Casting Choice?
RNeill22
Filmfax? Just like everyone else who has worked with James Garner, Elam
describes Garner as "professional" and great to work with.
The really surprising (to me, anyway) information in the article is Elam saying
that Garner wanted very badly for Elam to play "Rocky" on The Rockford Files!
Elam says in the interview that he didn't want to end out his career playing
James Garner's Father in a weekly TV series and declined the role. Elam
further says that Garner got upset over Elam turning down the role and
threatened him by saying he would never work in one of Garner's projects again
if he refused the role of Joseph Rockford.
Had Jack Elam ended up playing Rocky, I think the character would've been
closer to Robert Donley's interpretation of the role: an irascible con man with
a heart of a gold, rather than the version that Noah Beery, Jr. played.
Adam H. Kerman
>Has anyone else read the interview with Jack Elam in the current issue of
>Filmfax?
Thanks for the heads up; I'll see if I can buy a copy.
>The really surprising (to me, anyway) information in the article is Elam
>saying that Garner wanted very badly for Elam to play "Rocky" on The Rockford
>Files! Elam says in the interview that he didn't want to end out his career
>playing James Garner's Father in a weekly TV series and declined the role.
Not surpised, since he was in both of the "Support Your Local..." movies. I
was going to point out that he wasn't old enough, just 12 years older than
Garner. But then, Beery's only 15 years older though he certainly looks old
enough. Elam is tall, like Garner, so that would have helped to suggest a
family resemblence, though I cannot think what else would have.
There's negligible information about Robert Donley in IMDb, so I have no idea
when he was born. Nor did I notice that there were any credits before the
Rockford pilot, aside from an appearance on an early television show sponsored
by Philco. He must have done more television in the early '50's. Was he a
New York stage actor?
>Elam further says that Garner got upset over Elam turning down the role and
>threatened him by saying he would never work in one of Garner's projects
>again if he refused the role of Joseph Rockford.
Huh. Well, he never did. Perhaps there's some truth in it.
>Had Jack Elam ended up playing Rocky, I think the character would've been
>closer to Robert Donley's interpretation of the role: an irascible con man
>with a heart of a gold, rather than the version that Noah Beery, Jr. played.
Somehow, I doubt it. The pilot was weakened by the scenes with Rocky in it.
I think Donley played it as written, but he and Garner had no chemistry. If
anything, Jim seemed to dislike his father.
I think Roy Huggins saw that the character didn't work, and rewrote the part.
No way the "Donley" character would have been retained.
While Elam was a comic actor by the late '60's (like everyone else, doing
a parody of Western characters in "Sheriff"), he was a thug and a gangster
for years. He had a wide range, so he wouldn't have had to ham it up as he
did on roles he had in the '70's.
No way to know if that's the way the part would have been written, but he
would have been able to play a fully-drawn character as Beery was. We do
know that he and Garner would have had chemistry.
Craig Gordon
"Adam H. Kerman" <a...@chinet.chinet.com> wrote in message
news:uoipgu1...@corp.supernews.com...
> rnei...@cs.com wrote:.
>
> No way to know if that's the way the part would have been written, but he
> would have been able to play a fully-drawn character as Beery was. We do
> know that he and Garner would have had chemistry.
Actually, Beery was always the choice over Donley (didn't know about Elam
being offered the role first), he just was not available to shoot the pilot.
Donley was never intended as being Rocky more than that one time, but it is
possible they rewrote the part to fit the actor- don't know.
Adam H. Kerman
>"Adam H. Kerman" <a...@chinet.chinet.com> wrote:
>>No way to know if that's the way the part would have been written, but he
>>would have been able to play a fully-drawn character as Beery was. We do
>>know that he and Garner would have had chemistry.
>Actually, Beery was always the choice over Donley (didn't know about Elam
>being offered the role first), he just was not available to shoot the pilot.
>Donley was never intended as being Rocky more than that one time, but it is
>possible they rewrote the part to fit the actor- don't know.
I hope they rewrote the part because there wasn't enough to the character
in the pilot. No idea what they thought Donley was capable of as I've never
seen him act from something from the late '60's or early '70's.
Does anyone know anything about his earlier career?
bcnmason
"RNeill22" <rnei...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20020919004130...@mb-cn.news.cs.com...
