SKINNER: Thats No Hag...Thats My Wife!
AnnieB is back!
Mr. E wrote:
>
> I know who the old lady is and she ain't no tramp...nor is Mulder's theory of
> her being a succubus correct either. Old lady is Skinner's wife. Within the
> last month or so there was a report on one of the shows that covers paranormal
> activities on tv. This report was about a Viet Nam veteren who survived Viet
> Nam according to him, because his wife saved him. He saw her there in the
> jungle, her spirit saved him from dying out there. He had forgotten this until
> years later when during another brush with death, his wife appeared
> again...once more saving his life. In case you still don't see, why do you
> think the hag was dressed as his wife? Hhmmm...
>
> Good work CC ... a very thought provoking episode.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~hmm........has something to do with him wife.
Remember he was not married during Vietnam. And the first time the old
woman saved him was in the jungle. The she disappeared about the time he
got married. She shows up about 3 months ago, about the time he gets
shot in the stomache. But Skinner and the wife are seperated!
Skinner told his wife in the hospital: Your the only reason I made it
through, knowing I would go to bed and wake up with you got me thru it
all. hmm.......Each time he see's the old woman she trys to warn him
about something...... Then he see's the old woman in place of his wife,
and takes her hand. And he is not afraid no more......... She is there to
help him. And she also told him to help Scully and the Girl. Because we
know the man would have shot the girl and probably Scully too.
So maybe she is his gardian Angel. After all Scully had one in One
Breath, Nurse Owens. I loved this episode.
AnnieB
Mr. E
Mr. E
According to the guy in the report that's exactly what happened ... maybe
soulmate is more literal than we think?
In article <4ls9tp$s...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, sgt...@ix.netcom.co says...
Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
another part of the world.
Brian L. Cartwright
sgt...@ix.netcom.com(Mark Brian Huiskens) wrote:
>Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
>spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
>time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
>another part of the world.
>
>>
>>I know who the old lady is and she ain't no tramp...nor is Mulder's
>theory of
>this until
>>years later when during another brush with death, his wife appeared
>>again...once more saving his life. In case you still don't see, why
>do you
>>think the hag was dressed as his wife? Hhmmm...
Gosh darn, I think you're right. The clincher is when Skinner was
sleeping on the couch, with the wedding picture on his chest. He is
jolted from his sleep and sees a vision of the old hag (still in his
wife's red raincoat) screaming. Then the cops show up to tell him his
wife was hurt. I didn't know the signifigance of the screaming hag.
Mark Brian Huiskens
Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
another part of the world.
In <4lrs2n$c...@news7.erols.com> jack...@mail.erols.com (Mr. E) writes:
>
>I know who the old lady is and she ain't no tramp...nor is Mulder's
theory of
>her being a succubus correct either. Old lady is Skinner's wife.
Within the
>last month or so there was a report on one of the shows that covers
paranormal
>activities on tv. This report was about a Viet Nam veteren who
survived Viet
>Nam according to him, because his wife saved him. He saw her there in
the
>jungle, her spirit saved him from dying out there. He had forgotten
this until
>years later when during another brush with death, his wife appeared
>again...once more saving his life. In case you still don't see, why
do you
>think the hag was dressed as his wife? Hhmmm...
>
Mr. E
Possibly, but I'm sticking with the wife bit. Soulmate kinda stuff. A love
that transends time and space. She had to save him in Viet Nam so they could
meet. How do you know they were not married in while he was in Viet Nam? The
picture of him and her shows a much younger and hairier Skinner. Plus CC in an
interview said that episodes were inspired by events in the papers and such.
The story fits more into the one I posted...actually, the guy in that referred
to his wife as his guardian angel. Hhmmm...more to ponder. I think her
speaking through his wife's mouth is way too much to dismiss as well. I
believe while we saw his wife speaking to him before he ended up in the hotel,
I bet he still saw the old lady.
