposts/LordLieutenants
/LordLieutenants.aspx

This was revealed in a trail for a BBC Radio 4 programme about the office,
which will be broadcast shortly. Not that I suppose that anyone outside the
UK (or indeed most people within the UK) either knows or cares what a Lord
Lieutenant is, but it came as something of a surprise to me. I shall listen
avidly to find out the reason.

--
Guy Barry

[Harrison Hill]

On Aug 8, 8:39 am, "Guy Barry" <guy.ba...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> Well there's a turn-up for the book.  After a lifetime of believing that the
> plural of "Lord Lieutenant" was "Lords Lieutenant", I have just learned that
> the correct plural is "Lord-Lieutenants":
>

> http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/OfficialRoyalposts/LordLieu...

>
> This was revealed in a trail for a BBC Radio 4 programme about the office,
> which will be broadcast shortly.  Not that I suppose that anyone outside the
> UK (or indeed most people within the UK) either knows or cares what a Lord
> Lieutenant is, but it came as something of a surprise to me.  I shall listen
> avidly to find out the reason.
>
> --
> Guy Barry

Your link doesn't link, but it seems you are in for another shock,
because you have missed out the hyphen!

http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/OfficialRoyalposts/LordLieutenants/LordLieutenants.aspx

http://tinyurl.com/cpk9gkb

If he were a "Lord" it would be "Lords Lieutenant" but because he is a
"Lieutenant" the "lord" part is adjectival.

[Harrison Hill]

On Aug 8, 10:13 am, Harrison Hill <harrisonhill2...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Aug 8, 8:39 am, "Guy Barry" <guy.ba...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Well there's a turn-up for the book.  After a lifetime of believing that the
> > plural of "Lord Lieutenant" was "Lords Lieutenant", I have just learned that
> > the correct plural is "Lord-Lieutenants":
>
> >http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/OfficialRoyalposts/LordLieu...
>
> > This was revealed in a trail for a BBC Radio 4 programme about the office,
> > which will be broadcast shortly.  Not that I suppose that anyone outside the
> > UK (or indeed most people within the UK) either knows or cares what a Lord
> > Lieutenant is, but it came as something of a surprise to me.  I shall listen
> > avidly to find out the reason.
>
> > --
> > Guy Barry
>
> Your link doesn't link, but it seems you are in for another shock,
> because you have missed out the hyphen!

Or at least wrong-headed people with poor eyesight would see it that
way.

[bob]

On Aug 8, 9:39 am, "Guy Barry" <guy.ba...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
> Well there's a turn-up for the book.  After a lifetime of believing that the
> plural of "Lord Lieutenant" was "Lords Lieutenant", I have just learned that
> the correct plural is "Lord-Lieutenants":
>

> http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/OfficialRoyalposts/LordLieu...

>
> This was revealed in a trail for a BBC Radio 4 programme about the office,
> which will be broadcast shortly.  Not that I suppose that anyone outside the
> UK (or indeed most people within the UK) either knows or cares what a Lord
> Lieutenant is, but it came as something of a surprise to me.  I shall listen
> avidly to find out the reason.

It seems odd because in other forms, the lord is the part that becomes
plural such as lords spiritual, law lords or lords chief justice.
What is the correct way to make the plural of Lieutenant Governor?

Robin

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

As it is in "Lord Mayor".

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Guy Barry]

"Harrison Hill" <harrison...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:86da904e-2dfa-40f4...@y1g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...

> If he were a "Lord" it would be "Lords Lieutenant" but because he is a
> "Lieutenant" the "lord" part is adjectival.

Well I know now. Apparently in the 1920s a group of them started to insist
on the title "Lords Lieutenant" on the grounds that they were "Lords".
However, they're not members of the House of Lords, and so the title was
hyphenated in order to make clear that the main noun was "Lieutenant" and
not "Lord". How peculiarly British!

--
Guy Barry

[Adam Funk]

So what is the signifance of the "Lord" part?


--
Master Foo said: "A man who mistakes secrets for knowledge is like
a man who, seeking light, hugs a candle so closely that he smothers
it and burns his hand." --- Eric Raymond

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Wed, 08 Aug 2012 18:34:25 +0100, Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com>
wrote:

>On 2012-08-08, Guy Barry wrote:
>
>>
>> "Harrison Hill" <harrison...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:86da904e-2dfa-40f4...@y1g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> If he were a "Lord" it would be "Lords Lieutenant" but because he is a
>>> "Lieutenant" the "lord" part is adjectival.
>>
>> Well I know now. Apparently in the 1920s a group of them started to insist
>> on the title "Lords Lieutenant" on the grounds that they were "Lords".
>> However, they're not members of the House of Lords, and so the title was
>> hyphenated in order to make clear that the main noun was "Lieutenant" and
>> not "Lord". How peculiarly British!
>
>
>So what is the signifance of the "Lord" part?

I think that originally the person appointed to the office of Lord
Lieutenant was a Lord who was a representative, a Lieutenant, of the
sovereign.

The geographically nearest Lord Lieutenant to me is Dame Mary Peters,
Lord Lieutenant of Belfast.[1]

She is a Lord neither in the sense of being a peer nor in the sense of
being a male. She lives in the City of Lisburn rather than the City of
Belfast.

I hope no one is looking for logic and consistency.


[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Peters_%28athlete%29

[the Omrud]

Golly, I was thinking about her only the other day, for obvious reasons.
I clearly recall watching her final race in the 1972 Olympics.

This "Lord" seems to be identical in form to "Lord Mayor", who is also
not a lord.

--
David

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Wed, 08 Aug 2012 19:56:35 +0100, the Omrud <usenet...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Me too.

I have never met her but I did once do something that was helpful to
her.

There was an athletics meeting scheduled to take place south of Belfast
in 1981. There was a lot of scary news[1] coming out of Northern Ireland
at the time but it was in specific areas and did not and would not
affect the area of the athletics arena (the Mary Peters Track). There
were reports of athletes cancelling their planned attendance. I got all
fired up about this and wrote a letter that was published in The Times
(of London) explaining the situation and listing all the public events
that had been going ahead without any difficulty.

At the time my wife was attempting to get fit and lose weight at the
Mary Peters Health Club (Mary's own business). My wife gave a copy of my
letter in the Times to Mary P. I heard later that Mary had sat down at
the phone and called one leading athlete after another using the content
of my letter to explain things to them and, of course, using her own
knowledge and credibility. Cancellations were reversed and almost all
the booked athletes turned up and performed.

A similar letter was published in the Guardian a few days later. It was
from the Lord Mayor of Belfast, Ms Grace Bannister. When I say
"similar", "identical" would give a more accurate idea. Sometimes one is
delighted to have one's work copied regardless of the lack of
attribution.

>This "Lord" seems to be identical in form to "Lord Mayor", who is also
>not a lord.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1981_Irish_hunger_strike