It's over

[Jack]

Biden is president-elect. Trump is dumped. Mitch, if not ditched, is
tossed to the side.
The sixty-second chaplain of the senate nevertheless gave a two-minute
closing prayer.

--
Jack

[occam]

Not over, not yet. The Pumpkin is still in charge (i.e. finger on the
button) until the 20th. Barring the 25th Amendment, he could still do a
lot of damage.

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

I very much doubt whether "It's over" from the point of view of the
protesting Trump supporters, and many, many, others throghtout the USA.

They think, and will continue to think, that Trump had a landslide of
legitimate votes in his favour and that the counting of the votes was
fraudulent. The inauguration of Biden will be a further, and highly
offensive, act against democracy and freedom as they see the situation.

It is possible/probahle that there will be a pro-Trump protest at the
inauguration.

I watched the live coverage of the storming of the Capitol on CNN.

A reporter said that he had spoken to one of the protestors as he was
leaving the area. He had said that he would be "back with a rifle". If
that is a more widespread attitude then future pro-Trump protests could
involve armed protestors.

One woman was shot dead during the chaos at the Capitol.

The woman was 35-year-old Ashli Babbitt, a California native and Air
Force veteran, her former husband told The Washington Post. Before
her death in the Capitol, she had used her social media to express
fervent support for President Trump and echo many of the president’s
conspiracy theories and false claims of mass voter fraud.

Police have not yet confirmed Babbitt’s identity or confirmed
details about how she was shot. The woman was shot by U.S. Capitol
Police, D.C. Police Chief Robert J. Contee III told reporters on
Wednesday.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/01/07/ashli-babbitt-dead-capitol-riot/

In my judgement, from what I hope is a safe distance, It is far from
over.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Peter T. Daniels]

There are two things a president cannot pardon: Impeachment,
and Treason.

Articles of Impeachment are already being drawn up by "The Squad,"
and AO-C did do a good job during last year's impeachment hearings.

Precedent exists for impeaching someone no longer holding the
office he is being impeached, er, from.

The Constitution's definition: "Treason against the United States, shall
consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies,
giving them Aid and Comfort" (Article III Section 3 paragraph 1). Several
of the current and former office-holders interviewed on Wednesday
afternoon (NPR) and evening (ABC-TV) used words associated with
such activities, such as "fomenting rebellion."

There were reports that the XXVth Amendment was being considered,
but that Pence was not yet involved, and there's a question of what
"half" the Cabinet members means since so many of the incumbents
are "Actings" who have not been confirmed. It dates to 1967.

"Section 4.
"Whenever the Vice President and a majority of either the principal officers
of the executive departments or of such other body as Congress may by law
provide, transmit to the President pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker
of the House of Representatives their written declaration that the President
is unable to discharge the powers and duties of his office, the Vice President
shall immediately assume the powers and duties of the office as Acting President."

Congress then has three weeks to do something about it, but it'll be over
in two weeks. And Biden will be #47, not #46. Unless the National Archives,
which finally settled on the number that was complicated by Cleveland's
two non-consecutive terms, decides that Actings don't count in the numbering.

(There have been Actings before, notably when Reagan was hospitalized
after the assassination attempt, and GWB during colonoscopies innit.)

[Jerry Friedman]

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 6:02:25 AM UTC-7, PeterWD wrote:
> On Thu, 07 Jan 2021 03:09:27 -0600, Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Biden is president-elect. Trump is dumped. Mitch, if not ditched, is
> >tossed to the side.
> >The sixty-second chaplain of the senate nevertheless gave a two-minute
> >closing prayer.
> I very much doubt whether "It's over" from the point of view of the
> protesting Trump supporters, and many, many, others throghtout the USA.

...

Obaue: NBC News interviewed Theresa and Bill Reilly, a couple who took
part in the protests. (The article doesn't say whether they were among
those who broke into the Capitol.)

'Bill Reilly said that even without "doing too much research," it was clear that
"something's up" with the November election results

'"The only thing I can say is, however many people are here, this isn't going to
go away," he said. "If you thought 2020 was weird, 2021 is going to be 'hold
my beer,' if you ask me."'

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/we-will-never-concede-trump-baselessly-asserts-voter-fraud-speech-n1253011

--
Jerry Friedman

[Tony Cooper]

You have to admire the ability of the Trumpists to slither away from
blame. They are now promoting the conspiracy theory that Antifa
people infiltrated and it was those on the radical left who instigated
the violence. All of those in MAGA kit shown on television engaged in
anything other than peacefully demonstrating were Antifa terrorists in
disguise.

My laugh of the day was the "news" in _the Onion_ that "D.C. police
lose control of rioting Trump suporters after hundreds of officers
called away to deal with black jaywalker."

--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[occam]

On 07/01/2021 16:34, Tony Cooper wrote:

>
> My laugh of the day was the "news" in _the Onion_ that "D.C. police
> lose control of rioting Trump suporters after hundreds of officers
> called away to deal with black jaywalker."
>

Did you miss the article lower down:

"Serbia Deploys Peacekeeping Forces To U.S."

https://www.theonion.com/serbia-deploys-peacekeeping-forces-to-u-s-1819565829

[HVS]

On 07 Jan 2021, occam wrote

Yup; and that was from 2000. What goes around comes around, I
guess.....

