Is "Rickson Gracie" a fraud???
Leo Bueno
On 16 May 1998 18:39:53 GMT, "Bill Holland" <hollandx @hotmail.com>
wrote:
>I'm beginning to believe the "Rickson Gracie" legend is pure hype.
Only "beginning"?
GAHTU
>I'm beginning to believe the "Rickson Gracie" legend is pure hype.
Well whaddya know? ANOTHER post about Rickson being hype.
Bill Holland, seriously, is there ANYTHING on earth that does not remind you
that you think Rickson is overrated?
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <01bd81b3$41a4f260$ee8cdccf@wjhpc>,
"Bill Holland" <hollandx @hotmail.com> wrote:
Not necessarily. Most succesfull BJJ fighters recognize him to be the best
or one of the best. That must mean something. Maybe he is to old now, or
maybe he does not want to risk loosing, or maybe its just for business
reasons, but that doesn’t mean he is not among the best. He was champion in
Brazil for years. I believe a lot of the current fighters are not so great
anyway. Coleman is an example. And another thing, maybe some of his
opponents in Japan aren’t so bad. Does anybody know any history about
fighters, which were in the Japan tournament. (I.e. Nishi). Has anybody
offered the amount of money he makes in Japan to fight any well known fighter?
>
> Apparently so!
>
> > I'm beginning to believe the "Rickson Gracie" legend is pure hype.
> >
> > Who has Rickson fought that hasn't been crushed by one of today's NHB
> > fighters?
> >
> > Since Rickson wont defend his reputation in the Octagon, his reputation
> has
> > rested on the shoulders of those he defeated (by default). Hugo Duarte
> was
> > supposed to be the giant pillar Rickson's reputation rested on, right?.
> So
> > much for that idea.
> >
> > I always hear people saying "Rickson is 400-0". If Hugo Duarte was the
> > toughest of those 400, and Hugo Duarte lost to Tank Abbot in 44 seconds,
> > that says alot about the other 399 opponents.
> >
> > Of Rickson's "400 wins" I can think of maybe 3-4. Hugo Duarte, Zulu,
> Dave
> > Levicki, and a Japanese WWF type guy - with only one being fought in the
> > last 3 years. Now it's known that each of these fighters was 2nd tier at
> > best. If Tank is 2nd tier, then they would be 3rd tier at best.
> >
> > I think I understand now why Royce and Rickson don't fight in the UFC,
> they
> > would probably lose.
> >
> > With no time-limits, maybe they would win. But then their opponent might
> > want true no-rules at all, and the Gracies might not have an advantage
> when
> > you include joint manipulation, gouges, biting, kicking while down, and
> > elbows to the head.
> >
> > Playing the "less rules" game would eventually work against a little guy
> > like Rickson.
> >
> > "No timelimits" with all the other rules would be handi-capping.
> >
> > It's rapidly approaching the time for Rickson to step up to plate and
> show
> > the world he is not a fraud, with Hugo down there is no one else to carry
> > his reputation for him.
> >
> > - Bill Holland
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
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Johnny Kincaide
Rickson is one of, if not the, best BJJ practitioners. This does mean
something- it means he's a master of BJJ. This doesn't necessarily make him a
great fighter capable of beating the best-of-the-best in competition.
> I believe a lot of the current fighters are not so great
> anyway. Coleman is an example.
Hugo also seems to be an example. Tank nearly killed him, and Tank is a
second-tier fighter. Is this really the best that Rickson has fought? (I would
love to see Tank v. Rickson).
> Has anybody offered the amount of money he makes in Japan to fight any well
> known fighter?
"Independence Day" grossed more than "Schindler's List," but what does this
mean?
If Rickson were to beat a top wrestler( Coleman is no longer in this group), I
would have no reservations about calling him one of the best. If he beats two,
then I'd say he's the best.
If Rickson could survive Tank, I'd say he's near the top.
--
"Most people see no reason to stop arguing just because an issue has been
decided."
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <355FE885...@hotmail.com>,
Johnny Kincaide <john...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Rickson is one of, if not the, best BJJ practitioners. This does mean
> something- it means he's a master of BJJ. This doesn't necessarily make him
a
> great fighter capable of beating the best-of-the-best in competition.
He fought NHB for 15 years undefeated in Brazil. I think its probable he is
among the best. Not aven Carlson or Carley gracie have anything to say
against his reputation. Even Royce who didnt have as much experience and is
skinier than Rickson, beat Ken Shamrock and then went to a Draw, thats all
a muscular Shamrock could do after practicing for his revenge for years. And
he is the teacher from the Lions Den. On the other hand, some people say
Rickson is in his 40's.
> Hugo also seems to be an example. Tank nearly killed him, and Tank is a
> second-tier fighter. Is this really the best that Rickson has fought? (I
would
> love to see Tank v. Rickson).
>
>
> "Independence Day" grossed more than "Schindler's List," but what does
this
> mean?
>
That makes no sense, Im not saying he is better because they pay him more. Im
saying he may have not fought because they have not offered him the same money
he makes in Japan to fight a well known fighter. By the way I hate that
stupid movie.
> If Rickson were to beat a top wrestler( Coleman is no longer in this
group), I
> would have no reservations about calling him one of the best. If he beats
two,
> then I'd say he's the best.
> If Rickson could survive Tank, I'd say he's near the top.
Of course he would survive Tank! Taktarov beat tank. Any good BJJ'r can beat
Tank. Even Renzo KO Taktarov. In IMO I would like him to fight someone from
the RAW team like Randy Couture. Even Bustamante went to a draw with Erickson
who is a monster. Or he could fight Frank Shamrock too. But not tank!
Johnny Kincaide
herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
> That makes no sense, Im not saying he is better because they pay him more. Im
> saying he may have not fought because they have not offered him the same money
> he makes in Japan to fight a well known fighter. By the way I hate that
> stupid movie.
My mistake, I misunderstood your point.
> Of course he would survive Tank! Taktarov beat tank. Any good BJJ'r can beat
> Tank. Even Renzo KO Taktarov. In IMO I would like him to fight someone from
> the RAW team like Randy Couture. Even Bustamante went to a draw with Erickson
> who is a monster. Or he could fight Frank Shamrock too. But not tank!
