Crossover Guide Update

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Keith Gow

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Aug 13, 2002, 1:38:35 AM8/13/02
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http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html

- Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
- Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
- Added "Entertainment Tonight" as a link to "Chicago Hope" (they
aired an episode that was supposed to be an episode of ET, just as
"X-Files" had an episode that was supposed to be "Cops")

-- Keith Gow --

"I'm not going to let my favorite shows get crappy
because then I won't watch them anymore."
- Joss Whedon on Buffy, Angel and Firefly

RESchwalb

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Aug 13, 2002, 8:30:04 AM8/13/02
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Keith wrote:

<< - Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?) >>

Not a link, but worth mentioning: in a first season ep (IIRC) of Six Feet
Under, David and Keith are watching Oz on their TV.

Robin

Ashley

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Aug 13, 2002, 9:47:58 AM8/13/02
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kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d589b58...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...

Very nice,

very nice indeed.

The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.

And I see you haven't weighed in on The Tonight Show yet.

ash


"I'm getting better, honest. In fact, from here on, you're going to see
a drastic distraction reduction. Drastic distraction reduction... try
saying that ten times fast."
-Buffy, "Homecoming"

PaulJ

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Aug 13, 2002, 12:50:29 PM8/13/02
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kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d589b58...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...
> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>
> - Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
> importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
> - Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
> - Added "Entertainment Tonight" as a link to "Chicago Hope" (they
> aired an episode that was supposed to be an episode of ET, just as
> "X-Files" had an episode that was supposed to be "Cops")
>

Fantastic, as ever. But, umm...

ET?

This differs from the fictional Tonight Show in Caroline in the City
and Larry Sanders how?

I ask merely for information...

Keith Gow

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Aug 14, 2002, 12:01:09 AM8/14/02
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On 13 Aug 2002 09:50:29 -0700, pg...@hotmail.com (PaulJ) waxed
lyrical:

Well, The X-Files had an entire episode that was an episode of Cops -
nothing else, no view outside it was an episode of Cops. Same thing
with Chicago Hope - the entire hour was an ET special episode.

I'm starting to agree that if the fictional characters appear on the
Tonight Show you might be right, but that also gets out of hand. I'm
sure there are a lot more than Caroline in the City and then it opens
it up to a whole lot more shows.

Or maybe I'll just delete Cops and ET.

Keith Gow

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Aug 14, 2002, 12:02:49 AM8/14/02
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On 13 Aug 2002 06:47:58 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d589b58...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...
>> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>>
>> - Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
>> importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
>> - Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
>> - Added "Entertainment Tonight" as a link to "Chicago Hope" (they
>> aired an episode that was supposed to be an episode of ET, just as
>> "X-Files" had an episode that was supposed to be "Cops")
>>
>> -- Keith Gow --
>>
>> "I'm not going to let my favorite shows get crappy
>> because then I won't watch them anymore."
>> - Joss Whedon on Buffy, Angel and Firefly
>
>Very nice,
>
>very nice indeed.
>
>The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.
>

Whoops. I've changed it in my version...

This means that X-F should touch SVU, too, though, right? I'm not sure
I'm prepated to do that! It would mean all Munches appearances have to
touch SVU.

>And I see you haven't weighed in on The Tonight Show yet.
>

Well, I will... Soon.

Ashley

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Aug 14, 2002, 12:04:32 PM8/14/02
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kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d59d61e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...

> On 13 Aug 2002 06:47:58 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
> lyrical:
>
> >kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d589b58...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...
> >> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
> >>
<snip>

> >
> >Very nice,
> >
> >very nice indeed.
> >
> >The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.
> >
>
> Whoops. I've changed it in my version...
>
> This means that X-F should touch SVU, too, though, right? I'm not sure
> I'm prepated to do that! It would mean all Munches appearances have to
> touch SVU.

Not in my mind, The Beat should <only in my view> touch SVU because
Munch was n SVU when he crossed. he was Homicide when he crossed to
X-Files.
That's the difference in my mind.

>
> >And I see you haven't weighed in on The Tonight Show yet.
> >
>
> Well, I will... Soon.

I just found where you weighed in, by deciding not to play, no fun!

ash

"If you consider the multiple Jay Lenos"

Keith Gow

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Aug 15, 2002, 1:35:30 AM8/15/02
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On 14 Aug 2002 09:04:32 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d59d61e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...
>> On 13 Aug 2002 06:47:58 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
>> lyrical:
>>
>> >kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote in message news:<3d589b58...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>...
>> >> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>> >>
><snip>
>> >
>> >Very nice,
>> >
>> >very nice indeed.
>> >
>> >The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.
>> >
>>
>> Whoops. I've changed it in my version...
>>
>> This means that X-F should touch SVU, too, though, right? I'm not sure
>> I'm prepated to do that! It would mean all Munches appearances have to
>> touch SVU.
>
>Not in my mind, The Beat should <only in my view> touch SVU because
>Munch was n SVU when he crossed. he was Homicide when he crossed to
>X-Files.
>That's the difference in my mind.
>

Well, that makes some sense. And Munch is unique in this respect...
oh, hang on, there's Frasier who is/was a regular in two series. And
I've put Frasier next to Wings, even though that was when he was in
Cheers, right?

>>
>> >And I see you haven't weighed in on The Tonight Show yet.
>> >
>>
>> Well, I will... Soon.
>
>I just found where you weighed in, by deciding not to play, no fun!
>

The guy is just cameo guy to me. I've never seen a full episode of his
show, because it doesn't air here. So might eleven cents might not be
worth much - in fact, it's not because 11 Australian cents only buys
about 6 US cents. :-)

Ashley

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Aug 15, 2002, 12:18:18 PM8/15/02
to
> >> >kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote
> >> >> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
> >> >>
> ><snip>
> >> >
> >> >Very nice,
> >> >
> >> >very nice indeed.
> >> >
> >> >The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Whoops. I've changed it in my version...
> >>
> >> This means that X-F should touch SVU, too, though, right? I'm not sure
> >> I'm prepated to do that! It would mean all Munches appearances have to
> >> touch SVU.
> >
> >Not in my mind, The Beat should <only in my view> touch SVU because
> >Munch was n SVU when he crossed. he was Homicide when he crossed to
> >X-Files.
> >That's the difference in my mind.
> >
>
> Well, that makes some sense. And Munch is unique in this respect...
> oh, hang on, there's Frasier who is/was a regular in two series. And
> I've put Frasier next to Wings, even though that was when he was in
> Cheers, right?

I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the
last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
only really happened once.

>
> >>
> >> >And I see you haven't weighed in on The Tonight Show yet.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Well, I will... Soon.
> >
> >I just found where you weighed in, by deciding not to play, no fun!
> >
>
> The guy is just cameo guy to me. I've never seen a full episode of his
> show, because it doesn't air here. So might eleven cents might not be
> worth much - in fact, it's not because 11 Australian cents only buys
> about 6 US cents. :-)

Paul and I certianly put in our 11 cents and more and ended up with
three Jay Lenos: Jay leno, Jay Leno, and Jay Leno.
But I do think your solution is the easiest, just take COPS and ET off.

ash

"Our lives are different than other people's."
-Oz, "Graduation Day 1

Keith Gow

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Aug 15, 2002, 8:28:40 PM8/15/02
to
On 15 Aug 2002 09:18:18 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>> >> >kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow) wrote

>> >> >> http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>> >> >>
>> ><snip>
>> >> >
>> >> >Very nice,
>> >> >
>> >> >very nice indeed.
>> >> >
>> >> >The Beat still doesn't touch SVU though.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Whoops. I've changed it in my version...
>> >>
>> >> This means that X-F should touch SVU, too, though, right? I'm not sure
>> >> I'm prepated to do that! It would mean all Munches appearances have to
>> >> touch SVU.
>> >
>> >Not in my mind, The Beat should <only in my view> touch SVU because
>> >Munch was n SVU when he crossed. he was Homicide when he crossed to
>> >X-Files.
>> >That's the difference in my mind.
>> >
>>
>> Well, that makes some sense. And Munch is unique in this respect...
>> oh, hang on, there's Frasier who is/was a regular in two series. And
>> I've put Frasier next to Wings, even though that was when he was in
>> Cheers, right?
>
>I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the
>last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
>with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
>coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
>only really happened once.
>

Okay. That changes then.