Cheers,
Harvey

[Ken Blake]

Right. He's a lame fuck.


--
Ken

[Jerry Friedman]

Is that the 62nd chaplain or a chaplain who was supposed to pray for only
one minute, or both?

--
Jerry Friedman

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,

Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>They think, and will continue to think, that Trump had a landslide of
>legitimate votes in his favour and that the counting of the votes was

With respect to this particular group, for "legitimate" read "white".

-GAWollman

--
Garrett A. Wollman | "Act to avoid constraining the future; if you can,
wol...@bimajority.org| act to remove constraint from the future. This is
Opinions not shared by| a thing you can do, are able to do, to do together."
my employers. | - Graydon Saunders, _A Succession of Bad Days_ (2015)

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Thu, 07 Jan 2021 13:02:18 +0000, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"
<ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>On Thu, 07 Jan 2021 03:09:27 -0600, Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>Biden is president-elect. Trump is dumped. Mitch, if not ditched, is
>>tossed to the side.
>>The sixty-second chaplain of the senate nevertheless gave a two-minute
>>closing prayer.
>
>I very much doubt whether "It's over" from the point of view of the
>protesting Trump supporters, and many, many, others throghtout the USA.

"throughout" is a more conventional spelling!

Thinking further about this situation I'm reminded of Winston
Churchill's:

“This is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it
is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.”

Only time will tell whether or not that it applicable to the current
situation in the USA.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 11:52:09 AM UTC-5, Garrett Wollman wrote:
> In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,
> Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>
> >They think, and will continue to think, that Trump had a landslide of
> >legitimate votes in his favour and that the counting of the votes was
> With respect to this particular group, for "legitimate" read "white".

Some republican party honcho this morning mentioned in passing
that trump had lost by a very small margin. The interviewer didn't
bother to correct her.

It was the largest (percentage as well as absolute) margin in the
21st century and one of the largest ever.

[Janet]

In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,
ma...@peterduncanson.net says...

>
> I very much doubt whether "It's over" from the point of view of the
> protesting Trump supporters, and many, many, others throghtout the
USA.

Trump has never shown any real interest in politics or government,
and appears to have got thoroughly bored with the nitty gritty of
Presidenting. He's alienated his own party and no global organisation is
ever going to want to be associated with him. So his political career
is finished, dead in the water. He's not got the interest or commitment
to lead a revolution. He hasn't got the speaking or debating skills to
join the after-dinner speaker circuit. He'll sink back to where he came
from, golf bimbos and sleazy money.

Once he's gone, his supporters will just be headless chickens
wondering why there's no dirt to peck.

Janet

[Jack]

Yes. :-)

--
Jack

[Jack]

Plus, the various state-level prosecutions may keep Trump too busy to
do a lot of fomenting.

--
Jack

[Sam Plusnet]

For any of those which lead to a trial, how likely is it that an
impartial jury could be assembled?

Detailed checks on social media posts by all prospective jurors?

--
Sam Plusnet
Wales, UK

[Jack]

Also, if convicted and jailed, would he have Secret Service protection
in the mess hall and showers?

--
Jack

[Garrett Wollman]

In article <uhtevftml3d43gvaj...@4ax.com>,

Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Also, if convicted and jailed, would he have Secret Service protection

>in the mess hall and showers?

He'd be in Club Fed. Private accommodations, like other rich crooks
get.

[Peter T. Daniels]

He's planning to run in 2024. That's why either impeachment and
conviction or conviction for treason before then is necessary, because
his 75,000,000 supporters aren't going anywhere, and none of the
challengers will win the nomination.

[Peter T. Daniels]

(1) Going to trial is very, very rare. (2) If it does go to trial, the
defendant has the choice between a jury trial and a bench trial.

trump has spent about 40 years _settling_ lawsuits (in a criminal
case, that would be "pleading to a lesser charge that still carries
what would amount to a life sentence for a 75-year-old").

[Mack A. Damia]

His ego and lack of conscience may move him to run again, but he will
not get past first base. The American people will not stand for
another four years like the last four. We know who and what he is
now.

And as was mentioned earlier, he may be very busy with the possible
prosecutions that will likely be coming down.

[Jerry Friedman]

His approval rating in surveys is still over 42%, which is enough to win
the Republican nomination.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/trump-approval-ratings/?cid=rrpromo

Your "American people" and "we" isn't enough of us at this point.

> And as was mentioned earlier, he may be very busy with the possible
> prosecutions that will likely be coming down.

We'll see.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Mack A. Damia]

Wrong. He lost the 2020 election by over seven million popular votes
and seventy-four electoral votes. He was thoroughly trounced.

Let's be brutally honest: Biden didn't win the election as much as
trump lost it.

Do you think the events of yesterday are going to endear him to the
American people even more so that they elect him again in four years?

[Jerry Friedman]

Sorry, when I said "isn't enough" I was referring to your comments "will not
get past first base" and "We know who and what he is now." I wasn't
suggesting that he could be re-elected. I also meant "not enough" in a
general sense--there are still far too many Americans who don't seem to
know who and what he is.

