Re: can't half tell
John Dean
> I ran across this expression today:
>
> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
> in Subarus."
>
> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
> BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>
> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
"It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
--
John Dean
Oxford
the Omrud
> I ran across this expression today:
>
> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're in
> Subarus."
>
> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
> BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>
> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
"can't half" is an emphatic "can".
- She' can't half cook.
--
David
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>I ran across this expression today:
>
>"Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're in
>Subarus."
>
>I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>
It is a form of understatement: "You can't half" meaning "You really
can".
I think this figure of speech is classified as Meiosis.
http://www.poeticbyway.com/gl-m.html
MEIOSIS (my-OH-sis)
An understatement; the presentation of a thing with
underemphasis in order to achieve a greater effect, such as,
"the building of the pyramids took a little bit of effort."
Sidelight: Just as a hyperbole can underscore a truth by
overstatement, the meiosis achieves the same effect with
understatement.
>If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
the Omrud
Also "don't half".
- I don't half fancy a hot dog.
--
David
Jerry Friedman
Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was stuck on
tell=inform.
So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
--
Jerry Friedman is currently driving a BMW and may soon borrow a Subaru
till his Toyota arrives.
Leslie Danks
What colour is it? My BMW is black:
[quote]
Black. Black cars denote an aggressive personality or someone who’s an
outsider or rebel. This sexy shade represents authority and power. You also
appreciate classiness, style and undying classics. But you may also have a
darker side; black is often associated with villains and mystery.
[/quote]
<http://www.egodevelopment.com/your-car-color-shows-your-personality/>
Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I keep
forgetting.
> and may soon borrow a Subaru
> till his Toyota arrives.
--
Les
(BrE)
the Omrud
Typical Taurus.
I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of course,
but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
--
David
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
wrote:
>Jerry Friedman wrote:
>
>> On Feb 26, 7:34 am, "John Dean" <john-d...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>>> Lewis wrote:
>>> > I ran across this expression today:
>>>
>>> > "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
>>> > in Subarus."
>>>
>>> > I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>>> > BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>>>
>>> > If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>>>
>>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>>
>> Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was stuck on
>> tell=inform.
>>
>> So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
>> they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>>
>> --
>> Jerry Friedman is currently driving a BMW
>
>What colour is it? My BMW is black:
>
>[quote]
>Black. Black cars denote an aggressive personality or someone who’s an
>outsider or rebel. This sexy shade represents authority and power. You also
>appreciate classiness, style and undying classics. But you may also have a
>darker side; black is often associated with villains and mystery.
>[/quote]
>
I remember when black was a perfectly ordinary colour for a car. At that
time it was red that was the colour of aggression or rebellion.
><http://www.egodevelopment.com/your-car-color-shows-your-personality/>
>
>Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I keep
>forgetting.
>
>> and may soon borrow a Subaru
>> till his Toyota arrives.
--
LFS
Not to forget "It Ain't Half Hot Mum". I wanted to put a comma after
"hot" but it seems the title is officially unpunctuated.
--
Laura
(emulate St. George for email)
LFS
Careful: there are several Taureans hereabouts who might not like being
characterised as forgetful or villainous. The rest of Leslie's post fits
me to a T but my car is a silver Renault.
>
> I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
> know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife.
These days I have trouble remembering their birthdays, let alone their
star signs.
I know mine, of course,
> but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
>
--
the Omrud
Talking of hot dogs, as I was, you might be the person to tell me where
to buy decent hot dogs in the UK. We were given kosher hot dogs at camp
(not surprisingly) for cook-out nights. Most UK hot dogs are dire;
I've been told to try Lidl and Aldi, which makes sense. Costco used to
have good ones, but they seem to have disappeared. The dogs, not Costco.
--
David
Jerry Friedman
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
...
> > --
> > Jerry Friedman is currently driving a BMW
>
> What colour is it? My BMW is black:
So's the one I'm borrowing, I think, but it's hard to tell through the
tan dust. I may take it through a car wash before I return it
tomorrow, so then I'll be able to tell, assuming it's a color I can
identify.
> [quote]
> Black. Black cars denote an aggressive personality or someone who’s an
> outsider or rebel. This sexy shade represents authority and power. You also
> appreciate classiness, style and undying classics. But you may also have a
> darker side; black is often associated with villains and mystery.
> [/quote]
>
> <http://www.egodevelopment.com/your-car-color-shows-your-personality/>
And if you don't care what color your car is? (Though I don't want
bright red or bright yellow.)
In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better color
than another--maybe silver was better than tan. Isn't this a matter
of taste? Or could some colors have better resale value? Second, one
friend suggested that light-colored cars are more visible and
therefore safer, and when I mentioned that to another friend, he
agreed. I've never noticed any problem seeing a dark-colored car. At
night, when there would be a problem, you see the lights long before
you see the body.
> Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I keep
> forgetting.
I must admit I know the dates for something like half the astrological
signs of the zodiac (as opposed to the actual constellations).
