Villains, Villains
KalElFan
As I was looking through a comics guide recently, I was surprised
to see the name Tempus and Baron Sunday appear (before L&C).
The impression I had was that they were made-for-TV villains.
A character called Tempus was introduced in Jimmy Olsen #96,
which would have been in the early 1960s? Baron Sunday appeared
in Action 665 and Superman 26 second series (around 1989-90?).
Calling Vartox and the multi-media Superman experts...
(BTW, Vartox, you appeared in Superman 373 to 375 and 390 to
392, and in Action 498 and 499, which would have been around
the very late 70s to the mid-80s. There may be other references
but those were the only ones I noticed. Were you a good villain? <g>)
Zoomway
>>A character called Tempus was introduced in Jimmy Olsen #96,
which would have been in the early 1960s? Baron Sunday appeared
in Action 665 and Superman 26 second series (around 1989-90?).
>>>Calling Vartox and the multi-media Superman experts..<<<
Pre-Crisis mavens will have to answer about Tempus, but Baron Sunday is
definitely in the post-Crisis comics. In first season, almost no villains
from the comics were used other than Lex Luthor, though when they had
Vatman, he was something like Bizarro the imperfect clone of Superman, but
only in that he was dying from the imperfect cloning process, and was
created by Lex to destroy Superman (The World of Bizarro arc, though
Bizarro did exist in pre-crisis) Second season introduced villains and
elements of villainy from the post-crisis comics, but some differences
varied from small to siginicant.
INTERGANG was introduced in Church of Metropolis, with Bill Church as the
head of Intergang, but in the comics it would have been Morgan Edge (the
episode was originally titled The Edges of Metropolis, but something
happened where Morgan Edge was dropped, and the idea that Assistant
District Attorney Mayson Drake was his daughter)
The PRANKSTER In the episode with the same title, the Prankster was Kyle
Griffith, a guy that wanted revenge against Lois for helping send him to
prison on some gunrunning he'd been involved in. In the comics, the
Pankster was Oswald Loomis, a washed up kiddie show host who was being
cancelled because the network felt his show was old-hat, and wanted to
make way for more exciting, ratings-grabbing children's programming.
However, the Prankster had nothing against Lois Lane, but did kidnap her
and hold her hostage because he wanted her to cover his story, and because
he knew he'd create a "media circus" and that's what he
wanted...attention.
The TOYMAN as presented in Season's Greedings was similar to the original
concept of Toyman in the comics. Wynslow Shott, like the Prankster, had
been fired because he was out-of-step with the current kid market (in this
case toys, such as action heroes, computerized marvels, etc.) He became
obsessed with the welfare of children, and felt that children who were
neglected needed a safe haven, and he used his amazing prowess for
creating clever and sometimes lethal toys as a means for taking neglected
children away from their parents. He set up this fantasy world for them
and cared for them, and had their safety guarded by some pretty menacing
toys. Toyman was changed drastically a couple of years ago. He was turned
into a psycho child-murderer. Ironically, his gentle character was changed
for the same reason the oringinal Toyman himself was fired, he had no
"cool" villain appeal for the little kiddies, and so was turned into a
murderous despot.
METALLO introduced in the episode by the same name, was created by a
Trask-like villain in the comics, but by the Vale brothers on the TV show.
(Trask being the villain from Strange Visitor and Green Green Glow of
Home) The Vale brothers motive was greed. They wanted a robot or cyborg
that could rob for them, but keep the police helpless to shop him. The
fact that he was powered by Kryptonite is what made him so lethal against
Superman. In the comics, the guy who invented Metallo, had done so for the
express pupose of killing Superman. He, like the Trask character he so
resembles, felt that Superman was the vanguard of an invading horde of
aliens (he was also the one who had stolen Clark's spaceship) He had found
a petty crook who nearly died in a car crash, and turned him into a
cyborg. Unfortunately, Metallo had plans of his own, and killed his
inventer.
BARON SUNDAY He used voodoo as a mask to fool the superstitious. He was
really "mystical" and a practicioner in the black arts. But using voodoo
as a cover made a convincing smokescreen. Superman, being susceptible to
the supernatural made Sunday (along with Satanus, Silver Banshee, etc) a
formidable enemy. The show was fairly faithful to the character, and even
gave him a bit more depth by giving him a history and therefore a motive
where Clark Kent is concerned.
Other elements from the comics are STAR labs, Inspector Henderson (1rst
season only) Emil Hamilton (2nd season only) Cat Grant (1rst season only)
and red Kryptonite (which is a pre-crisis facet of the comics) That's
about all I can remember at the moment.
Zoo...@aol.com (oh, and you can find the "Zoomway" in Superman #37 among
other issues ;)
KalElFan
In article <4qg787$6...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, zoo...@aol.com (Zoomway)
writes:
>Pre-Crisis mavens will have to answer about Tempus...
After taking a closer look, the only two references I can find to
Tempus were both in the Jimmy Olsen series, the one I mentioned
where he was introduced (#96) and again in JO #105. As near as I
can figure, these would have been mid-1960s.
It may well be that DC has a list of villain names that have been
used and that are available, and that Tempus was one of them.
The Tempus that appeared in those two issues may have had little
resemblance to the one in L&C.
The same is the case with Metallo, whom I think I was confusing
with another villain when I mentioned him in one of my earliest
posts. I missed that L&C episode, but a review of the comic guide
shows a Metallo appearing in Adventure #276 which would have
been early to mid-1960s as near as I can tell. Action# 312 around
March/64 also had a "Metallo-Superman", and a Metallo appeared
in Superman 310, 316 and 317 in 1977, and #418 in 1986.
Superman 2nd series #1 in January 1987 indicates that Metallo
was "introduced," and so we seem to be talking several different
versions.
>In first season, almost no villains from the comics were used other
>than Lex Luthor, though when they had Vatman, he was something
>like Bizarro the imperfect clone of Superman
The first references I can find to Bizarro are late 50s or early 60s, the
same for Brainiac. Lex Luthor was there from near the beginning,
around 1940 (introduced in Action #23). Prankster and Toyman were
also very early villains, introduced in Action #51 and #64 respectively.
So was Mr. Mxyzptlk, introduced in Superman #30.
Another villain who appeared very early but seemed to fade away
after several appearances was The Puzzler (introduced in Action #49).
There are other villains who've also disappeared.
>INTERGANG was introduced in Church of Metropolis, with Bill
>Church as the head of Intergang, but in the comics it would have
>been Morgan Edge...
Intergang seems to have first appeared in the late 1980s (Action #643
and later #669, Adventures of Superman #457, Superman 2nd Series
#60).
