[VOY] Cynics Corner Review: "Human Error"
David E. Sluss
O
R Star Trek: Voyager: "Human Error"
N as reviewed by David E. Sluss
E
R copyright (c) 2001 Tiger Bay Publishing
Spoilers ahead!
THE BOTTOM LINE: An episode that serves little purpose other than to
titillate and then to resoundingly reset itself.
CYNICS CORNER RATING: 5.0
TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE OF THE WEEK: It's a little late to be addressing
the effect "Unimatrix Zero" supposedly had on Seven, isn't it? Where
in the last fifteen episodes or so do we see any indication that Seven
has felt empty inside since Unimatrix Zero's destruction? Personally,
I think that setting this story up in "Workforce," in which Seven
existed with a more human identity for an extended period of time
would have been more satisfying (and certainly more timely).
BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers.
They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
that she won't be changed as a result, namely the cortical node's
heretofore unseen ability to hose down drones that begin to feel
emotions. Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?
Certainly not in episodes such as "Unity" and "Survival Instinct"
which featured ex-drones with emotions. And Seven herself has
experienced emotions, at least to an extent, in episodes such as
"Drone," "Retrospect," "Infinite Regress," and, at least as far as the
implant would notice, "Body and Soul." Then, of course, we have seen
repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
LAUGH LINE OF THE WEEK: Janeway: "I see no reason to alter course."
Say what? Subspace radiation and metallic debris don't make her think
twice about this area of space? I need to amend my court martial
papers...
CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: An alien weapons range; that's pretty kewl.
They must be pretty crummy weapons though, considering the number of
tests. And wasn't it thoughtful of them to put up a warning beacon,
one that couldn't be detected except by special technobabble scans?
POOR PERCEPTION OF THE WEEK: You would think that the Doctor would be
able to tell a real person from a hologram. In fairness though, it
was the Chakotay hologram whom the Doctor seemed to mistake
momentarily for the robotic real thing. Speaking of which...
MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: What "admirable qualities" does Chakotay have
that make him a suitable specimen for Seven's experiment? And why is
it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
Seven's Stud? I seem to recall that Seven had run down a short list
of dating prospects in "Someone To Watch Over Me," and I don't think
Chuckles was on it.
CONTINUITY GLITCH OF THE WEEK: I mean the other kind of continuity,
in this case an apparent F/X goof. Voyager's warp drive was out, but
when the ship was hit just before Seven got the "I trusted you and you
let me down" speech from Janeway, the visual showed the vessel at warp
with the stars streaking by. Oops!
NEXT WEEK: Inexplicably, reruns. It's not like UPN to air a new
Special Episode like "Q2" all by itself with no promotion...
--
// David E. Sluss (The Cynic) \\ // "I'm impatient with \\
//____ sluss%cynicscorner.org _____\\//__ stupidity. My people have __\\
\\ The Cynics Corner //\\ learned to live without it." //
\\ http://www.cynicscorner.org // \\ Klaatu //
Janet Smith
"David E. Sluss" <sl...@cynicscorner.gro> wrote in message
news:ilktatg5slqv70oie...@4ax.com...
> C Y N I C S
> O
> R Star Trek: Voyager: "Human Error"
> N as reviewed by David E. Sluss
> E
> R copyright (c) 2001 Tiger Bay Publishing
>
> Spoilers ahead!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
> build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
> that she won't be changed as a result, namely the cortical node's
> heretofore unseen ability to hose down drones that begin to feel
> emotions. Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?>
This is probably the dumbest move by the writers to date. Now are they going
to give us a lame excuse why the personalities of the rest of the crew never
develop?
>
> LAUGH LINE OF THE WEEK: Janeway: "I see no reason to alter course."
> Say what? Subspace radiation and metallic debris don't make her think
> twice about this area of space? I need to amend my court martial
> papers...
>
Great move. Chatokay and Janeway blame Seven for being too distracted to do
her job and for the resulting damage to the ship when it was Janway's
incompetence that got them into the mess in the first place.
Runner up laugh line: "I've made mistakes before." Of course, Janeway never
got hung up on the holodeck, has she?
> CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: An alien weapons range; that's pretty kewl.
> They must be pretty crummy weapons though, considering the number of
> tests. And wasn't it thoughtful of them to put up a warning beacon,
> one that couldn't be detected except by special technobabble scans?
>
Not to mention they were already in danger when it was discovered. Some
warning.
>
> MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: What "admirable qualities" does Chakotay have
> that make him a suitable specimen for Seven's experiment? And why is
> it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
> Seven's Stud? I seem to recall that Seven had run down a short list
> of dating prospects in "Someone To Watch Over Me," and I don't think
> Chuckles was on it.
I guess they were running low on unattached lead males.