>>
>> The guy is just cameo guy to me. I've never seen a full episode of his
>> show, because it doesn't air here. So might eleven cents might not be
>> worth much - in fact, it's not because 11 Australian cents only buys
>> about 6 US cents. :-)
>
>Paul and I certianly put in our 11 cents and more and ended up with
>three Jay Lenos: Jay leno, Jay Leno, and Jay Leno.

That's about 3 too many ;-)

>But I do think your solution is the easiest, just take COPS and ET off.
>

Yep.

>"Our lives are different than other people's."
> -Oz, "Graduation Day 1

"I miss Oz. He'd get it. He wouldn't say anything, but he'd get it."
- Xander, I Was Made To Love You

Ashley Crowe

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Aug 15, 2002, 9:34:40 PM8/15/02
to

<snip>

> >> >Not in my mind, The Beat should <only in my view> touch SVU because
> >> >Munch was n SVU when he crossed. he was Homicide when he

> >> >crossed to X-Files.That's the difference in my mind.


> >>
> >> Well, that makes some sense. And Munch is unique in this respect...
> >> oh, hang on, there's Frasier who is/was a regular in two series. And
> >> I've put Frasier next to Wings, even though that was when he was in
> >> Cheers, right?
> >
> >I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the
> >last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
> >with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
> >coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
> >only really happened once.
>
> Okay. That changes then.

Whew! the whole crossover chart was very fun. Thanks for starting all that.

> >> The guy is just cameo guy to me. I've never seen a full episode of his
> >> show, because it doesn't air here. So might eleven cents might not be
> >> worth much - in fact, it's not because 11 Australian cents only buys
> >> about 6 US cents. :-)
> >
> >Paul and I certianly put in our 11 cents and more and ended up with
> >three Jay Lenos: Jay leno, Jay Leno, and Jay Leno.
>
> That's about 3 too many ;-)

There I agree


>
> >But I do think your solution is the easiest, just take COPS and ET off.
> >
>
> Yep.
>
> >"Our lives are different than other people's."
> > -Oz, "Graduation Day 1
>
> "I miss Oz. He'd get it. He wouldn't say anything, but he'd get it."
> - Xander, I Was Made To Love You

I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.

ash

"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
-Oz, "Dead Man's Party"


Keith Gow

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Aug 16, 2002, 12:23:48 AM8/16/02
to
On 15 Aug 2002 09:18:18 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the


>last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
>with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
>coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
>only really happened once.
>

Also, if The Beat crossover came after Munch was on SVU, then it
shouldn't connect to HLOTS. Unless it became between the series and
The Movie?

Keith Gow

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Aug 16, 2002, 1:52:53 AM8/16/02
to
On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 01:34:40 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

>Whew! the whole crossover chart was very fun. Thanks for starting all that.
>

It was fun. I've made a couple of small changes and it has been
updated. Most of the shows are gone now or in the process of going.
It'll be interesting to see if any more links are made to that
fictional mega-verse.

>> >"Our lives are different than other people's."
>> > -Oz, "Graduation Day 1
>>
>> "I miss Oz. He'd get it. He wouldn't say anything, but he'd get it."
>> - Xander, I Was Made To Love You
>
>I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.
>

Well, you see, there's this girl called Willow... No, no. Seriously. I
agree. But if this season is the last and with the rumoured return of
nearly every recurring character *ever*, I'd be disappointed not to
see him one last time.

I think they could work in a one-off episode for him, but probably not
more than one.

>"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
>mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
>hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
> -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"

"I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"

-- Keith Gow --

"Come on! This is a huge deal for me! Six years as a side man,
and now I get to be the Slayer." - Willow, "Two to Go"

Ashley Crowe

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Aug 17, 2002, 1:19:41 AM8/17/02
to

> On 15 Aug 2002 09:18:18 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
> lyrical:
> >I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the
> >last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
> >with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
> >coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
> >only really happened once.
> >

On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 04:23:48 GMT, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
wrote:


> Also, if The Beat crossover came after Munch was on SVU, then it
> shouldn't connect to HLOTS. Unless it became between the series and
> The Movie?

The Beat did occur between the series and the movie so it looks like it should
connect with both Homicide and SVU (you are correct).

ash

"TV is a good thing. Bright colors. Music. Tiny little people."
-Buffy, "Beer Bad"

Keith Gow

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Aug 17, 2002, 2:14:04 AM8/17/02
to
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002 05:19:41 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

>


>> On 15 Aug 2002 09:18:18 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
>> lyrical:
>> >I checked the dates and it looks like the crossover occured during the
>> >last season of Cheers so that would (in my mind) only be a crossover
>> >with Cheers not Cheers and Fraiser. I thouhg tI remembered Fraiser
>> >coming to the airport twice (once from Boston, once from Seattle) but it
>> >only really happened once.
>> >
>
>On Fri, 16 Aug 2002 04:23:48 GMT, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
>wrote:
>> Also, if The Beat crossover came after Munch was on SVU, then it
>> shouldn't connect to HLOTS. Unless it became between the series and
>> The Movie?
>
>The Beat did occur between the series and the movie so it looks like it should
>connect with both Homicide and SVU (you are correct).
>

Okay. Back it goes...

>"TV is a good thing. Bright colors. Music. Tiny little people."
> -Buffy, "Beer Bad"
>

"Beer Bad" is a terribly underrated episode. Just thought I'd provoke
a little controversy.

Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 17, 2002, 11:39:57 AM8/17/02
to
I wrote:
> >Whew! the whole crossover chart was very fun. Thanks for starting all that.
>
> It was fun. I've made a couple of small changes and it has been
> updated. Most of the shows are gone now or in the process of going.
> It'll be interesting to see if any more links are made to that
> fictional mega-verse.

I'm sure it will continue to expand. The crossover potienal is endless.

> >> >"Our lives are different than other people's."
> >> > -Oz, "Graduation Day 1
> >>
> >> "I miss Oz. He'd get it. He wouldn't say anything, but he'd get it."
> >> - Xander, I Was Made To Love You
> >
> >I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.
>
> Well, you see, there's this girl called Willow... No, no. Seriously. I
> agree. But if this season is the last and with the rumoured return of
> nearly every recurring character *ever*, I'd be disappointed not to
> see him one last time.

This season might not be the last. There's been no offical word on that yet.



> I think they could work in a one-off episode for him, but probably not
> more than one.

They could. Appartently ME and Seth Green are speaking again so the only
problems are finding time when he can shoot and a good one-off plot line.

> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
>
> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"

"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in my honor.
They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
-Buffy, "Helpless"

free association quoting fun.

ash


"This is a time of celebration. So sit still and be quiet. Spit out that
gum." -Snyder, "Graduation Day 2"


Ashley Crowe

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Aug 17, 2002, 12:50:24 PM8/17/02
to
<snip>

I quoted:


> >"TV is a good thing. Bright colors. Music. Tiny little people."
> > -Buffy, "Beer Bad"

and Keith said:
> "Beer Bad" is a terribly underrated episode. Just thought I'd provoke
> a little controversy.

oh I agree and it certianly has it's share of great lines.

I mean how can you not like an episode with these gems:
"This will give them some time to ponder the geopolitical ramifications
of being mean to me."
-Xander
"Well, excuse me, Mr. 'I spent the 60's in an electric- kool-aid
funky-Satan groove.'" "It was the early 70's, and you should know
better."
-Xander and Giles
"I'm not sure I need to explain my actions here. But if that's what you
want..." "Yes. Followed by an admission of undeniable guilt, but go on."
-Parker and Willow
"Well, even if I had a pretend cigarette, I couldn't tell you my pretend
problems. Real ones have clogged up my head space."
-Buffy
and the one quoted above.

