Natalie Explains Why She Didn't Join Up with Ashley and Andrea and Other Things
Brian Smith
didn't do certain things in the game.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Natalie Tenerelli ('Survivor: Redemption Island')
Tuesday, May 17 2011, 5:24pm EDT
By Jennifer Still, Entertainment Reporter
While being the youngest player in Survivor: Redemption Island certainly
posed its challenges, Natalie Tenerelli made the bold move of aligning with
eventual winner Rob 'Boston Rob' Mariano in the first days of the
competition, promising her loyalty in exchange for his word to take her all
the way to the end of the competition. While not a strong competitor during
challenges or a massive personality around camp, the 19-year-old did indeed
make it to the final three by honoring her alliance - eventually at the cost
of betraying her best friend in the game. However, the jury accused her of
"riding coat-tails" and being controlled by Rob and she received no votes
during the final Tribal Council, eventually taking third place in the game.
Here's what Natalie told reporters about her experience...
What made you stick with Rob rather than joining up with Andrea and Ashley?
"For the vote, the only thing I could have done was vote for Phillip with
Ashley. It would have been a tie and then I could have jeopardized my chance
of being in the final three, so that's where my decision was made. There was
no other way I could have gone in that situation."
Did you think that you honestly had a chance to win?
"I really thought that maybe I'd get a couple of votes but I know that Rob
played a really awesome game and it's impossible not to see that. I'm really
happy for him and I think in every situation, the best player wins."
Did you ever consider turning on Rob earlier in the game at any point?
"You know, I thought about that and there was no chance for me to do that. I
think that has a lot to do with the fact that we knew he had the idol and
I'm glad that was clarified during the reunion. He would know if we were
going to vote for him - he's a smart player. It was less risky for me to
play with him rather than against him. If I had gone in another direction,
like stayed with the girls or something, Andrea and Ashley had made friends
on the other tribe. The kind of game I played was just a loyal one and I
didn't try to make friends with the other tribe so I just didn't think that
it was something I should do."
Looking back, do you think you could have done anything differently?
"I think it was such a tough game to play with Rob, just being that he's
done this four times and has so much experience. I look back on it and I
don't regret anything, I really don't."
What were you hoping would tip the jury towards voting for you?
"I figured that Rob played a really aggressive game and I just really hoped
for a bitter jury. That's where I stood. I hoped people would understand
that Rob has played four times and I'm so young. I hoped that they would see
that and vote for me."
Were you hoping that the jury resented Rob's game play? What do you mean by
a bitter jury?
"I played a pretty nice game and didn't make too many enemies and I didn't
want to change that. That's pretty much what I had going for me - I didn't
have to hurt people's feelings and I didn't have to lie to people, with
Ashley being the exception. However, at the time I wasn't lying because I
did think we were voting for Phillip until the end."
If anything, the jury was bitter to you. What was it like hearing their
criticism?
"It's hard because I am so young and it's hard to take that criticism and
everything. I think I said something about Julie, to take it with a grain of
salt and move on because you can't hold onto all of it. I just think people
thought I didn't do anything. They thought many things and it's all part of
the game. It's two different strategies. One is aggressive and coming up
with strategic plans and the other is being smart and socially playing the
best game you can."
When did you learn that Rob had the hidden immunity idol?
"There was a scene where I came in and we met on one side of the beach. I'm
trying to think of what was actually shown there... Oh! It was when we were
going to blindside Matt the first time and that's when I found out. I wanted
to play a safe game - that could be a good or a bad thing. I felt that there
were always other options for someone else and no risk for myself to be
voted out. I figured by the end people would see that I stayed loyal to my
alliance with Rob."
Andrea called your relationship with Rob "borderline creepy". What did you
think of that?
"Someone said something about me trimming Rob's beard but if you look back
on it, it was Ashley. I think in the end it was a lot of people feeling hurt
that Rob didn't pick them to take to the end, which is understandable."
You said you'd rather lose the game than your friendship with Ashley but you
still voted for her. What changed your mind?
"I'm sure it's something that I said but it's a little bit of editing to
make you think it's going a certain way and then it goes the other. But it's
hard - you're so tired and so hungry. By that point in the game, you get to
a place where you just want to be done. Rob had an advantage there because
he's done that four times and he knows all those feelings. He knows that
it's going to end but for me, I was so exhausted and I felt really bad about
the whole situation."
Brian
Ron
>
> When did you learn that Rob had the hidden immunity idol?
>
> "There was a scene where I came in and we met on one side of the beach. I'm
> trying to think of what was actually shown there... Oh!
Nothing! Can't believe that was left out.
Seapig
I think they left it out because the season would have been even more
dull and predictable if we'd known that everybody knew about it. With
what we saw, we could still hold out hope that somebody would try to
launch some kind of resistance to Rob, but the reality was that nobody
was going to try because they thought it would be hopeless.
They always try to mislead us about which way the TCs are going to go
- at F5 they wanted us to think that there was a chance that the 3
girls were going to try to vote out Rob, and that Rob might not play
his HII. If we had known that everybody knew about the HII, we would
have known that there was no chance of either of those things
happening.
Guardsman
b> This is a good interview with Natalie where she explains why she did and
b> didn't do certain things in the game.
It's actually not a good interview for Natalie because it makes
her look even dumber. The interviewer also doesn't do a good job of
following up on her bad answers:
>>> What made you stick with Rob rather than joining up with Andrea and Ashley?
>> "For the vote, the only thing I could have done was vote for Phillip with
>> Ashley. It would have been a tie and then I could have jeopardized my chance
>> of being in the final three, so that's where my decision was made. There was
>> no other way I could have gone in that situation."
[...]
The interviewer seems to be asking about the F5 vote but she's
talking about the F4 vote. Furthermore, an F4 vote for Phillip wouldn't
have put her in danger because the F4 tiebreaker would have been a
revote with only Rob and Natalie casting votes followed by a 1:1
competition between Ashley and Phillip. The Purple Rock is only used
until F6.
>>> Were you hoping that the jury resented Rob's game play? What do you mean by
>>> a bitter jury?
>> "I played a pretty nice game and didn't make too many enemies and I didn't
>> want to change that. That's pretty much what I had going for me - I didn't
>> have to hurt people's feelings and I didn't have to lie to people, with
>> Ashley being the exception. However, at the time I wasn't lying because I
>> did think we were voting for Phillip until the end."
[...]
She lied to Ashley but it wasn't really a lie? It's still lying
by omission.
>>> When did you learn that Rob had the hidden immunity idol?
>> "There was a scene where I came in and we met on one side of the beach. I'm
>> trying to think of what was actually shown there... Oh! It was when we were
>> going to blindside Matt the first time and that's when I found out. [...]
That's clearly wrong since Rob didn't find the HII until after
Matt was voted out the first time. (Kristina had the HII and used it
when Matt was voted out.) In another interview, Ashley says Rob told
them at the merge.
>> Source:
>> http://www.digitalspy.ca/ustv/s76/survivor/interviews/a320090/natalie-tenerelli-survivor-redemption-island.html
--
R. D.
shit.
do...@webtv.net
Again, Brian...thanks.
Uke...zip it.
do...@webtv.net
Natalie was always upfront about being young and naive. She was scared
and got the help she needed to go through 39 days in a nasty place.
I think that I might be an empath.
Seapig
> On Wed, 18 May 2011 02:10:18 -0600, "Brian Smith"
>
> <dcg_br...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >This is a good interview with Natalie where she explains why she did and
> >didn't do certain things in the game.
