[OT] US World Trade Center on Fire
Rose
your TVs on. Two planes have crashed into the World Trade Center.
Pentagon is calling it a possible terrorist attack.
Rose
Violet
"Rose" <ro...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E119B...@my-deja.com...
Yes, I've been glued to the TV since it happened and it's just getting worse
as I'm sure everyone knows by now.... I always thought living in this
country meant being safe...... That was then, and this is now..... all those
innocent people killed by monstors that have no regard for human life,
including their own.
.... Vi (tearing up)
Silenus
I cannot believe what I am seeing. One of the towers has just collapsed.
Terrible, terrible. What can I say. I am in tears.
--
Silenus
Silenus
God no.
--
Silenus
Cleanthes
About 50,000 people work there.
All air travel is shut down in the US. International flights are diverted to
Canada.
Several explosions at the Pentagon, and maybe the Supreme Court in
Washington.
Anne
--
Anne
I can resist anything but temptation.
Mark A
>
> all those innocent people killed by monsters that have no regard for
> human life, including their own.
> .... Vi (tearing up)
I can't begin to describe how sick to my stomach I feel over this. :(
Jesus, we're quite possibly looking at the start of World War III here.
I'm not sure it can get any worse, there must be hundreds of thousands
dead, and I can't imagine the President taking it lightly.
And now the Pentagon's been hit too. Christ in a bucket, I'm going home.
Regards
Mark
Rose
The whole thing reminds me of Pearl Harbor.
I hope, nay, I pray to God that you're wrong, Mark. I live not too far
from Chicago and I'm sitting on top of a gas dump and a nuclear lab on
campus as well.
Rose
Rose
Thanks, Anne. I hate to say it, but you'd best look to your own
country. We don't know where these came from. We don't know if just
America is the target or not. Be careful. I say that to everyone. Be
careful.
Rose (who wants all of her ATX friends to remain safe)
Marcus Seeck
I cannot believe how anyone can do something like that, much less
devote time and energy to plan it. (and of course, the bastard who did
plan it is still alive somewhere).
If Bush is going to hunt him down and nuke him, he'll have my
blessing. Love is the way, and peace is the way, but in the faced of
this madness, extreme measures seem quite appropriate.
Marcus.
Member: FOBT, GGGHD, PIST
--
People are people everywhere you go, even if the people concerned
aren't the people the people who made up that phrase have
traditionally thought of as people.
Terry Pratchett, 'The Fifth Elephant'
RockScorpion
First of all, my sincere and heartfelt condolences to all affected, directly
and otherwise.
The shock has been felt as far as this little Rock on the Med. There are
people coming out of their flats on my block, first in shock to alert their
neighbours of what is happening across the Atlantic, now in anger at the
thought of all the innocents lost today. Materials losses can always be
replaced, you can rebuild, but the loss of a single life is irreplaceable
It is a small consolation, but the thought that the "thing's" (I refuse to
refer to them as human beings), who believed that this "guaranteed" them a
place in heaven as "martyrs" to their faith, are in for a shock.
This isn't an attack by another country, it is an attack by fanatics. Which
makes it all the more difficult to strike back.
What is required is for all free and democratic countries of the world to
unite with the US in the hunt for those behind this attack. They must not be
allowed to get away with this atrocity. Bring them in alive, let them face
trial before an international court. Let them know that they will not, ever,
succeed in intimidating the free peoples of the world.
This is an act of war against all the civilised nations of the world. The
world will strike back.
Be strong, you will rise above this.
Joe
--
Even the lion must put up with flies.
---Anonymous
Hanan
"Marcus Seeck" <mse...@t-online.de> wrote in message
news:9nldug$obm$05$1...@news.t-online.com...
> Where is Xena when you need her?
>
> I cannot believe how anyone can do something like that, much less
> devote time and energy to plan it. (and of course, the bastard who did
> plan it is still alive somewhere).
