just saw the REAL version of Highlander Endgame
wayl...@my-deja.com
now...I just happened to view it. With a runtime of 1 hour, 36 minutes,
WITHOUT OPENING/ENDING CREDITS, and with much CLEANER EDITING...this is
the version of Endgame that should have been in the theaters, not that
80 minute piece of garbage we all saw, which was all flash and with no
time to actually build a good movie with substance. I was SHOCKED at
how much better the working print is...I'm going to run through the
differences right now...hold on to your hats ladies and gents...
First off, this version is MUCH MORE VIOLENT. We see all the gushing
blood, all the chopped off hands, arms, and legs, ala Braveheart
violence.
There is no lame Connor voice over.
The story does not begin with Connor in the sancutary.
When Connor gets the rope dragged around his head, we see him get the
CRAP BEAT OUT OF HIM. He is clubbed repeatedly. Later when Connor kills
the priest, he gets up with a remorseful look, and shakes his head,
indicating it was not something he really meant to do. Jacob sees this,
yet still doesn't care.
***DELETED SCENE***
A nice 2-3 minute scene immediately follows in the modern day, and we
see Connor and Duncan walking out of a NY subway. Duncan gets a hotdog
from a street vendor and complains "not enough ketchup." What follows
is a nice interaction between the two, and the line from Connor
that "people change." Duncan makes Connor promise to meet him tonight
at a bar at 8pm. Connor agrees, then puts on his sunglasses and walks
towards his loft...
There is about 30-40 seconds more of Duncan/Methos conversation.
A gay guy tries to flirt with Duncan during the training scene in Italy
with Connor...don't ask.
The fight scene between Duncan and Kell's goons is TEN TIMES BETTER.
Each henchman gets a short intro, then they all make cracks toward
Duncan, who returns the shots, even making fun of Cracker Bob's outfit,
who then complains about it to Kate...who sort of shrugs. What follows
is an INCREDIBLE fight scene, cleanly edited, much more coherent, and
about 2 minutes longer. We see Duncan cut and beat up all of Kell's
henchman good and decisively, and see a nice longer scene of Duncan
battling off all of them from the stairs. We also see Cracker Bob pull
the bat out of his head...ouch. You can actually tell what is going on,
and the goons double and triple team a lot more, so the choreography is
much more complex than what ended up in the theater version.
When Kell decapitates Carlos, he lodges the sword in his throat, ala
the script, and spiels about seeing your own dead body, before killing
him. We see Jin clearly shake his head and frown in objection to
Carlos's actions beforehand, and seems to indicate he knows and doesn't
want Carlos to die. Wow, actual characterization!
When Duncan is strapped to the chair, the bad watcher dude goes off for
a minute as to WHY AND HOW Kell is so powerful. Why any of this was cut
is besides me, as it nicely explains his power.
In the getaway car, Methos says he found Duncan's sword in the "lost
and found." Duncan complains as to blood on the blade, to which Methos
replies "I didn't say it was easy."
When Kell taunts Connor, we see flashes of not only Connor's loft
blowing up, but also a French woman falling off a horse and breaking
her neck, BUT ALSO a short snippet of BRENDA WYATT BEING HIT BY A CAR.
At Kate's fashion place, the conversation lasts a bit longer.
This is where I actually start to like the movie...
***DELETED SCENE***
Following Kate and Duncan's conversation, we see a nice montage of both
Duncan and Kate walking the streets separately, both clearly pondering
the conversation they had with each other. We see Kate start to think
about what she is doing. WOW! More characterization! Is it possible???
This all leads to an ESTABLISHING SHOT OF KELL'S HEADQUARTERS, which is
in fact a large temple/church, on a bridge that appears to be on the
East River maybe??
***DELETED SCENE***
This scene is IMPERATIVE to establishing the relationship between Kell
and Kate/Faith. She walks into the temple, she greets him and says "no
not tonight, I'm tired." There, an establishment of at LEAST a sexual
relationship.
What follows is a conversation on a balcony of this huge temple, that
Kate mentions is still in construction. They then have an actual
conversation...wow. They talk about the Game, the Quickening, Kell's
motivations, and Kate and the rest's part in all of it. The
conversation ends quite strikingly. Kell asks Kate "do u know what LIVE
spelled backards is?" She responds, "Live would be Evil, but LIVED
would be..." She turns, and Kell is gone.
Kate then imagines and thinks back to:
1)
A longer and better version of the highwaymen scene. There is actual
humor, as the highwaymen play off of each other, as do Duncan and
Connor. At one point we see the highwaymen draw their swords as they
think Duncan is smart to their ways, but they quickly shield their
swords as Duncan indulges them. When they actually fight, there is nice
interaction between Connor and Duncan, who sits on his butt and
critiques Connor's technique as Connor finishes off the last two
highwaymen.
2)Longer wedding celebration sequence, where we see a drunk yell at
Duncan to "kiss her!!!", who happily obliges.
NOW WE ACTUALLY KNOW WHY KATE GOES TO VISIT DUNCAN, she remembers the
good old times and hopes to recapture the feelings to those memories
We then Kate dance inside the temple, as we hear the wedding music play
in the background...actually a very beautiful image.
THE SEX SCENE
A much longer, emotional, and dare I say...HOTTER SEX SCENE. Kate
caresses Duncan before going at it with him. More breast shots (yumm),
and for you ladies out there, 3 yes THREE shots of Duncan's butt,
including one where Kate gets a nice handful.
After Duncan "kills" Kate, she runs away and Duncan starts crying and
whimpers "Damn you Connor Macleod!". Duncan...you made your own
decision, so stop whining ;p
After the elevator closes, Duncan feels Connor's presence, which leads
directly to the ROOFTOP BATTLE.
This is basically the same, except...
It is nicely intertwined with the "last supper" scene.
At the supper, Kell thanks each of his men individually.
Here's where the important stuff happens...
Kell's henchmen do NOT give up their heads willingly!
He surprises them, and then in a blink of an eye, with two swings, he
kills all of them EXCEPT Jin and Kate...
U ready???
After Jin sees the rest dead, -Manny, Cracker Bob, the Jamaican
guy...he takes his sword into a defensive stance. He looks up at
Kell...shakes his head, and knows he's a dead man. He TAKES HIS SWORD,
PLANTS IT IN THE WALL, RUNS INTO THE BLADE AND DECAPITATES HIMSELF.
Got all that????
Then Kell says, right before the Quickening - to Kate..."Get out of
here!"
That's right...KELL DOES NOT KILL KATE
....
....
Connor's quickening to Duncan is MUCH more explosive, longer, and
powerful...finally some respect to the man.
***DELETED SCENE***
We quickly see 2 nude women, and then Kell next to them in bed, staring
up at the wall...this establishes that the final fight is in fact in
the temple!
The final fight was about 2 minutes longer, including a spectacular
stunt where Kell strikes a gas valve, Duncan, thinking to hurt Kell,
strikes an electrical wire which HITS the gas valve. However, the
flames start to come up through the floor grates at Duncan! He gets
chased by a fire trail and ends up being thrown some twenty feet.
Next they battle in a ROOM FULL OF CHAINS suspended from the
ceiling...a very nice little scene, which ends up with Duncan rising up
to the top of the temple by grabbing on to one of the chains that was
rising up. At the roof Duncan looks at his wounds and says "it's
endgame for you Kell." The battle then resumes as normal. AND NO STUPID
MORPHING
The quickening was much bigger also, with a lot of stuff in the
refinery section of the temple exploding.
***DIFFERENT ENDING***DELETED SCENE***
At Connor's grave, instead of the CHEESY blue background, we instead
see a beautiful mountain range. It's as if they forgot to put it in the
prints they shipped to theaters.
Now we see a solemn Duncan walking in what appears to be some sort of
modern building complex, with fireworks in the background. Duncan
surprisingly sees Kate, who has abandoned her "extreme" outfit and
makeup of before.
Duncan: So what now?
Kate: Trust.
Duncan: You can always trust me Faith.
Kate: Faith is dead...I thought we'd give Kate another chance.
Duncan tries to give back her locket that Kell dropped on him during
their fight, but Kate refuses and tells Duncan "not yet...you hold onto
it for me." "We have plenty of time."
---------------------
so there u have it, an actual ending instead of the movie just STOPPING.
I said my goodbyes, but I felt it was my duty as a Highlander fan to
let all of you know about this, and how we all got screwed over yet
again. I dunno why in the world all this stuff was cut out, but it was,
and it sucks hard. This version, as it was, was actually a pretty good
movie, and I would have given my thumbs up to this, instead of that
tripe they forced down our throats in theaters. Look forward to the DVD
and the REAL Highlander Endgame...
---------
waylayer
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Michigan
Eance
I understood there was considerable footage cut because miramax
insisted on an 85 min. slot but that might have been rumour too.
E
In article <8pk0h0$t2n$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
wayl...@my-deja.com
Eance <ea...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> This sounds really interesting Waylayer, may I ask where you found it?
>
> I understood there was considerable footage cut because miramax
> insisted on an 85 min. slot but that might have been rumour too.
> E
Wouldn't be prudent to say if and where I got it...some people just
know where to get these sort of things though. I know that most of you
won't believe me unless you see it for yourselves...but at least now
you will be on guard for this sort of stuff. Nowadays you can download
either a screener or a subtitled version of a movie about 2-3 weeks
after its initial release...it's the latest craze. 96 minutes of live
action vs 80...who was responsible for this??
Ladeebkwrm
On Tue, 12 Sep 2000 01:22:59 GMT, wayl...@my-deja.com wrote:
>I said my goodbyes, but I felt it was my duty as a Highlander fan to
>let all of you know about this, and how we all got screwed over yet
>again. I dunno why in the world all this stuff was cut out, but it was,
>and it sucks hard. This version, as it was, was actually a pretty good
>movie, and I would have given my thumbs up to this, instead of that
>tripe they forced down our throats in theaters. Look forward to the DVD
>and the REAL Highlander Endgame...