Timo S Saloniemi
>C Y N I C S
>O
>R Star Trek: Voyager: "Human Error"
>N as reviewed by David E. Sluss
>E
>R copyright (c) 2001 Tiger Bay Publishing
>
>Spoilers ahead!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
>build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
>that she won't be changed as a result, namely the cortical node's
>heretofore unseen ability to hose down drones that begin to feel
>emotions. Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?
>Certainly not in episodes such as "Unity" and "Survival Instinct"
>which featured ex-drones with emotions. And Seven herself has
>experienced emotions, at least to an extent, in episodes such as
>"Drone," "Retrospect," "Infinite Regress," and, at least as far as the
>implant would notice, "Body and Soul." Then, of course, we have seen
>repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
>she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
>Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
Perhaps because she didn't have one, until she got that transplant from
Icheb?
>CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: An alien weapons range; that's pretty kewl.
>They must be pretty crummy weapons though, considering the number of
>tests. And wasn't it thoughtful of them to put up a warning beacon,
>one that couldn't be detected except by special technobabble scans?
Hey, that's how I'd protect my testing range. Using a beacon that
only my own ships know how to read would be the ideal way, providing
safety while not revealing the testing location to spies.
>POOR PERCEPTION OF THE WEEK: You would think that the Doctor would be
>able to tell a real person from a hologram. In fairness though, it
>was the Chakotay hologram whom the Doctor seemed to mistake
>momentarily for the robotic real thing.
Then again, the Doctor probably isn't blessed with too many "human"
senses. Most of his sensory gear is probably mounted on the walls
of the sickbay. I wouldn't wonder if he was somewhat less perceptive
than a human when roaming the holodecks or using his mobile emitter,
since he wouldn't have eyes, ears, or skin... One would think this
would have provided nice story material in a couple of occasions.
The same with Odo, really - that guy didn't have eyes, now did he?
He seemed to have sufficient sensing capabilities even when camouflaging
as part of the bulkhead, as in "The Siege". How come you could surprise
him by stalking behind his back, then (like in "Duet")?
>Speaking of which...
>
>MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: What "admirable qualities" does Chakotay have
>that make him a suitable specimen for Seven's experiment? And why is
>it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
>Seven's Stud? I seem to recall that Seven had run down a short list
>of dating prospects in "Someone To Watch Over Me," and I don't think
>Chuckles was on it.
Well, I guess it's the classic "He doesn't want to change me" thing.
Trying to change somebody would be too active a pursuit for this
gentleman.
Timo Saloniemi
galitz
>>able to tell a real person from a hologram. In fairness though, it
>>was the Chakotay hologram whom the Doctor seemed to mistake
>>momentarily for the robotic real thing.
>
> Then again, the Doctor probably isn't blessed with too many "human"
> senses. Most of his sensory gear is probably mounted on the walls
> of the sickbay. I wouldn't wonder if he was somewhat less perceptive
> than a human when roaming the holodecks or using his mobile emitter,
> since he wouldn't have eyes, ears, or skin... One would think this
> would have provided nice story material in a couple of occasions.
>
> The same with Odo, really - that guy didn't have eyes, now did he?
> He seemed to have sufficient sensing capabilities even when camouflaging
> as part of the bulkhead, as in "The Siege". How come you could surprise
> him by stalking behind his back, then (like in "Duet")?
I've idlelly wondered about these things myself. Even if the
mobile emitter had superior sensors than what is found in
sickbay, there should have been some sort of change that would
be noticable.
In fact, a TNG broached this subject to a small extant. The
episode (on recently here in SF) where Geordi is trapped on
some planet near the Neutral Zone with a Romulan. The planet
seems to have some magentic properties which would
have rendered Data inoperable and Gerodi's visor was both
an advantage, and a hindrance. A similar story line with
the Doctor (or a DS9 story with Odo) would have been welcome.
On the tecnical side, the mobile emitter may equipped with
all sorts of sensors:
- visual light
- ultraviolet radiation
- infrared
- other forms of radiation
However, how would his program be able to process that kind
of data... his program wasn't to interface with the mobile emitter.
OTOH, since the mobile emitter is actually Federation technology, it is possible
that the programmers of the Federation (23rd and whatever respective
centuries) actually employ some form of (warning: catch phrase here)
object orient programming principles. OOP would seem to be exactly
the right thing to use in this case, since you would want to periodically
update sensors in sickbay, or switch sensory systems in runtime.
OOP should make that fairly easy. Then again, I'm not really a programmer by trade.
As for Odo, who knows. The entire length of his body may have
biological sensors of any kind embedded in it. This would be a
great evolutionary leap forward, actually. The size of the
receptor and lens has something to do with what wavelengths of
light you can perceive. I believe it would be theortically
possible for a create of Odo's size to be able see in the
X-ray band. Then again, the act of shapeshifting should result
in some loss of sensory acuity.
Hmm... fascinating ideas.
-geoff
--
---------------------------------------------------
Geoff Galitz, gal...@uclink.berkeley.edu
Research Computing
College of Chemistry, UC Berkeley
---------------------------------------------------
The laws of physics can be a harsh mistress...