>
> If Bush is going to hunt him down and nuke him, he'll have my
> blessing. Love is the way, and peace is the way, but in the faced of
> this madness, extreme measures seem quite appropriate.
>
> Marcus.
>
In the meantime, South Texas Blood Center has issued an urgent call for
blood donations. If the casualties are anywhere near what they estimate,
there's a good chance the current NATIONAL blood supply will not be enough.
I'm headed out that way now. It's about the only useful thing I can do.
--Hanan
Rose
They just announced that over 10,000 are dead. I pray that what you
have written comes to pass.
Rose (sitting at work crying)
Bohemia
Please check in here when you can (if you haven't already).
Bo
kuei...@-remove-hotmail.com
Fortunately, although I don't work near the WTC (I have a friend who
does and who I have not been able to reach) this morning I slept
through the alarm and by the time I got up, it had already happened.
The people in my office are effectively stuck there, with all the
subways out. So oversleeping was a good thing.
I know this is a time for gut reactions, but perhaps I am too much of
a scholar. The world is full of dead innocent people and we have just
been very lucky of late. We have, perhaps, cherished the illusion
that overseas quarrels (or domestic problems, the source of the terror
is not known) can be dealt with at our leisure and with little cost to
ourselves. That is not always the case. For American and its
citizens and allies to lash out with nationalist, ethnic, religious
hate is perhaps understandable, but it also plays into the hands of
the terrorists, for whom overhasty and blind retaliation is like meat
and drink.
Find out who is responsible and deal with them, yes. But the seeds of
hope lie in the individual human heart and the seeds of hate and
violence also reside there. Unless we (and by this I mean the world)
try to resolve the causes and roots of conflict (which is also
difficult, because in many cases you have not a case of right and
wrong but of two rights or two wronged parties) we are simply praying
that the violence, which will be inevitable fruit of those conflicts,
will merely strike our neighbor rather than ourself.
Against the irrational we have little defense. Against the true
believer, whatever his or her national origin we not only have out
weapons of war and state organs, but our intelligence and our
humanity. The world is too connected now (assuming this was a foreign
attack) for anyone to assume that the problems in Belfast, or
Sarajevo, or Gaza, or anywhere need not concern us. For whom does the
bell toll indeed.
It is up to us what lesson we draw from this. Good luck to all of us.
LaoWombat
who now looks up when he hears a plane passing overhead.
--
[remove -remove- to reply]
"It was not always like this, of course. On occasion it's been worse."
-- John Gardner, "Grendel"
Hobbit
up in this cowardly attack. God bless you all. Stay strong.
Violet
should have left an hour earlier but couldn't leave my TV..... the horror of
it almost seemed unreal.... this couldn't possibly be happening in our
country.... but in retrospect, it has before, ... not to this extent, thank
God, but bad enough. We found the ones responsible and yet they are still
breathing and being fed three square meals in American prisons, probably
better than they were in their old country. A message *should have been
delivered then ,but as Americans, we showed compassion.... Well, enough of
the misplaced compassion.... IMO it's time to come to terms and accept that
we can't be loved by everyone and USA is not a country to mess around
with.... Harry Truman knew how to handle a similar situation.. It took a
lot of courage for him to give the orders to bomb but as a result, untold
millions of lives were saved..... I'm no great historian but this is just
too much to stomach.... In the Boston area, we are just hearing some of the
names of the people on those planes that were hijacked from Boston/Logan
Airport, and it gets very personal.. Again, as I said, innocent people,
gone and for no good reason...
..
..... I feel like crying and feel sick to my stomach and also am so angry
that these sick, depraved, monsters who thought this was their ticket to
Heaven ,were able to get away with this well thought out plan. I don't
think we've heard the end of this episode. I hope I'm wrong..... Here's
where we find out if we really are the great country that we have been led
to believe we are......Come on Mr. President, let's take action. How many
more people have to die?
