Two observations on the Carl shooting...
Tim Witort
it would litteraly explode - not just get a nice
hole in it for water to trickle out of.
Did anyone else think of the scene from "The Jerk" when
Steve Martin is getting shot at while working at the
gas station? Holes appearing in the oil cans, "Hey!
These oil cans are defective!" That's how Carl looked.
"Hey! This water bottle is defective." ssszzzip! Thud!
-- TRW
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t i m . w i t o r t
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Gumby
> If you were holding a water bottle and it got shot,
> it would litteraly explode - not just get a nice
> hole in it for water to trickle out of.
Depends on what kind of projectile hits it.
More of an issue for me is that there was only one hole!
tdciago
> More of an issue for me is that there was only one hole!
When Locke displayed his entrance and exit wounds from Ben's bullet, I
thought it might be a comment on the entrance to and exit from the
island. As Hurley put it when the golf course was built, "It's two
holes, for now."
But here we see just one hole, with liquid pouring out. It makes me
think that turning the failsafe key set off a race against time before
the Losties will have no exit, and the island will be inundated and
cease to exist.
rob...@bestweb.net
> When Locke displayed his entrance and exit wounds from Ben's bullet, I
> thought it might be a comment on the entrance to and exit from the
> island. As Hurley put it when the golf course was built, "It's two
> holes, for now."
Good one! What I'd really like is for Sawyer's prediction to have
come true and for the site to turn out to be the golf course in the
Seychelles where Sayid shot Mr. Aveline/Avelino. But my money's off
the opposite coast of Africa, Equatorial Guinea.
> But here we see just one hole, with liquid pouring out.
That's the real clue. With a high speed projectile, the bottle would
not have been likely to explode, but there would be an exit hole, and
with the shot traveling horzontally or at least not upward, if one
hole was below the water line, so would the other. So apparently the
bottle, tree, Carl, and Rousseau were all rigged to simulate shooting,
but the exit hole in the bottle failed to materialize, and they hope
the girl didn't notice.
Robert
thinbluemime
I have shot tin cans full of water with a 22 semi automatic rifle. I had
to fill the cans with water to tell when I hit the cans, because even with
a 22, when the cans were hit, they would not fall off the log, or even
move. So to tell if I had hit the can from a distance, without walking up
to the target site, I filled them with water.
OK, I have a hard time with this Karl-Rousseau shooting scene, as I
mentioned in another thread. Karl was hit from the rear with the bullet
passing through his body and exiting out his chest. The right forarm shows
a slight blood splatter. Karl is sitting still when hit, and the shot
propels him forward (important, see below). A moment later his back is
shown with the entry wound visible. So reviewing the screen caps, Karl was
shot from the back, with bullet exiting the front.
Rousseau and Alex hid behind a tree a short distance from Karl and in
front of Karl's body, roughly in line with the shot and direction of the
shot that killed him.
Rousseau tells Alex she loves her, grabs Alex's hand and jumps up and
starts to run when she is hit from the front. Two things to note here.
Rousseau had no wound to her back, if you review the screen caps, so she
was hit from the front. So why did't Rousseau fall in the opposite
direction of the projectile like Karl did? Rousseau had forward momentum
from her jump start to run from the tree location.
So, at least 2 shooters in two locations, one behind Karl and one in front
of Rousseau.
Now back to Karl's Can aka water bottle. Rob as you mentioned, the only
way the bullet could have made one hole, would be if the shot came from
very high up, entered the mouth of the bottle, or above the water line. I
can't imagine this happening. There are actually no scenarios I can
imagine, where this bottle shot could happen. Stretching the imagination,
here are the only solutions I can see:
1) The shooting scene, or some element of it was faked in the Lost
universe.
2) A Production Error (I hope my Lozt Boyz aren't this stupid)
3) The water bottle was made of lightweight titanium and Karl has some
disease that causes extreme rigidity in the extremities (Lucky Alex :)
4)Some other scenario that causes the laws of the physical universe to be
bypassed or circumvented. Remember how long it took Faraday's rocket to
arrive on Island?
If this turns out to be a production error, I sure hope the next Official
Podcast addresses it, so I am not scratching my head till April 24, 2008,
or longer.
Gumby
> On Mar 25, 1:21�pm, Gumby <gu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>More of an issue for me is that there was only one hole!
>
>
> When Locke displayed his entrance and exit wounds from Ben's bullet, I
> thought it might be a comment on the entrance to and exit from the
> island.
More an issue *ther* for me was that his shirt had no holes in it!
