Nate v. Brenda: Am I the only one....
Moe Hailstone
episodes have led the audience to despise Brenda and engender sympathy for
Nate for being saddled with her. But...tonight, when they went head to head,
who was the most honest, the most devastatingly self-critical--the most
real? Nate had his justifiable initial reaction, but he refused to look at
his own behavior, whereas Brenda looked at herself and relayed what she saw,
no matter how ugly it was--"I fucked you right off the plane, that's what I
am." She looked truly crushed when Nate left her.
Nate has lead a life of running away from others, not much different than
the cancer patient he has "adopted". He probably feels noble about this
"adoption", but he has chosen to commit himself to someone who will be gone
for good in days, a few weeks at most. While he admires the idea of more
permanent commitment in others (Brenda's parents, for example), he never
chooses it for himself, even hiding from his mother that she is about to be
grandmother, as that would commit him to another role that he could not flee
easily.
Brenda is truly disturbed, but she is honest with herself, if not others.
Nate is buried in a long-spun web of avoiding such hard truths about
himself. An interesting couple indeed. And 6FU has given us a very subtly
drawn portrait of them.
Moe Hailstone
a much slower acting poison in his own way. He'd be no gift in his present
state, either.
"Shammie" <sham...@aol.comharemgrl> wrote in message
news:20020519225508...@mb-fw.aol.com...
> >From: "Moe Hailstone"
>
> >who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever?
>
> It was awesome!
> Good riddance to that BAGGAGE TRAIN named Brenda. It's not that I want her
> character off the show, I'm just glad for Nate, she's way too high
maintenance.
> She's just never any fun anymore, never a light-hearted humorous moment.
She
> has become so heavy in her self-involvement that, while I can follow your
logic
> regarding her, I can't agree with it. It only looks good on
> paper...er...monitor.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Moe Hailstone
> True, too. But if you had to choose...
Well, I'd choose the one with a pussy, but hey, I biased that way....
Liam Devlin
> who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever? The past several
> episodes have led the audience to despise Brenda and engender sympathy for
> Nate for being saddled with her. But...tonight, when they went head to head,
> who was the most honest, the most devastatingly self-critical--the most
> real? Nate had his justifiable initial reaction, but he refused to look at
> his own behavior, whereas Brenda looked at herself and relayed what she saw,
> no matter how ugly it was--"I fucked you right off the plane, that's what I
> am." She looked truly crushed when Nate left her.
>
> Nate has lead a life of running away from others, not much different than
> the cancer patient he has "adopted". He probably feels noble about this
> "adoption", but he has chosen to commit himself to someone who will be gone
> for good in days, a few weeks at most. While he admires the idea of more
> permanent commitment in others (Brenda's parents, for example), he never
> chooses it for himself, even hiding from his mother that she is about to be
> grandmother, as that would commit him to another role that he could not flee
> easily.
>
> Brenda is truly disturbed, but she is honest with herself,
Sorry, dude, don't agree with this at all. Brenda has all the insight of
a rhino in heat.
Moe Hailstone
explanation why she did what she did--she wishes she knew. Meanwhile, for
his own indiscretion, Nate offers up his brain disorder as a lame excuse,
blah blah blah--he was afraid; meanwhile, he shared his knowledge of this
condition with Lisa (whom he knew would be leaving in a couple of days) but
not Brenda until much later, and then really without any choice.
Also recall his out-of-left field accusation that Brenda might have fucked
her brother. Where does this come from?--not her novel. This is an original
Nate thought, and it is not pretty.
Alan Ball & Co. are very clever folks. They have built the paradigm for the
audience to swallow (willingly) that Brenda is horribly damaged and
maladjusted (true enough) and that Nate is being victimized by her. Now they
are shifting things perceptibly--the focus is on the consequences of Nate's
actions, his inability to commit, etc. If you watch carefully they are
building the case that he's just as poisonous as Brenda, just in a way that
has always allowed him a comfortable degree of self-denial. In the real
world you can spot the Brendas of the world from a mile away, and steer
clear if you wish (some people like to play with fire, however). The Nates
of the world, they are the real trouble, because you can easily fall for
their nice guy/girl exterior and genuine good intentions--but if you allow
yourself to fall for them, you'll regret it.
"Liam Devlin" <Lia...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:3CE88436...@optonline.net...