--
Jerry Friedman
tony cooper
wrote:
>I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
>know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of course,
>but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
I know I am a Taurus (unless they've moved the dates about), but don't
have any idea what December 28, January 16, or July 29 is.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
LFS
The only decent hot dogs are Hebrew National. Years ago we used to get
them via our American friends at the USAF base near here and I love them
but I haven't ever seen any on sale in the UK. I've just looked at all
the online UK kosher food places and none of them have HN. Sorry, not
much help.
Mike Lyle
<jerry_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Feb 26, 7:34 am, "John Dean" <john-d...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>> Lewis wrote:
>> > I ran across this expression today:
>>
>> > "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
>> > in Subarus."
>>
>> > I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>> > BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>>
>> > If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>>
>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>
>Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was stuck on
>tell=inform.
"You can always tell a Brummie. But you can't tell him much."
>
>So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
>they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as one
of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper classes. At
one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at agricultural
shows.
Beemers, as we've mentioned before, have the image over here of being
driven, and parked, by, or as if by, oiks. So I'll record that the
last three times I've even noticed a BMW, it was because the driver
was behaving with great courtesy.
--
Mike.
Ray
> I remember when black was a perfectly ordinary colour for a car.
Back in the Model T days, Henry Ford supposedly said, "Any customer can
have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black."
> At that time it was red that was the colour of aggression or
> rebellion.
I've heard a popular sports-car color referred to as "Arrest Me Red";
legend had it that red cars were more likely to be stopped for
speeding, though that's probably less true now than in the pre-radar
days.
--
Ray
(remove the Xs to reply)
MC
Mike Lyle <mike_l...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> >So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
> >they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>
> I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as one
> of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper classes. At
> one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at agricultural
> shows.
>
> Beemers, as we've mentioned before, have the image over here of being
> driven, and parked, by, or as if by, oiks. So I'll record that the
> last three times I've even noticed a BMW, it was because the driver
> was behaving with great courtesy.
Interesting this whole business of car and image. The same car can mean
different things in different (often pondian) places.
WIWAL in the UK my leftish/leftist parents dismissed Jaguars as the kind
of cars people in the "Gin Belt" drove - often while wearing sheepskin
jackets. I'm sure Jeremy Clarkson would have been tarred with that
particular brush if he'd been around at the time.
In these Northwestern Leftpondian parts, Subarus are greatly prized for
their handling in snow and are the unofficial state car of Vermont (and
therefore driven by liberal democrats).
BMWs don't carry any oik baggage. Quite the contrary. They're just seen
as more exciting alternatives to Mercedes-Benz... Erm... Um...
OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
--
"If you can, tell me something happy."
- Marybones
Ray
> In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
> First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better
> color than another--maybe silver was better than tan. Isn't
> this a matter of taste? Or could some colors have better resale
> value?
Probably the biggest difference was that the salesman had more silver
cars than tan ones.
Years ago a body-shop owner told me that red had the highest resale
value. Don't know if he was serious or just didn't want to change the
color of my car. After he said changing the color would cost more I
didn't care about the resale value anyway.
Some colors show dirt more easily than others. My current white car
usually looks dirtier than my previous silver one did.
Another possible difference: interior temperature when sitting in the
sun. Mythbusters did a test and found that a black car got about 10
deg F hotter than a white car. I couldn't find the details to tell how
valid their test method was.
MC
MC <cope...@mapca.inter.net> wrote:
> In these Northwestern Leftpondian parts,
Northeastern. Oops.
MC
Ray <vortre...@yaxhoo.com.invalid> wrote:
I've heard it said that insurance premiums are higher for red cars. No
idea if it's true.
Jerry Friedman
> In article <gsqim69sh54be2hg34a6qso0hkgu6df...@4ax.com>,
> Mike Lyle <mike_lyle...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > >So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
> > >they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>
> > I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as one
> > of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper classes. At
> > one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at agricultural
> > shows.
>
> > Beemers, as we've mentioned before, have the image over here of being
> > driven, and parked, by, or as if by, oiks. So I'll record that the
> > last three times I've even noticed a BMW, it was because the driver
> > was behaving with great courtesy.
As if they were Subaru drivers, in fact?
> Interesting this whole business of car and image. The same car can mean
> different things in different (often pondian) places.
...
> In these North[ea]stern Leftpondian parts, Subarus are greatly prized for
> their handling in snow
Somewhat true in these Southwestern parts, in some circles.
> and are the unofficial state car of Vermont (and
> therefore driven by liberal democrats).
>
> BMWs don't carry any oik baggage. Quite the contrary. They're just seen
> as more exciting alternatives to Mercedes-Benz... Erm... Um...
Here, I'd say Subarus are stereotypically for practical people, not
interested their image or in having fun while they drive, would drive
a Volvo if they could afford it.
BMWs are for the rich who are, or consider themselves, too mature for
Corvettes.
> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
"Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
plural must be "Mercedes".
--
Jerry Friedman
Ian Noble
>I ran across this expression today:
>
>"Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're in
>Subarus."
>
>I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>
>If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
"Can't/don't/isn't/won't half" = "can/do/is/will" (with forceful
emphasis).
e.g. "I don't half pong" ("I am somewhat ripe'").