>Other elements from the comics are... red Kryptonite (which is a
>pre-crisis facet of the comics)
Kryptonite was introduced in Superman #61, the origin of red
kryptonite explained in Superman #139, blue (bizarro) kryptonite
introduced in Superman #140 and gold in Superman #157. I believe
these would have been in the late 50s, early 60s timeframe.
>Zoo...@aol.com (oh, and you can find the "Zoomway" in
>Superman #37 among other issues ;)
Superman 2nd Series, I take it. <g>
There were a few other villain-related things I noted. There was
a villain called Ching or I-Ching who appeared in Superman #240
(early 70s). The Phantom Zone seems to have first appeared in
the very late 50s, Superboy #100. It also shows up early in
Adventure #283. There was a super-powered character (not a
villain) named Mon-El that I liked who was exiled to The Phantom
Zone to save his life from lead poisoning (his only weakness).
He was introduced in Superboy #89 and I think he later joined
the Legion of Super Heroes. I don't think he had any relationship
to Superman's "El" family, so maybe they stopped using him
to avoid confusion.
Two other villains I liked were Parasite and Zha-Vam. Parasite's
been around a lot, introduced in Action 340 (July/66) and has also
appeared post-crisis although I don't know if it's the same version.
Zha-Vam was introduced in Action #351 (June/67) for at least 3
issues, but I see no references to him after that. As I recall, he
was kind of a Greek-god, Zeus-like character who may have been
unearthed by Lana Lang's father the archaeologist.
Although they aren't villains, I also noted that Jimmy Olsen
(Action #6) and Perry White (Superman #7) were introduced
very early. Lana Lang was introduced in the Superboy series in
one of the earliest issues (Superboy #10, around 1950). Lois
was there from the start.
Getting back to Baron Sunday and Tempus, the only way the
former might have been created for TV is if he appeared first in
the Salkind Superboy series. There's no reference in the guide
to him being "Introduced" in the comics, although I was only
checking Superman-related titles and he could have come from
somewhere else. If anyone has access to Jimmy Olsen #96 or
#105, it would be interesting to know what that Tempus was like.
VARTOX
In article <4qeekn$e...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, kale...@aol.com (KalElFan)
writes:
>(BTW, Vartox, you appeared in Superman 373 to 375 and 390 to
>392, and in Action 498 and 499, which would have been around
>the very late 70s to the mid-80s. There may be other references
>but those were the only ones I noticed. Were you a good villain? <g>)
>
>
Tsk, tsk, tsk, Kal. I leave you guys for a couple of weeks while my
modem's busted and innuendoes about my namesake (and 9000 posts on Santa)
is what I come back to. ;)
Though they didn't meet on good terms initially, Superman and Vartox were
friends. Vartox almost married Lana Lang once, but I think his supposedly
dead ex-wife sort of put the kibosh on those plans.
(But if he ever comes back, I certainly hope he has a better costume.
Shorts, a vest and hip boots? Yikes!!!)
As for the origins of Tempus and Baron Sunday, I'll defer to Zoom's
previous explanation, since I wasn't reading the comics at those times.
But, the following I do know about
>There were a few other villain-related things I noted. There was
>a villain called Ching or I-Ching who appeared in Superman #240
>(early 70s). The Phantom Zone seems to have first appeared in
>the very late 50s, Superboy #100. It also shows up early in
>Adventure #283. There was a super-powered character (not a
>villain) named Mon-El that I liked who was exiled to The Phantom
>Zone to save his life from lead poisoning (his only weakness).
>He was introduced in Superboy #89 and I think he later joined
>the Legion of Super Heroes. I don't think he had any relationship
>to Superman's "El" family, so maybe they stopped using him
>to avoid confusion.
I Ching wasn't a villain, either. He was Wonder Woman's mentor when she
was forced to give up her Amazonian powers during one of her many revamps.
His appearance in Superman coincided with the attempt at that time to
depower Superman (which lasted about three issues, or when Denny O'Neil
left the book). His role eventually was to mediate the conflict
between....
(Slight pause here to give everyone a chance to bail out. I read the
thing, and I don't completely understand it)
...the Man of Steel and the Sand-Superman. The latter was created in a
freak accident that also transmuted all Kryptonite on Earth to iron.
The origin of said accident: An experiment was held which attempted to
harness the power of Kryptonite to replace Earth's dependence on
conventional fuels. Naturally, the thing blew up (literally) in
everyone's faces. The force of the blast drove Superman (though protected
by a substantial lead shield) into the desert, leaving an impression of
his body about six inches deep into the sand. The impression took form
when a denizen of the realm of Quarrm crossed the dimensional barrier and
assumed that form.
The Quarrmer (sorry, I forgot whether there are two "R"s or "M"s there),
whenever he drew near to Superman, siphoned off some of the Kryptonian's
powers. This lasted over a period of months (our time) until Kal-El was
completely powerless. I Ching's final task in this process - once the
powers were forgettably evened out - was to show the pair that both could
not simultaneously exist on the planet without eventually destroying
Earth. The impostor returned to his dimension with some of Superman's
powers, leaving Superman permanently less powerful than before. At least
until the next writer took over.
Mon-El, though he wasn't actually family, was mistaken originally by the
Boy of Steel for a long-lost brother. Mon, actually Lar Gand of the
planet Daxam, was (I think) suffering from amnesia when he first landed on
Earth. Since he had actually visited Krypton in his travels, he
apparently had some memento from his encounter with Jor-El (who helped him
get off Krypton quickly, as Krypton had a serious dislike of alien
visitors back then) which assisted to the confusion surrounding his
identity.
Mon-El was a popular character for years during his membership with the
Legion. He actually never left that I know of, but once the Crisis hit,
and Superboy became a non-factor in the origins of the LSH, he was renamed
Valor, and may now be a member of that group once again, as the current
Superboy similarly sent him to that century via a Phantom Zone-like
mechanism.
Colonel X
In article <4qh9n2$i...@newsbf02.news.aol.com> kale...@aol.com (KalElFan) writes:
>The same is the case with Metallo, whom I think I was confusing
>with another villain when I mentioned him in one of my earliest
>posts. I missed that L&C episode, but a review of the comic guide
>shows a Metallo appearing in Adventure #276 which would have
>been early to mid-1960s as near as I can tell. Action# 312 around
>March/64 also had a "Metallo-Superman", and a Metallo appeared
>in Superman 310, 316 and 317 in 1977, and #418 in 1986.
>Superman 2nd series #1 in January 1987 indicates that Metallo
>was "introduced," and so we seem to be talking several different
>versions.