Davej
> If you were holding a water bottle and it got shot,
> it would litteraly explode - not just get a nice
> hole in it for water to trickle out of.
>
> Did anyone else think of the scene from "The Jerk" when
> Steve Martin is getting shot at while working at the
> gas station? Holes appearing in the oil cans, "Hey!
> These oil cans are defective!" That's how Carl looked.
> "Hey! This water bottle is defective." ssszzzip! Thud!
Is it possible the bottle was supposed to have been nicked? Karl would
have felt the impact. I think they were playing to the audience's
confusion over what was happening. Having felt it Karl should have
figured it out in about 1 second.
It also annoys me that we are apparently out of sync with boat-time?
Who is shooting at them?
thinbluemime
> Is it possible the bottle was supposed to have been nicked? Karl would
> have felt the impact. I think they were playing to the audience's
> confusion over what was happening. Having felt it Karl should have
> figured it out in about 1 second.
>
> It also annoys me that we are apparently out of sync with boat-time?
> Who is shooting at them?
Nah, the water bottle hole was drilled out with a drill bit. I have looked
at that scene very closely.
Either it was
a major clue, or
a major prop error.
Remember that prop paper that Nikki and Paulo were reading at the Sidney
airport with Zuckerman's (Zukerman) death notice, that had a date on it in
the wrong universe?
I think the shooters are the first wave of the freighter folks. Frank's
choper can only transport a half dozen or so at a time. "I have a bad
feeling about this"
Moke Gibboni
"thinbluemime" <thinbl...@tbm.com> wrote in message
news:op.t8ljwfs0pzlo1x@experience...
.......... or, quite simply Ben may have set a trap for them and had
previously organised their execution. It would have needed to be done as far
away from Locke and Co. so that they wouldn't find out.
Do you remember when Juliet was helping Sawyer and Carl to escape in the
canoo and shot that guy who was trying to stop them? She said to Carl that
he couldn't leave with Alex, because if he did, then Ben would kill Carl.
Maybe, Ben was just fulfilling his promise. Also there was no love lost
between Ben and Rousseau as Rousseau had beaten up Ben pretty badly on
several occasions.
Moke G.
thinbluemime
<mo...@gibboni.greatxscape.net> wrote:
> .......... or, quite simply Ben may have set a trap for them and had
> previously organised their execution. It would have needed to be done as
> far
> away from Locke and Co. so that they wouldn't find out.
>
> Do you remember when Juliet was helping Sawyer and Carl to escape in the
> canoo and shot that guy who was trying to stop them? She said to Carl
> that
> he couldn't leave with Alex, because if he did, then Ben would kill Carl.
> Maybe, Ben was just fulfilling his promise. Also there was no love lost
> between Ben and Rousseau as Rousseau had beaten up Ben pretty badly on
> several occasions.
>
>
> Moke G.
>
>
Ben has made many promises he has wiggled out of.
Ben's one seemingly known weakness emotionally is Alex. Before the third
season finale Ben was upset with Alex so much that he allowed her to tag
along with him to meet Jack, with the pretense of turning Alex over to the
Losties, because he felt he could no longer trust her.
If the Freighter crew are really coming to the Island to capture Ben (and
you know how hard that can be even when he is tied up behind locked doors)
then the writers may be setting us up for more drama in the following
fashion.
Most everything is going Ben's way when the freighter crew attack. At some
point Alex is pulled out of the bushes like Kate was with bearded Mr
Friendly (Tom), and used as a hostage to seal Ben's capture.
Surrender Ben, or Alex dies.
I predict that Karl is gone for good, except maybe in the form of a ghost.
Rousseau's story is not finished, and a flashback should come about
eventually.
Ryan Robbins
"tdciago" <tdc...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:afd374c8-1fab-4220...@d62g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Mar 25, 1:21?pm, Gumby <gu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>But here we see just one hole, with liquid pouring out. It makes me
>think that turning the failsafe key set off a race against time before
>the Losties will have no exit, and the island will be inundated and
>cease to exist.
Are you like those crazy English teachers I had who tried to turn the course
into psychoanalysis?
Norm Crosby
> On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 14:09:07 -0400, <rob...@bestweb.net> wrote:
>
> OK, I have a hard time with this Karl-Rousseau shooting scene, as I
> mentioned in another thread. Karl was hit from the rear with the bullet
> passing through his body and exiting out his chest. The right forarm
> shows a slight blood splatter. Karl is sitting still when hit, and the
> shot propels him forward (important, see below). A moment later his back
> is shown with the entry wound visible. So reviewing the screen caps,
> Karl was shot from the back, with bullet exiting the front.