"She can't half dance" ("I am impressed by her terpsichore")
"You won't half catch it" ("I wouldn't like to be in your shoes when
people find out")
"He isn't half clever" ("I admire his intelligence")
Cheers - Ian
(BrE: Yorks., Hants.)
Ian Noble
wrote:
>On 26/02/2011 16:57, LFS wrote:
What can I say - the British have a different concept of what
constitutes a sausage to either the US or the rest of Europe, so
you're unlikely (bar sheer luck or imported goods) to find something
that you feel makes a "decent" hot dog. And quite probably you won't
find many Brits to agree with you even if you do.
A well-cooked Lincolnshire sausage in a bun, though (or, since I've
been a vegitarian for over a decade now, some of the quite decent
non-meat imitations on the market) can be very good indeed, especially
with a spicey tomato relish. Ignore the rubbish commercial substitutes
for what you're used to, and go with what we do well, is my advice
(and, indeed, my advice for eating anywhere in the world).
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
Or, casually in the UK, "Mercs".
Skitt
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>> MC wrote:
>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
>>
>> "Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>> plural must be "Mercedes".
>
> Or, casually in the UK, "Mercs".
Not to be confused with the AmE "Mercs" for Mercurys, although they're
gone now.
--
Skitt (SF Bay Area)
http://come.to/skitt
LFS
Who cares? I only want one. Cue Janis.
Mike Barnes
>I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
>know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife.
We don't have children but now that you mention it, I have no idea what
my wife's star sign is either. If I've been told, I've forgotten. I do
know it's not the same as mine.
--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>In message <8sshdc...@mid.individual.net>
> John Dean <john...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>> Lewis wrote:
>>> I ran across this expression today:
>>>
>>> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
>>> in Subarus."
>>>
>>> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>>> BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>>>
>>> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>
>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>
>Thanks. Any reason why 'can't half tell' means 'it's easy to tell' or
>just one of those things you have to learn?
It's just one of those things you have to learn.
"can't half tell" means something stronger than "it's easy to tell".
tony cooper
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
>>
>>"Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>>plural must be "Mercedes".
>
>Or, casually in the UK, "Mercs".
I had read a number of British books containing references to "Mercs"
before I figured out that the reference was to Mercedes. I thought,
for some reason, American-made Mercury automobiles were popular in the
UK.
I know the car is a Mercedes-Benz, but they are generally referred to
here as just "Mercedes". Some rather pretentious people call them a
"Benz".
R H Draney
Aquarius, Aquarius, and Leo respectively....
Note the title of the Monkees' fourth album, "Pisces, Aquarius, Capricorn &
Jones, Ltd"...Davy Jones got his name rather than his sun sign in the title
because he has the same birthday as Capricorn Mike Nesmith....r
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.
Evan Kirshenbaum
> The only decent hot dogs are Hebrew National.
Are we going to have the New York vs. Chicago hot dog argument here
again? The ones you want are Vienna.
> Years ago we used to get them via our American friends at the USAF
> base near here and I love them but I haven't ever seen any on sale
> in the UK. I've just looked at all the online UK kosher food places
> and none of them have HN. Sorry, not much help.
Unfortunately,
Q: I don't eat pork. Can I eat Vienna Beef sausages?
A: Yes you can, but a few of our products utilize a pork casing,
so you'll want to make sure you are eating a skinless Vienna
Beef sausage or a smaller sized natural casing sausage (5
to-a-lb or smaller[6,7,8,9,10 to a pound] which utilize a sheep
casing). If you desire a Vienna Beef natural casing sausage,
ask your restaurant proprietor which products he is using so
you can be sure. In accordance with applicable laws, all of our
natural casing foodservice boxes are clearly marked with an
ingredient statement specifying the type of casing used. Note
that all of our packaged retail products sold in supermarkets
and warehouse clubs are skinless and contain no casing.
A reminder... for those people who have religious dietary
restrictions, our products are not Kosher.
http://www.viennabeef.com/about/faq
I'm not sure when Vienna hot dogs stopped being kosher. They
certainly was when the company started. (I've seen photographs from
the late 19th century, and the signs on the front of the building, in
Yiddish, said "kosher".) I think they were still kosher when I was
growing up.
The other dog I ate a lot of growing up was Fluky's. I don't know if
they are/were kosher, either, although they almost certainly were when
they started.
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |It is a popular delusion that the
SF Bay Area (1982-) |government wastes vast amounts of
Chicago (1964-1982) |money through inefficiency and sloth.
|Enormous effort and elaborate
evan.kir...@gmail.com |planning are required to waste this
|much money
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ | P.J. O'Rourke
Peter Moylan
> On 26/02/2011 16:37, Leslie Danks wrote:
>> Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I keep
>> forgetting.
>
> Typical Taurus.
>
> I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
> know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of course,
> but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
I just tell them that we Pisceans don't believe in astrology. It's
surprising how many people don't realise that that's a joke.
--
Peter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org
For an e-mail address, see my web page.
Peter Moylan
>
> In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
> First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better color
> than another--maybe silver was better than tan.
I bought a car last month. I chose silver, on the grounds that that was
the one I could take delivery of immediately.
