POLL: Grayson Vs. Connor
flynhayn
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John Biltz
Agreeable Moose
flynhayn <flyn...@maui.net> wrote in message
news:1415c574...@usw-ex0101-008.remarq.com...
JunkyJim69
>Grayson would win. Duncan won by luck not skill.
Sorry, I didn't see it that way. Duncan was losing on the stairs and catwalk.
Would you call that "bad" luck?
Once on the sulphur, kneeling away from his opponent, Duncan protected the back
of his neck from Grayson's sword with his own and then quick as a fox he
whirled around and slashed open Grayson's belly.
You could see the planning in his face as he gripped and regripped his sword
bracing for the impact he knew was coming.
Grayson, for all his skill, didn't anticipate Duncan blocking and spinning so
quickly to strike.
It wasn't luck there. It was a move that Duncan learned and executed
perfectly. I think he even did it in another episode as well. That's not
luck, that's skill. It is why Duncan trained so frequently.
Grayson vs Conner? That would've really been something to see. A charitable
producer might include a flashback to this in HL IV.
Not that anyone's asking! <heheheheh>
JunkyJim
"Humans are the only species that protect their stupid from the forces of
evolution."
Fear The Government That Fears it's Citizens!
Phil
JunkyJim69 <junky...@aol.commontrash> wrote in message
news:19991026111312...@ng-cq1.aol.com...
<snip>
> It wasn't luck there. It was a move that Duncan learned and executed
> perfectly. I think he even did it in another episode as well. That's not
> luck, that's skill. It is why Duncan trained so frequently.
He did do that move again, it was in series two againsed Nicholas Ward (The
blond headed Vampire type bloke)
I agree that Duncan didn't win through luck, that it was Duncan's skill that
won it for him. But you cannot deny that it was a very close thing.
Plus there was the fact of whether actually Duncan wanted to win.
I know that sounds daft, of course he wanted Grayson Dead and obviously he
didn't want to die, but during the episode he had expressed his concern
about the strength of Greyson's Quickening, and whether or not it would be a
Dark-quickening.
Perhaps that was why Greyson overwhelmed him so much at the beginning of the
fight.
Phil
*Just pondering*
John Biltz
thought Mac was defeated so he was overconfident. It was the equivalent of
a flea flicker. Grayson was by far the better fighter.
Tricky Moose
JunkyJim69 <junky...@aol.commontrash> wrote in message
news:19991026111312...@ng-cq1.aol.com...
> flynhayn wrote:
>
> >Grayson would win. Duncan won by luck not skill.
>
> Sorry, I didn't see it that way. Duncan was losing on the stairs and
catwalk.
> Would you call that "bad" luck?
> Once on the sulphur, kneeling away from his opponent, Duncan protected the
back
> of his neck from Grayson's sword with his own and then quick as a fox he
> whirled around and slashed open Grayson's belly.
> You could see the planning in his face as he gripped and regripped his
sword
> bracing for the impact he knew was coming.
> Grayson, for all his skill, didn't anticipate Duncan blocking and spinning
so
> quickly to strike.
> It wasn't luck there. It was a move that Duncan learned and executed
> perfectly. I think he even did it in another episode as well. That's not
> luck, that's skill. It is why Duncan trained so frequently.
>
TBird
junky...@aol.commontrash (JunkyJim69) writes:
>You could see the planning in his face as he gripped and regripped his sword
>bracing for the impact he knew was coming.
>Grayson, for all his skill, didn't anticipate Duncan blocking and spinning so
>quickly to strike.
JJ - I think it's you and me on this one.
I agree completely.
And the other reason is that I don't think Duncan is ever defeated in his mind.
He never lets go of the idea that he can win somehow. We see Fitz succumb to
Kalas, we see Richie succumb to EDM, but DM never lets a little thing like his
sword getting knocked across a room, or Nefretri slamming her sword up through
his abdomen, let him give up. It's not luck. It's training in attitude as
well as sword skills.
That's how it looks from my little corner of the planet.
TBird <---- JJ's out of lurk mode, JJ's out of lurk mode.... :-)
~
~ ~ ~
Nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight
You've got to kick at the darkness
'Til it bleeds daylight....