Oleg beat Tank because he was tough enough to stand up to Tank's punches.
Oleg v. Tank was a real war.
Renzo is probably a better grappler than Oleg, and Oleg played the grappling
game with him.
Rickson v. Couture would be a great fight. Couture showed some boxing skill
against Vitor, so it would be interesting to see what Rickson would do against
him.
Leo Bueno
On Mon, 18 May 1998 03:47:36 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>In article <01bd81b3$41a4f260$ee8cdccf@wjhpc>,
> "Bill Holland" <hollandx @hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Not necessarily. Most succesfull BJJ fighters recognize him to be the best
>or one of the best. That must mean something. Maybe he is to old now, or
>maybe he does not want to risk loosing, or maybe its just for business
>reasons, but that doesn’t mean he is not among the best. He was champion in
>Brazil for years.
Hey, being "Champion in Brazil" and 50 cents will probably buy you a
good cup of coffee.
I bet Hugo Duarte, Amauri Bittetti, Vitor Belfort, the guy who
Zinoviev took out, etc., were "Champions in Brazil" too. Being
"Champion in Brazil" does not seem to carry a whole lot of weight
around the UFC, where the quality level appears to be a notch higher
than what it is in Brazil.
So, unless Rickson beats somebody worth fighting, he is and will be a
tomato can crusher--albeit it the most hyped tomato can crusher ever.
I believe a lot of the current fighters are not so great
Leo Bueno
On Mon, 18 May 1998 04:39:20 GMT, Johnny Kincaide
<john...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Rickson is one of, if not the, best BJJ practitioners. This does mean
>something- it means he's a master of BJJ. This doesn't necessarily make him a
>great fighter capable of beating the best-of-the-best in competition.
>
Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
water; you'll break their heart.
GAHTU
>I bet Hugo Duarte, Amauri Bittetti, Vitor Belfort, the guy who
>Zinoviev took out, etc., were "Champions in Brazil" too. Being
>"Champion in Brazil" does not seem to carry a whole lot of weight
>around the UFC, where the quality level appears to be a notch higher
>than what it is in Brazil.
Really? I bet Steve Jennum, Pat Smith, Oleg Taktarov, Jerry Bohlander, etc.
were "Champions in the US" too. In fact, with the exception of Pat Smith, they
all ARE past UFC champions (very different from Duarte or Belfort) and they all
got spanked in Brazil. Your Brazilian counterpart probably says the quality of
competition in the UFC is about ten notches below that in Brazilian Vale Tudo.
Personally, I don't feel that way. I just think you're both stupid.
Johnny Kincaide
GAHTU wrote:
> Really? I bet Steve Jennum, Pat Smith, Oleg Taktarov, Jerry Bohlander, etc.
> were "Champions in the US" too. In fact, with the exception of Pat Smith, they
> all ARE past UFC champions (very different from Duarte or Belfort) and they all
> got spanked in Brazil.
Jennum was a fluke. Taktarov got beat by another UFC Champ.
Samoanpowr
<<I bet Hugo Duarte, Amauri Bittetti, Vitor Belfort, the guy who
Zinoviev took out, etc., were "Champions in Brazil" too. Being
"Champion in Brazil" does not seem to carry a whole lot of weight
around the UFC, where the quality level appears to be a notch higher than what
it is in Brazil.>>
Yeah, and I bet there are a bunch of Brazilians who are saying the same thing
about Americans that go over there and get waxed. Ruas beats Jennum and the
Brazilians say "What the hell? That guy won a UFC". Ruas pummels Oleg from
ringpost to rinpost "That guy is one of the UFC's best?". Brian Keck (Premiere
American Wrestler) goes over and gets choked out by a Luta Livre guy he
outweighs by 20 lbs. The UFC Middleweight Champion (Bohlander) goes over and
gets KNOCKED STIFF by Murilo Bustamante. Renzo sends Oleg into Matua land, and
the Brazilians are asking "That guy WON a UFC?". That is a double edged sword
that you are wielding.
Samoa.
herman...@hotmail.com
>
> Hey, being "Champion in Brazil" and 50 cents will probably buy you a
> good cup of coffee.
>
> I bet Hugo Duarte, Amauri Bittetti, Vitor Belfort, the guy who
> Zinoviev took out, etc., were "Champions in Brazil" too. Being
> "Champion in Brazil" does not seem to carry a whole lot of weight
> around the UFC, where the quality level appears to be a notch higher
> than what it is in Brazil.
>
> So, unless Rickson beats somebody worth fighting, he is and will be a
> tomato can crusher--albeit it the most hyped tomato can crusher ever.
>
First of all, he must have fought at least a few good oponents in 15 years of
NHB experience defending the name of the Gracies, non of the fighters you
mentioned have had that type of experience. Just because he is not in his
prime and fighting in the UFC for what they pay does not mean he was not a
good fighter. In general the gracies have a good fighting level so why
wouldnt rickson if they all recognize he is among the best. And BTW that
tomato can crusher phrase is really stupid. Like Ruas challenges Rickson
while he can barely handle Taktarov, yea right.
herman...@hotmail.com
>
> Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
> water; you'll break their heart.
>
>
UUhhh. Rickson is a tomato can crusher, is that all you have to say you
moron?
Leo Bueno
On Tue, 19 May 1998 06:44:03 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>
>>
>> Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
>> water; you'll break their heart.
>>
>>
>
>UUhhh. Rickson is a tomato can crusher, is that all you have to say you
>moron?
>
Yes, and let me repeat the theme slowly. Betcha you can't name 2 top
competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
Leo Bueno
On 19 May 1998 04:52:05 GMT, samoa...@aol.com (Samoanpowr) wrote:
> That is a double edged sword
>that you are wielding.
>
Point well taken. Let me clarify my point. There is no doubt that
Brazil has some terrific fighters. The problem is that in NHB, like
in professional boxing, every Harry, Dick, and Tom is a champion of
something. Being the "Champion" of anything in either Boxing or NHB
does not carry any weight. In fact, because of the politics of
Boxing, for example, sometimes the legitimate champions get stripped
of their titles and two palukas then duke it out for the title.
So, the point I was making is that being a "Brazilian Champion", like
being the "UFC Champion" does not necessarily amount to much, there
are as many B.S. champions in Brazil, it seems to me, as there are
B.S. champions in boxing.