..... Vi (still crying)
"Rose" <ro...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E119B...@my-deja.com...
Misty
Misty.
(safely in Holland????)
"Rose" <ro...@my-deja.com> schreef in bericht
news:3B9E119B...@my-deja.com...
Violet
"Misty" <mist...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:VHun7.197$io....@pollux.casema.net...
> My thoughts go out to all the people in the US.
> Misty.
> (safely in Holland????)
>
Until this terrorism is stopped cold by all peace loving countries.... no
one is completely safe....
.... but thank you for your thoughts, they are appreciated.
...... Vi
Razerkiss
You can see the cloud of smoke and debris all the way from here, Ocean County,
NJ.
I was going to go to Xena Night at Meow Mix tonight, too, so now I'm wondering
how everyone who I would've been hanging out with tonight is doing...
Ginger
Razerkiss
Ginger
Misty
All of the Dutch and foreign tv stations in Holland are showing the horrible
views of the crashes,fires and wounded and scared people.
I was actually in shock when I heard the radio at work at 3 in the afternoon
(Dutch time). We are in between two possible target countries, namely the UK
and Germany. We have stuff to think about.
Misty.
Wgregcox
Village, several blocks north of the carnage, and things are surprisingly
quiet. There's no traffic on the streets, only emergency vehicles, but plenty
of unusually subdued and quiet pedestrians milling about on the sidewalks.
It's very strange to look south on Sixth Avenue and not see the twin towers,
only plumes of brownish smoke.
So far, most of my friends and relatives and relatives in the area have checked
in, thank goodness, although I shudder to think what the final body count will
be.....
Greg Cox
Now on sale:
ROSWELL: LOOSE ENDS
STAR TREK: THE EUGENICS WARS
Misty
Misty.
"Wgregcox" <wgre...@aol.com> schreef in bericht
news:20010911181707...@mb-ck.aol.com...
Atenea
hit, I just can't believe that such evil exists in this crazy old world of
ours.
I was watching the BBC news and thinking that it looked more like out of a
disaster movie than of reality, such is the scale of the masacre.
I was in New York in February 2000 for the Xena Con and of course I visited
the World Trade Center, like tourists do. I can't believe it's gone. I hope
all our newyorker xenite friends are safe and well.
I cry in my heart for all the people who died, got injured or lost somebody
today as a result of this barbaric terrorist attack. I hope that if there's
a God he'll be praying for us all.
--
Love,
Sammy
(alias Atenea la fantástica)
GGGHD
http://siemprexena.net
"Rose" <ro...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E119B...@my-deja.com...
Karen
Space Center here in FL. where me daddy works) and the people responsible as
sick, crazy bastards. I had started crying right in the middle of a news
cast thing. My heart goes out to all those who have been affected by this
tragedy.
Alwayz.
Ren~
pointnj022
perished today? How can you be so shallow and wrapped up in a television
show... get a life and get a clue, there are real people who need real help....
WAKE UP!
Concerned American
Molly
> I've been following the news all afternoon at work since the first tower got
> hit, I just can't believe that such evil exists in this crazy old world of
> ours.
> I was watching the BBC news and thinking that it looked more like out of a
> disaster movie than of reality, such is the scale of the masacre.
> I was in New York in February 2000 for the Xena Con and of course I visited
> the World Trade Center, like tourists do. I can't believe it's gone. I hope
> all our newyorker xenite friends are safe and well.
> I cry in my heart for all the people who died, got injured or lost somebody
> today as a result of this barbaric terrorist attack. I hope that if there's
> a God he'll be praying for us all.
>
>
> --
> Love,
> Sammy
> (alias Atenea la fantástica)
> GGGHD
> http://siemprexena.net
I pray that people can keep their sanity and that there will not be
random attacks against Arabs all over the country. We need sanity to
counteract this insanity; we need love to counteract this hate. We
need courage in the face of this terror.