*If* they're smart enough to put all this stuff back in - and take out
Methos' line about "holy ground". <g> (Although I really liked Jo's
reasoning a LOT) I don't mind there being less gore, but other than
that, this sounds like something I'd like to see. Thanks for taking
the time to tell us all about it, waylayer.
And come back, dammit!
Kristina <wishing for a cable modem>
~~~~~
Keeper of Peter Wingfield and Tim McGraw
Graphite
on a quick connections. I know a lot of people who would die to see this
version inculding me. So e-mail me if you can help at least find it.
--
Thanks,
Graphite
http://members.xoom.com/Graphite2k
Eance
Say no more.
Do you have a secret handshake and wear a gaberdine raincoat too?
E
Ladeebkwrm
On Tue, 12 Sep 2000 03:34:02 GMT, Eance <ea...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> So...You`re one of those chaps "in the know" nudge nudge, wink wink.
> Say no more.
>
>Do you have a secret handshake and wear a gaberdine raincoat too?
LOL - my brothers are internet junkies, I can vouch for waylayer's
being able to get current movies online. It's just that if you tell
people where, then the Big Bad Internet Police come along and shut it
down.
I imagine that's why he's being less than forthcoming. <g>
Kristina
~~~~~
One of the Four Horsewomen of the ATH Gutter
Kevin P. Brennan
on cable this weekend. utterly brilliant. didn't have harrison ford's lame
voice over. it was hugely impacting. you actually cared for rutger and
harrison, the two protagonists in conflict with each other.
I'm not surprised that highlander endgame happened the same way. It's as
though, at the focus groups, the marketing geeks say " uh oh, better widen the
primary market" and dillute what otherwise would be the director's vision.
If you can provide thelocation of the good version, I'm sure a thousand
highlander fans will download it, and discuss it.....
Oh, in terms of versions,
in the end, there can be only one.
Kevin
>The working print of Highlander Endgame is all over the internet
>now...I just happened to view it. With a runtime of 1 hour, 36 minutes,
>WITHOUT OPENING/ENDING CREDITS, and with much CLEANER EDITING...this is
>the version of Endgame that should have been in the theaters, not that
>80 minute piece of garbage we all saw, which was all flash and with no
>time to actually build a good movie with substance. I was SHOCKED at
>how much better the working print is...I'm going to run through the
>differences right now...hold on to your hats ladies and gents...
>
"What glorious creature is man, that he should see his doom and run so happily
towards it." -- attributed to some genius.
"It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail." -- Gore Vidal
Princess
I haven't been raving about the movie....but I did enjoy it.....maybe I'm
easily amused, I wanted new Highlander stuff, and I got it.
But...but.....but.....what were they thinking??? How on earth could they
cut out some of that stuff?
I've got a friend who downloads movies all the time....because so many
movies don't make it to Sweden....but I never even thought to ask him about
this one...because I thought I saw it.....
Man....I was hoping it would have a long run in the theatre.....and now I'm
just hoping they get it out on dvd as soon as possible......
Thanks for the post Waylayer.....
Tracey
--
Princess
(The Princess of Paranoia)
"It's not called paranoid if they really are out to get you!"
princesst...@HLcancelled.hotmail.com
(you know what to do right?)
<wayl...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8pk0h0$t2n$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Foxx
> The working print of Highlander Endgame is all over the internet
> now...I just happened to view it. With a runtime of 1 hour, 36 minutes,
> WITHOUT OPENING/ENDING CREDITS, and with much CLEANER EDITING...this is
> the version of Endgame that should have been in the theaters, not that
> 80 minute piece of garbage we all saw, which was all flash and with no
> time to actually build a good movie with substance. I was SHOCKED at
> how much better the working print is...I'm going to run through the
> differences right now...hold on to your hats ladies and gents...
But I saw this article before I plan to write the movie review in
Chinese.(to introduce this perfect movie^_^)
I saw this movie several times but still have some problem that I don't
really know what happened..that's why I would like to see that "real
version" or my articles will have some mistakes..
There are not so many Highlander fans in my country(Taiwan), and I'm
worry about that this wonderful movie will not be showed there:(
I'm going to write the review and try to push the company to show it in
my country..so can you give me some tips about how to find it?
If you think it's a little bit danger if you tell me about that, it's
ok..I understand.
After seeing your article, I do think this movie might be better than
the original one, because it seems to solve many questions in that 85min
version..anyway, thank you to let us know about the "true" Endgame:)
TBird
>Wouldn't be prudent to say if and where I got it...some people just
>know where to get these sort of things though. I know that most of you
>won't believe me unless you see it for yourselves...but at least now
>you will be on guard for this sort of stuff.
I'll say this.
You've posted here for a while.
And you know Gillian reads and posts here.
So you're either telling some version of the truth or you are a complete and
total nutcase. ;-)
TBird <------ the jury is out, yup, you're right, until I see it for myself or
hear it from Gillian
One of the Four Horsewomen of the ATH Gutter
~ ~ ~
No matter who we think we are
Everybody
Gets a chance to be
Nothing.
~ Bruce Cockburn
icq # 63568829
SLAYER7371
to get it rated. Hence the sloppy editing job. They wanted to movie out in
Sept. no matter what. Just an opinion.
Stephen
>In article <8pk688$3os$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, wayl...@my-deja.com writes:
>
>>Wouldn't be prudent to say if and where I got it...some people just
>>know where to get these sort of things though. I know that most of you
>>won't believe me unless you see it for yourselves...but at least now
>>you will be on guard for this sort of stuff.
>
>I'll say this.
>You've posted here for a while.
>And you know Gillian reads and posts here.
>So you're either telling some version of the truth or you are a complete and
>total nutcase. ;-)
It's true that the workprint is out there at least. There is a
version being posted to alt.binaries.vcd as I type this. I'm sure it
will end up in alt.binaries.movies* and other groups over the next
week or two in various forms as well...
dal...@erols.com
Well, now. <g> If this is the real deal (no offense waylayer- I am
going to assume it is until told otherwise by TPTB) I am not going
to jump on the bandwagon and endorse it wholeheartedly as the better
version of the film.
IMO, there was good reason to have cut some of this. OTOH, some of it
sounds good too...
Of course, I'd have to see it to be sure.
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E
wayl...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
> The working print of Highlander Endgame is all over the internet
> now...I just happened to view it. With a runtime of 1 hour, 36 minutes,
> WITHOUT OPENING/ENDING CREDITS, and with much CLEANER EDITING...this is
> the version of Endgame that should have been in the theaters, not that
> 80 minute piece of garbage we all saw, which was all flash and with no
> time to actually build a good movie with substance. I was SHOCKED at
> how much better the working print is...I'm going to run through the
> differences right now...hold on to your hats ladies and gents...
>
> First off, this version is MUCH MORE VIOLENT. We see all the gushing
> blood, all the chopped off hands, arms, and legs, ala Braveheart
> violence.
Would this have improved the film? Not IMO.
>
> There is no lame Connor voice over.
> The story does not begin with Connor in the sancutary.
Well, the story actually begins with Rachel's death, but that's
nitpicking. <g> I agree that as the film turned out, I would have
left off the voiceover.
>
> When Connor gets the rope dragged around his head, we see him get the
> CRAP BEAT OUT OF HIM. He is clubbed repeatedly. Later when Connor kills
> the priest, he gets up with a remorseful look, and shakes his head,
> indicating it was not something he really meant to do. Jacob sees this,
> yet still doesn't care.
Interestingly, in the film as is, it almost looked as if Connor was
impatient at this moment, not remorseful. I think that this would have
been a better scene. Which reminds me. The impact of this scene was
reduced for me by the previous one where the people come to Connor's
land. Aside fom CL's laughable accent, I thought that the people who
played the folks coming to tell Connor about his mother were less than
menacing. Had this been a scarier scene, the scene following would have
had even more impact, IMHO.
>
> ***DELETED SCENE***
> A nice 2-3 minute scene immediately follows in the modern day, and we
> see Connor and Duncan walking out of a NY subway. Duncan gets a hotdog
> from a street vendor and complains "not enough ketchup." What follows
> is a nice interaction between the two, and the line from Connor
> that "people change." Duncan makes Connor promise to meet him tonight
> at a bar at 8pm. Connor agrees, then puts on his sunglasses and walks
> towards his loft...
This sounds as if it might have been a good scene. Interestingly,
after I saw the movie it occurred to me that it would have been a more
dramatic opening scene if Duncan had been with Connor when the building
blew up...
>
> There is about 30-40 seconds more of Duncan/Methos conversation.
Can't know until I've seen it if this would have been good or not.
>
> A gay guy tries to flirt with Duncan during the training scene in Italy
> with Connor...don't ask.
Glad they cut it.
>
> The fight scene between Duncan and Kell's goons is TEN TIMES BETTER.
> Each henchman gets a short intro, then they all make cracks toward
> Duncan, who returns the shots, even making fun of Cracker Bob's outfit,
> who then complains about it to Kate...who sort of shrugs. What follows
> is an INCREDIBLE fight scene, cleanly edited, much more coherent, and
> about 2 minutes longer. We see Duncan cut and beat up all of Kell's
> henchman good and decisively, and see a nice longer scene of Duncan
> battling off all of them from the stairs. We also see Cracker Bob pull
> the bat out of his head...ouch.
Yuck. Just as happy that that scene was cut. But I'd like to see
this version to make up my mind about the rest. My feeling is that
adding some more to this scene would not have been a bad thing....
You can actually tell what is going on,
> and the goons double and triple team a lot more, so the choreography is
> much more complex than what ended up in the theater version.
>
> When Kell decapitates Carlos, he lodges the sword in his throat, ala
> the script, and spiels about seeing your own dead body, before killing
> him.
