kluge vs. kludge --- here's what the research says
Eric S. Raymond
`kludge'. I've researched this question in some depth, aided by several
pointers and bits of history sent to me by various USENETters. Here's what
the Jargon File has to say on the matter:
:kluge: /klooj/ [from the German `klug', clever] 1. n. A Rube
Goldberg (or Heath Robinson) device, whether in hardware or
software. (A long-ago "Datamation" article by Jackson Granholme
said: "An ill-assorted collection of poorly matching parts,
forming a distressing whole.") 2. n. A clever programming trick
intended to solve a particular nasty case in an expedient, if not
clear, manner. Often used to repair bugs. Often involves
{ad-hockery} and verges on being a {crock}. In fact, the
TMRC Dictionary defined `kludge' as "a crock that works". 3. n.
Something that works for the wrong reason. 4. vt. To insert a
kluge into a program. "I've kluged this routine to get around
that weird bug, but there's probably a better way." 5. [WPI] n. A
feature that is implemented in a {rude} manner.
Nowadays this term is often encountered in the variant spelling
`kludge'. Reports from {old fart}s are consistent that
`kluge' was the original spelling, reported around computers as
far back as the mid-1950s and, at that time, used exclusively of
*hardware* kluges. In 1947, the "New York Folklore
Quarterly" reported a classic shaggy-dog story `Murgatroyd the
Kluge Maker' then current in the Armed Forces, in which a `kluge'
was a complex and puzzling artifact with a trivial function. Other
sources report that `kluge' was common Navy slang in the WWII era
for any piece of electronics that worked well on shore but
consistently failed at sea.
However, there is reason to believe this slang use may be a decade
older. Several respondents have connected it to the brand name of
a device called a "Kluge paper feeder" dating back at least to
1935, an adjunct to mechanical printing presses. The Kluge feeder
was designed before small, cheap electric motors and control
electronics; it relied on a fiendishly complex assortment of cams,
belts, and linkages to both power and synchronize all its
operations from one motive driveshaft. It was accordingly
tempermental, subject to frequent breakdowns, and devilishly
difficult to repair --- but oh, so clever! One traditional
folk etymology of `kluge' makes it the name of a design engineer;
in fact, `Kluge' is a surname in German, and the designer of the
Kluge feeder may well have been the man behind this myth.
{TMRC} and the MIT hacker culture of the early '60s seems to
have developed in a milieu that remembered and still used some WWII
military slang (see also {foobar}). It seems likely that
`kluge' came to MIT via alumni of the many military electronics
projects that had been located in Cambridge (many in MIT's
venerable Building 20, in which {TMRC} is also located) during
the war.
The variant `kludge' was apparently popularized by the
{Datamation} article mentioned above; it was titled "How
to Design a Kludge" (February 1962, pp. 30, 31). Some people
who encountered the word first in print or on-line jumped to the
reasonable but incorrect conclusion that the word should be
pronounced /kluhj/ (rhyming with `sludge'). The result of this
tangled history is a mess; in 1993, many (perhaps even most)
hackers pronounce the word correctly as /klooj/ but spell it
incorrectly as `kludge' (compare the pronunciation drift of
{mung}). Some observers consider this appropriate in view of
its meaning.
:kludge: /klooj/ or /kluhj/ n. Common (but incorrect) variant
of {kluge}, q.v.
It is worth adding that my esteemed predecessors, the editors of the
original Hacker's Dictionary, definitely considered `kluge' the preferred
spelling. The intrusive `d' is both phonetically and historically wrong.
Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
sport native to Scandinavia.)
--
Eric S. Raymond <e...@snark.thyrsus.com>
HER...@auvm.american.edu
>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>sport native to Scandinavia.)
Neither 'rouge' nor 'luge' rhymes with 'stooge', 'Scrooge', or
'kluge'.
H.
Joseph C Fineman
>It is worth adding that my esteemed predecessors, the editors of the
>original Hacker's Dictionary, definitely considered `kluge' the preferred
>spelling. The intrusive `d' is both phonetically and historically wrong.
>Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>sport native to Scandinavia.)
In my dialect, "rouge" does not rhyme with the other words, being
pronounced the French way, without the "d" sound. A couple of other
rhymes are "centrifuge" & "subterfuge".
Let me repeat what has now sunk into oblivion on this thread: I heard
this word pronounced (at MIT, in 1958) long before I saw it written;
it was pronounced "clooge"; and that, IMAO, is still the honest
English way to spell it. I will compromise no further than "cluge";
the "k" is silly, and the "d" is barbarous.
--
Joe Fineman j...@world.std.com
239 Clinton Road (617) 731-9190
Brookline, MA 02146
Evan Kirshenbaum
>:kludge: /klooj/ or /kluhj/ n. Common (but incorrect) variant
> of {kluge}, q.v.
Oh, no! The _Hacker's Dictionary_ is run by prescriptivists! :-)
At Stanford in 1982 (where and when I learned the word), it was
definitely "kludge" and /kludZ/
>Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>sport native to Scandinavia.)
This is interesting to people (such as myself) in whose dialects these
four words do not even all rhyme with each other. "stooge" and
"Scrooge" (and "huge"), like "kludge" all end in /udZ/, while "rouge"
and "luge" end in /uZ/.
[Interesting. When I spell checked this article, ispell didn't know
"kluge", and suggested "kludge" as a replacement! (It's in the main
dictionary, not my personal one.)]
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories | It is error alone which needs the
3500 Deer Creek Road, Building 26U | support of government. Truth can
Palo Alto, CA 94304 | stand by itself.
| Thomas Jefferson
kirsh...@hpl.hp.com |
(415)857-7572
Zack Evans
>:kluge: /klooj/ [from the German `klug', clever] 1. n. A Rube
> Goldberg (or Heath Robinson) device, whether in hardware or
> software.
That's what it means to me...it's very like a 'hack'. I also use it as
a verb, as in "I'm going to have to kludge my way round this problem", or
"It's been kludged".
>:kludge: /klooj/ or /kluhj/ n. Common (but incorrect) variant
> of {kluge}, q.v.
That's how I spell it, and pronounce to rhyme with sludge.
You also mention that a kluge was an arbitrairly complex object of
uncertain function - sounds just like a widget :)
Zack "X11 - what's that?"
--
Zack Evans pyc...@cent1.lancs.ac.uk or zev...@nyx.cs.du.edu (Internet)
pyc...@uk.ac.lancs.cent1 (JANET)
Watch yer bass bins lads, I'm tellin' yer...
Matt Garretson
onomatopoetic value, anyway.
On the other hand, I was just watching the "Space Travelers (Marooned)"
episode of MST3K and noticed that David Janssen commented that he could
"kluge up" some kind of a rocketship. I think that movie dates back to the
early 70s.
--
Matt Garretson
bul...@rpi.edu
Albany NY, USA
Paula Gaynell Warnes
Actually, rouge does rhyme, if you mean the red cream that some women
put on their face to give it color. However, if you are speaking
of a thief, then rouge doesn't rhyme 'stooge' or 'Scrooge'.
Nell
--
ne...@is.rice.edu
These statements do not reflect Rice's opinions. Just mine. Unless they
were beamed into my brain by the Orbital Mind Control Lasers.
Jim Haynes
In article <1mB47Y#M7VSMtR1t7nJw2dV1109pwSw5=e...@boojum.thyrsus.com> e...@boojum.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
> a device called a "Kluge paper feeder" dating back at least to
> 1935, an adjunct to mechanical printing presses. The Kluge feeder
> was designed before small, cheap electric motors and control
> electronics; it relied on a fiendishly complex assortment of cams,
> belts, and linkages to both power and synchronize all its
> operations from one motive driveshaft. It was accordingly
> tempermental, subject to frequent breakdowns, and devilishly
> difficult to repair --- but oh, so clever! One traditional
> folk etymology of `kluge' makes it the name of a design engineer;
> in fact, `Kluge' is a surname in German, and the designer of the
> Kluge feeder may well have been the man behind this myth.
In fact I remember a printing press circa 1949 (but I don't know how
old it was at the time) with the brand name "Kluge" cast into some of
the parts and the full name of the maker somewhere was "Brantjen & Kluge"
or maybe it "Brandtjen & Kluge" (which is throwing another 'd' into the
other guy's name. The press was a marvelous thing for a kid to watch.
I suppose it could have been a paper-feeding adjunct to a press, but it
looked like all one machine to me. It used suction to pick a sheet of
paper off the stack and deposit it into the maw of the press and pick it
out again after printing. There were as described lots of cams and
linkages; but I don't recall it being subject to frequent breakdowns.
But then the print shop where it lived wasn't very busy; and the owner
did use another hand-fed press for smaller jobs.
--
hay...@cats.ucsc.edu
hay...@cats.bitnet
"Ya can talk all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was!"
"No it aint! But ya gotta know the territory!"
Meredith Willson: "The Music Man"
Tom Van Vleck
> It is worth adding that my esteemed predecessors, the editors of the
> original Hacker's Dictionary, definitely considered `kluge' the preferred
> spelling. The intrusive `d' is both phonetically and historically wrong.
From 1964 to about 1971, down the hall from the AI Lab on the ninth floor
at MIT Project MAC, where the esteemed prececessors later created the
jargon
file, there was a room whose door read
KLUDGE ROOM
The "kludge," the ESL Display, was a display-list-driven vector tube
connected to channel D of the Project MAC 7094. This device was built
by the MIT Electronic Systems Laboratory, and was used for experiments
in computer-aided design and computer graphics. When we gave tours of
Project MAC we always found ourselves apologizing for the name, saying
"affectionately known as the Kludge." Corby used to point this out as
an example of the risk of trying to be funny: the joke got old.
This doesn't prove that the "d" belongs in the word, or anything. But
nobody ever told me the display's name was spelled wrong, just that it
was a disrespectful name for a pioneering device.
Benjamin Ketcham
writes:
>Actually, rouge does rhyme, if you mean the red cream that some women
>put on their face to give it color. However, if you are speaking
>of a thief, then rouge doesn't rhyme 'stooge' or 'Scrooge'.
Rouge comes from the French for red, and every time I've heard it, it
has a soft 'g', and thus would not strictly rhyme with kluge (or huge
or stooge or Scrooge), but would rhyme with luge.
I am not aware of a meaning for rouge that corresponds to thief.
Perhaps you are thinking of rogue?
--ben
Taki Kogoma
>put on their face to give it color. However, if you are speaking
>of a thief, then rouge doesn't rhyme 'stooge' or 'Scrooge'.
Erm. You mean 'rogue' as a synonym of 'thief'.
--
Capt. Gym Z. Quirk (Known to some as Taki Kogoma) kog...@triton.unm.edu
I'll get a life when someone demonstrates that it would be superior to
what I have now...
Neil L Cook
|>
|> >It is worth adding that my esteemed predecessors, the editors of the
|> >original Hacker's Dictionary, definitely considered `kluge' the preferred
|> >spelling. The intrusive `d' is both phonetically and historically wrong.
My dad, an engineer, uses the word "kludge", and has done for a long
time. I would say its usage pre-dates hackerdom. I'll find out some
facts about where my dad got it from etc.
Neil.
Stewart Stremler
Hm. I grew up with "kludge", and my father was a Navy Chief. Until I had read
the Jargon file, I never *knew* that there was "another way" to pronounce it.
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roses are redish Stewart Stremler
Violets are bluish stre...@ucssun1.sdsu.edu
If it wasn't for Jesus FidoNet: 1:202/1111
We'd all be jewish AmigaNet: 40:406/10
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Neil L Cook
|> >Actually, rouge does rhyme, if you mean the red cream that some women
|> >put on their face to give it color. However, if you are speaking
|> >of a thief, then rouge doesn't rhyme 'stooge' or 'Scrooge'.
|>
|> Rouge comes from the French for red, and every time I've heard it, it
|> has a soft 'g', and thus would not strictly rhyme with kluge (or huge
|> or stooge or Scrooge), but would rhyme with luge.
This is correct. The end is pronounced like "je", not "juh".
Neil.
Tony Lezard
> [...] Some people
> who encountered the word first in print or on-line jumped to the
> reasonable but incorrect conclusion that the word should be
> pronounced /kluhj/ (rhyming with `sludge'). The result of this
> tangled history is a mess; in 1993, many (perhaps even most)
> hackers pronounce the word correctly as /klooj/ but spell it
> incorrectly as `kludge' (compare the pronunciation drift of
> {mung}). Some observers consider this appropriate in view of
> its meaning.
>
>:kludge: /klooj/ or /kluhj/ n. Common (but incorrect) variant
> of {kluge}, q.v.
>
>It is worth adding that my esteemed predecessors, the editors of the
>original Hacker's Dictionary, definitely considered `kluge' the preferred
>spelling. The intrusive `d' is both phonetically and historically wrong.
Who are you to dictate which of /klooj/ or /kluhj/ is correct? I have
obtained feedback on this matter from the *entire* programming team here
at Mantis Consultants and *all* agree that it's "kludge", rhyming with
"fudge". Furthermore, despite our contacts with other companies, we
don't know any Britons who call it /klooj/. (*)
The hacker community is a global one, and dialectic variations will emerge.
