Tai Would Have Been Voted Out If He Had Saved Scot According to Jeff

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

We finally have confirmation that if someone uses their HII to create a super idol and receives votes that they are not safe. Dalton asked Jeff what would have happened if Tai had saved Scot.

Just so everyone is clear, had the Super Idol been used by Scot, then the next two highest people with votes were Tai and Aubry, with two apiece. So what would have happened next?

Well, first you have to remember that Tai voted for Scot, so he was never going to use the idol to save him. He betrayed him the moment he wrote his name down. So if Tai had used the idol to save Scot after voting for Scot it would rival the worst move in Survivor history! But yes, if he did use the idol, regardless the circumstances, then Scot is safe. Then, everybody except Tai and Aubry would vote again and they could only vote for Tai or Aubry. Tai would have been voted out and would still be in therapy trying to figure out what happened.

Source: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/04/21/survivor-jeff-probst-kaoh-rong-super-idol

Jeff's response and one of the bonus clips show how important editing was to making the last episode so good. If they had show all of Tai and Aubry's talk, and Tai casting his vote, there would have been very little suspense for us watching TC.

Jeff's tease for next week from the same interview.

We are getting close to the home stretch here, so tease us up for next week's episode.

I think you saw a taste of it tonight. Loyalty. There have been so many different, fractured alliances. Now more than any other point in the game, you are looking for people you can trust, if only for one vote.

The only big thing I get out of that tease at the moment is that the medevac doesn't take place next week.

--
Brian

[Ron]

On 4/24/2016 1:07 AM, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:
> We finally have confirmation that if someone uses their HII to create
> a super idol and receives votes that they are not safe. Dalton asked
> Jeff what would have happened if Tai had saved Scot.
>
> Just so everyone is clear, had the Super Idol been used by Scot, then
> the next two highest people with votes were Tai and Aubry, with two
> apiece. So what would have happened next?
>
> Well, first you have to remember that Tai voted for Scot, so he was
> never going to use the idol to save him. He betrayed him the moment
> he wrote his name down. So if Tai had used the idol to save Scot
> after voting for Scot it would rival the worst move in Survivor
> history! But yes, if he did use the idol, regardless the
> circumstances, then Scot is safe. Then, everybody except Tai and
> Aubry would vote again and they could only vote for Tai or Aubry. Tai
> would have been voted out and would still be in therapy trying to
> figure out what happened.

Don't know why we would need confirmation. The girlfriend and I
discussed this right after the episode. Scot KNEW that Tai had already
voted for him, so why would he give him the idol, Tai would have put
himself at risk of being voted out on the revote. It was pretty cut and
dry for us.

[Karen M]

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 10:07:22 PM UTC-7, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:
> We finally have confirmation that if someone uses their HII to create a super idol and receives votes that they are not safe. Dalton asked Jeff what would have happened if Tai had saved Scot.
>
> Just so everyone is clear, had the Super Idol been used by Scot, then the next two highest people with votes were Tai and Aubry, with two apiece. So what would have happened next?
>
> Well, first you have to remember that Tai voted for Scot, so he was never going to use the idol to save him. He betrayed him the moment he wrote his name down. So if Tai had used the idol to save Scot after voting for Scot it would rival the worst move in Survivor history! But yes, if he did use the idol, regardless the circumstances, then Scot is safe. Then, everybody except Tai and Aubry would vote again and they could only vote for Tai or Aubry. Tai would have been voted out and would still be in therapy trying to figure out what happened.

Interesting. I wonder how it would have worked if Scot had handed Tai the idol in his possession with the intent that Tai would then hand over the Super Idol to Jeff--but Tai 'changes his mind' about playing his idol and is left holding both of them. Kosher? Does he then get to keep both idols? Does his name suddenly appear on the list of most reviled players ever?

Karen

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

I meant confirmation that the super idol power still didn't protect the original holders as well as the person saved. When this was first announced a lot of people thought it was a lot more powerful than it turned out to be.

Where are you getting that Scot KNEW that Tai had voted for him? I've seen no indication that Scot knew. This wasn't cut and dried at all. If it was there wouldn't be so much confusion about it.

--
Brian

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

Who knows? They've never made it clear if the person being saved is the one who has to be in possession of the two HIIs. I think they do. Before the vote is read Tai or Jason could have used one of their HIIs on Scot to save him. In hindsight Jason probably wishes he had done that because either way he was going to lose his HII.