Sounds icky, (and does that mean they'd have cut (sorry <g>) "Decap with
a twist. No sugar)?" I'm not sure that keeping this in wouldn't have
been gratuitous.
We see Jin clearly shake his head and frown in objection to
> Carlos's actions beforehand, and seems to indicate he knows and doesn't
> want Carlos to die. Wow, actual characterization!
I'd have liked to have seen this, I think.
>
> When Duncan is strapped to the chair, the bad watcher dude goes off for
> a minute as to WHY AND HOW Kell is so powerful. Why any of this was cut
> is besides me, as it nicely explains his power.
I'd have liked to have seen his power *shown* better, not explained.
There are too many explanations in this movie as is, IMO.
>
> In the getaway car, Methos says he found Duncan's sword in the "lost
> and found." Duncan complains as to blood on the blade, to which Methos
> replies "I didn't say it was easy."
I like this bit. This needed explaining.
>
> When Kell taunts Connor, we see flashes of not only Connor's loft
> blowing up, but also a French woman falling off a horse and breaking
> her neck, BUT ALSO a short snippet of BRENDA WYATT BEING HIT BY A CAR.
I like this too. We'd get a sense of just how often Kell has killed
those whom Connor loved, and they could have left out that
obvious bit where Kell talked about how Connor raised Rachel, in the
cemetery scene.
>
> At Kate's fashion place, the conversation lasts a bit longer.
I wouldn't have minded this, depending on the dialogue.
>
> This is where I actually start to like the movie...
>
> ***DELETED SCENE***
>
> Following Kate and Duncan's conversation, we see a nice montage of both
> Duncan and Kate walking the streets separately, both clearly pondering
> the conversation they had with each other. We see Kate start to think
> about what she is doing. WOW! More characterization! Is it possible???
I would have liked to have seen this too.
>
> This all leads to an ESTABLISHING SHOT OF KELL'S HEADQUARTERS, which is
> in fact a large temple/church, on a bridge that appears to be on the
> East River maybe??
Hmmm. Is this holy ground? If so, we'd be having another debate about
Kell killing on holy ground when he killed his henchmen.
>
> ***DELETED SCENE***
> This scene is IMPERATIVE to establishing the relationship between Kell
> and Kate/Faith. She walks into the temple, she greets him and says "no
> not tonight, I'm tired." There, an establishment of at LEAST a sexual
> relationship.
>
> What follows is a conversation on a balcony of this huge temple, that
> Kate mentions is still in construction. They then have an actual
> conversation...wow. They talk about the Game, the Quickening, Kell's
> motivations, and Kate and the rest's part in all of it. The
> conversation ends quite strikingly. Kell asks Kate "do u know what LIVE
> spelled backards is?" She responds, "Live would be Evil, but LIVED
> would be..." She turns, and Kell is gone.
Could have been good, but I'm not sure. I'd have to see it, but I agree
that seeing more on Kell's and Kate's relationship and Kell's
motivations would have been nice.
>
> Kate then imagines and thinks back to:
>
> 1)
> A longer and better version of the highwaymen scene. There is actual
> humor, as the highwaymen play off of each other, as do Duncan and
> Connor. At one point we see the highwaymen draw their swords as they
> think Duncan is smart to their ways, but they quickly shield their
> swords as Duncan indulges them. When they actually fight, there is nice
> interaction between Connor and Duncan, who sits on his butt and
> critiques Connor's technique as Connor finishes off the last two
> highwaymen.
I think this might be a better version of the scene. I'd like to see
it to make up my mind. :-)
>
> 2)Longer wedding celebration sequence, where we see a drunk yell at
> Duncan to "kiss her!!!", who happily obliges.
Works for me. :-)
>
> NOW WE ACTUALLY KNOW WHY KATE GOES TO VISIT DUNCAN, she remembers the
> good old times and hopes to recapture the feelings to those memories
>
> We then Kate dance inside the temple, as we hear the wedding music play
> in the background...actually a very beautiful image.
I'd like to see this someday...
>
> THE SEX SCENE
> A much longer, emotional, and dare I say...HOTTER SEX SCENE. Kate
> caresses Duncan before going at it with him. More breast shots (yumm),
> and for you ladies out there, 3 yes THREE shots of Duncan's butt,
> including one where Kate gets a nice handful.
Now here I'm not so sure. Frankly, I thought the posterior shot they
had was gratuitous, and didn't work with the rest of this scene. But I
thought that this scene could have been done better, so I'd like to
see this version and see if the juxtaposition of the past and present
scenes works better for me.
>
> After Duncan "kills" Kate, she runs away and Duncan starts crying and
> whimpers "Damn you Connor Macleod!". Duncan...you made your own
> decision, so stop whining ;p
I'm glad they cut this.
>
> After the elevator closes, Duncan feels Connor's presence, which leads
> directly to the ROOFTOP BATTLE.
>
> This is basically the same, except...
>
> It is nicely intertwined with the "last supper" scene.
> At the supper, Kell thanks each of his men individually.
>
Whoa. I don't know about this. This might dilute the impact of both
scenes. I liked the rooftop scene just fine and don't think they
should have done it much differently...
> Here's where the important stuff happens...
>
> Kell's henchmen do NOT give up their heads willingly!
> He surprises them, and then in a blink of an eye, with two swings, he
> kills all of them EXCEPT Jin and Kate...
Okay. This works better, maybe.
>
> U ready???
>
> After Jin sees the rest dead, -Manny, Cracker Bob, the Jamaican
> guy...he takes his sword into a defensive stance. He looks up at
> Kell...shakes his head, and knows he's a dead man. He TAKES HIS SWORD,
> PLANTS IT IN THE WALL, RUNS INTO THE BLADE AND DECAPITATES HIMSELF.
But how does this come across? It might nto work on screen. I'd have
to see it. But I like this idea better- at least Jin took control of
his own death.
>
> Got all that????
>
> Then Kell says, right before the Quickening - to Kate..."Get out of
> here!"
>
> That's right...KELL DOES NOT KILL KATE
I'd have to see how this all plays out in this version to see if I
like it better. I did wish that Duncan hadn't ended up never knowing
that Kate had begun to forgive him- it made his statement about
having tomorrow not really true, at least for him.
>
> ....
> ....
>
> Connor's quickening to Duncan is MUCH more explosive, longer, and
> powerful...finally some respect to the man.
I like this, although Kell's would have had to be even bigger still.
>
> ***DELETED SCENE***
> We quickly see 2 nude women, and then Kell next to them in bed, staring
> up at the wall...this establishes that the final fight is in fact in
> the temple!
Again- holy ground? Or did I miss something? Maybe they were trying
to *delete* all references to fighting on holy gorund and just missed
Methos' comment? Still, I think they might have done more to give Kell
a sense of place...
>
> The final fight was about 2 minutes longer, including a spectacular
> stunt where Kell strikes a gas valve, Duncan, thinking to hurt Kell,
> strikes an electrical wire which HITS the gas valve. However, the
> flames start to come up through the floor grates at Duncan! He gets
> chased by a fire trail and ends up being thrown some twenty feet.
Cool. :-)
>
> Next they battle in a ROOM FULL OF CHAINS suspended from the
> ceiling...a very nice little scene, which ends up with Duncan rising up
> to the top of the temple by grabbing on to one of the chains that was
> rising up. At the roof Duncan looks at his wounds and says "it's
> endgame for you Kell." The battle then resumes as normal. AND NO STUPID
> MORPHING
The chains!! I'd wondered where they had gotten to! But oh, man, if
they had kept that "it's endgame for you Kell" line in the movie I
would have had a hard time not throwing my popcorn at teh screen!
Yecch. That's a terrible line and well cut, IMO.
>
> The quickening was much bigger also, with a lot of stuff in the
> refinery section of the temple exploding.
Cool. (I like explosions. :-)
>
> ***DIFFERENT ENDING***DELETED SCENE***
>
> At Connor's grave, instead of the CHEESY blue background, we instead
> see a beautiful mountain range. It's as if they forgot to put it in the
> prints they shipped to theaters.
>
> Now we see a solemn Duncan walking in what appears to be some sort of
> modern building complex, with fireworks in the background. Duncan
> surprisingly sees Kate, who has abandoned her "extreme" outfit and
> makeup of before.
>
> Duncan: So what now?
> Kate: Trust.
> Duncan: You can always trust me Faith.
> Kate: Faith is dead...I thought we'd give Kate another chance.
>
> Duncan tries to give back her locket that Kell dropped on him during
> their fight, but Kate refuses and tells Duncan "not yet...you hold onto
> it for me." "We have plenty of time."
This sounds *much* better, tho' of course I'd have to see it to be
sure.
>
> ---------------------
> so there u have it, an actual ending instead of the movie just STOPPING.
>
> I said my goodbyes, but I felt it was my duty as a Highlander fan to
> let all of you know about this, and how we all got screwed over yet
> again. I dunno why in the world all this stuff was cut out, but it was,
> and it sucks hard. This version, as it was, was actually a pretty good
> movie, and I would have given my thumbs up to this, instead of that
> tripe they forced down our throats in theaters. Look forward to the DVD
> and the REAL Highlander Endgame...
Again, while I think some of this would have improved Endgame, I'm
just as happy that some of this was cut from the movie I saw in the
theaters. I must say I *am* curious about the version that will go to
Europe and to video...
Edie
>
> ---------
> waylayer
arguing that this version probably wouldn't satisfy everyone either <g>
LAB
see Connor and Duncan walking out of a NY subway. Duncan gets a hotdog
from a street vendor and complains "not enough ketchup." What follows
is a nice interaction between the two, and the line from Connor
that "people change." Duncan makes Connor promise to meet him tonight
at a bar at 8pm. Connor agrees, then puts on his sunglasses and walks
towards his loft...>>
This clears up my confusion when Duncan says he was with Connor that day but
you never see the two together before the loft blows up! They really ought
to let one of us fans in that editing room for continuity's sake!