This is off-topic, but I just wanted to point out here that Superman
#316, which an uncle gave to me as a visiting-gift, was one of my
favorite comics of youth, with a great cover. Never did learn how
the story finished (in 317), but certainly worth tracking down.
>Another villain who appeared very early but seemed to fade away
>after several appearances was The Puzzler (introduced in Action #49).
>There are other villains who've also disappeared.
Actually, of all places, the Puzzler turned up on "Batman," played by
Maurice Evans.
>
>There were a few other villain-related things I noted. There was
>a villain called Ching or I-Ching who appeared in Superman #240
>(early 70s). The Phantom Zone seems to have first appeared in
>the very late 50s, Superboy #100. It also shows up early in
>Adventure #283. There was a super-powered character (not a
>villain) named Mon-El that I liked who was exiled to The Phantom
>Zone to save his life from lead poisoning (his only weakness).
>He was introduced in Superboy #89 and I think he later joined
>the Legion of Super Heroes. I don't think he had any relationship
>to Superman's "El" family, so maybe they stopped using him
>to avoid confusion.
Mon-El got that name because he was thought to be a relation of Kal-El
and was "found" on a Monday. Mon-El was a very active part of Legion
continuity for years, but the second revamp of LSH continuity in
the 1990 LSH series, #4 or 5, saw a major change in their history.
The fellow in the red suit and the blue cape became known as "Valor"
and (I think) was actually a Daxamite.
>
>Two other villains I liked were Parasite and Zha-Vam. Parasite's
>been around a lot, introduced in Action 340 (July/66) and has also
>appeared post-crisis although I don't know if it's the same version.
>Zha-Vam was introduced in Action #351 (June/67) for at least 3
>issues, but I see no references to him after that. As I recall, he
>was kind of a Greek-god, Zeus-like character who may have been
>unearthed by Lana Lang's father the archaeologist.
Parasite would make a *great* villain for the show. I was all set to
send a spec script out via an agent to December 3rd during the middle
of season 2 that would have introduced him, but the big drive to the
character was that he was blind (hence his blank eyes), and rather
than just going around stealing heroes' powers, he stole people's sight
(temporarily) so he could see, robbing Superman's powers being a side
effect. A major plot element would have been Superman being blind--
in fact, it would have been the "30 minute cliffhanger" and driven
all through act 3 and most of act 4. I had just about got something
put together when I heard about Grant Rosenberg and Kathy McCormick's
"The Eyes Have It," which of course also deals with Superman being
blinded (in their case, by Dr. Light). Oh well!
>Getting back to Baron Sunday and Tempus, the only way the
>former might have been created for TV is if he appeared first in
>the Salkind Superboy series. There's no reference in the guide
>to him being "Introduced" in the comics, although I was only
>checking Superman-related titles and he could have come from
>somewhere else. If anyone has access to Jimmy Olsen #96 or
>#105, it would be interesting to know what that Tempus was like.
Sunday is definitely a comic villain. More of his caliber would
be nice. Doing the Parasite, Brainiac and Mr. Z would be superb.
On that note, the recently-finished Brainiac 4-part comic story was
interesting reading. The scope is waaaay beyond "Lois & Clark's"
abilities, but there's a scene in pt 4 where all the citizens of
Metropolis have become part of Brainiac's living computer and are
walking around, speaking binary out loud. It's very chilling and
would make simply great TV. Serious shocks like that, with a monster
like Brainiac behind them, are the sort of things I'd like to see.
Instead, we get the comical vibro-whammy making everyone do a hula
dance, with the pathetic Lame Brain Johnson behind it.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
On assignment in Athens, Georgia,
Colonel X.
Expect the unexpected.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Len Leshin
Personally, I would love for the writers to introduce Bizarro -- the real one, the
white, "Goodbye, Me am Superman" one, not the previous clone done back in season one.
I'd also like to see the pre-1980s mechanical Braniac on the show (I don't think the
show could do the new one well -- exposition would take too long). There's just
something menacing about a green dude with electrodes on his head.
--
Len L.
lle...@davlin.net
Mxyzptlk to Lois and Clark: "You're SUPPOSED ta get married! Heck,
I've already bought stock in Polybags!" --MOS #56
Christopher D Blue
In article <4qht1m$p...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, VARTOX <var...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>...the Man of Steel and the Sand-Superman. The latter was created in a
>freak accident that also transmuted all Kryptonite on Earth to iron.
>
though it was a trifle stale, and could use a bit of salt...
>The Quarrmer (sorry, I forgot whether there are two "R"s or "M"s there),
Two "R"s. You are right.
>Earth. The impostor returned to his dimension with some of Superman's
>powers, leaving Superman permanently less powerful than before. At least
>until the next writer took over.
>
1/3 less powerful, to be precise. Kind of a Superman "Lite."
>Mon-El was a popular character for years during his membership with the
>Legion. He actually never left that I know of, but once the Crisis hit,
>and Superboy became a non-factor in the origins of the LSH, he was renamed
>Valor, and may now be a member of that group once again, as the current
>Superboy similarly sent him to that century via a Phantom Zone-like
>mechanism.
>
Correction: Superboy *never* became a non-factor in the origins of
the Legion. What happened was that the Time Trapper appropriated one
moment of time. Basically he had the entire universe--a three-dimensional
cross section of the 4 dimensional spacetime continuum. He placed this
moment outside the normal universe, and in order to gain the necessary
energy to do anything with it, he destroyed most of it--basically
everything but Earth and Krypton. He then used this energy to initiate the
passage of time in this universe. Krypton and Earth developed, and they
did so much like they had in the pre-Crisis days. Eventually, Krypton blew
up, and Jor-El sent his son to Earth, where he was raised by the Kents,
and became Superboy--basically everything that happened in the pre-Crisis
universe is the way things happened here (The post-Crisis Superman
actually met and fought this Superboy, who was much more powerful--it was
your standard misunderstanding. Jonathan Kent managed to stop the fight by
exposing Superman to a container filled with every kind of kryptonite
known to man. It had no effect, of course, because even though Supes'
microscopic vision revealed it to truly be kryptonite, it still wasn't the
right stuff. In any case, Kent's interruption gave the two kryptonians a
chance to stop hitting each other and talk things out--which is when the
Legion showed up, ready for another misunderstanding...) In any case,
whenever the Legion had travelled into the past, it was explained, the
Time Trapper had shunted them into this pocket universe rather than the
real past. Once this was discovered, the pocket dimension really served no
further purpose. The Time Trapper killed Superboy, and to all appearances,
destroyed the pocket dimension.