In article <31818F...@bridge.net>, an...@bridge.net says...
catherine yronwode
sgt...@ix.netcom.com(Mark Brian Huiskens) wrote:
> >Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
> >spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
> >time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
> >another part of the world.
I too believe that the Old Woman was/is Sharon Skinner. At some poiint in the
future, (and i believe it is when she is dying -- as shown for a moment when
she was superimposed over her middle-aged self in the hospital scene) she
sends her spirit back in time to save Skinner from every bad close call he has
ever had, so she can be with him to the end of her life.
Yes, that means that she saved him in Vietnam BEFORE she met him -- but she
was able to do so (will be able to do so) because she knows what happened to
him there since he told her about it AFTER they met. (Yes--this is circular
logic, as happens in many time-travel stories.)
By middle age, she knows or suspects that her future self is the old woman who
saved him in Vietnam -- for she hints as much when she comes to him at his
apartment and says something like "i've helped you before" -- but he doesn't
get it then. He won't let her help, and so she is sent away -- to be almost
killed by the guys who are trying to frame him.
When he confesses his love to her at her bedside at the hospital she appears
again as the old woman -- and only then does he realize that she is not a
frightening old hag but the future of his beloved wife. This is a very
powerful moment, but non-verbal, which may be why some viewers missed the
impact of it.
This scene reinforces two major thematic subtexts in the overall X-Files --
the most obvious being the bedside confession of care and love ( e.g. Scully
at Mulder's bed in "Endgame," Mulder at Scully's bed in "One Breath," Mulder
tucking his mom into bed in "Colony") -- and the other being something i call
"bridging the generation gap" in which young and middle aged adults feel care,
concern, and even love for elderly people and vice versa (e.g. Scully and
Clyde Bruckman, Scully and Jose Chung, Deep Throat's care for Mulder, the
Well-Manicured Man's care for Scully, the businessman's after-death care for
Aubrey (was that her name?), and so forth).
In any case, in her old woman/time-traveller guise Sharon tells Skinner how to
save Scully and the other woman and stop the threat against himself. She knows
what he must do because Skinner has told her about what happened when they
were both middle-aged (and reconciled), after it happened. (Circular logic
again, but it's a time-travel scenario.)
That Sharon Skinner has paranormal powers is obvious -- that Skinner finally
RECCOGNIZES them is a turning point in his life. In this episode we -- and the
Skinners -- realize that Walter and Sharon will live to be old and that Sharon
will die as an old woman before Walter does -- the death-bed scene being a
flash-forward to her eventual death as an old woman, not her death in the
middle of this episode, as some have wrongly theorized -- and that Skinner
will be at her bedside when she dies -- and that as she lays dying (AH! AH!
The Faulkner reference i could not make in Jose Chuung!!!), she will send her
spirit back to warn Walter of all the dangers that beset him.
The wedding ring she gave Walter says "forever" on it -- and she means it. She
will always be and has always been his guardian angel. Circular logic. And
ultimately, Walter is always within her care, within the circle of her
concern.
Which leaves those errant thoughts of a Skinner-Scully "relationship" in the
dust, friends.
catherine yronwode -------------------- mailto:yron...@sonic.net
news:alt.lucky.w -- discussion of folkloric amulets and talismans
LUCKY W Amulet Archive: http://www.sonic.net/yronwode/LuckyW.html
Magine
"AnnieB is back!" <an...@bridge.net> wrote:
>Mr. E wrote:
>>
>> I know who the old lady is and she ain't no tramp...nor is Mulder's theory of
>> her being a succubus correct either. Old lady is Skinner's wife. Within the
>> last month or so there was a report on one of the shows that covers paranormal
>> activities on tv. This report was about a Viet Nam veteren who survived Viet
>> Nam according to him, because his wife saved him. He saw her there in the
>> jungle, her spirit saved him from dying out there. He had forgotten this until
>> years later when during another brush with death, his wife appeared
>> again...once more saving his life. In case you still don't see, why do you
>> think the hag was dressed as his wife? Hhmmm...