--
Brian

[The Horny Goat]

On Sat, 23 Apr 2016 22:07:21 -0700 (PDT), dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>We finally have confirmation that if someone uses their HII to create a super idol and receives votes that they are not safe. Dalton asked Jeff what would have happened if Tai had saved Scot.
>
>Just so everyone is clear, had the Super Idol been used by Scot, then the next two highest people with votes were Tai and Aubry, with two apiece. So what would have happened next?
>
>Well, first you have to remember that Tai voted for Scot, so he was never going to use the idol to save him. He betrayed him the moment he wrote his name down. So if Tai had used the idol to save Scot after voting for Scot it would rival the worst move in Survivor history! But yes, if he did use the idol, regardless the circumstances, then Scot is safe. Then, everybody except Tai and Aubry would vote again and they could only vote for Tai or Aubry. Tai would have been voted out and would still be in therapy trying to figure out what happened.
>
>Source: http://www.ew.com/article/2016/04/21/survivor-jeff-probst-kaoh-rong-super-idol

What I would love to know is whether Tai had figured this out at
Tribal Council - or whether Scot had this explained to him at
Ponderosa.

I suspect Scot might be a bit more forgiving if he knew Tai could have
given him the super idol and then himself been voted out.

[shawn]

On Sun, 24 Apr 2016 09:21:58 -0700, The Horny Goat <lcr...@home.ca>
wrote:

Yes, this revalation changes the way I view the super idol. It's
definitely not as powerful as it seemed before. If they wanted to keep
the trio safe Tai and Scott would have had to play both idols as
individual idols and then Aubrey would have been eliiminated.

So the Super Idol is great at protecting a individual but it can't
really keep an alliance safe unless they already have the numbers so
they can control the vote.

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

This was way more complicated than most people thought. Even Parv said she was confused in the podcast she cohosts for ET Canada. The power of the super idol and how it works were never made clear to us and this past episode shows why. If we knew how it worked there would have been no blindside of us which I think they also wanted.

My opinion on the super idol has changed completely after that episode. I thought it was too powerful at first but now that I know how it works I like it. There's a lot of strategy behind it's use and a lot of trust in people as well. Unless you have the numbers and more importantly can trust those numbers, this is a dangerous power. Jason and Scot got cocky and got burned.

--
Brian

[zeppo]

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 10:07:22 PM UTC-7, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>

> Well, first you have to remember that Tai voted for Scot, so he was never going to use the idol to save him. He betrayed him the moment he wrote his name down. So if Tai had used the idol to save Scot after voting for Scot it would rival the worst move in Survivor history! But yes, if he did use the idol, regardless the circumstances, then Scot is safe. Then, everybody except Tai and Aubry would vote again and they could only vote for Tai or Aubry. Tai would have been voted out and would still be in therapy trying to figure out what happened.

I agree with Probst's conclusion that Tai would have been booted on the re-vote.
Joe, Cyd, and likely Julia and Michelle would have vote for him. Jason and Scott
would have probably kept their votes on Aubry.

>
> Jeff's tease for next week from the same interview.
>

I never read Probst's teases as I consider them to be spoilers. But aren't
we getting to the point in the season when the dreaded "loved ones" should
be making their appearance?

[darrell...@gmail.com]

I don't think MB leaves anything to chance. He does dry-runs on every challenge. Stand ins are used in setting up shots.

I'd bet he did dry-run scenarios on the Super Idol as well. How else would he formulate policies and procedures on game play⁉️

[zeppo]

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 11:01:18 PM UTC-7, Ron wrote:

Scot KNEW that Tai had already
> voted for him, so why would he give him the idol,

In one of his exit interviews, Scot said that he was completely surprised by the
number of votes that he got, and did not have time to work out where they had
come from. His only concern was getting Tai's half of the idol as a way of saving himself.
It was only as he walked down the trail to the doctor's tent, that he understood that
Tai had betrayed him twice.

[zeppo]

On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 7:48:27 AM UTC-7, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>
> Who knows? They've never made it clear if the person being saved is the one who has to be in possession of the two HIIs. I think they do.

You're right.

Before the vote is read Tai or Jason could have used one of their HIIs on Scot to save him. In hindsight Jason probably wishes he had done that because either way he was going to lose his HII.

Jason had already done so by giving Scot his half of the idol prior to the vote. Jason
no longer had a HII, but he did have immunity earned at the IC. The plan was for all
three of them to be protected from being voted out. Jason could not be voted for, and
if either Tai or Scot received the most votes, the player with the lesser number would
give his half of the idol to the other.

[zeppo]

On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 9:34:18 AM UTC-7, shawn wrote:
idual idols and then Aubrey would have been eliiminated.
>
> So the Super Idol is great at protecting a individual but it can't
> really keep an alliance safe unless they already have the numbers so
> they can control the vote.

If an alliance is threatening to use two combined idols to keep all of them
safe, the way to beat that strategy is to split the votes evenly between
two or three members of the alliance, However, as you said, the players
outside of the alliance need to have the number of votes to do so.

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 1:02:46 PM UTC-6, darrell...@gmail.com wrote:
> I don't think MB leaves anything to chance. He does dry-runs on every challenge. Stand ins are used in setting up shots.
>
> I'd bet he did dry-run scenarios on the Super Idol as well. How else would he formulate policies and procedures on game play⁉️

They can change and make up rules on the fly so it's not a given they did extensive testing. Other twists have failed because they didn't think them through. Jeff has said so himself.