Liam Devlin
> Watch this part again.
I didn't see the 5/19 episode. I'll catch it Monday night & maybe I'll
understand then.
> Notice how Brenda, in anguish, says she has no
> explanation why she did what she did--she wishes she knew. Meanwhile, for
> his own indiscretion, Nate offers up his brain disorder as a lame excuse,
> blah blah blah--he was afraid; meanwhile, he shared his knowledge of this
> condition with Lisa (whom he knew would be leaving in a couple of days) but
> not Brenda until much later, and then really without any choice.
>
> Also recall his out-of-left field accusation that Brenda might have fucked
> her brother. Where does this come from?--not her novel. This is an original
> Nate thought, and it is not pretty.
This sounds like a throwback to last season in the episode in which Nate
& Brenda were supposed to get out of LA for the weekend. Billy went off
his meds and "needed Brenda's eyes" to look at some of his photos for
his upcoming show, which torpedoed their weekend. Nate asked Brenda what
was going on with Billy and Brenda came back with "What, you think I
slept with my brother?". In a flashback from the next episode, this
scene went on a moment longer so we could hear Brenda say "I didn't".
I certainly suspected last year that Billy & Brenda had had sexual
relations.
> Alan Ball & Co. are very clever folks. They have built the paradigm for the
> audience to swallow (willingly) that Brenda is horribly damaged and
> maladjusted (true enough) and that Nate is being victimized by her. Now they
> are shifting things perceptibly--the focus is on the consequences of Nate's
> actions, his inability to commit, etc. If you watch carefully they are
> building the case that he's just as poisonous as Brenda, just in a way that
> has always allowed him a comfortable degree of self-denial. In the real
> world you can spot the Brendas of the world from a mile away, and steer
> clear if you wish (some people like to play with fire, however). The Nates
> of the world, they are the real trouble, because you can easily fall for
> their nice guy/girl exterior and genuine good intentions--but if you allow
> yourself to fall for them, you'll regret it.
So you disagree with Brenda's comment from last season that it's easy to
read Nate: mid 30's, been cruising on his looks but is getting worried,
good for a fast fuck but nothing more?
Thanks for such a long, thoughtful post.
Jana
> Watch this part again. Notice how Brenda, in anguish, says she has no
> explanation why she did what she did--she wishes she knew. Meanwhile, for
> his own indiscretion, Nate offers up his brain disorder as a lame excuse,
> blah blah blah--he was afraid; meanwhile, he shared his knowledge of this
> condition with Lisa (whom he knew would be leaving in a couple of days) but
> not Brenda until much later, and then really without any choice.
>
of made it seem that she did what she did to get back at him for the
baby. Well, guess what, they weren't engaged when he went to Seattle
to the best of my memory. She WAS engaged when she was with Stoner
Tall and Stoner Short. Nate isn't without any blame, but this chick is
bad news and sadly, I don't think they are over. She can say how much
she loves him and she was hurting and after his speech from Bernard on
forgiveness, he'll give it a try -- unknowing all the other stuff
she's been up to. Margaret is right -- she's so negative. She's a
total downer to be around. She's loathsome and I despise people that
make excuses for their adult behavior because of their upbringing....
nobody has it perfect coming up in this world. Sure, she's had a
bizarre childhood, but it is time to take responsibility for the grown
up woman that she is. She is messed up, but he doesn't need to saddle
himself with her forever because he had sex with her straight off the
plane and that's just who she is.... @@
Robert Wade
"Jana" <ja...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:af622091.02052...@posting.google.com...
Very well said.
p...@usa.net
As for sex with her brother besides how gross that is they are both mental
(not an excuse just helps me sleep nightmare free)
Nate knew Lisa years and knew she wouldn't reject him for any reason that's
why he told her. I think he doesn't mind commitment so long as its one of
two ways, story book and no questions asked. It would be great if it was
perfect and no questions needed to be asked but sadly Nate is insecure
because he has never felt safe in any of his relationships probably (and
Brenda is a raging flake.)