Also I thought the polls were more up-to-date than they are. There's only
one recent poll at that page, and that was taken yesterday and today, so
it probably includes a significant number of results from before the attack
on the Capitol. In that one he's down to 38%. But anything over 25%
could be enough to win the Republican nomination (not the Presidency).
That, by the way, is why I said "enough to win the Republican nomination,"
not "enough to be elected again."

If he does decide to run again, though, the Republican establishment
and big donors may be able to a better job of stopping him this time.

As far as "thoroughly trounced" goes, the meaningful numbers for the
popular vote are the percentages. Biden won 51.4% to 46.9%. That's
decisive but I wouldn't call it trouncing. As for the electoral votes, if
about 130,000 votes in Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Wisconsin had gone
the other way, Trump would have won.

> Let's be brutally honest: Biden didn't win the election as much as
> trump lost it.

Certainly. (And I don't see that as brutal.)

> Do you think the events of yesterday are going to endear him to the
> American people even more so that they elect him again in four years?

...

Nope. Did you think I said that?

--
Jerry Friedman

[Mack A. Damia]

On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 15:44:33 -0800 (PST), Jerry Friedman

Just watching "The Five" on Fox News. Nothing about yesterday; their
focus is on the BLM protests over the summer. Media hypocrisy and
all that. No mention of the fact that yesterday was an insurrection
against a sitting government.

>Also I thought the polls were more up-to-date than they are. There's only
>one recent poll at that page, and that was taken yesterday and today, so
>it probably includes a significant number of results from before the attack
>on the Capitol. In that one he's down to 38%. But anything over 25%
>could be enough to win the Republican nomination (not the Presidency).
>That, by the way, is why I said "enough to win the Republican nomination,"
>not "enough to be elected again."

Many Republicans are embarrassed. Look at the resignations that have
happened today.

The liberal media will not let the American people forget yesterday.
The investigations have only just begun.

Trump running again in 2024? CNN and the others will run loops of
Trump urging them to the Capitol and the mob breaking in.

>If he does decide to run again, though, the Republican establishment
>and big donors may be able to a better job of stopping him this time.

Yes, the "Hidden Powers".

>As far as "thoroughly trounced" goes, the meaningful numbers for the
>popular vote are the percentages. Biden won 51.4% to 46.9%. That's
>decisive but I wouldn't call it trouncing. As for the electoral votes, if
>about 130,000 votes in Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Wisconsin had gone
>the other way, Trump would have won.
>
>> Let's be brutally honest: Biden didn't win the election as much as
>> trump lost it.
>
>Certainly. (And I don't see that as brutal.)

In that it diminishes the popularity of Biden and heightens the hatred
of Trump.

>> Do you think the events of yesterday are going to endear him to the
>> American people even more so that they elect him again in four years?
>...
>
>Nope. Did you think I said that?

You said: "Your "American people" and "we" isn't enough of us at this
point."

I say that the 2020 election proves otherwise.

[Peter Moylan]

Is anyone checking whether the crown jewels are being sent out of the
country?

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2021-01-07 21:18:13 +0000, Garrett Wollman said:

> In article <uhtevftml3d43gvaj...@4ax.com>,
> Jack <quia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Also, if convicted and jailed, would he have Secret Service protection
>> in the mess hall and showers?
>
> He'd be in Club Fed. Private accommodations, like other rich crooks
> get.

Would he get the hamberders and ice cream that he needs to stay alive?
What about golfing facilities?

--
Athel -- British, living in France for 34 years

[occam]

I'd heard of blitz chess, but this is the first time I come across
'blitz prayer'. I guess, with all the sinners in the Senate, he has to
keep his prayers short to accommodate everyone.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 5:18:34 PM UTC-5, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 13:51:35 -0800 (PST), "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 1:01:19 PM UTC-5, Janet wrote:
> >> In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,
> >> ma...@peterduncanson.net says...

> >> > I very much doubt whether "It's over" from the point of view of the
> >> > protesting Trump supporters, and many, many, others throghtout the
> >> USA.
> >> Trump has never shown any real interest in politics or government,
> >> and appears to have got thoroughly bored with the nitty gritty of
> >> Presidenting. He's alienated his own party and no global organisation is
> >> ever going to want to be associated with him. So his political career
> >> is finished, dead in the water. He's not got the interest or commitment
> >> to lead a revolution. He hasn't got the speaking or debating skills to
> >> join the after-dinner speaker circuit. He'll sink back to where he came
> >> from, golf bimbos and sleazy money.
> >> Once he's gone, his supporters will just be headless chickens
> >> wondering why there's no dirt to peck.
> >He's planning to run in 2024. That's why either impeachment and
> >conviction or conviction for treason before then is necessary, because
> >his 75,000,000 supporters aren't going anywhere, and none of the
> >challengers will win the nomination.

This morning on NPR, Jeh Johnson (Obama's DHS sec'y) deconstructed
yesterday's "water-calming" speech, the one delivered without affect
like all the ones when he's forced to come close to telling truths, listing
all the new lies.

> His ego and lack of conscience may move him to run again, but he will
> not get past first base. The American people will not stand for
> another four years like the last four. We know who and what he is
> now.

Have you forgotten who the electorate in the republican primaries is?

> And as was mentioned earlier, he may be very busy with the possible
> prosecutions that will likely be coming down.