To attempt to lay down the law on which version of this word is correct
is like trying to decree the correct spelling of the word "colour" (Answer:
it depends where you are).
The Jargon File is wrong in saying "kludge" and /kluhj/ are wrong. They're
not, they're just different, and I don't care what the {old farts} say.
The file should be amended accordingly.
(*) What's the betting that everyone in the minority in Britain who
pronounce it the American way sends me irate email telling me I'm
wrong (ITHO)?
P.S. Interesting observation: Hitting 'c' on the "Check spelling, Send
Abort, Edit, or List?" prompt from trn before posting this article gave
The following words not present in /usr/dict/words (SunOS 4.1, and we
haven't edited the dictionary but I've omitted non-words like esr):
colour email farts klooj kluge kluhj.
--
Tony Lezard tony@sunforest
I am also a foo
Eric S. Raymond
The word `rouge' as usually anglicized does, though not the original French.
The anglicized version is /rooj/, the original French /roozh/.
I believe that `luge' is pronounced /looj/ --- in fact I've heard it spoken
that way on Winter Olympics broadcasts. This would make it rhyme with
`kluge', which is pronounced /klooj/. What is your reason for believing
differently?
Telly Mavroidis
always pronounced it klooj, but I thought it was spelled klugde. This
seemed wrong, since kludge should probably sound like fudge. I
remembered first hearing the term when I learned Pascal as an undergrad.
The textbook we used was "OH! PASCAL!" by Cooper and Clancy. They used
the spelling kludge, but gave the pronounciation as (klooj). So, it's
possible that anyone that had that book, uses the wrong spelling.
Luckily, I found the jargon file and got the correct spelling.
--
****************************************************************************
Telly Mavroidis mavr...@acf2.nyu.edu
^-leave the last s off for savings.
****************************************************************************
Garrett Wollman
>The word `rouge' as usually anglicized does, though not the original French.
>The anglicized version is /rooj/, the original French /roozh/.
I have never heard your `anglicized' pronunciation used.
>I believe that `luge' is pronounced /looj/ --- in fact I've heard it spoken
>that way on Winter Olympics broadcasts.
Say, you wouldn't be referring to CBS's pathetic coverage of last
year's Games, would you?
I will be honest and say that I have heard the pronunciation ESR
suggests, but only as used by people talking about the luge run in
Calgary. When local people talk about the luge run in Lake Placid,
it's /loozh/.
-GAWollman
--
Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ...
wol...@emba.uvm.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance.
uvm-gen!wollman | It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people
UVM disagrees. | who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant
Evan Kirshenbaum
>The anglicized version is /rooj/, the original French /roozh/.
>
>I believe that `luge' is pronounced /looj/ --- in fact I've heard it spoken
>that way on Winter Olympics broadcasts. This would make it rhyme with
>`kluge', which is pronounced /klooj/. What is your reason for believing
>differently?
In my dialect (Chicago), they are /ruZ/ and /luZ/. As much as I hate
to use dictionaries to back up pronunciations, M/W NCD agrees, which
implies that at least many Americans pronounce them that way. It does
list /rudZ/ as a secondary pronunciation, but flags it _esp South_.
The OED only lists /ruZ/ and /luZ/.
What dialect do you speak?
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories | K: Natives. They may be hostile
3500 Deer Creek Road, Building 26U | C: Well, we're all a little hostile
Palo Alto, CA 94304 | now and then. Some of us are able
| to sublimate. Others just can't
kirsh...@hpl.hp.com | adjust.
(415)857-7572
HER...@auvm.american.edu
>
>In <93202.120...@auvm.american.edu> <HER...@auvm.american.edu> wrote:
>>
>> Neither 'rouge' nor 'luge' rhymes with 'stooge', 'Scrooge', or
>> 'kluge'.
>
>The anglicized version is /rooj/, the original French /roozh/.
>
>I believe that `luge' is pronounced /looj/ --- in fact I've heard it spoken
>that way on Winter Olympics broadcasts. This would make it rhyme with
>`kluge', which is pronounced /klooj/. What is your reason for believing
>differently?
My reason for believing differently is that I've never heard *anyone*
say either /rooj/ or /looj/. Perhaps I haven't been listening to the
right people. I've just consulted several desk-type dictionaries, all
of which give only /loozh/ for 'luge'. One (Merriam-Webster Collegiate)
gave both /roozh/ and (esp. Southern) /rooj/ for 'rouge'; the others
gave only /roozh/. But as I say, I've never heard anyone actually
pronounce it that way, and I've been around.
H.
Herschel Browne
The American University
Dave Jones
I started reading this thread a couple of days ago, I had never, ever heard
kluge pronounced "kludge". (Come to think of it, I still have never
*heard* it pronounced that way.)
Dave ("Here Come Da Kluge") Jones
Peter da Silva
used to refer to lighting, and to travelling bags. Therefore "kludge"
must be the correct spelling (and pronounced klooj).
--
Peter da Silva. <pe...@sugar.neosoft.com>.
`-_-' Hefur pu fadmad ulfinn i dag?
'U`
"Det er min ledsager, det er ikke drikkepenge."
Robert L. McMillin
>>Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
>>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>>sport native to Scandinavia.)
> Neither 'rouge' nor 'luge' rhymes with 'stooge', 'Scrooge', or
> 'kluge'.
Boy, for somebody who goes to the American University, you sure don't
know American pronounciations... here in El Lay, they all most certainly
*do* rhyme.
--
Robert L. McMillin | Surf City Software | r...@helen.surfcty.com | Dude!
"What's taking so long? It's only typing!"
-- a marketing manager posing as a software manager
Lennart Regebro
>Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>sport native to Scandinavia.)
Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
--
Lennart Regebro, Stacken Computer Club reg...@stacken.kth.se
Any Opinion expressed above is (c) Rent-An-Opinion(tm). It is not an Opinion
of either Lennart Regebro or the Stacken Computer Club.
Now you also can get an Opinion. Call Welcome To Reality(tm) +1 (800) NO-CLUES.
Peter da Silva
> The anglicized version is /rooj/, the original French /roozh/.
I've never heard "rooj", just "roozh". And I've never heard "looj" either.
It's always "loozh".
mathew
>I've been around hackers and computers since the mid sixties, and until
>I started reading this thread a couple of days ago, I had never, ever heard
>kluge pronounced "kludge". (Come to think of it, I still have never
>*heard* it pronounced that way.)
Until I met Richard Stallman, I'd always heard it pronounced "kludge",
and never "klooj". I think it's one of those transatlantic
differences.
mathew
Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879
by reg...@linnea-grind.stacken.kth.se (Lennart Regebro):
>
> Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
A luge (rhymes with rouge, in French) is simply put, a sled. When you get
on your flexible flyer and bellywhop down the hill, you're engaging in the
sport of lugeing. Of course, there is a formalized version of the sport
with highly regulated equipment derived from the traditional luges of the
French Savoy Alps. The traditional luge is wooden, about as long as your
torso, and ridden feat first. As in the flexible flyer, the runners flex,
but the fronts of the runners aren't linked together by a tiller mechanism.
Instead, you can work your ankles against the upward curls at the fronts
of the runners, bending one or the other slightly to steer, or pushing the
two fronts together to brake. Dragging your hands and heels on the snow
is also an accepted steering approach. In competitive lugeing, the sleds
are run down a bobsled track, but it's one person per sled, and the sled
is far smaller than the person. Considering that the speeds are similar
to bobsled speeds, and that the driver has no protection other than a
crash helmet, the sport has to be one of the most insane speed sports known
to mankind.
Doug Jones
jo...@cs.uiowa.edu
Dave Brown
>In article <1mB47Y#M7VSMtR1t7nJw2dV1109pwSw5=e...@boojum.thyrsus.com> e...@boojum.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
>
>>Finally, in response to one FAQ, here are several words that rhyme with
>>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>>sport native to Scandinavia.)
>
>Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
Imagine going down a hill of ice on a couple of planks wearing nothing
for protection but a helmet and a body-sized condom....
--
Dave Brown -- dagb...@napier.uwaterloo.ca -- (416) 669-5370
"I am quoted in Dave Brown's .signature twice."
--"Polar Bear" Morse
Eric S. Raymond
> In my dialect (Chicago), they are /ruZ/ and /luZ/. As much as I hate
> to use dictionaries to back up pronunciations, M/W NCD agrees, which
> implies that at least many Americans pronounce them that way. It does
> list /rudZ/ as a secondary pronunciation, but flags it _esp South_.
> The OED only lists /ruZ/ and /luZ/.
OK, I guess I'll have to drop `rouge' from the list of rhymes, as it will
mislead too many people.
Ironically, I tend to pronounce `rouge' in the French way myself; but I
thought that was a minority choice.
> What dialect do you speak?
According to two sociolinguists who've done the name-that-dialect parlor
trick on me, my accent is very, very close to network-announcer
standard American. This is the main reason I felt confident enough
to do the Jargon File pronunciation keys myself.
One of the sociolinguists was, actually, William Lebov himself (I knew
him slightly at UPenn). He spotted that I'd lived in New York as a child,
but said that was basically a barely-perceptible trace, not a strong coloring.
If you have a typical Chicago accent, our speech is probably very similar;
Chicago, Philadelphia (where I live) and Minneapolis/St.Paul are the three
urban areas that the networks generally hire their announcers out of, and
(not coincidentally) the reference areas for standard American pronunciation.
Eric S. Raymond
> I've been around hackers and computers since the mid sixties, and until
> I started reading this thread a couple of days ago, I had never, ever heard
> kluge pronounced "kludge". (Come to think of it, I still have never
> *heard* it pronounced that way.)
This is exactly the kind of `old fart' report I referred to in the entry.
*Every one* of the half-dozen or so respondents I have who learned the word
before 1975 says the same thing.
Furthermore, every written source I have from before then, excepting only the
1962 Granholme article, spells the word `kluge'. (My written sources go back
to 1947.)
Finally: I know of *no one* who pronounces the word to rhyme with `fudge'
and can chase a chain of oral transmission to before 1980.
The conclusion that the `kludge' pronunciation is in error, resulting
from transmission via the `kludge' misspelling in written sources, seems
on the basis of my data to be inescapable.
Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but you
chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things up for you
and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word by written
transmission only.
The fact that the *pronunciation* of the word has been messed up by the
`d' spelling is why I describe the `d' spelling as *incorrect* rather
than simply a variant.
Eric S. Raymond
> Sorry, Raymond, but in the real world "Kluge" (pronounced kloog) is
> used to refer to lighting, and to travelling bags. Therefore "kludge"
> must be the correct spelling (and pronounced klooj).
Wrong, camel-breath! :-)
As any fool can plainly see, the trademark "Kluge" has a *majuscule* k.
Obviously this changes its pronunciation to "aardvark". :-)
(This posting has been smiley-captioned for the humor-impaired.)
Eric S. Raymond
> In article <1mCCOl#7lyvWmB9MMvq4VxH185swd4B=e...@snark.thyrsus.com> e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
> I have never heard your `anglicized' pronunciation used.
>
> >I believe that `luge' is pronounced /looj/ --- in fact I've heard it spoken
> >that way on Winter Olympics broadcasts.
>
> Say, you wouldn't be referring to CBS's pathetic coverage of last
> year's Games, would you?
Yes, I would be, in fact. I think I've also heard it from ABC announcers, but
I'm not sure of that.
> I will be honest and say that I have heard the pronunciation ESR
> suggests, but only as used by people talking about the luge run in
> Calgary. When local people talk about the luge run in Lake Placid,
> it's /loozh/.
This is a significant data point, suggesting that both pronunciations are
in use. I'm readily prepared to believe that /loozh/ is the original
Scandinavian.
Eric S. Raymond
> Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
It's very similar to bobsledding (they hold the events on bobsled runs),
except that a luge is a tiny one-man vehicle, barely more than a plank on
runners. It's piloted by a man lying on his back, feet-forward. Looks
very fast, somewhat dangerous, and lots of fun.
I think it's actually native specifically to Norway. It's not a traditional
sport anywhere else, and tends to be treated as a sort of kid brother or
gee-whiz variant of bobsledding. All the luge teams I've ever seen were
Northern European, American, or Canadian.
(I've wanted to try it myself ever since I first saw it.)
Pierre Jelenc
>
>I think it's actually native specifically to Norway. It's not a traditional
>sport anywhere else, and tends to be treated as a sort of kid brother or
>gee-whiz variant of bobsledding. All the luge teams I've ever seen were
>Northern European, American, or Canadian.
"Luge" is the French word for "sled". Was it borrowed from the Norwegian?
It does not appear to exist in Swedish.
Pierre
--
Pierre Jelenc
rc...@panix.com
Andy Trafford
Ok, this is another one that I've always wondered about.....
When I was growing up, I used to own a 'sledge'. Is a sled the same thing?
Traff
Don Stokes
> from transmission via the `kludge' misspelling in written sources, seems
> on the basis of my data to be inescapable.