Consider this. Marco Ruas is a terrific fighter from Riod de Janeiro.
Super-hyped Rickson Gracie is also from Rio de Janeiro. I bet that
both Ruas and Rickson claim that they are the champions of Brazil's
something or other. Now, they have never faced each other, as far as
I can tell, so how do you know who the worhty "Champion" is?
Leo Bueno
On Tue, 19 May 1998 06:27:17 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
> And BTW that
>tomato can crusher phrase is really stupid.
OK, what about "Tomato can smasher" or "Tomato can blaster" or "Tomato
can bomber"?
Leo Bueno
On Tue, 19 May 1998 06:27:17 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>First of all, he must have fought at least a few good oponents in 15 years of
>NHB experience defending the name of the Gracies, non of the fighters you
>mentioned have had that type of experience.
OK, then go ahead and list those worthy opponents. By the way, did
any of them go into the ring wearing just one boxing glove, like Art
Jimmerson, or were in their '50s, like Ron Van Cliff?
>Just because he is not in his
>prime and fighting in the UFC for what they pay does not mean he was not a
>good fighter.
Nobody questions that Rickson was or is a good fighter. It's just
that when he is sold as having a 400+ and 0 record and being the
greatest NHB fighter that ever walked the earth, one has to wonder
first, who the heck did he fight and second, under what rules and
circumstances.
>In general the gracies have a good fighting level so why
>wouldnt rickson if they all recognize he is among the best.
There is a big difference between fighting your family and friends in
the gym and fighting a stranger in a real match.
Samoanpowr
I understand your point now Leobueno, and I agree that the Brazilians hype
their guys up a little too much. I guess hype is a constant in our sport.
Samoa.
GAHTU
> Betcha you can't name 2 top
>competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
What do you mean by "top competitors"? Name the two "top competitors" Don
Frye, Mike Van Arsdale, Dan Henderson, Mark Kerr, Tom Erickson, Kevin Jackson,
Kenny Monday, or Ken Shamrock have beaten and then maybe we can talk.
I'm not saying these guys haven't beaten more than two "top competitors". Just
wondering what you think a top competitor is. Is Bobish a "top competitor"? Or
Big Daddy? Or Bitteti? Or Randleman? Or Branco Cikatik? Or Ed De Kuijf? Or
John Lober?
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <356193be...@news.accesspro.net>,
leob...@usa.netREMOVETEXTWHICHFOLLOWSnet (Leo Bueno) wrote:
>
> On Tue, 19 May 1998 06:44:03 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
> >> water; you'll break their heart.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >UUhhh. Rickson is a tomato can crusher, is that all you have to say you
> >moron?
> >
>
> competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
>
>
Most of the competitor he beat are too old now. And so much for calling the
valetudo japan tomato cans, can someone give detailed information about all
the fighters in these tournaments, what they did before and after the
tournaments, etc. Also, anybody know anything about Yoji Anjo?
shi...@hotmail.com
In article <199805191615...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
ga...@aol.com (GAHTU) wrote:
>
> > Betcha you can't name 2 top
> >competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
>
> Frye, Mike Van Arsdale, Dan Henderson, Mark Kerr, Tom Erickson, Kevin
Jackson,
> Kenny Monday, or Ken Shamrock have beaten and then maybe we can talk.
>
> I'm not saying these guys haven't beaten more than two "top competitors".
Just
> wondering what you think a top competitor is. Is Bobish a "top competitor"?
Or
> Big Daddy? Or Bitteti? Or Randleman? Or Branco Cikatik? Or Ed De Kuijf? Or
> John Lober?
>
howz about the whole Gracie family is a bunch of greedy media whores who made
their money and ran home before they got beat too badly..
GAHTU!!! Guzuntite!
Leo Bueno
On 19 May 1998 16:15:33 GMT, ga...@aol.com (GAHTU) wrote:
>> Betcha you can't name 2 top
>>competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
>
>What do you mean by "top competitors"? Name the two "top competitors" Don
>Frye, Mike Van Arsdale, Dan Henderson, Mark Kerr, Tom Erickson, Kevin Jackson,
>Kenny Monday, or Ken Shamrock have beaten and then maybe we can talk.
The difference is that these guys and their followers don't go around
claiming they nearly walk on water and these guys fight and try to get
fights with whomever is at the top of the game. Can you say the same
thing about The Great Tomato Can Crusher?
Leo Bueno
On Tue, 19 May 1998 20:18:20 GMT, shi...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>howz about the whole Gracie family is a bunch of greedy media whores who made
>their money and ran home before they got beat too badly..
>
Very succinct description of the situation.
Leo Bueno
On 19 May 1998 14:49:02 GMT, samoa...@aol.com (Samoanpowr) wrote:
>I understand your point now Leobueno, and I agree that the Brazilians hype
>their guys up a little too much. I guess hype is a constant in our sport.
Exactly. Rembember all the bullshit about Vitor Belfort? He
supposedly was even a great boxer. Well, Randy Couture, the
*wrestler*, outboxed the hell out of him.
As far as being the standard bearer for the *other* Gracie clan
(Carlson), maybe they should get somebody else. And, by the way, at
least the Carlson clan seems to get out there and fight, unlike the
side of the family which has Rickson.
Then there is Bittetti. Turned into Don Frye's punching bag.
Hugo Duarte was hyped up too. Bomb, bomb, bomb, Tank away.
Allan Goes comes in surrounded in the Brazilian aura and, although he
did a good job and I though he should have won, he only did an
adequate job against a guy with little NHB experience.
I think also from Brazil was Mario Sperry, who got hammered by
Zinoviev.
So, your comment on Brazilian fighters seems to me to be right on the
money.
herman...@hotmail.com
OK, then go ahead and list those worthy opponents. By the way, did
> any of them go into the ring wearing just one boxing glove, like Art
> Jimmerson, or were in their '50s, like Ron Van Cliff?
>
oponents if you know so much.
IronmanIII
> Also, anybody know anything about Yoji Anjo?
Well, I know he got spanked by Tank.
Samoanpowr
<<> Also, anybody know anything about Yoji Anjo?