Most of the 2016 campaign was carried out by telephone from
the tower on (now) Black Lives Plaza on Fifth Avenue.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 6:44:36 PM UTC-5, Jerry Friedman wrote:

> As far as "thoroughly trounced" goes, the meaningful numbers for the
> popular vote are the percentages. Biden won 51.4% to 46.9%. That's
> decisive but I wouldn't call it trouncing. As for the electoral votes, if
> about 130,000 votes in Pennsylvania, Georgia, and Wisconsin had gone
> the other way, Trump would have won.

Biden and trump's victories were with exactly the same number of
electoral votes (306).

The difference is about 15,000 votes in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and
Wisconsin (so Biden's win was comparably a landslide), and I attribute
that almost entirely to Sanders.

Biden's popular-vote margin was the biggest in the 21st century
and one of the biggest ever.

All through the fall of 2016, Sanders voters were calling in to WNYC
claiming there wasn't a dime's worth of difference between Clinton
and trump (both corrupt tools of the 1% and all that) so they wouldn't
be voting. (Andrea Bernstein took a look at the Upstate primary
results and found that the only counties where Sanders won over
Clinton were the most conservative ones, including (or plus) the
ones that border Vermont so they were in the Burlington media
mini-market.) In NYS, of course, their staying home didn't affect
the outcome, but in places like Wisconsin it did: the actor Jeff
Daniels told Colbert that in his home state of Wisconsin, something
like 80,000 ballots included votes for down-ballot Democrats and
none for president.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 07:17:44 -0800 (PST), "Peter T. Daniels"

That's true, but they will be backing a loser - if they support him.

Can you imagine the debates? Trump name-calling? And his opponents
will bring up the last four years and January 6. They will be ready
for him. Also, it looks as if he may be impeached again.

I can imagine that within a couple of years, Trump will be persona non
grata in the Republican party.

[Peter T. Daniels]

If the post-presidential impeachment succeeds, he will be barred from
any Federal office.

"Article I
"Section 3
"last clause
"Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal
from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or
Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be
liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law."

Or maybe "under the United States" can be interpreted to include the States
as well?

[Sam Plusnet]

"Is that the Governor of Fort Knox?
Here's what I need you to do..."

"Get right on it, I want everything to arrive by the 19th."

[Jerry Friedman]

On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 4:44:36 PM UTC-7, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 3:49:03 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> > On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 14:41:35 -0800 (PST), Jerry Friedman
> > <jerry_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 3:18:34 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> > >> On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 13:51:35 -0800 (PST), "Peter T. Daniels"
> > >> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

[Trumpery]

...

A poll taken yesterday by Marist College and PBS has appeared at
fivethirtyeight.com. (The site grades this poll as A+.) 38% approve of Trump
and 58% disapprove. For comparison, in their previous poll, which was taken
Dec. 1-6, the numbers were 43% and 52%.

At Marist's site, I see that 51% of Republicans say Trump was not to
blame for the riot at all and 18% say that he was only a little to blame.

http://maristpoll.marist.edu/pbs-newshour-marist-poll-results-analysis-insurrection-at-the-capitol/#sthash.A6PafRr5.dpbs

A lot can happen in four years--in fact, a lot usually does--but I think Trump
could still get the Republican nomination. It doesn't look as if he could
win, though.
--
Jerry Friedman

[Jerry Friedman]

Fort Knox has a Commander or maybe a Commanding General, but
apparently the Fort Knox Bullion Depository has a Field Chief of Police
(that's the Mint Police) and an Inspector.

https://www.usmint.gov/about/leadership

--
Jerry Friedman

[Mack A. Damia]

I visited the Federal Reserve Bank office in NYC several times in the
early 1970s. They offer tours.

In the basement is a huge vault filled with gold bars. None of the
gold stored in the vault belongs to the New York Fed or the Federal
Reserve System. The New York Fed acts as the guardian and custodian of
the gold on behalf of account holders, which include the U.S.
government, foreign governments, other central banks, and official
international organizations.

Much of the gold in the vault arrived during and after World War II as
many countries wanted to store their gold reserves in a safe location.

As of 2019, the vault housed approximately 497,000 gold bars, with a
combined weight of about 6,190 tons. The vault is able to support this
weight because it rests on the bedrock of Manhattan Island, 80 feet
below street level and 50 feet below sea level.

Visitors can see the vault and the bars during the tour.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Fri, 8 Jan 2021 16:38:32 -0800 (PST), Jerry Friedman

But it is far too early. He could face federal charges for his role
in inciting a riot. Democrats are going to introduce the Article of
Impeachment for “incitement of insurrection” on Monday. Speaker
Pelosi has told him, "resign or else".

It probably will never get to the Senate, but it will be a stain on
Trump and his presidency forever. I have also heard that the Congress
may be able to pass legislation preventing him from holding any
federal office ever again; of course, that would be automatic if he
was convicted by the Senate.

I have also heard that the mob may be planning another assault for
Inauguration Day.

[Lewis]

In message <rt7e7k$1g1e$1...@grapevine.csail.mit.edu> Garrett Wollman <wol...@bimajority.org> wrote:
> In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,

> Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>>They think, and will continue to think, that Trump had a landslide of
>>legitimate votes in his favour and that the counting of the votes was

> With respect to this particular group, for "legitimate" read "white".

Exactly.