- Bender
Wickeddoll
"David E. Sluss" <sl...@cynicscorner.gro> wrote in message
news:ilktatg5slqv70oie...@4ax.com...
> O
> R Star Trek: Voyager: "Human Error"
> N as reviewed by David E. Sluss
> E
> R copyright (c) 2001 Tiger Bay Publishing
>
> Spoilers ahead!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> THE BOTTOM LINE: An episode that serves little purpose other than to
> titillate and then to resoundingly reset itself.
*nodding*
>
> CYNICS CORNER RATING: 5.0
Far, FAR too generous, IMO
>
> TOO LITTLE, TOO LATE OF THE WEEK: It's a little late to be addressing
> the effect "Unimatrix Zero" supposedly had on Seven, isn't it? Where
> in the last fifteen episodes or so do we see any indication that Seven
> has felt empty inside since Unimatrix Zero's destruction? Personally,
> I think that setting this story up in "Workforce," in which Seven
> existed with a more human identity for an extended period of time
> would have been more satisfying (and certainly more timely).
And that was a much more interesting foray into her emotions.
>
> BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers.
> They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
> build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
> that she won't be changed as a result, namely the cortical node's
> heretofore unseen ability to hose down drones that begin to feel
> emotions. Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?
> Certainly not in episodes such as "Unity" and "Survival Instinct"
> which featured ex-drones with emotions. And Seven herself has
> experienced emotions, at least to an extent, in episodes such as
> "Drone," "Retrospect," "Infinite Regress," and, at least as far as the
> implant would notice, "Body and Soul." Then, of course, we have seen
> repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
> she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
> Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
Because the chimps didn't think of it till now?
>
> LAUGH LINE OF THE WEEK: Janeway: "I see no reason to alter course."
> Say what? Subspace radiation and metallic debris don't make her think
> twice about this area of space? I need to amend my court martial
> papers...
LOL
>
> CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: An alien weapons range; that's pretty kewl.
> They must be pretty crummy weapons though, considering the number of
> tests. And wasn't it thoughtful of them to put up a warning beacon,
> one that couldn't be detected except by special technobabble scans?
:-)
>
> POOR PERCEPTION OF THE WEEK: You would think that the Doctor would be
> able to tell a real person from a hologram. In fairness though, it
> was the Chakotay hologram whom the Doctor seemed to mistake
> momentarily for the robotic real thing. Speaking of which...
>
> MYSTERY OF THE WEEK: What "admirable qualities" does Chakotay have
> that make him a suitable specimen for Seven's experiment? And why is
> it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
> Seven's Stud? I seem to recall that Seven had run down a short list
> of dating prospects in "Someone To Watch Over Me," and I don't think
> Chuckles was on it.
No kidding. I thought that was ridiculous, despite really liking
Beltran/Chakotay, myself. He was not a logical choice by any stretch, other
than that he's the best looking guy (for MY age group). I thought Harry was
a better choice for her.
>
> CONTINUITY GLITCH OF THE WEEK: I mean the other kind of continuity,
> in this case an apparent F/X goof. Voyager's warp drive was out, but
> when the ship was hit just before Seven got the "I trusted you and you
> let me down" speech from Janeway, the visual showed the vessel at warp
> with the stars streaking by. Oops!
I don't notice such things...
>
> NEXT WEEK: Inexplicably, reruns. It's not like UPN to air a new
> Special Episode like "Q2" all by itself with no promotion...
I'm not looking forward to THAT one. Bad enough we have to endure HIM, much
less the fruit of his loin.
Natalie, not a Q fan.
Arlie
>> THE BOTTOM LINE: An episode that serves little purpose other than to
titillate and then to resoundingly reset itself. <<
My feelings exactly.
>> Now where the hell has this feature been all these years? <<
Even if we assume it's a new innovation, and didn't apply until she got Icheb's
node...she was crying at the end of "Imperfection," and her new node didn't zap
her.
>> And why is
it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
Seven's Stud? <<
They found the perfect role for him: a robot, programmed by a drone.
-- Arlie
Boycott Fandom.com
http://www.fandomfightsback.com/news.html
Barry Margolin
tsal...@alpha.hut.fi (Timo S Saloniemi) wrote:
> >implant would notice, "Body and Soul." Then, of course, we have seen
> >repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
> >she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
> >Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
>
> Perhaps because she didn't have one, until she got that transplant from
> Icheb?
If it was Borg technology, shouldn't the collective have known about it,
and wouldn't that knowledge be in her brain, whether or not it had been
done to her?
--
Barry Margolin, bar...@alum.mit.edu
Genuity, Burlington, MA
David E. Sluss
>>Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?
>>Certainly not in episodes such as "Unity" and "Survival Instinct"
>>which featured ex-drones with emotions. And Seven herself has
>>experienced emotions, at least to an extent, in episodes such as
>>"Drone," "Retrospect," "Infinite Regress," and, at least as far as the
>>implant would notice, "Body and Soul." Then, of course, we have seen
>>repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
>>she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
>>Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
>
>Perhaps because she didn't have one, until she got that transplant from
>Icheb?