Well, I know he got spanked by Tank.>>
He also got spanked by Rickson and Rickson made him submit, unlike Tank. That
means nothing I know, but I can see the comparisons already. The "this fighter
beat this guy; but this fighter beat that guy quicker" thing doesn't always
work. Jon Lober beat Frank Shamrock, Kevin Jackson beats Jon Lober, so K.J.
should be able to squash Frank; right? Wrong. Oleg beat Tank and Renzo beat
Oleg.....any commments on that one? Barretto beat Bobish, Bobish beat
Beneteau; Barretto should be able to crush Beneteau right? wrong. Tank beat
Duarte up quicker than Rickson did; so what? Renzo knocked Oleg out in under a
minute, are you going to assume that Renzo could knock Tank out? I don't think
so.
Samoa.
LandS...@webtv.net
Jumpinmf
>> shihan
isn't this the asshole who shot bobby kennedy?
James Welsh
Leo Bueno wrote:
Ya' gotta admit that GTCC has got everyone beat in one regard----money. He
snagged 1m$ for one fight.
--
peace
-s-
Dog-Boy
Nuthin' there Nuthin' there, he's goin' out the back door.
There's no power in those legs. J.B.
shi...@hotmail.com
In article <3561fe13...@news.accesspro.net>,
the truth is what the truth is, and i pity anyone who shits out a lifes saving
on one of their worthless seminars to learns a single technique from one of
their green belts....
GAHTU! Gazuntite!
Bob Savage
Leo Bueno wrote in message <356193be...@news.accesspro.net>...
>Yes, and let me repeat the theme slowly. Betcha you can't name 2 top
>competitors Rickson has defeated in a real professional match.
Leo, you better be careful. You're awful obsessed with Rickson, and may end
up riding his jock if you say his name too many times.
Bob
GAHTU
> Name the two "top competitors" Don
>>Frye, Mike Van Arsdale, Dan Henderson, Mark Kerr, Tom Erickson, Kevin
>Jackson,
>>Kenny Monday, or Ken Shamrock have beaten and then maybe we can talk.
>
>The difference is that these guys and their followers don't go around
>claiming they nearly walk on water and these guys fight and try to get
>fights with whomever is at the top of the game.
"These guys fight"? Who has Kenny Monday fought in the last couple years? How
about Ken Shamrock? Who has Erickson fought in the last year? And do you
really think Kerr considers Branco Cikatik one of the fighters "at the top of
the game"?
LandS...@webtv.net
xxyzz
LandS...@webtv.net wrote:
> Point is Rainbow boy Rickson could not submit him with punches either.
> You should really come to the Mainland and learn. But then again you
> would get your ass beat down because we don't like Islanders.
>
>
Do you like people from Long Island? What about Hawaii? When you say
"we don't like Islanders," what fringe racist group are you talking
about?
Rodney A. Williams
Damn time travellers......can't ever trust them.
IronmanIII wrote:
> Yeah Jumpie, that's the guy. They are one and the same. He also shot Abe
> Lincoln. And JFK.
Rodney A. Williams
Speak for yourself on who is not liked by mainlanders, sandshark.
herman...@hotmail.com
True. I would like detailed information about all of the Vale Tudo Japan
fighters. Im waiting for the EXPERT in Tomato Cans Mr. Leo Bueno to provide
this information.
Keegan
Leo Bueno wrote:
> On Mon, 18 May 1998 04:39:20 GMT, Johnny Kincaide
> <john...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Rickson is one of, if not the, best BJJ practitioners. This does mean
> >something- it means he's a master of BJJ. This doesn't necessarily make him a
> >great fighter capable of beating the best-of-the-best in competition.
> >
>
> Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
> water; you'll break their heart.
Dude, don't even bother. They're of the same mentality of the folk who think Bruce
Lee would destroy anyone and everyone if he were to fight in NHB.
- -Keegan
"NHB has passed Rickson by and left him clinging to his ego and his past
accomplishments."
- -Jeff Shanks
Samoanpowr
FinFace wrote:
<<Point is Rainbow boy Rickson could not submit him with punches either. You
should really come to the Mainland and learn. But then again you would get your
ass beat down because we don't like Islanders.>>
First of all igorant one; wrong island. Come to the table with some knowledge
or you'll end up on the endangered species list like your weak ass namesake.
Second; I live on the "mainland", and I RESPECT NO ONLINE CHALLENGES!! Anyone
can woof for their monitor.
Wanna try a debate again? Tank made Anjoh quit? No. Rickson made Anjoh quit?
Yes. Tank was stupid enough to break his hand against Anjoh? Yes. Rickson
injured himself while spanking Anjoh? No, and the spanking took less time.
Samoa.
MAB
No he's not! He's one of the best marble shooters in
North America, and he's got over 400 wins to prove it. Heck, you beat
five or six guys a day plinkin' marbles out on the playground sand
and it does become difficult to track them
down years later.
Mike
Ivan
herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> True. I would like detailed information about all of the Vale Tudo Japan
> fighters. Im waiting for the EXPERT in Tomato Cans Mr. Leo Bueno to provide
> this information.
Rickson's Vale Tudo opponents were not that good - nobody seriously
disputes this. The two guys that Rickson faced in the two tournament
finals were David Levicki (or maybe one of the kickboxers made it to the
finals?) and Yuki Naki. Naki weighed in at an imposing 140 lbs while
Levicki was a UFC castoff who had lost to Johnny Rhodes in the first
round of UFC II.
-Ivan
herman...@hotmail.com
True. Im still waiting for Leo Bueno, who seems to be an expert in Tomato
Can classifying, to give detailed information about at least all the Vale
Tudo Japan fighters. And then he can also share his great knowledge about
the Tomato Cans who fought 10 or more years ago.
LandS...@webtv.net
xxyzz
LandS...@webtv.net wrote:
> First off bright one their was on on line challange.
The irony is just too much.......
GAHTU
>> First off bright one their was on on line challange.
>
>The irony is just too much.......
lol
Alex Joneth
tmit...@mail.utexas.edu (Thomas Mitchell) wrote:
[ snip - Rickson trounced Yoji Anjo...]
> Yoji has since fought Tank
> to a draw in the UFC.
Tank beat Yoji Anjo by judges' decision.
Bob Savage
Maelstrom?