LAB
Amen. ( :Ş Irene)
LAB
> blowing up, but also a French woman falling off a horse and breaking
> her neck, BUT ALSO a short snippet of BRENDA WYATT BEING HIT BY A CAR.>>
this would better establish the pattern that Kell had been tracking Connor
over the years as opposed to the Rachel only incident.
Who edited this movie? had they seen Highlander before?!
LAB
The establishment of Duncan's commitement and love for Kate would be
nice...seemed a very disjointed storyline. Why would he marry *her* and not
Tessa?
LAB
A much longer, emotional, and dare I say...HOTTER SEX SCENE. Kate
caresses Duncan before going at it with him. More breast shots (yumm),
and for you ladies out there, 3 yes THREE shots of Duncan's butt,
including one where Kate gets a nice handful.>>
Is this version going to be available on the black market?!?!?
LAB
> whimpers "Damn you Connor Macleod!". Duncan...you made your own
NO... NO Any scene where Duncan is crying is a good scene....I vote it
should have been left!
LAB
> Kate: Trust.
> Duncan: You can always trust me Faith.
> Kate: Faith is dead...I thought we'd give Kate another chance.
>
> Duncan tries to give back her locket that Kell dropped on him during
> their fight, but Kate refuses and tells Duncan "not yet...you hold onto
> it for me." "We have plenty of time.">>
NO NO NO NO NO NO....I liked Kate dead. No more Kate..no, no way...
Mark Nguyen <mnguyen@
And if you're lying, well, I like your version better anyway. :)
Mark
dal...@erols.com
wayl...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
> In article <8pk44c$1bi$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Eance <ea...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> > This sounds really interesting Waylayer, may I ask where you found it?
> >
> > I understood there was considerable footage cut because miramax
> > insisted on an 85 min. slot but that might have been rumour too.
> > E
>
Nowadays you can download
> either a screener or a subtitled version of a movie about 2-3 weeks
> after its initial release...it's the latest craze.
snips
I admit that I would like to see scenes that were cut from the
film. Or dailies, etc. But any extra footage I see, I want to see
because the people who own the rights to the film have screened it
themselves or have given their permission for the screening.
It's only fair.
Edie
won't look at any Highlander Endgame clips that come over the
internet that are not from official sites.
>
> ---------
> waylayer
Dotiran
>
I seriously doubt waylayer is lying. This version matches up very well with the
leaked script in many places especially the ending. Furthermore I know of
someone else who has seen this version though she will not say where or how..
Pirated or not there is footage out there.
Besides, in an interview online Lisa B. mentions all sorts of scenes of
Faith/Kate and Duncan that are not in the movie. The loss of back story on that
relationship is a glaring omission.
Dorothy aka Rottweiler on the Rysher forum
taxlady
wrote:
><< A gay guy tries to flirt with Duncan during the training scene in Italy
> with Connor...don't ask....Glad they cut it.>>
>
>Amen. ( :Ş Irene)
>
But, can you blame him?
taxlady
wrote:
Movies usually have someone in charge of continuity. I think letting
someone who really liked the series do it would have been an excellent
idea.
Jodi Ilyse
hush hush version of the film we folks at the NY party got to see. I know
folks here have mixed feeling about Panzer/Davis, so saying they had final cut
will probably only solidify whatever views you have even further, but they
*did* have final cut. So this is what they wanted us to see. The director was
a first time director--who agreed to work on a film where he didn't get final
cut AND which was filmed on the cheap so as to avoid pesky expensive union
rules. If ya wanna think he's the better keeper of Highlander mythos and the
more skilled movie-putter-together, all the more power to you.
He was, I hear, contracted to deliver a PG-13 film. And didn't. Who knows if
the mass of violence/no violence, breasts/no breasts mishmash we saw had
something to do with that running debate? I do know that if I was paying
attention to anything in this movie (aside from the Talmudic discussion which
folks who know me *know* I tune in for) I was there to see AP--and I can't say
that having the love scenes separate did anything to help further the soppy
Kate/Duncan relationship or my viewing pleasure. (I think AP and LB were
acting their little hearts out, but I wasn't feeling the love or chemistry
between them, despite the gorgeous bodily contortions.) Imo all TPTB in this
project, from the writers down to the editors, had the cards stacked against
them from the get-go by having to tell two stories for two lead
characters--each got shortshrift because no matter how valiant the effort, the
stories didn't come together seamlessly. Duncan and Connor both needed set-up,
back-story, etc. Don't get me wrong, I know we HL-folk love those flashbacks,
but usually they move the story forward in some way. Too often here it was
just to set-up plot points and belaboring character motivation.
On all the specifics mentioned in the previous post, for most it's probably six
on one hand, half dozen on the other. Since most audience members were
probably of the choir anyway, maybe longer would've been better in any case.
At least we'd feel like we got our money's worth. Not like it would've
affected reviews or box office anyway.
But--I do think the decap with a twist scene shows how ludicrous keeping more
of the 'gory' violence in would've been. Maybe it's just my cynical self,
maybe it's because of the rock bottom basement FX budget, maybe it's because I
couldn't care less about whose ox, so to speak, was being gored up there, but
those blinking eyes on Gun Boy's bodiless head made me snicker, not cringe.
More guts and gore might've satisfied the 'ooh we get to see more than on TV'
contingent. (Much as the ladies' boobies do.) But whether it'd have deepened
the impact of the story, I don't know. I have my doubts.
I do know that I thought the intercutting between the Last Supper and the
Duncan/Connor rooftop scene seemed to dilute the tension when I was watching
the director's cut. I don't know enough about directing or editing to say
whether that was at fault, but I do know that every time we switched scenes,
the 'forward motion' stopped and had to build again. I also thought the reshot
Connor and Duncan had much more emotional impact. As did offing all the posse
post-haste. I doubt the 'Kate Lives" ending I saw would've made it into the
film even if they'd decided to go that way--it was filmed so they could say
they finished the film in the UK and pass go and collect the tax rebate--but I
know that the Duncan/Kell showdown had much more oomph for me when Kell let
Duncan know wifey-woman was dead. If I'd felt what I wanted to feel for the
Duncan/Kate relationship, maybe I'd have wanted her standing at the end.
I definitely think this movie's a case of too many chefs. And a shining
example of the old saw 'it takes money to make money'. I'm just not convinced
that any one of the chefs might've given us a better souffle.
(That is, except for Gillian. Aisle Nine Gillian! I favor Gillian. Whether
she like the rest of La La wanted to direct or not. Whether she personally
threaded the beads on Kate's choker or not. Ever since someone hypothesized
that we'd all blame Gillian for what we didn't like in the movie, I vowed to
blindly ascribe all that was good within the movie--and the world at large--to
the mighty GHOR. All hail!)
Oh, it is fun to have these epics to write again. So much more fun than work
work :-)
Jodi
TBird
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
If you haven't seen the movie in the US yet, spoilers won't much matter....
In article <39BE49D9...@erols.com>, dal...@erols.com writes:
> He TAKES HIS SWORD,
>> PLANTS IT IN THE WALL, RUNS INTO THE BLADE AND DECAPITATES HIMSELF.
>
>But how does this come across? It might nto work on screen. I'd have
>to see it. But I like this idea better- at least Jin took control of
>his own death.
>
I thought about this in the shower....
And I decided this si too comical.....for some reason it just seems hokey and
Laurel and Hardy-ish to me. In reading it, I have expect him to bouce off the
sword, not decapitated himself. Maybe a good Monty Python scene....he keeps
trying to cut his own head of and bouncing off, getting up and trying again
while Kell and Kate look on......
TBird <-------- he's pining for the fjords!
Jay Sant Juan
hope of another movie instead of making a B movie barely worth the B? They made
their choice, I hope they get their act together on the video.
ladyim...@my-deja.com
Duncan's butt) on one of the Yahoo Highlander clubs. If there's
interest, I can post a link.
As for the film...who's decision was it to edit all that good stuff
out? When we find him - heads will roll!!!
In article <8plios$bd2$2...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net>,
Dotiran
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
>><<A nice 2-3 minute scene immediately follows in the modern day, and we
>> see Connor and Duncan walking out of a NY subway.
We get to see just a snippet of this scene in the montage following Connor's
death.
Susan Stansfield
released on DVD?
Susan
In article <8pk0h0$t2n$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, wayl...@my-deja.com wrote:
>The working print of Highlander Endgame is all over the internet
>now...I just happened to view it. With a runtime of 1 hour, 36 minutes,
>WITHOUT OPENING/ENDING CREDITS, and with much CLEANER EDITING...this is
>the version of Endgame that should have been in the theaters, not that
>80 minute piece of garbage we all saw, which was all flash and with no
>time to actually build a good movie with substance. I was SHOCKED at
>how much better the working print is...I'm going to run through the
>differences right now...hold on to your hats ladies and gents...
>
>First off, this version is MUCH MORE VIOLENT. We see all the gushing
>blood, all the chopped off hands, arms, and legs, ala Braveheart
>violence.
>
>There is no lame Connor voice over.
>The story does not begin with Connor in the sancutary.
>
>When Connor gets the rope dragged around his head, we see him get the
>CRAP BEAT OUT OF HIM. He is clubbed repeatedly. Later when Connor kills
>the priest, he gets up with a remorseful look, and shakes his head,
>indicating it was not something he really meant to do. Jacob sees this,
>yet still doesn't care.
>
>***DELETED SCENE***
>A nice 2-3 minute scene immediately follows in the modern day, and we
>see Connor and Duncan walking out of a NY subway. Duncan gets a hotdog
>from a street vendor and complains "not enough ketchup." What follows
>is a nice interaction between the two, and the line from Connor
>that "people change." Duncan makes Connor promise to meet him tonight
>at a bar at 8pm. Connor agrees, then puts on his sunglasses and walks
>towards his loft...
>
>There is about 30-40 seconds more of Duncan/Methos conversation.