Brenda has a ego because she was told she had a very high IQ thinking you
are smarter then your parents. (who in TV land are suppose to lead you down
the right path and hold your hand during those scary times) Her parents
figured she was a mental adult it seems by letting her be exposed to their
sex parties and drug use. Yes she was in bed and asleep in their mind but
when she woke up the next thing they should have done was get her counseling
for the event the next day. All they did was teach her to self medicate and
bottle up. Well she's what 30 something now? I bet her bottle has cracked
long ago been oozing bile so long she's chocking on it.
Oh Brenda mentioning she may barf if he tosses the ring was so childish it
just goes to show she is scared of being alone and not in a adult relation
ship Nate might just be a year or two more mature then Missy IQ (sarcasm
has it's place in bed but not break-ups.)
Together so long as Lisa has all the babies and raising they should be a
perfect couple keep one another out of the general population and safe from
mental damn-nation.
Oh and Keith needs a enema cause lately he has been full of shit.
I thing Ruth may have finally found the perfect kid Lisa might just help
Ruth spread her wings as a parent.
ok that's all bye
"Moe Hailstone" <coloneln...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3ce8637f$0$17618$45be...@newscene.com...
Jacqueline Davidson
"Shammie" <sham...@aol.comharemgrl> wrote in message
> >From: "Moe Hailstone"
>
> >> Good riddance to that BAGGAGE TRAIN named Brenda. It's not that I want
her
> >> character off the show, I'm just glad for Nate, she's way too high
> >maintenance.
> >> She's just never any fun anymore, never a light-hearted humorous
moment.
> >She
> >> has become so heavy in her self-involvement
>
>
>
> >But Nate is
> >a much slower acting poison in his own way. He'd be no gift in his
present
> >state, either.
>
Nate is the classic dance away lover. The good thing about this kind of guy
is that you don't get tied down with committments. The bad thing is that
you don't get tied down with committments.
I think all his relationships are time limited, certainly Lisa sees that,
and Brenda too.
Their confrontation was beautifully written ,directed and acted, IMO.
Really this show was Emmy material.
Jackie
LikeyGirL
>Brenda is a raging flake.
LOL! What a perfect description, I love it.
--
there's oceans in between us
but that's not very far
Jacqueline Davidson
be emotionally or physically unavailable, or both. In other words, Nate.
hugs, Jackie
"Shammie" <sham...@aol.comharemgrl> wrote in message
> >From: "Jacqueline Davidson"
>
> >Nate is the classic dance away lover.
>
image
> of Fred Astaire. I'm not just saying that.
>
> > The good thing about this kind of guy
> >is that you don't get tied down with committments. The bad thing is
that
> >you don't get tied down with committments.
>
>
>
> >Their confrontation was beautifully written ,directed and acted, IMO.
>
>
> >Really this show was Emmy material.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Lady0980
would be leaving in a couple of days) but not Brenda until much later, and then
really without any choice. >>
Actually, Nate did not share his condition with Lisa until after she told him
about the baby. It's in the episode where Brenda has her bridal shower. Lisa
and Nate are sitting on the steps at the house/funeral home, and he says, "now
you know what was really going on with me that night," and they proceed to talk
about his medicine, seizures, etc.
Because in the episode where Lisa first tells him she's pregnant, she says "you
were crying because you were home, blahblablah," so the night they slept
together, and when he was in Seattle, he didn't tell her about his illness.
And, Brenda already knows about his condition by the time he tells Lisa.
BTW - in the fight scene, Brenda accuses Nate of sleeping with Lisa while they
were engaged, but they weren't yet at that point (as someone else already
pointed out.) This is also obvious, since when Lisa tells Nate she's pregnant,
she first asks him about Brenda, and he says "oh, we're engaged now." It really
annoyed me in this last episode that they let that go by.
<< Also recall his out-of-left field accusation that Brenda might have fucked
her brother. Where does this come from?--not her novel. This is an original
Nate thought, and it is not pretty. >>
Last season there were insinuations that Brenda slept with Billy. It wasn't a
random line thrown in there.
Green Cougar
that. How it looks to me, as far as Brenda goes, she has had brought
things onto herself more than once before and during the relationship,
visiting her now ex-friend's brothle, seeing other men during home-run
therapy sessions, and drugged out having sex with two guys that she
just brings into her house. Yet, she knows how this stuff can ruin
her life easily with people she loves, so she basically keeps
everything covered up, and unlike Nate, she keeps bringing more onto
herself, therefore creating two sides of her life, but isn't well in
control of one side and resorts to keeping both sides further and
further apart, and just has to make sure that she doesn't get caught,
as what happened on Sunday's episode.