LandS...@webtv.net wrote in message
<6k28q1$29a$1...@newsd-151.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
First off bright one their was on on line challange. Second I could
shoot Anjoh in the head faster than Chickson could beat him. But that
really does not mean a thing.
Bob Savage
Thomas Mitchell wrote in message <6k2neb$i...@bgtnsc02.worldnet.att.net>...
>Rickson beat 220 lb Yoji Anjo in the summer of 1994 in a challenge match
after
>Yoji invaded his LA studio with some
> Japanese press . Rickson was [sick?] at home but came over after his
>brown belt instructor Mauricio called him.
> Aiming to beat him badly, Rickson traded a few low line kicks and then
>clinched and immediately mounted in one fluid
> motion. Anjo tried to fish hook Rickson's cheek, who responded with
a furry
>of punches which released the fish hook
> and broke Anjo's nose. Rolling over to avoid the furry of blows, Anjo
was
>choked unconscious before the reporters
> were let in. This was caputered on film by Mauricio and seen live by
10-15
>other students. Yoji has since fought Tank
> to a draw in the UFC.
This is basically identical to the account that I heard from another one of
Rickson's instructors, quite some time ago.
Bob
herman...@hotmail.com
> Dude, don't even bother. They're of the same mentality of the folk who
think Bruce
> Lee would destroy anyone and everyone if he were to fight in NHB.
Who has said Rickson can destroy anyone, I have not so who are you reffering
to?
GAHTU
>> He also got spanked by Rickson and Rickson made him submit, unlike Tank.
>That
>
These american fighters sure do have alot of excuses.
:)
Samoanpowr
<<Didn't Tank have a broken hand?>>
Yes, that was my point. Tank injured himself tryin to get Anjoh to submit, but
still couldn't do it. Rickson got the job done without hurting himself. Does
this mean that Rickson could beat Tank, no, and I'm not saying that, I was
simply pointing out the fact that Tank couldn't submit the tomato can Anjoh,
yet Rickson did. Fact. The rest is speculation.
Finboy wrote that he could shoot Anjoh in the head quicker....so what? We are
talkin NHB here, right? Tank needed the judges, Rickson didn't.
As far as his stupid little typo, he doesn't need my help lookin stupid, he
does an excellent job himself. A little Freudian slip by the Internet tough
guy I guess.
Samoa.
Thomas Mitchell
>Point is Rainbow boy Rickson could not submit him with punches either.
>You should really come to the Mainland and learn. But then again you
>would get your ass beat down because we don't like Islanders.
>
Here is a clip from my web page on the match:
Rickson beat 220 lb Yoji Anjo in the summer of 1994 in a challenge match after
Yoji invaded his LA studio with some
Japanese press . Rickson was [sick?] at home but came over after his
brown belt instructor Mauricio called him.
Aiming to beat him badly, Rickson traded a few low line kicks and then
clinched and immediately mounted in one fluid
motion. Anjo tried to fish hook Rickson's cheek, who responded with a furry
of punches which released the fish hook
and broke Anjo's nose. Rolling over to avoid the furry of blows, Anjo was
choked unconscious before the reporters
were let in. This was caputered on film by Mauricio and seen live by 10-15
other students. Yoji has since fought Tank
to a draw in the UFC.
Some things to note:
1) Rickson did use strikes and broke Anjoh's nose badly.
2) Anjoh used the dreaded "fish hook" with little success.
3) Anjoh didn't tap, he was choked unconscious. With Rickson you don't have
much time to tap :)
Just some info.
Thomas
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6k2sa8$9b7$3...@camel29.mindspring.com>,
jon...@ral.mindspring.com says...
>> to a draw in the UFC.
>
>
Thomas
GAHTU
>EVIL!!!!
>
>You are all EVIL I say!!!
>
>- Bill
Aw, c'mon Bill, I couldn't pass up the opportunity.
Leo Bueno
On Thu, 21 May 1998 00:40:25 -0700, Keegan <Kee...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
>Leo Bueno wrote:
>
>> Gee, don't tell that to the idiots who think Rickson nearly walks on
>> water; you'll break their heart.
>
>Dude, don't even bother. They're of the same mentality of the folk who think Bruce
>Lee would destroy anyone and everyone if he were to fight in NHB.
>
Good analogy.
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <3565604...@news.accesspro.net>,
Nobody has said Rickson can beat everybody you IDIOTS. Where is the good
analogy?.
You dont even know the fighters. And look what hapened to Yoji Anjo, he got
bloodied and chocked out easily while Tank who is much bigger and stronger
could not submit him. There you see the difference in quality Rickson is not
even 190 pounds.
Leo Bueno
On Sat, 23 May 1998 00:44:12 GMT, herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>You dont even know the fighters. And look what hapened to Yoji Anjo, he got
>bloodied and chocked out easily while Tank who is much bigger and stronger
>could not submit him. There you see the difference in quality Rickson is not
>even 190 pounds.
Then he will be right at home fighting in the UFC lightweight (199
limit) division. Do you think we'll see him there anytime soon?
Veritech
Bob Savage wrote:
>
> Maelstrom?
Bob, don't tell me it took you that long to figure it out. "there"
replaced with "their" Chickson, webtv... I think he faked his death only
to resurface under a new name ^_^
BTH
Ebola....The SOUL COLLECTOR
: herman...@hotmail.com wrote:
:
: In IMO I would like him to fight someone from
: the RAW team like Randy Couture.
I would love to see Rickson vs. Couture. I think Rickson would win, but
I'd love to see a fight like that anyways.
Bob Savage
Veritech wrote in message <3566D6...@deathsdoor.com>...
Well, I was thinking it from the first post, but he did change his style
just a little bit... I guess I'll have to take back what I usually say about
myself; which is: "I've been known to have a keen eye for the obvious!"
;-)
Bob
herman...@hotmail.com
If they werent so stingy maybe.
>>>>>>>>
> Then he will be right at home fighting in the UFC lightweight (199
> limit) division. Do you think we'll see him there anytime soon?
>
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
Andrew Jacobs
Rickson weighs 198 lbs.
Andrew Jacobs
I haven't seen the match yet but from what I've heard Bohlander
was doing very well against Bustamante until Bustamante was able to land
a KO that suprised even Bustamante himself.