I have to be in the right mood to watch Beer Bad, but I like it. Plus doesn't Buffy
boink Parker over the head? always a plus.

ash

"You have no shame." "Oh, please. Like shame is something to be proud
of?" -Xander and Cordelia, "Earshot


Keith Gow

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Aug 18, 2002, 2:42:31 AM8/18/02
to
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002 15:39:57 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

>> >


>> >I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.
>>
>> Well, you see, there's this girl called Willow... No, no. Seriously. I
>> agree. But if this season is the last and with the rumoured return of
>> nearly every recurring character *ever*, I'd be disappointed not to
>> see him one last time.
>
>This season might not be the last. There's been no offical word on that yet.
>

I know. I'm just concerned if they go on too long...

Season 7 has potential - great potential - from what I've heard. But I
fear that every year past this one has a great weight on it. Not many
shows last past their seventh year, let alone last well.

>> I think they could work in a one-off episode for him, but probably not
>> more than one.
>
>They could. Appartently ME and Seth Green are speaking again so the only
>problems are finding time when he can shoot and a good one-off plot line.
>

Apparently Joss and Marti and Seth have recorded a commentary for "New
Moon Rising" for the Region 1 Season 4 DVDs. Bastards - I am quite
happy with the Region 4 version that doesn't have it.

>> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
>> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
>> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
>> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
>>
>> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
>> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"
>
>"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in my honor.
>They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
> -Buffy, "Helpless"
>

"You should be at a good old-fashioned college, with keg parties and
boys. Not here, with Hellmouths and vampires." - Joyce
"Not really seeing a huge distinction there..." - Buffy, "Lover's
Walk"

-- Keith Gow --

"Come on! This is a huge deal for me! Six years as a side man,

and now I get to be the Slayer." - Willow, "Two to Go"

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 18, 2002, 2:42:34 AM8/18/02
to
On Sat, 17 Aug 2002 16:50:24 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

><snip>


>
>I quoted:
>> >"TV is a good thing. Bright colors. Music. Tiny little people."
>> > -Buffy, "Beer Bad"
>
>and Keith said:
>> "Beer Bad" is a terribly underrated episode. Just thought I'd provoke
>> a little controversy.
>
>oh I agree and it certianly has it's share of great lines.
>
>I mean how can you not like an episode with these gems:
>"This will give them some time to ponder the geopolitical ramifications
>of being mean to me."
> -Xander
>"Well, excuse me, Mr. 'I spent the 60's in an electric- kool-aid
>funky-Satan groove.'" "It was the early 70's, and you should know
>better."
> -Xander and Giles
>"I'm not sure I need to explain my actions here. But if that's what you
>want..." "Yes. Followed by an admission of undeniable guilt, but go on."
> -Parker and Willow

"You just want to jump on my bones." - Willow

>I have to be in the right mood to watch Beer Bad, but I like it. Plus doesn't Buffy
>boink Parker over the head? always a plus.
>

She does it twice, which is what I love about the episode.

Ashley Crowe

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Aug 18, 2002, 8:09:36 PM8/18/02
to
Keith Gow wrote:

Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com> waxed lyrical:
> >> >I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.
> >>
> >> Well, you see, there's this girl called Willow... No, no. Seriously. I
> >> agree. But if this season is the last and with the rumoured return of
> >> nearly every recurring character *ever*, I'd be disappointed not to
> >> see him one last time.
> >
> >This season might not be the last. There's been no offical word on that yet.
>
> I know. I'm just concerned if they go on too long...
>
> Season 7 has potential - great potential - from what I've heard. But I
> fear that every year past this one has a great weight on it. Not many
> shows last past their seventh year, let alone last well.

I agree. I'd like this season to be the end.

> >> I think they could work in a one-off episode for him, but probably not
> >> more than one.
> >
> >They could. Appartently ME and Seth Green are speaking again so the only
> >problems are finding time when he can shoot and a good one-off plot line.
>
> Apparently Joss and Marti and Seth have recorded a commentary for "New
> Moon Rising" for the Region 1 Season 4 DVDs. Bastards - I am quite
> happy with the Region 4 version that doesn't have it.

I'm sure you are. That means you have Season 3 on DVD already two. lucky
lucky man. Faith goodness, Willow and Tara goodness all on crisp clean DVD.
I'm ready from Season 3 to come out of DVD here. mmm Faith...

> >> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
> >> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
> >> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
> >> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
> >>
> >> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
> >> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"
> >
> >"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in my honor.
> >They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
> > -Buffy, "Helpless"
>
> "You should be at a good old-fashioned college, with keg parties and
> boys. Not here, with Hellmouths and vampires." - Joyce
> "Not really seeing a huge distinction there..." - Buffy, "Lover's
> Walk"

"This is a time of celebration. So sit still and be quiet. Spit out that


gum." -Snyder, "Graduation Day 2"

ash

"Wait for Faith." "That could be hours. The girl makes Godot look
punctual." -Wesley and Buffy, "Enemies"

Tina S

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 1:29:50 AM8/19/02
to
On Tue, 13 Aug 2002 05:38:35 GMT, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith
Gow) wrote:

>
>http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>
>- Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
>importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
>- Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)

St. Elsewhere, right? The corporation that bought St. Eligius in one
of the later seasons takes over the prison in Oz and tries to
implement managed care there (with tragic results, of course). I'm
blanking on the name.

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 3:29:55 AM8/19/02
to
On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 00:09:36 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

>Keith Gow wrote:
>> Apparently Joss and Marti and Seth have recorded a commentary for "New
>> Moon Rising" for the Region 1 Season 4 DVDs. Bastards - I am quite
>> happy with the Region 4 version that doesn't have it.
>
>I'm sure you are. That means you have Season 3 on DVD already two. lucky
>lucky man. Faith goodness, Willow and Tara goodness all on crisp clean DVD.
>I'm ready from Season 3 to come out of DVD here. mmm Faith...
>

Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.

>> >> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
>> >> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
>> >> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
>> >> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
>> >>
>> >> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
>> >> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"
>> >
>> >"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in my honor.
>> >They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
>> > -Buffy, "Helpless"
>>
>> "You should be at a good old-fashioned college, with keg parties and
>> boys. Not here, with Hellmouths and vampires." - Joyce
>> "Not really seeing a huge distinction there..." - Buffy, "Lover's
>> Walk"
>
>"This is a time of celebration. So sit still and be quiet. Spit out that
>gum." -Snyder, "Graduation Day 2"
>

"Sorry we couldn't do the big fancy. You kind of caught us with our
parties down." - Buffy
"That's all right. This is just the first premarital celebration.
We'll have lots more. With gifts!" - Anya, "All the Way"

-- Keith Gow --

"Come on! This is a huge deal for me! Six years as a side man,

and now I get to be the Slayer." - Willow, "Two to Go"

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 3:42:12 AM8/19/02
to
On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 05:29:50 GMT, tsh...@deletesprynet.com (Tina S)
waxed lyrical:

Really? TVFan must know this!

And, yet, with all this talk of lesbians he seems to have
disappeared...

Martha K.

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 8:08:26 AM8/19/02
to

"Keith Gow" <kw...@web.solutions.net.au> wrote in message
news:3d60a13d...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...

> On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 05:29:50 GMT, tsh...@deletesprynet.com (Tina S)
> waxed lyrical:
>
> >On Tue, 13 Aug 2002 05:38:35 GMT, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith
> >Gow) wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
> >>
> >>- Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
> >>importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
> >>- Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
> >
> >St. Elsewhere, right? The corporation that bought St. Eligius in one
> >of the later seasons takes over the prison in Oz and tries to
> >implement managed care there (with tragic results, of course). I'm
> >blanking on the name.