Nate, while he got his ex-girlfriend pregnant, may run from hard
truths, but soon understands the hardship involved if he doesn't speak
up. Like his ordeal with Lisa for example, he tried to get away with
being with the baby without Brenda knowing about it. But Lisa didn't
approve of that, and decided that her baby shouldn't be around a
dishonest jerk so she leaves. This was Nate's wake-up call. He then
decided that telling Brenda was the only right thing to do, whether it
was good for him or not. And unlike Brenda, the only other person on
his side is himself, and his dead dad.
So to sum it up, neither have been honest with each other, but Nate
has shown to be more capable of fixing his problems, Brenda isn't.
But I think in the end, Nate and Brenda will manage to get back
together. As for Lisa, although Nate got her pregnant and the baby
was born, she now knows the fact that his mom Ruth never was aware of
Nate getting her pregnant, and would be well-convinced at this point
that Nate runs away from his problems too often and will although make
things up, will decide that he was never her type to begin with
(remembering how he at one moment decided to keep the baby secret from
Brenda), and that will be something I expect her to tell Nate in his
face. Because in the long run, while Lisa had been more affectionate,
Nate actually has more in common with Brenda, and if both take time to
correct their wrong-doings, they will have the relationship they
thought they had. Maybe the book Brenda is writing will be her way to
closure in this.
Erin White
being real, she's doing it when it is to her advantage in an argument. Nate is
more genuinely empathetic and spiritual; Brenda is hopelessly self-involved to
the exclusion of the feelings of others.
And BTW, I predict that Nate will convert to Judiasm and marry the rabbi! He
just seems like he has a calling to minister to people, and could be very
effective.
Tink *~*~*
Moe Hailstone wrote:
--
"Conquer the mountain, dude!"
Tom
> Well, she didn't admit to all the other men she'd been with. She sort
> of made it seem that she did what she did to get back at him for the
> baby. Well, guess what, they weren't engaged when he went to Seattle
> to the best of my memory. She WAS engaged when she was with Stoner
> Tall and Stoner Short. Nate isn't without any blame, but this chick is
> bad news and sadly, I don't think they are over. She can say how much
> she loves him and she was hurting and after his speech from Bernard on
> forgiveness, he'll give it a try -- unknowing all the other stuff
> she's been up to. Margaret is right -- she's so negative. She's a
> total downer to be around. She's loathsome and I despise people that
> make excuses for their adult behavior because of their upbringing....
> nobody has it perfect coming up in this world. Sure, she's had a
> bizarre childhood, but it is time to take responsibility for the grown
> up woman that she is. She is messed up, but he doesn't need to saddle
> himself with her forever because he had sex with her straight off the
> plane and that's just who she is.... @@
youre right. theyll get back together. nate will see it as
retribution for his tryst with lisa and hell forgive her. brenda is a
mess. but at least she doesnt make any MORE excuses. the only excuse
is her parents using her as a guinea pig. i loved it when nate said
'i dont know you' and she said 'you know exactly who i am. i was
f*****g you twenty minutes after i met you.' or something to that
affect. not THAT is real.
Shammie
>Shammie, dance away lovers kiss and run. They pick people who are going to
>be emotionally or physically unavailable, or both.
How has Nate been emotionally or physically unavailable for Brenda? She's the
one who didn't even want to have sex with him for over six weeks. Just because
he didn't tell her about his AVM or Lisa's pregnancy, he was still there for
Brenda. In fact, I think he's been very patient waiting for her to become
emotionally/physically available to him.
But thanks for defining the expression!
Publius
>who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever? The past several
>episodes have led the audience to despise Brenda and engender sympathy for
>Nate for being saddled with her. But...tonight, when they went head to head,
>who was the most honest, the most devastatingly self-critical--the most
>real? Nate had his justifiable initial reaction, but he refused to look at
Only about half of her comments were self directed and completely
honest. 'I dont know why I did it" and "Fucked you right off the
plane" were examples of such. Additionally, she only fessed up to
things he already knew. But at least half of what she said was her
trying to shift the focus by bringing up Nate's imperfections (AVM,
baby, Lisa, not to mention her pathetic world misery rant).