Hmm. Vert clever. Of course that doesn't account for any emotional
behavior Seven has exhibited since "Inperfection," particularly "Body
and Soul." And besides, unless the emotional failsafe technology was
created or assimilated by the Borg in the last four years, Seven would
either have had it or would have been aware of it. And then, of
course, "Imperfection" showed the cortical node as being a pretty
interchangable part; Icheb's and Seven's were presumably identical.
And even if this explanation washed, you can't possibly believe the
writers accounted for it...
William December Starr
David E. Sluss <sl...@cynicscorner.gro> said:
> CONTRIVANCE OF THE WEEK: An alien weapons range; that's pretty kewl.
> They must be pretty crummy weapons though, considering the number of
> tests.
Not necessarily. First you take a shot at a target drone that's just
sitting there. Then you take a shot at a target drone that's moving in
a straight line. Then at one that's following a curve, and then at one
that's zig-zagging, and then at one that's running a low-level evasion
routine, and the... and repeat for combinations of multiple targets,
some designated friendly, some neutral, some unknown, and at varieties
of ranges and simulated conditions...
> And wasn't it thoughtful of them to put up a warning beacon, one that
> couldn't be detected except by special technobabble scans?
Maybe something that Starfleet can only detect by special technobabble
means is, to _them_, as utterly perceptible as big red flags, flashing
lights and sirens?
Look on the bright side: at least the guys running the show didn't turn
out to be yet another batch of Hard-Headed Aliens. ("We've accidentally
wandered onto your firing range! Cease fire! Cease fire!" "No.")
-- William December Starr <wds...@panix.com>
Jay Pennington
>Spoilers ahead!
>BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers.
>They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
>build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
>that she won't be changed as a result,
Which really puzzles me. Okay, I can see how the writing staff of any
TV show would depend on reset buttons to prevent their characters
developing tangentially from a long-term arc they have planned, but
geez, we're down to the last few episodes here! Why the hell couldn't
Seven have "really" gotten some quarters, a uniform, some social
skills?
It's like they're too chickenshit to have anything interesting with
lasting effects happen without a "it was just a
dream/holodeck/alternate timeline" crutch.
-Jay Pennington
Treadw...@Iavoidspambigfoot.com
(remove "Iavoidspam" from address when emailing)
See the Star Wars Special Edition FAQs in Treadwell's Techdome!
http://users.leading.net/~datalore/starwars
Stephen Voss
> >They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
> >build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
> >that she won't be changed as a result,
>
> Which really puzzles me. Okay, I can see how the writing staff of any
> TV show would depend on reset buttons to prevent their characters
> developing tangentially from a long-term arc they have planned, but
> geez, we're down to the last few episodes here! Why the hell couldn't
> Seven have "really" gotten some quarters, a uniform, some social
> skills?
Considering that Janeway has her doing "duties" and expects her to be "on
duty"
, why the heck doesnt she have a uniform and why isnt she getting paid at
least
the same as a starfleet enlisted person?
At least have her as some sort of "crewman" or alternatively if you didnt
want
her with the status of an enlisted person(which would get her tiny bunks)
you might have her as a "Specialist/Warrant officer"
I know she doesnt do anything with romantic stuff, but why not just
casual
friendships? As far as I can tell the limiter only kicks in romantically
stressful situations.
She seems to be able to have arguments without it kicking in. It seems
she avoids casual friendships not because of any borg tech, but more
because of her own pyschological limitations namely : being socially
withdrawn,
often seeming shy.
Im surprised at this point the real Chakotay wouldnt try harder to
get Seven involved in social situations. I would think even if he
didnt have her come down, at least he would try and talk to her
about why she constantly avoids these situations.
David Johnston
>> Then again, Paris had already gone through Starfleet Academy successfully.
>> Even Torres had done that semi-successfully (she dropped out before an
>> almost inevitable successful graduation). Seven's case would better be
>> compared with those of the Maquis who never had had anything to do with
>> Starfleet before being whisked to Delta.
>>
>> Timo Saloniemi
>
>Well, what of that insipid Wesley? He went from acting impaired to acting
>ensign to field commissioned ensign.
But that was terribly, terribly wrong. Janeway may be bad at
personnel management, but nobody was as bad at it as Picard.
xyz
news:98sa2g$9p7$1...@nntp.hut.fi...
> In article <9vt2bt07r3287jf04...@4ax.com> Brian Thorn
<bst...@cox-internet.com> writes:
> >On Wed, 14 Mar 2001 22:58:55 -0500, Stephen Voss <vo...@gate.net>
> >wrote:
>
> >>At least have her as some sort of "crewman" or alternatively if you
didnt
> >>want her with the status of an enlisted person(which would get her tiny
bunks)
> >>you might have her as a "Specialist/Warrant officer"
> >
> >qualified than he.