>
> >Source:
> >http://www.digitalspy.ca/ustv/s76/survivor/interviews/a320090/natalie...
>
> >Brian
>
> I'm still a little uncertain as to why they had this mentality that he
> "had an idol, what were we to do". You mean to tell me you couldn't
> blindside him at some point? A more honest answer would be that Rob
> had everyone so well played that no one had the guts or brains to
> initiate the blindside.
I would rephrase that last sentence slightly to say that Rob had
everyone so well played that no one had the guts or LACK of brains to
initiate the blindside. He had three people who were going to go
running to him at the first sign of a blindside. Anybody who intiated
that kind of talk was signing their own death warrant. Sometimes
paranoia is justified.
> The other thing of note was her comments about how tough it was to
> play the game with someone who's on it for his fourth time and carries
> all that experience. I suspect that this would not bode well for
> future returnees. While it is debateable that the Zappers killed their
> momentum by sacrificing Manson in that challenge, I think that it
> certainly warrants scrutiny as to when to bag these former players as
> once you get them too far along in the game, they can eat you up.
Yes, at the start of the game, going to the final with Rob probably
seemed like a good idea (which is why so many people bought into it),
because who would want to give another million dollars to the Romber
franchise? But, by the end of the game, those people had no argument
for why they deserved the money, because they had done nothing but
ride Rob's coattails.
zeppo
>
> They always try to mislead us about which way the TCs are going to go
> - at F5 they wanted us to think that there was a chance that the 3
> girls were going to try to vote out Rob, and that Rob might not play
> his HII. If we had known that everybody knew about the HII, we would
> have known that there was no chance of either of those things
> happening.
Rob took the idea of the three girls voting for him seriously enough
to play the idol.
If he had felt totally confident within his alliance, he wouldn't have
bothered.
zeppo
>
> It's actually not a good interview for Natalie because it makes
> her look even dumber.
No kidding. Her comment that "in every situation the best player
wins" might have
been one of the most clueless things that any survivor has ever said.
>
> The interviewer seems to be asking about the F5 vote but she's
> talking about the F4 vote.
I don't think so. She probably means that at F5 Rob and Phil ended up
voting Andrea and Andrea ended up voting for
Rob. If Nat and Ashley had voted for Phil, the tie that she mentioned
would have been created. What she does not
say is that she and Ashley could have told Andrea that Rob had the
HII, and that the three of them should
therefore take out Phil. But I suspect that making such a move never
crossed her mind.
>
> She lied to Ashley but it wasn't really a lie? It's still lying
> by omission.
And by commission. At F5, she promised Ashley that she would vote for
Phil at F4.
She broke her word plain and simple. What really surprised me was
that Ashley did not act
the least bit shocked or upset after Nat's betrayal. I was certain,
right after the F4 vote, that
she had been told ahead of time that everybody was voting for her.
But in confessional, she said
she didn't know.
zeppo
A more honest answer would be that Rob
> had everyone so well played that no one had the guts or brains to
> initiate the blindside.
Very well stated.
>
> The other thing of note was her comments about how tough it was to
> play the game with someone who's on it for his fourth time and carries
> all that experience. I suspect that this would not bode well for
> future returnees. While it is debateable that the Zappers killed their
> momentum by sacrificing Manson in that challenge, I think that it
> certainly warrants scrutiny as to when to bag these former players as
> once you get them too far along in the game, they can eat you up.
But to be fair, Rob is "not an ordinary man" :-)
And with all kidding aside, Rob's level of gamesmanship is unlikely to
be replicated by
any returning player in the foreseeable future.
zeppo
>
> Yes, at the start of the game, going to the final with Rob probably
> seemed like a good idea (which is why so many people bought into it),
> because who would want to give another million dollars to the Romber
> franchise?
Interesting comment. Certainly there were more than a few posters on
this ng who,
even post merge, were arguing that Rob couldn't and wouldn't win the
game.
shawn
wrote:
>On May 18, 10:56 am, Aloha Ray Walston wrote:
> A more honest answer would be that Rob
>> had everyone so well played that no one had the guts or brains to
>> initiate the blindside.
>
>Very well stated.
>
>>
>> The other thing of note was her comments about how tough it was to
>> play the game with someone who's on it for his fourth time and carries
>> all that experience. I suspect that this would not bode well for
>> future returnees. While it is debateable that the Zappers killed their
>> momentum by sacrificing Manson in that challenge, I think that it
>> certainly warrants scrutiny as to when to bag these former players as
>> once you get them too far along in the game, they can eat you up.
>
>But to be fair, Rob is "not an ordinary man" :-)
Ordinary men don't stab their friends in the back is what Grant would
say.
>And with all kidding aside, Rob's level of gamesmanship is unlikely to
>be replicated by
>any returning player in the foreseeable future.
That's true. Very few people have that good of a social game. Tom did
a good job during his season as did Parvati. She probably would have
won if Russell hadn't been sitting next to her as everyone associated
her with his behavior.
Guardsman
z> On May 18, 10:21 am, Guardsman <sp...@net.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> The interviewer seems to be asking about the F5 vote but she's
>> talking about the F4 vote.
z> I don't think so. She probably means that at F5 Rob and Phil ended
z> up voting Andrea and Andrea ended up voting for Rob. If Nat and
z> Ashley had voted for Phil, the tie that she mentioned would have been
z> created. What she does not say is that she and Ashley could have
z> told Andrea that Rob had the HII, and that the three of them should
z> therefore take out Phil. But I suspect that making such a move never
z> crossed her mind.
I considered that Natalie might have meant that F5 tie, but
rejected it because I thought even she could figure out that a tie at F5
was easy to avoid (as you say) just by telling Andrea to vote for Phil.
Maybe I gave her too much credit.
--
UCLAN
> Again, Brian...thanks.
Cool-Ade anyone?
> Uke...zip it.
Or, as she said, un-zip it.
UCLAN
God's Debris
wrote:
>On May 18, 7:44 am, Seapig <sea...@altavista.com> wrote:
As many times as he's played the game there is no way he would not
have played the idol, esp since it was the last time it could be
played. Only a fool "wouldn't have bothered" and Rob is no fool.
Brian Smith
news:14654-4DD...@storefull-3112.bay.webtv.net...
>
> Natalie was always upfront about being young and naive. She was scared
> and got the help she needed to go through 39 days in a nasty place.
>
>
> I think that I might be an empath.
In an interview Rob said he put himself in Natalie's shoes and said he would
have liked someone to help him as well. Rob did a great job of reading
Natalie because that was a perfect alliance for him.
How early on did you pin Natalie and Phillip as the two you'd like to take
with you to the end?
"With Natalie, it happened very early on, I'd say the first day. A lot of
that comes from a perceptive read that I had on her and part of it was
because of her situation. She's 19 years old. I try to put myself in her
position - if I were coming into the game at 19 not knowing what I was
doing, I'd like someone to take me under their wing and spend their energy
on that and in return I wanted her loyalty. I saw something in her that I
saw similarly in Amber. I knew that she would be loyal throughout the entire
thing and I can't explain it, it's just something that I felt from the
beginning. Phillip was a little bit different. In the beginning of the game,
he was trying to get me out but as time went on he kind of got frustrated
with that and adopted a 'if you can't beat them, join them' strategy. He
realized that as long as he kept up his antics, I would keep him around. I
think they thought that if they stayed, they could beat me while in reality
I don't think I could have beat anyone besides them at the end."