That's the first I ever heard of that,....Jim asking Elam to play the role
as Rocky. From what I have, Noah was clearly pencilled in for the role and
that due to prior commitments, Noah could not contribute to the pilot.
Imagining someone else playing the role of Rocky, other than Noah? Not in a
million years!
Brian
Craig Gordon
"bcnmason" <bcnm...@ca.inter.net> wrote in message
news:YTvi9.13337$qh1.8...@news.ca.inter.net...
looked old enough to be Jim's dad, could carry off the folksy stuff OK and
they did have history together. IMO Elam was the next best thing about both
the "Support" movies, and the timing would kinda fit in.
All in all, I could see Rocky being written for Elam and then Beery fitting
nicely into the role when he turned it down. The only thing that throws me
here is that Elam did end up doing a series not long after this all
happened, then did another one in the mid-80's (neither one took off
though).
>
>
>
Adam H. Kerman
>Brian <bcnm...@ca.inter.net> wrote:
>>That's the first I ever heard of that,....Jim asking Elam to play the role
>>as Rocky. From what I have, Noah was clearly pencilled in for the role
>>and that due to prior commitments, Noah could not contribute to the pilot.
>>Imagining someone else playing the role of Rocky, other than Noah?
>>Not in a million years!
>I'd never heard it either, but it does make a lot of sense. Elam certainly
>looked old enough to be Jim's dad, could carry off the folksy stuff OK and
>they did have history together. IMO Elam was the next best thing about both
>the "Support" movies, and the timing would kinda fit in.
>All in all, I could see Rocky being written for Elam and then Beery fitting
>nicely into the role when he turned it down. The only thing that throws me
>here is that Elam did end up doing a series not long after this all
>happened, then did another one in the mid-80's (neither one took off
>though).
I'm with Brian; it is a little difficult to imagine anyone else in famous
roles, but I can kind of imagine Elam if I make a lot of assumptions that
Huggins would have gone the same way with the character.
You know, it's like imagining that Jack Kelly playing Maverick...
Let's put some dates on all this. How soon after "Nichols" bit the dust did
Huggins resume speaking to Garner? Do we have an idea of when Huggins began
shopping the treatment for the series around? Perhaps that's around the time
that casting options were being considered. Perhaps Huggins always had Beery
in mind for the part, but would Garner have thought of Beery?
I'm not sure what series Craig's thinking of. Elam was in "Cat Ballou", the
pilot for the instantly yanked series, but I don't know if he was cast for
the series. And he was in a number of made-for-tv movies. It looks like the
early '70's were an especially busy time for him on television.
As long as we are recasting "Rockford", let's see. My choices may be good
for a laugh:
Angel... Jack Carson or Jack Warden
Dennis... Hal Linden
Chapman... Gale Gordon
Beth... Jo Ann Pflug (Lt. Dish!)
RNeill22
>> as Rocky. From what I have, Noah was clearly pencilled in for the role
>and
>> that due to prior commitments, Noah could not contribute to the pilot.
That's what I'd always heard, too! That's why I was so surprised by the
information in the Filmfax Jack Elam interview. Noah Beery, Jr. had been the
first choice for Rocky, but he was already committed to the Doc Elliott series,
so Robert Donley was hired for the role in the pilot instead. This was the
first I'd heard that they were both "second choices" to Jack Elam.
At first I thought maybe Mr. Elam was confused and had been offered the role of
Angel Martin, since he already had experience as Jim Rockford's rascally
sidekick from the "Support" movies. That theory doesn't hold up, however,
since Angel apparently wasn't planned as a recurring character yet when TRF
began; he was merely a guest star in the pilot. His recurring status didn't
begin until after the series had been on awhile and Mr. Elam was offered a
continuing role, not a guest shot.
>Elam certainly
>looked old enough to be Jim's dad, could carry off the folksy stuff OK and
>they did have history together. IMO Elam was the next best thing about both
>the "Support" movies, and the timing would kinda fit in.
Jack Elam is really only twelve years older than James Garner, but then, Noah
Beery Jr was really too young to have been Garner's father, too!
>The only thing that throws me
>here is that Elam did end up doing a series not long after this all
>happened, then did another one in the mid-80's (neither one took off
>though).
I never did see Jack Elam's "Texas-Wheelers" sitcom that aired on Friday nights
on ABC just before The Night Stalker. It got lousy ratings and was cancelled
quickly, but most of the reviews were good. It was billed at the time as an
antidote to all the warm, sentimental, touchy-feely family shows like The
Waltons and Apple's Way.