---Bruce Cockburn
JunkyJim69
> TBird <---- JJ's out of lurk mode, JJ's out of lurk mode.... :-)
That was cute! It put a huge grin on this tired face!
I can almost picture you jumping up & down when you say it, sort of like
a couple of frames from a Bugs Bunny cartoon!
BTW, thanks for agreeing......I think we're right.
A trick is something not just unexpected, but almost devious. Like Methos
pulling a dagger out of his sleeve and plunging into someones chest while tying
up their sword with his own.
Duncan move was practiced to perfection and had he not been doubting himself, I
think we would have seen him do better with Grayson much earlier in the fight.
Why? I'll tell you.......
<Tread carefully, the spoiler spaces below are for "The End Of Innocence" &
"Reluctant Heroes" episodes >
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Many consider Graham Ashe to be the best, yet he was defeated by Clay. Duncan
went on to defeat Clay fair and square in a head to head, sword to sword
battle. No tricks there. Just a really good disarming move reminding me of
something he learned while watching the English fop Paul Kinman. I think
Grayson was good and it was a close battle, but Duncan was better.
Skill, baby.
Skill is why he always survives.
JJ
HIGHLANDER
slay the Kurgan, he could slay anyone.
Yankees # 1
Gayle Sleight
would win After all he trained DM.
Phil
Gayle Sleight <gaylefr...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:12063-38...@newsd-611.iap.bryant.webtv.net...
> Frist I am glad I am glad I am not the only one up, Of course Connor
> would win After all he trained DM.
On the other hand Brother Paul trained Kalas.........
Get my point...?
Phil...
Shelby
TBird <sixt4...@aol.comedancing> wrote in
article
<19991027005710...@ngol08.aol.com>...
> In article
<19991026111312...@ng-cq1.aol.com>,
> junky...@aol.commontrash (JunkyJim69) writes:
>
> >You could see the planning in his face as he
gripped and regripped his sword
> >bracing for the impact he knew was coming.
> >Grayson, for all his skill, didn't anticipate
Duncan blocking and spinning so
> >quickly to strike.
>
> JJ - I think it's you and me on this one.
> I agree completely.
>
> And the other reason is that I don't think
Duncan is ever defeated in his mind.
> He never lets go of the idea that he can win
somehow. We see Fitz succumb to
> Kalas, we see Richie succumb to EDM, but DM
never lets a little thing like his
> sword getting knocked across a room, or
Nefretri slamming her sword up through
> his abdomen, let him give up.
Pulling Consone's sword *into* his abdomen to
effectively disarm him.
~Shelby
> It's not luck. It's training in attitude as
> well as sword skills.
>
> That's how it looks from my little corner of
the planet.
>
> TBird <---- JJ's out of lurk mode, JJ's out of
lurk mode.... :-)
Shelby
teacher? I don't believe that.
~Shelby
Gayle Sleight <gaylefr...@webtv.net> wrote in
article
<12063-38...@newsd-611.iap.bryant.webtv.net>.
dalroy and/or edie
I haven't read this entire thread so forgive me if I repeat what
others have already said...
I agree with J. J. and TBird about Mac's defeat of Grayson being
due to skill, not luck, and the fact that he refuses to be
beaten. A swordfight involves mental as well as physical skill,
as we all know, and DM has plenty of both.
It doesn't matter who is the better swordsman on paper, IMO.
It's the guy who's left with his head on his shoulders who is
the better fighter, because the other guy is dead. Connor was
better than the Kurgan; Duncan was better than Grayson.
As for who would win in a battle between Grayson and Connor- I'd
have to be an expert at understanding how these particular men
with their particular skills stacked up against each other to
know. (Although, of course, Connor is my sentimental favorite.
:-))
If fighter A beat fighter B after fighter B beat fighter
C, it does not necessarily follow that Fighter A would have
beaten fighter C. Perhaps C would have matched up better
against A than he did against B and won the fight.
JMHO!
