Fwd: Friedman's lies about Lazar
Anonymous
---- Begin Forwarded Message
>From: Stanton Friedman <fsp...@brunnet.net>
>
>>I wonder why some people have an emotional and angry reaction >>against him. i have
never hears any argument against him that held >>up.
>
>Sorry but the facts are clear. There is no evidence that any of Bob's
>claims are true and much that they are not. MIT and Cal Tech never
>heard of him. He did take some courses at Pierce Junior College in So.
>Calif at the same time he was supposedly going to MIT near Boston. He
>didn't work for Los Alamos, he worked for a subcontractor. He finished
>in the bottom 3rd of his high school class, graduating in August not
>June, having taken only one science course, chemistry . He could never
>have been admitted to MIT or Cal Tech.
>
>How is it that Patricia knows he has made no money from his videos, >the Testor model
etc? His 115 scheme won't work. The stuff would be
>radioactive, he couldn't have obtained any. ad nauseum ad nauseum. A
>diploma or 2 would have been nice sometime in the last 8 years?? The
>prof he said would recall him from CIT, never taught there, only at
>Pierce.
Response from tridot:
You aren't talking to Bob Lazar or Gene Huff, but we can answer that
question for you.
You have to understand some of the politics involved here. Stanton
Friedman has degenerated in recent years and has quite a chip on his
shoulder. If stories like that of Lazar are true, no one wants to see an
aging, bloated, windbag like Friedman standing around holding blacked out
Freedom of Information Act documents or talking about an individual UFO
sighting somewhere else in the world. The people want the real
information and Friedman doesn't have any.
When California changed it's funding for public education back in the
80s, it abruptly halted Friedman's career as a speaker on the college and
junior college circuit. His entire income was dependent on that and when
it stopped, he moved to Canada. Ask him. The point is that he has a lot
more to lose than most when the attention gets focused away from him. Bob
Lazar is running from the attention and Stanton Friedman is running to
it. There's a big difference. Friedman wrote and entire book about a UFO
crash at Corona and it never happened! His main informant turned out to
be completely unreliable and admitted that he was a fraud. Do you think
Friedman wants to talk about that?
Now we'll specifically address some of Friedman's allegations.
Lazar was the first to come out and say that some of his educational
background had been deleted. Bob Lazar never attended any of the
universities on an ongoing, year after year basis, going to football
games and running for student body president. He was a nerd who moved
around the country because of his parents. He had to petition for his
diplomas. Friedman's information about when and where Lazar went to
school was taken from some erroneous internet info, not from Lazar.
Bob Lazar graduated from high school in August alright, a year early. He
was in a special program for the smart kids and studied electronics and
things of that sort. Bob Lazar graduated from Tresper Clark High School
on Long Island in New York. They say they never spoke to Friedman and
that he fabricated that whole story. Now just in case you'd like to
confirm that, why don't you personally take it upon yourself to call that
high school and try and get records on Bob Lazar. You'll find that they
won't release any records without written, notorized permission from the
individual in question. Friedman was so desperate that he lied. It is
possible that Bob would be in a lower part of his class if they
segregated his general education grades from his technical grades. Bob is
not one to dwell on English Lit, Poli Sci, and mundane things of that
sort, nor would he try to excel in those subjects.
The reason Friedman brings up that Bob worked for a sub-contractor at Los
Alamos is because Friedman lost an old argument and he won't let it die.
When Bob Lazar first surfaced, Friedman called Los Alamos and asked if
they had any records on Lazar. They said no. Friedman released a world
wide statement on his own letterhead stating that Lazar was a total fraud
and had never worked at Los Alamos. Then Gene Huff and George Knapp sent
Friedman all of the information on Lazar and it showed that Bob had
worked for Kirk-Meyer, a large sub-contractor at Los Alamos, and Friedman
had to eat crow. He now made a world wide release, on his own letterhead,
and in it he then changed his story and said that Bob Lazar worked AT Los
Alamos, not FOR Los Alamos, implying that he was still right. Friedman
could not produce one shred of evidence that anyone had ever said that
Bob Lazar worked FOR Los Alamos as opposed to AT Los Alamos, but Friedman
just hates to admit that he's wrong. In case you don't know, a lot of
work at major facilities is done by sub-contractors who use the
facilities for their own purposes.
In his next release, Friedman said that Lazar never had a security
clearance because the Meson Physics Facility, where Lazar worked, was not
a classified facility. Well, Friedman is right that, generally speaking,
it is not a classified facility, but periodically, classified work is
done there. George Knapp had interviewed people who worked with Lazar
when they had clearance and they confirmed that Lazar had clearance. Gene
Huff asked Friedman if he'd like to bet $1,000 that no classified work
had ever been done at the Meson Physics facility and Friedman backed
down.