>
> Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but you
> chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things up for you
> and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word by written
> transmission only.
Oh for f***'s sake, Eric!
Most of the Jargon File's entries are more recent than 1980. There is a
difference outside the Good Old U. S. of A. How /kluhj/ came about, be it
by mispronunciation of another word, or by being handed down over centuries,
is quite irrelevant; the simple fact is that it's used by a very large
proportion of hackers outside the USA. You are claiming that what a word
which is perfectly valid jargon outside the US isn't, an assertion which is,
quite simply, wrong.
Oh, it's the *United States* Jargon File now then is it? Can I return my
copy of TNHD? It turns out not to be relevant.
--
Don Stokes, CSC Network Manager, Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand
Ph+64 4 495-5052 Fax+64 4 471-5386 Work:d...@vuw.ac.nz Home:d...@zl2tnm.gen.nz
Tom Van Vleck
It's in Frenkel, K. A., An Interview with Fernando Jose Corbato,
CACM 34 No. 9, September 1991, page 86. "We worked furiously
on CTSS. We kludged together a system, which we demonstrated."
Lars R{der Clausen
>In article <1mFQ8M#1bP1BR8P1rfd1MjYT57gynlw=e...@snark.thyrsus.com> e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
>>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general
>>--- but you chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme
>>screwed things up for you and for the minority of American hackers
>>who learned the word by written transmission only.
>Not wanting to take all this too seriously, but...
>The hacker ethic seems to support the cause of good ideas over
>bad. Truth is beauty and beauty is truth.
>The real argument for kludge (fudge) and against kluge (klooj) is that
>kludge is aesthetically better (IMAO). The connection between kludge,
>fudge and sludge may be the result of a mistake, but it's too good a
>mistake to neglect.
>You have to admit that there's a sort of irony that the better (heh)
>pronunciation of kludge is a kludge itself.
Agree! Agree! And I might add that I heard and read the kludge form many,
many times before discovering in TNHD that it should be kluge. I've heard
noone (and that's *noone*) in Europe using the kulge form.
-Lars
--
Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing left to add, but when there
is nothing left to take away. Antoine de St. Exupery
Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879
by e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond):
>
> I think it's actually native specifically to Norway.
This is curious folklore! When I first encountered the word luge, it was
in the French Savoy in the early 1960's, and the word was in common use to
refer to the toy sleds kids played with. The word and its correct
pronounciation are clearly French, not Germanic (which includes English
and the Scandinavian languages).
The luges I encountered were wooden, just big enough to sit on, and had
upcurved front runners that you could kick with your heels for steering
with. Kids on luges were particularly common on the smaller ski runs
around Les Gets (a small town and ski area northeast of Chamonix in the
French Alps). A French kid imported to America back then would have
immediately recognized a flexible flyer as a kind of metal luge.
It was 30 years later that I discovered that the luge had been developed
into an Olympic sport. The Olympic luge is generally similar to its
wooden ancestor, but lighter, with somewhat longer and more flexible
runners.
Doug Jones
jo...@cs.uiowa.edu
Neil L Cook
|> >>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general
|> >>--- but you chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme
|> Agree! Agree! And I might add that I heard and read the kludge form many,
|> many times before discovering in TNHD that it should be kluge. I've heard
|> noone (and that's *noone*) in Europe using the kulge form.
I can verify this. I had never heard of /klooj/ until I read TNHD. I
have been using the word kludge since my teenage days, circa 1983.
I suggest the derogatory reference to "incorrect" pronunciation be
struck from TNHD, and kludge take its place as a perfectly valid
varient of the word. Remember this is about how hackers *use* these
words - if nobody but a few ancient MIT guys pronounce it /klooj/,
then why should this be the "correct" variant?
Neil.
Pierre Jelenc
>From article <1mFR5V#643HVq1QX7hG5Tw5l93G1mll=e...@snark.thyrsus.com>,
>by e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond):
>>
>> I think it's actually native specifically to Norway.
>
>This is curious folklore! When I first encountered the word luge, it was
>in the French Savoy in the early 1960's, and the word was in common use to
>refer to the toy sleds kids played with. The word and its correct
>pronounciation are clearly French, not Germanic (which includes English
>and the Scandinavian languages).
Indeed. Further investigation in a French dictionary revealed that the
word is of Savoyard origin, and probably descended from the gaulish.
Alun Jones
>Finally: I know of *no one* who pronounces the word to rhyme with `fudge'
>and can chase a chain of oral transmission to before 1980.
>
>The conclusion that the `kludge' pronunciation is in error, resulting
>from transmission via the `kludge' misspelling in written sources, seems
>on the basis of my data to be inescapable.
>
>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but
>you chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things
>up for you and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word
>by written transmission only.
>
>The fact that the *pronunciation* of the word has been messed up by the
>`d' spelling is why I describe the `d' spelling as *incorrect* rather
>than simply a variant.
[...]
I quote from the jargon file :-)
>
>Further, the electronic media which knit them together are fluid, `hot'
>connections, well adapted to both the dissemination of new slang and the
>ruthless culling of weak and superannuated specimens. The results of this
>process give us perhaps a uniquely intense and accelerated view of
>linguistic evolution in action.
>
Hmmm, it seems to me here that you're saying that evolution via the
written word is a good thing, or at least one of the bases of hackish
talk. But above you're deploring it...
Looks like its another candidate for `Commonwealth Hackish' though...
Alun
--
#!/usr/local/bin/perl
$_=join("\:",@w=sort(split("\_","Once,_nab_Cones_per._yac._fuj@_BunJ_AAl_Fept
.+_MSc_Io_Kute_D,_Jmp_Go_ED_Nie_RAber_Twy_Uth.+_HfC_PU._QW._Lr_zukss_ba_Syst_
")));s/\n//g;s/ss/\n/;s/\:.//g;s/([A-Y])/\ $1/g;s/\s+\A+/\A/;s/\+/\ /g;print;
Thomas Beagle
>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general
>--- but you chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme
>screwed things up for you and for the minority of American hackers
>who learned the word by written transmission only.
Not wanting to take all this too seriously, but...
The hacker ethic seems to support the cause of good ideas over
bad. Truth is beauty and beauty is truth.
The real argument for kludge (fudge) and against kluge (klooj) is that
kludge is aesthetically better (IMAO). The connection between kludge,
fudge and sludge may be the result of a mistake, but it's too good a
mistake to neglect.
You have to admit that there's a sort of irony that the better (heh)
pronunciation of kludge is a kludge itself.
--
Thomas Beagle | tho...@datamark.co.nz Work:64 4 2338186 Home:64 4 4993832
Technical Writer |
Wellington, NZ | When we made it, did you hear a bell ring?
Guy Dawson
In article <1mFR5V#643HVq1QX7hG5Tw5l93G1mll=e...@snark.thyrsus.com>, e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
> In <1993Jul25.1...@kth.se> Lennart Regebro wrote:
> > Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
>
> It's very similar to bobsledding (they hold the events on bobsled runs),
> except that a luge is a tiny one-man vehicle, barely more than a plank on
> runners. It's piloted by a man lying on his back, feet-forward. Looks
> very fast, somewhat dangerous, and lots of fun.
It's a tiny one-man vehicle except when it is a tiny two-man vehicle. Best
done with a *good* friend!
>
> I think it's actually native specifically to Norway. It's not a traditional
> sport anywhere else, and tends to be treated as a sort of kid brother or
> gee-whiz variant of bobsledding. All the luge teams I've ever seen were
> Northern European, American, or Canadian.
It's an Olympic sport. The old soviet block was pretty good too...
[ Bobsledding was invented by the Brits at Cresta in the end of the last
century - don't know where the luge came from ]
>
> (I've wanted to try it myself ever since I first saw it.)
> --
> Eric S. Raymond <e...@snark.thyrsus.com>
Guy
--
-- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guy Dawson - Hoskyns Group Plc.
gu...@hoskyns.co.uk Tel Hoskyns UK - 71 251 2128
gu...@austin.ibm.com Tel IBM Austin USA - 512 838 2334
Guy Dawson
In article <1mFQ8M#1bP1BR8P1rfd1MjYT57gynlw=e...@snark.thyrsus.com>, e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
> In <CAMy1...@megatest.com> Dave Jones wrote:
> > I've been around hackers and computers since the mid sixties, and until
> > I started reading this thread a couple of days ago, I had never, ever heard
> > kluge pronounced "kludge". (Come to think of it, I still have never
> > *heard* it pronounced that way.)
>
> This is exactly the kind of `old fart' report I referred to in the entry.
> *Every one* of the half-dozen or so respondents I have who learned the word
> before 1975 says the same thing.
>
> Furthermore, every written source I have from before then, excepting only the
> 1962 Granholme article, spells the word `kluge'. (My written sources go back
> to 1947.)
>
> Finally: I know of *no one* who pronounces the word to rhyme with `fudge'
> and can chase a chain of oral transmission to before 1980.
>
> The conclusion that the `kludge' pronunciation is in error, resulting
> from transmission via the `kludge' misspelling in written sources, seems
> on the basis of my data to be inescapable.
>
> Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but you
> chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things up for you
> and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word by written
> transmission only.
:-) <- please take several!
Speeking as a Commonwealth chum...
One of the things I like about english is its dynamic nature. Words come
and go, change their meaning and pronounciation and spelling. The Oxford
English Dictionary reflects current usage, it does not state how it must
be pronounced. It's the French who are supposed to get all upset about
their language and how words should be pronounced. The even go so far as
to have the Acadmie Francais (sp?) to law down the law.
I've no problem with the original version of kludge ( rhymes with sludge )
having been kluge ( rhymes with stooge ), it's just that current usage
includes both...
Me, I use kludge. As long as people tell me I should use kluge, I'll keep
using kludge and defend my freedom to be wrong until every one agrees
with me! :-)
>
> The fact that the *pronunciation* of the word has been messed up by the
> `d' spelling is why I describe the `d' spelling as *incorrect* rather
> than simply a variant.
> --
> Eric S. Raymond <e...@snark.thyrsus.com>
Guy
Dave Jones
) The textbook we used was "OH! PASCAL!" by Cooper and Clancy. They used
) the spelling kludge, but gave the pronounciation as (klooj). So, it's
) possible that anyone that had that book, uses the wrong spelling.
Anyone who studied from that book may do quite a lot of things wrong.
Dave Jones
> Sorry, Raymond, but in the real world "Kluge" (pronounced kloog) is
> used to refer to lighting, and to travelling bags.
Tell the lexicographers at Merriem Webster. They seem to need some
edification.
> Therefore "kludge" must be the correct spelling (and pronounced klooj).
Why does it follow that if one word is spelled unphonetically, then a
similar word must therefore also be spelled unphonetically?
BTW, Merriem Webster gives both spellings and two pronunciations, but not
the two pronunciations that are under discussion. The first (and correct) one
I will transliterate into standard text as "KLOOJ" (with a "u" pronounced as in
"rule"), and the second, a new surprise entry, as "KLOOJee"! [I think
they must be confusing it with the adjective, "klugy".]
Danny R. Faught
>Ok, this is another one that I've always wondered about.....
>
>When I was growing up, I used to own a 'sledge'. Is a sled the same thing?
No, but a 'slege' is :-] Of course, that's pronounced "sleej".
Or is it "sleezh"?
--
Danny Faught -- Convex rookie -- MPP OS Test Development
"The use of COBOL cripples the mind; its teaching should, therefore,
be regarded as a criminal offence." -Dijkstra
Dave Jones
) Until I met Richard Stallman, I'd always heard it pronounced "kludge",
) and never "klooj". I think it's one of those transatlantic
) differences.
I think we can now safely speculate that original pronunciation, from the
great U.S. of A., cradle of hackery, was "kluge", probably derived from a
brand name, and that some programmers, who are not famous for their
spelling -- (e.g. "creat") -- got it wrong ("kludge") in some books or
articles. The books and such were read in England and other places on
the periphery of hackerdom where the word had never been heard, and
the rest, as they say, is histrionics.
phy...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
using the kulge form."
Who is this "noone" person anyway? I've often seen him mentioned in
posts from the U.S., and now he pops up in Europe too!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lyndon Watson L.Wa...@csc.canterbury.ac.nz
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Holyer
: In article <233evf$a...@belfort.daimi.aau.dk>, elas...@daimi.aau.dk (Lars R{der Clausen) writes:
: |> >>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general
: |> >>--- but you chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme
: |> Agree! Agree! And I might add that I heard and read the kludge form many,
: |> many times before discovering in TNHD that it should be kluge. I've heard
: |> noone (and that's *noone*) in Europe using the kulge form.
: I can verify this. I had never heard of /klooj/ until I read TNHD. I
: have been using the word kludge since my teenage days, circa 1983.
I third that motion. At London University, early eighties, it was
definitely "kludge". We really did say that. Intentionally. I too had
never heard "klooj" until I read the Jargon File. You might as well
say that you can't pronounce "Aluminium" or "Tomato" or "Herbs".