Brian
Brian Smith
news:700502d4-8d0f-47d8...@d26g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
How could Ashley be upset after Natalie told her she loved her? And let's
not forget the personal grooming. Maybe if Rob had done that with Grant,
Grant wouldn't still be so bitter.
Brian
Brian Smith
I was one of them who thought going into the merge that Rob wouldn't win. I
thought Zapatera would be able to swing a few people but they were
completely useless. So many people keep saying how stupid Natalie, Ashley,
etc. were but to me they were frickin' brilliant compared to Zapatera. Rob
might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to sixth
places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
Brian
Guardsman
b> I was one of them who thought going into the merge that Rob wouldn't win. I
b> thought Zapatera would be able to swing a few people but they were
b> completely useless. So many people keep saying how stupid Natalie, Ashley,
b> etc. were but to me they were frickin' brilliant compared to Zapatera. Rob
I thought the result actually emphasized how dumb they were.
This season showed that a tribe with dumb but good physical competitors
only needs one smart person. It's a great situation for that one smart
player to be surrounded by dumb followers.
b> might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to sixth
b> places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
No, the Koror tribe did it first in Palau and that was a more
dominating performance. Anyway, it's not as big a deal as you make it
out to be because both Koror and Ometepe lucked out in that they didn't
have to deal with tribal swaps, a twist designed to prevent that kind of
domination.
--
shawn
wrote:
>>>>>> Brian Smith writes:
>
>b> I was one of them who thought going into the merge that Rob wouldn't win. I
>b> thought Zapatera would be able to swing a few people but they were
>b> completely useless. So many people keep saying how stupid Natalie, Ashley,
>b> etc. were but to me they were frickin' brilliant compared to Zapatera. Rob
>
>
> I thought the result actually emphasized how dumb they were.
>This season showed that a tribe with dumb but good physical competitors
>only needs one smart person. It's a great situation for that one smart
>player to be surrounded by dumb followers.
So long as they are loyal and able to play a role it can work well.
They can be friends with other players and listen to their plans and
then pass that on to the strategist. The problem is that the dumb
follower can often give away as much or more as they get, or can be
swayed to follow someone else.
>b> might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to sixth
>b> places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
>
>
> No, the Koror tribe did it first in Palau and that was a more
>dominating performance. Anyway, it's not as big a deal as you make it
>out to be because both Koror and Ometepe lucked out in that they didn't
>have to deal with tribal swaps, a twist designed to prevent that kind of
>domination.
Tribal swaps often seem to destroy at least one players chance in the
game so I'm torn about them. I wanted Shii Ann to get more of a shot
but it wasn't to be. I almost think the producers would be best served
if they set up a rule to bring in a tribal swap if a tribe is
dominating the game by too much to keep it more interesting. The last
thing they really want is to have the game be too predictable to the
viewers as a number will tune out when they can see how then three or
four weeks will play out.
The Horny Goat
wrote:
>
>As many times as he's played the game there is no way he would not
>have played the idol, esp since it was the last time it could be
>played. Only a fool "wouldn't have bothered" and Rob is no fool.
I agree - and feel there's no reason to disbelieve his commentabout
his grandmother.
Not playing the idol had lots of downside and no upside so why would
he keep it?
I'm still amazed that someone who was voted off with two immunity
idols could ever come back as an 'all-star'
zeppo
> >And with all kidding aside, Rob's level of gamesmanship is unlikely to
> >be replicated by
> >any returning player in the foreseeable future.
>
> That's true. Very few people have that good of a social game. Tom did
> a good job during his season as did Parvati. She probably would have
> won if Russell hadn't been sitting next to her as everyone associated
> her with his behavior.
I agree with your comment about Parvati. I would also add that Sandra
played
two outstanding social games in her seasons.
zeppo
>
> As many times as he's played the game there is no way he would not
> have played the idol, esp since it was the last time it could be
> played. Only a fool "wouldn't have bothered" and Rob is no fool.
But he is also a cocky SOB. As he stated in confessional, he would
have
loved to have taken the HII home as a souvenir. But, on reflection,
you are exactly right. Rob had played close to a flawless game up to
that point, and he wasn't about to take any risks that he didn't need
to.
.
zeppo
>
> How early on did you pin Natalie and Phillip as the two you'd like to take
> with you to the end?
>
> "With Natalie, it happened very early on, I'd say the first day. A lot of
> that comes from a perceptive read that I had on her and part of it was
> because of her situation. She's 19 years old. I try to put myself in her
> position - if I were coming into the game at 19 not knowing what I was
> doing, I'd like someone to take me under their wing and spend their energy
> on that and in return I wanted her loyalty. I saw something in her that I
> saw similarly in Amber.
I wonder what Amber would think of that comment. At the time she and
Rob met in
All-stars, she had accumulated more game experience than he had, and
the fact
that Burnett and Probst invited her to participate is a testament to
what they thought
of her performance in S2. For Rob to try to compare his alliance with
Amber to his
alliance with Natalie is pretty insulting to the former.
. I
> think they thought that if they stayed, they could beat me while in reality
> I don't think I could have beat anyone besides them at the end."
Wow! A very surprising comment IMO.
zeppo
>
> I was one of them who thought going into the merge that Rob wouldn't win. I
> thought Zapatera would be able to swing a few people but they were
> completely useless. So many people keep saying how stupid Natalie, Ashley,
> etc. were but to me they were frickin' brilliant compared to Zapatera. Rob
> might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to sixth
> places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
>
It happened in S1 for sure, and I think in some of the other early
seasons as well.
But as someone else said in another thread, classic pagongings are
seldom seen
in Survivor anymore due to the frequent twists and tribal swaps that
have been inserted
into the game.
In regards to Nat, Ashely, Grant et. al., I don't regard them as
stupid at all, just very well
played.
zeppo
I almost think the producers would be best served
> if they set up a rule to bring in a tribal swap if a tribe is
> dominating the game by too much to keep it more interesting. The last
> thing they really want is to have the game be too predictable to the
> viewers as a number will tune out when they can see how then three or
> four weeks will play out.
Heh! As I was reading your post, I couldn't help but think of the
season
during which one tribe was given all sorts of luxuries, and the other
tribe
basically ate dirt and slept on rocks (I think that was the game that
Earl won).
Now that was a twist that we are unlikely to ever see repeated :-)
Seapig
> I wonder what Amber would think of that comment. At the time she and
> Rob met in
> All-stars, she had accumulated more game experience than he had, and
> the fact
> that Burnett and Probst invited her to participate is a testament to
> what they thought
> of her performance in S2.
I think it was more because Elisabeth didn't want to do it. They were
the two sweet young things from S2, and of the two, Elisabeth lasted
longer and was more well-liked by the fans (this was before anybody
knew about her politics). Amber was seen as pretty but boring. If
Elisabeth had done the first all stars season instead of Amber, just
think how subsequent Survivor history would have been different.
Brian Smith
That Haves vs. Have Nots was one of the worst twists ever. I'd like to know
whatever made them think that would be entertaining.
Brian
Brian Smith
news:t5uat6lb68uupch9i...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 19 May 2011 11:31:18 -0700, Guardsman <sp...@net.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>>>>>>> Brian Smith writes:
>>
>>b> I was one of them who thought going into the merge that Rob wouldn't
>>win. I
>>b> thought Zapatera would be able to swing a few people but they were
>>b> completely useless. So many people keep saying how stupid Natalie,
>>Ashley,
>>b> etc. were but to me they were frickin' brilliant compared to Zapatera.