In response, the Legionaires closest to Superboy (Mon-El, Duo
Damsel, Saturn Girl and Brainiac 5) formed a conspiracy to gain revenge.
This conspiracy was discovered, and the entire active Legion--with the
exception of the White Witch, who could not in good conscience be a part
of what was being planned demanded to be included. In the end, Brainiac 5
outsmarted everyone, and the 4 conspirators and Rond Vidar...and the
comatose form of Jaxon Rugarth, the Infinite Man went to the End of Time
to murder the Time Trapper. Vidar revealed himself as the heir to his
father's Green Lantern Ring and Power. In the end, The universal concepts
represented by the Infinite Man gave the Time Trapper pause...and
hesitation/doubt for him in the midst of the very embodiment of his
eventual victory was tantamount to death for him. The Infinite Man
disappeared in pitched combat, and was presumed dead. Vidar and Brainiac 5
came out with minimal injuries. Saturn Girl was severely burned, with most
of the hair being scorched from her head. One of Duo Damsel was killed,
leaving her essentially powerless (when Brainiac 5 left the Legion shortly
thereafter, he gave her his force field belt). Mon-El was critically
injured, with 3rd degree burns over his entire body, and was in a coma.
For the rest of the series, he was being cared for by longtime girlfriend
Night Girl. When in a subsequent adventure, Darkseid caused a
universe-wide blackout for several moments, his life support equipment
failed, and he flatlined, much to NG's chagrin. The series was cancelled
without any further info being revealed, and then a few months later, the
revamped Legion of Superheroes title was introduced, beginning five years
later. I didn't read that particular title, however, so I don't know how
he came back as Valor, though I have indeed seen him on a cover or two.
Later,
--Blue!
----------------------------------- |-| *
|-| _ * __
Those fools on the Science Council--THEY LAUGHED AT ME! |-| | * |/'
They said I was MAD...that my theories wouldn't work! |-| |~*~~~o~|
But I'll show them--I'LL SHOW THE ENTIRE WORLD!!! |-| | O o *|
/___\ |o___O__|
Brad Ferguson
In article <23JUN96.14...@128.192.253.5>, Colonel X
<GOG...@MUSIC.CC.UGA.EDU> wrote:
> In article <4qh9n2$i...@newsbf02.news.aol.com> kale...@aol.com
(KalElFan) writes:
> >The same is the case with Metallo, whom I think I was confusing
> >with another villain when I mentioned him in one of my earliest
> >posts. I missed that L&C episode, but a review of the comic guide
> >shows a Metallo appearing in Adventure #276 which would have
> >been early to mid-1960s as near as I can tell. Action# 312 around
> >March/64 also had a "Metallo-Superman", and a Metallo appeared
> >in Superman 310, 316 and 317 in 1977, and #418 in 1986.
> >Superman 2nd series #1 in January 1987 indicates that Metallo
> >was "introduced," and so we seem to be talking several different
> >versions.
The original Metallo (ca. 1958) was a second-rate crook, a murderer, who
was involved in a car accident. A kindly scientist found him and saved
the crook's life by transplanting his human head onto a robot body powered
by a chunk of green kryptonite in the chest. The crook then killed the
scientist. The crook operates without fear of Superman because everytime
Supes gets too close, he keels over. Metallo dies at the end of the story
and never comes back -- at least, not until after the Crisis.
The Metallo-Superman in Action Comics is actually a Metallo Clark Kent.
Red kryptonite splits Superman and Clark Kent into two separate people,
and apparently drives Superman power-mad. Superman sets himself up as
King of Earth (he even wears a crown and an ermine cape, and he flies
while clutching a sceptre), and Clark plots to overthrow him. In the
course of things, the non-super Clark is mortally wounded, and the people
of Atlantis (I know, I know) save his life by turning him into a Metallo.
Clark then tries to kill Superman with the kryptonite in _his_ chest.
However, Superman's takeover turns out to have been a gambit to safeguard
Earth from an alien invasion, and the Metallo Clark is harmlessly
reabsorbed into Superman as the effects of the red kryptonite wear off.
I don't have anything about Metallo's appearances in the 1970s.
> This is off-topic, but I just wanted to point out here that Superman
> #316, which an uncle gave to me as a visiting-gift, was one of my
> favorite comics of youth, with a great cover. Never did learn how
> the story finished (in 317), but certainly worth tracking down.
Sure you don't mean Action 316 and 317? I could look 'em up if you do.
> Actually, of all places, the Puzzler turned up on "Batman," played by
> Maurice Evans.
Just a coincidence. They couldn't get Gorshin to repeat as the Riddler,
and they didn't want Astin again, so they had Evans as the Puzzler rather
than do a third Riddler (although they did three Messrs. Freeze and three
Catwomen if you count Lee Meriwether).
> >There were a few other villain-related things I noted. There was
> >a villain called Ching or I-Ching who appeared in Superman #240
> >(early 70s).
I think I-Ching was actually Wonder Woman's mystic pal. He played a part
in helping Superman recover from the power-draining effects of the Sand
Thing.
> >The Phantom Zone seems to have first appeared in
> >the very late 50s, Superboy #100. It also shows up early in
> >Adventure #283.
It was in Adventure first. I think Superboy found the projector on an
asteroid, brought it home, and accidentally zapped himself into the Zone.
Pa got him out.
> >There was a super-powered character (not a
> >villain) named Mon-El that I liked who was exiled to The Phantom
> >Zone to save his life from lead poisoning (his only weakness).
> >He was introduced in Superboy #89 and I think he later joined
> >the Legion of Super Heroes. I don't think he had any relationship
> >to Superman's "El" family, so maybe they stopped using him
> >to avoid confusion.
>
> Mon-El got that name because he was thought to be a relation of Kal-El
> and was "found" on a Monday. Mon-El was a very active part of Legion
> continuity for years, but the second revamp of LSH continuity in
> the 1990 LSH series, #4 or 5, saw a major change in their history.
> The fellow in the red suit and the blue cape became known as "Valor"
> and (I think) was actually a Daxamite.
Mon-El was always a Daxamite. In the story that introduced him, there was
some evidence that Mon-El was Superboy's older brother, and he really did
come from a red-sun world. It took a thousand years, but Brainiac 5
finally cured Mon-El's vulnerability to lead -- with a solution of green
kryptonite.
> >Two other villains I liked were Parasite and Zha-Vam. Parasite's
> >been around a lot, introduced in Action 340 (July/66) and has also
> >appeared post-crisis although I don't know if it's the same version.
> >Zha-Vam was introduced in Action #351 (June/67) for at least 3
> >issues, but I see no references to him after that. As I recall, he
> >was kind of a Greek-god, Zeus-like character who may have been
> >unearthed by Lana Lang's father the archaeologist.