Edie
JunkyJim69 wrote:
>
> In a newsgroup that I spend entirely too much time reading, Six4TBird wrote:
>
> > TBird <---- JJ's out of lurk mode, JJ's out of lurk mode.... :-)
>
JunkyJim69
>If fighter A beat fighter B after fighter B beat fighter
>C, it does not necessarily follow that Fighter A would have
>beaten fighter C. Perhaps C would have matched up better
>against A than he did against B and won the fight.
OUCH......you know I just wake up at this time dontcha?
Remember also, that unless the head is taken, just because a fighter loses to
you today doesn't mean that he will lose to you tomorrow. It could be totally
different dynamics and circumstances.
Or, as many have said, the lesser fighter could just have good luck in the next
fight.
Shelby wrote:
>Pulling Consone's sword *into* his abdomen to
>effectively disarm him.
Now THAT'S a warrior!
Gayle Sleight commented:
> Of course Connor would win After all he trained DM.
But also consider the fact that DM was shown to learn something from everyone
he meets, not just Connor.
And what he didn't know he sought education on until he mastered that as well.
I have the feeling that Duncan is the better Warrior, but that's JMHO.
I live for threads like this! So much for lurking.
John Biltz
have beat Connor 9 out of 10 times. Consider the World Series, it is very
rare for a team to pull a sweep and win the first 4 games. It is more
likely that the better team will lose one along the way. Sometimes the
better man does not win, but it is the smart way to bet.
Vegas Moose, Odds Maker to the Immortals
dalroy and/or edie <dal...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:381748C9...@erols.com...
> Hi!
>
> I haven't read this entire thread so forgive me if I repeat what
> others have already said...
>
> I agree with J. J. and TBird about Mac's defeat of Grayson being
> due to skill, not luck, and the fact that he refuses to be
> beaten. A swordfight involves mental as well as physical skill,
> as we all know, and DM has plenty of both.
>
> It doesn't matter who is the better swordsman on paper, IMO.
> It's the guy who's left with his head on his shoulders who is
> the better fighter, because the other guy is dead. Connor was
> better than the Kurgan; Duncan was better than Grayson.
>
> As for who would win in a battle between Grayson and Connor- I'd
> have to be an expert at understanding how these particular men
> with their particular skills stacked up against each other to
> know. (Although, of course, Connor is my sentimental favorite.
> :-))
>
> If fighter A beat fighter B after fighter B beat fighter
> C, it does not necessarily follow that Fighter A would have
> beaten fighter C. Perhaps C would have matched up better
> against A than he did against B and won the fight.
>
Orbital915
both knees with his backed turned. He thought he had the victory and Duncan
knew this and blocked Grayson's final swing. Grayson was so shocked at this tha
the did not have time to react to Duncans slash to the belly. This is truly
skill.
As for Connor Vs. Grayson I would have to say Connor. A big partof a fight is
emotion and Connor always shows strong emotions when fighting. He has fought
the Kurgan one of the most feared Immortals his experience should help him
against Grayson. Grayson has never fought anyone like Connor.
John Biltz
repeat every fight in the movie.
Inquiring Moose
Orbital915 <orbit...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991109173036...@ng-fn1.aol.com...
waylayer
John Biltz <bilt...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:80aa20$5om$4...@holly.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> If Connor is such a great swordsman why does he drop his sword in every, I
> repeat every fight in the movie.
>
> Inquiring Moose
Not this *again*. I think the topics here come in cycles.
----------
waylayer
John Biltz
Schoolyard Moose
waylayer <wayl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:80abuc$c52$1...@autumn.news.rcn.net...
Dilesj
(Orbital915) writes:
>If Grayson was so skilled why did he forget to disarm Duncan after he was on
>both knees with his back turned. He thought he had the victory and Duncan
>knew this and blocked Grayson's final swing. Grayson was so shocked at this
>that he did not have time to react to Duncans slash to the belly. This is
truly
>skill.
>
Not skill. Will.
Diane J. <feelin' laconic>
--
You say the teacher never told you anything but white lies. But you
never see the lies that you believe.
TBird
<bilt...@earthlink.net> writes:
>She\he started it.
>
>Schoolyard Moose
Dang.
What'd they put in *your* coffee this morning? Ovaltine?
TBird <----- break it up or you'll both be making a trip to the principal's
office.... <----- written while trying not to crack a smile