Ecumena.

>
> Really? TVFan must know this!
>
> And, yet, with all this talk of lesbians he seems to have
> disappeared...

Some of my best friends are...

Martha K.
(doesn't watch Buffy, hasn't got a clue what we're talking about these days)

Ashley

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 1:30:46 PM8/19/02
to
> > Keith Gow wrote:
> >>http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
> >>
> >>- Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
> >>importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
> >>- Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
> >
Tina S waxed lyrical:

> >St. Elsewhere, right? The corporation that bought St. Eligius in one
> >of the later seasons takes over the prison in Oz and tries to
> >implement managed care there (with tragic results, of course). I'm
> >blanking on the name.
>
Keith Gow wrote:
> Really? TVFan must know this!

I check TV Tome and found this: Episode: The Truth and Nothing But...
"Oswald Maximum Security Penententiary is renamed Oswald State
Correctional Facility: Level Four. To cut costs, Devlin brings in the
Weigert Corporation to oversee medical matters." And from the notes:
"Weigert Corporation is presumably the same Weigert that took over St.
Eligius in the final year of "St. Elsewhere"."
The notes for that episode also mention that: "Miss Sally has become an
omnipresence in the Fontana multiverse, seen on television in both The
Beat and the wrap up movie for Homicide: Life on the Street." Someone
remembered that Miss Sally was in the movie (whch brought the
Homicide/Oz link) but the Oz/The Beat link is new.


>
> And, yet, with all this talk of lesbians he seems to have
> disappeared...

Yea really, where did he run off to?

ash

"In the end, you're always by yourself. You're all you've got. That's
the point" -Angelus, "Becoming II"

Ashley

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 1:32:28 PM8/19/02
to
Keith Gow wrote:
> >> Apparently Joss and Marti and Seth have recorded a commentary for "New
> >> Moon Rising" for the Region 1 Season 4 DVDs. Bastards - I am quite
> >> happy with the Region 4 version that doesn't have it.
> >
> >I'm sure you are. That means you have Season 3 on DVD already too. lucky

> >lucky man. Faith goodness, Willow and Tara goodness all on crisp clean DVD.
> >I'm ready from Season 3 to come out of DVD here. mmm Faith...
>
> Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
> for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.

Sure, go ahead. Rub it in.

> >> >> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
> >> >> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
> >> >> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
> >> >> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
> >> >>
> >> >> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
> >> >> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"
> >> >
> >> >"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in
> >> >my honor. They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
> >> > -Buffy, "Helpless"
> >>
> >> "You should be at a good old-fashioned college, with keg parties and
> >> boys. Not here, with Hellmouths and vampires." - Joyce
> >> "Not really seeing a huge distinction there..." - Buffy, "Lover's
> >> Walk"
> >
> >"This is a time of celebration. So sit still and be quiet. Spit out that
> >gum." -Snyder, "Graduation Day 2"
>
> "Sorry we couldn't do the big fancy. You kind of caught us with our
> parties down." - Buffy
> "That's all right. This is just the first premarital celebration.
> We'll have lots more. With gifts!" - Anya, "All the Way"

"We're having a party tonight." -Giles
"Looks like Mr. Caution Man, but the sound he makes is funny." -Xander
"Buffy's surprise party will go ahead as we planned. Except I won't be
wearing the little hat." -Giles
"But Buffy and Angel..." -Willow
"May well be in danger... as they have been before, and, I imagine, will
be again. One thing I've learned in my tenure here on the Hellmouth is
that there is no good time to relax. And Buffy's turning 17 just this
once, and she deserves a party." -Giles, "Surprise"

ash

"Whoa! Slow down, people. Summer is over. Be somber."
-Teacher, "Anne"

Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 18, 2002, 11:58:20 AM8/18/02
to
Keith Gow wrote:

Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com> waxed lyrical:
> >> >I miss Oz too, I just don't know how he'd fit it they brought him back.
> >>
> >> Well, you see, there's this girl called Willow... No, no. Seriously. I
> >> agree. But if this season is the last and with the rumoured return of
> >> nearly every recurring character *ever*, I'd be disappointed not to
> >> see him one last time.
> >
> >This season might not be the last. There's been no offical word on that yet.
>
> I know. I'm just concerned if they go on too long...
>
> Season 7 has potential - great potential - from what I've heard. But I
> fear that every year past this one has a great weight on it. Not many
> shows last past their seventh year, let alone last well.

I agree. I'd like this season to be the end.

> >> I think they could work in a one-off episode for him, but probably not


> >> more than one.
> >
> >They could. Appartently ME and Seth Green are speaking again so the only
> >problems are finding time when he can shoot and a good one-off plot line.
>
> Apparently Joss and Marti and Seth have recorded a commentary for "New
> Moon Rising" for the Region 1 Season 4 DVDs. Bastards - I am quite
> happy with the Region 4 version that doesn't have it.

I'm sure you are. That means you have Season 3 on DVD already two. lucky

lucky man. Faith goodness, Willow and Tara goodness all on crisp clean DVD.
I'm ready from Season 3 to come out of DVD here. mmm Faith...

> >> >"Well, a gathering is brie, mellow song stylings. Shindig: dip, less
> >> >mellow song stylings, perhaps a large amount of malt beverage. And
> >> >hootenanny: well, it's chock full of hoot, just a little bit of nanny."
> >> > -Oz, "Dead Man's Party"
> >>
> >> "I mean we're just gettin' started, I got all kinds of big party
> >> plans." - Willow, "Two to Go"
> >
> >"I dunno. I think it might be time to put a moratorium on parties in my honor.
> >They tend to go badly. Monsters crash. People die."
> > -Buffy, "Helpless"
>
> "You should be at a good old-fashioned college, with keg parties and
> boys. Not here, with Hellmouths and vampires." - Joyce
> "Not really seeing a huge distinction there..." - Buffy, "Lover's
> Walk"

"This is a time of celebration. So sit still and be quiet. Spit out that


gum." -Snyder, "Graduation Day 2"

ash

"Wait for Faith." "That could be hours. The girl makes Godot look
punctual." -Wesley and Buffy, "Enemies"

>

Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 18, 2002, 4:37:22 PM8/18/02
to

Diane

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 8:27:23 PM8/19/02
to
On Mon, 19 Aug 2002 12:08:26 GMT, "Martha K." <msong...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

<snip>


>> >>- Coloured background to make the links stand out and, more
>> >>importantly, the shows that aren't linked seem more separate
>> >>- Added "Oz" as a link to "Homicide" (Any shows linked to "Oz"?)
>> >
>> >St. Elsewhere, right? The corporation that bought St. Eligius in one
>> >of the later seasons takes over the prison in Oz and tries to
>> >implement managed care there (with tragic results, of course). I'm
>> >blanking on the name.
>
>Ecumena.

Which later got changed to Weigert. I think there was an HMO at the
time named Humana or somesuch that threatened to sue.

Diane

Patrick

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 8:45:50 PM8/19/02
to


A Google-cached page of the New York Daily News brings confirmation
from a well-placed source.

--Patrick

=========================================

From: New York Daily News |Arts and Lifestyle | Television |
Friday, June 29, 2001

Extra-Impressed Fontana Lauds Eagle-eyed Readers

In my most recent column relaying TV Extras, or in-jokes, caught by
Daily News readers, some of them noted sly references buried deep
within the shows of Tom Fontana — "St. Elsewhere" and "Oz" included.
One of the readers most surprised by the identification of those
Extras was ... Tom Fontana.

"I thought that was amazing," he says.

One Extra noted last time, by Kris Calabrese of Brooklyn, was that the
name of the HMO running (and ruining) "St. Elsewhere" in its final
season was changed from Ecumena to the Weigert Corporation — and that
Weigert, more than a decade later, also was the name of the
institution performing experiments on the inmates of "Oz."