>
>A gay guy tries to flirt with Duncan during the training scene in Italy
>with Connor...don't ask.
>
>The fight scene between Duncan and Kell's goons is TEN TIMES BETTER.
>Each henchman gets a short intro, then they all make cracks toward
>Duncan, who returns the shots, even making fun of Cracker Bob's outfit,
>who then complains about it to Kate...who sort of shrugs. What follows
>is an INCREDIBLE fight scene, cleanly edited, much more coherent, and
>about 2 minutes longer. We see Duncan cut and beat up all of Kell's
>henchman good and decisively, and see a nice longer scene of Duncan
>battling off all of them from the stairs. We also see Cracker Bob pull
>the bat out of his head...ouch. You can actually tell what is going on,
>and the goons double and triple team a lot more, so the choreography is
>much more complex than what ended up in the theater version.
>
>When Kell decapitates Carlos, he lodges the sword in his throat, ala
>the script, and spiels about seeing your own dead body, before killing
>him. We see Jin clearly shake his head and frown in objection to
>Carlos's actions beforehand, and seems to indicate he knows and doesn't
>want Carlos to die. Wow, actual characterization!
>
>When Duncan is strapped to the chair, the bad watcher dude goes off for
>a minute as to WHY AND HOW Kell is so powerful. Why any of this was cut
>is besides me, as it nicely explains his power.
>
>In the getaway car, Methos says he found Duncan's sword in the "lost
>and found." Duncan complains as to blood on the blade, to which Methos
>replies "I didn't say it was easy."
>
>When Kell taunts Connor, we see flashes of not only Connor's loft
>blowing up, but also a French woman falling off a horse and breaking
>her neck, BUT ALSO a short snippet of BRENDA WYATT BEING HIT BY A CAR.
>
>At Kate's fashion place, the conversation lasts a bit longer.
>
>This is where I actually start to like the movie...
>
>***DELETED SCENE***
>
>Following Kate and Duncan's conversation, we see a nice montage of both
>Duncan and Kate walking the streets separately, both clearly pondering
>the conversation they had with each other. We see Kate start to think
>about what she is doing. WOW! More characterization! Is it possible???
>
>This all leads to an ESTABLISHING SHOT OF KELL'S HEADQUARTERS, which is
>in fact a large temple/church, on a bridge that appears to be on the
>East River maybe??
>
>***DELETED SCENE***
>This scene is IMPERATIVE to establishing the relationship between Kell
>and Kate/Faith. She walks into the temple, she greets him and says "no
>not tonight, I'm tired." There, an establishment of at LEAST a sexual
>relationship.
>
>What follows is a conversation on a balcony of this huge temple, that
>Kate mentions is still in construction. They then have an actual
>conversation...wow. They talk about the Game, the Quickening, Kell's
>motivations, and Kate and the rest's part in all of it. The
>conversation ends quite strikingly. Kell asks Kate "do u know what LIVE
>spelled backards is?" She responds, "Live would be Evil, but LIVED
>would be..." She turns, and Kell is gone.
>
>Kate then imagines and thinks back to:
>
>1)
>A longer and better version of the highwaymen scene. There is actual
>humor, as the highwaymen play off of each other, as do Duncan and
>Connor. At one point we see the highwaymen draw their swords as they
>think Duncan is smart to their ways, but they quickly shield their
>swords as Duncan indulges them. When they actually fight, there is nice
>interaction between Connor and Duncan, who sits on his butt and
>critiques Connor's technique as Connor finishes off the last two
>highwaymen.
>
>2)Longer wedding celebration sequence, where we see a drunk yell at
>Duncan to "kiss her!!!", who happily obliges.
>
>NOW WE ACTUALLY KNOW WHY KATE GOES TO VISIT DUNCAN, she remembers the
>good old times and hopes to recapture the feelings to those memories
>
>We then Kate dance inside the temple, as we hear the wedding music play
>in the background...actually a very beautiful image.
>
>THE SEX SCENE
>A much longer, emotional, and dare I say...HOTTER SEX SCENE. Kate
>caresses Duncan before going at it with him. More breast shots (yumm),
>and for you ladies out there, 3 yes THREE shots of Duncan's butt,
>including one where Kate gets a nice handful.
>
>After Duncan "kills" Kate, she runs away and Duncan starts crying and
>whimpers "Damn you Connor Macleod!". Duncan...you made your own
>decision, so stop whining ;p
>
>After the elevator closes, Duncan feels Connor's presence, which leads
>directly to the ROOFTOP BATTLE.
>
>This is basically the same, except...
>
>It is nicely intertwined with the "last supper" scene.
>At the supper, Kell thanks each of his men individually.
>
>Here's where the important stuff happens...
>
>Kell's henchmen do NOT give up their heads willingly!
>He surprises them, and then in a blink of an eye, with two swings, he
>kills all of them EXCEPT Jin and Kate...
>
>U ready???
>
>After Jin sees the rest dead, -Manny, Cracker Bob, the Jamaican
>guy...he takes his sword into a defensive stance. He looks up at
>Kell...shakes his head, and knows he's a dead man. He TAKES HIS SWORD,
>PLANTS IT IN THE WALL, RUNS INTO THE BLADE AND DECAPITATES HIMSELF.
>
>Got all that????
>
>Then Kell says, right before the Quickening - to Kate..."Get out of
>here!"
>
>That's right...KELL DOES NOT KILL KATE
>
>
>....
>....
>
>Connor's quickening to Duncan is MUCH more explosive, longer, and
>powerful...finally some respect to the man.
>
>
>***DELETED SCENE***
>We quickly see 2 nude women, and then Kell next to them in bed, staring
>up at the wall...this establishes that the final fight is in fact in
>the temple!
>
>The final fight was about 2 minutes longer, including a spectacular
>stunt where Kell strikes a gas valve, Duncan, thinking to hurt Kell,
>strikes an electrical wire which HITS the gas valve. However, the
>flames start to come up through the floor grates at Duncan! He gets
>chased by a fire trail and ends up being thrown some twenty feet.
>
>Next they battle in a ROOM FULL OF CHAINS suspended from the
>ceiling...a very nice little scene, which ends up with Duncan rising up
>to the top of the temple by grabbing on to one of the chains that was
>rising up. At the roof Duncan looks at his wounds and says "it's
>endgame for you Kell." The battle then resumes as normal. AND NO STUPID
>MORPHING
>
>The quickening was much bigger also, with a lot of stuff in the
>refinery section of the temple exploding.
>
>***DIFFERENT ENDING***DELETED SCENE***
>
>At Connor's grave, instead of the CHEESY blue background, we instead
>see a beautiful mountain range. It's as if they forgot to put it in the
>prints they shipped to theaters.
>
>Now we see a solemn Duncan walking in what appears to be some sort of
>modern building complex, with fireworks in the background. Duncan
>surprisingly sees Kate, who has abandoned her "extreme" outfit and
>makeup of before.
>
>Duncan: So what now?
>Kate: Trust.
>Duncan: You can always trust me Faith.
>Kate: Faith is dead...I thought we'd give Kate another chance.
>
>Duncan tries to give back her locket that Kell dropped on him during
>their fight, but Kate refuses and tells Duncan "not yet...you hold onto
>it for me." "We have plenty of time."
>
>---------------------
>so there u have it, an actual ending instead of the movie just STOPPING.
>
>I said my goodbyes, but I felt it was my duty as a Highlander fan to
>let all of you know about this, and how we all got screwed over yet
>again. I dunno why in the world all this stuff was cut out, but it was,
>and it sucks hard. This version, as it was, was actually a pretty good
>movie, and I would have given my thumbs up to this, instead of that
>tripe they forced down our throats in theaters. Look forward to the DVD
>and the REAL Highlander Endgame...
>
>---------
>waylayer
Mark Nguyen <mnguyen@
Susan Stansfield wrote:
> WOW!! Where can I see this? Anyone know if this is the version that will be
> released on DVD?
It had better be... Or at the least, an eventual "Director's Cut" or "Special
Edition" release. Either way, THIS version is what I'll be buying.
Hmm... One wonders what special features they'll put on it? Hopefully, a bonus
audio track with AP and/or CL and/or the director. Behind the scenes stills.
Commercials and trailers (if you really wanna see Kell split in two again). And
OUTTAKES!
Mark
RCF23
Long Live Connor
GinjerB
>From: wayl...@my-deja.com
>Date: 9/11/00 10:00 PM EST
>Message-id: <8pk688$3os$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>
>
>In article <8pk44c$1bi$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Eance <ea...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>> This sounds really interesting Waylayer, may I ask where you found it?
>>
>> I understood there was considerable footage cut because miramax
>> insisted on an 85 min. slot but that might have been rumour too.
>> E
>
>know where to get these sort of things though. I know that most of you
>won't believe me unless you see it for yourselves...but at least now
>either a screener or a subtitled version of a movie about 2-3 weeks
>action vs 80...who was responsible for this??
>
>---------
>waylayer
>
<<Asim?? <G>
Where is he, anyway?
GinjerB
GinjerB
film....
Since Bill co-wrote the story ( remember that, guys) unless the footage was
just bad, it's hard for me to believe he would willingly leave a lot of his own
ideas on the cutting room floor.
The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the one
shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a better
idea to kill her off...
IMHO
GinjerB
Jette Goldie
GinjerB <gin...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000912163216...@ng-md1.aol.com...
<g> my thoughts too, Ginjer
>
> Where is he, anyway?
Hiding? (who from is a matter of opinion)
--
Jette Goldie
boss...@scotlandmail.com
Jerri LaPoint
> <<Asim?? <G>
> Where is he, anyway?
Didn't he claim to be an editor? Working on HL:E? And haven't people been
calling for the blood of the editors ever since the flick was released? A
strategic retreat, perhaps?
Jerri
Ladeebkwrm
I saw his name in the credits. I'd be hiding too.