The Zha-Vam arc was the last, I think, illustrated by the great Wayne
Boring (as well as being the first work he had done in the comics for
years). Wayne had been doing the newspaper strip, and I gather that his
output slowed as he grew older. As I recall, Zha-Vam had been empowered
by the Greek gods (whose initials made up his name) so they would remain
important. After Superman defeats Zha-Vam (with magic from other
cultures, I think), he goes to the long-abandoned Mt. Olympus, which is in
ruins: No one has worshipped those gods in centuries, and so they have
ceased to exist.
> >If anyone has access to Jimmy Olsen #96 or
> >#105, it would be interesting to know what that Tempus was like.
He was just a stupid villain with a clock gimmick, as I recall. There was
something about him predicting disasters with a big, fancy clock, and
profiting thereby. I think some sort of fraud was involved, too.
--
Stop by and set a spell at http://www.fred.net/thirteen/
KalElFan
In article <thirteen-240...@thirteen.fred.net>,
thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>In article <23JUN96.14...@128.192.253.5>, Colonel X
><GOG...@MUSIC.CC.UGA.EDU> wrote:
>> This is off-topic, but I just wanted to point out here that Superman
>> #316, which an uncle gave to me as a visiting-gift, was one of my
>> favorite comics of youth, with a great cover. Never did learn how
>> the story finished (in 317), but certainly worth tracking down.
>
>Sure you don't mean Action 316 and 317? I could look 'em up if you do.
It was Superman 316 and 317 according to the guide I have.
>The Zha-Vam arc was the last, I think, illustrated by the great Wayne
>Boring (as well as being the first work he had done in the comics for
>years)
The guide says it was Boring, and that he had worked on 6 Action
Comics shortly before the 3-part Zha Vam series and another 3 after.
Prior to that, it looks to have been about 5 or 6 years since his last
work. And his stuff did look great.
>As I recall, Zha-Vam had been empowered by the Greek gods
>(whose initials made up his name)
I just bought the first two issues in that three-part series, along
with several other comics over the past few days. His name was
indeed an acronym (Zeus, Hercules, Achilles, Vulcan. Apollo,
Mercury), which should make him a great villain for the Internet
Age. <g>. He also had a belt with other letters that he'd coerce
Superman into choosing from among, which would give him the
powers of another god starting with that letter. Unless the Lana
Lang's father unearthing him stuff is revealed in Part 3, it must
be my memory or imagination mixing the story up with that old
Superboy and the mummy issue, or something else. But heck,
I was nine years old at the time.
>> >[Kalelfan earlier wrote]
>> >If anyone has access to Jimmy Olsen #96 or #105, it
>> >would be interesting to know what that Tempus was like.
>
>He was just a stupid villain with a clock gimmick, as I recall.
I picked up #105, and he was a master of clockworks whose
abilities extended to other precision mechanisms, like thousands
of Jimmy Olsen androids he populated an asteroid with. <g> It
looks like he used them in a plot to navigate the asteroid and
send it on a collision course with Earth. In an earlier comic that's
referred to, he apparently had it in for Superman for some reason.
The whole issue is pretty stupid, typical of many of those Jimmy
Olsen comics. It didn't seem that stupid when I was nine, though.
The second story in the first two Zha-Vam Action issues has a
reprint of an imaginary story dealing with the marriage of Jimmy
Olsen and Supergirl. That one's actually kind of cute.
It would be nice to see Bizarro, Brainiac, Parasite, Mr. Mxyzptlk,
as well as Baron Sunday, Tempus, and Luthor back in season 4.
Throw in Ching and a few down-to-earth Intergang and NIA types,
and you've got a formidable cast of villains. Zha-Vam may be a bit
too obscure for them.
Off the villain topic, but I'll add a Supergirl cameo to my wish list
along with the Batman one that most people seem to like the idea
of. They're starting a new Supergirl monthly comic in July and
here's spoiler space...
C
O
M
I
C
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
She apparently gets connected somehow to Linda Danvers, the
secret identity of the pre-crisis Kara. Someone in r.a.c.dc.u
has speculated that Kara's spirit, which apparently survived
post-crisis, somehow gets merged with Matrix, effectively bringing
back the Kara version of Supergirl without ticking off any Matrix
fans. The promo ads for the series ("they told her to get a life, they
didn't say whose") suggest the speculation may not be that far off.
One way or another, Matrix apparently moves closer to the pre-
crisis version, which is a step in the right direction IMHO.
I did have qualms about Supergirl showing up in season 4, on the
theory it might signal TPTB's intent to end L&C in favor of a
spinoff. But there's no guarantee of a fifth season anyway, so they
may as well go with it this season. Besides, there's nothing to
stop them from running both as they do with Star Trek. I gather
TBAA has a spinoff on CBS this year as well.
flo...@nightl.com
I have a wildly off topic question. Did everyone hate the Crisis as much as I
did. Am I the only person who liked the mulitiple universe world of DC Comics?
Why did Kara/Supergirl have to die? Not related to crisis, why did we get the
butt head Jason as Robin. On the other hand, I like what they have done to the
Superman Comic and television show (although they are worlds apart). I still
like Jimmy Olsen as my favorite side character, ever since I saw the Superman
series with George Reeves when I was little. DId anyone else watch that.
Okay, done with my wildly off topic post. Thank you very much.
Flower
Jean M. Cousins
> Not related to crisis, why did we get the
>butt head Jason as Robin.
>
So we could enjoy supreme satisfaction at seeing him killed off and
replaced with Tim Drake.
Tim-fan,
Jeanie
Brad Ferguson
> I have a wildly off topic question. Did everyone hate the Crisis as
much as I
> did. Am I the only person who liked the mulitiple universe world of
DC Comics?
> Why did Kara/Supergirl have to die? Not related to crisis, why did
we get the
> butt head Jason as Robin. On the other hand, I like what they have
done to the
> Superman Comic and television show (although they are worlds apart).
I still
> like Jimmy Olsen as my favorite side character, ever since I saw the
Superman
> series with George Reeves when I was little. DId anyone else watch that.
> Okay, done with my wildly off topic post. Thank you very much.
>
> Flower
I think there were ways to solve DC's continuity problems without
destroying thirty years of storylines, yes. I loved the Earth-One and
Earth-Two stuff.
Kara/Supergirl was killed off because the character was going nowhere.
She'd done well as the "B" feature in Action Comics years before, but
comics had changed, and Supergirl had never been popular enough to sustain
her own book for long. The only reason to keep her alive would have been
if the 1984 feature SUPERGIRL had been successful, but it was a gigantic
disaster. When all the returns were in, they gave up and killed her.