Andy "Then again, you can't pronounce 'Aluminium'" Holyer
:-)
--
&ndy Holyer, School of Cognitive and | Now seeking work -
Computing Studies, University of Sussex, | cv/resume available by return
Brighton, UK | of eMail.
Jim Finnis
djo...@megatest.com (Dave Jones) burbled:
Hmmm.. my SO's father, who's an ecology lecturer from Aberdeen in his
late forties, has used the word "kludge", pronounced the "incorrect" way
/kluhj/ since before he can remember, certainly before the Datamation
article. It seems it was a fairly uncommon word for a Heath Robinson
gadget in Scotland in the 50's...
Maybe the problem is that we actually have two seperate but cognate words
here...
Another point is that we Britishers wouldn't pronounce it /klooj/ even if
we knew that was somehow "right"; it doesn't come easily to the British
vocal tract.. we prefer our vowels short, thank you.
Since no-one over here calls it /klooj/, I think it should be another one
of those hacker-speak enriching "Commonwealth Hackish" variants.
Incidentally, I don't know *anyone* over here who pronounces "vi" as two
letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Finnis, | Unit 6A, Science Park, Aberystwyth, Dyfed, SY23 3AH
Clef Digital Systems |
cl...@aber.ac.uk | Tel.: 0970 626601 Overseas: +44 970 626601
Tony Lezard
>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but you
>chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things up for you
>and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word by written
>transmission only.
Stop being so patronising. You weren't listening were you? In Europe it's
generally kludge, rhyming with fudge. *Fact*. This is borne out by the
postings on this thread, by private email to me (including some from
America!), and by my research chatting with people here.
The Jargon file should not be prescriptivist on anything; it should merely
report the usage of words. To try to use it to popularize your favourite
pronunciation or spelling of a word is very much against the spirit of
the file.
I'm also opposed to a Commonwealth version of the file. This sort of
division seems completely arbitrary in the face of the global nature of
the hacker community.
--
Tony Lezard
to...@mantis.co.uk
Andy Holyer
: ... in England and other places on
: the periphery of hackerdom ...
The periphery of hackerdom? *Splutter* :-) Who d'you yhing invented
these damn things, boy? If it wasn't for us, you'd all be trying to
port Unix onto abacuses (Then again...) :-)
Douglas W. Jones,201H MLH,3193350740,3193382879
by n...@trellis.cs.nott.ac.uk (Neil L Cook):
>
> ... Remember this is about how hackers *use* these
> words - if nobody but a few ancient MIT guys pronounce it /klooj/,
> then why should this be the "correct" variant?
Ancient? I'm only 41! MIT guy? I've never been to the Boston area
in my life! The word was in widespread use at Carnegie-Mellon
University in 1969, and pronounced klooj. We avoided MIT speak back
then, MIT was a rival. For example, nobody I knew at CMU ever used
the term hacker back then. To use it was to bow to the jargon of MIT,
and no real red-blooded techie -- that's Carnegie Tech, mind you --
would fall so low as to do that!
So, as far as I can tell, kluge is not a MITism. The TMRC and MIT
folks clearly used the term -- vacuums will be filled -- but the word
had a far wider circulation than hacker or crufty or all those other
MITisms.
In any case, I can't help but think "newbie" whenever I hear someone
pronounce the word as if it rhymes with sludge.
Doug Jones
jo...@cs.uiowa.edu
mathew
>Incidentally, I don't know *anyone* over here who pronounces "vi" as two
>letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
>shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
Good point. I've always said "vye", and that seems to be prevalent
amongst local hackers, although a couple of my friends say "vee eye".
mathew
Adam Boyd Roach
>
>Good point. I've always said "vye", and that seems to be prevalent
>amongst local hackers, although a couple of my friends say "vee eye".
Hmmm... I'll throw in my two cents worth and point out that
_I_ call it vee eye (although that's not really that significant,
since I used to call "a$" "a-dollar-sign" due to the fact that
I taught myself to program BASIC [back in 1978, mind you -- I was
young and really didn't know any better]), but I've never even heard
it called "vye" by anyone before. Of course, most of the people
around here are Emacs junkies anyway, so...
-Adam Roach
ad...@tamu.edu
Shaun Lowry
>Incidentally, I don't know *anyone* over here who pronounces "vi" as two
>letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
>shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
You mean "over here" as in Wales, right? I never heard it pronounced "vye"
in Britain until I met a U.S. software engineer.
Besides, "vye zcomic" doesn't work as well as an "in joke" for British CS
lecturers.
Shaun.
--
5 setlinewidth/c{/y exch def/x exch def x y moveto -10 0 rmoveto 20 0 rlineto
-10 20 rmoveto 0 -40 rlineto stroke}def 206 750 moveto 406 750 lineto 406 550
lineto 206 550 lineto closepath stroke 306 410 90 360 0 arc stroke 276 260 c 336
260 c 306 200 60 180 0 arc stroke showpage
Wendi Dunlap
>Ancient? I'm only 41! MIT guy? I've never been to the Boston area
>in my life! The word was in widespread use at Carnegie-Mellon
>University in 1969, and pronounced klooj. We avoided MIT speak back
>then, MIT was a rival. For example, nobody I knew at CMU ever used
>the term hacker back then. To use it was to bow to the jargon of MIT,
>and no real red-blooded techie -- that's Carnegie Tech, mind you --
>would fall so low as to do that!
I'm only 28, and I've always heard it as "klooj" but seen it spelled
"kludge." I'm not entirely sure when I learned it, but it was a long time
ago -- probably more than ten years.
Most likely it was at a radio station I worked at in high school where the
engineer would refer to things that were "kludged" <pronounced "kloojed").
On the other hand, my boyfriend, who's somewhat younger than I, says
"kludge". Then again, he had that same Pascal textbook that was mentioned
earlier in this thread; it's possible that that's where he learned the word.
**************************************************************
* Wendi Dunlap, Seattle, WA * litl...@mead.u.washington.edu *
**************************************************************
Chris Cannam
Adam Boyd Roach [abr...@tamuts.tamu.edu] writes:
:
: I used to call "a$" "a-dollar-sign" due to the fact that I taught
: myself to program BASIC
I always said "a-string". Oh, the levity upon reaching G.
PDP11 Hacker .....
>In article <1mFQ8M#1bP1BR8P1rfd1MjYT57gynlw=e...@snark.thyrsus.com> e...@snark.thyrsus.com (Eric S. Raymond) writes:
I didn't want to get drawn into this flame-war, but here's another data point.
>>Sorry, Commonwealth chums. I hate to be prescriptivist, in general --- but you
>>chaps have this one wrong. Not your fault; Granholme screwed things up for you
>>and for the minority of American hackers who learned the word by written
>>transmission only.
>
>Stop being so patronising. You weren't listening were you? In Europe it's
>generally kludge, rhyming with fudge. *Fact*. This is borne out by the
>postings on this thread, by private email to me (including some from
>America!), and by my research chatting with people here.
Until I read the Jargon File, I had only ever heard Kludge (rhymes with fudge),
but I had seen it spelt both ways. The favourite among the hackers in Bristol
is to spell it kluge, but pronounce it like kludge. Also, I have come across
(and used) the following expression when someone is about to do some amazing
Heath Robinson / Rube Goldberg fix to something :
'For I have a Kluge and a Good Kluge too'
- a parody of the Gilbert a Sulivan Line
For I am a Judge and a good Judge too,
which clearly doesn't work if it's pronounced klooj
>
>The Jargon file should not be prescriptivist on anything; it should merely
>report the usage of words. To try to use it to popularize your favourite
>pronunciation or spelling of a word is very much against the spirit of
>the file.
Agreed. The jargon file was originally designed to record the 'hackish'
language, not to define how to speak it.
>
>I'm also opposed to a Commonwealth version of the file. This sort of
>division seems completely arbitrary in the face of the global nature of
>the hacker community.
Since when has the hacker community ever seriously accepted any form of
division ?
>--
>Tony Lezard
>to...@mantis.co.uk
-tony
David C. Tuttle
>
>...if nobody but a few ancient MIT guys pronounce it /klooj/,
>then why should this be the "correct" variant?
I didn't go to MIT, but I learned the spelling "kluge" and
pronunciation /klooj/. (This was at Rice - late '70s & early '80s).
While there, I encountered the occasional ne'er-do-well :-) who
thought it should be spelled "kludge", but no one I met at the time
thought it should be pronounced /kluhj/.
It appears "kluge" has history on its side, but I agree that there's
nothing wrong with accepting "kludge" as a valid variant.
--
David C. Tuttle, Biomathematics ----> d...@odin.mda.uth.tmc.edu <----
University of Texas M.D. Anderson Cancer Center +1 713 792 2606
Mail Stop 237, 1515 Holcombe Boulevard, Houston, TX 77030-4096 USA
Today's anagram of "David Charles Tuttle" is: THAT CADET'LL DRIVE US
Christopher Samuel
da...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard N Kitchen) doodled:
> Ah, but moog (meaning the brand of synthesizer) is pronounced moag.
Ahh, but moog (a character in the British cartoon series "Doiley Wood")
is pronounced moog.. :-)
Chris, the irrelevant
--
Christopher Samuel, Computer Unit, U.W Aberystwyth, Aberystwyth, WALES
E-mail: c...@aber.ac.uk PGP 2.3 public key available on request
"Some say the gods are a myth, - The Waterboys
but guess who I've been dancing with." "The Return of Pan"
Adrian Corston
Everyone knows it's pronounced "siks".
:-) :-)
. Adrian Corston
. Analyst, Programmer & Technical Support
.
. adr...@internode.com.au or acor...@guest.adelaide.edu.au
. "I multitask therefore we are."
.
. Work: Internode Systems, Adelaide, South Australia
. Hobby: DEC & Unix hardware collector - always buying and selling!
Bernd Meyer
>Further up the screen Jim Finnis (cl...@aber.ac.uk) wrote:
>>
>>Incidentally, I don't know *anyone* over here who pronounces "vi" as two
>>letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
>>shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
>>
>Damn, that makes me a luser :-(
Me too - and everybody else who ever asked me why I was using it:-)
Bernie
--
We both know that the earth is round | Bernd Meyer, EE-student
So we can't see the way before us to its end | "Nobody is a failure who has
We walk on this way, hand in hand, | friends" (from: isn't it a
And I hope you are still with me behind the horizon| wonderful life?"
Bernd Meyer
>Dave Jones (djo...@megatest.com) wrote:
>: ... in England and other places on
>: the periphery of hackerdom ...
>The periphery of hackerdom? *Splutter* :-) Who d'you yhing invented
>these damn things, boy? If it wasn't for us, you'd all be trying to
>port Unix onto abacuses (Then again...) :-)
Well...... I may be totally wrong, but I have been told that Zuse was German
and built his computers in Berlin, and that Eniac was built in the USA?!?
If we talk Lady Lovelace, things get different, though :-)
John A Lambert
> In article <1993Jul27.2...@syma.sussex.ac.uk>, an...@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Andy Holyer) writes:
>> [edited]
>> Andy "Then again, you can't pronounce 'Aluminium'" Holyer
>
> word (and pronunciation) on both sides of the Atlantic.
>
> The newly-formed Aluminium Corporation of America placed an order (paid
> in advance) for a batch of stationery with a printer. When the order
> was completed, they found to their horror that their company's name had
> been misspelled as "Aluminum Corporation of America" on every sheet of
> letterhead.
>
> When they complained to the printer, the printer said "Tough." At this
> point, ALCOA had essentially two options:
>
> (a) Sue in court, and go out of business before the suit even gets
> before the judge, or
> (b) Change their name to accommodate the misspelling and live with it.
>
> And the rest is history.
>
> --
> David Barts N5JRN UW Civil Engineering, FX-10
> dav...@ce.washington.edu Seattle, WA 98195
> echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln256%Pln256/snlbx]sb3135071790101768542287578439snlbxq' |dc
--
I understood that Humphrey Davy originally called it `aluminum'.
However shortly afterwards the `-ium' ending wwas adopted as standard for the
names of metals.
As often happened, the UK & other English-speaking regions switched to the
standard, the US retianed the older spelling.
John A Lambert
Centre for Literary and Linguistic Computing
The University of Newcastle NSW 2308 Australia
Phone National (049)21 5751 Fax National (049) 21 6910
International +61 49 21 5751 International +61 49 21 6910
VAXPSI PSI%0505249626002::CCJAL AARNet cc...@cc.newcastle.edu.au
the Crisco Kid
>Further up the screen Jim Finnis (cl...@aber.ac.uk) wrote:
>>
>>letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
>>shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
>>
Don't worry, Alan. It seems to be regional. Round here, the diphonic
pronunciation is deprecated (ie, laughed at pityingly). We ancient
UNIX users use the monophonic exclusively (but use emacs for our
editing, of course).
Kay
--
6'2", dark short hair, blue eyes, bisexual and horny as ....