>>Rob
>>
>>
>> I thought the result actually emphasized how dumb they were.
>>This season showed that a tribe with dumb but good physical competitors
>>only needs one smart person. It's a great situation for that one smart
>>player to be surrounded by dumb followers.
>
> So long as they are loyal and able to play a role it can work well.
> They can be friends with other players and listen to their plans and
> then pass that on to the strategist. The problem is that the dumb
> follower can often give away as much or more as they get, or can be
> swayed to follow someone else.
Your last sentence shows why Natalie was not dumb. If Natalie was as naīve,
gullible and stupid as some claim she would have been easily influenced. For
example, she would have jumped at Steve's and Julie's offers both of which
had merit to them. The same goes for the other girls as well.
>>b> might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to
>>sixth
>>b> places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
>>
>>
>> No, the Koror tribe did it first in Palau and that was a more
>>dominating performance. Anyway, it's not as big a deal as you make it
>>out to be because both Koror and Ometepe lucked out in that they didn't
>>have to deal with tribal swaps, a twist designed to prevent that kind of
>>domination.
>
> Tribal swaps often seem to destroy at least one players chance in the
> game so I'm torn about them. I wanted Shii Ann to get more of a shot
> but it wasn't to be. I almost think the producers would be best served
> if they set up a rule to bring in a tribal swap if a tribe is
> dominating the game by too much to keep it more interesting. The last
> thing they really want is to have the game be too predictable to the
> viewers as a number will tune out when they can see how then three or
> four weeks will play out.
I'm willing to put up with one-sided games because they seldom happen. If
one tribe happens to be dominating so be it. It can still be entertaining to
see them do it and then see what will happen once they are down to just
their own tribe. I found this season very entertaining because there was
great strategic play and more than enough interesting and likable people.
Brian
Brian Smith
news:a36acf8d-5408-4085...@l18g2000yql.googlegroups.com...
You're right that Amber was a replacement. Thank God she was for numerous
reasons. I actually loved Amber in S2 so I was happy when she got chosen and
with everything since then.
Brian
Brian Smith
> On May 19, 1:31 am, "Brian Smith" <dcg_br...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> How early on did you pin Natalie and Phillip as the two you'd like to
>> take
>> with you to the end?
>>
>> "With Natalie, it happened very early on, I'd say the first day. A lot of
>> that comes from a perceptive read that I had on her and part of it was
>> because of her situation. She's 19 years old. I try to put myself in her
>> position - if I were coming into the game at 19 not knowing what I was
>> doing, I'd like someone to take me under their wing and spend their
>> energy
>> on that and in return I wanted her loyalty. I saw something in her that I
>> saw similarly in Amber.
>
> I wonder what Amber would think of that comment. At the time she and
> Rob met in
> All-stars, she had accumulated more game experience than he had, and
> the fact
> that Burnett and Probst invited her to participate is a testament to
> what they thought
> of her performance in S2. For Rob to try to compare his alliance with
> Amber to his
> alliance with Natalie is pretty insulting to the former.
My guess is that he's referring to the loyalty part. I don't recall Amber
having a strong alliance in S2 so Rob might be saying he thought he was a
better strategic player and that they would make a good pair. Of course
based on his first season we didn't see too much evidence that he was a
great strategic player.
> . I
>> think they thought that if they stayed, they could beat me while in
>> reality
>> I don't think I could have beat anyone besides them at the end."
>
> Wow! A very surprising comment IMO.
That shocked me as well. I do think other combos would have done better but
I can't see anyone else beating him unless he's got evidence that the jury
really didn't like him but hated Phillip and Natalie even more.
Brian
shawn
<dcg_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>"shawn" <nanof...@gNOmail.com> wrote in message
>news:t5uat6lb68uupch9i...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 19 May 2011 11:31:18 -0700, Guardsman <sp...@net.invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>> Brian Smith writes:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I thought the result actually emphasized how dumb they were.
>>>This season showed that a tribe with dumb but good physical competitors
>>>only needs one smart person. It's a great situation for that one smart
>>>player to be surrounded by dumb followers.
>>
>> So long as they are loyal and able to play a role it can work well.
>> They can be friends with other players and listen to their plans and
>> then pass that on to the strategist. The problem is that the dumb
>> follower can often give away as much or more as they get, or can be
>> swayed to follow someone else.
>
>Your last sentence shows why Natalie was not dumb. If Natalie was as naïve,
>gullible and stupid as some claim she would have been easily influenced. For
>example, she would have jumped at Steve's and Julie's offers both of which
>had merit to them. The same goes for the other girls as well.
I never thought Natalie was dumb. Naive, yes, but not dumb. She's just
got a serious lack of life experience which means she's not sure of
herself. Luckily for her she came in looking for someone to provide
guidance and Rob needed someone so it worked out well for both of
them. If she had jumped at Steve and Julie's offer that would have
shown her to be gullible since she wouldn't be putting herself in any
better position. Also by that time she already knew about Rob and his
HII which would also color her decision process.
>>>b> might have won but at least he was with them and they took second to
>>>sixth
>>>b> places which has probably never been before by an alliance/tribe.
>>>
>>>
>>> No, the Koror tribe did it first in Palau and that was a more
>>>dominating performance. Anyway, it's not as big a deal as you make it
>>>out to be because both Koror and Ometepe lucked out in that they didn't
>>>have to deal with tribal swaps, a twist designed to prevent that kind of
>>>domination.
>>
>> Tribal swaps often seem to destroy at least one players chance in the
>> game so I'm torn about them. I wanted Shii Ann to get more of a shot
>> but it wasn't to be. I almost think the producers would be best served
>> if they set up a rule to bring in a tribal swap if a tribe is
>> dominating the game by too much to keep it more interesting. The last
>> thing they really want is to have the game be too predictable to the
>> viewers as a number will tune out when they can see how then three or
>> four weeks will play out.
>
>I'm willing to put up with one-sided games because they seldom happen. If
>one tribe happens to be dominating so be it. It can still be entertaining to
>see them do it and then see what will happen once they are down to just
>their own tribe. I found this season very entertaining because there was
>great strategic play and more than enough interesting and likable people.
>
I don't know if it is that entertaining. I'll certainly admit that
what happened with T'Steph her first season was enjoyable just to
watch her keep going while the rest of her tribe fell to the wayside,
but it wouldn't have been nearly as enjoyable if she hadn't been such
a good physical player.
I didn't see this season as a case of true domination since there was
some back and forth in tribes winning TCs before the merge. If the
Zaps hadn't intentionally lost that one challenge they might have
managed to go into the merge with an advantage in the numbers which
would have radically changed the game. I'm referring to something like
with Stephanie's season where a tribe can't win any TCs so there's
just never any hope. It isn't something that will happen often but the
producers need a plan in place to help keep the game interesting
because if one tribe gets significant advantage in numbers then it's
almost certain they will win out the challenges till the merge.
Brian Smith
I didn't mean to imply that you had ever said Natalie was dumb just that you
provided a great example of why she isn't. She definitely has a serious lack
of life experience (not surprising given her age) but I give her a lot of
credit for having no problem admitting so.
I guess the few times it has happened they've lucked out and it has been
entertaining. At least I've been entertained. Concerning this season, I was
happy that Zapatera got wiped as there were a lot of them that I did not
like and I really liked the Ometepe Six members.