Kristina
~~~~~
Dotiran
>Didn't he claim to be an editor?
Yes he did . And if I remember the quote correctly he said "the script you read
online is not the movie we filmed." Having seen both I'd just like to say why
the he77 not *vbeg*
PLClements
summary.
TBird
RANT AHEAD!
RANT AHEAD!!!!
gin...@aol.com (GinjerB) writes:
><<Panzer/Davis might have had final cut--but it Miramax wanted an 85 minute
>film....
<frowning at Miramax>
From all the various bits and pieces of all the various Endgame related things
I've gotten from reliable sources over the past few months.... It seems to me
that Miramax shot themselves in the foot. Feet. And kept shooting.
First, they wanted story control - thank god DPP held on to that.
Then they mandated location. Revenge?
Then the stupid false advertising crap. (SO happy I never saw a commercial.)
Not this ridiculous 85 minute thing.
I don't understand how the business works. Not even gonna pretend I do.
But between the story that was written and film, and the one we got in the
theatres, it's clear to me there was a breakdown in common sense.
If the footage is there, why cut 5-10 minutes of film that furthers the story?
5-10 minutes! I mean - I was riveted to my seat, as was everyone in the
theatre, 5 more minutes wasn't gonna make me suddenly crave popcorn.
And why spend $15,000,000 in the filim and then $10,000,000 on advertising if
you MAKING NEW FOOTAGE for the film that isn't in it???? Why not use that
money for the actualy film to help make it better?
I'll give 'em Roumania, probably saved some bucks there. And I still think it
was a worthy trade for story control remaining as much in the hands of DPP as
possible.
This seems so pointless and backwards. And clearly didn't work if the movie
has only grossed, what, +/-$9,000,000 so far.....
I'm confused.
I'm disappointed.
I was happy with what we got, but if it could have been better, WHY HOLD IT
BACK??????
</RANT>
TBird <----- banging head on desk
One of the Four Horsewomen of the ATH Gutter
Banzai88
(GinjerB) writes:
>The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the
>one
>shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a better
>idea to kill her off...
>
So...okay, bear with me because while I read the script and everything,
I haven't seen the film (not because of no Ceirdwyn but because I did
read the script and it bit and no theater in town is screening it) but in
all the press, it's always "it's about redemption." Redemption, redemption,
redemption. In the script, the thing is Connor is so depressed because the
only folks that could've forgiven him are dead (well, except Kell and we
know that's not gonna happen) but because Faith is alive, Duncan still
has a shot at redemption.
So...with Faith dead, exactly who gets redeemed? Or is it unrequited
redemption? (in which case, shall we reserve Duncan a seat in Sanctuary?)
Chris
remove 77 to reply
Buckaroo Banzai - http://www.WorldWatchOnline.com
http://come.to/ConnorMacLeod
http://come.to/Buffy-timeline
][
@#####|}======================>
][
senote
and US releases of movies can sometimes be very different because the MPAA
love to take there scissors to movie reels
MPAA man: Oh look there .... see that .... yes that .... that looks like a
half second flash of a womans butt cheeks .... you know what we have to do
.... thats right ..... cut out FIFTEEN minutes from the movie
:-)
senote
Jodi Ilyse
GinjerB:
><<Panzer/Davis might have had final cut--but if Miramax wanted an 85 minute
>film....
Me: I'm all for making Miramax out to be the bad guys, but I'm baffled as to
why they'd mandate an 85 minute film. As opposed to any other arbitrary
number? Once the footage is in the can, why would running time matter? If
anything, I think they may have been rushed to get it out on Labor Day, but as
for running time--I don't get it. Is it just fun to pin the blame on the
Miramaxians?
Ginjer: >Since Bill co-wrote the story ( remember that, guys) unless the
footage was just bad, it's hard for me to believe he would willingly leave a
lot of his
>own ideas on the cutting room floor.>
If they didn't look good, if they didn't make sense, if they didn't work, why
wouldn't he? A lot of things that work on the page don't translate well
visually. Regardless, ultimately Bill's the producer concerned with the final
product. If cutting footage works, makes it more comprehensible, avoids a few
more cheesy lines or tacky performances, is he really going be ego-stuck on his
ideas? If I wrote the script, I know I would, but that's because that'd be the
extent of my involvement, and I'm wussy that way. I don't think Bill's wussy
or green enough to think that film is a writer's medium.
I get that it's more appealing to think there's a bigger better movie out there
that we just weren't given the chance to see. But I think the HL (remember
that <g>) editors and Panzer/Davis are wearing the white hats here.
Hmmm.
Jodi
lbv...@my-deja.com
will just be the movie (not even full screen) and the trailer(s). :-P
Or how's this for a worst thought? Only released on VHS!
John Biltz
there or not but some of it is. Not interested in downloading it myself.
It is in rar format and I don't mess with that if I can avoid it. You have
to get every single file for it to work. If it is 105 minutes that is about
10 megs per minute or 1.05 gigabytes in length add about 30 to 40 % the
structure needed to break it down into posts and you are looking at around a
gig and a half of download. If each file is 500k in length you have an idea
what a monstrous job it would be to download it. I will wait for the DVD,
thank you. If I was the TPTB I would be looking for this guy. Because he
probably worked for them.
Research Moose
"Mark Nguyen <mnguyen@ hotmail.com >" <"yucky> wrote in message
news:iqsv5.15996$Ds1....@jekyl.ab.tac.net...
John Biltz
the REAL movie. It is not, the real movie is in the theaters. We may see
some of the footage in the DVD, maybe not. I don't think there will be a
different ending, probably more fights and sex.
Slain Moose
"PLClements" <plcle...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000912182234...@ng-cc1.aol.com...
GHorvath
>why they'd mandate an 85 minute film.
Yes, that baffled us, too.
GH
Ann Hall
wonder he is absent from the NG!!! Many on this NG has been screaming for
the heads of the edit guys!!!!
--
Ann Hall
"If the world were a logical place, men would ride side saddle."
"Dotiran" <dot...@aol.comd> wrote in message
news:20000912175904...@ng-ft1.aol.com...
Red Rock West
<<Holy sh*t !.........
I haven't been raving about the movie....but I did enjoy it.....maybe I'm
easily amused, I wanted new Highlander stuff, and I got it.
But...but.....but.....what were they thinking??? How on earth could they
cut out some of that stuff?>>
Look at the theatrical release of The Abyss. The entire ending that showed WHAT
the alien beings (or advanced water beings) were up to was removed. They just
saved Ed Harris and that was that. Very anti-climatic.
Michael
DonnaLetto
>things
>I've gotten from reliable sources over the past few months.... It seems to me
>that Miramax shot themselves in the foot. Feet. And kept shooting.
Wouldn't be the first time...
Donna
swr...@webtv.net
ground Santuary mess in this version?
Kelly<looking for any logical way to explain killing on holy ground>
NBathke
>has only grossed, what, +/-$9,000,000 so far.....
>
I've always been under the impression, right or wrong, that HL movies don't
make their money back with the domestic release. It's the Euro-dollars and the
video release that put them in the black. Who knows...
Niki
Jodi Ilyse
Kelly:
>What I want to know is whether any more sense was made of the whole Holy
>ground Santuary mess in this version?
Umm, not in what I saw. I go with the trying to have the immie cake and eat it
too theory. All that about Kell not caring about the rules sure indicates to
me that we're supposed to think he's breaking them . . .
I'd say I need to find a hobby if this weren't my hobby :-)
jodi
Claire Maier
:
: The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the one
: shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a better
: idea to kill her off...
Novelization-- will there be one? I hope so. (Hey, they're still selling
the novelization for HL 1, aren't they? So better late than never.)
I think it may have been better to kill Kate too. I think she was
forgiving Duncan, but the fact that she didn't like being immortal and
really didn't want to live as one was still a problem for her. I don't
think it would have worked for her to suddently like her life just because
Duncan convinced her to forgive him. It sort of made a nice parallel with
Connor, as well--some people just aren't cut out for immortality.
--
Claire Maier, Ph.D. bioa...@emory.edu CLMaier (within AOL only)
To be different is not necessarily to be ugly;
to have a different idea is not necessarily to be wrong.
The worst possible thing is for all of us to begin
to look and act and think alike.
-- Gene Roddenberry
Claire Maier
: "GinjerB" <gin...@aol.com> wrote
I saw his name in the credits.
Maybe he's working on another project and isn't interested in HL any more?
Claire Maier
: Now this kills me. Someone posts an unauthorized file and suddenly this is
: the REAL movie. It is not, the real movie is in the theaters. We may see
: some of the footage in the DVD, maybe not. I don't think there will be a
: different ending, probably more fights and sex.
Yeah, I agree. Some of the things I would have liked to see, and maybe
they'll put some footage in that's of interest to trufen but that they
didn't think would work for general audiences.
I'm interested in seeing every frame that was shot, but those who know me
know I'd happily watch dailies for hours on end, every angle, all the
takes, most of which bores other people to tears. I don't assume that a
differently edited movie is necessarily better.
NBathke
> with Connor...don't ask....Glad they cut it.>>
Not me! This is just the kind of 5 second humor that has to be in a gory
movie, just for balance. I would have liked it.
Niki
Ladeebkwrm
It *has* to be that giggling, simpering guy watching Connor and Duncan
practice - the one that hands them the swords.
Kristina
~~~~~
One of the Four Horsewomen of ATH
(You're nobody till you've been dissed by waylayer)
ruthless
> S
> P
> O
> I
> L
> E
> R
>
> S
> P
> A
> C
> E
Hi Edie!