Kay Dekker, Dept of Industrial Design, Coventry University, Coventry UK
37 Old Winnings Road, Keresley Village, Coventry |B0 f t+ g++ k++! s+ e r p!
Phone: +44 203 838668 (work) +44 203 337865 (home) |Deflowerer-of-innocents
Kay Dekker
>I third that motion. At London University, early eighties, it was
>definitely "kludge". We really did say that. Intentionally.
Ditto for us, University of York, ca. 1976-77. Always have pronounced
it that way, always will.
Kay
--
Kay Dekker - the Vestigial Virgin of soc.bi
Kay Dekker
>There's no dichotomy between Titanium and Wolfram. There is one
>between Tungsten and Wolfram, however :-) At any rate, I know Wolfram
>is the German word for Tungsten.
I'm not sure that I could take "Steven Tungsten" seriously :)
Kay
--
Kay Dekker - the Vestigial Virgin of soc.bi
N4689 l-- a- f- n- e-- d m+ b g v+ u++ w+- (thanks, Candide!)
Thomas James Jones
In article <CANNAM.93J...@borodin.sc.ZIB-Berlin.DE>, Can...@sc.ZIB-Berlin.DE (Chris Cannam) writes:
|>
|> Adam Boyd Roach [abr...@tamuts.tamu.edu] writes:
|> :
|> : I used to call "a$" "a-dollar-sign" due to the fact that I taught
|> : myself to program BASIC
Likewise. I never knew what a-string meant, indeed I still
don't really -> why do we talk about 'strings'? Is it for 'strings
or characters'? I guess so.
ObVI: Vee Eye
ObKludge: kluDGE
tom
Meteorology General
Longish explanation about ALCOA deleted
>--
>I understood that Humphrey Davy originally called it `aluminum'.
>
>However shortly afterwards the `-ium' ending wwas adopted as standard for the
>names of metals.
>
>As often happened, the UK & other English-speaking regions switched to the
>standard, the US retianed the older spelling.
>
I have no reference for this, but the way I heard it was that Mr. Davy
actually favoured "alumium" as the name. Both the "aluminum" and
"aluminium" are later variants. I think it is much easier to avoid
the issue in the states and call it TIN (think Danny de Vito).
The Universal Dictionary (Reader's Digest) says that aluminium comes
from the new latin "alumina" combined with the (new latin) suffix "ium".
Now, can someone date "alumina" against "aluminium"?
Mick J.
mi...@mullara.met.unimelb.edu.au | Most people choose to be
Michael Johnson | shaped by their past rather
Dept. of Meteorology, Univ. of Melbourne| than mould their future.
Parkville, Australia |
Andy Trafford
>In article <23bo7a$n...@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>
> da...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard N Kitchen) doodled:
>
>> Ah, but moog (meaning the brand of synthesizer) is pronounced moag.
>
>Ahh, but moog (a character in the British cartoon series "Doiley Wood")
>is pronounced moog.. :-)
>
>Chris, the irrelevant
>--
Willo The Wisp, actually
Traff
Rich Mulvey
> an...@syma.sussex.ac.uk (Andy Holyer) writes:
>
>>Dave Jones (djo...@megatest.com) wrote:
>>: ... in England and other places on
>>: the periphery of hackerdom ...
>
>>The periphery of hackerdom? *Splutter* :-) Who d'you yhing invented
>>these damn things, boy? If it wasn't for us, you'd all be trying to
>>port Unix onto abacuses (Then again...) :-)
>
> Well...... I may be totally wrong, but I have been told that Zuse was German
> and built his computers in Berlin, and that Eniac was built in the USA?!?
>
> If we talk Lady Lovelace, things get different, though :-)
>
> Bernie
--
Hmmmm... I would suggest that you look up Alan Turing. :-)
- Rich
--
Rich Mulvey Amateur Radio: N2VDS 787 Elmwood Terrace
ri...@mulvey.com Rochester, NY 14620
haggerty
>a...@aber.ac.uk (Alun Jones) writes:
>>Further up the screen Jim Finnis (cl...@aber.ac.uk) wrote:
>>>
>>>Incidentally, I don't know *anyone* over here who pronounces "vi" as two
>>>letters; to do so over here is the sign of a luser... pronouncing it "vye" is
>>>shorter, and easier to verb. Life's rich tapestry, eh?
>>>
>>Damn, that makes me a luser :-(
>>Alun.
>And me! v.i. is very common here, but so is vye (which I hate).
>Ali Harlow.
>City University,
>London
For what it's worth - there is a file floting around called "The UNIX
Hierarchy", which under the description for one of a novice says "uses
the editor, but calls it 'vye'".
-Bruce (hagg...@acf2.nyu.edu)
Christopher Samuel
tr...@panix.com (Andy Trafford) doodled:
> In article <1993Aug1.1...@aber.ac.uk>
> c...@aber.ac.uk (Christopher Samuel) writes:
>
> >In article <23bo7a$n...@usenet.ins.cwru.edu>
> > da...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Richard N Kitchen) doodled:
> >
> >> Ah, but moog (meaning the brand of synthesizer) is pronounced moag.
> >
> >Ahh, but moog (a character in the British cartoon series "Doiley Wood")
> >is pronounced moog.. :-)
>
> Willo The Wisp, actually
Mea culpa, the cartoon is set in Doiley Wood, I was thinking back to the
version we put into AberMUD in 1987 as yet another in-joke..
Chris
Doug Spindler
: The Universal Dictionary (Reader's Digest) says that aluminium comes
: from the new latin "alumina" combined with the (new latin) suffix "ium".
: Now, can someone date "alumina" against "aluminium"?
From Encyclopedia Britannica (11th ed):
alumine[Fr] from ~1720s. Changed to alumina in 1820.
Alumium[1807], "soon" changed to aluminum -> aluminium [no
dates, however]. Alumine was clearly in use before the "n" was added, but it is
not clear if alumina was.
Doug Spindler
Michael Carley
alumina is now the word for aluminium oxide
Don Hutton
>Make of this what you will. `Kludge' does seem to be more `popular' though
>whether current popularity should affect it's definition in the Jargon file
>is a debatable point.
Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget). It's somewhere in
Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
from.
--
"I am Popeye of Borg; prepares to be askimilated. Arf, arf arf!"
Don Hutton, hut...@promis.com
Geoff Mccaughan
> Hmmmm... I would suggest that you look up Alan Turing. :-)
I've heard of looking up old friends, but this is ridiculous! 8-)
--
Geoff, Sysop Equinox (equinox.gen.nz) +64 (3) 3854406 [6 Lines]
"If you have to run heating in winter, you don't own enough computers."
Vote SPQR Ski Nix Olympica Freedom for Axolotls
Jim Finnis
hagg...@acf2.nyu.edu (haggerty) burbled:
>sg...@city.ac.uk (HARLOW A J) writes:
>
>>a...@aber.ac.uk (Alun Jones) writes:
>
>>>Damn, that makes me a luser :-(
Sorry, Alun :-)
>>And me! v.i. is very common here, but so is vye (which I hate).
>>Ali Harlow.
>>City University,
>>London
Personal perference.. I used to use vi a lot, and talk about it a lot,
and v.i. just took too long to say! Besides, most people hear at Aber
(including systems staff, lecturers, etc..) call it "vye"..
>For what it's worth - there is a file floting around called "The UNIX
>Hierarchy", which under the description for one of a novice says "uses
>the editor, but calls it 'vye'".
Well maybe I'm a newbie.. I've only been programming UNIX five years, and
I;ve only written one UNIX device driver so far..
>
>-Bruce (hagg...@acf2.nyu.edu)
>
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Finnis, | Unit 6A, Science Park, Aberystwyth, Dyfed, SY23 3AH
Clef Digital Systems |
cl...@aber.ac.uk | Tel.: 0970 626601 Overseas: +44 970 626601
Jim Finnis
hut...@pluto.dev.promis.com (Don Hutton) burbled:
> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
>the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget). It's somewhere in
>Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
>from.
That CAN'T be true! It's just *too* cool...
so...
...how's it pronounced?
> Don Hutton, hut...@promis.com
Jim Finnis
idx...@cck.coventry.ac.uk (the Crisco Kid) burbled:
>
>Don't worry, Alan. It seems to be regional. Round here, the diphonic
>
kinda like the spelling and pronunciation of Alun, then...
(I'll correct you now (hopefully) before Alun does)
It's Alun, prn. "Alin"; not Alan pron. "Alan"
> Kay
Hi, Kay, hows life?
Mark Brader
> > > The periphery of hackerdom? *Splutter* :-) Who d'you yhing invented
> > Well.... I may be totally wrong, but I have been told that Zuse was German
> > and built his computers in Berlin, and that Eniac was built in the USA?!?
> > If we talk Lady Lovelace, things get different, though :-)
For the benefit of those readers of alt.usage.english who might be
interested, but who don't read alt.folklore.computers (where I posted
this a few weeks ago), I repeat the following article. Note that
a.f.c has been dropped from the Newsgroups line for this article.
Relevance to a.u.e is marginal; followups directed to email.
#
What was the first computer and who built it?
It turns out that this is more a question of definition than a
question of fact. The computer, as we now understand the word,
was very much an evolutionary development rather than a simple
invention. This article traces the sequence of the most important
steps in that development, and in the earlier development of
digital calculators without programmability. It may help you
to decide for yourself whether you think the first computer was
the ABC, the V3 (aka Z3), the ENIAC, the SSEC, the Manchester
Mark I, the EDSAC, or perhaps yet another machine -- and how to
apportion the honor of invention among John Atanasoff, Charles
Babbage, Presper Eckert, John Mauchly, Alan Turing, John von
Neumann, Konrad Zuse, and others.
----------------------------------------------------
This article has evolved from an original version that I drafted
in 1988, and has been posted to various Usenet groups several times.
It has been prepared primarily from two sources:
Bit by Bit: An Illustrated History of Computers
by Stan Augarten
1984, Ticknor and Fields, New York
ISBN 0-89919-268-8, 0-89919-302-1 paperback
A History of Computing Technology
by Michael R. Williams
1985, Prentice-Hall, Englewood Cliffs, NJ
ISBN 0-13-389917-9
Either of these books is well worth a trip to the library to read.
(Unfortunately, finding either one in a bookstore today would be an
unlikely proposition.) Augarten is a journalist; he writes very
readably, but occasionally does not say exactly what he means.
Williams is a computer science professor; his book is superior in
technical depth, and covers additional subject areas including
analog computing and computing in ancient times.
For some material in the last part of the chronology I also
consulted:
Encyclopedia of Computer Science and Engineering, 2nd ed.
editor Anthony Ralston, associate Editor Edwin D. Reilly Jr.
1983, Van Nostrand Reinhold, New York
ISBN 0-442-24496-7
Portraits in Silicon
by Robert Slater
1987, MIT Press, Cambridge, MA
ISBN 0-262-69131-0
The Computer Comes of Age / Ainsi naquit l'informatique
by R. Moreau, English translation by J. Howlett
1981, translated 1984, MIT Press, Cambridge, MA
ISBN 0-262-36103-2
The August 1988 issue of Scientific American contained a article
about the Atanasoff-Berry machines. There is also a book by Clark
Mollenhoff about them, some information from which was forwarded to
me by email. The February 1993 issue of Scientific American
contained an article about Babbage's difference engines and the
modern-day completion of one of them.
----------------------------------------------------
I've tried to mention in this chronology each machine within the
relevant time period that meets the following criteria. First,
it must do arithmetic digitally; this eliminates, for instance,
the slide rule. Second, it must actually do the arithmetic rather
than just assisting the user's memory; I consider this to eliminate
the abacus as well as, say, Napier's Bones. Third, it must do
essentially the whole computation, with little or no assistance
from the user; you could subtract 16 on a 6-digit Pascaline by
adding 999984, but this doesn't mean we should say that a Pascaline
could subtract.
And finally, the machine must have either been technologically
innovative, or else well known and influential. For certain concepts
of special importance, I have also listed the first time they were
*described*, although they were not implemented at that time.
Where I do not describe the size of a machine, it is generally
suitable for desktop use if it has no memory and is unprogrammable
or if it is a small prototype, but would fill a small room if it has
memory or significant programmability.
The term "full-scale" is used, in contrast to "prototype", to refer
to a machine with sufficient capacity to do regular useful work.
For the sorts of machines described toward the end of the chronology,
I generally consider them "completed" when they first run a program,
even though they may be subject to further modifications and debugging.
The names Tuebingen, Wuerttemberg, and Mueller should have an
umlauted "u" in place of the "ue" used in this ASCII text.
----------------------------------------------------
A Chronology of Digital Computing Machines (to 1952)
----------------------------------------------------
1623. Wilhelm Schickard (1592-1635), of Tuebingen, Wuerttemberg
(now in Germany), makes his "Calculating Clock". This is a
6-digit machine that can add and subtract, and indicates overflow
by ringing a bell. Mounted on the machine is a set of Napier's Rods
(or Bones), a memory aid facilitating multiplications. The machine
and plans are lost and forgotten in the war that is going on.