Jack Elam played the drunken, ne'er-do-well Father who abadoned his children
and re-entered their lives years later, causing them all kinds of problems.
Mark Hamill and Gary Busey played 2 of the sons who had to cope with their
irresponsible dad.
I did watch his later sitcom "Struck By Lightning" in which Elam played the
Frankenstein Monster. Dr. Frankenstein's descendant inherits the family
hotel---and the family Monster--and tries to adjust to his responsibilities to
both. Elam was funny in the role, but the show, as you say, didn't take off.
I think it was on Monday nights on NBC.
Jack Elam was still rail-thin in the early 1970's. By 1980 he had become
rather large around the middle. Had he played Rocky on TRF, that increase in
size over the course of the series might have made an interesting source of
humor. "Dad, if you get any bigger, you won't be able to fit through my
trailer door anymore!"
JosephLoya
>for a laugh:
>
>Angel... Jack Carson or Jack Warden
>Dennis... Hal Linden
>Chapman... Gale Gordon
>Beth... Jo Ann Pflug (Lt. Dish!)
>
>
>
indeed played enough instantly dislikable roles to play Chapman. (I'm thinking
of his Columbo turn as a bad guy police chief -- am I thinking of the right
guy?)
Mariette Hartley would have been the best of all possible Beths. (This from not
a Gretchen Corbett fan.)
DanBriggs3000
Jim Rockford: Gene Hackman
Rocky:
Lt. Becker: Robert Culp
Angel:
Beth Davenport: Diana Muldaur
Chapman: JD Cannon
Diel: Robert Pine
I left Rocky and Angel Blank because I could think of no one else who could
ever play those roles!
BTW I tend to lean to more stiffness with some actors.........but then again
thats why I am no casting agent!
Adam H. Kerman
DanBriggs3000
:-)
Adam H. Kerman
>Lemme see what I can come up with:
>Jim Rockford: Gene Hackman
Gene Hackman is a favorite actor, but I have trouble picturing him as
Rockford. Garner brings a touch of wistfulness and whimsey to the role, while
Hackman would bring a touch of sadness.
If Hackman had ever starred in a television series, it likely would have
been a classic.
joe
OOPS. I just checked my Columbo Phile book. It was Richard Kiley who
played a deputy police commissioner. Kiley appears way too intelligent
to play Chapman.
Adam H. Kerman
>josep...@aol.com (JosephLoya) wrote:
>>Alternate casting? Now you really started some thinking. Gale Gordon
>>has indeed played enough instantly dislikable roles to play Chapman. (I'm
>>thinking of his Columbo turn as a bad guy police chief -- am I thinking
>>of the right guy?)
>OOPS. I just checked my Columbo Phile book. It was Richard Kiley who
>played a deputy police commissioner. Kiley appears way too intelligent
>to play Chapman.
In the early '70's, everyone would have remembered who Gale Gordon was. He
died a few years back. Well-known character actor, usually played a comic
blowhard. Did radio, movies, and television. On radio, he was Mayor Latrivia
on "Fibber McGee and Molly", for which he first became well-known, but then
was cast in his best-known role as Osgood Conklin the high school principal in
"Our Miss Brooks" starring Eve Arden, and played that part on radio, tv, and
a movie, I think. In the '60's, he was on two tv shows starring Lucille Ball.
I can certainly see Richard Kiley playing a guest villain, though Rockford
didn't usually face really evil guys.
Someone
> In the early '70's, everyone would have remembered who Gale Gordon was. He
> died a few years back. Well-known character actor, usually played a comic
> blowhard. Did radio, movies, and television. On radio, he was Mayor Latrivia
> on "Fibber McGee and Molly", for which he first became well-known, but then
> was cast in his best-known role as Osgood Conklin the high school principal in
> "Our Miss Brooks" starring Eve Arden, and played that part on radio, tv, and
> a movie, I think. In the '60's, he was on two tv shows starring Lucille Ball.
And Gordon lives on. Occasional one-time characters in "The Simpsons,"
like a Maitre'D, will have only one word repeated several times in their
dialogue: "Yeeeeeeeeeeeeesss?" "Yeeeeeeeeeeeeesss!"