> I didn't see this season as a case of true domination since there was
> some back and forth in tribes winning TCs before the merge. If the
> Zaps hadn't intentionally lost that one challenge they might have
> managed to go into the merge with an advantage in the numbers which
> would have radically changed the game. I'm referring to something like
> with Stephanie's season where a tribe can't win any TCs so there's
> just never any hope. It isn't something that will happen often but the
> producers need a plan in place to help keep the game interesting
> because if one tribe gets significant advantage in numbers then it's
> almost certain they will win out the challenges till the merge.
In Stephenie's first season I believe a lot of people maintained their
interest because they were convinced she and her tribe would finally win a
challenge. She became a great underdog which probably also kept people
interested. As long as there's something interesting going on and/or a lot
of likable people I'll be happy.
Brian
do...@webtv.net
R.D. said:
"You can't beleive what that lying bitch says. Natalie is so full of
shit."
A bit harsh for an enlightened Web-TV guy.
:-)
do...@webtv.net
zeppo commented on 'The Seapig's' words:
"Interesting comment. Certainly there were more than a few posters on
this ng who, even post merge, were arguing that Rob couldn't and
wouldn't win the game."
Yes...I thought that somebody would rise up and want Rob gone.
However...if they knew he had the HII...then maybe the 'newbies' were
stumped.
do...@webtv.net
Thanks for the fine report, Brian.
Rob DOES have a feel for the game (feel...haha).
I was glad that he guided Natalie...and that he never turned on her.
do...@webtv.net
After I told Uke to 'zip-it'...he said:
"Or, as she said, un-zip it."
I wear the 501 button-fly jeans...where each button opened...increases
the anticipation as my erecton pushes harder to be free.
(harder...:-)
do...@webtv.net
Brian said:
"How could Ashley be upset after Natalie told her she loved her? And
let's not forget the personal grooming. Maybe if Rob had done that with
Grant, Grant wouldn't still be so bitter."
Grooming?
Shirley you jest.
UCLAN
zeppo
:
>
> I think it was more because Elisabeth didn't want to do it. They were
> the two sweet young things from S2, and of the two, Elisabeth lasted
> longer and was more well-liked by the fans (this was before anybody
> knew about her politics). Amber was seen as pretty but boring. If
> Elisabeth had done the first all stars season instead of Amber, just
> think how subsequent Survivor history would have been different.
Good point. I had forgotten how deep Elisabeth went in S2, and I now
recall some chatter on this ng about Amber being the second choice,
after Elisabeth had declined.
In terms of her politics, there were some broad hints about that issue
during
S2. Her close alliance partner, Rodger Bingham, besides giving her
presents
from his oddly shaped rock collection, commented at times in
confessional
about what a fine, moral, upstanding young lady Elisabeth was.
Rodger's
choice of words, at the time, struck me as interesting, and so was not
the
least surprised to learn later on about her right wing political views.
zeppo
>
> That Haves vs. Have Nots was one of the worst twists ever. I'd like to know
> whatever made them think that would be entertaining.
>
Looking back on it, I can't help but laugh at the memory of the "have
not" tribe being so
malnourished and exhausted, that they could barely stand upright, but
yet would still
have to compete in challenges against the "have" tribe, which had been
gorging on
food, and sleeping on pillows and a hammock.
Fortunately, the Survivor production people saw the folly of their
ways pretty
quickly, and once the two tribes merged, the quality of game play
picked
up quickly.
Brian Smith
news:20238-4DD...@storefull-3111.bay.webtv.net...
>
> Brian said:
>
> "How could Ashley be upset after Natalie told her she loved her? And
> let's not forget the personal grooming. Maybe if Rob had done that with
> Grant, Grant wouldn't still be so bitter."
>
> Grooming?
Yes. Remember when Natalie used the pliers to pluck Ashley's underarm hair?
Then there was Ashley sniffing Natalie's underarm no doubt after applying
some concoction to help take away the odor.
Brian
zeppo
>
> My guess is that he's referring to the loyalty part. I don't recall Amber
> having a strong alliance in S2 so Rob might be saying he thought he was a
> better strategic player and that they would make a good pair. Of course
> based on his first season we didn't see too much evidence that he was a
> great strategic player.
My recollection of S2 is a bit shaky, but wasn't Amber closely
alligned with
Jerri in that game?
To be fair to Rob, he didn't really get a chance to play the game
in the Marquesas. A tribal switch put into a minority position, and he
ended up being the victim of a "mini-pagonging". Due to the fact that
he knew his days were numbered, he spent a considerable amount of
time with his one remaining alliance partner (Shaun?) playing to the
cameras. It was during that season that his sometimes used nickname,
"The Robfather " first appeared on this ng. This nickname was seldom
used in a complementary way, as Rob presented himself as being quite
unlikable during much of that season.
Brian Smith
Survivor and BB seem to think that they always need to have some crazy
twist/theme to start the season to grab the attention of viewers. When was
the last time we actually saw one of these twists last the entire season?
Survivor is probably due for another four tribe setup soon. Do you think MB
and CBS would have balls to base the tribes on religion?
Brian
zeppo
> Survivor and BB seem to think that they always need to have some crazy
> twist/theme to start the season to grab the attention of viewers. When was
> the last time we actually saw one of these twists last the entire season?
> Survivor is probably due for another four tribe setup soon. Do you think MB
> and CBS would have balls to base the tribes on religion?
>
Ha! Now there's an idea! How about a four tribe set up consisting of
Christians vs. Muslims vs. Buddhists vs. pagans?
Survivor's ratings would soar.
Brian Smith
The ratings most likely would soar. It's too bad they didn't cast some of
the people from this season to be on a religion-based season. I've been
watching the flood of the bonus videos from the last episode(s) and even
Ashley said that her faith in God helped her get through the rough times.
Brian
madamS
"shawn" <nanof...@gNOmail.com> wrote in message
> On Thu, 19 May 2011 20:41:29 -0600, "Brian Smith"
> <dcg_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>"shawn" <nanof...@gNOmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:t5uat6lb68uupch9i...@4ax.com...
>>> On Thu, 19 May 2011 11:31:18 -0700, Guardsman <sp...@net.invalid>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>>> Brian Smith writes:
>>>>
> I didn't see this season as a case of true domination since there was
> some back and forth in tribes winning TCs before the merge. If the
> Zaps hadn't intentionally lost that one challenge they might have
> managed to go into the merge with an advantage in the numbers which
> would have radically changed the game. I'm referring to something like
> with Stephanie's season where a tribe can't win any TCs so there's
> just never any hope. It isn't something that will happen often but the
> producers need a plan in place to help keep the game interesting
> because if one tribe gets significant advantage in numbers then it's
> almost certain they will win out the challenges till the merge.
My suggestion would be to take the choice of whom to sit out of challenges
away from the team with more people. Make them pick rocks or straws.
That way, you don't have one useless player sitting out most of the
challenges. That's even more of a problem when they don't have two
challenges every episode. The "no back to back sit-outs" helped a little
when they knew that if Chet sits out the Reward Challenge, he has to play in
the Immunity Challenge. At least they team winning all the Immunities
wouldn't be well-fed from rewards. Now, one team can get fed AND be immune.
--
madamS
"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject."
Sir Winston Churchill
Seapig
> On May 19, 7:55 pm, "Brian Smith" <dcg_br...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > My guess is that he's referring to the loyalty part. I don't recall Amber
> > having a strong alliance in S2 so Rob might be saying he thought he was a
> > better strategic player and that they would make a good pair. Of course
> > based on his first season we didn't see too much evidence that he was a
> > great strategic player.