I just hope that there acutally
*is* a Director's Cut. *I* am not
going to tell the Director (or whoever
*really* does these things) which scenes
to keep in (although I do have my
preferences), but I just hope that what
is eventually available on video isn't
a rush-job as parts of Endgame apparently
were.
ruthless<and you CAN'T KILL ON HOLY GROUND
WITHOUT CONSEQUENCES!!!>
>
> Frankly, there was a quite a bit in that posted 'real' version that I
> didn't care for. I'd have to see it, of course, to be sure, but
> I'm betting tht juxtaposing the last Duncan/Connor scene (the best
> thing about the movie, IMHO) and the killing of Kell's henchmen
> would have been a particularly bad move.
>
> One thing I missed in the movie that I expected to see from the
> trailer was a longer telling of Duncan and Connor's first meeting.
> I was hoping to see more of Connor teaching Duncan (and the
> uninitiated viewers) about the Game, and watching their bond grow
> throughout the movie, making the ending all that much more poignant.
> The Ravenna and Edge scenes were good, but I wished for more.
>
> Edie
>
> Claire Maier wrote:
> >
> > John Biltz (bilt...@earthlink.net) wrote:
> > : Now this kills me. Someone posts an unauthorized file and
suddenly this is
> > : the REAL movie. It is not, the real movie is in the theaters.
We may see
> > : some of the footage in the DVD, maybe not. I don't think there
will be a
> > : different ending, probably more fights and sex.
> >
> > Yeah, I agree. Some of the things I would have liked to see, and
maybe
> > they'll put some footage in that's of interest to trufen but that
they
> > didn't think would work for general audiences.
> >
> > I'm interested in seeing every frame that was shot, but those who
know me
> > know I'd happily watch dailies for hours on end, every angle, all
the
> > takes, most of which bores other people to tears. I don't assume
that a
> > differently edited movie is necessarily better.
> >
> > --
> > Claire Maier, Ph.D. bioa...@emory.edu CLMaier (within AOL only)
>
--
lady ruthless,
fair as fay-woman and fell-minded,
in the world walking for the woe of men.
-J.R.R. Tolkien
Susan Stansfield
In article <8plikd$rk2$2...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>, "LAB"
<labr...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>The establishment of Duncan's commitement and love for Kate would be
>nice...seemed a very disjointed storyline. Why would he marry *her* and
>not
>Tessa?
Remember, he was *going* to marry Tessa. Unfortunately, she died shortly after
they became engaged.
Susan
Susan Stansfield
In article <8plsmt$3u1$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, ladyim...@my-deja.com wrote:
>There is a picture of this scene you mentioned (Kate with her hands on
>Duncan's butt) on one of the Yahoo Highlander clubs. If there's
>interest, I can post a link.
Yes, please do. <eg>
>As for the film...who's decision was it to edit all that good stuff
>out? When we find him - heads will roll!!!
Oh yeah!
Susan
GinjerB
>
>Bastards! What is with these people? Wouldn't they rather have praise and the
>hope of another movie instead of making a B movie barely worth the B? They
>made
>their choice, I hope they get their act together on the video.
>
>
<<Oh for Pete's sake! Just because one person saw--something--and preferred it
to the final cut, that means automatically that that somethng is better?
"Longer' doesn't necessarily mean "better" after all.
And what's with the "bastards" crack? Even if the longer cut *is* better, don't
you get it that the reason that things like Director's Cuts' exist is that
Directors--and Producers--are often forced by The Powers That Be over them to
make changes? Miramax--the same Miramax that owns Dimension films --just pulled
out of a deal to distribute the newest Merchant/Ivory film because M/I wouldn't
make it shorter, for instance.
Making movies (and tv shows) is a business, a business that is rife with
comprimise. We may not like it, but it's the truth.
GinjerB
GinjerB
>"GinjerB" <gin...@aol.com> wrote
>
>> <<Asim?? <G>
>> Where is he, anyway?
>
>Didn't he claim to be an editor? Working on HL:E? And haven't people been
>calling for the blood of the editors ever since the flick was released? A
>strategic retreat, perhaps?
>
<<His name is in the credits, in fact. I'd just assumed that it was a screen
name, but apparently not.
Unless he uses his screen name for work, too...<g>
GinjerB
GinjerB
>In article <20000912164143...@ng-md1.aol.com>, gin...@aol.com
>(GinjerB) writes:
>
>>The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the
>>one
>>shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a
>better
>>idea to kill her off...
>>
>
>So...okay, bear with me because while I read the script and everything,
>I haven't seen the film (not because of no Ceirdwyn but because I did
>read the script and it bit and no theater in town is screening it) but in
>all the press, it's always "it's about redemption." Redemption, redemption,
>redemption. In the script, the thing is Connor is so depressed because the
>only folks that could've forgiven him are dead (well, except Kell and we
>know that's not gonna happen) but because Faith is alive, Duncan still
>has a shot at redemption.
>
>So...with Faith dead, exactly who gets redeemed? Or is it unrequited
>redemption? (in which case, shall we reserve Duncan a seat in Sanctuary?)
>
>
>Chris
>
>
Thanks, Chris!
GinjerB
GinjerB
>GinjerB (gin...@aol.com) wrote:
>:
>: The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the
>one
>: shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a
>better
>: idea to kill her off...
>
>Novelization-- will there be one? I hope so. (Hey, they're still selling
>the novelization for HL 1, aren't they? So better late than never.)
>
>I think it may have been better to kill Kate too. I think she was
>forgiving Duncan, but the fact that she didn't like being immortal and
>really didn't want to live as one was still a problem for her. I don't
>think it would have worked for her to suddently like her life just because
>Duncan convinced her to forgive him. It sort of made a nice parallel with
>Connor, as well--some people just aren't cut out for immortality.
>
>
>--
>Claire Maier, Ph.D. bioa...@emory.edu CLMaier (within AOL only)
<<Highly unlikley that there will be a novelization. And the main resson that I
think it was a better idea to kill off Kate in the film is that we all know
very well that if she didn't die now, she would die either between films or in
the opening credits of the next film.
Which then would make whatever happened in ENDGAME seem futiile.
MHO
GinjerB
GinjerB
things that were cut 'do" look good and work. If they can see that, you think
Bill Panzer couldn't?
GinjerB
LAB
See Kevin Costner's "Postman" or Warren Beatty's "Reds" for example :)
LAB
after
they became engaged.>>
Yes but he lived with her for TWELVE years or so before asking her! I did
not get the impression he knew kate long at all...OH WAIT, I forget, we have
NO background on his relationship with kate. Maybe, since that turned out
so well, that is why he stalled on marrying Tessa!
MMarks7883
probably be laughed out of town, is that Highlander in the US, has never really
grown out of its cult roots, and combining it with Europe and Japan where it
has a bigger following and apparently does better even if commercially not as
much in one country than the US, they usually tend to present a different
version over here (UK), than the US. Now Higlhander III had the least messed
around with as we had it first, and the only other major difference was the
name change. Dimension from what I've read over the years are known to be a bit
difficult in producing and generally sticking there noses into everything,
maybe this is the best version that they could do for the US in the time they
had to release it, if the euro release is later this year or maybe even next
year, and knowing what the opinion is over here, maybe we might get the more
complete version, probably not as glaringly different, but it might be more
padded out. I think blame Dimenison for this. Panzer/Davies don't exactly want
this to go "arse" up as its their income at stake for future tv and movies.
Plus if they were told 84 mins but had enough material for 98, then back story
had to go. I guess we'll have more of an idea when it comes out
here............... or maybe it really was the choice of blind idiots, who
knows?
Mike.
hei...@ecs.umass.edu
jodi...@aol.com (Jodi Ilyse) writes:
>For what it's worth:
>
>GinjerB:
>><<Panzer/Davis might have had final cut--but if Miramax wanted an 85 minute
>>film....
>
>Me: I'm all for making Miramax out to be the bad guys, but I'm baffled as to
>why they'd mandate an 85 minute film. As opposed to any other arbitrary
>number? Once the footage is in the can, why would running time matter? If
>anything, I think they may have been rushed to get it out on Labor Day, but as
>for running time--I don't get it. Is it just fun to pin the blame on the
>Miramaxians?
Only reason I can think of for 85 minutes is that is very easily sold to
fill a 2 hour TV time slot in the US. Add about 18 minutes of commercials
per hour, and that pretty much fills the 120 minutes.
Joe
Ladeebkwrm
On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 03:16:30 GMT, "Maggie" <c...@mail.utexas.edu>
wrote:
>
>"GinjerB" wrote ...
>
>> "Longer' doesn't necessarily mean "better" after all.
>
>That's what I've always said.
"One drink for Maggie from the Gutter Bar, please!"
What would you like, dear? <g>
Jerri LaPoint
> Maybe he's working on another project and isn't
> interested in HL any more?
There's a cure for HL? Where?
Jerri
dal...@erols.com
This is a 'me too' post. I'd love to see all of the footage taken.
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S
P
A
C
E
Frankly, there was a quite a bit in that posted 'real' version that I
didn't care for. I'd have to see it, of course, to be sure, but
I'm betting tht juxtaposing the last Duncan/Connor scene (the best
thing about the movie, IMHO) and the killing of Kell's henchmen
would have been a particularly bad move.
One thing I missed in the movie that I expected to see from the
trailer was a longer telling of Duncan and Connor's first meeting.
I was hoping to see more of Connor teaching Duncan (and the
uninitiated viewers) about the Game, and watching their bond grow
throughout the movie, making the ending all that much more poignant.
The Ravenna and Edge scenes were good, but I wished for more.
Edie
TBird
>>><< A gay guy tries to flirt with Duncan during the training scene in Italy
>>> with Connor...don't ask....Glad they cut it.>>
>>
>>Not me! This is just the kind of 5 second humor that has to be in a gory
>>movie, just for balance. I would have liked it.
>
>It *has* to be that giggling, simpering guy watching Connor and Duncan
>practice - the one that hands them the swords.
That's what I thought too....
And I thought, do something with that guy or leave him out....
TBird <----- yep
One of the Four Horsewomen of the ATH Gutter
~ ~ ~
No matter who we think we are
Everybody
Gets a chance to be
Nothing.