The plans are finally rediscovered in 1935, only to be lost in war
again, and then re-rediscovered in 1956 by the same man! The machine
is reconstructed in 1960, and found to be workable.
(Schickard is a friend of the astronomer Kepler.)
1644-5. Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), of Paris, makes his "Pascaline".
This 5-digit machine uses a different carry mechanism from
Schickard's, with rising and falling weights instead of a direct
gear drive; it can be extended better to support more digits, but
it cannot subtract, and probably is less reliable than Schickard's
simpler method.
Where Schickard's machine is forgotten -- and indeed Pascal is
apparently unaware it ever existed -- Pascal's becomes well known
and establishes the computing machine concept in the intellectual
community. He makes more machines and sells about 10-15 of them,
some supporting as many as 8 digits. (Several survive to the
present day.) Patents being a thing of the future, others also
sell copies of Pascal's machine.
(Pascal is also the inventor of the bus.)
c.1668. Sir Samuel Morland (1625-1695), of England, produces a
non-decimal adding machine, suitable for use with English
money. Instead of a carry mechanism, it registers carries on
auxiliary dials, from which the user must reenter them as addends.
1674. Gottfried Wilhelm von Leibniz (1646-1716), of Leipzig,
designs his "Stepped Reckoner", which is constructed by a
man named Olivier, of Paris. It uses a movable carriage so that it
can multiply, with operands of up to 5 and 12 digits and a product
of up to 16. The user has to turn a crank once for each unit in
each digit in the multiplier; a fluted drum translates the turns
into additions. But the carry mechanism requires user intervention,
and doesn't really work in all cases anyway.
Leibniz's machine doesn't get forgotten, but it does get misplaced
in an attic within a few years -- and stays there until 1879 when
it is noticed by a man working on the leaky roof!
(Leibniz, or Leibnitz, is also the co-inventor of calculus.)
1775. Charles, the third Earl Stanhope, of England, makes a
successful multiplying calculator similar to Leibniz's.
1770-6. Mathieus Hahn, somewhere in what is now Germany, also makes
a successful multiplying calculator.
1786. J. H. Mueller, of the Hessian army, conceives the idea of
what came to be called a "difference engine". That's a
special-purpose calculator for tabulating values of a polynomial,
given the differences between certain values so that the polynomial
is uniquely specified; it's useful for any function that can be
approximated by a polynomial over suitable intervals. Mueller's
attempt to raise funds fails and the project is forgotten.
1820. Charles Xavier Thomas de Colmar (1785-1870), of France,
makes his "Arithmometer", the first mass-produced calculator.
It does multiplication using the same general approach as Leibniz's
calculator; with assistance from the user it can also do division.
Machines of this general design, large enough to occupy most of a
desktop, continue to be sold for about 90 years.
1822. Charles Babbage (1792-1871), of London, having reinvented
the difference engine, begins his (government-funded)
project to build one by constructing a 6-digit calculator using
gear technology similar to that planned for the difference engine.
1832. Babbage and Joseph Clement produce a prototype segment of
his difference engine, which operates on 6-digit numbers
and 2nd-order differences (i.e. can tabulate quadratic polynomials).
The complete engine, which would be room-sized, is planned to be
able to operate both on 6th-order differences with numbers of about
20 digits, and on 3rd-order differences with numbers of 30 digits.
Each addition would be done in two phases, the second one taking
care of any carries generated in the first. The output digits
would be punched into a soft metal plate, from which a plate for a
printing press could be made.
But there are various difficulties, and no more than this prototype
piece is ever assembled.
1834. George Scheutz, of Stockholm, produces a small difference
engine in wood, after reading a brief description of
Babbage's project.
1834. Babbage conceives, and begins to design, his "Analytical
Engine". Whether or not this machine, if built, would
have constituted a computer depends on exactly how "computer" is
being defined. One essential feature of present-day computers
is absent from the design: the "stored-program" concept, which is
necessary for implementing a compiler. The program would have
been in read-only memory, specifically in the form of punch cards.
(In this chronology, such machines will be called "programmable
calculators".)
Babbage continues to work on the design for years, though after
about 1840 the changes are minor. The machine would operate on
40-digit numbers; the "mill" (CPU) would have 2 main accumulators
and some auxiliary ones for specific purposes, while the "store"
(memory) would hold perhaps 100 more numbers. There would be
several punch card readers, for both programs and data; the cards
would be chained and the motion of each chain could be reversed.
The machine would be able to perform conditional jumps. There
would also be a form of microcoding: the meaning of instructions
would depend on the positioning of metal studs in a slotted
barrel, called the "control barrel".
The machine would do an addition in 3 seconds and a multiplication
or division in 2-4 minutes.
1842. Babbage's difference engine project is officially canceled.
(The cost overruns have been considerable, and Babbage is
spending too much time on redesigning the Analytical Engine.)
1843. Scheutz and his son Edvard Scheutz produce a 3rd-order
difference engine with printer, and the Swedish government
agrees to fund their next development.
1847-9. Babbage designs an improved, simpler difference engine,
which will operate on 7th-order differences and 31-digit
numbers, but nobody is interested in paying to have it built.
(In 1989-91, however, a team at London's Science Museum will do
just that. They will use components of modern construction, but
with tolerances no better than Clement could have provided... and,
after a bit of tinkering and detail-debugging, they will find that
the machine does indeed work.)
1853. To Babbage's delight, the Scheutzes complete the first
full-scale difference engine, which they call a Tabul-
ating Machine. It operates on 15-digit numbers and 4th-order
differences, and produces printed output as Babbage's would have.
A second machine is later built to the same design by the firm
of Brian Donkin of London.
1858. The first Tabulating Machine is bought by the Dudley
Observatory in Albany, New York, and the second one by
the British government. The Albany machine is used to produce
a set of astronomical tables; but the observatory's director is
then fired for this extravagant purchase, and the machine is
never seriously used again, eventually ending up in a museum.
The second machine, however, has a long and useful life.
1871. Babbage produces a prototype section of the Analytical
Engine's mill and printer.
1878. Ramon Verea, living in New York City, invents a calculator
with an internal multiplication table; this is much faster
than the shifting carriage or other digital methods. He isn't
interested in putting it into production; he just wants to show that
a Spaniard can invent as well as an American.
1879. A committee investigates the feasibility of completing the
Analytical Engine and concludes that it is impossible now
that Babbage is dead. The project is then largely forgotten and is
unknown to most of the people mentioned in the last part of this
chronology -- though Howard Aiken is an exception.
1885. A multiplying calculator more compact than the Arithmometer
enters mass production. The design is the independent, and
more or less simultaneous, invention of Frank S. Baldwin, of the
United States, and T. Odhner, a Swede living in Russia. The fluted
drums are replaced by a "variable-toothed gear" design: a disk with
radial pegs that can be made to protrude or retract from it.
1886. Dorr E. Felt (1862-1930), of Chicago, makes his "Comptometer".
This is the first calculator where the operands are entered
merely by pressing keys rather than having to be, for example, dialed
in. It is feasible because of Felt's invention of a carry mechanism
fast enough to act while the keys return from being pressed.
1889. Felt invents the first printing desk calculator.
1890. US Census results are tabulated for the first time with sig-
nificant mechanical aid: the punch card tabulators of Herman
Hollerith (1860-1929) of MIT, Cambridge, Mass. This is the start of
the punch card industry. The cost of the census tabulation is 98%
*higher* than the previous one, in part because of the temptation to
use the machines to the fullest and tabulate more data than formerly
possible, but the tabulation is completed in a much shorter time.
Another precedent is that the cards are read electrically.
(Contrary to popular impression and to earlier versions of this
chronology, Hollerith's cards of 1890 are not the same size as
US paper money of the time; they are much smaller. Other sizes of
punch cards will also appear within a few years.)
1892. William S. Burroughs (1857-1898), of St. Louis, invents a
machine similar to Felt's but more robust, and this is the
one that really starts the office calculator industry.
(This machine is still hand powered, but it won't be many years
before electric calculators appear.)
1906. Henry Babbage, Charles's son, with the help of the firm of
R. W. Munro, completes the mill of his father's Analytical
Engine, just to show that it would have worked. It does. The
complete machine is never produced.
1919. W. H. Eccles and F. W. Jordan publish the first flip-flop
circuit design.
1931-2. E. Wynn-Williams, at Cambridge, England, uses thyratron
tubes to construct a binary digital counter for use in
connection with physics experiments.
1935. International Business Machines introduces the "IBM 601",
a punch card machine with an arithmetic unit based on relays
and capable of doing a multiplication in 1 second. The machine
becomes important both in scientific and commercial computation,
and about 1500 of them are eventually made.
1937. George Stibitz (c.1910-) of the Bell Telephone Laboratories
(Bell Labs), New York City, constructs a demonstration 1-bit
binary adder using relays.
1937. Alan M. Turing (1912-1954), of Cambridge University, England,
publishes a paper on "computable numbers". This paper solves
a mathematical problem, but the solution is achieved by reasoning
(as a mathematical device) about the theoretical simplified computer
known today as a Turing machine.
1938. Claude E. Shannon (1916-) publishes a paper on the
implementation of symbolic logic using relays.
1938. Konrad Zuse (1910-) of Berlin, with some assistance from
Helmut Schreyer, completes a prototype mechanical binary
programmable calculator, originally called the "V1" but retroactively
renamed "Z1" after the war. It works with floating point numbers
having a 7-bit exponent, 16-bit mantissa, and a sign bit. The
memory uses sliding metal parts to store 16 such numbers, and works
well; but the arithmetic unit is less successful.
The program is read from punched tape -- not paper tape, but
discarded 35 mm movie film. Data values can be entered from a
numeric keyboard, and outputs are displayed on electric lamps.
Nov 1939. John V. Atanasoff (1903-) and graduate student Clifford
Berry (?-1963), of Iowa State College (now the Iowa State
University), Ames, Iowa, complete a prototype 16-bit adder. This is
the first machine to calculate using vacuum tubes.
1939. Zuse and Schreyer begin work on the "V2" (later "Z2"),
which will marry the Z1's existing mechanical memory unit to
a new arithmetic unit using relay logic. The project is interrupted
for a year when Zuse is drafted.
(Zuse is a friend of Wernher von Braun, who will later develop the
*other* "V2", and after that, play a key role in the US space program.)
1939-40. Schreyer completes a prototype 10-bit adder using vacuum
tubes, and a prototype memory using neon lamps.
Jan 1940. At Bell Labs, Samuel Williams and Stibitz complete a
calculator which can operate on complex numbers, and give
it the imaginative name of the "Complex Number Calculator"; it is
later known as the "Model I Relay Calculator". It uses telephone
switching parts for logic: 450 relays and 10 crossbar switches.
Numbers are represented in "plus 3 BCD"; that is, for each decimal
digit, 0 is represented by binary 0011, 1 by 0100, and so on up to
1100 for 9; this scheme requires fewer relays than straight BCD.
Rather than requiring users to come to the machine to use it, the
calculator is provided with three remote keyboards, at various
places in the building, in the form of teletypes. Only one can be
used at a time, and the output is automatically displayed on the
same one. In September 1940, a teletype is set up at a mathematical
conference in Hanover, New Hampshire, with a connection to New York,
and those attending the conference can use the machine remotely.
1940. Zuse is released from the army and completes the Z2.
It works better than the Z1, but isn't reliable enough.
(Later he is drafted again, and released again.)
Summer 1941. Atanasoff and Berry complete a special-purpose calcu-
lator for solving systems of simultaneous linear equations,
later called the "ABC" ("Atanasoff-Berry Computer"). This has 60
50-bit words of memory in the form of capacitors (with refresh
circuits -- the first regenerative memory) mounted on two revolving
drums. The clock speed is 60 Hz, and an addition takes 1 second.
For secondary memory it uses punch cards, moved around by the user.
The holes are not actually punched in the cards, but burned. The
punch card system's error rate is never reduced beyond 0.001%, and
this isn't really good enough.
(Atanasoff will leave Iowa State after the US enters the war, and
this will end his work on digital computing machines.)
Dec 1941. Now working with limited backing from the DVL (German Aero-
nautical Research Institute), Zuse completes the "V3" (later
"Z3"): the first operational programmable calculator. It works with
floating point numbers having a 7-bit exponent, 14-bit mantissa
(with a "1" bit automatically prefixed unless the number is 0),
and a sign bit. The memory holds 64 of these words and therefore
requires over 1400 relays; there are 1200 more in the arithmetic
and control units.
The program, input, and output are implemented as described above for
the Z1. Conditional jumps are not available. The machine can do 3-4
additions per second, and takes 3-5 seconds for a multiplication.
It is a marginal decision whether to call the Z3 a prototype; with
its small memory it is certainly not very useful on the equation-
solving problems that the DVL was mostly interested in.
Jan 1943. Howard H. Aiken (1900-1973) and his team at Harvard
University, Cambridge, Mass. (with IBM's backing), complete
the "ASCC Mark I" ("Automatic Sequence-Controlled Calculator Mark I"),
also called the "Harvard Mark I". This electromechanical machine is
the first programmable calculator to be widely known: Aiken is to
Zuse as Pascal to Schickard.