They are all completely beside the point if the issue is, 'are you
sleeping with complete strangers on a massive scale while we have been
engaged'.
>his own behavior, whereas Brenda looked at herself and relayed what she saw,
Nate's behavior had nothing whatsoever to do with her behaviour this
year. She was not giving hand jobs to clients because of he kept his
med condition a secret, she didnt know. She was not going to sex
parties as payback for his infidelty, she didnt know. She did not bed
Ying and Yang because of the baby - she didnt know.
They are both highly imperfect human beings but none of the stuff she
tried to bring up really had any bearing on her own ongoing, repeated
debauchery. Nor is a result of, or related to, anything Nate has
done.
Further, when she had a REAL chance to confront her own issues with
the Shrink, she heard what she wanted to hear and did not follow
through.
>no matter how ugly it was--"I fucked you right off the plane, that's what I
>am." She looked truly crushed when Nate left her.
>
>Nate has lead a life of running away from others, not much different than
>the cancer patient he has "adopted". He probably feels noble about this
Neither has a record of longterm relationships. She is as unstable
as he in that area and both went into this thing knowing that about
the other.
>"adoption", but he has chosen to commit himself to someone who will be gone
>for good in days, a few weeks at most. While he admires the idea of more
While probably true, still has zip to do with gang-bang Brenda's
behavior.
>
>Brenda is truly disturbed, but she is honest with herself, if not others.
Disagree. She was only honest when confronted or shook up (like after
the sex party). But she heard what she wanted to hear from the shrink
and did not follow thru on getting some help when she did come to the
realization she needed some.
Instead, she fucked the author on the grazy floor of the bathroom.
>Nate is buried in a long-spun web of avoiding such hard truths about
Rewatch the shrink ep and see if that doesnt wholly apply toBrenda as
well.
Shammie
>>who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever? The past several
>>episodes have led the audience to despise Brenda and engender sympathy for
>>Nate for being saddled with her. But...tonight, when they went head to head,
>>who was the most honest, the most devastatingly self-critical--the most
>>real? Nate had his justifiable initial reaction, but he refused to look at
>>his own behavior, whereas Brenda looked at herself and relayed what she saw,
>>no matter how ugly it was--"I fucked you right off the plane, that's what I
>>am." She looked truly crushed when Nate left her.
>>
>>Nate has lead a life of running away from others, not much different than
>>the cancer patient he has "adopted". He probably feels noble about this
>>"adoption", but he has chosen to commit himself to someone who will be gone
>>for good in days, a few weeks at most. While he admires the idea of more
>>permanent commitment in others (Brenda's parents, for example), he never
>>c>hooses it for himself, even hiding from his mother that she is about to be
>>grandmother, as that would commit him to another role that he could not flee
>>easily.
>>
>>Brenda is truly disturbed, but she is honest with herself, if not others.
>>.Nate is buried in a long-spun web of avoiding such hard truths about
>>himself. An interesting couple indeed. And 6FU has given us a very subtly
>>drawn portrait of them.
>Fuck Brenda!
LOL!
I agree with this post.
Publius
><< meanwhile, he shared his knowledge of this condition with Lisa (whom he knew
>would be leaving in a couple of days) but not Brenda until much later, and then
>really without any choice. >>
>
>Actually, Nate did not share his condition with Lisa until after she told him
>about the baby. It's in the episode where Brenda has her bridal shower. Lisa
>and Nate are sitting on the steps at the house/funeral home, and he says, "now
>you know what was really going on with me that night," and they proceed to talk
>about his medicine, seizures, etc.
>
>Because in the episode where Lisa first tells him she's pregnant, she says "you
>were crying because you were home, blahblablah," so the night they slept
>together, and when he was in Seattle, he didn't tell her about his illness.
>
>And, Brenda already knows about his condition by the time he tells Lisa.
>
>BTW - in the fight scene, Brenda accuses Nate of sleeping with Lisa while they
>were engaged, but they weren't yet at that point (as someone else already
>pointed out.) This is also obvious, since when Lisa tells Nate she's pregnant,
>she first asks him about Brenda, and he says "oh, we're engaged now." It really
>annoyed me in this last episode that they let that go by.