Calabrese also noted in her e-mail that the children's show watched
avidly by the inmates of "Oz," featuring the buxom character known as
Ms. Sally, also was seen in the background on a TV in Fontana's UPN
series "The Beat."

"That's right," Fontana says. "And it's also in 'Homicide: The
Movie.'"

"That's the next sentence in her letter," I tell him.

"Give me her address," he says. "I'll send her something."

Fontana got a kick out of a recent Extra, from Sean Dougherty of
Clifton, N.J., prompted by my description of the "St. Elsewhere"
finale as revealing the entire series to be nothing more, or less,
than the mental meanderings of an autistic boy, the character of Tommy
Westphall.

Dougherty, recalling that Alfre Woodard's character from "St.
Elsewhere" also turned up once on "Homicide: Life on the Street,"
asked, "Did Tom Fontana really write a character who only existed as a
daydream into 'Homicide'? Does that mean that 'Homicide' ... was also
a daydream?"

"Here's the thing," Fontana says. "It's my personal plot that all of
television exists in the mind of Tommy Westphall, to this day. So
'Homicide' is still the musings; it's just that instead of looking at
a hospital snow globe," as he did in the "St. Elsewhere" finale, "now
he's looking at the police headquarters building snow globe.

"And because," Fontana adds, "we did the 'Cheers' crossover" — a few
"St. Elsewhere" characters visited the Boston bar — "it would make all
of 'Cheers,' which would then make all of 'Frasier,' also in the mind
of Tommy Westphall. It only gets bigger and bigger and bigger."

Another conspiracy Fontana supports, with Richard Belzer, is placing
Belzer's character of Munch on as many shows as possible. So far, the
wry "Homicide" detective has appeared on "The Beat," "Law & Order,"
"Law & Order: Special Victims Unit," "The X-Files" and, in cartoon
form, "The Simpsons."

"The trickiest one has been trying to figure out how to get him on
'Oz,' because he is now an NYPD cop, and 'Oz' is not set in any
specific state," Fontana says.

"I almost had him be a contestant on 'Up Your Ante,'" another
show-within-a-show watched by the "Oz" inmates, "but he was away the
day we were shooting it. But maybe he'll be on Ms. Sally."


La Reina

unread,
Aug 19, 2002, 10:57:25 PM8/19/02
to
Patrick cited the following article:

>A Google-cached page of the New York Daily News brings confirmation
>from a well-placed source.
>
>--Patrick
>
>=========================================
>
>From: New York Daily News |Arts and Lifestyle | Television |
>Friday, June 29, 2001
>
>Extra-Impressed Fontana Lauds Eagle-eyed Readers


Keith, Ash, you guys ought to send Fontana a framed printout of your Homicide
crossover spreadsheet.


Reina De Paréntesis

Unhurried1

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 3:01:13 AM8/20/02
to
Martha wrote:
>
> Martha K.
> (doesn't watch Buffy, hasn't got a clue what we're talking about these days)

Amen, sister. I'm trying to catch up after being away since Thursday,
and I know I'm not alone in making the following request. Could
anyone wishing to turn yet another thread into a Buffy discussion
*pretty please with sugar on it* re-label the subject header?

--
Unhurried1

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 3:45:12 AM8/20/02
to
On 19 Aug 2002 10:32:28 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>Keith Gow wrote:
>> Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
>> for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.
>
>Sure, go ahead. Rub it in.
>

That was a sneak preview for some time late next year ;-)

"I don't know. He may have a bunch of swell party tricks but
he's still just a vampire. I say we load up with stakes and crossbows
and go after him now." - Riley, "Buffy vs. Dracula"

-- Keith Gow --

"Come on! This is a huge deal for me! Six years as a side man,

and now I get to be the Slayer." - Willow, "Two to Go"

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 3:45:15 AM8/20/02
to
On 20 Aug 2002 02:57:25 GMT, kari...@aol.com (La Reina) waxed
lyrical:

I think we should. We can send it with letterhead from the "I Hate Tom
Fontana" club ;-)

But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)

So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 3:51:25 AM8/20/02
to
On Tue, 13 Aug 2002 05:38:35 GMT, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith
Gow) waxed lyrical:

>
>http://web.solutions.net.au/~kwgow/Cross_spread.html
>

Okay...

- The Beat touches SVU *and* Homicide
- Oz touches Homicide, The Beat *and* St Elsewhere

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 3:52:11 AM8/20/02
to
On 20 Aug 2002 00:01:13 -0700, Unhur...@webtv.net (Unhurried1) waxed
lyrical:

Yeah, that's a fair call.

Martha K.

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 7:09:10 AM8/20/02
to

"Keith Gow" <kw...@web.solutions.net.au> wrote in message
news:3d61f521...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...

> On 20 Aug 2002 00:01:13 -0700, Unhur...@webtv.net (Unhurried1) waxed
> lyrical:
>
> >Martha wrote:
> >>
> >> Martha K.
> >> (doesn't watch Buffy, hasn't got a clue what we're talking about these
days)
> >
> >Amen, sister. I'm trying to catch up after being away since Thursday,
> >and I know I'm not alone in making the following request. Could
> >anyone wishing to turn yet another thread into a Buffy discussion
> >*pretty please with sugar on it* re-label the subject header?
>
> Yeah, that's a fair call.

Merci beaucoup.

Martha K.


Ashley

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 11:55:42 AM8/20/02
to
Keith Gow wrote:
> Ashley waxed lyrical:

> >Keith Gow wrote:
> >> Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
> >> for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.
> >
> >Sure, go ahead. Rub it in.
>
> That was a sneak preview for some time late next year ;-)

Does/will Restless have commentary?

"lets get to the party part of the - party." -Buffy, "Fear, Itself"

Ashley

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 11:57:03 AM8/20/02
to
Keith Gow wrote:
> La Reina waxed lyrical:

> >Patrick cited the following article:
> >>A Google-cached page of the New York Daily News brings confirmation
> >>from a well-placed source.
> >>--Patrick
> >>
> >>=========================================
> >>From: New York Daily News |Arts and Lifestyle | Television |
> >>Friday, June 29, 2001
> >>
> >>Extra-Impressed Fontana Lauds Eagle-eyed Readers
> >
> >Keith, Ash, you guys ought to send Fontana a framed printout of your Homicide
> >crossover spreadsheet.
>
> I think we should. We can send it with letterhead from the "I Hate Tom
> Fontana" club ;-)
>
> But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
> list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
> crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)

I did that at one point, I'll have to search and find it.
I the explanation would also have to include something about what is
not
included: Jay Leno, ALex Trebek, Tim Russert, COPS, and ET.

> So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?

I'd be happy to do the sending if someone knows where since it would
be cheaper for me (not being oversees and all).

ash

"Whoa! Slow down, people. Summer is over. Be somber."
-Teacher, "Anne"
>

La Reina

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 12:50:12 PM8/20/02
to
Keith & Ash wrote:

>> So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?
>
>I'd be happy to do the sending if someone knows where since it would
>be cheaper for me (not being oversees and all).

I'll double check that it's still current and get back to you via e-mail.


Reina De Paréntesis

Patrick

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 9:15:28 PM8/20/02
to
Previously on alt.tv.homicide, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
wrote:


>But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
>list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
>crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
>
>So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?

Not to be picky, but the version of the spreadsheet I've looked at
doesn't seem to connect The Simpsons directly to either H:LotS or
L&O:SVU, and the TF interview said that Munch appeared on The
Simpsons. I don't pretend to have followed the technical aspects of
this discussion (I got lost somewhere amid Jay Leno), but if TF thinks
there's a crossover, perhaps you'll want to either chart it or explain
why not.

Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like? Putting the spreadsheet
in a big bubble over a picture of a dreaming Tommy might be just the
ticket. Or not.

--Patrick
And does TF's list of Munch crossovers resolve that question upthread
about whether some Belzer appearance or other was in Munch persona?

Martha K.