If anyone has been living under a rock as to just how much of a racist
shithole the USA really is all one need do is look at the last year of
protests.

How did the Capital Police respond to BLM peaceful protestors on the
mall? Full riot gear. White racists invading the US Capital, selfies,
giving them directions to the offices of the people they wanted to
murder, and occasionally a strong talking to.

Under Trump's own executive order each one of them must be sentenced to
a minimum 10 years in prison. See if that happens.

--
Nobody puts one over on Fred C. Dobbs.

[Lewis]

In message <8a40fe6d-b3ca-4bd2...@googlegroups.com> Jerry Friedman <jerry_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 2:09:33 AM UTC-7, Jack wrote:
>> Biden is president-elect. Trump is dumped. Mitch, if not ditched, is
>> tossed to the side.
>> The sixty-second chaplain of the senate nevertheless gave a two-minute
>> closing prayer.

> Is that the 62nd chaplain or a chaplain who was supposed to pray for only
> one minute, or both?

An example of when writing out the words for the numbers was the celear
wrong choice.

The 62nd chaplain.



--
Imagine all the people Sharing all the world

[Lewis]

I very much hope that the Dems have the balls to strip Trump of all
privileges, but that means impeaching him now.

I am certain this will not happen, and they are all saying "only a few
more days: but that fucker can do a lot of damage in a few days, and he
will.

"You're overreacting."

Yeah, just like I was in pre-election 2016 when I said I he was elected
he would try to overthrow the government rather than leave office.

Which, honestly, I expected him to do sooner than he tried, but I did
underrate his incompetence.

Next time, we are well and truly fucked.

Not just the US, everyone.

--
I'll have what the gentleman on the floor is having.

[Arindam Banerjee]

Hope so. You are all evil, while some are more stupid.

>
> Not just the US, everyone.

Every one else minus the corruptocrats will jump for joy when the US implodes under its own weight of lies, greed, violence, bad manners etc.

[Lewis]

In message <slrnrvibqv....@m1mini.local> Lewis <g.k...@kreme.dont-email.me> wrote:
> In message <rt7e7k$1g1e$1...@grapevine.csail.mit.edu> Garrett Wollman <wol...@bimajority.org> wrote:
>> In article <u2vdvf9s0slphj41c...@4ax.com>,
>> Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:

>>>They think, and will continue to think, that Trump had a landslide of
>>>legitimate votes in his favour and that the counting of the votes was

>> With respect to this particular group, for "legitimate" read "white".

> Exactly.

> If anyone has been living under a rock as to just how much of a racist
> shithole the USA really is all one need do is look at the last year of
> protests.

Further on this Maxine Waters refused to be evacuated from her office
during the coup attempt because she did no trust the Capital Police.

AS I said, "No sane black person in America would ever trust the cops."

> How did the Capital Police respond to BLM peaceful protestors on the
> mall? Full riot gear. White racists invading the US Capital, selfies,
> giving them directions to the offices of the people they wanted to
> murder, and occasionally a strong talking to.

> Under Trump's own executive order each one of them must be sentenced to
> a minimum 10 years in prison. See if that happens.



--

Rent a flat above a shop, cut your hair and get a job, smoke some
fags and play some pool, pretend you never went to school and
still you'll never get it right cuz when you're lay'n in bed at
night watching roaches climb the wall if you called your dad he
could stop it all.

[occam]

Never mind the crown jewels, Nancy Pelosi is more rightly worried about
the nuclear button (and its codes). Quite rightly so, in my mind. The
deranged ego of Trump is capable of anything at this stage.

https://globalnews.ca/news/7563927/nancy-pelosi-us-military-donald-trump-nuclear-codes/

[charles]

In article <i5tl6n...@mid.individual.net>,

I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell someone else to strt
the proceedure.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

[None]

News from Saturday morning, January 9.

AP has intercepted a document from the White House supply office. Last night
(Friday Jan 8), the office issued an emergency order, quadrupling the
standing order for size XXXXXL Depends, for about two weeks, after which the
order is cancelled. This is real deep state stuff, and certainly warrants a
violent and murderous armed insurrection against the US Congress and the
Electoral College.

Since the Trumplickin White Nazionalist Party (the former "GOP") has adopted
their fatboy loser as their official platform, sedition is now their
official party policy. They just voted the disowned Romney spawn as the
party's Reichskanzler, and she's a staunch supporter of the seditious
putsch.

[Janet]

In article <15b8cea0-0f88-42a4...@googlegroups.com>,
jerry_f...@yahoo.com says...
> Subject: Re: It's over
> From: Jerry Friedman <jerry_f...@yahoo.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.usage.english

>
> On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 4:44:36 PM UTC-7, Jerry Friedman wrote:

> > [quoted text muted]

> > > <jerry_f...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >On Thursday, January 7, 2021 at 3:18:34 PM UTC-7, Mack A. Damia wrote:
> > > >> On Thu, 7 Jan 2021 13:51:35 -0800 (PST), "Peter T. Daniels"
> > > >> <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
> [Trumpery]
>

> > [quoted text muted]