Andrew Jacobs
If Ruas would be no problem for Rickson then why didn't Rickson
except Ruas's challenge at Pride-1?
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6kiqj6$mdb$1...@newsd-122.bryant.webtv.net>, thesh...@webtv.net
says...
>
> If Ruas would be no problem for Rickson then why didn't Rickson
>except Ruas's challenge at Pride-1?
Rickson's reply was "I accept". He said it was just up to the anouncers.
Thomas Mitchell
Andrew Jacobs
I have the tape of Pride-1. Rickson weasled his way out of the
challenge to fight Ruas by saying it was up to the promoters. Why
didn't he just say sure I'll fight him anywhere, anytime, and,
anyplace? The Pride promoters would have signed that match in a second
and it would have made HUGE money. Instead Rickson decided to go back
into hiding and he won't come out again until next October to face
Takada again. I don't see anything wrong with him giving Takada a
rematch but why can't he face somebody else in the meantime who is a
better quality opponent like Marco Ruas? Does he really need a year
with no matches to prepare for his rematch against Takada?
Jumpinmf
>> Rickson weasled his way out of the
challenge to fight Ruas by saying it was up to the promoters. Why
didn't he just say sure I'll fight him anywhere, anytime, and,
anyplace? The Pride promoters would have signed that match in a second
and it would have made HUGE money. Instead Rickson decided to go back
into hiding >>
thanks for sharing your speculation. it will be taken into consideration next
time somebody gives a shit what you think.
Andrew Jacobs
It's NOT speculation, I have the fucking tape. Rickson could
have fought Marco Ruas at Pride-2 but he backed out of it so Ruas had to
fight Gary Goodridge instead. Rickson has no matches until October of
this year and he is facing the same opponent that he defeated at that
same time last year. These are all FACTS, NOT "speculation."
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <6ki0j1$o4v$1...@newsd-124.bryant.webtv.net>,
thesh...@webtv.net (Andrew Jacobs) wrote:
>
> Rickson weighs 198 lbs.
>
Style: Gracie Jiu Jitsu
Age: 37
Ht: 5'9
Wt: 190
Record 9-0
Andrew Jacobs
Rickson was announced as weighing 198 lbs. at his most recent
match at Pride-1.
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <6klsev$qas$1...@newsd-122.bryant.webtv.net>,
thesh...@webtv.net (Andrew Jacobs) wrote:
>
> Rickson was announced as weighing 198 lbs. at his most recent
> match at Pride-1.
>
What I meant was his weight in 1994 when he fought Yoji Anjo not 1997, anyway
I may not remember well so ill leave it there. My point was comparing his
performance with Tanks.
Andrew Jacobs
Yoji Anjoh was a better fighter when he fought Tank than when
he fought Rickson. Rickson could probably still beat him but I bet that
Anjoh would do better the second time around.
Bob Savage
Like what? Rickson would only punch him in the face 15 times, and then
choke him unconscious?
Andrew Jacobs wrote in message <6kngj4$2hq$1...@newsd-121.bryant.webtv.net>...
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6kngj4$2hq$1...@newsd-121.bryant.webtv.net>, thesh...@webtv.net
says...
>
> Yoji Anjoh was a better fighter when he fought Tank than when
>Anjoh would do better the second time around.
You mean better like... uhh... get a hit in? :)
Thomas Mitchell
herman...@hotmail.com
In article <6kngj4$2hq$1...@newsd-121.bryant.webtv.net>,
thesh...@webtv.net (Andrew Jacobs) wrote:
>
> Yoji Anjoh was a better fighter when he fought Tank than when
> he fought Rickson. Rickson could probably still beat him but I bet that
> Anjoh would do better the second time around.
>
Maybe, I dont know. I do hope Rickson fights a well known current fighter,
although being 37 I think is a disandvantage and he may not want to risk
loosing before retirement.
Andrew Jacobs
Dan Severn is like 39 now and he has faced well known fighters
so that is no excuse for Rickson.
herman...@hotmail.com
Maybe its not, but it can be a factor, im just speculating.
Alex Apelbaum (AppleBomb)
Yeah, like Kevin Rosier.
Alex Apelbaum (AppleBomb)
Twice even.
Reminds me just a little of Rickson.
Andrew Jacobs
Yeah, and in addition to Severn facing Rosier he has also faced
tough opponents like Royce Gracie, Oleg Taktarov (twice), Dave
Benataue, Ken Shamrock (twice), Tank Abott, Mark Coleman, Jeremy
Horn, and, Kimo. Severn has definetely faced tougher competition than
Rickson has faced.
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6lglgg$724$1...@newsd-123.bryant.webtv.net>, thesh...@webtv.net
says...
Severn also has a few other things Rickson doesn't have:
1) Size
2) Several losses and several lame draws
Thomas Mitchell
Andrew Jacobs
Severn's official NHB record is 18-3-2. Rickson's official NHB
record is 9-0.
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6lianm$8l4$1...@newsd-124.bryant.webtv.net>, thesh...@webtv.net
says...
>
> Severn's official NHB record is 18-3-2. Rickson's official NHB
>record is 9-0.
So you are choosing not to include Rickson's fights against Lutra Livre guys on
fight night back in Brazil during the 80's? Those were professional matches,
and they were NHB, and Rickson was undefeated. They were not telivised, but
neither were all of Severn's. It all comes down to the fact that, yea, Severn has
fought more recently. Thats certainly undeniable. He has also lost & drawn
several times more recently, and often uses his size to substitute for some skill
on many oponents. It is lame IMO to try to deny Rickson has experience and
skill beyond the 9-0 record you say. Is it official b/c you read it on Fight World or
where ever? Let me just ask you this: Who has more NHB experience as a
whole, Rickson or Dan Severn? Pound for pound, who has more skill, Rickson
or Dan Severn? Who has accomplished more in their art (BJJ/Wrestling)?
Thomas Mitchell
http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/~thomas4/Rickson/rickson.htm
Andrew Jacobs
Look, I'm not saying that Rickson isn't good and nor am I
saying that Severn is necessarily better than Riskson. What I was
indicating is that Severn and Rickson are both around the same age
(Rickson I believe is a little bit younger) and that Severn has faced
top quality opponents in the last few years and that Rickson hasn't
faced any top quality opponents ever and that Rickson has done very
little in the last few years as compared to Severn. Severn has had a
total of 23 NHB matches in addition to doing a bunch of other stuff.