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 10:24:01 PM8/20/02
to

"Patrick" <pjh714F...@bestweb.net> wrote in message
news:3d62e6f3...@nntp.bestweb.net...

> Previously on alt.tv.homicide, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
> wrote:
>
>
> >But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
> >list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
> >crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
> >
> >So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?
>
> Not to be picky, but the version of the spreadsheet I've looked at
> doesn't seem to connect The Simpsons directly to either H:LotS or
> L&O:SVU, and the TF interview said that Munch appeared on The
> Simpsons. I don't pretend to have followed the technical aspects of
> this discussion (I got lost somewhere amid Jay Leno), but if TF thinks
> there's a crossover, perhaps you'll want to either chart it or explain
> why not.
>
> Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like? Putting the spreadsheet
> in a big bubble over a picture of a dreaming Tommy might be just the
> ticket. Or not.

He looks like Chad Allen, unless that's a figment of his imagination, too.

Martha K.

Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 10:32:40 PM8/20/02
to
On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 01:15:28 GMT, pjh714F...@bestweb.net
(Patrick) wrote:
> Previously on alt.tv.homicide, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
> wrote:
>
> >But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
> >list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
> >crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
> >
> >So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?
>
> Not to be picky, but the version of the spreadsheet I've looked at
> doesn't seem to connect The Simpsons directly to either H:LotS or
> L&O:SVU, and the TF interview said that Munch appeared on The
> Simpsons. I don't pretend to have followed the technical aspects of
> this discussion (I got lost somewhere amid Jay Leno), but if TF thinks
> there's a crossover, perhaps you'll want to either chart it or explain
> why not.

I was actually going to bring that up. The article was the first I'd heard of a
Munch/The Simpsons connection. I search both at TV Tome and found
nothing. I also checked here: http://bit.sit.ac.nz/olsen/kenny/guests.html and
found nothing. I think TF is confused. Homicide does connect with the The
Simpsons by way of Munch but not becasue Munch was on X-Files but
because Munch was on X-Files and Mulder and Scully were on The Simpsons.

Can anyone find a reference other than the TF quote that shows that Munch
was indeed on The Simpsons? I searched the two best places I know.

I did find more Simpsons crossovers:
Season 5: 1F07: Werner Klemperer as Colonel Klink so Hogan's Heros should
be added
(Keith's going to hate me for this one because it screws up the grid)
Season 6: 2F08: Ted Danson as Sam; Woody Harrelson as Woody; Rhea
Perlman as Carla; John Ratzenberger as Cliff; George Wendt as Norm
Season 7: 3F06: Harry Morgan as Bill Gannon (Dragnet and Dragnet '67 (and
the eighties Dragnet movie))
Season 10: AABF05: Dick Tufeld as Lost in Space Robot
The Simpsons also started on/spun off from The Tracy Ullman Show

And what about movies? The Simpsons has also crossed over with Spinal Tap
and the Freddy Kreguer movies.

> Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like? Putting the spreadsheet
> in a big bubble over a picture of a dreaming Tommy might be just the
> ticket. Or not.

He was played by Chad Allen. I found a few pictures here:
http://www.kclark.net/chad/images/stelsewhere/page_01.htm but there have
to be better pictures somewhere, or maybe not.


>
> --Patrick
> And does TF's list of Munch crossovers resolve that question upthread
> about whether some Belzer appearance or other was in Munch persona?

no the show in question there was (I believe) Mad About You which TF doesn't
mention. But Belzer was playing a different character in that episode (with a
name and everything)

ash

Patrick

unread,
Aug 20, 2002, 10:45:21 PM8/20/02
to
Previously on alt.tv.homicide, "Martha K." <msong...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>> Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like?
>

>He looks like Chad Allen, unless that's a figment of his imagination, too.

http://www.kclark.net/chad/images/stelsewhere/chaall22.jpg

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 21, 2002, 1:43:13 AM8/21/02
to
On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 02:32:40 GMT, Ashley Crowe <acr...@nc.rr.com>
waxed lyrical:

>On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 01:15:28 GMT, pjh714F...@bestweb.net

>(Patrick) wrote:
>> Previously on alt.tv.homicide, kw...@web.solutions.net.au (Keith Gow)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
>> >list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
>> >crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
>> >
>> >So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?
>>
>> Not to be picky, but the version of the spreadsheet I've looked at
>> doesn't seem to connect The Simpsons directly to either H:LotS or
>> L&O:SVU, and the TF interview said that Munch appeared on The
>> Simpsons. I don't pretend to have followed the technical aspects of
>> this discussion (I got lost somewhere amid Jay Leno), but if TF thinks
>> there's a crossover, perhaps you'll want to either chart it or explain
>> why not.
>
>I was actually going to bring that up. The article was the first I'd heard of a
>Munch/The Simpsons connection. I search both at TV Tome and found
>nothing. I also checked here: http://bit.sit.ac.nz/olsen/kenny/guests.html and
>found nothing. I think TF is confused.

It wasn't directly attributed to Fontana. Whoever wrote the article
made this claim.

>Homicide does connect with the The
>Simpsons by way of Munch but not becasue Munch was on X-Files but
>because Munch was on X-Files and Mulder and Scully were on The Simpsons.
>
>Can anyone find a reference other than the TF quote that shows that Munch
>was indeed on The Simpsons? I searched the two best places I know.
>

If it's not at snpp.com then it didn't happen.

>I did find more Simpsons crossovers:
>Season 5: 1F07: Werner Klemperer as Colonel Klink so Hogan's Heros should
>be added

Well, it was a vision of Colonel Klink, so I'm not sure... Otherwise,
Hogans Heroes links to a lot of other stuff!

>(Keith's going to hate me for this one because it screws up the grid)
>Season 6: 2F08: Ted Danson as Sam; Woody Harrelson as Woody; Rhea
>Perlman as Carla; John Ratzenberger as Cliff; George Wendt as Norm

I hate you for that one!

>Season 7: 3F06: Harry Morgan as Bill Gannon (Dragnet and Dragnet '67 (and
>the eighties Dragnet movie))
>Season 10: AABF05: Dick Tufeld as Lost in Space Robot

I think he appeared at a Sci Fi convention, so it wasn't the actual
character from the Lost in Space universe.

>The Simpsons also started on/spun off from The Tracy Ullman Show
>

That's a weird one because they appeared on the show but not in it.

>And what about movies? The Simpsons has also crossed over with Spinal Tap
>and the Freddy Kreguer movies.
>

Lets not bring movies into this!

Martha K.

unread,
Aug 21, 2002, 8:11:23 AM8/21/02
to

"Patrick" <pjh714F...@bestweb.net> wrote in message
news:3d62fc07...@nntp.bestweb.net...

Where was I when he came out?

Martha K.


Ashley

unread,
Aug 21, 2002, 9:22:46 AM8/21/02
to
> >> Keith Gow wrote:
> >> >But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
> >> >list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
> >> >crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
> >> >
> >> >So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?

> >Patrick wrote:
> >> Not to be picky, but the version of the spreadsheet I've looked at
> >> doesn't seem to connect The Simpsons directly to either H:LotS or
> >> L&O:SVU, and the TF interview said that Munch appeared on The
> >> Simpsons. I don't pretend to have followed the technical aspects of
> >> this discussion (I got lost somewhere amid Jay Leno), but if TF thinks
> >> there's a crossover, perhaps you'll want to either chart it or explain
> >> why not.

I wrote:
> >I was actually going to bring that up. The article was the first I'd heard of a
> >Munch/The Simpsons connection. I search both at TV Tome and found
> >nothing. I also checked here: http://bit.sit.ac.nz/olsen/kenny/guests.html and
> >found nothing. I think TF is confused.

Keith Gow wrote:
> It wasn't directly attributed to Fontana. Whoever wrote the article
> made this claim.
>
> >Homicide does connect with the The
> >Simpsons by way of Munch but not becasue Munch was on X-Files but
> >because Munch was on X-Files and Mulder and Scully were on The Simpsons.
> >
> >Can anyone find a reference other than the TF quote that shows that Munch
> >was indeed on The Simpsons? I searched the two best places I know.
>
> If it's not at snpp.com then it didn't happen.