>
> My recollection of S2 is a bit shaky, but wasn't Amber closely
> alligned with
> Jerri in that game?
I don't remember if they had any kind of strategic alliance, just that
they spent a lot of time together. Amber was like Jerri's quiet
little sister.
Seapig
That would be interesting, but I'm guessing that the answer to the
OP's question is no, they wouldn't have the balls to do that.
How about splitting them up geographically? I've suggested Red States
vs. Blue States before; in a four-tribe setup they could do East vs.
West vs. Midwest vs. South.
Brian Smith
That sounds right to me but who knows given it was 10 years ago.
Brian
Brian Smith
They could do that but that would prevent them from using tribe names based
on the location where the game was. They obviously could use the names but
it would sound awfully stupid.
Brian
do...@webtv.net
zeppo said:
"But he is also a cocky SOB. As he stated in confessional, he would have
loved to have taken the HII home as a souvenir. But, on reflection, you
are exactly right. Rob had played close to a flawless game up to that
point, and he wasn't about to take any risks that he didn't need to."
He's Boston Rob...if he wanted a HII...JP and MB would probably kiss his
ring and GIVE it to him.
:-)
I kid...cuz the world ends today.
do...@webtv.net
zeppo postulated:
"Ha! Now there's an idea! How about a four tribe set up consisting of
Christians vs. Muslims vs. Buddhists vs. pagans? Survivor's ratings
would soar."
See...they couldn't have a Jewish tribe cuz if the did...they'd outsmart
the others.
Outlast, Outwit, Out whine.
:-)
HEYYYY...HE'S comin' back today.
(comin'...ha)
do...@webtv.net
'The Seapig' said:
"How about splitting them up geographically? I've suggested Red States
vs. Blue States before; in a four-tribe setup they could do East vs.
West vs. Midwest vs. South."
Uh-HUH.
Boston Rob...Ralph...Jeff Schroeder (BB) and one of a ZILLION left
coasters to be captains.
'Wanna know what you're playin' for?'
Rob: 'I would like that'
Jeff: 'Fuckin' A'
Left Coaster: 'Uh, Jeff...I already have it.'
Ralph: 'Will this be on the test?'
do...@webtv.net
About geographically located teams...Brian said:
"They could do that but that would prevent them from using tribe names
based on the location where the game was. They obviously could use the
names but it would sound awfully stupid."
Left Coast Lackies
Chi-town Hustlers
East Coast Bloombergs
Southern Bumpkins
This sounds STUPID to you, Brian?
:-)
Brian Smith
news:14654-4DD...@storefull-3112.bay.webtv.net...
>
> 'The Seapig' said:
>
> "How about splitting them up geographically? I've suggested Red States
> vs. Blue States before; in a four-tribe setup they could do East vs.
> West vs. Midwest vs. South."
>
>
> Uh-HUH.
>
> Boston Rob...Ralph...Jeff Schroeder (BB) and one of a ZILLION left
> coasters to be captains.
If they did that setup with returning players they might have to change it
to SoCal vs. Rest of Nation.
Brian
Brian Smith
I notice you've downgraded the Midwest to just Chicago. Have any famous
Survivor players even come out of Chicago? I'd like to see two players from
Wisconsin return--one of my all time faves young Erinn and Andrea.
Brian
zeppo
>
> The ratings most likely would soar. It's too bad they didn't cast some of
> the people from this season to be on a religion-based season. I've been
> watching the flood of the bonus videos from the last episode(s) and even
> Ashley said that her faith in God helped her get through the rough times.
>
That's interesting given Rob's comments about Ashley being a
"corrupting influence"
on Natalie. He mentioned this at least twice during confessionals,
and both times
I found it an odd way to describe the relationship between the two
young women.
It is my belief that Rob's desire to protect and nurture Natalie was
as much personal
as it was strategic, and IMO showed a side of his character that we
had not seen before.
I also would say that his view of himself as Natalie's protector goes
a long way towards
explaining his otherwise inexplicable mistrust of Ashley throughout
most of the game.
Seapig
I'm pretty sure that "corrupting influence" just meant that she might
try to tell Natalie to do something that wasn't designed to help Rob
win a million dollars.
Brian Smith
That sounds right to me. I don't recall seeing any evidence from the TV
episodes, bonus clips, post game interviews, etc. that Ashley ever tried to
corrupt Natalie morally if that's what Zeppo is implying. I never got the
impression that Ashley is even like that.
Zeppo does a have a point however that Rob probably did want to genuinely
look out for Natalie. We saw a few good examples of that where he could have
easily just sat back and did nothing and it probably wouldn't have impacted
his game or his alliance with her one bit.
I find it interesting that a number of past players have criticized Rob for
making Natalie vote out Ashley when they were so close. They said he
shouldn't have done so and just taken both girls to the end because he would
have still won. I think this is where some of the Rob wasn't nice to Natalie
talk is coming from even though I think it is nonsense. Rob did everything
he could so she could win $100K and she would have if it wasn't for
illogical Ralph. Ashley very well could have finished third if she had only
followed his system.
Brian
The Horny Goat
wrote:
I always saw her as your stereotypical Polish-Catholic girl from
Boston. Which aside from the Boston part describes a lot of my
inlaws... I wouldn't consider any of them particularly left wing but
definitely fitting the mold on their views of family and kids...
The Horny Goat
<dcg_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> My recollection of S2 is a bit shaky, but wasn't Amber closely
>>> alligned with
>>> Jerri in that game?
>>
>> I don't remember if they had any kind of strategic alliance, just that
>> they spent a lot of time together. Amber was like Jerri's quiet
>> little sister.
>
>That sounds right to me but who knows given it was 10 years ago.
That's basically right - though I don't remember Amber having any
particular strategic sense whatsoever - she was a nastier version of
'America's Sweetheart' and doubtless would have been cast that way had
Elisabeth not fitted the role.
Brian Smith
news:615ht6lcattm67qvo...@4ax.com...
I don't recall Amber being nasty except by association.
Speaking of Jerri and Amber here's a funny story about them. I was watching
a recap show for this season and Jerri was one of the people on the show.
Anyway, someone asked about moments they wish had or had not been shown
during their season. Jerri said that during S2 she and Amber won a reward
which involved a lot of food. She said that night they both got up at the
same time, they each grabbed a candle (they had won them in some challenge)
and a shovel and proceeded to dig two holes in the sand three feet apart
into which they each shit. She said she's never been able to do that in
front of someone. I was amazed that Amber was the person she felt
comfortable taking a dump in front of not to mention that Amber would even
do something like that. After she was done telling the story Eliza said
something like "Jerri, they can't show people pooping on TV!" But Jerri is
hard core for the show to go back to it's roots of people really having to
rough it.
Brian
madamS
I always interpreted it as he was afraid that Ashley would have influence
over her in the game and that her loyalty to him would be compromised. I
think that you are giving credit to Rob that is not due. Imagine that! ;)
Seapig
I'm not sure what examples you're talking about here.
> I find it interesting that a number of past players have criticized Rob for
> making Natalie vote out Ashley when they were so close. They said he
> shouldn't have done so and just taken both girls to the end because he would
> have still won. I think this is where some of the Rob wasn't nice to Natalie
> talk is coming from even though I think it is nonsense. Rob did everything
> he could so she could win $100K and she would have if it wasn't for
> illogical Ralph. Ashley very well could have finished third if she had only
> followed his system.