Molly
Razerkiss
something, but, like I said, I could see the cloud that hovered over the north.
It didn't seem like it was too far away, and I heard that it's actually pretty
dark just a few towns up. I was going outside and looking at it to remind
myself that this is no dream...
I can't believe it.
Greg, I'm glad you and your loved ones are safe. My heart goes out to all who
have lost people they care for in this tragedy.
Ginger
Rose
I know Marcus well enough to know that he is a concerned person. He
meant nothing bad by it. If anything, it was wishful thinking as we all
might wish for a Superman or a Batman or a Xena to deal with problems
that we really don't want to. It's human nature not to want to deal
with something of this magnitude.
Rose (who is also a Concerned American while Marcus is from Europe)
Rose
I'll probably be doing a bit of that also. :-)
Are we missing anyone else?
Rose
Rose
>
> My thoughts go out to all the people in the US.
> Misty.
> (safely in Holland????)
Sad to say, I don't think there is such a place as a *safe* place in any
country. It's just that the odds of something happening are less in
some places than others. I'd still keep my eyes open, Misty.
And thank you for your kind words.
Rose
Rose
>
> As I'm writing this, it's a little after six p.m. here in NYC. I'm in the W.
> Village, several blocks north of the carnage, and things are surprisingly
> quiet. There's no traffic on the streets, only emergency vehicles, but plenty
> of unusually subdued and quiet pedestrians milling about on the sidewalks.
> It's very strange to look south on Sixth Avenue and not see the twin towers,
> only plumes of brownish smoke.
>
> So far, most of my friends and relatives and relatives in the area have checked
> in, thank goodness, although I shudder to think what the final body count will
> be.....
>
you're saying. Please continue to keep us informed as best you can.
Rose
Rose
>
> "Atenea" <ate...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message news:<Ojwn7.14212$iD.23...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com>...
> > I've been following the news all afternoon at work since the first tower got
> > hit, I just can't believe that such evil exists in this crazy old world of
> > ours.
> > I was watching the BBC news and thinking that it looked more like out of a
> > disaster movie than of reality, such is the scale of the masacre.
> > I was in New York in February 2000 for the Xena Con and of course I visited
> > the World Trade Center, like tourists do. I can't believe it's gone. I hope
> > all our newyorker xenite friends are safe and well.
> > I cry in my heart for all the people who died, got injured or lost somebody
> > today as a result of this barbaric terrorist attack. I hope that if there's
> > a God he'll be praying for us all.
Right now, if there is a God, I'd be asking him why he let this happen.
> I pray that people can keep their sanity and that there will not be
> random attacks against Arabs all over the country. We need sanity to
> counteract this insanity; we need love to counteract this hate. We
> need courage in the face of this terror.
>
True words, Molly. There are quite a few very good Middle Easterners
here at the university. I, too, pray that people keep thier heads
together and do not take this out on just anybody.
Rose
Rose
Let us know. I'll be praying for them.
Rose
Violet
> who now looks up when he hears a plane passing overhead.
..... I know exactly what you are saying.... yesterday, (I live only around
sixteen miles from Boston) I was driving to a friends around mid morning,
this is *after it was reported that *all planes were ordered out of the sky.
I became painfully aware of a commercial plane in the beautiful blue sky and
was immediately filled with anxiety. I would never have believed that I
could feel that emotion just looking up at one of our own planes. My
feeling of safety is no longer viable given the horror of yesterday that
continues today and will for a very long time. I am still weeping for all
the lost, innocent souls and those injured beyond repair, all thanks to
maniacs with no regard for human life, including their own.
...... violet
Rose
Agreed.
I also just had a conversation with my sister and she pointed out that
most life insurance policies do not pay when something like terrorism is
involved. Also, many medical plans also do not cover this kind of
thing. Many people are going to be bankrupt from this.
Rose
Marcus Seeck
you are a very funny person, huh?
