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OT: God Save The President?

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TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 3:59:19 PM1/20/09
to
Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?

The melody did seem familiar.

TOF

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:12:27 PM1/20/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>

"My Country 'Tis of Thee".

Her actual performance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE

>The melody did seem familiar.
>

It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:16:44 PM1/20/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 21:12:27 +0000, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>>
>
>"My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>
>Her actual performance:
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>
>>The melody did seem familiar.
>>
>It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.

See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_save_the_queen

Particularly:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_save_the_queen#Use_elsewhere

The first German national anthem used the melody of "God Save the King"
with the words changed to Heil dir im Siegerkranz, and sung to the same
tune as the UK version. The tune was either used or officially adopted as
the national anthem for several other countries, including those of Russia
(until 1833) and Switzerland (Rufst Du, mein Vaterland or O monts
indépendants, until 1961). Molitva russkikh, considered to be the first
Russian anthem, was also sung to the same music.

It is also the melody to the United States patriotic hymn "America" (also
known by its first line, "My Country, 'Tis of Thee"), and was played
during the Presidential Inauguration parade of President George W. Bush on
20 January, 2001 and sung by Aretha Franklin prior to the inauguration of
Barack H. Obama on 20 January, 2009. In Iceland it is sung to the poem of
Eldgamla Ísafold. The tune is also used as Norway's royal anthem entitled
Kongesangen, and was used for the Swedish royal anthem between 1805 and
1893, entitled Bevare gud vår kung.

The tune is still used as the national anthem of Liechtenstein, Oben am
jungen Rhein. When England played Liechtenstein in a Euro 2004 qualifier,
the same tune was therefore played twice, causing some minor confusion.

The melody of "God Save the King" has been, and continues to be, used as a
hymn tune by Christian churches in various countries. The United
Methodists of the southern United States, Mexico, and Latin America, among
other denominations (usually Protestant), play the same melody as a hymn.
The Christian hymn "Glory to God on High" is frequently sung to the same
tune, as well as an alternative tune that fits both lyrics.

TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:24:03 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 21, 8:12 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net>
wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>
> Her actual performance:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>
> >The melody did seem familiar.
>
> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>


Do you know the provenance of the melody?

TOF

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:41:08 PM1/20/09
to

No.
http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page5010.asp#

The British National Anthem dates back to the eighteenth century.

'God Save The King' was a patriotic song first publicly performed in
London in 1745, which came to be known as the National Anthem at the
beginning of the nineteenth century.

The words and tune are anonymous, and may date back to the seventeenth
century.

In September 1745 the 'Young Pretender' to the British Throne, Prince
Charles Edward Stuart, defeated the army of King George II at Prestonpans,
near Edinburgh.

In a fit of patriotic fervour after news of Prestonpans had reached
London, the leader of the band at the Theatre Royal, Drury Lane, arranged
'God Save The King' for performance after a play. It was a tremendous
success and was repeated nightly.

This practice soon spread to other theatres, and the custom of greeting
monarchs with the song as he or she entered a place of public
entertainment was thus established.

There is no authorised version of the National Anthem as the words are a
matter of tradition. Additional verses have been added down the years, but
these are rarely used.

The words used today are those sung in 1745, substituting 'Queen' for
'King' where appropriate. On official occasions, only the first verse is
usually sung.

The words of the National Anthem are as follows:
....

Django Cat

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:41:55 PM1/20/09
to
TOF wrote:

Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it. Fortunately Ms Franklin's singing could send shivers down my spine with Old Macdonald's Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.

I liked the old guy at the end, too.

DC
--

LFS

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:52:03 PM1/20/09
to
Django Cat wrote:
> TOF wrote:
>
>> Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>>
>> The melody did seem familiar.
>>
>> TOF
>
> Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it.
> Fortunately Ms Franklin's singing could send shivers down my spine
> with Old Macdonald's Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.

Her hat was pretty splendid, too.

>
> I liked the old guy at the end, too.
>

But when did Itzhak Perlman get so old?


--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)

TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:52:22 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 21, 8:41 am, "Django Cat" <notar...@address.com> wrote:
> TOF wrote:
> > Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> > The melody did seem familiar.
>
> > TOF
>
> Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it.  Fortunately Ms
> Franklin's  singing could send shivers down my spine with Old Macdonald's
> Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.
>

As someone forced to listen to this tune and its usual words for
almost all of my school career, it is a dirge, but as you say, Aretha
could make anything sound good. It has a bit of a gospel-jazz-blues
sound and wasn't half bad.