Shammie
>Well, what of that insipid Wesley? He went from acting impaired to acting
>ensign to field commissioned ensign.
>
I thought Wil Wheaton did a good acting job with Wesley.
Julianna Feigl
<wicke...@nofeckingspamhotmail.com> wrote:
>No kidding. I thought that was ridiculous, despite really liking
>Beltran/Chakotay, myself. He was not a logical choice by any stretch, other
>than that he's the best looking guy (for MY age group). I thought Harry was
>a better choice for her.
Don't speak for an entire age group. Laura is close to you in age for
instance and he doesn't do a thing for her.
Julianna
--------
Tuvok:
The main reason to watch Voyager!
Julianna Feigl
>>> And why is
>it that Voyager-bashing Beltran of all people got cast in the role of
>Seven's Stud? <<
>
>They found the perfect role for him: a robot, programmed by a drone.
ROTFLOL!!!! I shouldn't have tea ready when reading the newsgroup...
(starts wiping monitor)
Brian Thorn
Johnston) wrote:
>But that was terribly, terribly wrong. Janeway may be bad at
>personnel management, but nobody was as bad at it as Picard.
And Janeway has far more justification for bending the rules. So far
as she knows, Voyager is still 30 years travel from Earth and
statistics indicate she'll lose a bunch more crewmembers in that time.
She should put both Seven and Icheb on the fast-track for "distance
learning" Starfleet Academy, and she probably should have kept those
Klingons aboard, too. She'll have a serious personnel shortage pretty
soon (although we all know Voyager gets home in another two months.)
Brian
xyz
news:20010316165536...@ng-fa1.aol.com...
dislike the überkid. Any überkid on Trek.
Brian Thorn
wrote:
>Then again, Paris had already gone through Starfleet Academy successfully.
You and Maureen said essentially the same thing, so here's a reply to
both of you...
Yes, that's true, I'd forgotten that. Still, field commissions are not
limited only to military academy graduates today, and one would expect
they wouldn't be in the Trek universe, either. Seven should probably
take the equivalent of Officers Candidate Course, probably taught by
Tuvok, and then automatically be commissioned a full Lieutenant (O-3),
as other highly-qualified candidates, such as Doctors and Lawyers
frequently are in today's military.
And I still say Seven is more qualified than Paris. She may not have
the Command training (neither does Paris, for all we've seen) but she
is easily the most qualified person on Voyager to be, say, Science
Officer.
I wonder if we'll see her running Engineering while B'ellana is on
Maternity Leave...
Brian
Kent Campbell
"Brian Thorn" <bst...@cox-internet.com> wrote in message
news:fp75bt8gd6kkedsoe...@4ax.com...
>
> And I still say Seven is more qualified than Paris. She may not have
> the Command training (neither does Paris, for all we've seen) but she
> is easily the most qualified person on Voyager to be, say, Science
> Officer.
Be kind, we've seen Paris in command a number of times, and
he's done a fine job. He's even acted as first officer for extended
periods, when two of the big three have been off the ship.
> I wonder if we'll see her running Engineering while B'ellana is on
> Maternity Leave...
We've already seen liquid-silver "Seven" in command of
engineering while liquid-silver "Torres" was going on her
honeymoon, in "Course: Oblivion". Granted, it wasn't actually
Seven, but everyone was behaving in a manner consistent with
their real counterparts. It's logical to assume that Janeway
would make the same decision that "Janeway" did.
-- Kent Campbell
ken...@indy.net
Helen & Bob
Shammie wrote:
So did I. The problem seems to be the character he portrayed was irritation
to many people, and they confused the actor with the part. Which tells me
that Mr. Wheaton did a damn good job of acting. Wesley Crusher was sort of a
Heinleinian character. He was competent. Being competent does arouse the ire
of many people.
Bob
Shammie
>> I thought Wil Wheaton did a good acting job with Wesley.
>>
>Well, OK, I guess he was competent for the most part. But it's so easy to
>dislike the überkid. Any überkid on Trek.
Here is a repost for both you and Bob of something from the TNG NG after a con
I recently attended up in Waterbuy, CT. Wil Wheaton, Denise Crosby, Gates
McFadden, and Brent Spiner were the Trek guests.
Title: The best part of the Con
Author: sham...@aol.comharemgrl (Shammie)
Date: 04 Mar 2001 16:22:43 GMT
By far the most stand-out, entertaining, enjoyable section of the entire event
that I attended yesterday at http://www.sfedora.com/waterbur.htm was....
I am not making this up, I am not trolling, I am not kidding:
Wil Wheaton!!! OMG, he RULES as a speaker/guest!
Before he even got on stage, the director of the event introduced him and
actually warned us, as if we were little children, now please be polite and
remember that this is Wil's first con appearance in 8 years because of bad
experiences of people not separating him from the Wesley Crusher character.