Ah hell, why am I even talking to you. My real message was beneath the
post opener, but I expect you didn't even read it.
If life were a tv show, then we could call on Xena to find the bad guy
and deal justice on him. Unfortunately, in real life superheroes are
not available, and I fear that the people behind this act against
humanity will go unpunished.
All this was condensed in my message opener, but I suppose it was lost
on you.
Marcus.
Member: FOBT, GGGHD, PIST
--
People are people everywhere you go, even if the people concerned
aren't the people the people who made up that phrase have
traditionally thought of as people.
Terry Pratchett, 'The Fifth Elephant'
Hanan
> Molly wrote:
> > I pray that people can keep their sanity and that there will not be
> > random attacks against Arabs all over the country. We need sanity to
> > counteract this insanity; we need love to counteract this hate. We
> > need courage in the face of this terror.
> >
> True words, Molly. There are quite a few very good Middle Easterners
> here at the university. I, too, pray that people keep thier heads
> together and do not take this out on just anybody.
>
> Rose
Agreed.
As it happened, I was actually in Arabic class (physically sitting in, not
just enrolled in) when word of Oklahoma City came in. My instructor, an
Egyptian by birth, was close to tears. There was a pall over the entire
department, which was mainly staffed by native Arabs.
As I recall, everyone assumed that it just HAD to be the work of Arab
terrorists. An understandable assumption, to be sure, but in the end an
incorrect one.
Even if the WTC does turn out to be the work of a few radical Muslim Arabs,
it would be as ridiculous to hold all the Muslims or Arabs of the world
responsible as it would be to hold all white people or Christians of the
world responsible for producing Timothy McVeigh.
--Hanan
Rose
I see they've issued warrants for the arrests of several people. Also,
the White House and AF-1 were part of the targets, not the Pentagon.
Rose
Nuncio
Firstly and importantly, so many people dead.
And, in particularly gruesome ways which don't bear
thinking about.
So professionally executed: what kind of organisation
and money must be behind it?
But also, this changes everything.
It feel as if our tools are turned against us.
Planes are a necessary part of life, and now they feel like
a threat.
Bush's grand plan to build a missile shield is shown up
for what it is: a failure to understand what a foreign policy is.
And, just maybe, one is forced to contemplate the kind of
frustration which allows this kind of terrorism to arise.
The world is changed forever.
We teeter on the brink...
Violet
"Nuncio" <metric...@tesco.net> wrote in message
news:3b9fbbdb...@news.freeuk.net...
> Tragic and frightening on so many levels.
>
> Firstly and importantly, so many people dead.
> And, in particularly gruesome ways which don't bear
> thinking about.
>
>
> But also, this changes everything.
>
> It feel as if our tools are turned against us.
> Planes are a necessary part of life, and now they feel like
> a threat.
>
> Bush's grand plan to build a missile shield is shown up
> for what it is: a failure to understand what a foreign policy is.
>
> And, just maybe, one is forced to contemplate the kind of
> frustration which allows this kind of terrorism to arise.
>
> The world is changed forever.
> We teeter on the brink...
I am sure you don't intend it to be, but this must be great reading for the
parties that are behind this or the ones that think yesterday was a day well
deserved by USA.
... Vi
Aethelrede
Then what in the world do you think the non-stop TV coverage from the
USA since yesterday morning has been? It tells them they won.
They closed down the white house, the pentagon and the capitol, made the
senate, congress and the president run for cover and closed down just about
every US government office, plus many state capitols and offices and many
large corporate offices too. And in New York they caused the worst man-made
damage to a city in the continental USA since the British army burned
Washington, shut the stock exchange, which has disrupted businesses around
the world, and grounded all commercial flight indefinitely.
And the reaction to this from politicians and officials is just what
they want too: more regulation, more security checks, more restriction on
personal liberty: a total disruption of American life. Most of these people
used much stronger and far less positive language than Nuncio used in his
post, making things look far worse for the country and much more encouraging
for terrorists the world over.