Severn has won 18 of those matches, lost 3 (to Royce Gracie, K.
Shamrock, and, Coleman), and had 2 draws (with Horn and Kimo/Severn
was clearly dominating Kimo towards the end of that match and would have
definetely won had there been a longer time limit or judges). As far as
Rickson's unofficial matches go, sure he has an impressive reputation
but who all did he beat to get that reputation? Rickson beat Hugo
Daurte in 2 different street fights but look at how Hugo got destroyed
by Tank Abott in UFC XVII and while Tank is a tough guy he is not
exactly in the first tier of fighters himself. Tank also beat Yoji
Anjoh, another one of Rickson's victims. Sure, Anjoh lost to Tank in
a 15 min. decsion and Rickson finished Anjoh off in like 2 1/2 min. in
his dojo but Anjoh was a more expierenced NHB fighter when he fought
Tank as compared to when he fought Rickson too. Then you've got
Rickson's victory over Zulu. Now I know that this match was quite a few
years ago but what evidence is there to suggest that Zulu was as good as
any top notch NHB figher on the seen today. NONE. I have the Shooto
tape where Zulu faces Enson Inoue and Inoue KO'd Zulu with ease in just
a matter of seconds. Besides, the match against Zulu is listed as a
part of Rickson's official record. My point is that Rickson has done a
whole hell of a lot compared to Severn.
Andrew Jacobs
I'm pretty sure that all of Severn's official NHB matches are
available on video. I do think that there needs to be some way of
coming up with official NHB records because there are so many guys that
go around with these trumped up records that they have no proof of. I'm
sure that there are a lot of guys that really have been in lots of NHB
matches (like Tank Abott for instance) but I think that there should be
some proof that these matches actually took place in order for them to
be official. I don't doubt that Rickson beat a lot of guys in matches
that aren't on tape back in the '80s but what I am questioning is the
quality of the opposition. It is still impressive but if you want to be
considered to be the best then you should have to beat the best.
Andrew Jacobs
Previous post should read "Rickson has not done a whole hell of
a lot compared to Severn." TYPO.......
Thomas Mitchell
In article <6ljvot$c0r$1...@newsd-121.bryant.webtv.net>, thesh...@webtv.net
says...
>
> Look, I'm not saying that Rickson isn't good and nor am I
>saying that Severn is necessarily better than Riskson. What I was
>indicating is that Severn and Rickson are both around the same age
>(Rickson I believe is a little bit younger) and that Severn has faced
>top quality opponents in the last few years and that Rickson hasn't
>faced any top quality opponents ever and that Rickson has done very
>little in the last few years as compared to Severn.
Rickson completely blows people away in BJJ, and has been training since
before he could walk with a mindset of fighting. I don't think being good at BJJ
alone makes you a good fighter, but training for so long and being so good at it
while at the same time haveing a mindset to prepare yourself to fight just makes
for an amazing fighter.
Severn has had a
>total of 23 NHB matches in addition to doing a bunch of other stuff.
>Severn has won 18 of those matches, lost 3 (to Royce Gracie, K.
>Shamrock, and, Coleman), and had 2 draws (with Horn and Kimo/Severn
>was clearly dominating Kimo towards the end of that match and would have
>definetely won had there been a longer time limit or judges).
He also got a lame decision over Shamrock. While Severn's record is good, he
likewise has not really faced any serious oposition (maybe Oleg) and pulled
through with a win.
As far as
>Rickson's unofficial matches go, sure he has an impressive reputation
>but who all did he beat to get that reputation?
They are not unofficial. They just don't happen to be known by the guy who put
up the 9-0 record. I can't find the fighters names either, but they certainly
happened, thats for sure.
Rickson beat Hugo
>Daurte in 2 different street fights but look at how Hugo got destroyed
>by Tank Abott in UFC XVII and while Tank is a tough guy he is not
>exactly in the first tier of fighters himself.
Tank has a bit of size over Rickson don't ya think? Did we really get to see
Hugo's skills?
Tank also beat Yoji
>Anjoh, another one of Rickson's victims. Sure, Anjoh lost to Tank in
>a 15 min. decsion and Rickson finished Anjoh off in like 2 1/2 min. in
>his dojo but Anjoh was a more expierenced NHB fighter when he fought
>Tank as compared to when he fought Rickson too.
Anjoh didn't even get a hit off on Rickson, and went so far as to try to fish hook
as a last resort. Rickson broke him and then put him to sleep. Tank on the other
hand had quite a bit of size on him as well as several months to prepare.
Then you've got
>Rickson's victory over Zulu. Now I know that this match was quite a few
>years ago but what evidence is there to suggest that Zulu was as good as
>any top notch NHB figher on the seen today. NONE. I have the Shooto
>tape where Zulu faces Enson Inoue and Inoue KO'd Zulu with ease in just
>a matter of seconds. Besides, the match against Zulu is listed as a
>part of Rickson's official record. My point is that Rickson has done a
>whole hell of a lot compared to Severn.
Who all is that good that Severn has beaten? I could watch a fight or two of
Oleg's and say "gee, this guy is a tomato can." Or I could watch some of his
other fights and go "wow, this guy is great." Same with Tank. I could watch him
vs. Belfort and Severn and say "damn, he sucks." Or I could watch him K0 a few
people and think he is unbeatable. Here are the reasons I think Severn has
accomplished less than Rickson:
1) He is bigger.
2) He has lost several times.
3) He has fought less in his career.
4) He didn't train wrestling when he was younger with a fighters mindset. (and
consequently still feels the urge to roll to his stomach, forgets to hit when he
can, etc)
5) He has no guard :-)
Thomas Mitchell
IronmanIII
> Who has accomplished more in their art (BJJ/Wrestling)?
It is much tougher to suceed in wrestling than BJJ. I'm not saying wrestling
is better, but there are wrestlers competing all around the world. BJJ is only
in Brazil. What I'm trying to say is far more people have studied wrestling
than BJJ, therefor it is tougher to suceed.