> > it probably includes a significant number of results from before the attack
> > on the Capitol. In that one he's down to 38%. But anything over 25%
> > could be enough to win the Republican nomination (not the Presidency).
> > That, by the way, is why I said "enough to win the Republican nomination,"
> > not "enough to be elected again."
> ...
>
> A poll taken yesterday by Marist College and PBS has appeared at
> fivethirtyeight.com. (The site grades this poll as A+.) 38% approve of Trump
> and 58% disapprove. For comparison, in their previous poll, which was taken
> Dec. 1-6, the numbers were 43% and 52%.
>
> At Marist's site, I see that 51% of Republicans say Trump was not to
> blame for the riot at all and 18% say that he was only a little to blame.
>
> http://maristpoll.marist.edu/pbs-newshour-marist-poll-results-analysis-insurrection-at-the-capitol/#sthash.A6PafRr5.dpbs
>
> A lot can happen in four years--in fact, a lot usually does--but I think Trump
> could still get the Republican nomination. It doesn't look as if he could
> win, though.

Humpty Dumpty never got back on the wall and nobody bothered to put him
back together again.

I doubt Trump will ever risk a second election. Being a loser is more
than his mental state can handle, it has crushed his fragile shell and
there's nothing left inside it. Some men get old with their marbles and
dignity intact; he isn't one of them.

All that's on his horizon is a diagnosis of dementia, arranged by his
daughter to sweep his shit under the rug and off her political path.

Janet


Janet

[Jerry Friedman]

Right. You were the one who was sure he could not get past first base
because we now know who and what he is. I was saying it's not so certain.
Now that his supporters know more about who and what he is, maybe an
eighth or a ninth of them have changed their view of him. Of course one
would like to see more polls, but there's nothing new at fivethirtyeight.

> He could face federal charges for his role
> in inciting a riot. Democrats are going to introduce the Article of
> Impeachment for “incitement of insurrection” on Monday. Speaker
> Pelosi has told him, "resign or else".

As I write, it doesn't look as if "or else" amounts to anything.

> It probably will never get to the Senate, but it will be a stain on
> Trump and his presidency forever.

He and his supporters didn't care about the last one.

> I have also heard that the Congress
> may be able to pass legislation preventing him from holding any
> federal office ever again; of course, that would be automatic if he
> was convicted by the Senate.
>
> I have also heard that the mob may be planning another assault for
> Inauguration Day.

I feel certain some of those nuts are thinking about it. We'll see
what happens.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

On 2021-01-09 13:46:42 +0000, Janet said:

>
> [ … ]

>
>
> All that's on his horizon is a diagnosis of dementia, arranged by his
> daughter to sweep his shit under the rug and off her political path.

I'm not for a moment suggesting that all the trumpkins who sacked the
Capitol are like this, but at least one or two of them thought it a
good idea to smear their faeces around in the corridors, walls, etc.

[Mack A. Damia]

On Sat, 9 Jan 2021 07:45:50 -0800 (PST), Jerry Friedman

I would wager that he will not get past first base - maybe even on his
own volition. I do not think he will run. He won't get the support
that he had in 2016, and his legacy will be sullied.

There is going to be a lot of investigating and cleaning up his messes
over the next few years.

>> He could face federal charges for his role
>> in inciting a riot. Democrats are going to introduce the Article of
>> Impeachment for “incitement of insurrection” on Monday. Speaker
>> Pelosi has told him, "resign or else".
>
>As I write, it doesn't look as if "or else" amounts to anything.

Only president to be impeached twice?

>> It probably will never get to the Senate, but it will be a stain on
>> Trump and his presidency forever.
>
>He and his supporters didn't care about the last one.

The opposition is often like that, you know. It's called "denial".

>> I have also heard that the Congress
>> may be able to pass legislation preventing him from holding any
>> federal office ever again; of course, that would be automatic if he
>> was convicted by the Senate.
>>
>> I have also heard that the mob may be planning another assault for
>> Inauguration Day.
>
>I feel certain some of those nuts are thinking about it. We'll see
>what happens.

We could even have an attempt at secession by a number of states. Good
riddance to bad rubbish.

[Jack]

But then it doesn't work!

--
Jack

[Sam Plusnet]

On 09-Jan-21 4:21, Lewis wrote:

> If anyone has been living under a rock as to just how much of a racist
> shithole the USA really is all one need do is look at the last year of
> protests.
>
> How did the Capital Police respond to BLM peaceful protestors on the
> mall? Full riot gear. White racists invading the US Capital, selfies,
> giving them directions to the offices of the people they wanted to
> murder, and occasionally a strong talking to.
>
> Under Trump's own executive order each one of them must be sentenced to
> a minimum 10 years in prison. See if that happens.
>

It seems that a number of those people are now distressed at the way
Trump has abandoned them by saying now that they are terrible people who
must be punished.
They really cannot have been paying attention over the last 4 years.

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be Obeyed.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

[Jerry Friedman]

On Saturday, January 9, 2021 at 5:36:25 PM UTC-7, PeterWD wrote:
> On Sat, 09 Jan 2021 13:07:41 +0000 (GMT), charles
> <cha...@candehope.me.uk> wrote:
>
> >In article <i5tl6n...@mid.individual.net>,

...

> >> Never mind the crown jewels, Nancy Pelosi is more rightly worried about
> >> the nuclear button (and its codes). Quite rightly so, in my mind. The
> >> deranged ego of Trump is capable of anything at this stage.
> >
> >> https://globalnews.ca/news/7563927/nancy-pelosi-us-military-donald-trump-nuclear-codes/
> >
> >I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell someone else to strt
> >the proceedure.
> Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be Obeyed.