(Later on we found out that 8 years ago, he was not only booed on stage, but he
actually had death threats!!)
Well, there was no need for this warning whatsoever, because from the moment
this vivacious, hilarious, charismatic, 28-year-old cutie bounded on stage, he
had us in the palm of his hand!! I cannot begin to describe how absolutely
captured every single one of us was, we were laughing every other minute and he
was so engaging even when he wasn't being funny!! I am now a huge Wil Wheaton
fan and so are 300 other Trekkers that were there. We gave him a loud standing
ovation.
OK, just a few things that he talked about, but I can't possibly do justice to
capture the wonderful energy that exuded from him. Well, after he left TNG, he
left acting and moved to Kansas. "Not a good idea" he says. He said going from
LA, a 24-hour-a-day city to Topeka was like moving to a 78-minute city. He was
in the computer industry. "I am a geek. I'm extremely proud of that fact."
Well, then he left the computer business and went to drama school. He is
married about a year now with 2 step-kids (children of his wife), back in
entertainment, performing "sketch comedy" with a group. He is HiLARious.
He left Star Trek on what he thought were good terms, but he found out later
that apparently that wasn't the case. When he mentioned Rick Berman's name, he
stuck his finger down his throat in a gag-me gesture. He said it is very
unlikely that he'll be involved in any Star Trek ever again. He was not
satisfied with how they wrote him out, though. Said he wished he had gone out
in some shuttlecraft explosion. [pause] "Because it would have ensured my
return." LOL!
He talked about an Outer Limits ep that he did where he plays a bad guy and
drops a doomsday bomb on the world and destroys all of humanity. He said that
he thought that really balanced out all the times that Wesley saved the ship.
"So get off my back, huh?" We all cracked up big time.
He said he would have LOVED to have had a cameo in Galaxy Quest as a crazed fan
being right in the face of the kid telling him how much he hated him on the
show! ROFL! Man we laughed for several minutes.
Then he said, ooh, they should have had me back as the Traveler so I could go
to DS9 and make it interesting. hahaha we laughed, but some fan in a wheelchair
said hey for some of us who can't get out, DS9 was very comforting, or some
mumbo jumbo like that. Wil mumbles (so we can all hear him). "Note to self - no
more jokes about DS9, could get ugly."
When asked about all the negative letters etc against Wesley, he told us quite
frankly that it hurt a lot and he took it personally. He said he made the
mistake of trying to reason with people and get them to understand. He said
people would blame him, a 14-year-old, for some of his lines and actions,
instead of going to the writers. One time, he had some really pompous-sounding,
major technobabble stuff he had to say, and he actually called up TPTB begging
them please, PLEASE don't make me say that. I can only imagine the torment the
poor kid must have had to endure. :-((((( It just really struck me.
He talked about River Phoenix and what a junkie he was and got on a small soap
box about how any one of the people surrounding him could have saved him by
getting him go into rehab, but that they are all such ass-kissers in Hollywood
and *everything* but everything is about money.
Then he felt bad that he brought us all down, so he closed by telling us of his
fondest memory on TNG. They were all on the bridge shooting a scene where they
are getting bonked by the Borg. They were preparing to do the biggest "shake"
they had ever done, they were calling it an "eleven." Picard was supposed to
fall down. Wil was like No he's the captain, he can't fall down! And Stewart
didn't like it either. Anyway, the director yelled action and everyone started
shaking, Frakes falls out of his seat, Wil crashes into his console, Spiner is
jerking around, etc. Stewart apparently decides to have some fun and totally
spazzes out, crashing into everything, falling down, getting back up, crashing
into something else, spinning around, crashing into yet something else, falling
again, getting back up, etc etc, until finally he crashes into a wall that
falls down! Suddenly everyone is hushed because they all know it's gonna be at
least a four thousand dollar delay. So Wil quickly improvises with "Captain, we
have a hull breach!"
[pause]
"AND I SAVED THE DAY," announces Wil with his arms up in a victory position.
ROFLMAO. That was the end of his talk and we all jumped up to give him a
standing O.
TheFlinx
Shammie wrote in message <20010316165536...@ng-fa1.aol.com>...
xyz
Wish I could have been there.
Juli17
>less the fruit of his loin.
>
>Natalie, not a Q fan.
>
Speaking of the fruit of his loin (de Lancie's ,not Q's), Keegan de Lancie
looks very familiar. Has he been in another series? Or maybe he just has that
kind of face...
Julie
Timo S Saloniemi
If it was a post-"Scorpion" development, then probably not. Perhaps
emotions were found to be a severe weakness only after the Borg
learned of what had happened to the "Descent" drones, and this
only happened in "Scorpion" when the Borg managed to scan the
Voyager's database (nice coincidence - the "Descent" rogue Borg ship
is seen on a Borg display in "Scorpion", for the first time AFAIK)?