~ Bruce Cockburn
icq # 63568829
TBird
swr...@webtv.net writes:
It might not have been in this version.
Gillian mentioned that she wrote Sanctuary to *look* like HG, but not BE HG....
TBird <--- guessing
Jodi Ilyse
I don't think Asim ever said he was a fan, and I imagine he feels the movie's
as 'flawed' as anyone else who's worked on it--why apologize? Surely no one
here could be surprised by a little ego investment. I'm possessive of my
posts! Hypothetically speaking, however, maybe his laptop's fried, and he's
working on another project . . . ? It could happen.
Another nit to pick. Anyone else wish they'd had the costume and set designers
from the series working on this? They certainly appear to know better how to
make more with less.
Jodi
John Biltz
used a little editing.
Moose With Scissors
"LAB" <labr...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:8poupe$7nv$2...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net...
> <<"Longer' doesn't necessarily mean "better" after all.>>
>
becky717
bioa...@emory.edu (Claire Maier) wrote:
> GinjerB (gin...@aol.com) wrote:
> :
> : The only *major* change I detect from the verison of the script I read (the one
> : shopped for novelization) was the fate of Kate. And it may have been a better
> : idea to kill her off...
>
> Novelization-- will there be one? I hope so. (Hey, they're still selling
> the novelization for HL 1, aren't they? So better late than never.)
>
Actually, I saw a paperback in Books-a-Million that was a "novelization"
of the first movie yesterday (I was looking for Evening at Joe's)... had
CL on the cover in clan garb... they had quite a few books that were from
movies.
--
Becky
***********
"So it's a little purple... the prose, I mean."
-Amanda to Duncan, "Dramatic License"
"Well, you know what they say... two's company, four's... not sanitary."
-DM, "Money No Object"
Maggie
"GinjerB" wrote ...
> "Longer' doesn't necessarily mean "better" after all.
That's what I've always said.
Maggie
Maggie
"Jodi Ilyse" wrote ...
> Kelly:
> >What I want to know is whether any more sense was made of the whole Holy
> >ground Santuary mess in this version?
> Umm, not in what I saw. I go with the trying to have the immie cake and
eat it
> too theory. All that about Kell not caring about the rules sure indicates
to
> me that we're supposed to think he's breaking them . . .
So the idea is that Kell could appear to be the most ruthless and reckless
of villains because he *thought* he was killing on holy ground. Since it
wasn't really holy ground, though, the question of what happened if someone
violated the HG rule would remain unanswered, ergo no canon challenge.
Maggie
Foxx
I wanna say that..I just found another version of Endgame on the
internet.
(Spending two days to find it:p..*.hk is really a collection of illegal
websites:p)
The title is like this:
Dream as if you'll live forever.
Life as if you'll die tomorrow.
-unknown
there is no Connor's laughable speech..
I haven't downloaded all files yet, so I don't know what's the
difference between these two versions..
But the beginning is that Connor and Heather standed in front of the
door...
I don't have enough disk spaces of my internet account..and I'm using
lan of my university..so I can't share it to other people(if the school
knew that, I will be kicked off, go back to my country and serve two
years army:p), I believe this version can be found on the internet in
this weekend.
TBird
"DANG JOHN! I LOVE your moose sigs!!!!!"
DANG JOHN! I LOVE your moose sigs!
TBird <----- addicted to moose sigs
"John Biltz" <bilt...@earthlink.net> writes:
HiRene23
lol... I'm not sure I've ever seen Maggie splashing around in the gutter before
:)
Rene
drobbins
<20000914000951...@ng-ce1.aol.com>...
Wow.
There's hope for me yet.
ROTFLMAO
David
(Sorry. Couldn't resist. :)))
SUQKRT
In article <20000913000834...@ng-cj1.aol.com>, nba...@aol.com
(NBathke) wrote:
>
>>This seems so pointless and backwards. And clearly didn't work if the
>movie
>>has only grossed, what, +/-$9,000,000 so far.....
>>
>
>I've always been under the impression, right or wrong, that HL movies don't
>make their money back with the domestic release. It's the Euro-dollars
>and the
>video release that put them in the black. Who knows...
>Niki
>
maybe the abreviated movie is a Miramax tease many movies make as much or more
in video release. You release movie with plot hole. then somehow a more
complete version is leaked..............a few months later you release a
directors cut with the missing pieces, sales are alot higher, and its popular
in Blockbuster etc..............QED
Suz #5A
Iron Chef Macmoosette
Thank Heavens There's Only One
150 +
=^..^= =^..^= =^..^= =^..^=
Do not meddle in the affairs of cats,
for they are subtle and will piss
on your computer.
SUQKRT
In article <20000913164937...@ng-fi1.aol.com>, gin...@aol.com
(GinjerB) wrote:
>Powers That Be over them to
>make changes? Miramax--the same Miramax that owns Dimension films --just
>pulled
>out of a deal to distribute the newest Merchant/Ivory film because M/I
>wouldn't
>make it shorter, for instance.
Can you say Oscar Ginger. Look at how many Howard's End won. Merchant-Ivory
would improve their reputation. plus don't they take pride in doing alot with a
modest budget, they talked about this in an intervieiw. I'm a big M/I fan btw
some of my all time favorite movies are theirs
ruthless
> So the idea is that Kell could appear to be the most ruthless and
reckless
> of villains because he *thought* he was killing on holy ground. Since
it
> wasn't really holy ground, though, the question of what happened if
someone
> violated the HG rule would remain unanswered, ergo no canon challenge.
Kell is *not* ruthless <eg>
ruthless<not Kell>
--
lady ruthless,
fair as fay-woman and fell-minded,
in the world walking for the woe of men.
-J.R.R. Tolkien
Susan Stansfield
In article <URvv5.16367$Ds1....@jekyl.ab.tac.net>, "Mark Nguyen <mnguyen@"
<"yucky>hotmail.com"> wrote:
>Susan Stansfield wrote:
>
>> WOW!! Where can I see this? Anyone know if this is the version that
>will be
>> released on DVD?
>
>It had better be... Or at the least, an eventual "Director's Cut" or "Special
>Edition" release. Either way, THIS version is what I'll be buying.
Me too!
>Hmm... One wonders what special features they'll put on it? Hopefully,
>a bonus
>audio track with AP and/or CL and/or the director. Behind the scenes stills.
>Commercials and trailers (if you really wanna see Kell split in two again).
>And
>OUTTAKES!
Yeah!
Susan
Susan Stansfield
In article <8poirb$9vm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, ruthless <lady_r...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
>I just hope that there acutally
>*is* a Director's Cut. *I* am not
>going to tell the Director (or whoever
>*really* does these things) which scenes
>to keep in (although I do have my
>preferences), but I just hope that what
>is eventually available on video isn't
>a rush-job as parts of Endgame apparently
>were.
>
>ruthless<and you CAN'T KILL ON HOLY GROUND
> WITHOUT CONSEQUENCES!!!>
Forgive me for shouting here, but -- YOU SAID IT, RUTHLESS!!!
Susan <agreeing completely, obviously><g>
Maggie
"ruthless" wrote ...
> maggie:
> > So the idea is that Kell could appear to be the most ruthless and
> reckless of villains because he *thought* he was killing on holy ground.
Since
> it wasn't really holy ground, though, the question of what happened if
> someone violated the HG rule would remain unanswered, ergo no canon
challenge.
> Kell is *not* ruthless <eg>
> ruthless<not Kell>
You mean he's fake ruthless? <eeg>
Maggie
Maggie
"Ladeebkwrm" wrote ...
>
> Maggie wrote:
> >"GinjerB" wrote ...
> "One drink for Maggie from the Gutter Bar, please!"
Why, don't mind if I do.
> What would you like, dear? <g>
I'll have what he's having, thanks.
Maggie
Maggie
"HiRene23" wrote ...
> >"GinjerB" wrote ...
> >Maggie
Uh-oh. It looks as if I outlasted my youthful reputation and emerged as a
sober, thoughtful soul only to reveal the Truth in an unguarded moment! Hon,
I was one of the original decorators.
Maggie
ruthless
>So the idea is that Kell could appear to be the most ruthless and
ruthless:
> Kell is *not* ruthless <eg>
> ruthless<not Kell>
Maggie:
> You mean he's fake ruthless? <eeg>
:::spew::::
now, *there's* a thought....
could one write an ENDGAME/ATH crossover??
ruthless<ideas for HL5:the clone wars run through
my mind......><eg>
Ladeebkwrm
On Thu, 14 Sep 2000 20:31:09 GMT, ruthless <lady_r...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
>now, *there's* a thought....
>could one write an ENDGAME/ATH crossover??
>
>ruthless<ideas for HL5:the clone wars run through
> my mind......><eg>
I've been here too long...that's actually appealing to me.
Kristina <needs Sanctuary from ATH>
~~~~~
One of the Four Horsewomen of ATH
(You're nobody till you've been dissed by waylayer)
~I'm not as blonde as I look~
Ladeebkwrm
On Fri, 15 Sep 2000 05:16:54 GMT, "Maggie" <c...@mail.utexas.edu>
wrote:
>
>"HiRene23" wrote ...
>> ! Hon,
>> >I was one of the original decorators.
>
>> >Maggie
>
>> I was wondering who put up that painting of Duncan behind the bar. He
>looks
>> good on black velvet canvas. Nice job. :)
>
>Actually, that one wasn't mine - I forget who mounted ONH.
*Kristina cannonballs into the gutter*
"Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeee!"
Kristina
John Biltz
Moose Who Likes to be Appreciated
"TBird" <sixt4...@aol.comedancing> wrote in message
news:20000913234856...@nso-cv.aol.com...
HiRene23
>I was one of the original decorators.
>
>Maggie
I was wondering who put up that painting of Duncan behind the bar. He looks
good on black velvet canvas. Nice job. :)
Rene