Munch is never mentioned at snpp.


>
> >I did find more Simpsons crossovers:
> >Season 5: 1F07: Werner Klemperer as Colonel Klink so Hogan's Heros should
> >be added
>
> Well, it was a vision of Colonel Klink, so I'm not sure... Otherwise,
> Hogans Heroes links to a lot of other stuff!

I forgot that part, he was Homer's guardian angel maybe it shouldn't
count. Seems like it would be equivalent to Munch et al watching Another
World on the squad room TV.



> >(Keith's going to hate me for this one because it screws up the grid)
> >Season 6: 2F08: Ted Danson as Sam; Woody Harrelson as Woody; Rhea
> >Perlman as Carla; John Ratzenberger as Cliff; George Wendt as Norm
>
> I hate you for that one!

sorry, I double checked at snpp.com (and read transcripts) it wasn't a
dream sequence in any way.


>
> >Season 7: 3F06: Harry Morgan as Bill Gannon (Dragnet and Dragnet '67 (and
> >the eighties Dragnet movie))

according to snpp.com this one is very bizarre. Bill Gannon was voiced
by the original actor but Joe Friday wasn't. And the way in The Simpsons
Gannon mention Friday had a son but on the TV show Dragnet he had no
children (and goodness know tv shows are always consistent).

> >Season 10: AABF05: Dick Tufeld as Lost in Space Robot
>
> I think he appeared at a Sci Fi convention, so it wasn't the actual
> character from the Lost in Space universe.

It was at the Sci-fi convention but the robot appear "in character" the
whole time. but discussing whether a robot was in character is akin to
discussing multiple Jay Leno so I'm fine with leaving that one out.

> >The Simpsons also started on/spun off from The Tracy Ullman Show
>
> That's a weird one because they appeared on the show but not in it.

Just like Miss Sally which we are using for a connection already.


>
> >And what about movies? The Simpsons has also crossed over with Spinal Tap
> >and the Freddy Kreguer movies.
>
> Lets not bring movies into this!

funny I knew you'd say that.

ash

"I say this is all moving much too fast. We need time to fully analyze
the situation and devise a proper and strategic stratagem."
-Wesley, "Choices"

Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 21, 2002, 3:36:59 PM8/21/02
to
Patrick asked:

> > >> Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like?
> > >
Martha K. responded:

> > >He looks like Chad Allen, unless that's a figment of his imagination,
> too.

Patrick gave the URL:
> > http://www.kclark.net/chad/images/stelsewhere/chaall22.jpg

Martha K. asked:


> Where was I when he came out?

I don't know. It wasn't a huge deal but there was a good Advocate
story/intv with Bruce Vilanch here:
http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/848/848_cvr_allen.asp
and the original article about the tabloid photo mentioned in the intv
is here: http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/848/848_allen_719.asp (the
second includes a scanned in image of the Globe article).

I'm sure their were right wingers who made a huff. But honestly it
didn't get much attention because most of the gay community didn't watch
his show, or know him as a actor. An Advocate article in 1996, and a
advocate article in 2001 (which went along with a review of his (then)
current play), and everyone moved on their merry way.

If more outings happened like this, maybe more folks would come out of
the closet.

ash

"I'm not going to treat you differently. I won't. Cause that's not who I
am. And who I am is all I have left." - Pembleton, "Hostage 2"


Martha K.

unread,
Aug 21, 2002, 7:08:08 PM8/21/02
to

"Ashley Crowe" <acr...@nc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:1103_10...@news-server.nc.rr.com...

> Patrick asked:
> > > >> Do we know what Tommy Westphall looks like?
> > > >
> Martha K. responded:
> > > >He looks like Chad Allen, unless that's a figment of his imagination,
> > too.
>
> Patrick gave the URL:
> > > http://www.kclark.net/chad/images/stelsewhere/chaall22.jpg
>
> Martha K. asked:
> > Where was I when he came out?
>
> I don't know. It wasn't a huge deal but there was a good Advocate
> story/intv with Bruce Vilanch here:
> http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/848/848_cvr_allen.asp
> and the original article about the tabloid photo mentioned in the intv
> is here: http://www.advocate.com/html/stories/848/848_allen_719.asp (the
> second includes a scanned in image of the Globe article).

Thanks for the links.


>
> I'm sure their were right wingers who made a huff. But honestly it
> didn't get much attention because most of the gay community didn't watch
> his show, or know him as a actor. An Advocate article in 1996, and a
> advocate article in 2001 (which went along with a review of his (then)
> current play), and everyone moved on their merry way.
>
> If more outings happened like this, maybe more folks would come out of
> the closet.

Wish they felt they could.

Martha K.

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 1:43:25 AM8/22/02
to
On 20 Aug 2002 08:55:42 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>Keith Gow wrote:
>> Ashley waxed lyrical:
>> >Keith Gow wrote:
>> >> Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
>> >> for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.
>> >
>> >Sure, go ahead. Rub it in.
>>
>> That was a sneak preview for some time late next year ;-)
>
>Does/will Restless have commentary?
>

Oh, yes it does. It's quite wonderful, yet Joss still doesn't address
some stuff that I'd love to ask him about!

For the record, commentaries on -

Season 3: Helpless, Bad Girls, Consequences, Earshot
Season 4: The Initiative, Hush, This Year's Girl, Superstar, Primeval,
Restless (and, from what I hear, New Moon Rising especially for Region
1...)
Season 5: Real Me, Fool For Love, I Was Made to Love You, The Body

"Got it. What makes you feel more alive than the good stuff?" - Xander
"Exactly. Sex is like a big party for our aliveness. But it's more
than that. It's about making life." - Anya, "Forever"

-- Keith Gow --

"Come on! This is a huge deal for me! Six years as a side man,

and now I get to be the Slayer." - Willow, "Two to Go"

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 1:43:28 AM8/22/02
to
On 20 Aug 2002 08:57:03 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>Keith Gow wrote:


>> La Reina waxed lyrical:
>> >Patrick cited the following article:
>> >>A Google-cached page of the New York Daily News brings confirmation
>> >>from a well-placed source.
>> >>--Patrick
>> >>
>> >>=========================================
>> >>From: New York Daily News |Arts and Lifestyle | Television |
>> >>Friday, June 29, 2001
>> >>
>> >>Extra-Impressed Fontana Lauds Eagle-eyed Readers
>> >
>> >Keith, Ash, you guys ought to send Fontana a framed printout of your Homicide
>> >crossover spreadsheet.
>>
>> I think we should. We can send it with letterhead from the "I Hate Tom
>> Fontana" club ;-)
>>
>> But seriously, I think he'd find it cool. Especially if I made up a
>> list of how the shows linked - in the most simplest terms (character
>> crossover, story crossover, character mention, etc.)
>
>I did that at one point, I'll have to search and find it.
>I the explanation would also have to include something about what is
>not
>included: Jay Leno, ALex Trebek, Tim Russert, COPS, and ET.
>

A small disclaimer about them being real and not fictional covers all
those examples.

Whereas Miss Sally counts because she is a fictional show.

>> So, La Reina, you've got contacts, where would we send it?
>
>I'd be happy to do the sending if someone knows where since it would
>be cheaper for me (not being oversees and all).

Very cool. Thanks.

Keith Gow

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 4:30:42 AM8/22/02
to
On 21 Aug 2002 06:22:46 -0700, acr...@nc.rr.com (Ashley) waxed
lyrical:

>Keith Gow wrote:


>> It wasn't directly attributed to Fontana. Whoever wrote the article
>> made this claim.
>>
>> >Homicide does connect with the The
>> >Simpsons by way of Munch but not becasue Munch was on X-Files but
>> >because Munch was on X-Files and Mulder and Scully were on The Simpsons.
>> >
>> >Can anyone find a reference other than the TF quote that shows that Munch
>> >was indeed on The Simpsons? I searched the two best places I know.
>>
>> If it's not at snpp.com then it didn't happen.
>
>Munch is never mentioned at snpp.
>>

Good.