Peter Moylan
> In article <gsqim69sh54be2hg3...@4ax.com>,
> Mike Lyle <mike_l...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> Beemers, as we've mentioned before, have the image over here of being
>> driven, and parked, by, or as if by, oiks. So I'll record that the
>> last three times I've even noticed a BMW, it was because the driver
>> was behaving with great courtesy.
>
> Interesting this whole business of car and image. The same car can mean
> different things in different (often pondian) places.
Over here it was the Volvo drivers who had a bad reputation. This has
now changed. Now it's the 4WD drivers (of any make and model) who have
the reputation of being inconsiderate. Tailgaters, especially, seem to
prefer 4WD cars.
One very popular 4WD model here has the name "Pajero". I assume that
it's bought only by people who don't understand Spanish.
Peter Moylan
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>> On Feb 26, 2:30 pm, MC <copes...@mapca.inter.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
>>
>> "Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>> plural must be "Mercedes".
>>
>
> Who cares? I only want one. Cue Janis.
>
Peter Moylan
>
> Thanks. Any reason why 'can't half tell' means 'it's easy to tell' or
> just one of those things you have to learn?
In general, <negative> half means "a lot more than half". For example,
"It didn't half make me laugh" means that I found it very funny.
Jerry Friedman
> tony cooper filted:
[sun sign of wife and children]
> >I know I am a Taurus (unless they've moved the dates about), but don't
> >have any idea what December 28, January 16, or July 29 is.
>
> Aquarius, Aquarius, and Leo respectively....
Ahem. It's easy to remember that Capricorn is Dec. 22 to Jan. 20,
because on the December solstice the sun is its farthest south in the
sky, which puts it overhead at the Tropic of Capricorn.
--
Jerry Friedman
Roland Hutchinson
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>> On Feb 26, 2:30 pm, MC <copes...@mapca.inter.net> wrote:
>
>
>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz,
>>> anyway?
>>
>> "Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>> plural must be "Mercedes".
>>
>>
> Who cares? I only want one. Cue Janis.
"My friends all drive Volvos... er, Beemers... wait a min--I've got it!"
--
Roland Hutchinson
He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba,"
... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy.
--Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ )
Roland Hutchinson
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>
>> In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
>> First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better color
>> than another--maybe silver was better than tan.
>
> I bought a car last month. I chose silver, on the grounds that that was
> the one I could take delivery of immediately.
We needed immediate delivery, but we had a choice between red and--I
think--silver (from two different dealers). We figured everyone ought to
have a cute, zippy little red car once in their life--and when better
than in middle age, in lieu of any more expensive sort of mid-life crisis
or frivolity? (But not _too_ zippy: it's a Honda Fit/Jazz, as had been
mentioned. Zippy enough with the smallest engine offered for it in the
USA.)
Roland Hutchinson
I _think_ the meaning derives as follows (and it might help you to
remember it):
If you could (only) half tell, it would mean that you could just about
tell, but only just; you wouldn't be too sure that you were correct.
But, if it's really, really easy for you to tell:
Question: "So--can you tell?"
Answer: "Not half!" (meaning, not just half-way, all the way, completely
and readily).
So--you "can't half tell".
Roland Hutchinson
I bet you could buy the natural-casing dogs at retail then, too.
Bob Martin
>"Peter Duncanson (BrE)" <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>
>
>Back in the Model T days, Henry Ford supposedly said, "Any customer can
>have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is black."
Urban myth.
Roland Hutchinson
> Peter Duncanson (BrE) wrote:
>> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>> MC wrote:
>
>>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz,
>>>> anyway?
>>>
>>> "Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>>> plural must be "Mercedes".
>>
>> Or, casually in the UK, "Mercs".
>
> Not to be confused with the AmE "Mercs" for Mercurys, although they're
> gone now.
I always was confused, and considered the word to be ambiguous.
the Omrud
Oh sure, I am a great fan of British sausages, which we buy from the
local butcher and farm shop, both of which make their own (if we want a
shoulder of pork from the butcher, we have to warn him in advance
because he uses up all the shoulder for sausages). But my time in the
US left me with an occasional hankering for a hot dog.
--
David
the Omrud
> the Omrud wrote:
>
>> Talking of hot dogs, as I was, you might be the person to tell me
>> where to buy decent hot dogs in the UK. We were given kosher hot dogs
>> at camp (not surprisingly) for cook-out nights. Most UK hot dogs are
>> dire; I've been told to try Lidl and Aldi, which makes sense. Costco
>> used to have good ones, but they seem to have disappeared. The dogs,
>> not Costco.
>
> them via our American friends at the USAF base near here and I love them
> but I haven't ever seen any on sale in the UK. I've just looked at all
> the online UK kosher food places and none of them have HN. Sorry, not
> much help.
Thanks anyway. I may have to visit North Manchester and East Didsbury
where there are plenty of kosher delis. I've seen an online report that
Selfridges have a good dog in their kosher section so that's another trip.
--
David
LFS
Do let me know if you find HN. I have a feeling that meat imports from
the US were stopped some time ago but at this time of year, in the run
up to Passover, a lot of foodstuffs come in from the US so you may be lucky.