I'd guess that by taking Phillip instead of Ashley his chance of
winning went from about 98% to about 99%. That seems trivial, but
when you're talking about a million dollars, it matters. Rob didn't
owe it to Natalie to take Ashley and more than he owed it to Phillip
to take Phillip. He owed it to himself to give himself the best
chance to win.
do...@webtv.net
Brian asked:
"Have any famous Survivor players even come out of Chicago?"
(cum...haha)
Just LIVING here makes you a Survivor player.
<mini-rimshot>
God's Debris
wrote:
>On May 18, 10:10 pm, God's Debris <hea...@dead.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> As many times as he's played the game there is no way he would not
>> have played the idol, esp since it was the last time it could be
>> played. Only a fool "wouldn't have bothered" and Rob is no fool.
>
>But he is also a cocky SOB. As he stated in confessional, he would
>have
>loved to have taken the HII home as a souvenir. But, on reflection,
>you are exactly right. Rob had played close to a flawless game up to
>that point, and he wasn't about to take any risks that he didn't need
>to.
>
>.
I think some, maybe a lot, of teh cockiness is just for show. Like
his comment about keeping it as a souvenir. Rob's a natural "actor"
for a show like this. He instinctively knows what makes for good
confessional material and how to get face time. Assuming someone
isn't literally writing a script for him he naturally comes up with
perfect phrasing, etc, just as if it was scripted and polished. He
knows the producers need faked drama to feed the mystery of what's
going to happen at next weeks tribal council and Rob gives it to them.
UCLAN
> Brian asked:
>
> "Have any famous Survivor players even come out of Chicago?"
Methinks "famous Survivor players" is a contradiction in terms. Even
Survivor's most well known contestants are far from "famous." Richard
Hatch famous? Nah. Boston Rob famous? Nah.
Brian Smith
news:14655-4DD...@storefull-3112.bay.webtv.net...
Chicago is more of a BB than a Survivor city. Including the suburbs just off
the top of my head I can think of Jeff, Matt, Howie, James, Sarah and Annie
was originally from there.
Brian
zeppo
>
> That sounds right to me. I don't recall seeing any evidence from the TV
> episodes, bonus clips, post game interviews, etc. that Ashley ever tried to
> corrupt Natalie morally if that's what Zeppo is implying. I never got the
> impression that Ashley is even like that.
Nor did I. That's why I thought Rob's use of the word "pure" to
describe Natalie,
and the word "corrupting" to describe how he saw Ashley's influence on
her, to
be odd choices if he was simply describing game play.
But maybe he was, and I am reading too much into his comments.
zeppo
>
> Speaking of Jerri and Amber here's a funny story about them. I was watching
> a recap show for this season and Jerri was one of the people on the show.
> Anyway, someone asked about moments they wish had or had not been shown
> during their season. Jerri said that during S2 she and Amber won a reward
> which involved a lot of food. She said that night they both got up at the
> same time, they each grabbed a candle (they had won them in some challenge)
> and a shovel and proceeded to dig two holes in the sand three feet apart
> into which they each shit. She said she's never been able to do that in
> front of someone. I was amazed that Amber was the person she felt
> comfortable taking a dump in front of not to mention that Amber would even
> do something like that. After she was done telling the story Eliza said
> something like "Jerri, they can't show people pooping on TV!" But Jerri is
> hard core for the show to go back to it's roots of people really having to
> rough it.
>
There was a lot of scatological humour in S2, which has rarely been
repeated in subsequent seasons.
However, despite Jerri's feelings on the matter, I wouldn't have
wanted to have seen the events
described above, even in what would have been a heavily edited format.
do...@webtv.net
'The Seapig' said:
"I'd guess that by taking Phillip instead of Ashley his chance of
winning went from about 98% to about 99%."
MUCH higher. Maybe 75 to 99.
I can't give numbers...but Ashley would have given everyone a legitimate
alternative to voting for Rob.
She could have won.
do...@webtv.net
'The UCLAN'...practicing for his summer stock theater gig, said:
"Methinks "famous Survivor players" is a contradiction in terms. Even
Survivor's most well known contestants are far from "famous." Richard
Hatch famous? Nah. Boston Rob famous? Nah."
Go where Rudy and Sue Hawk live.
do...@webtv.net
'God's Debris' said:
"I think some, maybe a lot, of the cockiness is just for show. Like his
comment about keeping it as a souvenir. Rob's a natural "actor" for a
show like this. He instinctively knows what makes for good confessional
material and how to get face time. Assuming someone isn't literally
writing a script for him he naturally comes up with perfect phrasing,
etc, just as if it was scripted and polished. He knows the producers
need faked drama to feed the mystery of what's going to happen at next
weeks tribal council and Rob gives it to them."
Very accurate.
do...@webtv.net
zeppo said:
"There was a lot of scatological humour in S2, which has rarely been
repeated in subsequent seasons.
However, despite Jerri's feelings on the matter, I wouldn't have wanted
to have seen the events
described above, even in what would have been a heavily edited format."
REALLY? Do tell.
If it's not fit for this forum...you may mail it directly to me.
I am always on the lookout for humor.
:-)
do...@webtv.net
Brian said:
"Chicago is more of a BB than a Survivor city. Including the suburbs
just off the top of my head I can think of Jeff, Matt, Howie, James,
Sarah and Annie was originally from there."
Probably true. Chicagoans like to live in houses with other people.
:-)
Hey...who wants a
do...@webtv.net
zeppo said:
"...That's why I thought Rob's use of the word "pure" to describe
Natalie,
and the word "corrupting" to describe how he saw Ashley's influence on
her, to
be odd choices if he was simply describing game play. But maybe he was,
and I am reading too much into his comments."
I thought that 'pure' meant that Natalie didn't know much about the
game...and that 'corrupting' by Ashley meant trying to change Nat's
thinking as set up by Rob.
The Horny Goat
wrote:
>That's interesting given Rob's comments about Ashley being a
>"corrupting influence"
>on Natalie. He mentioned this at least twice during confessionals,
>and both times
>I found it an odd way to describe the relationship between the two
>young women.
>It is my belief that Rob's desire to protect and nurture Natalie was
>as much personal
>as it was strategic, and IMO showed a side of his character that we
>had not seen before.
>I also would say that his view of himself as Natalie's protector goes
>a long way towards
>explaining his otherwise inexplicable mistrust of Ashley throughout
>most of the game.
>
>
>I always interpreted it as he was afraid that Ashley would have influence
>over her in the game and that her loyalty to him would be compromised. I
>think that you are giving credit to Rob that is not due. Imagine that! ;)
That's exactly how I interpreted it - as in 'nobody should have
influence on her but me!"
The Horny Goat
wrote:
>Nor did I. That's why I thought Rob's use of the word "pure" to
>describe Natalie,
>and the word "corrupting" to describe how he saw Ashley's influence on
>her, to
>be odd choices if he was simply describing game play.
>But maybe he was, and I am reading too much into his comments.
I don't remember the use of the word "pure" but if he did that's way
over the top on Rob's part.