When Friedman talks about whether 115 is real or not, it's important for
you to know that he, nor anyone else who wasn't in the program at S4,
knows that. Currently the Lab for Heavy Ion Research at Darmstadt,
Germany has plans to fuse Curium with Calcium to achieve element 116
which they anticipate will then decay in a chain of unknown nuclides and
identify the island of stability. However, you need to understand that
creating an atom of something which will only exist for a short time does
not allow scientists to learn much about it qualitatively or
quanitatively. They need to have a "chunk" if it massive enough to allow
them to experiment with it and they are far from achieving that. The
element 115 at S4 was kept under neutron bombardment when it was at rest
to help it remain stable. It was activated by proton bombardment.
Friedman knows nothing about any of this and is just blowing smoke
because he's jealous of Lazar.
In his most recent book, Friedman claims that Lazar says he stole some
115 from S4 and brought it home with him. Lazar never said that and
Friedman didn't as much as make a phone call to confirm whether he did or
didn't. Friedman lied about Lazar in his book.
It seems that Friedman has fallen on some trying financial times and can
no longer be trusted. That's unfortunate as he's been out there touting
ufology for two decades, instead of getting a real job, and he used to be
a trustworthy character when it came to the government covering all of
this up. His degeneration is blatant and sad. Too bad for ufology and too
bad for Friedman.
Friedman needs to heed his following advice.
>Please get facts in hand before putting word processor in gear.
>Stan Friedman
We hope this helps you, and feel free to post this wherever you like.
Mr jolly
Of course theirs one piece of evidence about Lazar that I hear very little
about, but is utterly true.
his tax number/code (Whatever it's called in the USA), was one used by
intelligence etc (forgive my paraphrasing) and was top secret and the IRS
could give out no details on it.....
Of course if you've all hear to the contrary, then i nead to update my
facts.....
regards Jon
Jeremy Bee
In article <343ff...@news.power.net.uk>,
"Mr jolly" <j...@wibble.powernet.co.uk> wrote:
>Of course theirs one piece of evidence about Lazar that I hear very little
>about, but is utterly true.
>his tax number/code (Whatever it's called in the USA), was one used by
>intelligence etc (forgive my paraphrasing) and was top secret and the IRS
>could give out no details on it.....
Interesting. THis is one of the pieces that points more towards patsy than
outright charlatan.
Personaly, I think the guy was picked out on purpose (because he is a born
flake) and taken in to see some foam rubber spaceships and then "released" to
tell his story. Disinformation.
ON the other hand, the person Lazar chose to be the chief "spreader" of his
story, (Gene Huff) is more of a perfect patsy than Lazar himself. This is
exactly the kind of guy you want to tell a story like this to if you want it
to get out (gullible yet irracible and determined believer with delusions of
grandeur). That kind of makes me lean towards Lazar being the active member
that he says he was, but still a big time fibber.
>Of course if you've all hear to the contrary, then i nead to update my
>facts.....
>regards Jon
>
>
jeremy
Dave Bethke
Jeremy Bee wrote:
>
> "Mr jolly" <j...@wibble.powernet.co.uk> wrote:
> >Of course theirs one piece of evidence about Lazar that I hear very little
Utterly true seems a bit strong. The form, a W-2, is easily faked.
Blank forms are readily available.
> Interesting. THis is one of the pieces that points more towards patsy than
> outright charlatan.
[snip of interesting ideas]
Interesting to me, because the big, and almost only question I have
about the Lazar story is "why did he do it?". Unfortunately no one but
Robert Scott Lazar will ever know.
--
Dave Bethke - on the fringe of Houston
msmith07
Dave Bethke <beth...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in article
<3446A4...@ix.netcom.com>...
I've searched on the net, but I haven't seen the copy of the W-2.
Didn't a researcher find the Fed ID # on the W-2 come back as a Majic
number or some such thing?
Also, Mahood's Lazar timeline on Lazar alludes to Lazar being married to
two women at the same time, but he failed to post any supporting documents.
I have been snooping around trying to get any some info on Marsha Spader,
and so far I'm coming up empty.
I did happen across some news that one of the Sharon's daughters is
undergoing a heart operation for a hole in the heart. I and others at the
Inn, do wish her well and a very speedy recovery. Yeah, this is from a
Campbell basher!
Smitty
Paul Owen
msmith07 <msmi...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in article
<01bcdafa$fd43f620$5145d3c6@default>...
> Didn't a researcher find the Fed ID # on the W-2 come back as a Majic
> number or some such thing?
Surely a Majic ID only shows he was involved with USN Intelligence?
Dave Bethke
msmith07 wrote:
>
> I've searched on the net, but I haven't seen the copy of the W-2.
>
> number or some such thing?
No, there's no copies on the net. When Gene Huff was really pushing
this, it was suggested he post a copy, but he never did. Bob Oechsler
(http://www.ufomind.com/ufo/people/o/oechsler/) did some "research" on
the number, but he's hardly impartial.