Adam H. Kerman
Hm. Wouldn't that be a reference to Frank Nelson from "The Jack Benny Program"?
Coincidentally, he did the same thing on "I Love Lucy".
Of course, I'd need to hear how the line was delivered. Mr. Mooney did
something like that.
j.r._johnson
wrote:
That's exactly whom I thought of too. Frank Nelson had a way of popping up
from behind a counter or some such quick entry with his trademark
"Yeeeeeeeeessss!" line. Didn't he also play on some Green Acres episodes?
>Of course, I'd need to hear how the line was delivered. Mr. Mooney did
>something like that.
Yes, hearing is the key. Mr. Mooney's voice was a bit lower sounding and not
quite as "exciting" as Frank Nelson's voice.
Johnny
RNeill22
>from behind a counter or some such quick entry with his trademark
>"Yeeeeeeeeessss!" line. Didn't he also play on some Green Acres episodes?
I thought of Frank Nelson when I first read this, too, though I can also 'hear'
Gale Gordon delivering the "line."
Frank Nelson did that schtick in a series of TV commercials for McDonald's,
too, as I'm sure you recall. At the time someone pointed out that Nelson's was
the last voice you'd want associated with a line of food products you were
trying to sell. Maybe McDonalds's should've hired Gale Gordon instead!
jcollins25
>>from behind a counter or some such quick entry with his trademark
>>"Yeeeeeeeeessss!" line
I remember an episode of the Jack Benny show where he kept on seeing Frank
Nelson everywhere he went... restaurants, drug stores, bank windows, etc. Jack
began to wonder if he was hallucinating so he went to see a psychiatrist.
After the session, the psychiatrist assued jack that he was fine and that he
only needed to take time off and relax for a bit. Jack was relieved at the
diagnosis and left the office. As he walked out, the next patient came in...
Frank Nelson. He saw Jack and went nuts... crawling up the walls and saying
"It's him, it's him... everywhere I go, I see him... etc, etc" Of course, Jack
just gave that look.
I haven't seen that episode since I was a little kid but I remember cracking
up.
j.r._johnson
>>That's exactly whom I thought of too. Frank Nelson had a way of popping up
>>from behind a counter or some such quick entry with his trademark
>>"Yeeeeeeeeessss!" line. Didn't he also play on some Green Acres episodes?
>
>I thought of Frank Nelson when I first read this, too, though I can also >'hear' Gale Gordon delivering the "line."
>
>Frank Nelson did that schtick in a series of TV commercials for McDonald's,
>too, as I'm sure you recall.
I actually can't remember that now. Do you recall when the commercials ran?
One thing that TV Land will do on occassions is t show old commercials. But,
I haven't seen these run on there yet.
>At the time someone pointed out that Nelson's was
>the last voice you'd want associated with a line of food products you were
>trying to sell. Maybe McDonalds's should've hired Gale Gordon instead!
I suppose if you didn't know who Frank Nelson was, a person might not like his
voice for selling a product. But, knowing who he was, he's the kind of person
that I would definitely buy something like fast food from simply because it
was him. What can I say? I just like the guy. :-)
Johnny
RNeill22
>From: J.R. Johnson
>I actually can't remember that now. Do you recall when the commercials ran?
It wasn't all that long before he passed away. I would say around 1981-1982.
>What can I say? I just like the guy. :-)
Have you visited the Frank Nelson fan tribute site? It's full of photos,
information and anecdotes, including Nelson's own mini-autobiography.
Tony DeAngelo
I've got it! We could cast "Pamela Dean" as Leeann Sweeney! Think of
it! Instead of a CB scanner she has a PC. There she is, sitting in her
Mom's basement, chain smoking Virginia Slims, surfing the net until her
shift at the Quickie Mart comes up...
Bruce Simpson
Bruce
"Tony DeAngelo" <aj...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:3D97BB18...@adelphia.net...
Adam H. Kerman
>well played. Where do we get these trolls???
People feed 'em, so they keep coming back. That's the usual way in which
newsgroups get trolls.
righter
> Bruce Simpson <br...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >well played. Where do we get these trolls???
>
> People feed 'em, so they keep coming back. That's the usual way in which
> newsgroups get trolls.
People just don't pay attention to the signs. It's like at the Zoo. But on
the up side, you don't have a real newsgroup till you've had a few trolls.
:o)
Russ