> I liked the old guy at the end, too.

I missed that as I only heard the radio version.

TOF

TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 4:53:37 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 21, 8:41 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net>
wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 13:24:03 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Jan 21, 8:12 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net>
> >wrote:
> >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> >> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>
> >> Her actual performance:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>
> >> >The melody did seem familiar.
>
> >> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>
> >Do you know the provenance of the melody?
>
> No.http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page5010.asp#

>
>     The British National Anthem dates back to the eighteenth century.
>

<snip>


Thanks

TOF

Django Cat

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Jan 20, 2009, 5:39:51 PM1/20/09
to
LFS wrote:

> > Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it.
> > Fortunately Ms Franklin's singing could send shivers down my spine
> > with Old Macdonald's Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.
>
> Her hat was pretty splendid, too.
>
> >
> > I liked the old guy at the end, too.
> >
>
> But when did Itzhak Perlman get so old?


And who was the elderly black gentleman that the camera cut to four times during the inauguration? I'm guessing he was a civil rights veteran?

DC
--

Prai Jei

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Jan 20, 2009, 5:45:50 PM1/20/09
to
TOF set the following eddies spiralling through the space-time continuum:

Several composers, from Beethoven to Charles Ives, have written variations
on this little melody.

Any lyric that is set to this melody can also be sung to the tune that is
more familiar for the hymn "Thou whose almighty word". In the hymnals this
tune is known as Moscow.
--
ξ:) Proud to be curly

Interchange the alphabetic letter groups to reply

Django Cat

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Jan 20, 2009, 5:42:19 PM1/20/09
to
Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:

>
> There is no authorised version of the National Anthem as the words are a
> matter of tradition. Additional verses have been added down the years, but
> these are rarely used.


Bring back 'Rebellious Scots to crush' I say...

DC
--

Django Cat

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Jan 20, 2009, 5:44:31 PM1/20/09
to
TOF wrote:

> > Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it.  Fortunately Ms
> > Franklin's  singing could send shivers down my spine with Old Macdonald's
> > Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.
> >
>
> As someone forced to listen to this tune and its usual words for
> almost all of my school career, it is a dirge, but as you say, Aretha
> could make anything sound good. It has a bit of a gospel-jazz-blues
> sound and wasn't half bad.
>
> > I liked the old guy at the end, too.
>
> I missed that as I only heard the radio version.


Was that live? What time of day was *that* in Aus? We watched at 5pm in the Uke.

DC
--

Mike Lyle

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Jan 20, 2009, 5:46:05 PM1/20/09
to
TOF wrote:
> On Jan 21, 8:41 am, "Django Cat" <notar...@address.com> wrote:
>> TOF wrote:
>>> Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>>
>>> The melody did seem familiar.
>>
>>> TOF
>>
>> Jaze, but it's a grim tune, whichever set of lyrics you put to it.
>> Fortunately Ms Franklin's singing could send shivers down my spine
>> with Old Macdonald's
>> Farm, so this is as good as it's going to get.
>>
>
> As someone forced to listen to this tune and its usual words for
> almost all of my school career, it is a dirge, but as you say, Aretha
> could make anything sound good. It has a bit of a gospel-jazz-blues
> sound and wasn't half bad.
[...]

This is fascinating: as I hinted in another thread, I thought she stank.
This is clearly /de gustibus/ territory.

--
Mike.


James Silverton

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Jan 20, 2009, 6:06:13 PM1/20/09
to

I'd just as soon not have listened to Aretha Franklin's take on "My
Country Tis of Thee" but it is the same tune as "God Save the Queen" and
both Beethoven and Haydn thought that was a pretty good melody. It takes
a fair amount of chutzpah to place yourself above those two.

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 6:25:11 PM1/20/09
to

She was certainly not at her one-time best.

There are times when the selection of a symbolically appropriate person takes
precedence over actual performance.

Of course, if the organisers of the Chinese Olympics opening ceremony had been
consulted she would have been miming to a perfect performance by someone else.

jerry_f...@yahoo.com

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Jan 20, 2009, 6:32:22 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 20, 2:59 pm, TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> The melody did seem familiar.

I wish people would call the American version "America" rather than
"My Country, 'Tis of Thee", as Sen. Feinstein did.

Pretty much every American knows the first verse of this song. We
learn it before learning our national anthem, as it's much easier. If
you asked a sample of Americans to sing something /right now/, a fair
proportion would probably come up with "America".