Athel Cornish-Bowden
> On 26/02/2011 16:37, Leslie Danks wrote:
>> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>
>>> On Feb 26, 7:34 am, "John Dean"<john-d...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>>>> Lewis wrote:
>>>>> I ran across this expression today:
>>>>
>>>>> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
>>>>> in Subarus."
>>>>
>>>>> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>>>>> BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>>>>
>>>>> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>>>>
>>>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>>>
>>> Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was stuck on
>>> tell=inform.
>>>
>>> So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
>>> they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jerry Friedman is currently driving a BMW
>>
>> What colour is it? My BMW is black:
>>
>> [quote]
>> Black. Black cars denote an aggressive personality or someone who’s an
>> outsider or rebel. This sexy shade represents authority and power. You also
>> appreciate classiness, style and undying classics. But you may also have a
>> darker side; black is often associated with villains and mystery.
>> [/quote]
>>
>> <http://www.egodevelopment.com/your-car-color-shows-your-personality/>
>>
>> Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I keep
>> forgetting.
>
> Typical Taurus.
>
> I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
> know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of
> course, but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
That describes me as well.
--
athel
Athel Cornish-Bowden
<inv...@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> said:
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>
>> In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
>> First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better color
>> than another--maybe silver was better than tan.
>
> I bought a car last month. I chose silver, on the grounds that that was
> the one I could take delivery of immediately.
That was precisely the reason for the choice of our car's colour.
--
athel
Athel Cornish-Bowden
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 07:21:37 -0800 (PST), Jerry Friedman
> <jerry_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> On Feb 26, 7:34 am, "John Dean" <john-d...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>>> Lewis wrote:
>>>> I ran across this expression today:
>>>
>>>> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're
>>>> in Subarus."
>>>
>>>> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
>>>> BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>>>
>>>> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>>>
>>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>>
>> Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was stuck on
>> tell=inform.
>
> "You can always tell a Brummie. But you can't tell him much."
>>
>> So someone would say this when seeing someone drive a Beemer as if
>> they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>
> I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as one
> of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper classes. At
> one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at agricultural
> shows.
That's interesting. I tend to think of Subarus as very small
uncomfortable cars of the sort driven by people who can't afford
anything else. I realize that nowadays there are bigger and better
Subarus but my prejudice was built about 30 years ago when basic-model
Subarus were being imported to Chile in vast numbers, all the same
colour, a sort of metallic brown. One had the impression that in the
1980s they accounted for about half of all the cars on Chilean roads.
My wife had one, which hardly ever got driven after she came to Europe.
By the time we sold it it was about the only one left.
>
> Beemers, as we've mentioned before, have the image over here of being
> driven, and parked, by, or as if by, oiks. So I'll record that the
> last three times I've even noticed a BMW, it was because the driver
> was behaving with great courtesy.
--
athel
Donna Richoux
> Thanks. Any reason why 'can't half tell' means 'it's easy to tell' or
> just one of those things you have to learn?
I may have gone down the wrong road, but I suspected that the expression
"not half bad" was the origin of this particular sense of Negative
"Half". When I follow that back, "not half bad" shows up as a popular
phrase in the late 19th century, but it disappears before 1850 -- except
in the particular construction "not half bad enough." For example,
--
The battle of Waterloo ... 1817
Extract of a Letter from Serjeant Crichley of the 1st Dragoons...
Nanterre, 24th of July, 1815.
...The Prussian army plays the devil with the country wherever they go;
they made destruction in all the villages on the road from Waterloo to
Paris, and beyond. I am not in the least sorry for them [i.e. the
villages], for it just serves them right, and not half bad enough, for
the usage they gave the Portuguese and Spaniards; it makes them feel a
little of the seat of war as well as the rest of their neighbours.
--
"Not half bad enough" turns up most often in one case, where radical
John Tutchin was tried in 1685 for seditious poetry and participation in
the Monmouth Rebellion. There are various retellings, with the same
basic elements. From _The History of the town of Taunton_, 1791:
--
The sentence was that the boy should be imprisoned seven years, and
should, during that period, be flogged through every market town in
Dorsetshire every year. The women in the galleries burst into tears. The
clerk of the arraigns stood up in great disorder. " My Lord," said he, "
the prisoner is very young. There are many market towns in our county.
The sentence amounts to whipping once a fortnight, for seven years." "
If he is a young man," said Jeffreys, " he is an old rogue. Ladies, you
do not know the villain as well as I do. The punishment is not half bad
enough for him."
[Snip remainder of what happened to John Tutchin.]
--
So in both cases, the idea is is that a punishment is bad, but not bad
enough -- not nearly bad enough -- not even HALF bad enough -- if you
knew how much the "evil-doer" deserved it. Given the retelling of this
story in books of history, it may be that that the Tutchin case gave the
expression to the language.
--
Best -- Donna Richoux
Donna Richoux
Henry Ford says it himself in his autobiography.
---
http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/gutbook/lookup?num=7213
MY LIFE AND WORK
By Henry Ford
In Collaboration With Samuel Crowther
...Therefore in 1909 I announced one morning, without any previous
warning,
that in the future we were going to build only one model, that the model
was going to be "Model T," and that the chassis would be exactly the
same for all cars, and I remarked:
"Any customer can have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as
it is black."