It doesn't matter much, because the post-Crisis version of Superman came
along a few months later, and Kara/Supergirl became a non-person forever.
KalElFan
writes:
>Mon-El, though he wasn't actually family, was mistaken originally by the
>Boy of Steel for a long-lost brother. Mon, actually Lar Gand of the
>planet Daxam, was (I think) suffering from amnesia when he first landed
>on Earth. Since he had actually visited Krypton in his travels, he
>apparently had some memento from his encounter with Jor-El (who helped
>him get off Krypton quickly, as Krypton had a serious dislike of alien
>visitors back then) which assisted to the confusion surrounding his
>identity.
>
>Mon-El was a popular character for years during his membership with the
>Legion. He actually never left that I know of, but once the Crisis hit,
>and Superboy became a non-factor in the origins of the LSH, he was re-
>named Valor, and may now be a member of that group once again, as
>the current Superboy similarly sent him to that century via a Phantom
>Zone-like mechanism.
And the Colonel also posted about the Mon-El character, saying he was
named that because he arrived on a Monday.
Having done a little more research on the comic side lately, I just wanted
to add a few things I came across. Mon-El was indeed a Daxamite,
and that race has apparently been used in the comics quite a few times
since. In some of the upcoming comics, a Daxamite is apparently a villain.
I'm assuming Mon-El came first, and that his popularity led to others
of his race being introduced over the years.
He was renamed Valor after the crisis and even had his own comic book
for a couple of years around 1992-94, which seems to have ended around
the time of the Zero Hour storyline. I read somewhere that he's now been
renamed again M'Onel.
So Vartox, would this be another example of Crisis mismanagement?
It seems they've taken a popular part of the folklore and fiddled with
him until he just about burned to the ground. Oh, well, at least he
spawned all those Daxamites...
KalElFan
thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>Kara/Supergirl was killed off because the character was going nowhere.
>She'd done well as the "B" feature in Action Comics years before, but
>comics had changed, and Supergirl had never been popular enough to
>sustain her own book for long. The only reason to keep her alive would
>have been if the 1984 feature SUPERGIRL had been successful, but it
>was a gigantic disaster. When all the returns were in, they gave up and
>killed her.
>
>It doesn't matter much, because the post-Crisis version of Superman
>came along a few months later, and Kara/Supergirl became a non-
>person forever.
Hopefully even the Crisis isn't forever. <g>
Some of the most recent comic spoilers for the August release of the
new Supergirl comic call into question whether the Linda Danvers
character is really a move to make Matrix more like Kara, but in any
event I think it remains a mistake to have killed Kara off.
The failure of the movie was the direct result of the Salkinds'
incompetence, which became apparent with Superman III. They
obviously had no understanding of what made the first two films
successful, and just lucked out with Donner and a few others
who obviously did understand what they were doing.
Supergirl was a great supporting character from her introduction,
which I understand was in Action 252 around 1959. By the time they
tried to give her her own comic in 1972, even the longer-established
titles like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane were on their way out. Did
that mean that Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane should have been killed
off, because they could no longer support separate titles?
They tried again in 82-83, an economically ridiculous time to try
anything when you look back on it. Then the movie failed, but
it needn't have if they hadn't already destroyed the series with
Superman III.
They're in a similar situation now. Up until Tempus, Anyone? they
had a very successful TV series that held great promise for a
Supergirl spinoff. Assuming they haven't destroyed their prospects
with the arc and what followed, and can put L&C back on top this
season with the wedding, then a Supergirl TV series might still
be a big success. But the problem is they're stuck with this shape-
shifting imposter instead of the genuine article. IMHO people won't buy
it if she isn't Superman's cousin. If they want any chance of a
successful Supergirl TV series, they should bring Kara back.
If I'm wrong and they can succeed with Matrix, then I think I'm going
to give up TV before they hit us with Odo: The Next Generation.
Brad Ferguson
In article <4r3qge$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, kale...@aol.com (KalElFan)
wrote:
> Hopefully even the Crisis isn't forever. <g>
I hope not! I hasten to add that I liked Kara, and I found the prospect
of her resurrection in SUPERMAN/ALIENS exciting -- until they went limp
and decided it wasn't really Kara and that wasn't really Argo City. Very,
very disappointing.
>
> Some of the most recent comic spoilers for the August release of the
> new Supergirl comic call into question whether the Linda Danvers
> character is really a move to make Matrix more like Kara, but in any
> event I think it remains a mistake to have killed Kara off.
I don't know a thing about this. Linda Danvers is back? Wowsers.
>
> The failure of the movie was the direct result of the Salkinds'
> incompetence, which became apparent with Superman III. They
> obviously had no understanding of what made the first two films
> successful, and just lucked out with Donner and a few others
> who obviously did understand what they were doing.
Absolutely agreed. The Salkinds were hacks. They had no idea what these
characters were about.
> Supergirl was a great supporting character from her introduction,
> which I understand was in Action 252 around 1959. By the time they
> tried to give her her own comic in 1972, even the longer-established
> titles like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane were on their way out. Did
> that mean that Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane should have been killed
> off, because they could no longer support separate titles?
No, it doesn't. It remains true, though, that Kara was killed off because
she was perceived as expendable. I think they were wrong to do it.
> They're in a similar situation now. Up until Tempus, Anyone? they
> had a very successful TV series that held great promise for a
> Supergirl spinoff. Assuming they haven't destroyed their prospects
> with the arc and what followed, and can put L&C back on top this
> season with the wedding, then a Supergirl TV series might still
> be a big success. But the problem is they're stuck with this shape-
> shifting imposter instead of the genuine article. IMHO people won't buy
> it if she isn't Superman's cousin. If they want any chance of a
> successful Supergirl TV series, they should bring Kara back.
Of course, they can do anything they want in a TV series, including using
Kara as Supergirl. (Example: The resurrected Barry Allen on THE FLASH.)
I agree with you that she has to be Kara and not Matrix. It'd be a cool
show, if they can ever work it out.
Would they double-program L&C and SUPERGIRL? Maybe. Been done before, by
that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
it's been a very long time.
Len Leshin
Brad Ferguson wrote:
> No, it doesn't. It remains true, though, that Kara was killed off because
> she was perceived as expendable. I think they were wrong to do it.
Actually, Supergirl was killed not because of her failure to carry a comic book or any fault of her character
as a supporting role in the Superman family. It's just that at the time Crisis was written, DC had decided
that Kal-El would really become the Last Son of Krypton, with no other surviving people or animals.