There were news stories when he took office about how the generals
were making sure that no one would obey an irrational order for a nuclear
attack. At this point I don't think they'd even pay attention to him. No one's
going to be court-martialed for disobeying him.

--
Jerry Friedman

--
Jerry Friedman

[Arindam Banerjee]

All wars are about money, it was said.
The civil war in the US is between the despicables and the deplorables.

[Hibou]

Le 10/01/2021 à 01:18, Jerry Friedman a écrit :
> On Saturday, January 9, 2021 at 5:36:25 PM UTC-7, PeterWD wrote:
>> On Sat, 09 Jan 2021 13:07:41 +0000 (GMT), charles
>>>

>>> I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell someone else to strt
>>> the proceedure.
>> Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be Obeyed.
>
> There were news stories when he took office about how the generals
> were making sure that no one would obey an irrational order for a nuclear
> attack. At this point I don't think they'd even pay attention to him. No one's
> going to be court-martialed for disobeying him.

I hope the generals would never obey such an irrational order. If no
situation has developed that might warrant it - and they should be au
courant - then it is irrational.

In such a case, it would be an insane general who chose to kill millions
of people rather than face a court-martial for not doing so.

[Rich Ulrich]

Ivanka cleaning up and following him? That's a horrible thought.

He passed that dementia test, but I think his delusions are now
/significant/ and interfering with his function.

"Psychosis" is tricky to define. Looking back, today, I figure that
his original, "My crowd was bigger than Obama's" was a frank
delusion. What else should you call it? That delusion was harmless,
but today I figure that we should have started calling him
"delusional," for whatever good it may have done. And I still don't
know where "psychotic" starts. He still functions; his head is
a mess, inside.

"Lies" are ordinarily retreated from, eventually. The Washington Post
created their new category of "bottomless Pinocchio" (December,
2018) to describe Trump's unusual practice of maintaining the same
"untruths" after they had been uncovered and displayed; almost
everyone else in their history of fact-checking has backed down, or
at least shut up. The Post ranks their untruths on a scale of 0 to 4
"pinocchios"; the bottomless ones have been repeated at least
20 times.

Today, I figure the bottomless pinocchios give us a catalog of his
fondest delusions.

--
Rich Ulrich

[bil...@shaw.ca]

Clearly not. I see an administration that is poised to disobey any destructive orders
issued by Trump. The lunatics who invaded the Capitol will obey insane orders by
Trump, but I think that professional civil and diplomatic service employees of the
U.S. government are prepared now to use their good sense before obeying a presidential
order.

bill

[charles]

In article <cpikvf5kpdqpvqr1v...@4ax.com>, Peter Duncanson

I thought the Nuremburg trials put paid to that idea.

[Athel Cornish-Bowden]

That's for Johnny foreigner: it doesn't apply to the President of the USA

[Ken Blake]

Not even General Jack D. Ripper?


--
Ken

[Peter T. Daniels]

Only if an order is "lawful."

[Jerry Friedman]

On Sunday, January 10, 2021 at 4:01:09 AM UTC-7, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2021-01-10 09:39:21 +0000, charles said:
>
> > In article <cpikvf5kpdqpvqr1v...@4ax.com>, Peter Duncanson
> > [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
> >> On Sat, 09 Jan 2021 13:07:41 +0000 (GMT), charles
> >> <cha...@candehope.me.uk> wrote:
> >
> >>> In article <i5tl6n...@mid.individual.net>, occam
> >>> <nob...@nowhere.nix> wrote:

...

> >>>> Never mind the crown jewels, Nancy Pelosi is more rightly worried
> >>>> about the nuclear button (and its codes). Quite rightly so, in my
> >>>> mind. The deranged ego of Trump is capable of anything at this stage.
> >>>
> >>>> https://globalnews.ca/news/7563927/nancy-pelosi-us-military-donald-trump-nuclear-codes/
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell someone else to
> >>> strt the proceedure.
> >
> >> Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be Obeyed.
> >
> > I thought the Nuremburg trials put paid to that idea.
> That's for Johnny foreigner: it doesn't apply to the President of the USA

Trump might think it doesn't, but the law says it does and most of the
military understands that, as people here including me have been saying.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Mack A. Damia]

Read Tim Snyder's "On Tyranny". Twenty short lessons, very easy and
interesting to read.

https://www.amazon.com/Tyranny-Twenty-Lessons-Twentieth-Century/dp/0804190119

I saw him on a news show yesterday talking about "The Big Lie". Here
is an article from the New York Times about it. Hope you can access
it.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/09/magazine/trump-coup.html

[J. J. Lodder]

Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:

Yes, and the lawfulness of the order is going to be decided upon
by a court-martial filled with other senior generals,

Jan

[Rich Ulrich]

Thanks. That is an excellent article. I read it without explicitly
invoking my NY Times subscription.

I've seen Snyder on Rachel Maddow a couple of times, and I
was impressed. Last week, they give us the steps of the Big Lie.