>>
>> Good work CC ... a very thought provoking episode.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~hmm........has something to do with him wife.
>
>Remember he was not married during Vietnam. And the first time the old
>woman saved him was in the jungle. The she disappeared about the time he
>got married. She shows up about 3 months ago, about the time he gets
>shot in the stomache. But Skinner and the wife are seperated!
>Skinner told his wife in the hospital: Your the only reason I made it
>through, knowing I would go to bed and wake up with you got me thru it
>all. hmm.......Each time he see's the old woman she trys to warn him
>about something...... Then he see's the old woman in place of his wife,
>and takes her hand. And he is not afraid no more......... She is there to
>help him. And she also told him to help Scully and the Girl. Because we
>know the man would have shot the girl and probably Scully too.
>So maybe she is his gardian Angel. After all Scully had one in One
>Breath, Nurse Owens. I loved this episode.
>
>AnnieB
Except the title, Avatar, implies that the old woman *was* a
projection (avatar) of his wife. IMHO.
-Magine
Coleen Sullivan-Baier
>
>Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
>spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
>time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you
....I can't even get my husband to appear to me to put the
garbage out......
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& (back in the tub, because
&&&&&gizzie&&&&& of my "3...why you hate it"
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& post. You guys better start
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&& being nicer to me, or I'll go
play in "Leap" land 4ever)
Karen Green
On Sat, 27 Apr 1996, Magine wrote:
> >help him. And she also told him to help Scully and the Girl. Because we
> >know the man would have shot the girl and probably Scully too.
> >So maybe she is his gardian Angel. After all Scully had one in One
> >Breath, Nurse Owens. I loved this episode.
> >
> >AnnieB
>
> Except the title, Avatar, implies that the old woman *was* a
> projection (avatar) of his wife. IMHO.
> -Magine
But an Avatar is a projection, or manifestation, of something divine.
And while Sharon Skinner is a very attractive woman, I wouldn't go so
far as to call her divine! In addition, no one with Jennifer Hetrick's
facial bone structure would EVER end up looking like that old woman. If
they wanted it to be Sharon Skinner as an old lady, they needed to choose
a different actress for either Sharon or the hag.
Karen
Mr. E
In article <Pine.SUN.3.91.96...@sawasdee.cc.columbia.edu>,
kl...@columbia.edu says...
>But an Avatar is a projection, or manifestation, of something divine.
Fortunately ... unfortunately for those who hate change ... we have a living
language. The definition for Avatar has already gone beyond the limitations of
divinity. Computer scientists are creating Avatars for people to use in 3D
computer applications ... Neal Stephenson's "Snow Crash" characters use
elaborate Avatars to intermingle in cyberspace.
>And while Sharon Skinner is a very attractive woman, I wouldn't go so
>far as to call her divine!
We don't know of enough to make that judgement ... remember the cliche "Don't
judge a book by it's cover." and "All that glitters is not gold." Mother
Theresa ... bless her soul ... is far from an attractive woman ... yet, her
divinity is unquestionable with or without a God.
>In addition, no one with Jennifer Hetrick's
>facial bone structure would EVER end up looking like that old woman. If
>they wanted it to be Sharon Skinner as an old lady, they needed to choose
>a different actress for either Sharon or the hag.
It's called poetic license ... putting Sharon up in all that make-up to make
her look older is more time and money extensive than in hiring someone for a
few cameo shots. This isn't a high-budget movie it's only an hour of
television.
r/Mr. E
"The hour of departure has arrived, and we go our ways-I to die and you to
live. Which is the better, only God knows." Socrates (469-399 B.C.)
AnnieB
On Apr 27, 1996 11:45:46 in article <Re: SKINNER: Thats No Hag...Thats My
Wife!>, 'jack...@mail.erols.com (Mr. E)' wrote:
>According to the guy in the report that's exactly what happened ... maybe
>soulmate is more literal than we think?
>
>In article <4ls9tp$s...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, sgt...@ix.netcom.co
>says...