However, there is the upcoming story line about a city in a bottle...is Kandor about to make a reappearance in
the comics?
And I do miss Kara....
S.E. Morris
In article <thirteen-300...@thirteen.fred.net>,
thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>In article <4r3qge$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, kale...@aol.com (KalElFan)
>wrote:
>
>> Hopefully even the Crisis isn't forever. <g>
>
>I hope not! I hasten to add that I liked Kara, and I found the prospect
>of her resurrection in SUPERMAN/ALIENS exciting -- until they went limp
>and decided it wasn't really Kara and that wasn't really Argo City. Very,
>very disappointing.
[snipped...]
>>
>> Supergirl was a great supporting character from her introduction,
>> which I understand was in Action 252 around 1959. By the time they
>> tried to give her her own comic in 1972, even the longer-established
>> titles like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane were on their way out. Did
>> that mean that Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane should have been killed
>> off, because they could no longer support separate titles?
>
>No, it doesn't. It remains true, though, that Kara was killed off because
>she was perceived as expendable. I think they were wrong to do it.
>
Plus DC wanted Supes to be the only survivor of Krypton.
>> They're in a similar situation now. Up until Tempus, Anyone? they
>> had a very successful TV series that held great promise for a
>> Supergirl spinoff. Assuming they haven't destroyed their prospects
>> with the arc and what followed, and can put L&C back on top this
>> season with the wedding, then a Supergirl TV series might still
>> be a big success. But the problem is they're stuck with this shape-
>> shifting imposter instead of the genuine article. IMHO people won't buy
>> it if she isn't Superman's cousin. If they want any chance of a
>> successful Supergirl TV series, they should bring Kara back.
>
>Of course, they can do anything they want in a TV series, including using
>Kara as Supergirl. (Example: The resurrected Barry Allen on THE FLASH.)
>I agree with you that she has to be Kara and not Matrix. It'd be a cool
>show, if they can ever work it out.
Agreed. The tv show has it's own continuity separate to the regular
DC Universe. If L&C do introduce a Supergirl character (and that's a
*big* if) I suspect it will be based upon the 'traditional' Supergirl
(Kara) as this is the version which the general public at large are
familiar with. Bringing in the new 'blob' version (Matrix) would
only cause them un-necessary problems because it would confuse the
general public - most of whom don't know anything about Crisis etc.
Besides, Kara's origin is a lot easier to tell than Matrix's (this
assuming they stick to the comicbook origins). To introduce Matrix
would require a fair amount of information about the current Superman/
DC Universe.
>Would they double-program L&C and SUPERGIRL? Maybe. Been done before, by
>that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
>it's been a very long time.
You mean split multi-parters between shows?
I doubt this. They learned their lesson doing this when they tried
to put the SMDM and BW into syndication. A lot of the multi-parters were
threaded between the two shows - and this lead to opening/closing titles
and captions needing to be redone on many episodes so that a story
could be transfered entirely into one series or another.
It would also cause real headaches when they sell L&C/SGirl abroad.
-FISH- ><>
Colonel X
In article <thirteen-300...@thirteen.fred.net> thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>Would they double-program L&C and SUPERGIRL? Maybe. Been done before, by
>that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
>it's been a very long time.
Well, they've already used the bionics' anmesia, which was hackneyed
even then, so I don't see why they shouldn't at least offer a companion
show to the web. (A companion "Supergirl" show might even be more
successful than "Lois & Clark"...the first season of "Bionic Woman" did
better business than "Six Million" ever did.)
Another example of trying to keep a superhero show going past its
sell-by date: "The Greatest American Heroine." (All right, that example
failed, but it's one heck of a neat TV oddity.)
Brad Ferguson
> In article <thirteen-300...@thirteen.fred.net>,
> thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
> >In article <4r3qge$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, kale...@aol.com (KalElFan)
> >wrote:
> >> Supergirl was a great supporting character from her introduction,
> >> which I understand was in Action 252 around 1959. By the time they
> >> tried to give her her own comic in 1972, even the longer-established
> >> titles like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane were on their way out. Did
> >> that mean that Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane should have been killed
> >> off, because they could no longer support separate titles?
> >
> >No, it doesn't. It remains true, though, that Kara was killed off because
> >she was perceived as expendable. I think they were wrong to do it.
> >
>
> Plus DC wanted Supes to be the only survivor of Krypton.
Not really -- at least, not by killing off Supergirl. There was no
possibility that Superman could be the only Kryptonian survivor in the
old, pre-Crisis continuity. More than a billion Kandorians were
inhabiting their version of New Krypton, and there were other Kryptonians
trapped in the Phantom Zone. This doesn't even count the odd Kryptonian
refugee, rocket scientist or space pirate Superman encountered then and
again.
The only way to make Superman the only survivor of Krypton was to
thoroughly change his backstory, which they did, post-Crisis. The death
of Kara was an attention grabber. DC doomed a character it felt had been
played out.
> >Would they double-program L&C and SUPERGIRL? Maybe. Been done before, by
> >that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
> >it's been a very long time.
>
> You mean split multi-parters between shows?
>
> I doubt this. They learned their lesson doing this when they tried
> to put the SMDM and BW into syndication. A lot of the multi-parters were
> threaded between the two shows - and this lead to opening/closing titles
> and captions needing to be redone on many episodes so that a story
> could be transfered entirely into one series or another.
>
> It would also cause real headaches when they sell L&C/SGirl abroad.
I agree with you there. Arcing stories between series leads to
syndication nightmares. No, what I had in mind was the simultaneous
scheduling of two series joined at the hip, perhaps with a character or
two in common, but with diveging storylines. I'd said the last time it
was done was back in the Bionic Era, but of course Trek has been doing it
in syndication since DS9 was linked to Next Gen.
S.E. Morris
In article <thirteen-020...@thirteen.fred.net>,
thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>In article <DtwvE...@csc.liv.ac.uk>, fi...@csc.liv.ac.uk (S.E. Morris) wrote:
>>
>> Plus DC wanted Supes to be the only survivor of Krypton.
>
>Not really -- at least, not by killing off Supergirl. There was no
>possibility that Superman could be the only Kryptonian survivor in the
>old, pre-Crisis continuity. More than a billion Kandorians were
>inhabiting their version of New Krypton, and there were other Kryptonians
>trapped in the Phantom Zone. This doesn't even count the odd Kryptonian
>refugee, rocket scientist or space pirate Superman encountered then and
>again.
>
>The only way to make Superman the only survivor of Krypton was to
>thoroughly change his backstory, which they did, post-Crisis. The death
>of Kara was an attention grabber. DC doomed a character it felt had been
>played out.