Or then the information was gained earlier, but internal bureaucracy
in the Collective delayed the response? Or perhaps the failsafe was
created when the Queen began to suspect that her subjects were doing
emotional things in Unimatrix Zero, and these suspicions arose well
after "Scorpion" but still before Icheb was equipped with the tech?
Timo Saloniemi
Kent Campbell
"Barry Margolin" <bar...@alum.mit.edu> wrote in message
news:barmar-F5DAA5....@nntp.ne.mediaone.net...
Not if the advancement in cortical nodes was made in the almost
three years between her separation from the Collective and Icheb's.
Which is entirely the point. If the Borg had the ability to upgrade
Seven's cortical node to behave in the manner described in
"Human Error" they would have done it when Seven was still a
drone. They didn't, as can be seen in a half-dozen Seven episodes
before "Imperfection" this year. "Human Error" was Seven's first
big bout with emotions since then. The Doctor specifically said the
fail-safe was programmed into her cortical node, which is exactly the
part she inherited from Icheb.
Remember, the Borg add others' biological and technological
distinctiveness to their own. Somewhere in that three years they
found a means to force drones to shut down in case of emotional
development. This is an obvious advancement that they would want
to implement, especially given episodes like TNG's "Descent" two-
parter and VOY's "Survival Instinct".
-- Kent Campbell
ken...@indy.net
Kent Campbell
"Stephen Voss" <vo...@gate.net> wrote in message
news:3AB03DFF...@gate.net...
>
> Considering that Janeway has her doing "duties" and expects her to be "on
> duty", why the heck doesnt she have a uniform and why isnt she getting
paid at
> least the same as a starfleet enlisted person?
Sheesh, do you even watch Star Trek? They don't get paid.
They DO get certain ship's resources, like replicator rations
and holodeck time. Clearly Seven HAS been earning a lot of
time on the holodeck, which she must've been accumulating,
given the amount of time she uses up in this episode.
> Im surprised at this point the real Chakotay wouldnt try harder to
> get Seven involved in social situations. I would think even if he
> didnt have her come down, at least he would try and talk to her
> about why she constantly avoids these situations.
I disagree. Chakotay certainly expressed his desire to have
Seven join the fun, but he has neither the friendship with her
to confront her on a personal level nor the authority as first
officer to confront her on a personal matter.
From his perspective, Seven can behave as anti-socially as
she wishes as long as it doesn't interfere with her duties.
When Janeway asked him why Seven wasn't at her post
(since as first officer he's the one who would've given her
permission to leave her post), Chakotay asked Janeway to
take the issue up with Seven. Obviously he recognizes
Janeway's personal relationship with Seven and sees that
Janeway would be more successful in asserting authority
over Seven as well as relating to her personally.
-- Kent Campbell
ken...@indy.net
Janet Smith
"Jay Pennington" <Treadw...@YOUKNOWWHATTODObigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:0cWr6.1689$e9.1...@news1.fdn.com...
> David E. Sluss <sl...@cynicscorner.gro> wrote:
>
> >Spoilers ahead!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers.
> >They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
> >build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
> >that she won't be changed as a result,
>
> Which really puzzles me. Okay, I can see how the writing staff of any
> TV show would depend on reset buttons to prevent their characters
> developing tangentially from a long-term arc they have planned, but
> geez, we're down to the last few episodes here! Why the hell couldn't
> Seven have "really" gotten some quarters, a uniform, some social
> skills?
>
quarters. More to the point, the writers aren't up the challenge of writing
characters who can actually grow.
Brian Thorn
wrote:
>Considering that Janeway has her doing "duties" and expects her to be "on
>duty" , why the heck doesnt she have a uniform and why isnt she getting paid at
>least the same as a starfleet enlisted person?
Apparently, Seven is getting "paid". How else did she accumulate so
much Holodeck Priviledge Time?
Also, Janeway did make a point of saying "while the ship is on alert"
when she complained that Seven wasn't on duty. During normal
operations, Seven may be free to work whatever hours she chooses, as
is Neelix. But when the ship is on alert, as it was after Voyager
strayed into the Firing Range, all personnel should be at their
designated locations, be they passengers, crew, or quasi-crew.
Note also that in the critical situations in "Year of Hell", Neelix
wore a Starfleet uniform but Seven didn't. Neelix wanted one and
apparently got it. Seven by all accounts hasn't wanted one until
recently.
>At least have her as some sort of "crewman" or alternatively if you didnt
>want her with the status of an enlisted person(which would get her tiny bunks)
>you might have her as a "Specialist/Warrant officer"
Nah, she could get a Field Commission, same as Paris. She's much more
qualified than he.
Brian
Timo S Saloniemi
>wrote:
>>At least have her as some sort of "crewman" or alternatively if you didnt
>>want her with the status of an enlisted person(which would get her tiny bunks)
>>you might have her as a "Specialist/Warrant officer"
>
>Nah, she could get a Field Commission, same as Paris. She's much more
>qualified than he.
Then again, Paris had already gone through Starfleet Academy successfully.