I doubt I'm the only person here who was surprised as a child to learn
that the British, our enemies in the Revolutionary War (which is a
mainstay of primary-school history), used "our" tune for their
national anthem.

Are you interested in a little American iconography? The last two
line of the first verse are "From every mountainside,/ Let freedom
ring", which Aretha Franklin repeated many times at the end of her
performance. Martin Luther King's "I have a dream" speech is one of
the two most famous speeches in our history; he gave it in 1963 at the
Lincoln Memorial, on the Mall in Washington, which the Capitol is at
the other end of. For his peroration, he quoted "America" and named
mountains around the country, including the former slave states where
racism was still overt: "Let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of
Georgia..."

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/mlkihaveadream.htm (It's
worth listening to as well as reading.)

The selection of the song undoubtedly referred to that. So did Dianne
Feinstein (if memory serves) in her speech, when she mentioned the
other end of the Mall and the forty years since then. Even Obama's
"this great Mall" may have been a subtle reminder of King's speech.

(Could King really have said "curvaceous" in that speech? Could I
have heard extracts from it so many times and not noticed?)

--
Jerry Friedman

tony cooper

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Jan 20, 2009, 6:59:22 PM1/20/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 22:46:05 -0000, "Mike Lyle"
<mike_l...@REMOVETHISyahoo.co.uk> wrote:

My brother the ex-pat called me a few minutes ago from Denmark to tell
me how much he disapproved of Aretha's rendition. "Too gospel".

I spent the day with my grandchildren (5- and 4-years old)letting them
take photographs at a horse training stable.
http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/gallery/7147015_rxzuj#458551472_NRJEo
All photos taken by them without my suggestions or help.

I can always watch the Inauguration on the endless replays that will
be on TV, but a day with the grandchildren...priceless.

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

Raymond O'Hara

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Jan 20, 2009, 7:33:06 PM1/20/09
to

"Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote in message
news:qdfcn41j9dqahn1lk...@4ax.com...

> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>>
>
> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>
> Her actual performance:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>
>>The melody did seem familiar.
>>
> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>

Yeah, you Brits are always stealing our songs. ;)


Raymond O'Hara

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Jan 20, 2009, 7:35:26 PM1/20/09
to

"Django Cat" <nota...@address.com> wrote in message
news:frsdl.19$6p...@newsfe30.ams2...
Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:

DC
--


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Rule Brittania should be the Brit National Anthem.
That is a great song.


James Silverton

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Jan 20, 2009, 7:46:23 PM1/20/09
to
Raymond wrote on Tue, 20 Jan 2009 19:33:06 -0500:


> "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote in
> message news:qdfcn41j9dqahn1lk...@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the
>>> inauguration?
>>>
>> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>>
>> Her actual performance:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>>
>>> The melody did seem familiar.
>>>
>> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>>

"Columbia the Gem of the Ocean" and "Brittannia the Pride of the Ocean"
and things like that.

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 8:04:17 PM1/20/09
to

Obama swore the oath on a copy of the KJV Bible. This may mean he now owes
allegiance to the successor of KJ.

TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 8:05:21 PM1/20/09
to


Shortly after 6AM 21 January, AEDST. (Sydney, which is currently GMT -
11)

Not sure if it was live but as it was a grab in a news story about the
event, one suspects it wasn't.

TOF

TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 8:07:20 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 21, 10:32 am, "jerry_fried...@yahoo.com"

<jerry_fried...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jan 20, 2:59 pm, TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> > The melody did seem familiar.
>
> I wish people would call the American version "America" rather than
> "My Country, 'Tis of Thee", as Sen. Feinstein did.
>
> Pretty much every American knows the first verse of this song.  We
> learn it before learning our national anthem, as it's much easier.  If
> you asked a sample of Americans to sing something /right now/, a fair
> proportion would probably come up with "America".
>
> I doubt I'm the only person here who was surprised as a child to learn
> that the British, our enemies in the Revolutionary War (which is a
> mainstay of primary-school history), used "our" tune for their
> national anthem.
>
<snip interesting read>

Thanks Jerry

TOF

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

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Jan 20, 2009, 8:18:30 PM1/20/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:59:22 -0500, tony cooper <tony_co...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>I spent the day with my grandchildren (5- and 4-years old)letting them
>take photographs at a horse training stable.
>http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/gallery/7147015_rxzuj#458551472_NRJEo
>All photos taken by them without my suggestions or help.
>

Those are good pictures. The kids were thinking carefully about what they were
doing. I'm impressed.