---
Do you think he was prone to -- fabrication?
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
wrote:
He said it, but that policy was not implemented until five years later.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_T_Ford#Colors
By 1918, half of all the cars in the US were Model T’s. However it
was a monolithic bloc; Ford wrote in his autobiography that he told
his management team in 1909 that in the future “Any customer can
have a car painted any colour that he wants so long as it is
black”.[23]
However, in the first years of production from 1908 to 1914, the
Model T was not available in black[24] but rather only grey, green,
blue, and red. Green was available for the touring cars, town cars,
coupes, and Landaulets. Grey was only available for the town cars,
and red only for the touring cars. By 1912, all cars were being
painted midnight blue with black fenders. It was only in 1914 that
the "any color as long as it is black" policy was finally
implemented.
[23] MY LIFE AND WORK quoted in post replied to.
[24] no link, but apparently the same as:
[25] McCalley, Bruce W. (1994), Model T Ford: The Car That Changed the
World, Iola, WI, USA: Krause Publications, ISBN 0-87341-293-1
Andrew B.
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 16:44:19 +0000, the Omrud <usenet.om...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
> >know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of course,
> >but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
>
Well, since you mention it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/13-sign_zodiac#13-sign_astrology
Andrew B.
wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 14:33:21 +0000 (UTC), Lewis
>
> <g.kr...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> >I ran across this expression today:
>
> >"Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think they're in
> >Subarus."
>
> >I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off as a
> >BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am at a loss.
>
> can".
>
> I think this figure of speech is classified as Meiosis.
Or litotes, as used by Doug Piranha.
CDB
> Leslie Danks wrote:
>> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>>> Lewis wrote:
>>
>>>>> I ran across this expression today:
>>>>
>>>>> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think
>>>>> they're in Subarus."
>>>>
>>>>> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it
>>>>> off as a BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence,
>>>>> I am at a loss.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>>>
>>> Oh, tell=spot, distinguish. When I read Lewis's post, I was
>>> stuck on tell=inform.
>>>
>>> they were driving a Subaru? However that is.
>>>
>>> Jerry Friedman is currently driving a BMW
>>
>> What colour is it? My BMW is black:
>>
>> [quote]
>> Black. Black cars denote an aggressive personality or someone
>> who's an outsider or rebel. This sexy shade represents authority
>> and power. You also appreciate classiness, style and undying
>> classics. But you may also have a darker side; black is often
>> associated with villains and mystery. [/quote]
>>
>> <http://www.egodevelopment.com/your-car-color-shows-your-personality/>
>>
>> Now I'm off to look up what sign of the zodiac I fall under - I
>> keep forgetting.
>
> Typical Taurus.
>>
Sloppy, Dopey, Huey, Dewey, Gooey, Stewie, and Zippy. Something like
that.
>>
> I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I
> don't know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine,
> of course, but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
>>
CDB
> John Dean <john...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
>> Lewis wrote:
>>
>>> I ran across this expression today:
>>>
>>> "Sheesh, you can't half tell people who drive BMWs but think
>>> they're in Subarus."
>>>
>>> I've seen, in passing, can't half tell before and written it off
>>> as a BrE idiom I didn't need to know, but in this sentence, I am
>>> at a loss.
>>>
>>> If it matters, the person who said it is from Northern Ireland.
>
>> "It's easy to spot people who drive BMWs but think ..."
>
> or just one of those things you have to learn?
>>
Evan Kirshenbaum
Sure, but just because they didn't use pork doesn't make them kosher.
The meat has to be kosher, slaughtered in a certain way and with all
of the blood removed[1]. And somebody has to certify that nothing in
the manufacture of the hot dogs brings any of the ingredients into
contact with anything that has been "contaminated" by non-kosher food
or (since meat is involved) by dairy products.
[1] All salt is kosher. "Kosher salt" is salt designed for use in
drawing the blood out of meat as part of the koshering process.
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |To find the end of Middle English,
SF Bay Area (1982-) |you discover the exact date and
Chicago (1964-1982) |time the Great Vowel Shift took
|place (the morning of May 5, 1450,
evan.kir...@gmail.com |at some time between neenuh fiftehn
|and nahyn twenty-fahyv).
http://www.kirshenbaum.net/ | Kevin Wald
Evan Kirshenbaum
> MC wrote:
>> Interesting this whole business of car and image. The same car can
>> mean different things in different (often pondian) places.
>
> Over here it was the Volvo drivers who had a bad reputation.
I'm just trying to get home. And I get behind the worst thing of
all: a Volvo station wagon...diesel. Here's a safety freak who's
going to save his life and give me cancer. He has 2.6 children
strapped in to the point of suffocation, a damp canoe on the roof,
and a New Zealand license plate with a little sticker that says
"Save Our Volcano". Volvo: the intelligent car for ignorant
people.
George Carlin, "Cars and Driving", _Carlin
on Campus_, 1984
> This has now changed. Now it's the 4WD drivers (of any make and
> model) who have the reputation of being inconsiderate. Tailgaters,
> especially, seem to prefer 4WD cars.