--
Brian

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

Or get one of the alliance members to turn like Aubry did with Tai. These so-called super powers are now 0 for 3 in terms of helping out the holders. Dan and Stephen got voted out when using theirs and Jason lost his HII and Scot got voted out. If I was playing in S33 or S34 I think I wouldn't even bother to go for an advantage--too risky to use!

--
Brian

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

We should be close to the "loved ones" visit. Doesn't sound like it's next week as the preview always plays it up. I'd say the week after when there's six people left. Have they ever done it with just five people left?

--
Brian

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

Scot's also said that they planned on getting rid of Tai and that Julia was their real F3. I'd like to know if Aubry made that clear to Tai as well?

--
Brian

[zeppo]

On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 1:01:22 PM UTC-7, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>
> Scot's also said that they planned on getting rid of Tai and that Julia was their real F3. I'd like to know if Aubry made that clear to Tai as well?

Scot has said a lot of things since his boot, some of them contradictory. Brian, did he
provide any rational for his choice of Julia as a F3 partner rather than Tai?

[dcg_...@hotmail.com]

Not precisely but it sounded like he and Jason thought Tai was a lot harder to beat than Julia. No idea if he meant Tai was more popular or he played a better game than Julia or if he thought Julia was more trustworthy. Based on the edit alone I don't recall them showing any signs of wanting to dump Tai before the end other than telling Julia she was there F3.

--
Brian

[Elmo P. Shagnasty]

On 2016-04-24 19:43:10 +0000, dcg_...@hotmail.com said:

>> I don't think MB leaves anything to chance. He does dry-runs on every
>> challenge. Stand ins are used in setting up shots.>> I'd bet he did
>> dry-run scenarios on the Super Idol as well. How else would he
>> formulate policies and procedures on game play⁉️
>
> They can change and make up rules on the fly

oh, man, you're going to incur the wrath of Kenny with that one.

[Ron]

OK, my bad for thinking he would have processed that right after the
votes were read.

[Ron]

I never thought it would save the person giving up his or her half of
the idol. Had Tai given it to Scot before going to TC then why would Tai
also be saved? What if Jason had never given Tai (the original holder)
his half back? Would people still think that Tai would be saved?

>
> Where are you getting that Scot KNEW that Tai had voted for him? I've
> seen no indication that Scot knew. This wasn't cut and dried at all.
> If it was there wouldn't be so much confusion about it.

I thought he would have figured it out right after the votes were read.
But after reading another post I see it took him a few minutes after TC
to process it.

[Karen M]

On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 11:52:19 AM UTC-7, dcg_...@hotmail.com wrote:

>
> This was way more complicated than most people thought.

Not really.

To protect himself, an idol holder has to play an idol before votes are counted.

After votes are counted, TWO idol holders (or one player with both, I suppose) can play both idols to save the boot-ee.

That saved player could be one of the idol holders or anyone else.

It would be illogical to assume that a single potentially-super-idol could be played to save the holder AFTER votes are counted to save the holder--he had his chance BEFORE the count and opted not to take it. Never has it been stated that the Super Idol protects both the holders and the player they choose to save.

I would think that Tai knew that handing his idol to Scot to play in combination with Jason's would have been sacrificing himself. Tai may be a bit eccentric, but he's not stupid.

> Jason and Scot got cocky and got burned.
>

And who didn't see that coming?


Karen

[Ron]

You wrote exactly what I'm saying, but much more eloquently.

It's was pretty much common sense to me about how the idol(s) could be
played.

[Elmo P. Shagnasty]

On 2016-04-25 03:17:37 +0000, Karen M said:

> To protect himself, an idol holder has to play an idol before votes are
> counted.
> After votes are counted, TWO idol holders (or one player with both, I
> suppose) can play both idols to save the boot-ee.
> That saved player could be one of the idol holders or anyone else.
> It would be illogical to assume that a single potentially-super-idol
> could be played to save the holder AFTER votes are counted to save the
> holder--he had his chance BEFORE the count and opted not to take it.
> Never has it been stated that the Super Idol protects both the holders
> and the player they choose to save.

Frankly, I don't think the producers expected it to play out like it did.

But I think the viewers here are missing what you pointed out--the
possibility of one player with two idols.

Anyway, there's no reason not to continue to play the super idol thing again.

[Karen M]

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 3:18:04 AM UTC-7, Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:

>
> Frankly, I don't think the producers expected it to play out like it did.

I'm sure that the possibility that one idol-holder wouldn't be willing to sacrifice his idol to save someone else had to have been considered. That's the test--will he or won't he?

That the other idol would walk off in someone's pocket--again--well, that they probably didn't foresee.

>
> But I think the viewers here are missing what you pointed out--the
> possibility of one player with two idols.
>
> Anyway, there's no reason not to continue to play the super idol thing again.

Of course they should try it again--maybe it'll be used as intended.

Karen