Shammie
>>I thought Wil Wheaton did a good acting job with Wesley.
>>
>Anybody notice Shammie falls for every Trek male she sees live?
Not quite, wrong-breath.
Helen & Bob
Shammie wrote:
> From: "xyz"
>
> >> I thought Wil Wheaton did a good acting job with Wesley.
> >>
> >Well, OK, I guess he was competent for the most part. But it's so easy to
> >dislike the überkid. Any überkid on Trek.
>
> Here is a repost for both you and Bob of something from the TNG NG after a con
> I recently attended up in Waterbuy, CT. Wil Wheaton, Denise Crosby, Gates
> McFadden, and Brent Spiner were the Trek guests.
> snippity snip.
Thanks, Sammie. That was a very interesting post. I am NOT a "con" attendee, but
from what you have said, I think I would have liked to have heard his speech.
Bob
Shammie
> I am NOT a "con" atten=
>dee, but
>from what you have said, I think I would have liked to have heard his spe=
>ech.
You don't know what you are missing. You should really go to one sometime, I
think you will be surprised at how much fun you will have. Just mingling with
hundreds of fellow Trekkers alone is worth it.
TheFlinx
Shammie wrote in message <20010317103905...@ng-bj1.aol.com>...
Oh come on, I saw you sneaking into Armin Shimmerman's room in DC!
Shammie
>>>Anybody notice Shammie falls for every Trek male she sees live?
>>
>>Not quite, wrong-breath.
>Oh come on, I saw you sneaking into Armin Shimmerman's room in DC!
>
He told me he was gonna show me his Latinum bar! I had to see that...
TC
Did you see it!!! kewl
xyz
And to think mine is twice the size! And also gold pressed!
Who's going to pay attention to my Lobes!!
Tony Midyett
Spoilers ahead!
BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers. They
create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but build
right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees that she
won't be changed as a result,
Which really puzzles me. Okay, I can see how the writing staff of any TV
show would depend on reset buttons to prevent their characters
developing tangentially from a long-term arc they have planned, but
geez, we're down to the last few episodes here! Why the hell couldn't
Seven have "really" gotten some quarters, a uniform, some social skills?
lasting effects happen without a "it was just a dream/holodeck/alternate
timeline" crutch.
-Jay Pennington
Treadw...@Iavoidspambigfoot.com
(remove "Iavoidspam" from address when emailing)
See the Star Wars Special Edition FAQs in Treadwell's Techdome!
http://users.leading.net/~datalore/starwars >>>>>>>>
Tony Midyett responds:
You said a mouthful, brother! This episode reeks of wimpiness. We're
nearing the end---shake things up!
I didn't expect any shake-ups in the status quo during TNG's final
season, since I knew that the movies were upcoming. DS9 wrapped up
while TNG movies were still being made, plus the Dominion Arc was just
that--an arc. Closure for the DS9 characters was anticipated and
received. Now look at VOY's 7th season---except for Tom and B'Elanna,
where have the status-shaking events/storylines been? TPTB _might_ use
VOY cast members in post-TNG movies, but that's a longshot, at best.
Besides, if they do use VOY characters in a future film, they'll use the
"stars", not the short-shrift (i.e., criminally under-used) guys like
Harry, Neelix, and Tuvok.
Would it really be so bad for Seven to have everyone call her Annika?
Or for the EMH to get a name? Or for Harry to get another pip? Sigh!
I had a wantlist for DS9's finale, and with the exception of Bajor's not
joining the UFP, every item on it was filled. If I get _one_ thing on
my VOY list, I'll be shocked/stunned. If only they'd let me write the
damn things! :):):):)
Tony Midyett
tsbr...@gmail.com
> In article <ilktatg5slqv70oie...@4ax.com> David E. Sluss <sl...@cynicscorner.gro> writes:
> >C Y N I C S
> >O
> >R Star Trek: Voyager: "Human Error"
> >N as reviewed by David E. Sluss
> >E
> >R copyright (c) 2001 Tiger Bay Publishing
> >Spoilers ahead!
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >BUILT-IN RESET BUTTON OF THE WEEK: Pretty clever, these writers.
> >They create a story in which Seven gets to explore her emotions, but
> >build right into the resolution a bit of techno-B.S. that guarantees
> >heretofore unseen ability to hose down drones that begin to feel
> >emotions. Now where the hell has this feature been all these years?
> >Certainly not in episodes such as "Unity" and "Survival Instinct"
> >which featured ex-drones with emotions. And Seven herself has
> >experienced emotions, at least to an extent, in episodes such as
> >"Drone," "Retrospect," "Infinite Regress," and, at least as far as the
> >repeatedly that Seven knows all about Borg drone technology; indeed,
> >she knows everything the collective knows, according to "Day of
> >Honor." So why wouldn't she know about the emotional failsafe?
>
> Perhaps because she didn't have one, until she got that transplant from
> Icheb?