>
Yes - I suppose you are correct. They way DC re-wrote Superman's history
post-Crisis meant that Supergirl could not have had any place in it anyway.
Thus killing her off in Crisis was, as you say, an attention grabber.
>> >Would they double-program L&C and SUPERGIRL? Maybe. Been done before, by
>> >that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
>> >it's been a very long time.
>>
>> You mean split multi-parters between shows?
>>
>> I doubt this. They learned their lesson doing this when they tried
>> to put the SMDM and BW into syndication. A lot of the multi-parters were
>> threaded between the two shows - and this lead to opening/closing titles
>> and captions needing to be redone on many episodes so that a story
>> could be transfered entirely into one series or another.
>>
>> It would also cause real headaches when they sell L&C/SGirl abroad.
>
>I agree with you there. Arcing stories between series leads to
>syndication nightmares. No, what I had in mind was the simultaneous
>scheduling of two series joined at the hip, perhaps with a character or
>two in common, but with diveging storylines. I'd said the last time it
>was done was back in the Bionic Era, but of course Trek has been doing it
>in syndication since DS9 was linked to Next Gen.
Yes, your failure to mention DS9,etc was what lead me to assume you might
be refering to threaded storylines. Trek though doesn't really share
characters between it's shows much - not like Richard Anderson on the
SMDM and BW (who played OSI boss Oscar Goldman in both, btw.)
I see no real reason why this could not be done with a L&C spin-off...
but I am not sure of any characters who could be written into both shows
(apart from occasional guest slots). Jimmy is the only obvious candidate -
he could work in the same office as L&C, and also be the boyfriend of
Supergirl. I can't see any other L&C character who could easily be made
a regular on both shows apart from him.
-FISH- ><>
Brad Ferguson
> I see no real reason why this could not be done with a L&C spin-off...
> but I am not sure of any characters who could be written into both shows
> (apart from occasional guest slots). Jimmy is the only obvious candidate -
> he could work in the same office as L&C, and also be the boyfriend of
> Supergirl. I can't see any other L&C character who could easily be made
> a regular on both shows apart from him.
Oddly, that's exactly what they did in the SUPERGIRL movie. Marc McClure
was the only actor to repeat from the SUPERMAN arc.
S.E. Morris
In article <02JUL96.14...@128.192.253.5>,
Colonel X <GOG...@MUSIC.CC.UGA.EDU> writes:
>In article <thirteen-300...@thirteen.fred.net> thir...@fred.net (Brad Ferguson) writes:
>>that network, with THE SIX MILLION DOLLAR MAN and THE BIONIC WOMAN -- but
>>it's been a very long time.
>
>even then, so I don't see why they shouldn't at least offer a companion
>show to the web. (A companion "Supergirl" show might even be more
>successful than "Lois & Clark"...the first season of "Bionic Woman" did
>better business than "Six Million" ever did.)
This is true! :-> I wonder if studio/netork are aware of this? :->
>Another example of trying to keep a superhero show going past its
>sell-by date: "The Greatest American Heroine." (All right, that example
>failed, but it's one heck of a neat TV oddity.)
Urg! I can't say I liked it much - although I suppose it had *some*
potential.
Maybe a better example of how a (female) spin off could be successful was
the 60s Batman show. At the end of the second season the show was getting
good ratings, but the demographics had changed. Originally the show
was watched by adults and children alike, but during the second season
the adults share dropped (but the children's share grew). The network
figured it wasn't worth spending cash on new episodes only watched by
kids - the show was *very* expensive to make and kids apparantly don't
mind watching repeats as much as adults. The shows Producer wanted to
win back the adult audience - so he brought in a new character, Batgirl.
Originally the plan was to give her her own series, which would run
earlier in the evening before Batman. The shows would be linked by
plot - a cliff hanger in the Batgirl show being resolved in Batman.
In the end the studio/network chickened out - and she was integrated
into the existing Batman show. She proved very popular and managed to
bring back a lot of the adult audience (yes - you guessed it - mainly
because the men wanted to watch!!)
If only they had been more bold and given her her own show they may
have had another hit series on their hands.
(They decided they had enough episodes to go to synication after the
third season, and bolldozed the massive batcave set. Only a few days
later NBC said they wanted the show to switch network to them for a fourth
season - but with the costly sets destroyed they quickly backed down!)
-FISH- ><>
jason_lebeau
> >Another example of trying to keep a superhero show going past its
> >sell-by date: "The Greatest American Heroine." (All right, that example
> >failed, but it's one heck of a neat TV oddity.)
>
Greatest American Heroine ?!? i can't say that that series made it down under. if i
remember correctly William Katt, Robert Clup and Connie Sellica were in the Greatest
American Hero. Who were the lead charaters in Greatest American Heroine
---
jase
Brad Ferguson
"The Greatest American Heroine" was a pilot shot in 1986 (four years after
the original series ended) in an attempt to revive the GAH franchise on
NBC. (The show originally ran on ABC.) In syndication, the one-hour
pilot serves as the final episode of THE GREATEST AMERICAN HERO.
The show is rather silly and very, very rushed. After operating with Bill
for five years, Ralph is unmasked as the Hero and becomes famous. It all
goes to his head -- TV appearances, Wheaties endorsements, etc. Soon
enough, the aliens come back and order Ralph to give the suit to a
successor, to be chosen by him. (Transferring the suit will also make
everyone forget Ralph was ever the Hero, and it will erase all records of
same.) Without consulting Bill, Ralph picks Holly Hathaway, a
frizzy-haired environmental activist with an adopted daughter. Thus, a
mortified Bill finds himself partnered with a "skirt." Ralph and Pam say
goodbye to Bill.
Holly wants her and Bill to go off to save some whales, and an unwilling
Bill agrees. There's a big fight in a tavern frequented by sailors, plans
are laid to save the whales, and then the story suddenly ends with a short
scene in which we're told the mission went well, and Bill quietly
determines to make this new relatonship work. Clearly, "Heroine" is only
the core of what was supposed to be a two-hour premiere for the new
series.
Purists have noted that the suit in "Heroine" is made of shiny Lycra
instead of the fabric used in the original series, and that the same suit
fits both Ralph and the smaller and far bustier Hathaway perfectly.
Christopher D Blue
In article <thirteen-030...@thirteen.fred.net>,
Brad Ferguson <thir...@fred.net> wrote:
>Oddly, that's exactly what they did in the SUPERGIRL movie. Marc McClure
>was the only actor to repeat from the SUPERMAN arc.
Which is not to say that he's the only actor they tried to *get*
to put in an appearance in Supergirl...