>
> One very popular 4WD model here has the name "Pajero". I assume that
> it's bought only by people who don't understand Spanish.
How widespread is that? The DRAE only gives it a regional label of
Argentina, Cuba, Uruguay, El Salvador, and Peru, although "paja"
itself in that sense doesn't have any label.
On the other hand, it's not exectly clear why the more literal sense
of "straw merchant" (or the Nicaraguan sense of "plumber") is really a
great name for a car, either.
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |"Revolution" has many definitions.
SF Bay Area (1982-) |From the looks of this, I'd say
Chicago (1964-1982) |"going around in circles" comes
|closest to applying...
evan.kir...@gmail.com | Richard M. Hartman
Sara Lorimer
> I have had arguments with people who simply don't believe that I don't
> know the zodiac sign of my children or my wife. I know mine, of course,
> but I learned it before I was old enough not to bother.
Same and same, but I have a husband (not a wife) and "argument" might be
a tad strong.
--
SML
Seattle-ish
Sara Lorimer
Sara Lorimer
> The only decent hot dogs are Hebrew National.
Agreed. I wish it were reasonable to send you a package or two.
--
SML
Seattle-ish
Skitt
> LFS wrote, in part:
>> The only decent hot dogs are Hebrew National.
>
> Agreed. I wish it were reasonable to send you a package or two.
Interesting. I tried them once and decided that one try is all they
deserved. I don't like all-beef hot dogs.
--
Skitt (SF Bay Area)
http://come.to/skitt
Dr Nick
> Peter Moylan <inv...@peter.pmoylan.org.invalid> writes:
>
>> MC wrote:
>>> Interesting this whole business of car and image. The same car can
>>> mean different things in different (often pondian) places.
>>
>> Over here it was the Volvo drivers who had a bad reputation.
>
> I'm just trying to get home. And I get behind the worst thing of
> all: a Volvo station wagon...diesel. Here's a safety freak who's
> going to save his life and give me cancer. He has 2.6 children
> strapped in to the point of suffocation, a damp canoe on the roof,
> and a New Zealand license plate with a little sticker that says
> "Save Our Volcano". Volvo: the intelligent car for ignorant
> people.
There's a very entertaining rant along the same lines (admittedly in the
mind of a not-very-nice person) in Christopher Brookmyre's "A Big Boy
Did it and Ran Away".
--
Online waterways route planner | http://canalplan.eu
Plan trips, see photos, check facilities | http://canalplan.org.uk
Dr Nick
> "He isn't half clever" ("I admire his intelligence")
As distinct from "He's too clever by half" ("he's so sharp he'll cut
himself").
MC
Dr Nick <3-no...@temporary-address.org.uk> wrote:
> Ian Noble <ipn...@offspam.o2.co.uk> writes:
>
> > "He isn't half clever" ("I admire his intelligence")
>
> As distinct from "He's too clever by half" ("he's so sharp he'll cut
> himself").
Didn't someone (who?) famously accuse Jonathan Miler of being "too
clever by three quarters"?
--
"If you can, tell me something happy."
- Marybones
Evan Kirshenbaum
> Mike Lyle <mike_l...@yahoo.co.uk> said:
>
>> I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as
>> one of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper
>> classes. At one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at
>> agricultural shows.
>
> That's interesting. I tend to think of Subarus as very small
> uncomfortable cars of the sort driven by people who can't afford
> anything else. I realize that nowadays there are bigger and better
> Subarus but my prejudice was built about 30 years ago when
> basic-model Subarus were being imported to Chile in vast numbers,
> all the same colour, a sort of metallic brown.
That sounds like the American perception of Hondas when they first hit
in the '70s. My family got a Civic hatchback in about 1974 as a cheap
second car for my mom to use. We called it the "bug".
--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
Still with HP Labs |Other computer companies have spent
SF Bay Area (1982-) |15 years working on fault-tolerant
Chicago (1964-1982) |computers. Microsoft has spent
|its time more fruitfully, working
evan.kir...@gmail.com |on fault-tolerant *users*.
tony cooper
<evan.kir...@gmail.com> wrote:
>That sounds like the American perception of Hondas when they first hit
>in the '70s. My family got a Civic hatchback in about 1974 as a cheap
>second car for my mom to use. We called it the "bug".
Back in the 70s, the company I was working for in Niles, IL was
negotiating to purchase the lot and building across the street for
additional parking and warehouse space. Someone else jumped in and
leased the site to open a Datsun (now Nissan) dealership.
It was predicted that we'd still be able to buy the site because no
one would buy those cheap little cars and they'd go out of business in
a matter of months.
--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
Robin Bignall
wrote:
>On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 22:54:27 +0000, "Peter Duncanson (BrE)"
><ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>
>>>> OBAUE: how do you form the plural of Mercedes or Mercedes-Benz, anyway?
>>>
>>>"Mercedes-Benzes". I've been known to say "Mercedeses", but the real
>>>plural must be "Mercedes".
>>
>>Or, casually in the UK, "Mercs".
>
>I had read a number of British books containing references to "Mercs"
>before I figured out that the reference was to Mercedes. I thought,
>for some reason, American-made Mercury automobiles were popular in the
>UK.