--
Rich Ulrich

[Sam Plusnet]

On 10-Jan-21 15:40, Jerry Friedman wrote:
> On Sunday, January 10, 2021 at 4:01:09 AM UTC-7, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>> On 2021-01-10 09:39:21 +0000, charles said:
>>
>>> In article <cpikvf5kpdqpvqr1v...@4ax.com>, Peter Duncanson
>>> [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 09 Jan 2021 13:07:41 +0000 (GMT), charles

>>>>>

>>>>> I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell someone else to
>>>>> strt the proceedure.
>>>
>>>> Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be Obeyed.
>>>
>>> I thought the Nuremburg trials put paid to that idea.
>> That's for Johnny foreigner: it doesn't apply to the President of the USA
>
> Trump might think it doesn't, but the law says it does and most of the
> military understands that, as people here including me have been saying.
>

We have 10 days left in which to discover who's right.

p.s. I would suspect a conventional attack on Iran, rather than a "loose
the ICBMs'" scenario.

P.P.S The bombs to _land_ at 12:01 on the 20th in order to shift the
blame onto Biden.

[Ken Blake]

Don't say that! You never know if the rump is reading here and might
think that's a good suggestion!


--
Ken

[bil...@shaw.ca]

I am 100 per cent certain that any such order would not be obeyed. Whoever
gave that order and anyone who followed it would find themselves in a sea
of legal and political trouble. Senior military officials by and large did not get
where they are today by being total idiots.

bill

[Sam Plusnet]

Trump... Reading...
I think we're fairly safe.

[Peter Moylan]

Mad generals are more powerful than insane presidents.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW

[Bob Martin]

What about Michael Flynn? Would he have disobeyed an order from Trump?

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

On Sun, 10 Jan 2021 13:30:05 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>
wrote:

"the rump"?

Has he been beheaded?

[Tony Cooper]

On Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:42:08 +0000, "Peter Duncanson [BrE]"

That's where his head is...and well up it.

>Has he been beheaded?


--

Tony Cooper Orlando Florida

[Ken Blake]

He's an ass/arse.


--
Ken

[Peter Duncanson [BrE]]

Senior US military officers: We can't obey your order Mr President.

Trump: Why not?

Officers: The Nuremberg Principles.

Trump: What's Nuremberg?

Officers: A city in Germany.

Trump: Bomb Nuremberg first. They cannot tell us what we can and cannot
do.

[CDB]

On 1/11/2021 9:42 AM, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
> Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com> wrote:
>> Sam Plusnet wrote:
>>> Jerry Friedman wrote:
>>>> Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:

>>>>> charles said:
>>>>>> Peter Duncanson [BrE] <ma...@peterduncanson.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> charles:

>>>>>>>> I don't think the 'nuclear button' does more than tell
>>>>>>>> someone else to strt the proceedure.

>>>>>>> Indeed. But he is Commander-in-Chief: He Who Must Be
>>>>>>> Obeyed.

>>>>>> I thought the Nuremburg trials put paid to that idea.
>>>>> That's for Johnny foreigner: it doesn't apply to the
>>>>> President of the USA

>>>> Trump might think it doesn't, but the law says it does and most
>>>> of the military understands that, as people here including me
>>>> have been saying.

>>> We have 10 days left in which to discover who's right.

>>> p.s. I would suspect a conventional attack on Iran, rather than a
>>> "loose the ICBMs'" scenario.

>>> P.P.S The bombs to _land_ at 12:01 on the 20th in order to shift
>>> the blame onto Biden.

>> Don't say that! You never know if the rump is reading here and
>> might think that's a good suggestion!

> "the rump"?

"In the name of God, go!"

[Quinn C]

* Ken Blake:

You mean a real punishment would be to beass him?

--
Perhaps it might be well, while the subject is under discussion,
to attempt the creation of an entirely new gender, for the purpose
of facilitating reference to the growing caste of manly women and
womanly men. -- Baltimore Sun (1910)

[bil...@shaw.ca]

De-rump Trump? But then what would you do with it?

We could emulate a favourite bit of Kurt Vonnegut Jr.:

Rumpity-trump, rumpity-trump, rumpity-rumpity trump.

bill

[Arindam Banerjee]

And the best Potus ever, even so.
>
>
> --
> Ken

[Peter Moylan]

On 12/01/21 12:31, Quinn C wrote:
> * Ken Blake:
>> On 1/11/2021 7:42 AM, Peter Duncanson [BrE] wrote:
>>> On Sun, 10 Jan 2021 13:30:05 -0700, Ken Blake <k...@invalidemail.com>

>>>>

>>>> Don't say that! You never know if the rump is reading here and might
>>>> think that's a good suggestion!
>>>
>>> "the rump"?
>>>
>>> Has he been beheaded?
>>
>> He's an ass/arse.
>
> You mean a real punishment would be to beass him?

Did you hear about the woman who backed into a circular saw?

Disaster.

[Kerr-Mudd,John]

On Tue, 12 Jan 2021 03:34:34 GMT, "bil...@shaw.ca" <bil...@shaw.ca>
wrote:

Nellie the Elephant (Toy Dolls)

for younger listeners:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9m7tPikH0UA
(1984)
after some practice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvDdDmgqqKE
(2017)
fer yer southern yanks ;-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMU2ndjiMeQ
(Devil went down to Georgia)

--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.

[Ken Blake]

<like>

--
Ken