>
>Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
>spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
>time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
>another part of the world.
>
>
--
Good Point!
Maybe the succubas is Skinner's wife. Take Note Skinner. This is what she
will look like in old age!!!! LOL
AnnieB
AnnieB
On Apr 27, 1996 12:48:55 in article <Re: SKINNER: Thats No Hag...Thats My
Wife!>, '"Brian L. Cartwright" <blca...@mail.erols.com>' wrote:
>sgt...@ix.netcom.com(Mark Brian Huiskens) wrote:
>>Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
>>spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
>>time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
>>another part of the world.
>>theory of
>>this until
>>>years later when during another brush with death, his wife appeared
>>>again...once more saving his life. In case you still don't see, why
>>do you
>>>think the hag was dressed as his wife? Hhmmm...
>
>sleeping on the couch, with the wedding picture on his chest. He is
>jolted from his sleep and sees a vision of the old hag (still in his
>wife's red raincoat) screaming. Then the cops show up to tell him his
>wife was hurt. I didn't know the signifigance of the screaming hag.
>
Screaming Hag! Hey it's a time honored way of all woman trying to catch a
man attention!
It's either screaming or throwing plate at his head!
LOL
AnnieB
Darleen
I think you are reading waaaaaay too much into a fairly straightforward
episode. Everything is there if you just pay attention. I suggest that if
you taped it you go back and rewatch it, a little more carefully this time.
The old woman (I refuse to use the word "hag" it is too sexist) is NOT NO
WAY NO HOW Sharon Skinner. We see her superimposed over Sharon's body in
the hospital because she (Old Woman) has momentarily taken over SS's body
to tell Skinner what the fork is going on.
In article <318243...@sonic.net>,
catherine yronwode <yron...@sonic.net> wrote:
>sgt...@ix.netcom.com(Mark Brian Huiskens) wrote:
>> >Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
>> >spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
>> >time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you in
>> >another part of the world.
>
Mary Lynn
> >Interesting input here. What if you were so close to your spouse in
> >spirit that he or she appeared to you wherever you happened to be in a
> >time of crisis, even if he or she were physically away from you
i dunno... i don't think that even Fox Mulder could believe in extreme
possibilities enough to allow for the "True Love" thing.
'scuse me, cuz i think i need a little Maalox......
-mar
genbac
giz...@ix.netcom.com(Coleen Sullivan-Baier) wrote:
>
>>
>>
> ....I can't even get my husband to appear to me to put the
>garbage out......
>
> &&&&&gizzie&&&&&
Me either, soul mates shmoul mates-the people with this theory have
obviously never been married to a human male. <g> Love your posts,
Colleen
david raoul derbes
In article <ADA93FD19...@slip8.wave.sheridan.wy.us>,
Darleen <ba...@wave.sheridan.wy.us> wrote:
>I think you are reading waaaaaay too much into a fairly straightforward
>episode. Everything is there if you just pay attention. I suggest that if
>you taped it you go back and rewatch it, a little more carefully this time.
>
>The old woman (I refuse to use the word "hag" it is too sexist) is NOT NO
>WAY NO HOW Sharon Skinner. We see her superimposed over Sharon's body in
>the hospital because she (Old Woman) has momentarily taken over SS's body
>to tell Skinner what the fork is going on.
I disagree; and I think cyronwode nailed it.
I didn't understand why the succubus assumed the form of an old woman (recall
that drawing; succubi usually looked *very* appealing) but catherine's theory
is extremely pleasing.
"Avatar" means a human form for a divine being, the most famous being
Krishna in the Bhagavad-Gita (an avatar of Siva, the destroyer in Hindu
belief), but I suppose Jesus may be viewed as an avatar of the Judaic
God.
I think we are supposed to understand that once upon a time, this succubus
fell in love with Skinner; and that Sharon became an avatar of this being.
But I gotta admit that I like cyronwode's version better.