They also slipped on a Clare-Aunt Sara thing. First Clare thought she
was dead, then when she sends the mushrooms, 'they Chinese herbs from
Aunt Sara... who usually sends neat stuff'.
>
><< Also recall his out-of-left field accusation that Brenda might have fucked
>her brother. Where does this come from?--not her novel. This is an original
>Nate thought, and it is not pretty. >>
>
>Last season there were insinuations that Brenda slept with Billy. It wasn't a
>random line thrown in there.
Very good recap/corrections! You saved me a post.
It should also be pointed out that part of the reason Nate never told
Brenda about the AVM is that for a while she was going on and on, week
after week about how nice it was not to have someone else you to take
care of them (post Billy committment). It would hesitate to mention
the AVM after that as well.
Liam Devlin
>>who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever? The past several
>>episodes have led the audience to despise Brenda and engender sympathy for
>>Nate for being saddled with her. But...tonight, when they went head to head,
>>who was the most honest, the most devastatingly self-critical--the most
>>real? Nate had his justifiable initial reaction, but he refused to look at
>>his own behavior, whereas Brenda looked at herself and relayed what she saw,
>>no matter how ugly it was--"I fucked you right off the plane, that's what I
>>am." She looked truly crushed when Nate left her.
>>
>>Nate has lead a life of running away from others, not much different than
>>the cancer patient he has "adopted". He probably feels noble about this
>>"adoption", but he has chosen to commit himself to someone who will be gone
>>for good in days, a few weeks at most. While he admires the idea of more
>>permanent commitment in others (Brenda's parents, for example), he never
>>c>hooses it for himself, even hiding from his mother that she is about to be
>>grandmother, as that would commit him to another role that he could not flee
>>easily.
>>
>>Brenda is truly disturbed, but she is honest with herself, if not others.
>>.Nate is buried in a long-spun web of avoiding such hard truths about
>>himself. An interesting couple indeed. And 6FU has given us a very subtly
>>drawn portrait of them.
>>
>
> Fuck Brenda!
get in line like the rest of us, bud.
Liam Devlin
"gang-bang Brenda" - love it! That should be her name from now on, good,
ol' Gang-Bang Brenda.
Shammie
>> Fuck Brenda!
>
>
>get in line like the rest of us, bud.
Oh I *highly* doubt you are speaking for all the men here.
Cambie
Shammie wrote:
> Oh I *highly* doubt you are speaking for all the men here.
i'd do her.
Liam Devlin
"Guys" in general, there's an endless stream of guys who'd pork Brenda
given half a chance - starting with the guy from the bar where she met Nate.
Liam Devlin
QED:-)
the fucking goblin guy
> >From: "Moe Hailstone"
>
> >who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever?
>
>
fer sure!
--
BFG
goblin at iglou dot com
RCLOVELY
>> >who found this confrontation to be incredibly clever?
>>
>> It was awesome!
It was real. They were attacking, blaming, being unreasonable and shouting at
each other at the same time. It was a real argument, not something out of a
soap.
RC
John DeRosa
> [snip]
>
Well said!
DevilGrrl
Yes, but would you rather pork Brenda Chenowith or Rachel Griffiths?
Shammie
>Nate is the classic dance away lover.
What is this? I've never heard this expression. I swear, it gives me an image
of Fred Astaire. I'm not just saying that.
> The good thing about this kind of guy
>is that you don't get tied down with committments. The bad thing is that
>you don't get tied down with committments.
so...um...just how comfortable is it up there on the fence? Take a stand.
>Their confrontation was beautifully written ,directed and acted, IMO.
Totally ditto.
>Really this show was Emmy material.
Maybe that scene.
Jack
"DevilGrrl" <nos...@hades.net> wrote in message
news:B911AAC7.37FBF%nos...@hades.net...
-Jack
Liam Devlin
Very creative.
Shammie
>> Good riddance to that BAGGAGE TRAIN named Brenda. It's not that I want her
>> character off the show, I'm just glad for Nate, she's way too high
>maintenance.
>> She's just never any fun anymore, never a light-hearted humorous moment.
>She
>> has become so heavy in her self-involvement
>Oh, no doubt, she would be a nightmare to be with--for anybody.
I'm so bored with her constant ennui.
>But Nate is
>a much slower acting poison in his own way. He'd be no gift in his present
>state, either.
True, too. But if you had to choose...