>I can always watch the Inauguration on the endless replays that will
>be on TV, but a day with the grandchildren...priceless.

Indeed.

Raymond O'Hara

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Jan 20, 2009, 8:40:07 PM1/20/09
to

"James Silverton" <not.jim....@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:gl5r8r$m2m$1...@news.motzarella.org...

> Raymond wrote on Tue, 20 Jan 2009 19:33:06 -0500:
>
>
>> "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote in
>> message news:qdfcn41j9dqahn1lk...@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the
>>>> inauguration?
>>>>
>>> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>>>
>>> Her actual performance:
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>>>
>>>> The melody did seem familiar.
>>>>
>>> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>>>
>
> "Columbia the Gem of the Ocean" and "Brittannia the Pride of the Ocean"
> and things like that.
>
> --

Columbia the Gem of the Ocean has a different tune from MCTOT.


TOF

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Jan 20, 2009, 9:13:24 PM1/20/09
to
On Jan 21, 12:04 pm, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net>
wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 19:33:06 -0500, "Raymond O'Hara"
>
>
>
>
>
> <raymond-oh...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >"Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net> wrote in message
> >news:qdfcn41j9dqahn1lk...@4ax.com...

> >> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>
> >> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>
> >> Her actual performance:
> >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>
> >>>The melody did seem familiar.
>
> >> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>
> >Yeah, you Brits are always stealing our songs. ;)
>
> Obama swore the oath on a copy of the KJV Bible. This may mean he now owes
> allegiance to the successor of KJ.
>


Also because he was "born in Kenya".

(sorry, couldn't resist)

TOF

Mark Brader

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Jan 20, 2009, 10:37:58 PM1/20/09
to
Jerry Friedman:

> I wish people would call the American version "America" rather than
> "My Country, 'Tis of Thee", as Sen. Feinstein did.

I'm glad *someone* in this thread know the title of the thing.



> I doubt I'm the only person here who was surprised as a child to learn
> that the British, our enemies in the Revolutionary War (which is a
> mainstay of primary-school history), used "our" tune for their
> national anthem.

It's equally surprising from the other side, of course.

The story is that the author of the American words used a piece of
sheet music he'd found with no title on the page. In other words,
he knew he was borrowing an existing melody, but he didn't know
*what* melody.
--
Mark Brader, Toronto "Asps. Very dangerous. You go first."
m...@vex.net -- Raiders of the Lost Ark

My text in this article is in the public domain.

R H Draney

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Jan 20, 2009, 10:56:24 PM1/20/09
to
Raymond O'Hara filted:

>
>
>"Django Cat" <nota...@address.com> wrote in message
>news:frsdl.19$6p...@newsfe30.ams2...
>Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:
>
>>
>> There is no authorised version of the National Anthem as the words are
>> a
>> matter of tradition. Additional verses have been added down the years,
>> but
>> these are rarely used.
>
>
>Bring back 'Rebellious Scots to crush' I say...

Some national anthems are more stirring than others...on strictly musical
grounds, I like Canada's best, followed by the old Soviet anthem....

"Scotland the Brave" is pretty awesome too, but I may have been swayed by the
usual instrumentation....r


--
"You got Schadenfreude on my Weltanschauung!"
"You got Weltanschauung in my Schadenfreude!"

R H Draney

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Jan 20, 2009, 11:02:02 PM1/20/09
to
Mark Brader filted:

>
>Jerry Friedman:
>> I wish people would call the American version "America" rather than
>> "My Country, 'Tis of Thee", as Sen. Feinstein did.

Too much potential confusion with "America the Beautiful", which has often been
suggested as a better choice than the existing national anthem....

>I'm glad *someone* in this thread know the title of the thing.
>
>> I doubt I'm the only person here who was surprised as a child to learn
>> that the British, our enemies in the Revolutionary War (which is a
>> mainstay of primary-school history), used "our" tune for their
>> national anthem.
>
>It's equally surprising from the other side, of course.
>
>The story is that the author of the American words used a piece of
>sheet music he'd found with no title on the page. In other words,
>he knew he was borrowing an existing melody, but he didn't know
>*what* melody.

Isn't that how every country in continental Europe ended up with its own version
of "Lili Marlene"?...r

Steve Hayes

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Jan 20, 2009, 11:36:50 PM1/20/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>

>The melody did seem familiar.

I couldn't discern the words, but imagined "confound their politics, frustrate
their knavish tricks" being in there somewhere.