The idea that the US President has declared war against a few hundred,
maybe a couple of thousand people must be making them feel that each of
them is the equivalent of hundreds of thousands of Americans, and thousands
of US military people. Talk about an ego booster: it took thousands of
trained Japanese sailors and airmen, hundreds of planes and a carrier task
force backed by the resources of an entire nation to inflict damage on a few
useless battleships: yesterday, two dozen men damaged the entire country
and changed it forever
It has proved to them how few of their people need die to cause an
enormous disruption of US society. When people are so filled with hate
and frustration that they will undertake suicide missions for their cause,
proving to them that a mere twenty or so can inflict such a shock to the
"only super-power in the world" is hardly going to make them stop planning
the next mission.
If the script for what we have heard on TV and radio since yesterday
morning had been written by anti-US terrorists, it would have been exactly
what we heard.
Nuncio
Those who were behind this do not view the world the same way that the U.S.
or "the West" do. This was a seriously horrible act, and I do not believe that
anyone from anywhere does something like this simply because they are somehow
intrinsically evil. It is a symptom of people who are very seriously unbalanced
in their view of what western civilisation represents. How did they get like this?
What is necessary to stop more people developing those views too?
Does that make sense to you?
We teeter on the brink because all humans exist on just the single world.
If any humans get to the point where killing many thousands of ordinary people
going about their lives seems a valid behaviour, something has gone seriously
wrong -- for everyone in every country.
A great injustice has been done. But jingoism is very dangerous.
Nunc
Violet
"Aethelrede" <æthel...@worldnot.att.net> wrote in message
news:ImRn7.17476$Uf1.1...@bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
My only, and I do mean *only*, point was that I think at this time, we
should be standing behind our government, and not throwing stones and second
guessing what is right ...... that's just giving more amunition to our
enemies. As for the commentators doing just that, I don't think they are
doing that IMO, They have been describing the carnage and let's face it....
it was carnage and still is. I don't remember hearing them knock our
President or our government . and of course, there will have to be stronger
security at strategic areas. If nothing else, that lesson has been learned,
unfortunately too late for the thousands who have lost their lives thanks to
(as you put it) just a *few* people. I happen to think that it was more
than just a few people who caused this to happen. It's a mentality that
some of the followers of whatever group is responsible for this massacre
have. or didn't you see the happy faces and cheers on television coming
from a very distinct group in the middle east. Of course, it's not all of
the people in the middle east but it's sure more than a *few*...... The
pictures being shown on television showing the results of their handywork
filled them with joy.
I'm not going to get into a debate with you Aethelrede. I'm sure you can
out talk me any day of the week. I said what I meant and that's all I will
say....
>
>
Violet
For all concerned.... no question or disagreement from me on that
Nuncio....(thank you by the way, I just added a new word to my vocabulary)
.... Vi
Brithnoth
>
>
> I also just had a conversation with my sister and she pointed out that
> most life insurance policies do not pay when something like terrorism is
> involved. Also, many medical plans also do not cover this kind of
> thing. Many people are going to be bankrupt from this.
>
> Rose
General building/contents cover may also excludes terror attacks. In
the UK central government would cover such eventualities, as is the case
in NI. I hope the same principle is applied there.
thoughts to all
B
Brithnoth
>
> Tragic and frightening on so many levels.
>
> Firstly and importantly, so many people dead.
> And, in particularly gruesome ways which don't bear
> thinking about.
Indeed
>
> So professionally executed: what kind of organisation
> and money must be behind it?
>
I am not so sure on this point. To conceive such an assault is indeed
truly evil but bringing it about looks to have been very simple and
low-tech.
thoughts to all
B
Brithnoth
>
> I pray that people can keep their sanity and that there will not be
> random attacks against Arabs all over the country. We need sanity to
> counteract this insanity; we need love to counteract this hate. We
> need courage in the face of this terror.