I have reviewed the Hanso Zapruder film and clearly it shows that the
bullet enters at the neck and exits from his chest, disputing the magic
bullet theory. Karls head snaps back clearly indicating frontal exit.
>
> Rousseau and Alex hid behind a tree a short distance from Karl and in
> front of Karl's body, roughly in line with the shot and direction of the
> shot that killed him.
>
> Rousseau tells Alex she loves her, grabs Alex's hand and jumps up and
> starts to run when she is hit from the front. Two things to note here.
> Rousseau had no wound to her back, if you review the screen caps, so she
> was hit from the front. So why did't Rousseau fall in the opposite
> direction of the projectile like Karl did? Rousseau had forward momentum
> from her jump start to run from the tree location.
>
> So, at least 2 shooters in two locations, one behind Karl and one in
> front of Rousseau.
Indeed- in the Hanso Zapruder film a white puff of smoke can be seen
rising from the grassy knoll behind the trees.
>
> Now back to Karl's Can aka water bottle. Rob as you mentioned, the only
> way the bullet could have made one hole, would be if the shot came from
> very high up, entered the mouth of the bottle, or above the water line.
> I can't imagine this happening. There are actually no scenarios I can
> imagine, where this bottle shot could happen. Stretching the
> imagination, here are the only solutions I can see:
The shot entered Carls bottle, exited through the bottle cap, ricocheted
off the tree, bounced off the airplane up in the tree, hit Carl in the
back, exited his left pinky, entered Rousseau, exited through her ....,
and took out ex-gov Spitzer, who happened to be visiting the Island as
guest number 9.
Next week: Arrested as the lone gunman, will be Ben Harvey Linus, who
was found watching a movie on his VCR after a rifle was found hidden in
the book shelf. Unfortunately, John Locky pulls out a gun and shoots him
before there can be a trial.
In a related incident next season, Sayid Sayid shoots Bens brother.
thinbluemime
After that we will examine the forensic evidence supporting pilot error in
the disapearance of the downed Flight containing the remains of 'Ben's
brother's nephew' & the Bestest looking Blonde on the block, September 21
:)
This is too much reality...bring back the Lost fantasy to relieve me of
this hell, LOL
C'mon Take Me to the Mardi Gras...
Norm Crosby
not to mention investigating the other Linus Brother, Edward, who while
drunk, drove off the Dharma bridge. His passenger died, drowning... in
a dried up river bed. Hmmmm....
thinbluemime
Oh yeah, I almost forgot about the crazy sister, crazy french chick
Rousseau Rosemary, who lived 'under ground' after her lobotomy. Jeez, this
is just getting crazy!
Would that make Alex, "Rosemary's Baby"?
I'd say put her in a straight jacket, but she is already dead.
Maybe the Lost island is a suburb of Boston!
Advance Scout
No- its a suburb of NYC- I hear people all the time that are from NYC
say - " I live on Lostt Island. I have to sit everyday on the LIE. The
Lostt Island Expressway. And dont get off at the wrong heading- you'll
go absolutely mad. "
remys...@yahoo.com
You just have to wait 31 minutes....
Brian Attwood
> > If you were holding a water bottle and it got shot,
> > it would litteraly explode - not just get a nice
> > hole in it for water to trickle out of.
>
> Depends on what kind of projectile hits it.
>
> More of an issue for me is that there was only one hole!
>
Was the cap on the bottle at the time it was shot? If so and the shot
was even slightly angled, it is probable that water would only come
out one hole while air was being drawn in through the "missing" hole.
M81162
boat people who were moved onto the island secretly.
In a recent episode when Sayid and Desmond were on the boat, the
helicopter wasn't there and the captain said that it was running an
errand.
But I favour the Ben theory.
Technix
> was even slightly angled, it is probable that water would only come
> out one hole while air was being drawn in through the "missing" hole.
You can clearly see in several frames the cap is off. The bottle is
the short, squat, wide kind as well. Initially I thought perhaps his
thumb might be closing the other hole, as the water gushes out of what
appears to be the exit hole, but I didn't see any blood in the bottle.
Watch it again, you'll see there obviously is no other way for it to
be anything but a production error, imho.
/t
Gumby
s--t--r--e--t--c--h--i--n--g
Gumby
Or... since there was a close-up on the bottle, maybe there's more of
a meaning there?
Brian Attwood
Hey, I don't really care one way or another. Just throwing it out
there as a possibility.