Look at it like this. If me and 10 of my buddies were to start our own sport
and I was known as the best, does that make my accomplishments greater than
Severn's? Well, I am the best. Severn is not the best wrestler. But that
does not mean I've accomplished more.
IronmanIII
>Tank has a bit of size over Rickson don't ya think? Did we really get to see
>
>Hugo's skills?
Well, if Hugo had any skills worth noting, he wouldn't have been beat by Abbott
like that.
>Here are the reasons I think Severn has
>accomplished less than Rickson:
>
>1) He is bigger.
>2) He has lost several times.
>3) He has fought less in his career.
1) What does Severn's size have to do with anything? Has Sugar Ray Robinson
accomplished more than Mohhamed Ali? Using your logic, he has because he's
smaller.
2) That's because Severn has faced much tougher opponents than Rickson has.
3) You don't know this for sure.
Thomas Mitchell
In article <199806100348...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
ironm...@aol.com says...
>
>>Tank has a bit of size over Rickson don't ya think? Did we really get to see
>>
>>Hugo's skills?
>
>Well, if Hugo had any skills worth noting, he wouldn't have been beat by Abbott
>like that.
>
>>Here are the reasons I think Severn has
>>accomplished less than Rickson:
>>
>>1) He is bigger.
>>2) He has lost several times.
>>3) He has fought less in his career.
>
>1) What does Severn's size have to do with anything? Has Sugar Ray
Robinson
>accomplished more than Mohhamed Ali? Using your logic, he has because
he's
>smaller.
>
No, you weren't using my logic. Severn and Rickson has both fought in the
same weight class (aka: none). Sugar Ray Robinson and Mohhamed Ali
did not. Severn weights ~60 lbs more than Rickson. Since they both fight in an
open weight class that is an advantage and can make up for Severn's lesser
skills.
>2) That's because Severn has faced much tougher opponents than Rickson
has.
Lets see... Severn lost to Royce, Shammy, and Coleman. Rickson can clearly
beat Royce, and I personally believe he would have little problem with a guy like
Shammy playing his mat game. Coleman would be interesting, but I have a
feeling Rickson would take it a little longer than Severn did IF he were to loose.
Kimo took Severn to a draw. Oleg almost got him in a leg lock at the very
beginning of the match. Shamrock mounted him in his lame decision victory.
See one thing Rickson usually does is fight people around 30 lbs heavier than
him. I imagine Severn does the opposite.
>
>3) You don't know this for sure.
>
So you think Severn, who has been fighting since 1994-1995 has been fighting
more than Rickson, who has had *documented* challenge matches back to age
13 (against an adult Brazilian soldier)? Ok...
Thomas Mitchell
Thomas Mitchell
In article <199806100341...@ladder03.news.aol.com>,
ironm...@aol.com says...
>
>> Who has accomplished more in their art (BJJ/Wrestling)?
>
>It is much tougher to suceed in wrestling than BJJ. I'm not saying wrestling
>is better, but there are wrestlers competing all around the world. BJJ is only
>in Brazil. What I'm trying to say is far more people have studied wrestling
>than BJJ, therefor it is tougher to suceed.
>
the US). But I think judo is a HUGE sport and Rickson has done well in that as
well. The judo --> BJJ transition is not a hard one. BJJ is not really that new by
any means, and its techniques are far from exclusive to Brazil.
>Look at it like this. If me and 10 of my buddies were to start our own sport
>and I was known as the best, does that make my accomplishments greater
than
>Severn's? Well, I am the best. Severn is not the best wrestler. But that
>does not mean I've accomplished more.
Totally invalid. BJJ is not as distinct as you appear to want to make it. It
wasn't a new sport introduced by Rickson and 10 of his weak friends. You act
like they would be ripe for the pickings if some sambo or judo guy went in to
show them "whats up." That hasn't happened. Further, Rickson not only
dominated his weight class, but likewise reigned as absolute weight class
champion for over 10 years and stayed *undefeated.* He further went and won
gold in the Pan Am games in free style wrestling and has won his share of
sambo tournaments (under THEIR rules). Poor analogy.
Thomas
IronmanIII
>Lets see... Severn lost to Royce, Shammy, and Coleman. Rickson can clearly
>beat Royce, and I personally believe he would have little problem with a guy
>like
>Shammy playing his mat game.
The fact is that Severn has faced tougher opponents than Rickson. It really
doesn't matter what you personally believe, the fact is Rickson hasn't fought
these people, so we'll never know how well he'd do.
>No, you weren't using my logic. Severn and Rickson has both fought in the
>same weight class (aka: none). Sugar Ray Robinson and Mohhamed Ali
>did not. Severn weights ~60 lbs more than Rickson. Since they both fight in
>an
>open weight class that is an advantage and can make up for Severn's lesser
>skills.
Well, I can just as easily say Severn has accomplished more because he hasn't
trained for NHB fighting as long as Rickson. But both arguments are flawed.
It's not Severn fault he's bigger than Rickson, as it is not Rickson's fault he
has more training experiance than Severn.
>So you think Severn, who has been fighting since 1994-1995 has been fighting
>more than Rickson, who has had *documented* challenge matches back to age
>13 (against an adult Brazilian soldier)? Ok...
Documented? Tell me how you know these fights actually happened? Have you
seen the tapes of these matches, or did you just hear about them?
IronmanIII
>>Well, if Hugo had any skills worth noting, he wouldn't have been beat by
>Abbott
>>like that.
>>
>Spoken like a true non competitor. Everybody has an off day.
Ok, when has Duarte had an ON day against a good opponent?
IronmanIII
>Totally invalid. BJJ is not as distinct as you appear to want to make it.
>It
>wasn't a new sport introduced by Rickson and 10 of his weak friends.
I know BJJ is bigger than the example I made, but it still gets the point
across.
Andrew Jacobs
I don't think that the point is how big Severn is compared to
Rickson. First off, Rickson is 5'9" and 198 lbs. Not a huge man but
he's not tiny either. The point is that Severn has faced tougher
opponents than Rickson has regaurdless of weight class. There are
plenty of guys out there that Rickson could be facing that are around
his weight that are quality opponents. Nobody claims that Severn is the
greatest NHB competitor in the world like the claim for Rickson is. At
least Severn has tested himself against quality opposition. The same
thing can't be said about Rickson.