.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk

Roland Hutchinson

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Jan 21, 2009, 1:46:34 AM1/21/09
to
jerry_f...@yahoo.com wrote:

> (Could King really have said "curvaceous" in that speech?  Could I
> have heard extracts from it so many times and not noticed?)

Perhaps it is forgettable because it is not really accurately used in that
part of the speech -- I search my brain in vain for any reasonable sense in
which the mostly quite rugged mountains of California can be said to
possess curvaceous slopes. I imagine that, speaking semi-extemporaneously,
he hit on it more because of its sound (alliterating with "California")
than because of its sense.

One overlooks such piffling problems in a bravura perfomance like this
one -- one heck of a speech it was!

--
Roland Hutchinson Will play viola da gamba for food.

NB mail to my.spamtrap [at] verizon.net is heavily filtered to
remove spam. If your message looks like spam I may not see it.

Roland Hutchinson

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Jan 21, 2009, 1:56:27 AM1/21/09
to
TOF wrote:

One internal clue is that the tune has the characteristic rhythm of a
galliard, which suggests origins no later than the first half of the
seventeenth century.

Evan Kirshenbaum

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Jan 21, 2009, 2:07:39 AM1/21/09
to
TOF <Fran...@gmail.com> writes:

> On Jan 21, 8:12 am, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <m...@peterduncanson.net>
> wrote:
>> On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 12:59:19 -0800 (PST), TOF <Fran.B...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >Was Aretha singing God Save the President at the inauguration?
>>
>> "My Country 'Tis of Thee".
>>
>> Her actual performance:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AE_Dds8DfE
>>
>> >The melody did seem familiar.
>>
>> It has other uses -- "God Save the Queen" for one.
>
> Do you know the provenance of the melody?

According to Wikipedia, Samuel Francis Smith put words to Muzio
Clementi's Symphony No. 3, which was taken from "God Save the King".

That Smith wouldn't have known of the British song strains credulity,
but it appears to be the story he himself told in the nineteenth
century:

On a dismal day in February, 1832, looking over one of these books,
my attention was drawn to a tune which attracted me by its simple
and natural movement, and its fitness for children's choirs.
Glancing at the German words at the foot of the page, I saw that
they were patriotic, and I was instantly inspired to write a
patriotic hymb of my own.

Seizing a scrap of waste paper, I began to write, and in half an
hour I think the words stood upon it substantially as they are
sung today. I did not know at the time that the tune was the
British "God save the King." I do not share the regret of those
who deem it an evil that the national tune of Britain and America
is the same. On the contrary, I deem it a new and beautiful tie
of union between the mother and the daughter, one furnishing the
music (if, indeed, it is really English), and the other the words.

_Souvenir "America" Testimonial to Rev. S.F. Smith.,
D.D., Author of the National Hymn_, 1895

--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories |He seems to be perceptive and
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |effective because he states the
Palo Alto, CA 94304 |obvious to people that don't seem
|to see the obvious.
kirsh...@hpl.hp.com |
(650)857-7572 | Tony Cooper

http://www.kirshenbaum.net/


LFS

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 2:10:34 AM1/21/09
to

Yes, I think her hat was the best bit. I just marvelled at how everyone
looked so very old. And Cheney in his wheelchair looked so wonderfully
angry.

--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 4:19:17 AM1/21/09
to
On Tue, 20 Jan 2009 18:59:22 -0500, tony cooper <tony_co...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>


>My brother the ex-pat called me a few minutes ago from Denmark to tell
>me how much he disapproved of Aretha's rendition. "Too gospel".
>

My thoughts are about the quality of Aretha's performance, not the style.
Gospel Music is an inextricable part of American culture.

The inauguration proceedings were full of meaning expressed in words and
symbols. I have no criticism of the organizers' choice of a gospel singer.

In Aretha's defence the conditions were not conducive to a top quality vocal
performance. It was relatively early in the day, she was breathing cold air
and she was probably tense because of the importance of the occasion.

Django Cat

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 4:21:18 AM1/21/09
to
Raymond O'Hara wrote:

> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Rule Brittania should be the Brit National Anthem.
> That is a great song.

I'd buy into that. And you can sing it without signing up as a lackey of the chinless Windsors.

DC
--

Django Cat

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 4:58:40 AM1/21/09
to
jerry_f...@yahoo.com wrote:

> Are you interested in a little American iconography? The last two
> line of the first verse are "From every mountainside,/ Let freedom
> ring", which Aretha Franklin repeated many times at the end of her
> performance. Martin Luther King's "I have a dream" speech is one of
> the two most famous speeches in our history; he gave it in 1963 at the
> Lincoln Memorial, on the Mall in Washington, which the Capitol is at
> the other end of. For his peroration, he quoted "America" and named
> mountains around the country, including the former slave states where
> racism was still overt: "Let freedom ring from Stone Mountain of
> Georgia..."