>> >I did find more Simpsons crossovers:
>> >Season 5: 1F07: Werner Klemperer as Colonel Klink so Hogan's Heros should
>> >be added
>>
>> Well, it was a vision of Colonel Klink, so I'm not sure... Otherwise,
>> Hogans Heroes links to a lot of other stuff!
>
>I forgot that part, he was Homer's guardian angel maybe it shouldn't
>count. Seems like it would be equivalent to Munch et al watching Another
>World on the squad room TV.
>

It doesn't count.

>> >(Keith's going to hate me for this one because it screws up the grid)
>> >Season 6: 2F08: Ted Danson as Sam; Woody Harrelson as Woody; Rhea
>> >Perlman as Carla; John Ratzenberger as Cliff; George Wendt as Norm
>>
>> I hate you for that one!
>
>sorry, I double checked at snpp.com (and read transcripts) it wasn't a
>dream sequence in any way.
>>

Damn it. What am I going to do? I don't want to put it in twice!

There's no way of reconfiguring the guide without it looking
completely ridiculous! Too many loops!

>> >Season 7: 3F06: Harry Morgan as Bill Gannon (Dragnet and Dragnet '67 (and
>> >the eighties Dragnet movie))
>
>according to snpp.com this one is very bizarre. Bill Gannon was voiced
>by the original actor but Joe Friday wasn't. And the way in The Simpsons
>Gannon mention Friday had a son but on the TV show Dragnet he had no
>children (and goodness know tv shows are always consistent).
>

Hmmm...

>> >The Simpsons also started on/spun off from The Tracy Ullman Show
>>
>> That's a weird one because they appeared on the show but not in it.
>
>Just like Miss Sally which we are using for a connection already.
>>

Yes, but Tracy Ullman wasn't a drama, it was a sketch comedy show,
right?

>> >And what about movies? The Simpsons has also crossed over with Spinal Tap
>> >and the Freddy Kreguer movies.
>>
>> Lets not bring movies into this!
>
>funny I knew you'd say that.
>

Excellent.

morph

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 5:58:17 AM8/22/02
to

Unhurried1 wrote:

she is the best, don't ya know. I know how ya feel rushless, but i been watchin
her a mitey long time. and just when i hesitated about naming her the best
cinematic character, this guy Angel comes by and wow, what a hunk. oh yeah, BUFFY
is frigginn aces. Real good. I hear the Buffy cop-rock mock is a scream.

The show is a millimeter above disney crap. Angel, sadly, isn't even as good as
disney crap. Who else is involved!!!!! and when can i shoot them????

I like Lizzie Maguire. she is way hotter than that Angel pervo. like, get real. I
just got this top at Hot Topics, ain't it superfly? and check out my steve madden
shoes. he's in jail. he's my hero......but angel afteralll,as i was bein real, is
a stonehunk. i can't believe Buffy didn't do him when she had the chance!
snotnosed bitch!

maybe this isn't exact, but it's an all too common sad scenario.

morph(who will scadaddle as fast as he ever has as soon as this post is sent)-
Buffy is a faking whore bitch snob. Her popularity depends on people being not
that bright. She emulates the erosion of intelligence once regarded
for(sigh)((gasp!!)) Homicide fans. Buffy sad to say, killed ryland, and she set
Tim up for it cuz Tim wouldn't sleep with her. I swear, it's true! why would i
lie. Yasee, it was bad timing is all

Buffy thought she could manipulate Tim into a relationship without him knowing it,
and Tim eventually found out. and he was pissed. And instead of admitting she was
wrong, Buffy went out and seduced the first brainless Fallen son she could find,
to make him jealous. Tim, took no notice. He had revenge on his mind. no time for
women, slayers or otherwise. Buffy whored herself out to the highest bidding
shaman in misguided hope of redemption. And here comes Angel, the fallen, to be
the bullshit white knight female humans have been taught to expect from male
humanity, but never find, so they can complain about it.

Buffy is trailortrash. it's springer meets Xena. (i do love xena, but i won't
admit it)()(it's so campy)(). damn.

well, i still don't like buffy, and angel is total total wholehearted crap. i just
can't justify the position tho. actually, it's pretty much just a perspective.

morph- i'm flying with broken wings, i'm flying alone.....(a line, from a song, by
the group Angel)((so, it's a song ref, i guess))(((i was trying not to do any
ref's and--- damn....)))

morph

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 6:10:27 AM8/22/02
to

Ashley wrote: snip. with extreme prejudice.

lissen up crowe. i shall say this once again, and once again only.

Fontana has/had/always will have/ his own agenda. It doesn't matter how
awesome a model someone sets up for him, he turns it into his agenda. He is
not a creator. He preys on human emotional insecurity. he's a stringpuller.
a complicated stringpuller, but one nonetheless.

He changed elsewhere, changed hlots, used OZ as the percieved gritty show
that is truly nothing more than a followup of "prison riot". he is all
agenda.

fuck fontanna. gimme Attanasio and Levinson. They created what he
bastardized, they get the credit. not fontana.

morph-didn't post this, you are looking into a shakey thingy snowball
thingy.......it's a dream. yeah, that's it. It's just a dream......

Martha K.

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 8:46:10 AM8/22/02
to

"morph" <oneir...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3D64B61A...@earthlink.net...
morphy, honey, much as I was repulsed by the two five-minute segments of
Buffy I've viewed over the years, it's not worth the rant. Are you hopped
up on goofball draperies? Trixie, I think the boy needs some silly cookies,
pronto.

Martha K.


Ashley Crowe

unread,
Aug 22, 2002, 7:53:06 PM8/22/02
to
> >> >Keith Gow wrote:
> >> >> Season 5 is out here in November with commentaries on Real Me, Fool
> >> >> for Love, I was Made to Love You and The Body.
> >> >
> >> >Sure, go ahead. Rub it in.
> >>
> >> That was a sneak preview for some time late next year ;-)
> >
> >Does/will Restless have commentary?
>
> Oh, yes it does. It's quite wonderful, yet Joss still doesn't address
> some stuff that I'd love to ask him about!

I'm looking forward to that then. And speaking of Restless. Have you ever seen
the old annotated Restless webpage? I think it's been taken offline now but I
probably have it somewhere on my hard drive.

I have this whole theory about the Cheese Man in Restless and what he means
but that's probably better suited for email, as what I quote in my sig for that
matter.

<snip>

"I don't want to be
Going through the motions
Losing all my drive.
I can't even see
If this is really me
And I just want to be-
Alive." -Buffy, "Once More, With Feeling"

ash

"That night the Mother of the Spirits walked the length and breadth of the clan,
weeping for her murdered son. It was a terrible night. Not even the oldest man
in Umuofia had ever heard such a strange and fearful sound, and it was never
to be heard again. It seemed as if the very soul of the tribe wept for a great evil
that was coming -- it's own death." - Chinua Achebe, Things Fall Apart

morph

unread,
Aug 24, 2002, 2:02:11 AM8/24/02
to

"Martha K." wrote:

>
> morphy, honey, much as I was repulsed by the two five-minute segments of
> Buffy I've viewed over the years, it's not worth the rant. Are you hopped
> up on goofball draperies? Trixie, I think the boy needs some silly cookies,
> pronto.
>
> Martha K.

time out. that was some of my best work! i tied in the ryland shooting, tim
being cute, buffy being..well what it is. I even had a song ref about Angel! i
deserve an ...umm. well, yaknow.

morph- all the peoples ain't always pleased alls the time. c'est la vie.

RESchwalb

unread,
Aug 26, 2002, 12:49:30 AM8/26/02