>
>I know the car is a Mercedes-Benz, but they are generally referred to
>here as just "Mercedes". Some rather pretentious people call them a
>"Benz".
I've seen that in novels by American authors and had to puzzle for a moment. We
seem to have discarded the Benz connection when we casually discuss Mercedes or
Mercs, over here, and I'm not sure that Daimlers are known as Daimler-Benzes
anymore. Ah, I see that Daimler AG owns Mercedes-Benz, but there doesn't seem
to be a Daimler car.
--
Robin Bignall
(BrE)
Herts, England
Mike Lyle
<acor...@ifr88.cnrs-mrs.fr> wrote:
>On 2011-02-26 22:13:42 +0100, Mike Lyle <mike_l...@yahoo.co.uk> said:
[...]
>>
>> I'm thinking the now slightly out-of-date image of the Subaru as one
>> of the vehicles likely to be favoured by the rural upper classes. At
>> one stage, you'd typically find the dealers only at agricultural
>> shows.
>
>That's interesting. I tend to think of Subarus as very small
>uncomfortable cars of the sort driven by people who can't afford
>anything else. I realize that nowadays there are bigger and better
>Subarus but my prejudice was built about 30 years ago when basic-model
>Subarus were being imported to Chile in vast numbers, all the same
>colour, a sort of metallic brown. One had the impression that in the
>1980s they accounted for about half of all the cars on Chilean roads.
>My wife had one, which hardly ever got driven after she came to Europe.
>By the time we sold it it was about the only one left.
I remember the colour. But my first recollection of Subarus was as the
kind of thing you could with impunity bump from covert to covert in
with guns and dogs in the back.
--
Mike.
Robert Bannister
> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>
>> In my recent attempts to buy a car, I was surprised by two things.
>> First, a salesman said one car of a certain model was a better color
>> than another--maybe silver was better than tan.
>
> I bought a car last month. I chose silver, on the grounds that that was
> the one I could take delivery of immediately.
>
I asked for white, but got red for similar reasons.
--
Rob Bannister
Richard Bollard
I chose red because all the other colours were silver. Well, not quite
but almost. There was white, there's always white, and there may have
been a blue but the rest were grey, black and umpteen varieties of
silver.
Google "why are cars silver" and there is plenty of discussion. Damn
things are everywhere. Hard to see against the grey tarmac.
--
Richard Bollard
Canberra Australia
To email, I'm at AMT not spAMT.
Roland Hutchinson
> Sara Lorimer wrote:
>> LFS wrote, in part:
>
>>> The only decent hot dogs are Hebrew National.
>>
>> Agreed. I wish it were reasonable to send you a package or two.
>
> Interesting. I tried them once and decided that one try is all they
> deserved. I don't like all-beef hot dogs.
Evidently not!
--
Roland Hutchinson
He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba,"
... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy.
--Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ )
Roland Hutchinson
I hope I didn't suggest otherwise.
> The meat has to be kosher, slaughtered in a certain way and with all of
> the blood removed[1]. And somebody has to certify that nothing in the
> manufacture of the hot dogs brings any of the ingredients into contact
> with anything that has been "contaminated" by non-kosher food or (since
> meat is involved) by dairy products.
>
> [1] All salt is kosher. "Kosher salt" is salt designed for use in
> drawing the blood out of meat as part of the koshering process.
Evan, just this once you have, quite uncharacteristically, failed to tell
me anything I did not already know.
Roland Hutchinson
> On 26/02/2011 22:52, Ian Noble wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2011 17:21:22 +0000, the Omrud<usenet...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Talking of hot dogs, as I was, you might be the person to tell me
>>> where to buy decent hot dogs in the UK. We were given kosher hot dogs
>>> at camp (not surprisingly) for cook-out nights. Most UK hot dogs are
>>> dire; I've been told to try Lidl and Aldi, which makes sense. Costco
>>> used to have good ones, but they seem to have disappeared. The dogs,
>>> not Costco.
>>
>> What can I say - the British have a different concept of what
>> constitutes a sausage to either the US or the rest of Europe, so you're
>> unlikely (bar sheer luck or imported goods) to find something that you
>> feel makes a "decent" hot dog. And quite probably you won't find many
>> Brits to agree with you even if you do.
>>
>> A well-cooked Lincolnshire sausage in a bun, though (or, since I've
>> been a vegitarian for over a decade now, some of the quite decent
>> non-meat imitations on the market) can be very good indeed, especially
>> with a spicey tomato relish. Ignore the rubbish commercial substitutes
>> for what you're used to, and go with what we do well, is my advice
>> (and, indeed, my advice for eating anywhere in the world).
>
> Oh sure, I am a great fan of British sausages, which we buy from the
> local butcher and farm shop, both of which make their own (if we want a
> shoulder of pork from the butcher, we have to warn him in advance
> because he uses up all the shoulder for sausages). But my time in the
> US left me with an occasional hankering for a hot dog.
It works in the other direction, too.
R H Draney
File this under "there are people who came in after you"....r
--
Me? Sarcastic?
Yeah, right.