Is that also why King talked about 'the red hills of Georgia'? I've often wondered... does Georgia have red hills?


DC
--

James Hogg

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 5:00:12 AM1/21/09
to
On 20 Jan 2009 19:56:24 -0800, R H Draney <dado...@spamcop.net>
wrote:

>Raymond O'Hara filted:
>>
>>
>>"Django Cat" <nota...@address.com> wrote in message
>>news:frsdl.19$6p...@newsfe30.ams2...
>>Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> There is no authorised version of the National Anthem as the words are
>>> a
>>> matter of tradition. Additional verses have been added down the years,
>>> but
>>> these are rarely used.
>>
>>
>>Bring back 'Rebellious Scots to crush' I say...
>
>Some national anthems are more stirring than others...on strictly musical
>grounds, I like Canada's best, followed by the old Soviet anthem....

... now the new anthem of the Russian Federation, although I
believe they changed the words..

James

James Hogg

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 5:04:00 AM1/21/09
to

But you can't sing it unless you're a very good singer. I dread
to think what a full Wembley Stadium would do to it.

It's hard to spell too...

When the United Kingdom disintegrates, England will always have
"Jerusalem".

James

Peter Duncanson (BrE)

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 5:27:30 AM1/21/09
to
On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 10:04:00 +0000, James Hogg <Jas.H...@SPAM.gmail.com>
wrote:

In a Hip Hop version?

James Hogg

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 5:37:25 AM1/21/09
to

I believe Ireland was the first country to have Hip Hop contests,
adjudicated by Rapparees.

James

Django Cat

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 5:55:30 AM1/21/09
to
Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:

> > When the United Kingdom disintegrates, England will always have
> > "Jerusalem".
> >
> In a Hip Hop version?

Don't tempt me...

--

James Silverton

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Jan 21, 2009, 8:01:17 AM1/21/09
to

Absolutely true! I was a bit unclear and what I actually meant was that
patriotic songs often appear on both sides of the Atlantic. "Columbia"
and "Brittannia" have the same tune and there is argument about which
set of words is earliest.

James Silverton

unread,
Jan 21, 2009, 8:03:53 AM1/21/09
to
Django wrote on Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:21:18 GMT:

>> -------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Rule Brittania should be the Brit National Anthem.
>> That is a great song.

> I'd buy into that. And you can sing it without signing up as
> a lackey of the chinless Windsors.

The words are a bit dated. Isn't there something about the world
offering homage to Brittania?

tony cooper

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Jan 21, 2009, 8:34:24 AM1/21/09
to
On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 09:58:40 GMT, "Django Cat" <nota...@address.com>
wrote:

>jerry_f...@yahoo.com wrote:

Oh my, yes. Most of Georgia is a distinctive-appearing red clay that
is rich in iron oxides. Drive through Georgia and you will notice
that many of the vehicles on the road are reddish because they've been
driven off-pavement. What would be dark mud in other states is red
mud in Georgia.

When you think of Scotland, you think of the purple hills. That's
from plants (heather) that cover the hills. In Georgia, it's the soil
that is red.


--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida

Leslie Danks

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Jan 21, 2009, 8:53:28 AM1/21/09
to
tony cooper wrote:

[...]



> When you think of Scotland, you think of the purple hills. That's
> from plants (heather) that cover the hills. In Georgia, it's the soil
> that is red.

As it is in much of Devon:

<http://www.bbc.co.uk/devon/content/image_galleries/two_moors_way_walk_day4_gallery.shtml?10>
<http://tinyurl.com/8p6uxj>

--
Les (BrE)

Barbara Bailey

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Jan 21, 2009, 9:00:47 AM1/21/09
to
tony cooper <tony_co...@earthlink.net> wrote in
news:7tocn4pmf29so1c7q...@4ax.com:

> I spent the day with my grandchildren (5- and 4-years old)letting them
> take photographs at a horse training stable.
> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/gallery/7147015_rxzuj#458551472_NRJEo
> All photos taken by them without my suggestions or help.

Your grandchilden have good photographic instincts. Numbers 2,3,9, and 12
especially are gorgeously composed.

Barbara Bailey

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Jan 21, 2009, 9:05:49 AM1/21/09