The machine is 51 feet long, weighs 5 tons, and incorporates 750,000
parts. It includes 72 accumulators, each incorporating its own arith-
metic unit as well as a mechanical register with a capacity of 23
digits plus sign. (See the ENIAC entry, below, for a more detailed
description of such an architecture.) The arithmetic is fixed-point,
with a plugboard setting determining the number of decimal places.
I/O facilities include card readers, a card punch, paper tape readers,
and typewriters. There are 60 sets of rotary switches, each of which
can be used as a constant register -- sort of a mechanical read-only
memory.
The program is read from one paper tape; data can be read from the
other tapes, or the card readers, or from the constant registers.
Conditional jumps are not available. However, in later years the
machine is modified to support multiple paper tape readers for the
program, with the transfer from one to another being conditional,
sort of like a conditional subroutine call. Another addition allows
the provision of plugboard-wired subroutines callable from the tape.
Apr 1943. Max Newman, Wynn-Williams, and their team at the secret
Government Code and Cypher School, Bletchley Park, Bletchley,
England, complete the "Heath Robinson". This is a specialized machine
for cipher-breaking, not a general-purpose calculator or computer but
some sort of logic device, using a combination of electronics and relay
logic. It reads data optically at 2000 characters per second from
2 closed loops of paper tape, each typically about 1000 characters long.
(The secrecy that surrounded this machine and its successors at
Bletchley Park will still be partially in effect at the time of
writing, hence the vague description. Newman knew Turing from
Cambridge, and had been the first person to see a draft of Turing's
1937 paper. Heath Robinson is the name of a British cartoonist known
for drawings of comical machines, like the American Rube Goldberg.
Two later machines in the series will be named for London stores
with "Robinson" in their names!)
Sep 1943. Williams and Stibitz complete the "Relay Interpolator",
later called the "Model II Relay Calculator". This is a
programmable calculator; again, the program and data are read from
paper tapes. An innovative feature is that, for greater reliability,
numbers are represented in a biquinary format using 7 relays for
each digit, of which exactly 2 should be "on": 01 00001 for 0,
01 00010 for 1, and so on up to 10 10000 for 9.
(Some of the later machines in this series used the biquinary
notation for the digits of floating-point numbers.)
Dec 1943. H. T. Flowers and his team at Bletchley Park complete the
the first "Colossus". This successor to the "Robinson"
series machines is entirely electronic, incorporating 2400 vacuum
tubes for logic. It has 5 paper tape loop readers, each working
at 5000 characters per second.
(10 Colossi will eventually be built. Turing also has an important
role at Bletchley Park, but does not work directly on the machines.)
1944-5. Zuse almost completes his first full-scale machine, the "V4"
(later "Z4"), which resembles his earlier designs. Its
memory reverts to the Z1's mechanical design, storing 1000 words of
32 bits in less then a cubic meter; the equivalent in relays would
have filled a large room.
As the war begins to go very badly for Germany, Zuse's work is dis-
rupted several times, and then abandoned for the duration. An air
raid had destroyed the Z3 in 1943, but the incomplete Z4 survives the
war's end in a basement.
1945. Zuse invents a programming language called Plankalkul.
Jun 1945. John von Neumann (1903-1957) joins the ENIAC team and
drafts a report describing the future computer eventually
built as the "EDVAC" ("Electronic Discrete Variable Automatic
Computer" (!)); this is the first description of the design of a
stored-program computer, and gives rise to the term "von Neumann
computer".
The first draft of the report fails to credit other team members
such as Eckert and Mauchly; when this version becomes widely
circulated, von Neumann gets somewhat too much credit for the
design. The final version corrects the oversight, but too late.
(Von Neumann, also noted for his mental calculating ability, is
the only one of the principal computer pioneers in the US familiar
with Turing's 1937 paper.)
Nov 1945. John W. Mauchly (pronounced Mawkly; 1907-80) and J. Presper
Eckert (1919-) and their team at the Moore School of Electrical
Engineering, of the University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, complete
a secret project for the US Army's Ballistics Research Lab: a program-
mable calculator called the "ENIAC" ("Electronic Numerator, Integrator,
Analyzer, and Computer").
The ENIAC's architecture resembles that of the Harvard Mark I, but
its components are entirely electronic, incorporating 17,468 vacuum
tubes. The machine weighs 30 tons, covers about 1000 square feet
of floor, and consumes 130 or 140 kilowatts of electricity.
The machine incorporates 20 accumulators (the original plan was for 4).
The accumulators and other units are all connected by several data
buses, and a set of "program lines" for synchronization. Each accum-
ulator stores a 10-digit number, using 10 bits to represent each digit,
and also incorporates circuits to add a number from a bus to the
stored number, and to transmit the stored number or its complement to
a bus.
A separate unit can perform multiplication (in about 3 milliseconds),
while another does division and square roots; the inputs and outputs
for both these units use the buses. There are constant registers, as
on the Harvard Mark I: 104 12-digit registers forming an array called
the "function table". 100 of these registers are directly addressable
by a 2-digit number from a bus (the others are used for interpolations).
Finally, a card reader is available to input data values, and there
is a card punch for output.
The program is set up on a plugboard -- this is considered reasonable
since the same or similar program would generally be used for weeks
at a time. For example, connecting certain sockets would cause
accumulator 1 to transmit its contents onto data bus 1 when a pulse
arrived on program line 1; meanwhile several accumulators could be
adding the value from that data bus to their stored value, while
others could be working independently. The program lines are pulsed
under the control of a master unit, which can perform iterations.
The ENIAC's clock speed is 100 kHz.
Mauchly and Eckert apply for a patent. The university disputes this
at first, but they settle. The patent is finally granted in 1964,
but is overturned in 1973, in part because of the previous work by
Atanasoff, with which Mauchly was acquainted.
(The BRL wanted the ENIAC to use on the difficult problem of making
aiming tables for use by artillerymen. It isn't ready in time for
the war, and overruns its original budget by 225% -- problems that
will face Eckert and Mauchly again on later projects.)
Feb 1946. The ENIAC is revealed to the public.
Jul-Aug 1946. The Moore School gives a course on "Theory and Techniques
for Design of Electronic Computers"; lectures are given by
Eckert, Mauchly, Stibitz, von Neumann, and Aiken among others. The
course leads to several projects being started, among them the EDSAC.
Jul 1947. Aiken and his team complete the "Harvard Mark II", a large
programmable calculator using relays both for its 50 floating-
point registers and for the arithmetic unit, 13,000 of them in all.
Sep 1947. A moth (?-1947) makes the mistake of flying into the Harvard
Mark II. A whimsical technician makes the logbook entry "first
actual case of bug being found", and annotates it by taping down the
remains of the moth.
(The term "bug" was of course already in use; that's why it's funny.)
1947. Frederick Viehe (?-1960), of Los Angeles, applies for a patent
on an invention which is to use magnetic core memory.
c.1947. The magnetic drum memory is independently invented by several
people, and the first examples are constructed.
(As noted below, some early machines will use drums as main memory
rather than secondary memory.)
Jan 1948. Wallace Eckert (1902-1971, no relation to Presper Eckert)
of IBM, with his team, completes the "SSEC" ("Selective
Sequence Electronic Calculator"). This technological hybrid has
8 vacuum tube registers, 150 words of relay memory, and 66 paper
tape loops storing a total of 20,000 words. The word size is
20 digits, stored in BCD in the registers.
As with the Harvard Mark I in its later form, the machine can be
switched to read instructions from any of the paper tapes. There
is also some use of plugboards in its programming. But it can
also cache some instructions in memory and read them from there;
thus, in effect, it can operate either as a stored-program computer
(with a very small program memory) or not. Because it can do this,
IBM's point of view is that this is the first computer.
Jun 1948. Newman, F. C. Williams, and their team at Manchester Uni-
versity, Manchester, England, complete a prototype machine,
the "Mark I" (also called the "Manchester Mark I"). This is the
first machine that everyone would call a computer, because it's the
first with a true stored-program capability.
It uses a new type of memory developed by F. C. Williams (possibly
after an original suggestion by Presper Eckert), which uses the
residual charges left on the screen of a CRT after the electron
beam has been fired at it. (The bits are read by firing another
beam through them and reading the voltage at an electrode beyond
the screen.) This is a little unreliable but is fast, and also
relatively cheap because it can use existing CRT designs; and it is
much more compact than any other memory then existing. The Mark I's
main memory of 32 32-bit words occupies a single Williams tube.
(Other CRTs on the machine are less densely used: one contains only
an accumulator.)
The Mark I's programs are initially entered in binary on a keyboard,
and the output is read in binary from another CRT. Later Turing
joins the team (see also the "Pilot ACE", below) and devises a primi-
tive form of assembly language, one of several developed at about the
same time in different places.
Sep 1948. The ENIAC is improved, using ideas from Richard F. Clipper of
the BRL and Nicholas Metropolis of Los Alamos. Each program line
is permanently wired for a different operation, and a new converter
unit allows them to be addressed by a program, the way the function
table can -- thus implementing, in effect, opcodes. With this change,
the program can now be entered via the *function table*.
(This conversion will sometimes be described as making the ENIAC into a
stored-program computer, but the program memory is still read-only.
However, setting up a program now takes a matter of hours, rather than
days as before.)
Fall 1948. IBM introduces the "IBM 604", a programmable calculator
and card punch using vacuum tubes. It can read a card,
perform up to 60 arithmetic operations in 80 milliseconds, and punch
the results on the same card. The programming is by plugboard.
All machines first mentioned in the chronology from here on are
stored-program computers.
1949-51. Jay W. Forrester and his team at MIT construct the
"Whirlwind" for the US Navy's Office of Research and
Inventions. The vague date is because its advance to full-time
operational status is gradual. Its original form has 3300 tubes
and 8900 crystal diodes. It occupies 2500 square feet of floor.
Its 2048 16-bit words of CRT memory use up $32,000 worth of tubes
each month. There is also a graphical I/O device consisting of a
CRT (only one dot can be displayed at a time) and a light pen.
This allows the machine to be used for air traffic control.
The Whirlwind is the first computer designed for real-time work;
it can do 500,000 additions or 50,000 multiplications per second.
Spring 1949. Forrester conceives the idea of magnetic core memory as
it is to become commonly used, with a grid of wires used to
address the cores. The first practical form, in 1952-53, will replace
the Whirlwind's CRT memory and render obsolete all types of main
memory then existing.
April 1949. The Manchester Mark I, its main memory now upgraded to
128 40-bit words (on two CRTs), acquires a secondary memory
in the form of a magnetic drum holding a further 1024 words. Also
at about this time, two index registers are added to the machine.
May 1949. Maurice Wilkes (1913-) and his team at Cambridge Uni-
versity complete the "EDSAC" ("Electronic Delay Storage
Automatic Computer"), which is closely based on the EDVAC design
report from von Neumann's group -- Wilkes had attended the 1946
Moore School course. The project is supported both financially
and with technical personnel from J. Lyons & Co. Ltd., a large
British firm in the food and restaurant business.
This is the first full-scale operational stored-program computer,
and is therefore the final candidate for the title of "the first
computer".
Its main memory is of a type that had existed for some years, but
had not been used for a computing machine: the "ultrasonic delay
line" memory. It had been invented originally by William Shockley
of Bell Labs (also one of the co-inventors of the transistor, in
1948), and Eckert had made an improved version in connection with
radar systems. It works by repeatedly converting from the usual
electrical data pulses to ultrasonic pulses directed along, typic-
ally, the length of a tank of mercury; on arrival at the other end,
the pulses are converted back to electrical form. The memory must
be maintained at a particular temperature, and only the few bits
currently in electrical form are accessible. In the EDSAC, 16 tanks
of mercury give a total of 256 35-bit words (or 512 17-bit words).
The clock speed of the EDSAC is 500 kHz; most instructions take
about 1500 ms to execute. Its I/O is by paper tape, and a set of
constant registers is provided for booting.
The software eventually supports the concept of relocatable proce-
dures with addresses bound at load time.
Aug 1949. Eckert and Mauchly, having formed their own company,
complete the "BINAC" ("Binary Automatic Computer") for the
US Air Force. Designed as a first step to in-flight computers, this
has dual (redundant) processors each with 700 tubes and 512 31-bit
words of memory. Each processor occupies only 4 square feet of floor
space and can do 3500 additions or 1000 multiplications per second.
The designers are thinking mostly of their forthcoming "UNIVAC"
("Universal Automatic Computer") and don't spend much time making
the BINAC as reliable as it should be, but the tandem processors
compensate somewhat.
Sep 1949. Aiken's team completes the "Harvard Mark III". This
computer has separate magnetic drum memories for data and
instructions. Only some of the data drums can be addressed by
the CPU; the others serve as secondary memory. The total memory
capacity is 4000 instructions, 350 16-bit words in the main data
drums, and 4000 words more in the secondary memory. The machine
contains over 5000 vacuum tubes and 2000 relays.