Last time I heard the word 'pure' on Survivor was 21 seasons ago -
thank you Ms. Haskell!
zeppo
I just don't see that happening Doob. Even if she joins with Andrea
and Nat at F5 and dumps Phil,
the only way she gets to FTC is if Rob chooses her over Andrea. And
in such a scenario, I can't see
many people on the jury voting for her. She would have been viewed as
a "coat tail rider", the
same way that Natalie was, and even though some members of the jury
(Matt, Grant, maybe Andrea)
had hard feelings towards Rob, out of respect for his game play, they
still would have voted for him.
zeppo
> zeppo said:
>
> "There was a lot of scatological humour in S2, which has rarely been
> repeated in subsequent seasons.
> However, despite Jerri's feelings on the matter, I wouldn't have wanted
> to have seen the events
> described above, even in what would have been a heavily edited format."
>
> REALLY? Do tell.
>
1. At one point in the S2 game, one of the tribes, or maybe it was
after the merge, won a big
food reward. Of course, they all over-indulged which resulted in a
number of players needing
to vomit, or squat behind trees, on a repeated basis. This incident
may actually be the one that
Jerri was referring to in the interview that Brian posted. IIRC,
there was a fair amount of
dark humour exhibited by some of the players (not Elisabeth, Goat),
about the state of their
bodily functions.
2. The other incidence of scatological humour involved one of the
players (Nick?) who apparently had
developed a uniquely unpleasant odor. Somebody on the show (it may
have been Nick himself) made a
reference in confessional to (and I may have the wording wrong) the
shelter smelling like ass.
Brian Smith
> On May 23, 12:09 pm, d...@webtv.net wrote:
>> zeppo said:
>>
>> "There was a lot of scatological humour in S2, which has rarely been
>> repeated in subsequent seasons.
>> However, despite Jerri's feelings on the matter, I wouldn't have wanted
>> to have seen the events
>> described above, even in what would have been a heavily edited format."
>>
>> REALLY? Do tell.
>>
>
> 1. At one point in the S2 game, one of the tribes, or maybe it was
> after the merge, won a big
> food reward. Of course, they all over-indulged which resulted in a
> number of players needing
> to vomit, or squat behind trees, on a repeated basis. This incident
> may actually be the one that
> Jerri was referring to in the interview that Brian posted. IIRC,
> there was a fair amount of
> dark humour exhibited by some of the players (not Elisabeth, Goat),
> about the state of their
> bodily functions.
Eliza was on the Redemption Island Recap show on SuperPass after the last
Wednesday episode and Chelsia asked her about people getting sick from
eating so much food. Eliza said we probably only a saw a small part of just
how sick Natalie and Ashley got from their big feast. I wonder why they
don't show us some of this? In the past I can remember them showing us
people throwing up when they got sick so why not after they've pigged out?
> 2. The other incidence of scatological humour involved one of the
> players (Nick?) who apparently had
> developed a uniquely unpleasant odor. Somebody on the show (it may
> have been Nick himself) made a
> reference in confessional to (and I may have the wording wrong) the
> shelter smelling like ass.
I'm not surprised by that comment. I'd like to know how often they boil
their clothes to get them clean and get the smell out.
Brian
Brian Smith
news:14654-4DD...@storefull-3112.bay.webtv.net...
Your interpretation of "corrupting" makes sense to me. It doesn't for "pure"
though. "Pure" in this sense just doesn't sound game related to me. People
have said Natalie is naïve and innocent which relates to being pure and that
would appear to describe her personally better than her game play. But who
knows Rob meant.
Brian
Brian Smith
Are you saying Natalie isn't pure? Don't buy into the whore and porn talk!
Brian
Seapig
You may be right. Rob expressed concern that she had made more
friends on the other tribe than anybody else. We didn't really get to
see that, but it may have been true. The jury probably would have
been impressed by her IC wins. But, they didn't know that she needed
to win them, like we did, so they might not have been as impressed as
we were. She would have made better arguments to the jury than
Natalie and Phillip did, because a trained bird would have better
arguments to the jury than Natalie and Phillip did. Unless the bird
was trained by Natalie or Phillip.
If the odds were closer to your guess than mine, that's even more of a
reason for why Rob didn't owe it to Natalie to take Ashley to the F3.
Brian Smith
Rob definitely would have taken Ashley over Andrea. Andrea was a powerhouse
and easily had the best relations with the jury out of the four of them. I
don't think Andrea would have won but it would have been close. With Ashley
at the end I think it still would have been 8-1-0 with Ashley getting
Ralph's vote. Even though Ashley did turn it on at the end she would have
had a very hard time separating herself from Natalie. For example, if
Natalie was lazy then so was Ashley because they spent so much together just
lying around.
Brian
zeppo
>
> Last time I heard the word 'pure' on Survivor was 21 seasons ago -
> thank you Ms. Haskell!
Refresh my memory Goat! Did Colleen use the word, or did somebody
else use it to describe her?
Brian Smith
In an interview Ashley said she didn't talk much to the others (non-alliance
members) but when she did she felt they were good conversations. Both Rob
and Natalie have said they didn't talk much to others at all other than just
casual conversation. So Ashley probably did have more "friends" on the other
tribe but I don't think that was nearly enough for her to have done any
better than Phillip did.
Brian
zeppo
>
> Rob definitely would have taken Ashley over Andrea. Andrea was a powerhouse
> and easily had the best relations with the jury out of the four of them. I
> don't think Andrea would have won but it would have been close. With Ashley
> at the end I think it still would have been 8-1-0 with Ashley getting
> Ralph's vote. Even though Ashley did turn it on at the end she would have
> had a very hard time separating herself from Natalie. For example, if
> Natalie was lazy then so was Ashley because they spent so much together just
> lying around.
Agreed! Except Ralph still would have voted for Phillip :-)
The Horny Goat
wrote:
>1. At one point in the S2 game, one of the tribes, or maybe it was
>after the merge, won a big
>food reward. Of course, they all over-indulged which resulted in a
>number of players needing
>to vomit, or squat behind trees, on a repeated basis. This incident
>may actually be the one that
>Jerri was referring to in the interview that Brian posted. IIRC,
>there was a fair amount of
>dark humour exhibited by some of the players (not Elisabeth, Goat),
>about the state of their
>bodily functions.
Rodger: "My leaf has a hole in it!"
>2. The other incidence of scatological humour involved one of the
>players (Nick?) who apparently had
>developed a uniquely unpleasant odor. Somebody on the show (it may
>have been Nick himself) made a
>reference in confessional to (and I may have the wording wrong) the
>shelter smelling like ass.
>
I'm pretty sure the one whose odor was complained about was Kimmie
Kappenburg
UCLAN
The Horny Goat
wrote:
>On May 23, 1:00 pm, The Horny Goat <lcra...@home.ca> wrote:
We're talking about the original "America's Sweetheart" as opposed to
my lady who only came along in season two.
No further elaboration should be required - not even by Rob Lowe!
do...@webtv.net
zeppo said that he didn't see Ashley winning...even if she made F3.
Well...she would have won a few tough II's...and bickered enough during
the season that she would be looked at as a girl who came up big at the
end.
do...@webtv.net
zeppo told us about early scatological humor...
"...what Jerri was referring to in the interview that Brian posted.
IIRC, there was a fair amount of
dark humour exhibited by some of the players (not Elisabeth, Goat),
about the state of their
bodily functions. "
Certainly not the sainted E-BETH.
Her stool comes out hermetically sealed in Saran Wrap.
Right goat?
do...@webtv.net
About the shelter 'smelling like a--'...Brian said:
"I'm not surprised by that comment. I'd like to know how often they boil
their clothes to get them clean and get the smell out."
I would think that they get new rag clothes...except for the washables
like Phils' pink panties.