I think there is a lot about succubi and incubi in the "Malleus Maleficarum",
but I gave away my copy to my neighbor, a theologian who likes these arcana.
The "MM" was used by witch-hunters in the late middle ages to prove a case
against a suspected witch.
David Derbes [lo...@midway.uchicago.edu]
Karen Green
On 28 Apr 1996, Mr. E wrote:
> In article <Pine.SUN.3.91.96...@sawasdee.cc.columbia.edu>,
> kl...@columbia.edu says...
>
> >But an Avatar is a projection, or manifestation, of something divine.
>
> Fortunately ... unfortunately for those who hate change ... we have a living
> language. The definition for Avatar has already gone beyond the limitations of
> divinity. Computer scientists are creating Avatars for people to use in 3D
> computer applications ... Neal Stephenson's "Snow Crash" characters use
> elaborate Avatars to intermingle in cyberspace.
OK, I'll buy that. Not being familiar with that connotation, however,
I'd appreciate it if you could explain how it applies in the episode. Do
you mean like a "physical" alias?
> >And while Sharon Skinner is a very attractive woman, I wouldn't go so
> >far as to call her divine!
>
> We don't know of enough to make that judgement ... remember the cliche "Don't
> judge a book by it's cover." and "All that glitters is not gold." Mother
> Theresa ... bless her soul ... is far from an attractive woman ... yet, her
> divinity is unquestionable with or without a God.
Um, I was just making a joke. Sorry if my nuances didn't make it through
the ether.
> >In addition, no one with Jennifer Hetrick's
> >facial bone structure would EVER end up looking like that old woman. If
> >they wanted it to be Sharon Skinner as an old lady, they needed to choose
> >a different actress for either Sharon or the hag.
>
> It's called poetic license ... putting Sharon up in all that make-up to make
> her look older is more time and money extensive than in hiring someone for a
> few cameo shots. This isn't a high-budget movie it's only an hour of
> television.
I never thought they should have made Jennifer Hetrick up to look old -
after "Dod Kalm" I _never_ want to see aging makeup again! But given the
casting director's proven skill in finding the perfect faces for the
smallest roles, I would think that they would have been able to find
someone who would look more convincingly like SHaron Skinner at 80. The
fact that that hag looked nothing like an aged Hetrick is just another
cog in why I don't think the hag was a representation of Skinner's wife.
Karen
Ed Vigmond
In article <4ltk71$7...@news5.erols.com>, Mr. E <jack...@mail.erols.com> wrote:
>Possibly, but I'm sticking with the wife bit. Soulmate kinda stuff. A love
>that transends time and space. She had to save him in Viet Nam so they could
>meet. How do you know they were not married in while he was in Viet Nam? The
>picture of him and her shows a much younger and hairier Skinner. Plus CC in an
>interview said that episodes were inspired by events in the papers and such.
>The story fits more into the one I posted...actually, the guy in that referred
>to his wife as his guardian angel. Hhmmm...more to ponder. I think her
>speaking through his wife's mouth is way too much to dismiss as well. I
>believe while we saw his wife speaking to him before he ended up in the hotel,
>I bet he still saw the old lady.
>
I think the old hag is Skinner's mother. That would explain why she's old
and protective. Also, a mother's love is the primal love which serves as a
blueprint for all future love and men try to
recapture it at some level when they marry. Often men project their mother
onto their mates, sometimes very literally by expecting them to do all the
things their mother did for them like cooking and cleaning.
Ed Vigmond
Lucas
> Good Point!
>
> Maybe the succubas is Skinner's wife. Take Note Skinner. This is what she
> will look like in old age!!!! LOL
>
> AnnieB
Yeah, but so will he (age un-gracefully, that's the way it works.) Hence
the phrase grow old together.
--
101-ism:
The tendency to pick apart, often in minute detail, all aspects of life using half understood pop psychology as a tool.
Douglas Coupland-GENERATION X
Jessica Lucas-pretending to be:
osgo...@mailo.starnetinc.com