May 1950. A group at the National Physical Laboratory, Teddington,
England, complete the "Pilot ACE" (pilot project for an
"Automatic Computing Engine"). This had been largely designed by
Turing when he was there in 1945-47; he had left and gone to Manches-
ter because the designs were not being implemented. The main memory
of this computer is in the form of 200 separate ultrasonic delay
lines, thus allowing better addressability than other ultrasonic-
based machines. An additional group of short delay lines serve as
registers, each of which performs a particular operation automatic-
ally on a number directed to it. Most operations then consist simply
of routing a number, or a counted stream of numbers, from one delay
line to another. Punch cards are used for input and output; a drum
will be added later for secondary memory.
(A successor to this machine will be named "DEUCE".)
1950. Zuse's Z4 is finally completed and goes into service at
ETH (Federal Polytechical Institute) in Zurich, Switzerland.
The design is modified so that it can do conditional jumps. The
machine also implements a form of intstruction pipelining, with the
program tape being read 2 instructions ahead and various optimiz-
ations performed automatically.
The Z4 remains in use for 5 years at ETH and 5 more in France, and
Zuse soon begins making his machines commercially. He eventually
sells some 300 machines before being bought out by Siemens.
1950. Douglas Hartree (the leading expert in the country on the
specialized computing machines called differential analyzers)
gives his professional opinion to Ferranti Ltd., of Manchester:
as the 3 existing computer projects will suffice to handle all the
calculations that will ever be needed in Britain, Ferranti would be
well advised to drop the idea of making computers for commercial sale.
Feb 1951. A rather more optimistic Ferranti Ltd. completes the first
commercial computer. This is yet another "Mark I", but is
also known as the "Manchester Mark II", "MUDC", "MUEDC", and "MADAM"!
It has 256 40-bit words of main memory and 16K words of drum, and
includes 8 index registers. An eventual total of 8 of these machines
are sold.
(The index register's contents are added, not to the address taken
from an instruction, but to the entire instruction, thus potentially
changing the opcode! Calling Mel...)
Mar 1951. Presper Eckert and Mauchly, having sold their company to
Remington Rand, complete the first "UNIVAC", which is the
first US commercial computer. (The US census department is the first
customer.) It has 1000 12-digit words of ultrasonic delay line memory
and can do 8333 additions or 555 multiplications per second; it con-
tains 5000 tubes and covers 200 square feet of floor. For secondary
memory it uses magnetic tapes of nickel-coated bronze; these are 1/2
inch wide, and store 128 characters per inch.
Fall 1951. The Lyons company receives its reward for supporting the
EDSAC, as T. R. Thompson and his team complete the "LEO I"
("Lyons Electronic Office I"), which is modeled closely after the
EDSAC. Its ultrasonic memory is 4 times as large, and avoids the
usual temperature dependency by using one delay line as a master
and synchronizing the others to it instead of to a clock.
The Lyons company wants the LEO I for its own use -- payroll, inven-
tory, and so on; it is the first computer used for commercial calcul-
ations. But other companies now turn out to be interested in the LEO,
and Lyons will soon find itself in the computer manufacturing business
as well.
1951. Grace Murray Hopper (1906-1992), of Remington Rand, invents
the modern concept of the compiler.
1952. The EDVAC is finally completed. It has 4000 tubes, 10,000
crystal diodes, and 1024 44-bit words of ultrasonic memory.
Its clock speed is 1 MHz.
1952. The IBM "Defense Calculator", later renamed the "701", the
first IBM computer unless you count the SSEC, enters
production at Poughkeepsie, New York. (The first one is delivered
in March 1953; 19 are sold altogether. The machine is available
with 2048 or 4096 36-bit words of CRT memory; it does 2200 multi-
plications per second.)
1952. Grace Murray Hopper implements the first compiler, the "A-0".
(But as with "first computer", this is a somewhat arbitrary
designation.)
----------------------------------------------------
A few things have happened since then, too, but this margin is too
narrow...
--
Mark Brader, SoftQuad Inc., Toronto, utzoo!sq!msb, m...@sq.com
Nature is often much more interesting than we would like her to be.
However when we finally do understand something, we strike our
foreheads and cry "Of course!", and then marvel at how beautifully
simple it was all the time. -- Leigh Palmer
This article is in the public domain.
Lars R{der Clausen
>Personal perference.. I used to use vi a lot, and talk about it a lot,
>and v.i. just took too long to say! Besides, most people hear at Aber
>(including systems staff, lecturers, etc..) call it "vye"..
I just now notice that this pronounciation could equally well be of the
word 'Why?', which quite succintly describes my feelings about vi.
-Lars
--
Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing left to add, but when there
is nothing left to take away. Antoine de St. Exupery
Dik T. Winter
> cs9...@brunel.ac.uk (Nik Clayton) writes:
>
> >Make of this what you will. `Kludge' does seem to be more `popular' though
> >whether current popularity should affect it's definition in the Jargon file
> >is a debatable point.
>
> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
> the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget).
Neither: Cluj.
> It's somewhere in
> Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
> from.
True enough (have been there). So henceforth the spelling is Cluj.
--
dik t. winter, cwi, kruislaan 413, 1098 sj amsterdam, nederland
home: bovenover 215, 1025 jn amsterdam, nederland; e-mail: d...@cwi.nl
Rich Wales
Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as
the name of the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I
forget). It's somewhere in Transylvania . . . .
That's Cluj (pronounced "kloozh"; Romanian "j" sounds like French "j").
--
Rich Wales (VE3HKZ, WA6SGA/VE3) // Mortice Kern Systems Inc.
ri...@mks.com // 35 King Street North
+1 519 884-2251; fax: 884-8861 // Waterloo, Ontario, Canada N2J 2W9
Ted Schuerzinger
ri...@mks.com (Rich Wales) writes:
> Don Hutton wrote:
>
> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as
> the name of the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I
> forget). It's somewhere in Transylvania . . . .
>
> That's Cluj (pronounced "kloozh"; Romanian "j" sounds like French "j").
Isn't the full name Cluj-Napoca, anyway?
--Ted Schuerzinger
z...@Dartmouth.EDU
Den Glaubenden gehoert die Ewigkeit.
Lennart Regebro
>>>`kluge': rouge, stooge, Scrooge, and luge. (Lugeing is a winter Olympic
>>>sport native to Scandinavia.)
>>
>>Enlighten me. I have never heard of lugeing.
>
>Imagine going down a hill of ice on a couple of planks wearing nothing
>for protection but a helmet and a body-sized condom....
Ah. That sport. It's called something completely different in Scandinavia.
AlthoughI can't remember what at the moment. Bobsleigh is usually called
Bob, but I can't remeber this name.
--
Lennart Regebro, Stacken Computer Club reg...@stacken.kth.se
Any Opinion expressed above is (c) Rent-An-Opinion(tm). It is not an Opinion
of either Lennart Regebro or the Stacken Computer Club.
Ian_Cornell DONALDSON
> don't really -> why do we talk about 'strings'? Is it for 'strings
> or characters'? I guess so.
Come on, surely EVERYONE knows that an A-string is a device Tim Brooke
Taylor uses to cover his belly-button ...
(Americans might not get this)
Ian
Lennart Regebro
>>>Imagine going down a hill of ice on a couple of planks wearing nothing
>>>for protection but a helmet and a body-sized condom....
>>
>>Ah. That sport.
>
>Sounds like skiing to me....
Nonono. Skiing involves two sticks for balance.
Robert L. McMillin
In article <mjcarley....@unix2.tcd.ie> mjca...@unix2.tcd.ie (Michael Carley) writes:
> In <23mah2...@jmf-amct.al.alcoa.com> spin...@al.alcoa.com (Doug Spindler) writes:
> alumina is now the word for aluminium oxide
It probably was then, too. Misty memory tells me that back in those
days, the process to convert alumina (the oxide) to aluminum (the
now-common metal) was unknown. Metallic aluminum was actually more
valuable than gold! I remember seeing a ceremonial helmet Napolean had
made for himself of half gold and half aluminum. At the time, this was
considered an ultimate extravagance.
--
Robert L. McMillin | Surf City Software | r...@helen.surfcty.com | Dude!
Translations from the Clintonese available on request.
--
Robert L. McMillin | Surf City Software | r...@helen.surfcty.com | Dude!
Translations from the Clintonese available on request.
Traff
>In article <CAsAC...@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca> dagb...@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca (Dave Brown) writes:
>
>>
>>Imagine going down a hill of ice on a couple of planks wearing nothing
>>for protection but a helmet and a body-sized condom....
>
>Ah. That sport. It's called something completely different in Scandinavia.
>AlthoughI can't remember what at the moment. Bobsleigh is usually called
>Bob, but I can't remeber this name.
>
>--
>Lennart Regebro, Stacken Computer Club reg...@stacken.kth.se
Michael Covington
>In article <hutton.7...@news.promis.com>
> hut...@pluto.dev.promis.com (Don Hutton) burbled:
>
>> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
>>the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget). It's somewhere in
>>Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
>>from.
>
>That CAN'T be true! It's just *too* cool...
Cluj-Napoca, Romania. Pronounced "klooj" of course.
--
:- Michael A. Covington, Associate Research Scientist : *****
:- Artificial Intelligence Programs mcov...@ai.uga.edu : *********
:- The University of Georgia phone 706 542-0358 : * * *
:- Athens, Georgia 30602-7415 U.S.A. amateur radio N4TMI : ** *** ** <><
Robert L. McMillin
In article <1993Aug4.0...@aber.ac.uk> cl...@aber.ac.uk (Jim Finnis) writes:
> In article <hutton.7...@news.promis.com>
> hut...@pluto.dev.promis.com (Don Hutton) burbled:
>> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
>>the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget). It's somewhere in
>>Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
>>from.
> That CAN'T be true! It's just *too* cool...
> ...how's it pronounced?
"Bug".
umi...@foobar.hanse.de
>ro...@umibox.hanse.de (Bernd Meyer) writes:
>> Well...... I may be totally wrong, but I have been told that Zuse was German
>> and built his computers in Berlin, and that Eniac was built in the USA?!?
>>
>> If we talk Lady Lovelace, things get different, though :-)
>>
>> Bernie
>--
> Hmmmm... I would suggest that you look up Alan Turing. :-)
Makes me think - Turing "designed" a computer that was easy, proven to be
able to do everything, and had just this one problem that it needed an
infinitly long paper-strip.... Did someone ever actually bother to build it
(with a LOOOONG strip)? Has one (even a simulated one) ever done ANYTHING
useful?
Bernie
Guy Dawson
In article <1993Aug2.0...@cs.su.oz.au>, t...@cs.su.oz.au (Thomas James Jones) writes:
>
> In article <CANNAM.93J...@borodin.sc.ZIB-Berlin.DE>, Can...@sc.ZIB-Berlin.DE (Chris Cannam) writes:
> |>
> |> Adam Boyd Roach [abr...@tamuts.tamu.edu] writes:
> |> :
> |> : I used to call "a$" "a-dollar-sign" due to the fact that I taught
> |> : myself to program BASIC
>
> Likewise. I never knew what a-string meant, indeed I still
> don't really -> why do we talk about 'strings'? Is it for 'strings
> or characters'? I guess so.
Definatly for strings - the string was the basic data type.
A single character was stored and managed as a single character
string and not a byte.
Guy
--
-- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Guy Dawson - Hoskyns Group Plc.
gu...@hoskyns.co.uk Tel Hoskyns UK - 71 251 2128
gu...@austin.ibm.com Tel IBM Austin USA - 512 838 2334
J J Farrell
>>>Ali Harlow.
I always thought it was pronounced "six".
My opinions. I do not speak for my employer.
James Petts
(Robert L. McMillin) wrote:
> On Wed, 4 Aug 1993 09:10:41 GMT, cl...@aber.ac.uk (Jim Finnis) said:
>
> In article <1993Aug4.0...@aber.ac.uk> cl...@aber.ac.uk (Jim Finnis) writes:
>
> > In article <hutton.7...@news.promis.com>
> > hut...@pluto.dev.promis.com (Don Hutton) burbled:
>
> >> Well, I think that it should be spelled the same way as the name of
> >>the town in Romania ("Kluge" or "Kludge", I forget). It's somewhere in
> >>Transylvania and would be an appropriate place for evil programming to come
> >>from.
>
> > That CAN'T be true! It's just *too* cool...
>
> > ...how's it pronounced?
>
> "Bug".
Wrong! The Bug is a river (in Poland or Ukraine ?)
--
===> James Petts <===
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I feel that if a person can't communicate, the very least he can
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Rich Mulvey
--
Well.... it was a model used to show computability. Many CS students
have had the pleasure of building Turing Machines as course projects.
Myself included. :-) You can't do really useful work with them, as they
are just *too* basic. As for being able to do "anything", that won't
happen until P=NP. :-)
- Rich
--
Rich Mulvey Amateur Radio: N2VDS 787 Elmwood Terrace
ri...@mulvey.com 44.69.128.251 Rochester, NY 14620