> Also, Mahood's Lazar timeline on Lazar alludes to Lazar being married to
> two women at the same time, but he failed to post any supporting documents.
I re-read of the timeline,
(http://www.serve.com/mahood/lazar/timeline.htm) and it seems to give
the location of supporting documents, but not actual scanned copies.
Now though, you can get the marriage records from the Clark County on
the Web. (http://www.co.clark.nv.us/recorder/mar_srch.htm) Lazar and
Tracy Anne Murk were married on April 19, 1986. (cert.# B 617775) The
date of Carol Lazar's death is listed as April 21, 1986 on her death
certificate (# 001423-86 Clark County Health District). You have to go
there to see the certificate, and Tom Mahood did. It may have been only
for two days, but it looks like he was married to two women at once.
> I have been snooping around trying to get any some info on Marsha Spader,
> and so far I'm coming up empty.
I doubt if you will; I don't think there is a "Marsha Spader".
> I did happen across some news that one of the Sharon's daughters is
> undergoing a heart operation for a hole in the heart.
That's really sad news. I hope she's doing well. Which daughter is
it? I've only met "Lambchop", who I assume is the youngest.
msmith07
Dave Bethke <beth...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in article
> msmith07 wrote:
> >
> > I've searched on the net, but I haven't seen the copy of the W-2.
> >
> > Didn't a researcher find the Fed ID # on the W-2 come back as a Majic
> > number or some such thing?
>
> No, there's no copies on the net. When Gene Huff was really pushing
> this, it was suggested he post a copy, but he never did. Bob Oechsler
> (http://www.ufomind.com/ufo/people/o/oechsler/) did some "research" on
> the number, but he's hardly impartial.
>
> > Also, Mahood's Lazar timeline on Lazar alludes to Lazar being married
to
> > two women at the same time, but he failed to post any supporting
documents.
>
> I re-read of the timeline,
> (http://www.serve.com/mahood/lazar/timeline.htm) and it seems to give
> the location of supporting documents, but not actual scanned copies.
> Now though, you can get the marriage records from the Clark County on
> the Web. (http://www.co.clark.nv.us/recorder/mar_srch.htm) Lazar and
> Tracy Anne Murk were married on April 19, 1986. (cert.# B 617775) The
> date of Carol Lazar's death is listed as April 21, 1986 on her death
> certificate (# 001423-86 Clark County Health District). You have to go
> there to see the certificate, and Tom Mahood did. It may have been only
> for two days, but it looks like he was married to two women at once.
Dave,
Thanks for the above posting. You are always helpful.
Speaking of marriages, I hadn't seen any posting by Glenn on his getting
hitched.
Did they tie the knot at Rachel or "Sin City"? I never received a invite!
Darned Post office probably
lost my invitation. :-)
> > I have been snooping around trying to get any some info on Marsha
Spader,
> > and so far I'm coming up empty.
>
> I doubt if you will; I don't think there is a "Marsha Spader".
I talked to the one "M Spader" that is in Vegas on 10-18-97 and had a
little chat with her.
She said her name is Murna Spader . I told her I was trying to find a
Marsha Spader that
posted an article on the Internet. She said she didn't have a computer or
know of anyone with that name,
but she told me that she had a uncle that ran away at the age of 14 and no
one in the family
knows his whereabouts. Might be a long stretch...
> > I did happen across some news that one of the Sharon's daughters is
> > undergoing a heart operation for a hole in the heart.
>
> That's really sad news. I hope she's doing well. Which daughter is
> it? I've only met "Lambchop", who I assume is the youngest.
The 4 to 5 year old daughter. She's out of surgery and making progress
was the latest that I've heard. Youth is on her side. I and many others at
Rachel are wishing her the best!
Smitty
Dave Bethke
msmith07 wrote:
>
> Speaking of marriages, I hadn't seen any posting by Glenn on his getting
> hitched. Did they tie the knot at Rachel or "Sin City"? I never received
Just can't rely on snail mail! :-) Their marriage license was issued
in Clark county, according to the Clark county online service, but the
location of the wedding isn't given.
> I talked to the one "M Spader" that is in Vegas on 10-18-97 and had a
> little chat with her. She said her name is Murna Spader .
Good work. I wondered about that listing. I still think the name was
made up by the author(s), maybe with a little double meaning as are many
of the fake names that appear here. (Hular, Goober, Mawoody,
Woodley108, etc.) A spade is a type of shovel that digs up dirt;
Marsha Spader certainly tried to dig up dirt about Glenn Campbell. :-)
> The 4 to 5 year old daughter. She's out of surgery and making progress
> was the latest that I've heard. Youth is on her side. I and many others at
> Rachel are wishing her the best!
Glad to hear that. She would be the one I saw in Rachel. I wish her
continued progress.