>
> Molly
To which I would add that for the individual returning to normality is
our way of saying we are not beaten.
Having been 'missed' by the IRA bomb in Bishopsgate London (by exactly a
week, to the minute) walking back along a few weeks later was emotional
but *I was there again*.
thoughts to all
B
Aethelrede
>On Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:07:58 GMT, "Violet" <vi...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Nuncio" <metric...@tesco.net> wrote in message
>>>
>>> And, just maybe, one is forced to contemplate the kind of
>>> frustration which allows this kind of terrorism to arise.
>>>
>>> The world is changed forever.
>>> We teeter on the brink...
>>
>>I am sure you don't intend it to be, but this must be great reading for
the
>>parties that are behind this or the ones that think yesterday was a day
well
>>deserved by USA.
>>
>>... Vi
>>
>
>Those who were behind this do not view the world the same way that the U.S.
>or "the West" do. This was a seriously horrible act, and I do not believe
that
>anyone from anywhere does something like this simply because they are
somehow
>intrinsically evil. It is a symptom of people who are very seriously
unbalanced
>in their view of what western civilisation represents.
I don't think that's true. Look at wars throughout time: people do
obscenely brutal things, and risk their lives, and even do things that they
know will kill them (and I'm talking about hundreds, if not thousands or
hundreds of thousands, of normal, ordinary Western people over centuries,
not just "Those" non-Westerners like the Kamikazi pilots or suicide bombers
or the two dozen people on those planes yesterday), for their country or for
their way of life.
And think of what it takes to burn someone to death for their religion,
and even more, think of what it takes to believe so strongly that you think
it's beter to be burned than change your beliefs. That happened in the
west: In Spain, most European counties and right in London too (Smithfield,
Tower Hill among other places), and in other parts of the British Isles too.
Fanaticism isn't just something that makes "them" act oddly: there are
people in Europe and in the US who are part of society and western
civilization who are by your definition "seriously unbalanced" (i.e.
"religious").
I found out yesterday that at least one person I work with believes,
utterly, that this attack on NYC and Washington, is a sign that "The End
Times" are starting and that Armageddon is only a few years ahead. And
this man is an educated, long-time information systems professional. I'm
not too sure what he'd do for his religion, let's just say I wouldn't attack
the church or rip up a bible around him.
>How did they get like this?
>What is necessary to stop more people developing those views too?
That really is too big a question to even think of discussing in a forum
like this.
>Does that make sense to you?
>
>We teeter on the brink because all humans exist on just the single world.
>If any humans get to the point where killing many thousands of ordinary
people
>going about their lives seems a valid behaviour, something has gone
seriously
>wrong -- for everyone in every country.
You never met anyone who was in bomber command (or its equivalent in the
USAAF, or the German bomber squads) in WW II? Anyone who was in a bomber
crew killed thousands of ordinary people who were trying to go about their
lives.
It is unfortunately very easy for normal, ordinary people to believe
what they hear when they are told that going off and killing people in
large numbers is good, and moral.
>A great injustice has been done. But jingoism is very dangerous.
It most certainly is. Specially when it's the attitude of a complacent
and essentially non-military populace, who pay a tiny fraction of their
fellows to fight for them(1). I've been wondering how different the
opinions I've heard over the past 36 hours would be if the "leaders"
mouthing them were expected to actually join in the "war" they've declared,
and put their own butts on the line. Bush senior during desert storm knew
what he was sending people into: Bush junior only has it to his advantage
that he isn't a self admitted draft-dodger.
(1)There are obvious parallels between the USA today and Britain on the eve
of the Crimean war, when "Jingoism" was first named.
--
"Any man who is under 30 and is not a liberal has no heart ; and any
man who is over 30, and is not a conservative, has no brains."
Sir Winston Churchill, 1874-1965.
